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(The Detroit_News)   Detroit to lower property taxes, which will cause people to flock to live in the city   (detroitnews.com) divider line 128
    More: Unlikely, Detroit, Orr, property taxes, emergency managers  
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3187 clicks; posted to Main » on 14 Jun 2013 at 2:49 PM (43 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-06-14 03:46:53 PM

JohnAnnArbor: Buttknuckle: I have been looking for a job and received a call the other day that went like this:

Caller:  "Mr. Buttknuckle, we have several positions that you would be a great fit.  Are you willing to relocate?"

Me:  "Oh sure.  I have no dependents and am open to a new environment."

Caller: "Fantastic.  We have a terrific position available in Detroit."

Me: "No.  I meant I would relocate anywhere but Detroit."

Caller:  "Understood.  I figured."

Sounds like Compuware was calling.


Could've been.  I have wiped the name of the company from my mind.
 
2013-06-14 03:47:06 PM
2.bp.blogspot.com
 
2013-06-14 03:49:16 PM
Back in the 90s Detroit implemented a Homestead program.  Basically, anyone who took over an abandoned property and paid to bring it up to code would have the house and property free with all back property taxes forgiven.  Hundreds of people moved in and spent tens of thousands of dollars renovating these homes, raising the property values of the surrounding housing and bringing revenue into the city.  The program worked beautifully.

Then in 2001 Kwame Kilpatrick was elected.  He and the city council immediately cancelled the program and sent these "squatters" bills for 10s or 100s of thousands of dollars in back taxes threatening seizure.  All of those investors abandoned their homes.  Not one of those reclaimed properties is a livable residence today.

Anyone who believes this and gets suckered in deserves what they get.
 
2013-06-14 03:50:08 PM

jaytkay: Detroit has a lot interesting stuff going on. Lots of young people are moving in because it's cheap.

Think of any formerly-rundown-now-gentrified neighborhood in your city - it's like that, in the early stages. But on a bigger scale.


I visited home last wknd. Went to a Detroit FC soccer game at Cass Tech. Nothing but white hipsters as far as the eye could see. That said only a small percentage live in midtown or corktown. The long and short is a few coffee shops and artisan bakeries will not fix a city designed for 2 million. It's a great start but they need to draw families to the city and that's schools, police, fire (insert basic city service here). Those currently do not exist.
 
2013-06-14 03:50:32 PM
Isn't it about time we wall up Detroit, Escape from NY style?
 
d23 [TotalFark]
2013-06-14 03:50:34 PM
Not when it's 20-30 miles just to go to a supermarket.
 
2013-06-14 03:51:00 PM
StreetlightinTheGhetto: thecpt: Also, how unimaginative is your transportation department? The People Mover?

I had a keychain for awhile that celebrated the first anniversary of the People Mover and said "THANKS FOR RIDING THE SKY!" on it.  Then it broke and I lost it.


That People Mover has to be hands down the dumbest "mass transit" system I've ever ridden.

If you've never been to Detroit, let me describe it.  It's an elevated train system that doesn't go to any suburb or any connecting city, all it does is go around its rather small-ish downtown area - so basically wherever it goes - you could just easily walk.   Basically, all it does is connect you to the location where you parked your car.  You still have to use your car to pretty much commute home, hence totally negating the point of having a train system in the first place.  Who thought of this dumb system?

It's like a real life version of the Disneyland Monorail and just as useful (Seattle can be forgiven for its useless Monorail as its just something from the World's fair).
 
2013-06-14 03:51:33 PM
By lowering tax rates, he's going to make it a bit more likely that current homeowners will actually pay their property tax. That'll drive at least some revenue to the city.

That should be combined with revised tax bills for unpaid bills.

Detroit it's a prime example of the Democratic tax philosophy. Tax, and if we get less revenue from that tax people more while we provide less services. Then the only ones left paying taxes are, well, suckers.

The property valuations have been overstated for years, by any measure, according to the article.
 
2013-06-14 03:53:05 PM
"What the average Detroiter needs to understand is that where we are right now is a culmination of years and years and years of kicking the can down the road," said Orr, adding that his proposal should not be seen as a "hostile act" but as a step in the right direction.

Dear rest of America....prepare for "steps in the right direction".
 
2013-06-14 03:59:36 PM

AngryDragon: Back in the 90s Detroit implemented a Homestead program.  Basically, anyone who took over an abandoned property and paid to bring it up to code would have the house and property free with all back property taxes forgiven.  Hundreds of people moved in and spent tens of thousands of dollars renovating these homes, raising the property values of the surrounding housing and bringing revenue into the city.  The program worked beautifully.

Then in 2001 Kwame Kilpatrick was elected.  He and the city council immediately cancelled the program and sent these "squatters" bills for 10s or 100s of thousands of dollars in back taxes threatening seizure.  All of those investors abandoned their homes.  Not one of those reclaimed properties is a livable residence today.

Anyone who believes this and gets suckered in deserves what they get.


Wow.  Really?  I don't remember that one.
 
2013-06-14 04:02:34 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: No, the democrat way is to tax people more and then use that tax money to make people want to live in Detroit.


And, in theory, that should work perfectly. It's probably sabotage by the CIA agents and kulaks that makes it fail in practice.

/if only Detroit had a Federal Reserve mint, then they could print all the money they need and everybody would be rich
//in theory
 
2013-06-14 04:03:27 PM

SirEattonHogg: Who thought of this dumb system?


I would suspect, and I know nothing about this system at all, someone who intended on using it as a hub.  And perhaps never got around to it.
 
2013-06-14 04:05:16 PM

legion_of_doo: jaytkay: legion_of_doo: The Detroit way is to:
1) blame whitey.

You sound white. And Republican.

You sound like you've never been to Detroit.


I sound like I don't reflexively spew racist bile at the mention of "Detroit".

I lived in the Detroit suburbs for a few years and spent plenty of time in the city.
 
2013-06-14 04:06:47 PM

Decillion: How is Detroit able to fill stadiums of four pro sports teams? Is there a magic fairy land of jobs in the suburbs?


Detroit: <1M people
Metro Detroit: 4.3M people.

Its the 14th largest metropolitan area in the country.
 
2013-06-14 04:09:25 PM
www.dreamstime.com

People have to eat too, you know.
 
2013-06-14 04:11:23 PM

bunner: [www.dreamstime.com image 400x266]

People have to eat too, you know.


Problem: over a century of industry, much of it before environmental regulations started.   Just one example.
 
2013-06-14 04:13:36 PM

JohnAnnArbor: AngryDragon: Back in the 90s Detroit implemented a Homestead program.  Basically, anyone who took over an abandoned property and paid to bring it up to code would have the house and property free with all back property taxes forgiven.  Hundreds of people moved in and spent tens of thousands of dollars renovating these homes, raising the property values of the surrounding housing and bringing revenue into the city.  The program worked beautifully.

Then in 2001 Kwame Kilpatrick was elected.  He and the city council immediately cancelled the program and sent these "squatters" bills for 10s or 100s of thousands of dollars in back taxes threatening seizure.  All of those investors abandoned their homes.  Not one of those reclaimed properties is a livable residence today.

Anyone who believes this and gets suckered in deserves what they get.

Wow.  Really?  I don't remember that one.


Having trouble finding a source.  I was considering investing in one of these when the story broke about homesteaders getting served with massive back tax bills though.  I immediately changed my mind.
 
2013-06-14 04:14:59 PM
IIRC, a few years ago you could be a 'house' in Detroit for $100 give or take, but the property taxes on it were $5000/year.
 
2013-06-14 04:17:58 PM

Gunny Walker: They don't have tax auctions in Detroit?


You need willing buyers.

Tax buyers expect either:

A) The property owner gets their shiat together and pays all the taxes and interest and a little profit

- or -

B) The tax buyer gets a worthwhile property for cheap.
  In much of Detroit, neither possibility exists.
 
2013-06-14 04:18:52 PM
TheGreatGazoo

IIRC, a few years ago you could be a 'house' in Detroit for $100 give or take, but the property taxes on it were $5000/year.

So yet more proof that lower taxes is better for revenue.

It's almost like this could be applied elsewhere. nawwwwwwwww.
 
2013-06-14 04:22:07 PM

bullsballs: As soon as those taxes drop, I'm buying the old packard plant and building some fine automobiles!


The Packard property is up for auction in September. It's extremely unlikely to sell for the full tax bill ($975,000).

So then the price drops to $21,500 in auction round two.

Link
 
2013-06-14 04:22:58 PM
We built factories and churches and salons and banks, and dug all the minerals out of the earth and turned them into stuff.

And the rest we burned so we could be jazzed with electricity and refrigeration.

And a handful of old men died with enough money to make Croesus blush.

So we sift through the wreckage of their abandoned palaces, trying to put a wrench to the misaligned wheels that used to turn so regally.  And we scratch the broken ground.  And we talk of hope.
 
2013-06-14 04:23:32 PM

JohnAnnArbor: Gunny Walker: They don't have tax auctions in Detroit?

They do, but it's very disorganized.  If they do figure out you're delinquent on taxes (a BIG if), you yourself can go to the auction, buy your property for less than the tax bill, then start over with a $0 property tax balance.  People have done that.


theres really nothing wrong with that. if the city cant collect and is willing to sell at market rate what do they care who buys it? if the debt was worth more someone would bid against them.
 
2013-06-14 04:24:09 PM

chaddsfarkprefect: Privatize the city, like a sci-fi movie.


They did, that's what farked it up in the first place.

Detroit was designed to fail.


Personally, I'd love to buy a historic old home there. I hear good things about urban farming and the burgeoning artist scene. But I'm still nervous about the crime so I doubt I'd move there.
 
2013-06-14 04:27:07 PM

Mrs.Sharpier: chaddsfarkprefect: Privatize the city, like a sci-fi movie.

They did, that's what farked it up in the first place.

Detroit was designed to fail.


Personally, I'd love to buy a historic old home there. I hear good things about urban farming and the burgeoning artist scene. But I'm still nervous about the crime so I doubt I'd move there.


There is almost nothing privatized in the city of Detroit.
 
2013-06-14 04:27:17 PM

MichiganFTL: Decillion: How is Detroit able to fill stadiums of four pro sports teams? Is there a magic fairy land of jobs in the suburbs?

Doesn't hurt that Detroit is adjacent to one of top 3 richest counties in the nation ya know.


Is that Anne Arbor?  I hear it's nice and someone at work plugged it as an awesome place to live (except for the cold)
 
2013-06-14 04:28:32 PM

mike_d85: MichiganFTL: Decillion: How is Detroit able to fill stadiums of four pro sports teams? Is there a magic fairy land of jobs in the suburbs?

Doesn't hurt that Detroit is adjacent to one of top 3 richest counties in the nation ya know.

Is that Anne Arbor?  I hear it's nice and someone at work plugged it as an awesome place to live (except for the cold)


No, Oakland County.  Ann Arbor is in Washtenaw County.
 
2013-06-14 04:31:54 PM

jaytkay: Gunny Walker: They don't have tax auctions in Detroit?

You need willing buyers.

Tax buyers expect either:

A) The property owner gets their shiat together and pays all the taxes and interest and a little profit

- or -

B) The tax buyer gets a worthwhile property for cheap.
  In much of Detroit, neither possibility exists.


theres a c that is a huge problem too. your property tax lien you bought can get shoved below a irs tax lien. if that happens you have to pay it if you foreclose or basically write it off.

if you do file a tax foreclosure and no one bids on the property you are going to be kind of farked too unless you really want it. buying liens is high risk and the property should be worth way more than you are paying.

some places get around the issue of people buying their own liens by doing them in blocks too. so you dont bid on one lien, you bid on 150 of them or some number.
 
2013-06-14 04:33:50 PM
It that everything I read about Detroit, the citizens are frustrated because no one can build anything nice there without it getting ripped off because the politicians are corrupt and the cops are way too slow to respond to violent crime. I saw something where Wendy's put in a store in a neighborhood and citizens literally guarded it on their own time against robbery because they were scared it would get robbed too many times and corporate would shut it down. They were that desperate for some kind of... anything there. It was really sad.

If I had the money, I would resettle Detroit like the western frontier. Right now it's basically a lawless wasteland, right? So I would incorporate a new town right in the middle of the worst of it. I would build a factory making something simple, like storm drain grates or cast iron cookware or something, taking advantage of the low labor costs. The taxes on the factory would provide for a police force for the factory and the few blocks around it, which would house workers who wanted to live there.Having a beat heart to the economy of this micro-city would hopefully encourage other people to start supporting businesses like laundries and restaurants and whatnot and that would increase the tax base and the police-protected area would expand to the point where we could build schools and hospitals etc.

Rebuild Detroit from the inside out.
 
2013-06-14 04:39:26 PM

Mrs.Sharpier: chaddsfarkprefect: Privatize the city, like a sci-fi movie.

They did, that's what farked it up in the first place.


Virtually nothing in Detroit is privatized.

What farked it up was having one party run the city for fifty years.  Almost every city like that is a shiathole.  Usually the party is the Democrats, but that's mostly just demographics.
 
2013-06-14 04:39:40 PM
not to mention despite what the late night tv shows tell you its not like 'oh they didnt pay their tax lien so i got a million dollar property for 50k!'.

you are going to have to hire attornies, ensure proper notices get sent and the required amount of time elapses, then file the foreclosure and go through that hellful process (the banks dont take like a year to do a foreclosure because they are idiots, it is a ton of shiat that takes foreverand the courts are overloaded). then you have to send the property to auction and have the required notices and time elapse. at this point whoever owns the thing surely hasnt touched it in forever so you are probobly walking into code enforcement issues and god knows what else if you buy it. also if there is someone squating their you will have to file an eviction and go through that long ass process before you can even access what you bought.
 
2013-06-14 04:39:41 PM

jaytkay: legion_of_doo: jaytkay: legion_of_doo: The Detroit way is to:
1) blame whitey.

You sound white. And Republican.

You sound like you've never been to Detroit.

I sound like I don't reflexively spew racist bile at the mention of "Detroit".

I lived in the Detroit suburbs for a few years and spent plenty of time in the city.


Racist scum.
 
2013-06-14 04:41:23 PM

Magnanimous_J: It that everything I read about Detroit, the citizens are frustrated because no one can build anything nice there without it getting ripped off because the politicians are corrupt and the cops are way too slow to respond to violent crime. I saw something where Wendy's put in a store in a neighborhood and citizens literally guarded it on their own time against robbery because they were scared it would get robbed too many times and corporate would shut it down. They were that desperate for some kind of... anything there. It was really sad.

If I had the money, I would resettle Detroit like the western frontier. Right now it's basically a lawless wasteland, right? So I would incorporate a new town right in the middle of the worst of it. I would build a factory making something simple, like storm drain grates or cast iron cookware or something, taking advantage of the low labor costs. The taxes on the factory would provide for a police force for the factory and the few blocks around it, which would house workers who wanted to live there.Having a beat heart to the economy of this micro-city would hopefully encourage other people to start supporting businesses like laundries and restaurants and whatnot and that would increase the tax base and the police-protected area would expand to the point where we could build schools and hospitals etc.

Rebuild Detroit from the inside out.


This would fail miserably.  The regulatory hurdles to incorporate, let alone build a factory, would drive you broke.  The powers-that-be like to retain that power.
 
2013-06-14 04:47:05 PM

Magnanimous_J: It that everything I read about Detroit, the citizens are frustrated because no one can build anything nice there without it getting ripped off because the politicians are corrupt and the cops are way too slow to respond to violent crime. I saw something where Wendy's put in a store in a neighborhood and citizens literally guarded it on their own time against robbery because they were scared it would get robbed too many times and corporate would shut it down. They were that desperate for some kind of... anything there. It was really sad.

If I had the money, I would resettle Detroit like the western frontier. Right now it's basically a lawless wasteland, right? So I would incorporate a new town right in the middle of the worst of it. I would build a factory making something simple, like storm drain grates or cast iron cookware or something, taking advantage of the low labor costs. The taxes on the factory would provide for a police force for the factory and the few blocks around it, which would house workers who wanted to live there.Having a beat heart to the economy of this micro-city would hopefully encourage other people to start supporting businesses like laundries and restaurants and whatnot and that would increase the tax base and the police-protected area would expand to the point where we could build schools and hospitals etc.

Rebuild Detroit from the inside out.


I had the same thought.
I'm pretty sure that violates anti-trust laws since the mill villages of the 1940s basically ran a debtor's prison/sharecropper scam.

Low labor costs might be an issue, although anyone not in the union would probably come a-scurrying.
 
2013-06-14 04:48:59 PM

StreetlightInTheGhetto: jaytkay: Detroit has a lot interesting stuff going on. Lots of young people are moving in because it's cheap.

Think of any formerly-rundown-now-gentrified neighborhood in your city - it's like that, in the early stages. But on a bigger scale.

Despite the fact that a) my auto insurance would double overnight, b) I couldn't count on police response for anything, and c) lack of decent public transport (the buses are wretched and getting budgets slashed anyhow)... I'd move to Detroit in a heartbeat if it didn't mean an hour long commute to work and if I could find a decent neighborhood.  Hamtramck for sure.  There's awesome, awesome stuff going on there now and I only get to experience it vicariously through my friends.


I almost agree.  There were once worthwhile things to do in Detroit.  I actually think this is a step in the right direction.  While I wouldn't live there, this might get me to consider working there.
The way it is right now, I'd have to make at least $75K more per year just to start thinking about working in Detroit instead of the suburbs.  Between taxes, parking and safety (depending on where you are) at 75K more per year I figure I'd be breaking even.
Ham-town was great 20 years ago, now I honestly don't know.  I don't visit anymore.
 
2013-06-14 04:49:10 PM

jaytkay: Detroit has a lot interesting stuff going on. Lots of young people are moving in because it's cheap.

Think of any formerly-rundown-now-gentrified neighborhood in your city - it's like that, in the early stages. But on a bigger scale.


We like to refer to those folks as victims. Sorry my sister in law lives there and tells me how utterly horrible the place is. We visited her not long ago. I tild my wife I was never going back there. Ever.
 
2013-06-14 04:56:28 PM

Netrngr: jaytkay: Detroit has a lot interesting stuff going on. Lots of young people are moving in because it's cheap.

Think of any formerly-rundown-now-gentrified neighborhood in your city - it's like that, in the early stages. But on a bigger scale.

We like to refer to those folks as victims. Sorry my sister in law lives there and tells me how utterly horrible the place is. We visited her not long ago. I tild my wife I was never going back there. Ever.


Greektown + Brush St., Corktown, even Midtown are all awesome and pretty safe places to have a GREAT time in Detroit whether you're into good food (Slow's, Pegasus, Pub Rub, etc.), pretty decent nightlife (hope you like Irish/German/Mexican on Brush St, Corktown), gambling (MGM, MCC, Greektown) or sports (Wings, Tigers). With the casino's + the stadiums down there, there's a ton of stuff to do that's reasonably priced and a damn good time. I don't live close enough to go as often anymore, but when I was close it was a more fun going there than to Royal Oak/Ferndale.

Yeah, anything outside of that sucks, but there's no reason to go to those parts anyway unless you are looking for drugs and/or to drop off a body.
 
2013-06-14 05:02:30 PM

mike_d85: Magnanimous_J: It that everything I read about Detroit, the citizens are frustrated because no one can build anything nice there without it getting ripped off because the politicians are corrupt and the cops are way too slow to respond to violent crime. I saw something where Wendy's put in a store in a neighborhood and citizens literally guarded it on their own time against robbery because they were scared it would get robbed too many times and corporate would shut it down. They were that desperate for some kind of... anything there. It was really sad.

If I had the money, I would resettle Detroit like the western frontier. Right now it's basically a lawless wasteland, right? So I would incorporate a new town right in the middle of the worst of it. I would build a factory making something simple, like storm drain grates or cast iron cookware or something, taking advantage of the low labor costs. The taxes on the factory would provide for a police force for the factory and the few blocks around it, which would house workers who wanted to live there.Having a beat heart to the economy of this micro-city would hopefully encourage other people to start supporting businesses like laundries and restaurants and whatnot and that would increase the tax base and the police-protected area would expand to the point where we could build schools and hospitals etc.

Rebuild Detroit from the inside out.

I had the same thought.
I'm pretty sure that violates anti-trust laws since the mill villages of the 1940s basically ran a debtor's prison/sharecropper scam.

Low labor costs might be an issue, although anyone not in the union would probably come a-scurrying.


The idea isn't that workers would HAVE to live there. But if people weren't afraid their houses were going to get broken into the minute they left, maybe they would be more willing to invest in their property and create value in their community.
 
2013-06-14 05:03:23 PM

forteblast: Wouldn't have helped, he lived near the river. Speaking of which... you really miss Meijer when you leave Michigan.


Please tell me it's called Meijer General Store.
 
2013-06-14 05:07:22 PM

Magnanimous_J: mike_d85: Magnanimous_J: It that everything I read about Detroit, the citizens are frustrated because no one can build anything nice there without it getting ripped off because the politicians are corrupt and the cops are way too slow to respond to violent crime. I saw something where Wendy's put in a store in a neighborhood and citizens literally guarded it on their own time against robbery because they were scared it would get robbed too many times and corporate would shut it down. They were that desperate for some kind of... anything there. It was really sad.

If I had the money, I would resettle Detroit like the western frontier. Right now it's basically a lawless wasteland, right? So I would incorporate a new town right in the middle of the worst of it. I would build a factory making something simple, like storm drain grates or cast iron cookware or something, taking advantage of the low labor costs. The taxes on the factory would provide for a police force for the factory and the few blocks around it, which would house workers who wanted to live there.Having a beat heart to the economy of this micro-city would hopefully encourage other people to start supporting businesses like laundries and restaurants and whatnot and that would increase the tax base and the police-protected area would expand to the point where we could build schools and hospitals etc.

Rebuild Detroit from the inside out.

I had the same thought.
I'm pretty sure that violates anti-trust laws since the mill villages of the 1940s basically ran a debtor's prison/sharecropper scam.

Low labor costs might be an issue, although anyone not in the union would probably come a-scurrying.

The idea isn't that workers would HAVE to live there. But if people weren't afraid their houses were going to get broken into the minute they left, maybe they would be more willing to invest in their property and create value in their community.


Mill villagers didn't HAVE to live there either.  But since the mill was financing the employees, the homes were relatively nice, and the commute was ideal nearly everyone did.  A bit of apples and oranges since the mills were set up in rural-ish locations in the south.
Of course, those mill villages were set up near farming districts in order to draw more business to the company store (a general store owned or financed entirely by the mill).  Given the "grocery store desert" described by forteblast, I'm assuming you would need to do the same thing which again would violate anti-trust laws.

/Honest intentions and all that.
 
2013-06-14 05:19:57 PM

mike_d85: MichiganFTL: Decillion: How is Detroit able to fill stadiums of four pro sports teams? Is there a magic fairy land of jobs in the suburbs?

Doesn't hurt that Detroit is adjacent to one of top 3 richest counties in the nation ya know.

Is that Anne Arbor?  I hear it's nice and someone at work plugged it as an awesome place to live (except for the cold)


Oakland County.  Even with Pontiac in it, somehow.
 
2013-06-14 05:22:44 PM
Anyone who spells his name "Kevyn" is doomed to failure.
 
2013-06-14 05:24:35 PM

Netrngr: jaytkay: Detroit has a lot interesting stuff going on. Lots of young people are moving in because it's cheap.

Think of any formerly-rundown-now-gentrified neighborhood in your city - it's like that, in the early stages. But on a bigger scale.

We like to refer to those folks as victims. Sorry my sister in law lives there and tells me how utterly horrible the place is. We visited her not long ago. I tild my wife I was never going back there. Ever.


then why doesn't your sister in law... move?

Detroit is not for everyone - namely, it's not for folks trying to start families to relocate to right now unless you're incredibly ambitious.  But hanging out with my 20-something friends is a blast, partly because they all chose to be there.  Yeah, there will be some reasonable biatching about services, crime, etc., but that's maybe 5% of the conversation.  The rest is art projects, music projects, urban gardening, how the business they started is getting along, etc.

But seriously, unless you're really poor - or own property in the city and you'd take a hit if you sold it, which is pretty much any property - it's really not that hard to move to even south Warren.  And it's not like your job is in Detroit anyway, probably.
 
2013-06-14 05:26:01 PM
Legalize it!
 
2013-06-14 05:35:31 PM

mike_d85: forteblast: Wouldn't have helped, he lived near the river. Speaking of which... you really miss Meijer when you leave Michigan.

Please tell me it's called Meijer General Store.


It's called Meijer. Meijer Thrifty Acres if you're old enough to remember (not that anyone called it that back then). We used to drive 20 minutes to get to the nearest Meijer (in Saginaw, from Auburn) because they offered better deals than the local IGA.
 
2013-06-14 05:36:01 PM

SirEattonHogg: That People Mover has to be hands down the dumbest "mass transit" system I've ever ridden.


Thought is was okay, it only really serves visitors coming in for sports, theatre and casinos.  Or special events like the Autoshow.  They are working on a much better system for commuters since the buses can't seem to keep running.  It will be twice the size of the people mover and reaches into the neighborhoods a little bit.  To what extent, I am not sure.

All the talk of how much the property tax adjust to value of the house won't mean much to each house.  Over half of my PT's is just millages and service fees.  Any adjustments would likely only mean $100 if the assessed value is way way (yes two ways) off.  My house value fell off by 75% after market fell, my PT's dropped $500.  If they were assessed in recent years, they are not that far off.  Look at the full list of why your PT's are what they are, only $700 of my $1,900 tax bill is based on the value of my house.
 
2013-06-14 05:44:46 PM
There is absolutely no situation in which lowering taxes doesn't cause almost unbelievable magical growth in tax revenue sufficient to provide for any conceivable need.
 
2013-06-14 05:53:56 PM

Buttknuckle: I have been looking for a job and received a call the other day that went like this:

Caller:  "Mr. Buttknuckle, we have several positions that you would be a great fit.  Are you willing to relocate?"

Me:  "Oh sure.  I have no dependents and am open to a new environment."

Caller: "Fantastic.  We have a terrific position available in Detroit."

Me: "No.  I meant I would relocate anywhere but Detroit."

Caller:  "Understood.  I figured."


Too quick a call to get around to "Are you bulletproof?"
 
2013-06-14 05:58:14 PM

Decillion: How is Detroit able to fill stadiums of four pro sports teams? Is there a magic fairy land of jobs in the suburbs?


Yes.  (Though the Pistons are way the fark up in Auburn Hills, which honestly puts them closer to Flint)

Downtown, midtown, and Greektown are all cool (defined as: "I could visit these during the day, park my car in a watched garage for $10 and be reasonably certain that my car wasn't going to be stolen or me get mugged, while finding reasonably cool things to do for an afternoon/evening").

The rest of Detroit and the largely black/hispanic suburbs surrounding it SUCK.  Like Gary, IN "Don't get off the freeway for ANYTHING even if your car is ON FIRE (literally.  Fun story there)" suck.

Immediately outside that is super-super rich people.  They're not multi-millionaires (outside of Bloomfield Hills, which is like top 5 richest area code in terms of income/Cost of living in the country), but there's still a small, but solid corp of UAW workers making high 5, low 6 + bennies, coupled with a surprisingly large group of white-collar knowledge workers a lot of whom drive 30 minutes into the city from the rich suburbs every morning. (And despite this, Detroit lacks a morning rush hour.  The one advantage of focusing on cars to the extent they do).  And honestly, in the land of 150K houses, you don't have to be rich to live a really nice lifestyle.

Also, the whole "You have to live near Detroit" thing pushes wages sky-high.  For my CS degree with a couple years of experience, Chicago was offering $45K out of college, and Detroit was offering $60K.   Heck, SF (Fark-you COL) was only offering $70K, and CT near NYC (And the horse you rode in on COL) was offering $80K.  My uncle drove a beer truck, and he made $80K/year before retiring early at 60.
 
2013-06-14 06:02:10 PM
How to make Detroit better:

1. Legalize gambling, brothels (taxed and regulated prostitution within a licensed establishment), and marijuana within city limits.

2. Give tax incentives to businesses who wish to operate within the city. Woo organizations that would like to build casinos, hash bars, and brothels.

3. Basically let organized crime move into town and set up business. Put the expected amount of pressure on them, but know that the cops will probably all be on their payroll at some point.

4. Watch tourists flock to the area to spend lots of money, which will be taxed.

5. Watch as the mobsters wipe out the street crime by either crushing the gangs, or assuming control of them and preventing them from terrorizing paying customers and tourists.

6. Accept that since Detroit is going to have crime, that at least organized crime/mobsters are generally good businessmen who don't commit random acts of violence or want to see their neighborhoods become rundown pits after pocketing all the city's money, as opposed to the gangbangers and criminals that rule Detroit now.

7. Watch Michigan finally get their damned roads fixed after seeing a huge spike in tax revenue from taxed weed, prostitution, and gambling establishments.

8. Cross your fingers and hope that as a result, Michigan is annexed by Canada, so we can finally have universal health care, milk in bags, and justification for all the Tim Horton's around here.
 
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