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(Fox News)   "Son, I am disappoint"   (foxnews.com) divider line 24
    More: Obvious, Edward Snowden, Eric Bolling, sons  
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16352 clicks; posted to Main » on 18 Jun 2013 at 8:31 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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Archived thread
2013-06-18 09:38:57 AM
5 votes:
It's cute that so many people think the story is about Snowden.

That's just what the administration is hoping for.
2013-06-18 08:34:05 AM
5 votes:
TFA: "

"The U.S. Government, just as they did with other whistle-blowers, immediately and predictably destroyed any possibility of a fair trial at home, openly declaring me guilty of treason and that the disclosure of secret, criminal and even unconstitutional acts is an unforgivable crime. That's not justice, and it would be foolish to volunteer yourself to it if you can do more good outside of prison than in it," he said during the chat. "


 Sounds about right.
2013-06-18 09:00:03 AM
4 votes:
"Being called a traitor by Dick Cheney is the highest honor you can give an American, and the more panicked talk we hear from people like him, Feinstein ... the better off we all are," Snowden said.

He added that "Bathtub falls and police officers kill more Americans than terrorism, yet we've been asked to sacrifice our most sacred rights for fear of falling victim to it."

In one of his final replies, Snowden attacked the "mainstream media" for its coverage, saying it "now seems far more interested in what I said when I was 17 or what my girlfriend looks like rather than, say, the largest program of suspicion-less surveillance in human history."
2013-06-18 08:32:11 AM
4 votes:
Its a trap!
2013-06-18 10:49:18 AM
3 votes:

Corvus: washington-babylon: Do you realize how ridiculous you sound? If you are so sure of your statement that Snowden specifically said he didn't need a warrant to listen to a call, then perhaps you can provide the requisite citation? All Snowden has done is provide further information about the process, which he didn't go into explicit detail on initially. Are you going to claim he lied because he didn't specifically outline everything, thereby creating a "Lie of omission" which is only a pseudo-lie if it is not clarified in more detail later?

I linked above to what he said. Yes he said it in a way that was obviously misleading. Why do you think all the new reports (which I linked to above) say that he said it they could listen in without a warrant? They even asked him that point blank where he once again was misleading. He could of said "no" but he didn't.

If they need warrants (and according to you, he was not trying to imply they didn't) then what is the actual "whistle blowing" here?

How is he a "whistle blower" if his allegations are something that the government has already said they were doing?


You may have noticed that the articles themselves only quote snowden as saying that they have access to metadata. The closest that they ever come to quoting him saying that they have access to unwarranted information is where he says that they collect "incidental" intelligence. This is a widely known fact, so he wasn't lying. As for the legality of the situation, and hence the question of what he is blowing the whistle on: the legality has NOT been determined yet in a court of law.

What he has blown the whistle on is a massive 4th amendment violation, no matter what "special legality" the patriot act grants the NSA's activity. The question boils down to this: "Is the Patriot Act a greater legal statute than the U.S. Constitution? " The answer is quite simple "No. The U.S. Constitution is the first and Supreme Law of the nation, from which all other laws derive authority and legal power."

Why this is so hard to understand is beyond me. To continue your blatant disregard for the facts of the case as a whole is to continue to attempt to obfuscate the real issue: Our government has overstepped its bounds of authority, and actions must be taken to rectify this egregious misuse of power.
I sincerely hope that your special brand of ignorance is a sham, and that this was a clever (and quite successful) troll attempt. Because if it is not, then you are the kind of person whose ideologies  destroy nations.
2013-06-18 09:45:32 AM
2 votes:

Corvus: Instead he lied


Corvus: What he originally said was a lie.


Corvus: He originally lied


Corvus: lying


Corvus: he was lying


Corvus: turned out to be lie


Corvus: That was lie. He lied. he lied he lied.


Corvus: So which truth should I believe


Corvus: Which still means he was lying. He lied.


Corvus: that was a lie


Corvus: He lied.


Corvus: He still lied


Corvus: still lying. He lied.



NSA like typing detected..... lol....
2013-06-18 09:20:22 AM
2 votes:
Treason is giving aid and comfort to the enemy.  Does that mean the US Federal government considers US Citizens its enemy?

I mean, that explains a whole helluva lot, but kinda stupid of them to admit it so openly.
2013-06-18 08:41:28 AM
2 votes:
Government Definitions:
wistleblower: You brought into the open information I agree should be made public

traitor: You brought into the openinformation I disagree should be made public


Simple, anyone can see the difference and never make any mistakes about which is which.
2013-06-18 08:40:41 AM
2 votes:
This is crap, his dad was on youtube ranting against the government.

record all senate and congressional phone, email, and chat correspondence and make it public for anyone to see.

If the government has the power to record our conversations we should, as a society, be able to review all senate and congressional conversations via phone, email, and chat to monitor for criminal activity and back room deals. Our elected officials are working for us, therefore we should have complete insight into what they are doing behind closed doors. This holds true for any corporation, why not the US government.
2013-06-18 12:53:26 PM
1 votes:

evilbryan: The NSA misinformation team is hard at work I see. Good to see them fighting for freedomtm by attacking the truth.


They don't even need to convince anyone of anything.  Just put out enough stuff to confuse people.
2013-06-18 11:01:05 AM
1 votes:
Son, you gave up a $120k/year job, a home in Hawaii, and a lithe, 28-year-old pole dancing girlfriend to "expose" a program that we've all expected was going on and about which the majority of Americans (who just finished Instagramming a picture of their lunch, Foursquaring their location, Tweeting about a health condition, and coughing up  a bunch of demographics information to get a $0.25 burrito coupon) don't give a shiat about...we're all disappoint.
2013-06-18 10:22:43 AM
1 votes:
Let me start by saying it's almost certain I've missed some of the reports on this so I doubt I have the most current information, but I think we might be obscuring the point with the whole "hi lied/he didn't" debate.

I hate to quibble over semantics, but this might be one of those cases where the message is getting lost in the telling. So, Snowden says they don't need a warrant to access and listen to calls, and the argument that saying so is a lie is based on needing a warrant. That's all well and good, but if the call is recorded (even if, as I recently read, it's only recorded so that if meta-data interpretation indicates something suspicious they can go get a warrant to actually listen to the call) then it's accessible. Sure, maybe they're supposed to get a warrant, but that doesn't mean someone with access to the system can't simply pull up a file and press play. They can't do it legally, but, presumably, they can still do it and personally I'm not satisfied that sufficient oversight exists to keep this from happening. I doubt anyone bothered engineering a system that would require entering a FISA docket number for verification in order to "unlock" a recorded call, so while there may be a legal restriction (not getting into the whole FISA rubber stamp debate), that doesn't mean there's any kind of preventative system for keeping people with access to the recorded calls (archives? database?) to listening to any that they choose.

So, Snowden saying they can do it isn't necessarily a lie. Saying they can't illegally do it would be a lie.
2013-06-18 10:15:00 AM
1 votes:

neversubmit: responsible members of the press in America."


lolwhut?
2013-06-18 09:48:31 AM
1 votes:

redmid17: TFA: "

"The U.S. Government, just as they did with other whistle-blowers, immediately and predictably destroyed any possibility of a fair trial at home, openly declaring me guilty of treason and that the disclosure of secret, criminal and even unconstitutional acts is an unforgivable crime. That's not justice, and it would be foolish to volunteer yourself to it if you can do more good outside of prison than in it," he said during the chat. "


 Sounds about right.


The US government didn't declare him guilty of treason; certain loud mouthed assholes in Congress did.
2013-06-18 09:29:17 AM
1 votes:

Corvus: I keep saying it. His original allegation that government officials can just call up and listen to any conversation of a US citizen without a warrant turned out to be lie.


You can keep saying it all you want.  If you believe the NSA does  not have the ability to listen to any phone conversation they want,  you are a fool.  This isnt even new.. some of us have known this for a  very long time, for varying reasons.  It is a fact that the NSA can and does intercept any and every wireless communication in the world that they choose to.  The only thing thats new is the internet snooping... but dur, we already knew NSA has their own rooms in all the ISP backbones and we know they've been using ECHELON for 30+ years, so its not hard to connect the dots.
2013-06-18 09:24:44 AM
1 votes:

neversubmit: "Being called a traitor by Dick Cheney is the highest honor you can give an American, and the more panicked talk we hear from people like him, Feinstein ... the better off we all are," Snowden said.

He added that "Bathtub falls and police officers kill more Americans than terrorism, yet we've been asked to sacrifice our most sacred rights for fear of falling victim to it."

In one of his final replies, Snowden attacked the "mainstream media" for its coverage, saying it "now seems far more interested in what I said when I was 17 or what my girlfriend looks like rather than, say, the largest program of suspicion-less surveillance in human history."


Dick Cheney being about the only politician that stands behind Obama on this ought to tell you all you need to know.

You where the chosen one, It was said you would destroy the sith, not become one.
2013-06-18 09:21:59 AM
1 votes:

Corvus: IdBeCrazyIf: Corvus: I already said. His originally story was government people could listen into any conversation of any citizen without a warrant at anytime. That was not true.
And now his story is well they are just recording it for if they get a warrant. That's a huge difference. He originally lied and now that he is being caught in his lie he is changing his story.

NO, he said that with a word he could look into any conversation of any citizen which was corroborated with documentation. Now yes, that word may still require a warrant, but to your average layman contractor it may appear as if those requests just come willy nilly.

And keep in mind, the press still has documents yet to be released

Right so "Needing a court ordered warrant" was just a small detail he left out on accident?

That's bullshiat. He left that out on purpose to give the impression to people that they didn't need a warrant, and that's what everyone believed (and many still think that is true because the press isn't clarifying the story) before people was pointing out he was lying and he walked his story back.


FISA court rejects 0.03% of applications.  It's a rubber stamp process.  He didn't lie.
2013-06-18 09:17:33 AM
1 votes:

neversubmit: If the government has the power to record our conversations we should, as a society, be able to review all senate and congressional conversations via phone, email, and chat to monitor for criminal activity and back room deals. Our elected officials are working for us, therefore we should have complete insight into what they are doing behind closed doors. This holds true for any corporation, why not the US government.


They have nothing to fear if they havent done anything wrong..... right?
2013-06-18 08:51:48 AM
1 votes:

Corvus: No there is a system to be a whistle blower without leaking secret information. He did not want to do that. Instead he lied and went to the news with those lies. First he said every had access to any conversation of a US citzen without a warrant, which now we know was a lie.


Yes because the director of the NSA is such a top notch and trusted source of information
2013-06-18 08:48:01 AM
1 votes:

GameSprocket: He needs to wait for a case to get to the Supreme Court challenging the constitutionality of the program. If the program is declared illegal, and he only ever released information to expose that program, then he should fall well within "wistleblower" protections.



No there is a system to be a whistle blower without leaking secret information. He did not want to do that. Instead he lied and went to the news with those lies. First he said every had access to any conversation of a US citzen without a warrant, which now we know was a lie.
2013-06-18 08:47:59 AM
1 votes:

Oldiron_79: redmid17: TFA: "

"The U.S. Government, just as they did with other whistle-blowers, immediately and predictably destroyed any possibility of a fair trial at home, openly declaring me guilty of treason and that the disclosure of secret, criminal and even unconstitutional acts is an unforgivable crime. That's not justice, and it would be foolish to volunteer yourself to it if you can do more good outside of prison than in it," he said during the chat. "


 Sounds about right.

Yeah If I pissed in the NSAs cheereos Id seek asylum in a country that hates the US. Russia or China beats the hell out of a fingernail factory™


Kind of undermines your integrity as a whistleblower on a surveillance state if you go running to China, though.
2013-06-18 08:45:01 AM
1 votes:
CSB

Talking with my parents (who are in their 70s) on father's day, my mother said "I can't believe they want to arrest him. He is doing the right thing."  I quickly asked her "What would Richard Nixon have done if he knew who Deep Throat was?"  She then understood why he was wanted.

/CSB
2013-06-18 08:38:21 AM
1 votes:
good i hope he never gets turned in. I care for this government as much as they care about me
2013-06-18 08:36:55 AM
1 votes:

Freakin Rican: how many leaked NSA greenlights can we have today?


We can never have too many, in my opinion.  It needs to stay in the spot light.
 
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