If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(The Detroit_News)   Detroit to lower property taxes, which will cause people to flock to live in the city   (detroitnews.com) divider line 128
    More: Unlikely, Detroit, Orr, property taxes, emergency managers  
•       •       •

3194 clicks; posted to Main » on 14 Jun 2013 at 2:49 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



128 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

Archived thread
 
2013-06-14 02:51:46 PM
Properties in Detroit are worth enough money to pay taxes on?
 
2013-06-14 02:53:20 PM
THOG MOVE INTO EMPTY CAVE, THOG NOT-

err,

If you don't ask permission then it's free.
 
2013-06-14 02:54:12 PM
Detroit is going to need bigger negative integers.
 
2013-06-14 02:54:22 PM

Ethertap: Properties in Detroit are worth enough money to pay taxes on?


Yes. And the city has literally millions in unpaid taxes.
 
2013-06-14 02:54:25 PM
Wasn't this the same city that were practically giving away houses to police stationed there but they still opted out?

I've read haunting articles about the rapid (and continuing) decline of this city and at some point it will only house people who can't afford to move out of it. That will be an ugly time for this place.

/I love Tampa
 
2013-06-14 02:54:29 PM
How is Detroit able to fill stadiums of four pro sports teams? Is there a magic fairy land of jobs in the suburbs?
 
2013-06-14 02:56:06 PM
Something about Michigan, not just Detroit, that seems to just make the govt make everything cost more. On top of no-fault auto insurance, our gas/property tax rates are stupid.

Was in Florida for a while and man was that awesome for the insurance/no state tax/gas tax rates, money seemed like it went so much farther.

Still, Michigan is an awesome state for what there is in terms of things to do. I've known a lot of stupid people, myself included, who've moved out and missed MI enough to come back and deal with the high taxes.
 
2013-06-14 02:57:38 PM

Ethertap: Properties in Detroit are worth enough money to pay taxes on?


A surprising amount of taxes, actually, for what you get in return.  My uncle rents properties, and appealed a number of assessments he got with his real estate appraiser sister.  They turned him down on all of them, which is why forgive me if I'm rolling my eyes pretty goddamn hard right now.

Mrbogey: Ethertap: Properties in Detroit are worth enough money to pay taxes on?

Yes. And the city has literally millions in unpaid taxes.


And they could go after the slumlords with more vigor (they = emergency manager), but ah, f--k it, let's sell off the DIA.
 
2013-06-14 02:57:53 PM

Ethertap: Properties in Detroit are worth enough money to pay taxes on?


Sure, the taxes are low, but when you add in the cost of a stamp and an envelope...
 
2013-06-14 02:57:55 PM

Decillion: How is Detroit able to fill stadiums of four pro sports teams? Is there a magic fairy land of jobs in the suburbs?


Doesn't hurt that Detroit is adjacent to one of top 3 richest counties in the nation ya know.
 
2013-06-14 02:59:02 PM

Decillion: How is Detroit able to fill stadiums of four pro sports teams? Is there a magic fairy land of jobs in the suburbs?


Compared to the city itself? Yes.

That said, my uncle works downtown and used to live downtown, too, until he realized he could live just north of the city and not have to drive for 20 minutes just to get to a decent grocery store. Property taxes aren't what's keeping people from living in Detroit.
 
2013-06-14 02:59:28 PM
What Detroit needs is a TV series that combines elements of The Wire with Robocop.
 
2013-06-14 03:00:12 PM

StreetlightInTheGhetto: And they could go after the slumlords with more vigor (they = emergency manager), but ah, f--k it, let's sell off the DIA.


PLEASE.  He was pointing out that the creditors might go after the art, not that HE wanted to.  It was a warning: fix the problem.
 
2013-06-14 03:01:16 PM
Privatize the city, like a sci-fi movie.
 
2013-06-14 03:02:32 PM

forteblast: Decillion: How is Detroit able to fill stadiums of four pro sports teams? Is there a magic fairy land of jobs in the suburbs?

Compared to the city itself? Yes.

That said, my uncle works downtown and used to live downtown, too, until he realized he could live just north of the city and not have to drive for 20 minutes just to get to a decent grocery store. Property taxes aren't what's keeping people from living in Detroit.


a Whole Foods just opened in Midtown
 
2013-06-14 03:04:05 PM

dumbobruni: forteblast: Decillion: How is Detroit able to fill stadiums of four pro sports teams? Is there a magic fairy land of jobs in the suburbs?

Compared to the city itself? Yes.

That said, my uncle works downtown and used to live downtown, too, until he realized he could live just north of the city and not have to drive for 20 minutes just to get to a decent grocery store. Property taxes aren't what's keeping people from living in Detroit.

a Whole Foods just opened in Midtown


Exception that proves the rule.

Meijer will open another soon, near Eight Mile I believe.  Another exception.
 
2013-06-14 03:05:59 PM
I read an article a few months ago of some people in the D not paying any tax, and no one came after them..

lower in hopes they pay something? lol
 
2013-06-14 03:08:13 PM
Sounds like the dickhead unelected Emergency Manager wants to cut revenue as an excuse to cut further services.
 
2013-06-14 03:08:39 PM
No, the democrat way is to tax people more and then use that tax money to make people want to live in Detroit.
 
2013-06-14 03:10:17 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: No, the democrat way is to tax people more and then use that tax money to make people want to live in Detroit.


Well with taxes in the city more than double the national average, it's obviously working.
 
2013-06-14 03:11:17 PM

dumbobruni: a Whole Foods just opened in Midtown


I said a decent grocery store. You know, the kind of place where you can buy food once or twice a week and not bankrupt yourself.

JohnAnnArbor: Meijer will open another soon, near Eight Mile I believe. Another exception.


Wouldn't have helped, he lived near the river. Speaking of which... you really miss Meijer when you leave Michigan.
 
2013-06-14 03:12:20 PM
Removing all the corrupt politicians from the city counsel and government leadership would have an even bigger impact. Making a huge personal property investment in an area with a corrupt, unstable government is just nuts.
 
2013-06-14 03:12:41 PM
THE CHINESE WILL BE RIGHT OVER.

/because we let them
 
2013-06-14 03:12:45 PM

RepoManTSM: Sounds like the dickhead unelected Emergency Manager wants to cut revenue as an excuse to cut further services.


That must be why he announced today he was stopping payment on Detroit debt payments and diverting that into city services.

/Reading is fundamental; it's all over the media.
 
2013-06-14 03:13:01 PM

JohnAnnArbor: dumbobruni: forteblast: Decillion: How is Detroit able to fill stadiums of four pro sports teams? Is there a magic fairy land of jobs in the suburbs?

Compared to the city itself? Yes.

That said, my uncle works downtown and used to live downtown, too, until he realized he could live just north of the city and not have to drive for 20 minutes just to get to a decent grocery store. Property taxes aren't what's keeping people from living in Detroit.

a Whole Foods just opened in Midtown

Exception that proves the rule.

Meijer will open another soon, near Eight Mile I believe.  Another exception.


but what about Honey Bee, Harbortown Market, and Eastern Market?
 
2013-06-14 03:13:07 PM
Lower taxes?

i761.photobucket.com
 
2013-06-14 03:13:23 PM
Detroit has a lot interesting stuff going on. Lots of young people are moving in because it's cheap.

Think of any formerly-rundown-now-gentrified neighborhood in your city - it's like that, in the early stages. But on a bigger scale.
 
2013-06-14 03:13:47 PM

rko281: Removing all the corrupt politicians from the city counsel and government leadership would have an even bigger impact. Making a huge personal property investment in an area with a corrupt, unstable government is just nuts.


No, we can't do that. Anyone not from Detroit is going to bring back slavery.
 
2013-06-14 03:14:24 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: No, the democrat way is to tax people more and then use that tax money to make people want to live in Detroit.


The Detroit way is to:
1) blame whitey.
2) ???
3) Profit! (and embezzle the shiat out of the money that the city actually does get, or hand it out to your cronies)

/don't know nothin bout no god damn krugerrands!
 
2013-06-14 03:15:42 PM

forteblast: dumbobruni: a Whole Foods just opened in Midtown

I said a decent grocery store. You know, the kind of place where you can buy food once or twice a week and not bankrupt yourself.

JohnAnnArbor: Meijer will open another soon, near Eight Mile I believe. Another exception.

Wouldn't have helped, he lived near the river. Speaking of which... you really miss Meijer when you leave Michigan.


Walmart not good enough for ya?

/jk lol
//I heart Meijer so much
///I'm leery of eminent domain (my grandma remembered when Poletown got destroyed for the freeway), but I would be okay with eminent domaining, say, the urban prairie next to Hamtramck so Meijer could build within the city proper and not on the Warren (I'm speculating) border.  But if that one does fine, who knows.
 
2013-06-14 03:15:43 PM
As soon as those taxes drop, I'm buying the old packard plant and building some fine automobiles!
 
2013-06-14 03:16:47 PM

MichiganFTL: rko281: Removing all the corrupt politicians from the city counsel and government leadership would have an even bigger impact. Making a huge personal property investment in an area with a corrupt, unstable government is just nuts.

No, we can't do that. Anyone not from Detroit is going to bring back slavery.


SHREK!

/treat me with respect. Cause I'm tired of that. Be respectful. You may not do that at home, but you gonna do it up in here.
 
2013-06-14 03:19:40 PM

legion_of_doo: The Detroit way is to:
1) blame whitey.


You sound white. And Republican.
 
2013-06-14 03:19:58 PM

jaytkay: Detroit has a lot interesting stuff going on. Lots of young people are moving in because it's cheap.

Think of any formerly-rundown-now-gentrified neighborhood in your city - it's like that, in the early stages. But on a bigger scale.


Despite the fact that a) my auto insurance would double overnight, b) I couldn't count on police response for anything, and c) lack of decent public transport (the buses are wretched and getting budgets slashed anyhow)... I'd move to Detroit in a heartbeat if it didn't mean an hour long commute to work and if I could find a decent neighborhood.  Hamtramck for sure.  There's awesome, awesome stuff going on there now and I only get to experience it vicariously through my friends.
 
2013-06-14 03:20:52 PM

tbhouston: I read an article a few months ago of some people in the D not paying any tax, and no one came after them..

lower in hopes they pay something? lol


Well you have to pay people to go after them. I wonder if there's a threshold where the govt simply says "not worth it"
 
2013-06-14 03:22:44 PM

dumbobruni: JohnAnnArbor: dumbobruni: forteblast: Decillion: How is Detroit able to fill stadiums of four pro sports teams? Is there a magic fairy land of jobs in the suburbs?

Compared to the city itself? Yes.

That said, my uncle works downtown and used to live downtown, too, until he realized he could live just north of the city and not have to drive for 20 minutes just to get to a decent grocery store. Property taxes aren't what's keeping people from living in Detroit.

a Whole Foods just opened in Midtown

Exception that proves the rule.

Meijer will open another soon, near Eight Mile I believe.  Another exception.

but what about Honey Bee, Harbortown Market, and Eastern Market?


I think Harbortown is where he ended up going, and Trader Joe's in Grosse Pointe on occasion. Both 15-20 minutes away.

Anyway...

www.necro-equine-sadism.com
 
2013-06-14 03:22:58 PM
Also, how unimaginative is your transportation department? The People Mover?
 
2013-06-14 03:24:41 PM
I have been looking for a job and received a call the other day that went like this:

Caller:  "Mr. Buttknuckle, we have several positions that you would be a great fit.  Are you willing to relocate?"

Me:  "Oh sure.  I have no dependents and am open to a new environment."

Caller: "Fantastic.  We have a terrific position available in Detroit."

Me: "No.  I meant I would relocate anywhere but Detroit."

Caller:  "Understood.  I figured."
 
2013-06-14 03:25:15 PM

thecpt: Also, how unimaginative is your transportation department? The People Mover?


That's "Coleman's Train" to you.

/sung to the tune of "Purple Rain."
 
2013-06-14 03:26:00 PM

thecpt: Also, how unimaginative is your transportation department? The People Mover?


I had a keychain for awhile that celebrated the first anniversary of the People Mover and said "THANKS FOR RIDING THE SKY!" on it.  Then it broke and I lost it.

When I was a little kid, riding that thing in circles was a crazy cheap way for my Dad to keep us entertained.  The only time it's ever actually been useful for me is going to Greektown to get food while working a convention at Cobo.  So, um, one weekend.  Took it from the Ren Cen to Greektown as well but at that point you might as well just walk it.
 
2013-06-14 03:26:10 PM
I'm starting to think Detroit needs city walls for protection, like in the old anarchic days of city-states. But. Like. The other way around.
 
2013-06-14 03:26:37 PM

StreetlightInTheGhetto: Walmart not good enough for ya?


*cringe*

I like Publix though. Kind of reminds me of Busch's.
 
2013-06-14 03:27:59 PM
They don't have tax auctions in Detroit?
 
2013-06-14 03:28:22 PM

Buttknuckle: I have been looking for a job and received a call the other day that went like this:

Caller:  "Mr. Buttknuckle, we have several positions that you would be a great fit.  Are you willing to relocate?"

Me:  "Oh sure.  I have no dependents and am open to a new environment."

Caller: "Fantastic.  We have a terrific position available in Detroit."

Me: "No.  I meant I would relocate anywhere but Detroit."

Caller:  "Understood.  I figured."


Sounds like Compuware was calling.
 
2013-06-14 03:28:38 PM
Squatters don't pay taxes now, and are not going to start.
 
2013-06-14 03:29:10 PM

Gunny Walker: They don't have tax auctions in Detroit?


It's been difficult to arrange since the signs keep getting stolen to sell the wire for scrap metal.
 
2013-06-14 03:30:08 PM

Gunny Walker: They don't have tax auctions in Detroit?


They do, but it's very disorganized.  If they do figure out you're delinquent on taxes (a BIG if), you yourself can go to the auction, buy your property for less than the tax bill, then start over with a $0 property tax balance.  People have done that.
 
2013-06-14 03:32:57 PM

StreetlightInTheGhetto: thecpt: Also, how unimaginative is your transportation department? The People Mover?

I had a keychain for awhile that celebrated the first anniversary of the People Mover and said "THANKS FOR RIDING THE SKY!" on it.  Then it broke and I lost it.

When I was a little kid, riding that thing in circles was a crazy cheap way for my Dad to keep us entertained.  The only time it's ever actually been useful for me is going to Greektown to get food while working a convention at Cobo.  So, um, one weekend.  Took it from the Ren Cen to Greektown as well but at that point you might as well just walk it.


I mean thank gawd it was there. After stuffing myself with gyros, saganaki, and baclava how the hell was I going to waddle my suddenly top heavy self all the way to tiger stadium/comerica?
 
2013-06-14 03:36:30 PM

jaytkay: legion_of_doo: The Detroit way is to:
1) blame whitey.

You sound white. And Republican.


You sound like you've never been to Detroit.
 
2013-06-14 03:42:39 PM

JohnAnnArbor: Gunny Walker: They don't have tax auctions in Detroit?

They do, but it's very disorganized.  If they do figure out you're delinquent on taxes (a BIG if), you yourself can go to the auction, buy your property for less than the tax bill, then start over with a $0 property tax balance.  People have done that.


In TN, bidding starts at amount owed plus any other leins the county might have against it. If no one bids, the county buys the property by writing off the taxes. And you'd be stupid to buy your own at a tax auction, because you'd have fees, penalties, and maybe even a bidding war to jack the expense up. Regardless, people who don't pay taxes, lose it in three years. (I've seen leniency for bankruptcies, but the taxes still accrue.)
 
2013-06-14 03:46:53 PM

JohnAnnArbor: Buttknuckle: I have been looking for a job and received a call the other day that went like this:

Caller:  "Mr. Buttknuckle, we have several positions that you would be a great fit.  Are you willing to relocate?"

Me:  "Oh sure.  I have no dependents and am open to a new environment."

Caller: "Fantastic.  We have a terrific position available in Detroit."

Me: "No.  I meant I would relocate anywhere but Detroit."

Caller:  "Understood.  I figured."

Sounds like Compuware was calling.


Could've been.  I have wiped the name of the company from my mind.
 
2013-06-14 03:47:06 PM
2.bp.blogspot.com
 
2013-06-14 03:49:16 PM
Back in the 90s Detroit implemented a Homestead program.  Basically, anyone who took over an abandoned property and paid to bring it up to code would have the house and property free with all back property taxes forgiven.  Hundreds of people moved in and spent tens of thousands of dollars renovating these homes, raising the property values of the surrounding housing and bringing revenue into the city.  The program worked beautifully.

Then in 2001 Kwame Kilpatrick was elected.  He and the city council immediately cancelled the program and sent these "squatters" bills for 10s or 100s of thousands of dollars in back taxes threatening seizure.  All of those investors abandoned their homes.  Not one of those reclaimed properties is a livable residence today.

Anyone who believes this and gets suckered in deserves what they get.
 
2013-06-14 03:50:08 PM

jaytkay: Detroit has a lot interesting stuff going on. Lots of young people are moving in because it's cheap.

Think of any formerly-rundown-now-gentrified neighborhood in your city - it's like that, in the early stages. But on a bigger scale.


I visited home last wknd. Went to a Detroit FC soccer game at Cass Tech. Nothing but white hipsters as far as the eye could see. That said only a small percentage live in midtown or corktown. The long and short is a few coffee shops and artisan bakeries will not fix a city designed for 2 million. It's a great start but they need to draw families to the city and that's schools, police, fire (insert basic city service here). Those currently do not exist.
 
2013-06-14 03:50:32 PM
Isn't it about time we wall up Detroit, Escape from NY style?
 
d23 [TotalFark]
2013-06-14 03:50:34 PM
Not when it's 20-30 miles just to go to a supermarket.
 
2013-06-14 03:51:00 PM
StreetlightinTheGhetto: thecpt: Also, how unimaginative is your transportation department? The People Mover?

I had a keychain for awhile that celebrated the first anniversary of the People Mover and said "THANKS FOR RIDING THE SKY!" on it.  Then it broke and I lost it.


That People Mover has to be hands down the dumbest "mass transit" system I've ever ridden.

If you've never been to Detroit, let me describe it.  It's an elevated train system that doesn't go to any suburb or any connecting city, all it does is go around its rather small-ish downtown area - so basically wherever it goes - you could just easily walk.   Basically, all it does is connect you to the location where you parked your car.  You still have to use your car to pretty much commute home, hence totally negating the point of having a train system in the first place.  Who thought of this dumb system?

It's like a real life version of the Disneyland Monorail and just as useful (Seattle can be forgiven for its useless Monorail as its just something from the World's fair).
 
2013-06-14 03:51:33 PM
By lowering tax rates, he's going to make it a bit more likely that current homeowners will actually pay their property tax. That'll drive at least some revenue to the city.

That should be combined with revised tax bills for unpaid bills.

Detroit it's a prime example of the Democratic tax philosophy. Tax, and if we get less revenue from that tax people more while we provide less services. Then the only ones left paying taxes are, well, suckers.

The property valuations have been overstated for years, by any measure, according to the article.
 
2013-06-14 03:53:05 PM
"What the average Detroiter needs to understand is that where we are right now is a culmination of years and years and years of kicking the can down the road," said Orr, adding that his proposal should not be seen as a "hostile act" but as a step in the right direction.

Dear rest of America....prepare for "steps in the right direction".
 
2013-06-14 03:59:36 PM

AngryDragon: Back in the 90s Detroit implemented a Homestead program.  Basically, anyone who took over an abandoned property and paid to bring it up to code would have the house and property free with all back property taxes forgiven.  Hundreds of people moved in and spent tens of thousands of dollars renovating these homes, raising the property values of the surrounding housing and bringing revenue into the city.  The program worked beautifully.

Then in 2001 Kwame Kilpatrick was elected.  He and the city council immediately cancelled the program and sent these "squatters" bills for 10s or 100s of thousands of dollars in back taxes threatening seizure.  All of those investors abandoned their homes.  Not one of those reclaimed properties is a livable residence today.

Anyone who believes this and gets suckered in deserves what they get.


Wow.  Really?  I don't remember that one.
 
2013-06-14 04:02:34 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: No, the democrat way is to tax people more and then use that tax money to make people want to live in Detroit.


And, in theory, that should work perfectly. It's probably sabotage by the CIA agents and kulaks that makes it fail in practice.

/if only Detroit had a Federal Reserve mint, then they could print all the money they need and everybody would be rich
//in theory
 
2013-06-14 04:03:27 PM

SirEattonHogg: Who thought of this dumb system?


I would suspect, and I know nothing about this system at all, someone who intended on using it as a hub.  And perhaps never got around to it.
 
2013-06-14 04:05:16 PM

legion_of_doo: jaytkay: legion_of_doo: The Detroit way is to:
1) blame whitey.

You sound white. And Republican.

You sound like you've never been to Detroit.


I sound like I don't reflexively spew racist bile at the mention of "Detroit".

I lived in the Detroit suburbs for a few years and spent plenty of time in the city.
 
2013-06-14 04:06:47 PM

Decillion: How is Detroit able to fill stadiums of four pro sports teams? Is there a magic fairy land of jobs in the suburbs?


Detroit: <1M people
Metro Detroit: 4.3M people.

Its the 14th largest metropolitan area in the country.
 
2013-06-14 04:09:25 PM
www.dreamstime.com

People have to eat too, you know.
 
2013-06-14 04:11:23 PM

bunner: [www.dreamstime.com image 400x266]

People have to eat too, you know.


Problem: over a century of industry, much of it before environmental regulations started.   Just one example.
 
2013-06-14 04:13:36 PM

JohnAnnArbor: AngryDragon: Back in the 90s Detroit implemented a Homestead program.  Basically, anyone who took over an abandoned property and paid to bring it up to code would have the house and property free with all back property taxes forgiven.  Hundreds of people moved in and spent tens of thousands of dollars renovating these homes, raising the property values of the surrounding housing and bringing revenue into the city.  The program worked beautifully.

Then in 2001 Kwame Kilpatrick was elected.  He and the city council immediately cancelled the program and sent these "squatters" bills for 10s or 100s of thousands of dollars in back taxes threatening seizure.  All of those investors abandoned their homes.  Not one of those reclaimed properties is a livable residence today.

Anyone who believes this and gets suckered in deserves what they get.

Wow.  Really?  I don't remember that one.


Having trouble finding a source.  I was considering investing in one of these when the story broke about homesteaders getting served with massive back tax bills though.  I immediately changed my mind.
 
2013-06-14 04:14:59 PM
IIRC, a few years ago you could be a 'house' in Detroit for $100 give or take, but the property taxes on it were $5000/year.
 
2013-06-14 04:17:58 PM

Gunny Walker: They don't have tax auctions in Detroit?


You need willing buyers.

Tax buyers expect either:

A) The property owner gets their shiat together and pays all the taxes and interest and a little profit

- or -

B) The tax buyer gets a worthwhile property for cheap.
  In much of Detroit, neither possibility exists.
 
2013-06-14 04:18:52 PM
TheGreatGazoo

IIRC, a few years ago you could be a 'house' in Detroit for $100 give or take, but the property taxes on it were $5000/year.

So yet more proof that lower taxes is better for revenue.

It's almost like this could be applied elsewhere. nawwwwwwwww.
 
2013-06-14 04:22:07 PM

bullsballs: As soon as those taxes drop, I'm buying the old packard plant and building some fine automobiles!


The Packard property is up for auction in September. It's extremely unlikely to sell for the full tax bill ($975,000).

So then the price drops to $21,500 in auction round two.

Link
 
2013-06-14 04:22:58 PM
We built factories and churches and salons and banks, and dug all the minerals out of the earth and turned them into stuff.

And the rest we burned so we could be jazzed with electricity and refrigeration.

And a handful of old men died with enough money to make Croesus blush.

So we sift through the wreckage of their abandoned palaces, trying to put a wrench to the misaligned wheels that used to turn so regally.  And we scratch the broken ground.  And we talk of hope.
 
2013-06-14 04:23:32 PM

JohnAnnArbor: Gunny Walker: They don't have tax auctions in Detroit?

They do, but it's very disorganized.  If they do figure out you're delinquent on taxes (a BIG if), you yourself can go to the auction, buy your property for less than the tax bill, then start over with a $0 property tax balance.  People have done that.


theres really nothing wrong with that. if the city cant collect and is willing to sell at market rate what do they care who buys it? if the debt was worth more someone would bid against them.
 
2013-06-14 04:24:09 PM

chaddsfarkprefect: Privatize the city, like a sci-fi movie.


They did, that's what farked it up in the first place.

Detroit was designed to fail.


Personally, I'd love to buy a historic old home there. I hear good things about urban farming and the burgeoning artist scene. But I'm still nervous about the crime so I doubt I'd move there.
 
2013-06-14 04:27:07 PM

Mrs.Sharpier: chaddsfarkprefect: Privatize the city, like a sci-fi movie.

They did, that's what farked it up in the first place.

Detroit was designed to fail.


Personally, I'd love to buy a historic old home there. I hear good things about urban farming and the burgeoning artist scene. But I'm still nervous about the crime so I doubt I'd move there.


There is almost nothing privatized in the city of Detroit.
 
2013-06-14 04:27:17 PM

MichiganFTL: Decillion: How is Detroit able to fill stadiums of four pro sports teams? Is there a magic fairy land of jobs in the suburbs?

Doesn't hurt that Detroit is adjacent to one of top 3 richest counties in the nation ya know.


Is that Anne Arbor?  I hear it's nice and someone at work plugged it as an awesome place to live (except for the cold)
 
2013-06-14 04:28:32 PM

mike_d85: MichiganFTL: Decillion: How is Detroit able to fill stadiums of four pro sports teams? Is there a magic fairy land of jobs in the suburbs?

Doesn't hurt that Detroit is adjacent to one of top 3 richest counties in the nation ya know.

Is that Anne Arbor?  I hear it's nice and someone at work plugged it as an awesome place to live (except for the cold)


No, Oakland County.  Ann Arbor is in Washtenaw County.
 
2013-06-14 04:31:54 PM

jaytkay: Gunny Walker: They don't have tax auctions in Detroit?

You need willing buyers.

Tax buyers expect either:

A) The property owner gets their shiat together and pays all the taxes and interest and a little profit

- or -

B) The tax buyer gets a worthwhile property for cheap.
  In much of Detroit, neither possibility exists.


theres a c that is a huge problem too. your property tax lien you bought can get shoved below a irs tax lien. if that happens you have to pay it if you foreclose or basically write it off.

if you do file a tax foreclosure and no one bids on the property you are going to be kind of farked too unless you really want it. buying liens is high risk and the property should be worth way more than you are paying.

some places get around the issue of people buying their own liens by doing them in blocks too. so you dont bid on one lien, you bid on 150 of them or some number.
 
2013-06-14 04:33:50 PM
It that everything I read about Detroit, the citizens are frustrated because no one can build anything nice there without it getting ripped off because the politicians are corrupt and the cops are way too slow to respond to violent crime. I saw something where Wendy's put in a store in a neighborhood and citizens literally guarded it on their own time against robbery because they were scared it would get robbed too many times and corporate would shut it down. They were that desperate for some kind of... anything there. It was really sad.

If I had the money, I would resettle Detroit like the western frontier. Right now it's basically a lawless wasteland, right? So I would incorporate a new town right in the middle of the worst of it. I would build a factory making something simple, like storm drain grates or cast iron cookware or something, taking advantage of the low labor costs. The taxes on the factory would provide for a police force for the factory and the few blocks around it, which would house workers who wanted to live there.Having a beat heart to the economy of this micro-city would hopefully encourage other people to start supporting businesses like laundries and restaurants and whatnot and that would increase the tax base and the police-protected area would expand to the point where we could build schools and hospitals etc.

Rebuild Detroit from the inside out.
 
2013-06-14 04:39:26 PM

Mrs.Sharpier: chaddsfarkprefect: Privatize the city, like a sci-fi movie.

They did, that's what farked it up in the first place.


Virtually nothing in Detroit is privatized.

What farked it up was having one party run the city for fifty years.  Almost every city like that is a shiathole.  Usually the party is the Democrats, but that's mostly just demographics.
 
2013-06-14 04:39:40 PM
not to mention despite what the late night tv shows tell you its not like 'oh they didnt pay their tax lien so i got a million dollar property for 50k!'.

you are going to have to hire attornies, ensure proper notices get sent and the required amount of time elapses, then file the foreclosure and go through that hellful process (the banks dont take like a year to do a foreclosure because they are idiots, it is a ton of shiat that takes foreverand the courts are overloaded). then you have to send the property to auction and have the required notices and time elapse. at this point whoever owns the thing surely hasnt touched it in forever so you are probobly walking into code enforcement issues and god knows what else if you buy it. also if there is someone squating their you will have to file an eviction and go through that long ass process before you can even access what you bought.
 
2013-06-14 04:39:41 PM

jaytkay: legion_of_doo: jaytkay: legion_of_doo: The Detroit way is to:
1) blame whitey.

You sound white. And Republican.

You sound like you've never been to Detroit.

I sound like I don't reflexively spew racist bile at the mention of "Detroit".

I lived in the Detroit suburbs for a few years and spent plenty of time in the city.


Racist scum.
 
2013-06-14 04:41:23 PM

Magnanimous_J: It that everything I read about Detroit, the citizens are frustrated because no one can build anything nice there without it getting ripped off because the politicians are corrupt and the cops are way too slow to respond to violent crime. I saw something where Wendy's put in a store in a neighborhood and citizens literally guarded it on their own time against robbery because they were scared it would get robbed too many times and corporate would shut it down. They were that desperate for some kind of... anything there. It was really sad.

If I had the money, I would resettle Detroit like the western frontier. Right now it's basically a lawless wasteland, right? So I would incorporate a new town right in the middle of the worst of it. I would build a factory making something simple, like storm drain grates or cast iron cookware or something, taking advantage of the low labor costs. The taxes on the factory would provide for a police force for the factory and the few blocks around it, which would house workers who wanted to live there.Having a beat heart to the economy of this micro-city would hopefully encourage other people to start supporting businesses like laundries and restaurants and whatnot and that would increase the tax base and the police-protected area would expand to the point where we could build schools and hospitals etc.

Rebuild Detroit from the inside out.


This would fail miserably.  The regulatory hurdles to incorporate, let alone build a factory, would drive you broke.  The powers-that-be like to retain that power.
 
2013-06-14 04:47:05 PM

Magnanimous_J: It that everything I read about Detroit, the citizens are frustrated because no one can build anything nice there without it getting ripped off because the politicians are corrupt and the cops are way too slow to respond to violent crime. I saw something where Wendy's put in a store in a neighborhood and citizens literally guarded it on their own time against robbery because they were scared it would get robbed too many times and corporate would shut it down. They were that desperate for some kind of... anything there. It was really sad.

If I had the money, I would resettle Detroit like the western frontier. Right now it's basically a lawless wasteland, right? So I would incorporate a new town right in the middle of the worst of it. I would build a factory making something simple, like storm drain grates or cast iron cookware or something, taking advantage of the low labor costs. The taxes on the factory would provide for a police force for the factory and the few blocks around it, which would house workers who wanted to live there.Having a beat heart to the economy of this micro-city would hopefully encourage other people to start supporting businesses like laundries and restaurants and whatnot and that would increase the tax base and the police-protected area would expand to the point where we could build schools and hospitals etc.

Rebuild Detroit from the inside out.


I had the same thought.
I'm pretty sure that violates anti-trust laws since the mill villages of the 1940s basically ran a debtor's prison/sharecropper scam.

Low labor costs might be an issue, although anyone not in the union would probably come a-scurrying.
 
2013-06-14 04:48:59 PM

StreetlightInTheGhetto: jaytkay: Detroit has a lot interesting stuff going on. Lots of young people are moving in because it's cheap.

Think of any formerly-rundown-now-gentrified neighborhood in your city - it's like that, in the early stages. But on a bigger scale.

Despite the fact that a) my auto insurance would double overnight, b) I couldn't count on police response for anything, and c) lack of decent public transport (the buses are wretched and getting budgets slashed anyhow)... I'd move to Detroit in a heartbeat if it didn't mean an hour long commute to work and if I could find a decent neighborhood.  Hamtramck for sure.  There's awesome, awesome stuff going on there now and I only get to experience it vicariously through my friends.


I almost agree.  There were once worthwhile things to do in Detroit.  I actually think this is a step in the right direction.  While I wouldn't live there, this might get me to consider working there.
The way it is right now, I'd have to make at least $75K more per year just to start thinking about working in Detroit instead of the suburbs.  Between taxes, parking and safety (depending on where you are) at 75K more per year I figure I'd be breaking even.
Ham-town was great 20 years ago, now I honestly don't know.  I don't visit anymore.
 
2013-06-14 04:49:10 PM

jaytkay: Detroit has a lot interesting stuff going on. Lots of young people are moving in because it's cheap.

Think of any formerly-rundown-now-gentrified neighborhood in your city - it's like that, in the early stages. But on a bigger scale.


We like to refer to those folks as victims. Sorry my sister in law lives there and tells me how utterly horrible the place is. We visited her not long ago. I tild my wife I was never going back there. Ever.
 
2013-06-14 04:56:28 PM

Netrngr: jaytkay: Detroit has a lot interesting stuff going on. Lots of young people are moving in because it's cheap.

Think of any formerly-rundown-now-gentrified neighborhood in your city - it's like that, in the early stages. But on a bigger scale.

We like to refer to those folks as victims. Sorry my sister in law lives there and tells me how utterly horrible the place is. We visited her not long ago. I tild my wife I was never going back there. Ever.


Greektown + Brush St., Corktown, even Midtown are all awesome and pretty safe places to have a GREAT time in Detroit whether you're into good food (Slow's, Pegasus, Pub Rub, etc.), pretty decent nightlife (hope you like Irish/German/Mexican on Brush St, Corktown), gambling (MGM, MCC, Greektown) or sports (Wings, Tigers). With the casino's + the stadiums down there, there's a ton of stuff to do that's reasonably priced and a damn good time. I don't live close enough to go as often anymore, but when I was close it was a more fun going there than to Royal Oak/Ferndale.

Yeah, anything outside of that sucks, but there's no reason to go to those parts anyway unless you are looking for drugs and/or to drop off a body.
 
2013-06-14 05:02:30 PM

mike_d85: Magnanimous_J: It that everything I read about Detroit, the citizens are frustrated because no one can build anything nice there without it getting ripped off because the politicians are corrupt and the cops are way too slow to respond to violent crime. I saw something where Wendy's put in a store in a neighborhood and citizens literally guarded it on their own time against robbery because they were scared it would get robbed too many times and corporate would shut it down. They were that desperate for some kind of... anything there. It was really sad.

If I had the money, I would resettle Detroit like the western frontier. Right now it's basically a lawless wasteland, right? So I would incorporate a new town right in the middle of the worst of it. I would build a factory making something simple, like storm drain grates or cast iron cookware or something, taking advantage of the low labor costs. The taxes on the factory would provide for a police force for the factory and the few blocks around it, which would house workers who wanted to live there.Having a beat heart to the economy of this micro-city would hopefully encourage other people to start supporting businesses like laundries and restaurants and whatnot and that would increase the tax base and the police-protected area would expand to the point where we could build schools and hospitals etc.

Rebuild Detroit from the inside out.

I had the same thought.
I'm pretty sure that violates anti-trust laws since the mill villages of the 1940s basically ran a debtor's prison/sharecropper scam.

Low labor costs might be an issue, although anyone not in the union would probably come a-scurrying.


The idea isn't that workers would HAVE to live there. But if people weren't afraid their houses were going to get broken into the minute they left, maybe they would be more willing to invest in their property and create value in their community.
 
2013-06-14 05:03:23 PM

forteblast: Wouldn't have helped, he lived near the river. Speaking of which... you really miss Meijer when you leave Michigan.


Please tell me it's called Meijer General Store.
 
2013-06-14 05:07:22 PM

Magnanimous_J: mike_d85: Magnanimous_J: It that everything I read about Detroit, the citizens are frustrated because no one can build anything nice there without it getting ripped off because the politicians are corrupt and the cops are way too slow to respond to violent crime. I saw something where Wendy's put in a store in a neighborhood and citizens literally guarded it on their own time against robbery because they were scared it would get robbed too many times and corporate would shut it down. They were that desperate for some kind of... anything there. It was really sad.

If I had the money, I would resettle Detroit like the western frontier. Right now it's basically a lawless wasteland, right? So I would incorporate a new town right in the middle of the worst of it. I would build a factory making something simple, like storm drain grates or cast iron cookware or something, taking advantage of the low labor costs. The taxes on the factory would provide for a police force for the factory and the few blocks around it, which would house workers who wanted to live there.Having a beat heart to the economy of this micro-city would hopefully encourage other people to start supporting businesses like laundries and restaurants and whatnot and that would increase the tax base and the police-protected area would expand to the point where we could build schools and hospitals etc.

Rebuild Detroit from the inside out.

I had the same thought.
I'm pretty sure that violates anti-trust laws since the mill villages of the 1940s basically ran a debtor's prison/sharecropper scam.

Low labor costs might be an issue, although anyone not in the union would probably come a-scurrying.

The idea isn't that workers would HAVE to live there. But if people weren't afraid their houses were going to get broken into the minute they left, maybe they would be more willing to invest in their property and create value in their community.


Mill villagers didn't HAVE to live there either.  But since the mill was financing the employees, the homes were relatively nice, and the commute was ideal nearly everyone did.  A bit of apples and oranges since the mills were set up in rural-ish locations in the south.
Of course, those mill villages were set up near farming districts in order to draw more business to the company store (a general store owned or financed entirely by the mill).  Given the "grocery store desert" described by forteblast, I'm assuming you would need to do the same thing which again would violate anti-trust laws.

/Honest intentions and all that.
 
2013-06-14 05:19:57 PM

mike_d85: MichiganFTL: Decillion: How is Detroit able to fill stadiums of four pro sports teams? Is there a magic fairy land of jobs in the suburbs?

Doesn't hurt that Detroit is adjacent to one of top 3 richest counties in the nation ya know.

Is that Anne Arbor?  I hear it's nice and someone at work plugged it as an awesome place to live (except for the cold)


Oakland County.  Even with Pontiac in it, somehow.
 
2013-06-14 05:22:44 PM
Anyone who spells his name "Kevyn" is doomed to failure.
 
2013-06-14 05:24:35 PM

Netrngr: jaytkay: Detroit has a lot interesting stuff going on. Lots of young people are moving in because it's cheap.

Think of any formerly-rundown-now-gentrified neighborhood in your city - it's like that, in the early stages. But on a bigger scale.

We like to refer to those folks as victims. Sorry my sister in law lives there and tells me how utterly horrible the place is. We visited her not long ago. I tild my wife I was never going back there. Ever.


then why doesn't your sister in law... move?

Detroit is not for everyone - namely, it's not for folks trying to start families to relocate to right now unless you're incredibly ambitious.  But hanging out with my 20-something friends is a blast, partly because they all chose to be there.  Yeah, there will be some reasonable biatching about services, crime, etc., but that's maybe 5% of the conversation.  The rest is art projects, music projects, urban gardening, how the business they started is getting along, etc.

But seriously, unless you're really poor - or own property in the city and you'd take a hit if you sold it, which is pretty much any property - it's really not that hard to move to even south Warren.  And it's not like your job is in Detroit anyway, probably.
 
2013-06-14 05:26:01 PM
Legalize it!
 
2013-06-14 05:35:31 PM

mike_d85: forteblast: Wouldn't have helped, he lived near the river. Speaking of which... you really miss Meijer when you leave Michigan.

Please tell me it's called Meijer General Store.


It's called Meijer. Meijer Thrifty Acres if you're old enough to remember (not that anyone called it that back then). We used to drive 20 minutes to get to the nearest Meijer (in Saginaw, from Auburn) because they offered better deals than the local IGA.
 
2013-06-14 05:36:01 PM

SirEattonHogg: That People Mover has to be hands down the dumbest "mass transit" system I've ever ridden.


Thought is was okay, it only really serves visitors coming in for sports, theatre and casinos.  Or special events like the Autoshow.  They are working on a much better system for commuters since the buses can't seem to keep running.  It will be twice the size of the people mover and reaches into the neighborhoods a little bit.  To what extent, I am not sure.

All the talk of how much the property tax adjust to value of the house won't mean much to each house.  Over half of my PT's is just millages and service fees.  Any adjustments would likely only mean $100 if the assessed value is way way (yes two ways) off.  My house value fell off by 75% after market fell, my PT's dropped $500.  If they were assessed in recent years, they are not that far off.  Look at the full list of why your PT's are what they are, only $700 of my $1,900 tax bill is based on the value of my house.
 
2013-06-14 05:44:46 PM
There is absolutely no situation in which lowering taxes doesn't cause almost unbelievable magical growth in tax revenue sufficient to provide for any conceivable need.
 
2013-06-14 05:53:56 PM

Buttknuckle: I have been looking for a job and received a call the other day that went like this:

Caller:  "Mr. Buttknuckle, we have several positions that you would be a great fit.  Are you willing to relocate?"

Me:  "Oh sure.  I have no dependents and am open to a new environment."

Caller: "Fantastic.  We have a terrific position available in Detroit."

Me: "No.  I meant I would relocate anywhere but Detroit."

Caller:  "Understood.  I figured."


Too quick a call to get around to "Are you bulletproof?"
 
2013-06-14 05:58:14 PM

Decillion: How is Detroit able to fill stadiums of four pro sports teams? Is there a magic fairy land of jobs in the suburbs?


Yes.  (Though the Pistons are way the fark up in Auburn Hills, which honestly puts them closer to Flint)

Downtown, midtown, and Greektown are all cool (defined as: "I could visit these during the day, park my car in a watched garage for $10 and be reasonably certain that my car wasn't going to be stolen or me get mugged, while finding reasonably cool things to do for an afternoon/evening").

The rest of Detroit and the largely black/hispanic suburbs surrounding it SUCK.  Like Gary, IN "Don't get off the freeway for ANYTHING even if your car is ON FIRE (literally.  Fun story there)" suck.

Immediately outside that is super-super rich people.  They're not multi-millionaires (outside of Bloomfield Hills, which is like top 5 richest area code in terms of income/Cost of living in the country), but there's still a small, but solid corp of UAW workers making high 5, low 6 + bennies, coupled with a surprisingly large group of white-collar knowledge workers a lot of whom drive 30 minutes into the city from the rich suburbs every morning. (And despite this, Detroit lacks a morning rush hour.  The one advantage of focusing on cars to the extent they do).  And honestly, in the land of 150K houses, you don't have to be rich to live a really nice lifestyle.

Also, the whole "You have to live near Detroit" thing pushes wages sky-high.  For my CS degree with a couple years of experience, Chicago was offering $45K out of college, and Detroit was offering $60K.   Heck, SF (Fark-you COL) was only offering $70K, and CT near NYC (And the horse you rode in on COL) was offering $80K.  My uncle drove a beer truck, and he made $80K/year before retiring early at 60.
 
2013-06-14 06:02:10 PM
How to make Detroit better:

1. Legalize gambling, brothels (taxed and regulated prostitution within a licensed establishment), and marijuana within city limits.

2. Give tax incentives to businesses who wish to operate within the city. Woo organizations that would like to build casinos, hash bars, and brothels.

3. Basically let organized crime move into town and set up business. Put the expected amount of pressure on them, but know that the cops will probably all be on their payroll at some point.

4. Watch tourists flock to the area to spend lots of money, which will be taxed.

5. Watch as the mobsters wipe out the street crime by either crushing the gangs, or assuming control of them and preventing them from terrorizing paying customers and tourists.

6. Accept that since Detroit is going to have crime, that at least organized crime/mobsters are generally good businessmen who don't commit random acts of violence or want to see their neighborhoods become rundown pits after pocketing all the city's money, as opposed to the gangbangers and criminals that rule Detroit now.

7. Watch Michigan finally get their damned roads fixed after seeing a huge spike in tax revenue from taxed weed, prostitution, and gambling establishments.

8. Cross your fingers and hope that as a result, Michigan is annexed by Canada, so we can finally have universal health care, milk in bags, and justification for all the Tim Horton's around here.
 
2013-06-14 06:07:26 PM

Buttknuckle: I have been looking for a job and received a call the other day that went like this:

Caller:  "Mr. Buttknuckle, we have several positions that you would be a great fit.  Are you willing to relocate?"

Me:  "Oh sure.  I have no dependents and am open to a new environment."

Caller: "Fantastic.  We have a terrific position available in Detroit."

Me: "No.  I meant I would relocate anywhere but Detroit."

Caller:  "Understood.  I figured."


Depending on the money, pick up a cheap apartment in the burbs and catch Amtrak to Chicago every once in a while.  Deal with the $20K/year disconnect (see my above post) by dropping it into an investment account and in 5 years use that to make a down payment somewhere you actually want to live.

/Or do what everyone else does and get a cheap house in Detroit and a cottage or two on a lake somewhere in the fingers or the UP.  Detroit sucks.  Michigan is real pretty.
 
2013-06-14 06:18:23 PM
Why are there even property taxes there to begin with? Ever heard the phrase "You can't get blood from a turnip"?
 
2013-06-14 06:37:48 PM

jaytkay: bullsballs: As soon as those taxes drop, I'm buying the old packard plant and building some fine automobiles!

The Packard property is up for auction in September. It's extremely unlikely to sell for the full tax bill ($975,000).

So then the price drops to $21,500 in auction round two.

Link


I lived in a city where a mall was up for auction. The local county auditor valued the property at $68 million. I LOL'd. So, in order to sell it at foreclosure under state law, it had to be sold starting no lower than 2/3 the property value. Not ONE. FARKING. BID. And I can't blame them. So, the bank brings in, with judge approval, an actual expert in valuing retail properties. He puts the value of the property at a whopping $1.3 million. Auditors are farking idiots sometimes I swear.
 
2013-06-14 06:50:30 PM

ZeroCorpse: How to make Detroit better:

1. Legalize gambling, brothels (taxed and regulated prostitution within a licensed establishment), and marijuana within city limits.

2. Give tax incentives to businesses who wish to operate within the city. Woo organizations that would like to build casinos, hash bars, and brothels.

3. Basically let organized crime move into town and set up business. Put the expected amount of pressure on them, but know that the cops will probably all be on their payroll at some point.

4. Watch tourists flock to the area to spend lots of money, which will be taxed.

5. Watch as the mobsters wipe out the street crime by either crushing the gangs, or assuming control of them and preventing them from terrorizing paying customers and tourists.

6. Accept that since Detroit is going to have crime, that at least organized crime/mobsters are generally good businessmen who don't commit random acts of violence or want to see their neighborhoods become rundown pits after pocketing all the city's money, as opposed to the gangbangers and criminals that rule Detroit now.

7. Watch Michigan finally get their damned roads fixed after seeing a huge spike in tax revenue from taxed weed, prostitution, and gambling establishments.

8. Cross your fingers and hope that as a result, Michigan is annexed by Canada, so we can finally have universal health care, milk in bags, and justification for all the Tim Horton's around here.


This is quite possibly the most laughable thing I have read in this thread. Starting with point 1.
 
2013-06-14 06:57:34 PM
The unsustainability of endless growth, especially after the last haircut we got from Wall St. almost dismantled the entire economy, is being reflected by the fact that renewal, rebuilding, repurposing and scaling things back to a usable community sized scope is about the only growth there is.  People WANT to live in tidy, productive safe communities that aren't festooned with gargantuan buildings that nobody uses.

When you stop making stuff AND everybody's office fits into a laptop bag, you don't NEED buildings for anything but people to live in and buy stuff at, or house utilities and medicinal facilities.

If anybody starts promising new "growth" from some brick an mortar clusterf*ck they will build on the site on an old brick and mortar leviathan that is in ruins, run them out of town on a rail  The town is irrelevant.

Poor people be f*ckin'.  And they aren't going to get in on the game and the people running the game are abandoning their "my architectural dick is bigger than yours" vanity palaces.  Skyscrapers, malls, factories.  All of them mostly redundant.  We have to start  looking at what comprises a community, a neighborhood and a city and which bits do and do not need to be under roofs and why.  It's time to fire the architects and designers and feng shui mooks and pick up a broom and a shovel.
 
2013-06-14 07:00:24 PM

jayphat: jaytkay: bullsballs: As soon as those taxes drop, I'm buying the old packard plant and building some fine automobiles!

The Packard property is up for auction in September. It's extremely unlikely to sell for the full tax bill ($975,000).

So then the price drops to $21,500 in auction round two.

Link

I lived in a city where a mall was up for auction. The local county auditor valued the property at $68 million. I LOL'd. So, in order to sell it at foreclosure under state law, it had to be sold starting no lower than 2/3 the property value. Not ONE. FARKING. BID. And I can't blame them. So, the bank brings in, with judge approval, an actual expert in valuing retail properties. He puts the value of the property at a whopping $1.3 million. Auditors are farking idiots sometimes I swear.


With a quick reading, I though you were responding to yourself and was really, really confused.
 
2013-06-14 07:11:24 PM

Ethertap: Properties in Detroit are worth enough money to pay taxes on?


Came here to aks that very quarstion.
 
2013-06-14 07:25:04 PM

jayphat: ZeroCorpse: How to make Detroit better:

1. Legalize gambling, brothels (taxed and regulated prostitution within a licensed establishment), and marijuana within city limits.

2. Give tax incentives to businesses who wish to operate within the city. Woo organizations that would like to build casinos, hash bars, and brothels.

3. Basically let organized crime move into town and set up business. Put the expected amount of pressure on them, but know that the cops will probably all be on their payroll at some point.

4. Watch tourists flock to the area to spend lots of money, which will be taxed.

5. Watch as the mobsters wipe out the street crime by either crushing the gangs, or assuming control of them and preventing them from terrorizing paying customers and tourists.

6. Accept that since Detroit is going to have crime, that at least organized crime/mobsters are generally good businessmen who don't commit random acts of violence or want to see their neighborhoods become rundown pits after pocketing all the city's money, as opposed to the gangbangers and criminals that rule Detroit now.

7. Watch Michigan finally get their damned roads fixed after seeing a huge spike in tax revenue from taxed weed, prostitution, and gambling establishments.

8. Cross your fingers and hope that as a result, Michigan is annexed by Canada, so we can finally have universal health care, milk in bags, and justification for all the Tim Horton's around here.

This is quite possibly the most laughable thing I have read in this thread. Starting with point 1.


But don't we already have a Chicago?
 
2013-06-14 07:31:52 PM
No city run by dems ever lowered taxes. That must be a misprint or the writer is playing a joke.
They probably meant Detroit to raise takes again, give the dem lawmakers higher pay, give the govt workers more benifits and ask uncle sugar for more help to pay the bills.
 
2013-06-14 07:35:28 PM

dead: jayphat: ZeroCorpse: How to make Detroit better:

1. Legalize gambling, brothels (taxed and regulated prostitution within a licensed establishment), and marijuana within city limits.

2. Give tax incentives to businesses who wish to operate within the city. Woo organizations that would like to build casinos, hash bars, and brothels.

3. Basically let organized crime move into town and set up business. Put the expected amount of pressure on them, but know that the cops will probably all be on their payroll at some point.

4. Watch tourists flock to the area to spend lots of money, which will be taxed.

5. Watch as the mobsters wipe out the street crime by either crushing the gangs, or assuming control of them and preventing them from terrorizing paying customers and tourists.

6. Accept that since Detroit is going to have crime, that at least organized crime/mobsters are generally good businessmen who don't commit random acts of violence or want to see their neighborhoods become rundown pits after pocketing all the city's money, as opposed to the gangbangers and criminals that rule Detroit now.

7. Watch Michigan finally get their damned roads fixed after seeing a huge spike in tax revenue from taxed weed, prostitution, and gambling establishments.

8. Cross your fingers and hope that as a result, Michigan is annexed by Canada, so we can finally have universal health care, milk in bags, and justification for all the Tim Horton's around here.

This is quite possibly the most laughable thing I have read in this thread. Starting with point 1.

But don't we already have a Chicago?


Honestly, if this guy thinks that legalizing something that is already wildly available to the population so he can "tax it" is going to be the magic bullet to solve these problems, then he needs his head examined.
 
2013-06-14 07:35:31 PM
MichiganFTL:Yeah, anything outside of that sucks, but there's no reason to go to those parts anyway unless you are looking for drugs and/or to drop off a body.

Any more specific info on where for the dope and drop?
A friend wants to know.
 
2013-06-14 07:50:48 PM

JohnTuttle: mike_d85: forteblast: Wouldn't have helped, he lived near the river. Speaking of which... you really miss Meijer when you leave Michigan.

Please tell me it's called Meijer General Store.

It's called Meijer. Meijer Thrifty Acres if you're old enough to remember (not that anyone called it that back then). We used to drive 20 minutes to get to the nearest Meijer (in Saginaw, from Auburn) because they offered better deals than the local IGA.


Heh...haven't heard that in awhile. We used to drive around 30 minutes or so to our nearest one. My favorite part was the penny horse rides out front.
 
2013-06-14 08:10:16 PM

Launch Code: No city run by dems ever lowered taxes.


No, No anything run by anybody lowered taxes AND lowered services/shuttered bureaucracy to do anything other than run up massive deficits after they lowered taxes (except some of the crazier red states, and they've taken that so far it's counterproductive).

/How the fark do the Europeans make rent?  Cause a major city apartment is about $2K, and if you're at 50% taxes, you're making $4K just to pay the rent, which is well above the per capita average income for a lot of places.   Does everyone just get like 12 roommates?
 
2013-06-14 08:26:45 PM
Last year, I happen to come home from work and the county tax accessor was in my driveway. I pointed out that the house next door was vacant, and had 10 foot tall weeds. I pointed out that the house across the street just sold for $75K so my house can't be worth that much. He asked if it was a foreclosure sale and I told him it was. He laughed and said they don't take foreclosure sales into consideration, and the vacant house next store doesn't mean squat,  when valuing adjoining property. So, once again, I get hosed on my property taxes.
 
2013-06-14 08:34:55 PM

thecpt: Also, how unimaginative is your transportation department? The People Mover?


I call it "the crime-flinger!
 
2013-06-14 08:40:19 PM
Detroit ranked first among the 50 largest U.S. cities in taxes and last among property values

Ooga booga democrats want death by ooga booga for everyone!

www.detroitmi.gov
Why would anyone go from an income tax free suburb to live in a hell hole like Detroit is completely inexplicable unless you're as short sighted and corrupt as these leeches.  I just don't understand why they don't loot everything that isn't nailed down in Detroit, get their retirement as a single 7 figure lump sum out of the slush fund and disappear into some extradition free sandy beach tropical paradise like Morocco.  Maybe there are some more drops of blood to be sucked out of the corpse yet. Michigan should revoke the city charter and let the bond holders take a well deserved bath just as an object lesson in fiscal responsibility.
 
2013-06-14 09:18:20 PM

Pick: Last year, I happen to come home from work and the county tax assessor was in my driveway. I pointed out that the house next door was vacant, and had 10 foot tall weeds. I pointed out that the house across the street just sold for $75K so my house can't be worth that much. He asked if it was a foreclosure sale and I told him it was. He laughed and said they don't take foreclosure sales into consideration, and the vacant house next store doesn't mean squat,  when valuing adjoining property. So, once again, I get hosed on my property taxes.


Begging your pardon, as I have never bought a home so I am not familiar. What does the assessor use to determine your rate? It sounds like some weird set of deductive reasoning.

/honestly asking, and deathly afraid to get a mortgage (even in my late thirties)
 
2013-06-14 09:31:26 PM

Rip Dashrock: MichiganFTL:Yeah, anything outside of that sucks, but there's no reason to go to those parts anyway unless you are looking for drugs and/or to drop off a body.

Any more specific info on where for the dope and drop?
A friend wants to know.


8 mile east, pass dequinder then warner,  first party store on the right.
 
2013-06-14 10:06:19 PM

thecpt: StreetlightInTheGhetto: thecpt: Also, how unimaginative is your transportation department? The People Mover?

I had a keychain for awhile that celebrated the first anniversary of the People Mover and said "THANKS FOR RIDING THE SKY!" on it.  Then it broke and I lost it.

When I was a little kid, riding that thing in circles was a crazy cheap way for my Dad to keep us entertained.  The only time it's ever actually been useful for me is going to Greektown to get food while working a convention at Cobo.  So, um, one weekend.  Took it from the Ren Cen to Greektown as well but at that point you might as well just walk it.

I mean thank gawd it was there. After stuffing myself with gyros, saganaki, and baclava how the hell was I going to waddle my suddenly top heavy self all the way to tiger stadium/comerica?


My wife and I did that very thing last Saturday. Went to the New Parthenon. I remember it being better.

The game was good, though.
 
2013-06-14 10:25:30 PM

JohnTuttle: mike_d85: forteblast: Wouldn't have helped, he lived near the river. Speaking of which... you really miss Meijer when you leave Michigan.

Please tell me it's called Meijer General Store.

It's called Meijer. Meijer Thrifty Acres if you're old enough to remember (not that anyone called it that back then). We used to drive 20 minutes to get to the nearest Meijer (in Saginaw, from Auburn) because they offered better deals than the local IGA.


Woah, woah, woah!!

You didn't go to the Saginaw meijer from Auburn, you went to the Bay City meijer. Way closer, way safer. Unless you're talking a really long time ago.
 
2013-06-14 10:48:17 PM
jayphat
Why are there even property taxes there to begin with?

To ensure that dollars have value by forcing everyone to need some.
 
HBK
2013-06-14 11:15:52 PM

ZeroCorpse: How to make Detroit better:

1. Legalize gambling, brothels (taxed and regulated prostitution within a licensed establishment), and marijuana within city limits.

2. Give tax incentives to businesses who wish to operate within the city. Woo organizations that would like to build casinos, hash bars, and brothels.

3. Basically let organized crime move into town and set up business. Put the expected amount of pressure on them, but know that the cops will probably all be on their payroll at some point.

4. Watch tourists flock to the area to spend lots of money, which will be taxed.

5. Watch as the mobsters wipe out the street crime by either crushing the gangs, or assuming control of them and preventing them from terrorizing paying customers and tourists.

6. Accept that since Detroit is going to have crime, that at least organized crime/mobsters are generally good businessmen who don't commit random acts of violence or want to see their neighborhoods become rundown pits after pocketing all the city's money, as opposed to the gangbangers and criminals that rule Detroit now.

7. Watch Michigan finally get their damned roads fixed after seeing a huge spike in tax revenue from taxed weed, prostitution, and gambling establishments.

8. Cross your fingers and hope that as a result, Michigan is annexed by Canada, so we can finally have universal health care, milk in bags, and justification for all the Tim Horton's around here.


First of all, you do realize that there are several casinos already in Detroit, right?

Second of all, for some reason you imagine organized crime as an episode of the Sopranos. It's not that. Gangs are organized crime, and gangs are already prevalent throughout Detroit. Do you really think some mobsters are going to be able to come in and rid the city of the street gangs?

Third of all, legalizing marijuana would do nothing for the city. If a marijuana aficionado wanted to smoke legally, that stoner could go to Colorado or Washington and not have to be worried about being robbed or murdered.

Fourth of all, any increase in tax revenue will likely be swallowed up by the corrupt politicians.
 
2013-06-15 12:00:17 AM

RanDomino: jayphat
Why are there even property taxes there to begin with?

To ensure that dollars have value by forcing everyone to need some.


coachotis.files.wordpress.com
 
2013-06-15 01:32:38 AM
bunner

well actually I misread that and missed the second "there" that meant the reference was to Detroit specifically, in which case a better answer is probably "because institutions and bureaucracies full of people who have had things working out just fine want to keep things the same, because if everything is good now (for them) then change is potentially bad"
 
2013-06-15 01:45:20 AM
I think the point is it's all just bad IOUs and if you need to have some to have a roof over your head, voila.  Instant sweat  equity in, and demand for, your debt notes.
 
2013-06-15 08:11:40 AM
We, the corporations, are ready to build a new city here in Detroit. Our plan, which began fifty years ago, is now almost complete. The entire city will soon be under our control. The government, desperate for jobs and money, is willing to give us big tax breaks and build roads and parks for us. We have successfully raised taxes, increased living costs, and used eminent domain and other legal and illegal means to force the residents to sell out and get out. The new city will be built according to our design and concept. We took land away from the natives, and now we are taking it from the disenfranchised and uneducated black underclass that currently lives in the slum that is Detroit. We have a clean slate with which to start fresh.

Here is how our plan has worked:

After World War II, our victorious soldiers came home from Asia and Europe. We needed to build new houses so they could start families. The city was packed with old houses, which cost too much to fix. We simply let them go to ruin.

We designed and built generic houses so that everyone could fill them with the exact same things. We generated tremendous economic gain because people bought new things for their new houses: refrigerators, ovens, heaters, air conditioners, furniture, bathrooms, washers, dryers, lawn mowers, swimming pools, and more. As long as we made new things, people bought them.

We then built bigger, more expensive houses, farther and farther away from the city. People bought the newer houses and filled them again, with our newer products. We successfully made consumerism a mass addiction.

But we needed to do more; we needed to keep the newly created, massive white middle class in constant motion to increase our profits exponentially. So we realized that our plan would require nothing less than the total destruction of the city of Detroit.

We realized that the best method to reclaim land other than by force was to exploit urban fears and racial hatred. Through media control and manipulation, we've created an unquestioned impression that all domestic violence and other urban ills are caused by black people.

Also, we designed exit ramps of the highways in Detroit so they could be closed easily and quickly; this way, inner city crime, chaos, ruin, and riots could be contained, ensuring that people would burn their own neighborhoods.

Then we moved all our big factories out of Detroit, and then all other businesses, stores, and even gas stations followed us. But we let the liquor stores stay, to successfully pollute the mind and soul of city people. We've made damn sure that it's easier to get guns, drugs, and sex in Detroit than voter registration. We let the people there just keep on killing each other. We made Detroit so violent that people continue to flee from it, just like from a war zone. With their lives in danger, city residents sell their properties fast and low.

This set the stage for the disinvestment and total abandonment of the inner city. It became impossible to build new houses and buildings there because nobody would loan the money. All new houses and buildings were built exclusively in the suburbs.

We've also undermined Detroit's education system by pulling out funds and corrupting school officials. We've crowded the classes, paid less to teachers, and supplied no new books nor built new libraries. Our goal has been to make the entire population of Detroit illiterate and unqualified for any professional work.

As education failed and jobs moved out, the inner city became bankrupt. Public buildings and houses have been abandoned by the hundreds of thousands. We let them all rot or we burned them. Thus we have created an extremely inhospitable and dangerous environment, which has infected the whole population with an inescapable hopelessness. This has driven the land price down further and further. So low, that land in Detroit is now practically free.

To better control the population, we had to educate some of the city residents. They now help us oversee the rest of the people. That's how things were done with the slaves, and we continue that practice today. They work hard and long hours, always hoping that the American dream someday will take them to the suburbs. But we will keep them locked up in the city, just like we do with the natives on the reservations.

Occasionally, we've given the city some money, but never quite enough. All the city departments fight among themselves for it, and this has bred wide-scale corruption and graft in Detroit. No public money ever gets to the people that need it. But it has made us look generous and compassionate, while our goal of the complete destruction of the inner city continues, uninterrupted and unsuspected.

We have moved out, but we are coming back. Our plan has taken about fifty years to completely destroy Detroit and its population, at no cost to us or our shareholders. Most of the buildings and houses have been burnt or demolished, and it won't take much more to "clear cut" the rest of them. With so many vacant lots and open spaces, the city now looks more like the countryside. A tabula rasa has been created, so that we can take back the city dirt cheap.

Using this plan, we have successfully tested new techniques of profitable land seizure, without resorting to the costly use of armed force. Hidden by countless layers of economic agreements and legal manipulations, we have written a new chapter of colonialism, with techniques deeply embedded in the automated global matrix of advanced capitalism.

The purpose of this plan has been to establish the next form of government. Detroit is the place where the secret revolution of corporations is being realized.


http://artefact.mi2.hr/_a04/lang_en/theory_park_en.htm
 
2013-06-15 09:01:08 AM
While it probably won't attract new residents, it very well may help keep some from moving out.
 
2013-06-15 11:59:10 PM
Magnanimous_J:
Rebuild Detroit from the inside out.

What all of you keep forgetting is; the problem with Detroit is Detroiters.

None of these plans will work as long as the current population demographic
remains the same, Detroiters are the reason the city is a ghetto.

And by "Detroiters" I mean exactly who you think I mean.

This space reserved for the predictable accusations of racism:
{________________________________________________}
 
Displayed 128 of 128 comments

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is archived, and closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »






Report