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(Quartz)   This man lost his house because his Kickstarter was too successful   (qz.com) divider line 89
    More: Dumbass, Chinese Girl  
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22192 clicks; posted to Main » on 17 Jun 2013 at 12:56 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-06-17 12:41:34 PM
He wasn't prepared for the scale of his success.
 
2013-06-17 12:47:37 PM
If it weren't for my horse, I wouldn't have spent that year in college.
 
2013-06-17 01:00:21 PM
img.photobucket.com
 
2013-06-17 01:00:28 PM
encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com

MOOT!
 
2013-06-17 01:00:37 PM
Sounds like he just sucks at running a business, and math.
 
2013-06-17 01:00:56 PM

cameroncrazy1984: If it weren't for my horse, I wouldn't have spent that year in college.


For some reason, my nose is bleeding profusely.
 
2013-06-17 01:01:16 PM

"This man lost his house because his Kickstarter was too successful "


Jeebus, what a farked up misleading headline. He lost his house because he decided to stop making payments on it, not that he seemed to give a fark in the first place.

"Running out of cash and faced with expenses from every avenue, Carter stopped making the mortgage on a house he owned outside Boston, which was also his company address. He eventually lost the house. (Carter, who lives in Amsterdam, admits that had he lived in the Boston house, he might not have sacrificed it for the game.)"

 
2013-06-17 01:01:26 PM
Big promises, insufficient goal to cover those promises, didn't have an interpreter hired, didn't design the packaging right...

Sounds like a mismanaged clusterfark all around.
 
2013-06-17 01:03:53 PM
Why didn't he try to manufacture in the Netherlands?
 
2013-06-17 01:04:02 PM
I can only hope something like this happens to Tim Schafer and his "indie" outfit.

/60 team company that needs rotating projects is not a god damn indie company you greedy fark
 
2013-06-17 01:05:16 PM
one commenter wrote:

I'm sorry, but fark off with your guilt trip at the beginning of your update. As someone who has sat quite [sic], my only crime is donating money to help get this project off the ground. I see no reason why you should be blaming us for your downfall. Most of this update was unnecessary and I'm done with this company.


Hey, I think I've been in a raid with this guy.
 
2013-06-17 01:05:29 PM
A team of 60 in a company that is to say
 
2013-06-17 01:05:48 PM

dv-ous: Big promises, insufficient goal to cover those promises, didn't have an interpreter hired, didn't design the packaging right...

Sounds like a mismanaged clusterfark all around.


To be fair, these are exactly the sorts of mistakes that amateurs make in publishing or making just about anything that requires relying on outside entities to produce. There's a steep learning curve in creating goods, and it's often an expensive curve at that.
 
2013-06-17 01:06:27 PM
Kickstarter: For when you can't get a project funded by actual investors who run due dilligence.
 
2013-06-17 01:06:33 PM
Maybe he should write a book about it -- call it "Kickstarting A Business For Dummies."
 
2013-06-17 01:07:02 PM
While I am sympathetic, he needs to add "not protecting bothering to protect myself with an LLC or S-corp" to his list of stupid mistakes.

/TFA says he lives in Amsterdam, so I guess YMMV depending on where he considers himself doing business.
 
2013-06-17 01:07:18 PM
This man lost  his house one of his houses because his Kickstarter was too successful he sucks at project planning.
 
2013-06-17 01:08:31 PM
He Kickstarted not wisely, but too well.
 
2013-06-17 01:09:50 PM
How about you have your shiat together before begging people for money.
 
2013-06-17 01:11:18 PM
I was expecting a story about Kickstarter money being counted as personal assets even though he couldn't use them for personal expenditures and that somehow resulted in a foreclosure.

This story just sucked, and I completely agree with the commenter quoted at the end of the article.
 
2013-06-17 01:11:42 PM

ThatDarkFellow: I can only hope something like this happens to Tim Schafer and his "indie" outfit.

/60 team company that needs rotating projects is not a god damn indie company you greedy fark


Without those high-profile projects, I doubt half the people who actively donate to kickstarter projects would have ever heard of it. They did a lot to get the ball rolling, and really, being able to judge demand and essentially do preordering before going into production eliminates a ton of risk which is great for everyone.

The only ones that deserve to fail are the ones who can't deliver and can't keep schedule.
 
2013-06-17 01:12:59 PM
Wonder if the company that hired him will read that story, realize he's a bit moronic and he'll be out of job #2.
 
2013-06-17 01:13:06 PM

Rezurok: This man lost  his house one of his houses because his Kickstarter was too successful he sucks at project planning and was too stupid to hire an experienced logistics manager.

 
2013-06-17 01:15:53 PM
He lost his house because he tried to publish his own game.

Been a gamer since childhood, spent a lot of time hanging out in many a game store, have known the principals of a number of smaller gaming companies.  I have yet to know anyone who tried to put out a game like this that didn't end up losing their shirt.

Doesn't matter how good your game is; if you're not prepared for the business aspect of the venture, you're farked.

Dude should have sold his idea or partnered with Cheap Ass Games or a company like that.
 
2013-06-17 01:19:34 PM
A relative of mine runs a moderately sucessful RPG publishing company that also uses Kickstarter frequently to fund new releases.   Even as bright and business savvy as he is, he's run into some real nasty shocks along the way, like the incredibly high price for international frieght shipping that reneder KS contributions from overseas donors more or less a "push" with the cost to ship them their games.
 
2013-06-17 01:20:06 PM
The really funny thing is that he sort of goes on in the original rulebook for Glory to Rome about how smart he must be because he went to MIT.

I might not be very smart, but my household is solvent.
 
2013-06-17 01:20:59 PM
I was one of the backers in this Kickstarter. All I wanted to say was the end product looked great and I had no issues with the delivery time frame. But Im a patient reasonable person, so I guess Im in the minority
 
2013-06-17 01:21:52 PM

Satanic_Hamster: Been a gamer since childhood, spent a lot of time hanging out in many a game store, have known the principals of a number of smaller gaming companies. I have yet to know anyone who tried to put out a game like this that didn't end up losing their shirt.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cards_Against_Humanity
 
2013-06-17 01:24:25 PM
Call me old and grumpy but every time someone links me a kickstarter that's supposed to be the greatest thing since sliced bread, to me it just seems lame and stupid.
 
2013-06-17 01:25:19 PM

FrancoFile: Rezurok: This man lost  his house one of his houses because his Kickstarter was too successful he sucks at project planning and was too stupid to hire an experienced logistics manager.


Choosing to do business directly with China despite not speaking Chinese likely didn't help him either.  Going through a publisher, choosing a manufacturer who operated in a country where he spoke the language, or putting a disclaimer that the free shipping would only be available in certain countries could have solved him a heap of trouble.

On the bright side, it's a heck of a learning experience so next time he'll know what to do differently.
 
2013-06-17 01:28:29 PM

ProfessorOhki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cards_Against_Humanity


I know any of these people?
 
2013-06-17 01:33:59 PM
I like Kickstarter, but I know going in that I'm not getting an order like Amazon, I'm not getting a refund or any customer service, and the money is gone if the project flops. So it's my job to do due diligence before handing cash over.

Any project with grandiose claims and no demo (even a PDF for print and play testing) is automatically out, no matter how cool. Any project that talks about developing rather than producing something (as in, "I have an idea so give me money" rather than "I have a basic working concept and need money to make it cool")  is out. Any project that claims to be revolutionary is out.

So far, I've got a pretty good track record and have received some pretty cool stuff. But I'm not an investor; I'm buying an idea.
 
2013-06-17 01:35:01 PM

Satanic_Hamster: ProfessorOhki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cards_Against_Humanity

I know any of these people?


Ah, the semantics between, "know" and "know of." Technically correct, yet it turns your original post from simply mistaken to "CSB."
 
2013-06-17 01:35:31 PM
So, I'm confused.

Guy starts Kickstarter campaign to fund his hobby, promising free shipping for folks that donate, even though he actually has no idea what global shipping costs would be involved.
Guy outsources work to China, although he can't speak Chinese nor conduct business there in any knowledgeable manner.
Guy screws up Chinese business relationship and Chinese romantic relationship, leaving him unable to communicate or work with with outsourcer.
Guy screws up shipping arrangements, resulting in damaged games and high shipping costs.
Guy's hobby eats into his work time, screwing up his day job, blowing his finances, and costing him a house.

Article's take? "This man lost his house because his Kickstarter was too successful." Really?

No. This man is out six figures because he's a goddamned moron. That's it. Anyone who would donate to any other Kickstarter effort led or connected to this guy is a fool.
 
2013-06-17 01:37:29 PM
As I recall, the Ogre Designer's Edition from Steve Jackson Games also had difficulty breaking even despite getting almost $1 million in Kickstarter funds, and that had a bunch of experienced professionals working on it.  So it's no surprise when amateurs wind up suffering from Stretch Goal scope creep and get in way over their heads.
 
2013-06-17 01:38:00 PM

Jument: Call me old and grumpy but every time someone links me a kickstarter that's supposed to be the greatest thing since sliced bread, to me it just seems lame and stupid.


No, you're just pragmatic - most such efforts I've seen on Kickstarter are just that. There have been a couple of worthwhile efforts, and I've donated to them, but for the most part, I skip anything that claims to be "revolutionary" or appears to be based on vaporware of any sort, and far too much of what's on Kickstarter appears to be just that.
 
2013-06-17 01:38:08 PM

secularsage: To be fair, these are exactly the sorts of mistakes that amateurs make in publishing or making just about anything that requires relying on outside entities to produce.


I would hope that most people would be smart enough to not offer free worldwide shipping on something as physically large as a board game, or to fail to tell anyone that pallets of cardboard boxes were too fragile to stack, or any of the other obvious mistakes the article lists.

Honestly, I have some sympathy for him (running a small business in a creative field is hard work and rarely profitable), but it doesn't change the fact that he's clearly a dumbass. It's like watching one of those realty shows where people who have never worked in a restaurant try to run a restaurant, then are astonished when they go bankrupt in six months.
 
2013-06-17 01:38:52 PM

lemurs: As I recall, the Ogre Designer's Edition from Steve Jackson Games also had difficulty breaking even despite getting almost $1 million in Kickstarter funds, and that had a bunch of experienced professionals working on it.  So it's no surprise when amateurs wind up suffering from Stretch Goal scope creep and get in way over their heads.


Bingo.
 
2013-06-17 01:39:04 PM

ProfessorOhki: Satanic_Hamster: ProfessorOhki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cards_Against_Humanity

I know any of these people?

Ah, the semantics between, "know" and "know of." Technically correct, yet it turns your original post from simply mistaken to "CSB."


Just as yours in.  You found a business that didn't fail, that means no businesses fail!

And there's no "technical" about it.  You misread what I said.

Gaming industry is just like the restaurant industry; anyone can get into it and odds are the majority of them are going to fail.
 
2013-06-17 01:39:12 PM
and his relationship with a Chinese girl fell apart, leaving him with nobody who could speak Chinese.

That was your plan? You picked up a Chinese GF so you could work with China?
 
2013-06-17 01:40:10 PM

FormlessOne: lemurs: As I recall, the Ogre Designer's Edition from Steve Jackson Games also had difficulty breaking even despite getting almost $1 million in Kickstarter funds, and that had a bunch of experienced professionals working on it.  So it's no surprise when amateurs wind up suffering from Stretch Goal scope creep and get in way over their heads.

Bingo.


We're going to lose a little money on each one, but we'll make up for it in volume!
 
2013-06-17 01:46:42 PM

Satanic_Hamster: ProfessorOhki: Satanic_Hamster: ProfessorOhki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cards_Against_Humanity

I know any of these people?

Ah, the semantics between, "know" and "know of." Technically correct, yet it turns your original post from simply mistaken to "CSB."

Just as yours in.  You found a business that didn't fail, that means no businesses fail!

And there's no "technical" about it.  You misread what I said.

Gaming industry is just like the restaurant industry; anyone can get into it and odds are the majority of them are going to fail.


Sure, most fail. It just sounded an awful lot like you were trying to communicate, "there have been no self-published kickstarter-funded games that weren't disasters," which isn't accurate.

Yes, I misread your post; I expected it to contain something to TFA and that was my error. You got me.
 
2013-06-17 01:47:17 PM
*something relevant to
 
2013-06-17 01:49:31 PM

TuteTibiImperes: FormlessOne: lemurs: As I recall, the Ogre Designer's Edition from Steve Jackson Games also had difficulty breaking even despite getting almost $1 million in Kickstarter funds, and that had a bunch of experienced professionals working on it.  So it's no surprise when amateurs wind up suffering from Stretch Goal scope creep and get in way over their heads.

Bingo.

We're going to lose a little money on each one, but we'll make up for it in volume!


encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com
 
2013-06-17 01:52:40 PM

ProfessorOhki: Sure, most fail. It just sounded an awful lot like you were trying to communicate, "there have been no self-published kickstarter-funded games that weren't disasters," which isn't accurate.

Yes, I misread your post; I expected it to contain something to TFA and that was my error. You got me.


Yep.

Like I said, I know a lot of people in the gaming industry and a number of tried to go the self publishing route, pre-kickstarter.  The failure rate is DAMN high.  Trying to self publish a game is pretty much throwing your money away, even if you have an awesome game.
 
2013-06-17 01:52:59 PM

Pick13: How about you have your shiat together before begging people for money.


Why? Haven't you seen the Fark beg threads? Idiots are more than willing to give people money for dubious reasons via the Internet.
 
2013-06-17 01:54:29 PM

FrancoFile: Rezurok: This man lost  his house one of his houses because his Kickstarter was too successful he sucks at project planning and was too stupid to hire an experienced logistics manager he thought that banging a Chinese girl was all he needed in order to work properly with Chinese businesses.


Also this.
 
2013-06-17 01:55:20 PM

secularsage: dv-ous: Big promises, insufficient goal to cover those promises, didn't have an interpreter hired, didn't design the packaging right...

Sounds like a mismanaged clusterfark all around.

To be fair, these are exactly the sorts of mistakes that amateurs make in publishing or making just about anything that requires relying on outside entities to produce. There's a steep learning curve in creating goods, and it's often an expensive curve at that.


It's an easy learning curve actually.  Businesses are not your friends.  Businesses are not competent.  Businesses WILL fark up in creative and unexpected ways.  Businesses will NOT accept responsibility for their fark up without an iron clad contract and possibly law enforcement on your side, but don't rely on that.  Triple check EVERYTHING!
 
2013-06-17 01:56:25 PM

TuteTibiImperes: FormlessOne: lemurs: As I recall, the Ogre Designer's Edition from Steve Jackson Games also had difficulty breaking even despite getting almost $1 million in Kickstarter funds, and that had a bunch of experienced professionals working on it.  So it's no surprise when amateurs wind up suffering from Stretch Goal scope creep and get in way over their heads.

Bingo.

We're going to lose a little money on each one, but we'll make up for it in volume!


sounds like they need a sale!
 
2013-06-17 02:03:03 PM
FTFA : Running out of cash and faced with expenses from every avenue, Carter stopped making the mortgage on a house he owned outside Boston, which was also his company address. He eventually lost the house. (Carter, who lives in Amsterdam, admits that had he lived in the Boston house, he might not have sacrificed it for the game.)

He lives in Amsterdam, but owns a house in Boston which is his business address?  This doesn't sound like a "my company lost money" story, it smells like a "I'm a scam artist" story.
 
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