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(BBC)   Before we all get ahead of ourselves in proclaiming the PS4 the winner of the console wars, Sony would just like to remind everyone that it is still, at heart, incompetent   (bbc.co.uk) divider line 84
    More: Obvious, console wars, Sony, PlayStation, system software  
•       •       •

5704 clicks; posted to Geek » on 19 Jun 2013 at 10:23 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-06-19 04:19:46 PM
Microsoft to reverse DRM policy according to inside sources

It might get even more interesting...  We'll see if it actually happens.
 
2013-06-19 04:25:34 PM

Elegy: Microsoft to reverse DRM policy according to inside sources

It might get even more interesting...  We'll see if it actually happens.


if true i hope all the farkers here who defended this crap get farked
 
2013-06-19 04:38:30 PM
I was expecting a reversal, but I was expecting it to be after launch when they saw decent pre-order sales, but lackluster activation (there are many people who pre-order to re-sell). I am glad they are seeing the light, it is always good when people and corporations learn from their mistakes.

I still will not be getting one, not after they showed their utter disregard for their user base.
 
2013-06-19 04:43:52 PM
I swear that sometimes my PS3 wants me to update backwards.  I will buy a older game and it will tell me to it needs to update to system 1.43.  I look at my system and it says that I'm currently at at version 1.80.  I wonder how that works.
 
2013-06-19 04:53:39 PM

Elegy: Microsoft to reverse DRM policy according to inside sources

It might get even more interesting...  We'll see if it actually happens.


It's official

http://news.xbox.com/2013/06/update
 
2013-06-19 04:54:43 PM

Elegy: Microsoft to reverse DRM policy according to inside sources

It might get even more interesting...  We'll see if it actually happens.


It just happened. Officially:

"So, today I am announcing the following changes to Xbox One and how you can play, share, lend, and resell your games exactly as you do today on Xbox 360. Here is what that means:
An internet connection will not be required to play offline Xbox One games - After a one-time system set-up with a new Xbox One, you can play any disc based game without ever connecting online again. There is no 24 hour connection requirement and you can take your Xbox One anywhere you want and play your games, just like on Xbox 360.

Trade-in, lend, resell, gift, and rent disc based games just like you do today - There will be no limitations to using and sharing games, it will work just as it does today on Xbox 360.

In addition to buying a disc from a retailer, you can also download games from Xbox Live on day of release. If you choose to download your games, you will be able to play them offline just like you do today. Xbox One games will be playable on any Xbox One console - there will be no regional restrictions.

These changes will impact some of the scenarios we previously announced for Xbox One. The sharing of games will work as it does today, you will simply share the disc. Downloaded titles cannot be shared or resold. Also, similar to today, playing disc based games will require that the disc be in the tray.

We appreciate your passion, support and willingness to challenge the assumptions of digital licensing and connectivity. While we believe that the majority of people will play games online and access the cloud for both games and entertainment, we will give consumers the choice of both physical and digital content. We have listened and we have heard loud and clear from your feedback that you want the best of both worlds.

Thank you again for your candid feedback. Our team remains committed to listening, taking feedback and delivering a great product for you later this year."


Sounds like digital lending is in the crapper now, along with accessing any of your games from remote consoles. And you now have to have the disk in the machine at all times to play a game (unless it was digitally downloaded in the first place). That's kind of a bummer, but I guess people wanting to sell their games via craigslist won out over people who don't want to dick with physical media.
 
2013-06-19 04:55:07 PM

Elegy: Microsoft to reverse DRM policy according to inside sources

It might get even more interesting...  We'll see if it actually happens.


Seems like the smart move, if true.
At least the 24 hour requirement needs to go. They never explained it, and its redundant if you're already buying and trading online. You'd be "checking in" every time your collection is altered, as with iTunes.

/This still doesn't insure we won't end up with the publishers turning the locks eventually.
/or continuing with the "Make half the game DLC" pattern they've already established.
/They may just be waiting for the pre-release shiatstorm to die down.
 
2013-06-19 04:57:01 PM

MrSteve007: Elegy: Microsoft to reverse DRM policy according to inside sources

It might get even more interesting...  We'll see if it actually happens.

It just happened. Officially:

"So, today I am announcing the following changes to Xbox One and how you can play, share, lend, and resell your games exactly as you do today on Xbox 360. Here is what that means:
An internet connection will not be required to play offline Xbox One games - After a one-time system set-up with a new Xbox One, you can play any disc based game without ever connecting online again. There is no 24 hour connection requirement and you can take your Xbox One anywhere you want and play your games, just like on Xbox 360.

Trade-in, lend, resell, gift, and rent disc based games just like you do today - There will be no limitations to using and sharing games, it will work just as it does today on Xbox 360.

In addition to buying a disc from a retailer, you can also download games from Xbox Live on day of release. If you choose to download your games, you will be able to play them offline just like you do today. Xbox One games will be playable on any Xbox One console - there will be no regional restrictions.

These changes will impact some of the scenarios we previously announced for Xbox One. The sharing of games will work as it does today, you will simply share the disc. Downloaded titles cannot be shared or resold. Also, similar to today, playing disc based games will require that the disc be in the tray.

We appreciate your passion, support and willingness to challenge the assumptions of digital licensing and connectivity. While we believe that the majority of people will play games online and access the cloud for both games and entertainment, we will give consumers the choice of both physical and digital content. We have listened and we have heard loud and clear from your feedback that you want the best of both worlds.

Thank you again for your candid feedback. Our team remains committed to listening, tak ...


guess what, you can already avoid physical media on the xbox 360

shocking, there's no correlation between draconian DRM on physical media and a healthy digital market! weird how that reality set in for everybody pretty quickly, no?
 
2013-06-19 04:59:50 PM

MrSteve007: I guess people wanting to sell their games via craigslist won out over people who don't want to dick with physical media.


If I ran the world I would have half arsed it with a two license system.
One wherever the disk is and one that's permanently attached to your ID.

/The latter would be needed for DLC or installing, sold for a lower fee from the online store.
/Resellers still get to profit from used or rental disks, but customers also know that used isn't as valuable as new.
 
2013-06-19 05:06:02 PM

AdamK: guess what, you can already avoid physical media on the xbox 360


Really?!? I can buy any AAA title the day is comes out on my 360 without having to own the physical media?
 
2013-06-19 05:07:05 PM
What will happen to the magic of cloud computing? I thought that was going to be the great equalizer between their specs compared to the PS4.

I thought the digital lending was a good concept for digital games, horrible idea for physical copies.
 
2013-06-19 05:09:40 PM

Elegy: Microsoft to reverse DRM policy according to inside sources

It might get even more interesting...  We'll see if it actually happens.


Now we have a proper fight on our hands.  Good to see this one go, and raises the xbone from 'not a chance in hell' to 'maybe pick i up sometime this gen'.

Still going with ps4 first, due to price and stronger hardware, but consider my xbone interest raised several notches.

Would hate to be Sony or Nintendo though, both just lost a major advantage of theirs.  Each will have to retool their message and focus for gamescom/TGS as we approach the console launches.
 
2013-06-19 05:11:10 PM

MrSteve007: AdamK: guess what, you can already avoid physical media on the xbox 360

Really?!? I can buy any AAA title the day is comes out on my 360 without having to own the physical media?


day 1? yes on most platforms, complain to microsoft that you can't on 360 for no reason at all

even on the wiiu you can download full games day 1, nintendo with that digital future and no drm... crazy stuff
 
2013-06-19 05:12:39 PM
Hey Sony, update the mutha frkkin web browser, you POS farks.
 
2013-06-19 05:13:45 PM

chozo13: What will happen to the magic of cloud computing? I thought that was going to be the great equalizer between their specs compared to the PS4.

I thought the digital lending was a good concept for digital games, horrible idea for physical copies.


Announcing to developers and publishers your going to, in essence, give away nine copies of a game for every one sold couldn't have sat well with folks.

Sony used to allow you to put any PSN game on up to five ps3's.  they were forced to scrap that pretty quickly, due to dev pressure from lost sales.  Now it's 2 ps3/2 psp or vita, which seemed to have done the trick.
 
2013-06-19 05:15:10 PM

Antimatter: Elegy: Microsoft to reverse DRM policy according to inside sources

It might get even more interesting...  We'll see if it actually happens.

Now we have a proper fight on our hands.  Good to see this one go, and raises the xbone from 'not a chance in hell' to 'maybe pick i up sometime this gen'.

Still going with ps4 first, due to price and stronger hardware, but consider my xbone interest raised several notches.

Would hate to be Sony or Nintendo though, both just lost a major advantage of theirs.  Each will have to retool their message and focus for gamescom/TGS as we approach the console launches.


i'm not sure if serious, sony still has $100 less entry point and appears to be outsupplying microsoft for launch units

nintendo was going to nintendo regardless of what the others did, they have their own unique problems that will probably be fixed 3ds-style

microsoft can only blame microsoft for the damage that's been done, only they could dig themselves out of the hole they created, good for gaming that they backtracked
 
2013-06-19 05:17:06 PM
Suck it corporate apologists.

Microsoft had to have seen the almost universal condemnation of their anti-consumer policies. So much for the morons who thought 'just vote with you wallet' was enough.
 
2013-06-19 05:21:34 PM

AdamK: day 1? yes on most platforms, complain to microsoft that you can't on 360 for no reason at all

even on the wiiu you can download full games day 1, nintendo with that digital future and no drm... crazy stuff


Downloadable AAA titles on *most* platforms? What are you smoking? The only platform where this is true is on PC via Origin or Steam.

The Wii U only offers digital downloads on a couple dozen titles. Sure, the PS3 and Xbox 360 offer digital downloads of "arcade" style games or older titles, but day-1 AAA download titles are almost unheard of on consoles. Looks like this will hold true for the next generation of consoles too.

/hasn't yet played a Wii U yet, so if I'm wrong, please point me to some AAA titles available on it.
 
2013-06-19 05:26:32 PM

jigger: Hey Sony, update the mutha frkkin web browser, you POS farks.


I gave up on that ages ago.  Phones and tablets made in the last 3 years are way better.  Course I don't have a keyboard for the ps3.

It still does really well as a blu-ray player.
 
2013-06-19 05:27:13 PM

chozo13: What will happen to the magic of cloud computing? I thought that was going to be the great equalizer between their specs compared to the PS4.

I thought the digital lending was a good concept for digital games, horrible idea for physical copies.


Just a guess... games that actually use the cloud on either system will be always online when you're playing.  If that rumor of the check in being scrapped proves out I'll still give Sony a 60% chance of winning the generation but they could squander that easily.
 
2013-06-19 05:28:44 PM

MrSteve007: AdamK: day 1? yes on most platforms, complain to microsoft that you can't on 360 for no reason at all

even on the wiiu you can download full games day 1, nintendo with that digital future and no drm... crazy stuff

Downloadable AAA titles on *most* platforms? What are you smoking? The only platform where this is true is on PC via Origin or Steam.

The Wii U only offers digital downloads on a couple dozen titles. Sure, the PS3 and Xbox 360 offer digital downloads of "arcade" style games or older titles, but day-1 AAA download titles are almost unheard of on consoles. Looks like this will hold true for the next generation of consoles too.

/hasn't yet played a Wii U yet, so if I'm wrong, please point me to some AAA titles available on it.


this is a better list:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Wii_U_eShop_games

the big one that was never put on eshop was call of duty black ops 2, that's on activision and really has nothing to do with disc drm, authentications, 24 hour check ins, etc.

and yes, i own a wii u and have gone 100% digital, i've got a 1tb external hard drive connected and never expect to ever have to delete anything or goto a store to buy anything - cod aside (which i'd rather play on my gaming pc)

what's nice tho? it's all an option that's heavily supported - support is what matters, not drm, if you wanted to you could avoid downloadable titles on the wii u as well - it's not a problem and never will be
 
2013-06-19 05:30:43 PM

MrSteve007: AdamK: day 1? yes on most platforms, complain to microsoft that you can't on 360 for no reason at all

even on the wiiu you can download full games day 1, nintendo with that digital future and no drm... crazy stuff

Downloadable AAA titles on *most* platforms? What are you smoking? The only platform where this is true is on PC via Origin or Steam.

The Wii U only offers digital downloads on a couple dozen titles. Sure, the PS3 and Xbox 360 offer digital downloads of "arcade" style games or older titles, but day-1 AAA download titles are almost unheard of on consoles. Looks like this will hold true for the next generation of consoles too.

/hasn't yet played a Wii U yet, so if I'm wrong, please point me to some AAA titles available on it.


I think the next generation both systems will be day one digital AAA titles.  The potential for impulse purchases are to great.

Yes I know Sony has done this with some titles.  I bought The Last of Us digitally.
 
2013-06-19 05:54:14 PM

Nefarious: MrSteve007: AdamK: day 1? yes on most platforms, complain to microsoft that you can't on 360 for no reason at all

even on the wiiu you can download full games day 1, nintendo with that digital future and no drm... crazy stuff

Downloadable AAA titles on *most* platforms? What are you smoking? The only platform where this is true is on PC via Origin or Steam.

The Wii U only offers digital downloads on a couple dozen titles. Sure, the PS3 and Xbox 360 offer digital downloads of "arcade" style games or older titles, but day-1 AAA download titles are almost unheard of on consoles. Looks like this will hold true for the next generation of consoles too.

/hasn't yet played a Wii U yet, so if I'm wrong, please point me to some AAA titles available on it.

I think the next generation both systems will be day one digital AAA titles.  The potential for impulse purchases are to great.

Yes I know Sony has done this with some titles.  I bought The Last of Us digitally.


Both systems are shiat for post-day-one prices though. Usually even WITH 'project $10' from EA a used game was cheaper than either digital option.

I am sad about the lack of disk-less play from non-digital sources. Though I guess you have to if you're canning the check-in.
 
2013-06-19 05:56:05 PM

chozo13: What will happen to the magic of cloud computing? I thought that was going to be the great equalizer between their specs compared to the PS4.


I'm not a game developer, but one area I can think of where cloud computing could improve a game is in AI for strategy games.  It's currently possible to build an AI that uses machine learning to adapt to the player's strategies, thus becoming more difficult as the player becomes more skilled.  The problem is that with AI technology that is feasible today, the AI needs to play a lot more games than the human in order to improve its skill as much (unless a game developer is willing to put in the effort to develop a more specialized AI, which might make sense for e.g. a Chess game but might not be cost-effective for other games).

Cloud computing wouldn't solve the problem of slow AI learning, but it could mitigate it by allowing an AI living in the cloud to train against thousands of human opponents, rather than just the player(s) of a single console.

If you're talking about the brown FPS of the week, however, cloud computing would be useless.

/my $0.02
 
2013-06-19 05:58:55 PM
 
2013-06-19 06:13:46 PM

Virtual Pariah: Guess we can put the whole thing to bed now.

http://www.joystiq.com/2013/06/19/xbox-one-80-microsoft-reverses-xbo x- one-drm-features/


They walked that one back so fast Usain Bolt lost his world record.
 
2013-06-19 06:17:21 PM

Virtual Pariah: Guess we can put the whole thing to bed now.

http://www.joystiq.com/2013/06/19/xbox-one-80-microsoft-reverses-xbo x- one-drm-features/


So the link from Xbox.com wasn't good enough to put it to bed, but the link from Joystiq was the tipping point?
 
2013-06-19 06:18:17 PM

degenerate-afro: Virtual Pariah: Guess we can put the whole thing to bed now.

http://www.joystiq.com/2013/06/19/xbox-one-80-microsoft-reverses-xbo x- one-drm-features/

So the link from Xbox.com wasn't good enough to put it to bed, but the link from Joystiq was the tipping point?


Also
img.fark.net
 
2013-06-19 06:27:26 PM
Put my money down of the PS4 pre-order yesterday.  The kid at Gamestop was an obvious Xbox fanboy and he would not stop going on and on about the new Xbox.  He was telling me how the Microsoft rep laughed off all of the DRM amd used game issues as being non-existant.  He informed me that Gamestop had already fullfilled their pre-order and shut new orders down for the holiday.  I suppose all of this is true, but I eventually had to shut him down and go on with my life.  I did this by letting him know that he would be out of a job soon if Microsoft has their way.

And since that would hit his wallet pretty hard, I went on to explain that I'm a financial planner and totally agnostic when it comes to gaming.  It was the costs associated that motivated me.  I got rid of the Xbox 360 when it started to RRoD and when the online service started adding up.  Taking away the ability to sell games used hit my pocket as much as the extra $100 I would have to spend on the unit.

I'm pretty sure the economics still play into people's decisions in this economy.  Let's see if Xbox1 proves me wrong.
 
2013-06-19 07:00:22 PM

AdamK: Antimatter: Elegy: Microsoft to reverse DRM policy according to inside sources

It might get even more interesting...  We'll see if it actually happens.

Now we have a proper fight on our hands.  Good to see this one go, and raises the xbone from 'not a chance in hell' to 'maybe pick i up sometime this gen'.

Still going with ps4 first, due to price and stronger hardware, but consider my xbone interest raised several notches.

Would hate to be Sony or Nintendo though, both just lost a major advantage of theirs.  Each will have to retool their message and focus for gamescom/TGS as we approach the console launches.

i'm not sure if serious, sony still has $100 less entry point and appears to be outsupplying microsoft for launch units

nintendo was going to nintendo regardless of what the others did, they have their own unique problems that will probably be fixed 3ds-style

microsoft can only blame microsoft for the damage that's been done, only they could dig themselves out of the hole they created, good for gaming that they backtracked


Five months is a lot of time to reframe their marketing though.  And well, they have more moneyhats then sony these days.  Moneyhat the right games, and people may stomach the $100 premium.

If sony wants to keep their early lead, they need to give people something to cheer for besides used games.  Show off the consoles power with some exclusives, demo it's unique features, etc and so forth.

Nintendo just needs to release some damn games already.  Their winter lineup is solid, but that's a long ways away.

MS can now retool to be full on game blitzing, somethign that Nintendo and sony have to now deal with.

Going to be a fun few months.
 
2013-06-19 07:03:38 PM

MrSteve007: Elegy: Microsoft to reverse DRM policy according to inside sources

It might get even more interesting...  We'll see if it actually happens.

It just happened. Officially:

"So, today I am announcing the following changes to Xbox One and how you can play, share, lend, and resell your games exactly as you do today on Xbox 360. Here is what that means:
An internet connection will not be required to play offline Xbox One games - After a one-time system set-up with a new Xbox One, you can play any disc based game without ever connecting online again. There is no 24 hour connection requirement and you can take your Xbox One anywhere you want and play your games, just like on Xbox 360.

Trade-in, lend, resell, gift, and rent disc based games just like you do today - There will be no limitations to using and sharing games, it will work just as it does today on Xbox 360.

In addition to buying a disc from a retailer, you can also download games from Xbox Live on day of release. If you choose to download your games, you will be able to play them offline just like you do today. Xbox One games will be playable on any Xbox One console - there will be no regional restrictions.

These changes will impact some of the scenarios we previously announced for Xbox One. The sharing of games will work as it does today, you will simply share the disc. Downloaded titles cannot be shared or resold. Also, similar to today, playing disc based games will require that the disc be in the tray.

We appreciate your passion, support and willingness to challenge the assumptions of digital licensing and connectivity. While we believe that the majority of people will play games online and access the cloud for both games and entertainment, we will give consumers the choice of both physical and digital content. We have listened and we have heard loud and clear from your feedback that you want the best of both worlds.

Thank you again for your candid feedback. Our team remains committed to listening, taking feedback and delivering a great product for you later this year."

Sounds like digital lending is in the crapper now, along with accessing any of your games from remote consoles. And you now have to have the disk in the machine at all times to play a game (unless it was digitally downloaded in the first place). That's kind of a bummer, but I guess people wanting to sell their games via craigslist won out over people who don't want to dick with physical media.


I'm really bummed about digital lending. Trading games with my online only friends would have been awesome. But it's probably the right move for MS, given the Internet hate, the soldier market, and the global market.
 
2013-06-19 07:32:22 PM

Antimatter: AdamK: Antimatter: Elegy: Microsoft to reverse DRM policy according to inside sources

It might get even more interesting...  We'll see if it actually happens.

Now we have a proper fight on our hands.  Good to see this one go, and raises the xbone from 'not a chance in hell' to 'maybe pick i up sometime this gen'.

Still going with ps4 first, due to price and stronger hardware, but consider my xbone interest raised several notches.

Would hate to be Sony or Nintendo though, both just lost a major advantage of theirs.  Each will have to retool their message and focus for gamescom/TGS as we approach the console launches.

i'm not sure if serious, sony still has $100 less entry point and appears to be outsupplying microsoft for launch units

nintendo was going to nintendo regardless of what the others did, they have their own unique problems that will probably be fixed 3ds-style

microsoft can only blame microsoft for the damage that's been done, only they could dig themselves out of the hole they created, good for gaming that they backtracked

Five months is a lot of time to reframe their marketing though.  And well, they have more moneyhats then sony these days.  Moneyhat the right games, and people may stomach the $100 premium.

If sony wants to keep their early lead, they need to give people something to cheer for besides used games.  Show off the consoles power with some exclusives, demo it's unique features, etc and so forth.

Nintendo just needs to release some damn games already.  Their winter lineup is solid, but that's a long ways away.

MS can now retool to be full on game blitzing, somethign that Nintendo and sony have to now deal with.

Going to be a fun few months.


that's fine with me, it's always been about the games, games sell systems not the other way around
 
2013-06-19 07:33:32 PM

Elegy: MrSteve007: Elegy: Microsoft to reverse DRM policy according to inside sources

It might get even more interesting...  We'll see if it actually happens.

It just happened. Officially:

"So, today I am announcing the following changes to Xbox One and how you can play, share, lend, and resell your games exactly as you do today on Xbox 360. Here is what that means:
An internet connection will not be required to play offline Xbox One games - After a one-time system set-up with a new Xbox One, you can play any disc based game without ever connecting online again. There is no 24 hour connection requirement and you can take your Xbox One anywhere you want and play your games, just like on Xbox 360.

Trade-in, lend, resell, gift, and rent disc based games just like you do today - There will be no limitations to using and sharing games, it will work just as it does today on Xbox 360.

In addition to buying a disc from a retailer, you can also download games from Xbox Live on day of release. If you choose to download your games, you will be able to play them offline just like you do today. Xbox One games will be playable on any Xbox One console - there will be no regional restrictions.

These changes will impact some of the scenarios we previously announced for Xbox One. The sharing of games will work as it does today, you will simply share the disc. Downloaded titles cannot be shared or resold. Also, similar to today, playing disc based games will require that the disc be in the tray.

We appreciate your passion, support and willingness to challenge the assumptions of digital licensing and connectivity. While we believe that the majority of people will play games online and access the cloud for both games and entertainment, we will give consumers the choice of both physical and digital content. We have listened and we have heard loud and clear from your feedback that you want the best of both worlds.

Thank you again for your candid feedback. Our team remains committed to li ...


digital lending is still possible, there are no limitations against it, only corporate politics
 
2013-06-20 07:56:12 AM

Elegy: MrSteve007: Elegy:

Sounds like digital lending is in the crapper now, along with accessing any of your games from remote consoles. And you now have to have the disk in the machine at all times to play a game (unless it was digitally downloaded in the first place). That's kind of a bummer, but I guess people wanting to sell their games via craigslist won out over people who don't want to dick with physical media.


I'm really bummed about digital lending. Trading games with my online only friends would have been awesome. But it's probably the right move for MS, given the Internet hate, the soldier market, and the global market.

Sony tried to let users share games with 5 consoles. The publishers revolted and now you can only share with 2 consoles.
http://www.destructoid.com/playstation-game-downloads-to-be-limited- to -two-consoles-215189.phtml
I'm sure the publishers weren't happy with sharing with 10 consoles, but they might have been willing to accept that in trade for ending the private used game trade.
 
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