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(National Review)   Libertarianism is just an ideal   (nationalreview.com) divider line 1480
    More: Followup, modern, communist state  
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12204 clicks; posted to Main » on 14 Jun 2013 at 11:39 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-06-14 02:42:54 PM
POOG JUST WANT KNOW WHAT HAPPEN AT BONEGAZI.  THAT ALL.
 
2013-06-14 02:43:11 PM
Libertarianism does exist.

1)  It exists at the upper echelon of the wealthy.  No matter what country they come from, Sweden, China, USA, Mexico, they all compete generally "outside of the control of any specific government."

2) It exists at a level below the government's reach (remember we are talking about rules other than the ones preventing hurting other people etc).  There are people living day to day without any concern for the government all over the world, including the US.  You can shop for many goods on the black market, or maybe sometimes pay a little sales tax in some places, but that is about it.  (Think about illegal immigrants in this sense)

Point is, that it is really only the middle class that is trapped by, gets the benefits of, and supports a government.  Everybody else could give a flying f*ck.

The real issue that nobody ever seams to talk about (maybe because it is defeatist) is that there are generally two types of people (based on raw human nature) 1) those that will always seeks out and use power to their advantage, and 2) those that don't have power, either through choice or poor circumstances.

Second, there will always be a consolidation of power towards the first group.  It doesn't matter if it is via corporations in a purely capitalist society or the legislature in a socialist society.  Powerful people will take over the most powerful positions and use them to their own benefit.  Libertarianism is the only ideal that at least attempts to give the power back to every individual, such that it is the individual's fault if it is lost or given up.

And no, Somalia is not a libertarian lifestyle, it is ruled by warlords.  Warlords have the power not the greater population of individuals.  Like I said, there will always be a consolidation of power towards the powerful, even under a libertarianism effort.
 
2013-06-14 02:43:44 PM

Mrtraveler01: WinoRhino: Crude: Your website is dying. I couldn't be happier about that. (When articles have less than 50 - 100 comments on them, and most of those are from the same users, it's dead)

... and I should know! I spend all day reading the articles, counting the number of posts and analyzing their content! Since 2007!

Jesus, I didn't even catch that.

I've been on Fark for a little longer than he has (discovered it in March 2007) and I really can't tell a noticeable difference between Fark in 2007 and Fark today.

I think he's just being a drama queen just for the sake of being a drama queen.


And it does seem curiously vicious considering the site is free. It's not like Drew sneaks into your bedroom at night and rests his ballsack on your forehead.  If anything, Drew's post admits that the mods who approve stuff for the poltics tab generally do a shiat job.
 
2013-06-14 02:43:51 PM

iawai: Without governmental regulation and enforcement, the rich and powerful have no ability to crush all the possible competition in the world.


That's adorable!
 
2013-06-14 02:44:03 PM

Mrtraveler01: I've been on Fark for a little longer than he has (discovered it in March 2007) and I really can't tell a noticeable difference between Fark in 2007 and Fark today.


I was a lurker for a couple years before opening this username in 2004. That's over a decade. I can't think of another site I have been visiting for that long, except maybe Google. I am also now, suddenly, feeling old.

GROKS GREEN PLANT MATERIAL IN FRONT OF CAVE-- MOVE FROM IT.
 
2013-06-14 02:44:10 PM

JohnnyC: craigdamage: .....BUT WE ARE NOT ROCKS!!


(from VERY old SNL/cavemen sketch)


Also.
Libertarians believe in ALL the same practical things everybody else does. (food safety, public services like fire dept. and EMT etc., any-all things that the government provides)
....they just simply believe ALL these things can be done better and more efficiently by the private sector.

All the dumb "what does a libertarian do when his house catches fire?" is kinda stupid.

So you're saying that Libertarians prefer a couple of guys who come through your business every now and then to collect "protection money" over paying taxes and having police a phone call away? Is that right?


How is situation 1 different from situation 2?
 
2013-06-14 02:44:31 PM
What's going on in here...

/runs to make popcorn
 
2013-06-14 02:44:38 PM

Crude: Drew: Holy crap a good thread from the politics tab?  Must be national bourbon day

Don't you dare complain about the content of the Politics tab when you're the piece of shiat who is responsible for creating both the content and the political slant of the drivel found there.


Your website is dying. I couldn't be happier about that. (When articles have less than 50 - 100 comments on them, and most of those are from the same users, it's dead)


/RIP Digg FARK


i970.photobucket.com
 
2013-06-14 02:44:43 PM

craigdamage: .....BUT WE ARE NOT ROCKS!!


(from VERY old SNL/cavemen sketch)


Also.
Libertarians believe in ALL the same practical things everybody else does. (food safety, public services like fire dept. and EMT etc., any-all things that the government provides)
....they just simply believe ALL these things can be done better and more efficiently by the private sector.

All the dumb "what does a libertarian do when his house catches fire?" is kinda stupid.


MAYBE YOU UNEVOLVED TROGLODYTE IF YOU THINK PRIVATIZED POLICE AND FIRE WORK OUT. LOOK AT PRIVATE PRISON.
 
2013-06-14 02:45:21 PM

Mercutio74: It's not like Drew sneaks into your bedroom at night and rests his ballsack on your forehead.


...THEN WHO?
 
2013-06-14 02:45:28 PM

iawai: Mercutio74: FuzedBox: Libertarianism is not anarchy, nor even close to it. Sure there's anarcho-libertarianism, a form of libertarianism but they are not the majority. Libertarianism in and of it self does not want to abolish government; it wants to streamline it and prune the branches.

But let's face it.  Libertarianism is a terrible idea.  All it does is transfer power and resources to people with the most power and resources.  Without governmental regulation and enforcement, there's no way an individual has any ability to move up in the world except by the grace of the people already in charge.

But let's face it.  Statism is a terrible idea.  All it does is transfer power and resources to people with the most power and resources.  Without governmental regulation and enforcement, the rich and powerful have no ability to crush all the possible competition in the world.


So strip all those regulations and leave all the rich and powerful with the resources they already have! It'll all work itself out in no time, guys!
 
2013-06-14 02:45:42 PM

PsiChick: MAUG HAS BETTER CAVEWOMAN NAME THAN EEA. EEA JEALOUS.

MAUG ALSO HAS POINT ABOUT ARISTOCRACY. BEAT AND CLAW, THEN USE SHINY ROCKS FOR BETTER THINGS.


EEA NOT NEED TO BE JEALOUS. EEA NICE.

MAUG WOULD ALSO LIKE TO POINT OUT WITH CLAW SCRATCHING DEEP IN ROCK...EAGLE CLAN BEGIN BY THROWING OFF OLD ARISTOCRACY, DAMMIT, WITH SHARP STICKS AND FLINT POINTS TOO.

OLD ARISTOCRACY NOT HAVE SKY MAN MANDATE, NEW ARISTOCRACY NOT HAVE SKY MAN MANDATE EITHER!!

THAT WHY SHARP STICKS IN GREAT WORD OF ELDERS.
 
2013-06-14 02:45:45 PM
For all those wondering, this is what happens when you introduce Libertarian ideology into anything.


Chaos and wrestling and stone boobies and cavewomen.
 
2013-06-14 02:45:46 PM

verbaltoxin: timujin: verbaltoxin: mrshowrules: is an ideal of the greedy and self serving suggesting that left to their own, people will look after each other

Well they would, because most people would group together socially and form an organization. That organization would then pick leaders, and those leaders would come up with some form of charter, so everyone has the same rules. Then they'd pick people to argue over and interpret those rules, and form another group to decide new rules as necessary for unforseen issues. Eventually, each group's organization would decide it's better if multiple groups create one, larger overseeing body so that multiple groups have the same rules and can resolve disputes between each other.

You realize that's the system we have now, right?

YOU NO READ GOOD, GO BASH YOUR OWN HEAD WITH OWN ROCK, MY ROCK TOO GOOD FOR YOUR HEAD


You know, when multiple misinterpret what you write, it might be you... But, yeah, I mistook your point to be that those actions were somehow exclusive to what Libertarians would do if just given the chance to rebuild government using their ideals.

or

YOU ROCK NO GOOD FOR BASHING, YOUR ROCK NOT EVEN GOOD FOR SCRATCHING ON CAVE WALL, ALL SAY YOUR BUFFALO LOOK LIKE SLUG WITH HORNS.  WHY YOU NO DRAW MORE GOOD?  TIMOOKJIN SAY YOU GO BACK TO BRIDGE, EAT MORE GOATS.
 
2013-06-14 02:45:47 PM

Mrtraveler01: iawai: Without governmental regulation and enforcement, the rich and powerful have no ability to crush all the possible competition in the world.

That's adorable!


Sometimes the truth is beautiful.
 
2013-06-14 02:45:48 PM

craigdamage: ....they just simply believe ALL these things can be done better and more efficiently by the private sector.

All the dumb "what does a libertarian do when his house catches fire?" is kinda stupid.


Right.  Because urgent need for a good or service in the face of dire catastrophic consequences is not a motivation for a profit-driven entity to price gouge.   Tell me more about the power of the unfettered free market, oh wise one.
 
2013-06-14 02:45:59 PM

iawai: But let's face it. Statism is a terrible idea. All it does is transfer power and resources to people with the most power and resources. Without governmental regulation and enforcement, the rich and powerful have no ability to crush all the possible competition in the world.


The industrial revolution would like a word with you.  That's probably the closest modern society has ever gotten to a libertarian ideal.  It was great if you were a factory owner, not so much if you were working class.
 
2013-06-14 02:46:08 PM

iawai: Mercutio74: FuzedBox: Libertarianism is not anarchy, nor even close to it. Sure there's anarcho-libertarianism, a form of libertarianism but they are not the majority. Libertarianism in and of it self does not want to abolish government; it wants to streamline it and prune the branches.

But let's face it.  Libertarianism is a terrible idea.  All it does is transfer power and resources to people with the most power and resources.  Without governmental regulation and enforcement, there's no way an individual has any ability to move up in the world except by the grace of the people already in charge.

But let's face it.  Statism is a terrible idea.  All it does is transfer power and resources to people with the most power and resources.  Without governmental regulation and enforcement, the rich and powerful have no ability to crush all the possible competition in the world.


Yes, because the only alternative to the libertarian ideal is a pure statist one. My god, the caveman posts have more logical coherency than that fallacy.
 
2013-06-14 02:46:13 PM

Crude: Drew: Holy crap a good thread from the politics tab?  Must be national bourbon day

Don't you dare complain about the content of the Politics tab when you're the piece of shiat who is responsible for creating both the content and the political slant of the drivel found there.


Your website is dying. I couldn't be happier about that. (When articles have less than 50 - 100 comments on them, and most of those are from the same users, it's dead)


/RIP Digg FARK


Any suggestions on other sites with less bias?
 
2013-06-14 02:46:38 PM

Obama's Reptiloid Master: MAYBE YOU UNEVOLVED TROGLODYTE IF YOU THINK PRIVATIZED POLICE AND FIRE WORK OUT. LOOK AT PRIVATE PRISON.


WORK FOR MILGRAM. WHY NOT COUNTRY?
 
2013-06-14 02:46:57 PM

Crude: Drew: Holy crap a good thread from the politics tab?  Must be national bourbon day

Don't you dare complain about the content of the Politics tab when you're the piece of shiat who is responsible for creating both the content and the political slant of the drivel found there.


Your website is dying. I couldn't be happier about that. (When articles have less than 50 - 100 comments on them, and most of those are from the same users, it's dead)


/RIP Digg FARK


YOU NOT SUPPOSED PUT STICK IN OWN BUTT. TAKE OUT STICK.
 
2013-06-14 02:47:08 PM

Mrtraveler01: TerminalEchoes: Libertarianism will never work because most people are either too lazy or too stupid to look after themselves. I could actually say the same thing about democracy.

Well that and it only takes one asshole who tries to take advantage of the system to ruin it for the rest of us.

But if you want to pretend to feel superior to others, be my guest.


Not trying to feel superior, man. I'm a libertarian and I'm the first person to admit it'd never actually work. We humans just suck at this whole governing thing.
 
2013-06-14 02:47:23 PM

WinoRhino: Mercutio74: It's not like Drew sneaks into your bedroom at night and rests his ballsack on your forehead.

...THEN WHO?


Hah!  You'll never know, my ballsack-blinded friend, you'll never know...
 
2013-06-14 02:47:49 PM

Z-clipped: Rabid Badger Beaver Weasel: I read your post wrong

It's probably my fault for not typing it in "caveman".  ; )

IRQ12: You may be right. If the "social connotation" is: "I'm afraid of saying I am an atheist or libertarian because almost every single one I have ever heard from is an obnoxious asshole who really has no clue of what they are talking about and most people I meet think the same, regardless of their beliefs."

You know why ALL atheists seem so offensive?  It's not their behavior.  It's because to Christians, their lack of belief is an affront- their existence is inherently offensive.  So Christians attempt to skew the perceptions of everyone around them so that any behavior by atheists other than "pretending not to exist" is aggressive.  Congrats.  You fell for it.


I didn't say "offensive" or "aggressive", I said "obnoxious asshole".  This is coming from someone who doesn't see libertarian-ism or atheism as an affront to my ideology.  I can't count the times I have seen Libertarians shiat on "independents" or atheists shiat on agnostics.  Just look at any libertarian or atheist thread on the internet is dripping with smug self important idiots who usually have little to no clue about what they are talking about.
 
2013-06-14 02:47:53 PM

iawai: Mrtraveler01: iawai: Without governmental regulation and enforcement, the rich and powerful have no ability to crush all the possible competition in the world.

That's adorable!

Sometimes the truth is beautiful.


You're getting too obvious now.

Removing the rules and regulations just makes it easier for the rich and powerful to crush all the possible competition in the world.
 
2013-06-14 02:48:26 PM
EPIC DERP THREAD
 
2013-06-14 02:48:50 PM

mmmk: Crude: Drew: Holy crap a good thread from the politics tab?  Must be national bourbon day

Don't you dare complain about the content of the Politics tab when you're the piece of shiat who is responsible for creating both the content and the political slant of the drivel found there.


Your website is dying. I couldn't be happier about that. (When articles have less than 50 - 100 comments on them, and most of those are from the same users, it's dead)


/RIP Digg FARK

Any suggestions on other sites with less bias?


Infowars, Stormfront, World Net Daily, Free Republic, Townhall, American Thinker, your grandfather's crazy FWD:FWD:FWD: e-mails, etc...
 
2013-06-14 02:48:53 PM
I'm crying! People are looking at me funny and I can't help it.
 
2013-06-14 02:48:56 PM

timujin: verbaltoxin: timujin: verbaltoxin: mrshowrules: is an ideal of the greedy and self serving suggesting that left to their own, people will look after each other

Well they would, because most people would group together socially and form an organization. That organization would then pick leaders, and those leaders would come up with some form of charter, so everyone has the same rules. Then they'd pick people to argue over and interpret those rules, and form another group to decide new rules as necessary for unforseen issues. Eventually, each group's organization would decide it's better if multiple groups create one, larger overseeing body so that multiple groups have the same rules and can resolve disputes between each other.

You realize that's the system we have now, right?

YOU NO READ GOOD, GO BASH YOUR OWN HEAD WITH OWN ROCK, MY ROCK TOO GOOD FOR YOUR HEAD

You know, when multiple misinterpret what you write, it might be you... But, yeah, I mistook your point to be that those actions were somehow exclusive to what Libertarians would do if just given the chance to rebuild government using their ideals.

or

YOU ROCK NO GOOD FOR BASHING, YOUR ROCK NOT EVEN GOOD FOR SCRATCHING ON CAVE WALL, ALL SAY YOUR BUFFALO LOOK LIKE SLUG WITH HORNS.  WHY YOU NO DRAW MORE GOOD?  TIMOOKJIN SAY YOU GO BACK TO BRIDGE, EAT MORE GOATS.


I already clarified what I meant earlier. Go look up that post and then GO ROCK YOURSELF.
 
2013-06-14 02:49:08 PM

TerminalEchoes: Mrtraveler01: TerminalEchoes: Libertarianism will never work because most people are either too lazy or too stupid to look after themselves. I could actually say the same thing about democracy.

Well that and it only takes one asshole who tries to take advantage of the system to ruin it for the rest of us.

But if you want to pretend to feel superior to others, be my guest.

Not trying to feel superior, man. I'm a libertarian and I'm the first person to admit it'd never actually work. We humans just suck at this whole governing thing.


It's not because we're lazy though. It's because we're a bunch of self-serving assholes.
 
2013-06-14 02:49:26 PM

mmmk: Crude: Drew: Holy crap a good thread from the politics tab?  Must be national bourbon day

Don't you dare complain about the content of the Politics tab when you're the piece of shiat who is responsible for creating both the content and the political slant of the drivel found there.


Your website is dying. I couldn't be happier about that. (When articles have less than 50 - 100 comments on them, and most of those are from the same users, it's dead)


/RIP Digg FARK

Any suggestions on other sites with less bias?


ROCKS NEWS. FAIR AND BALANCED.
 
2013-06-14 02:49:30 PM
GROG USE COMPLEX SYSTEM OF SATIRE TO UNDERMINE SHINY ROCK WORSHIPERS, SMACK THEM ON HEAD WITH CLUB.
 
2013-06-14 02:51:29 PM
WHATGOINGONINTHREAD_OHLAWD.JPG
 
2013-06-14 02:51:31 PM

Mercutio74: Hah!  You'll never know, my ballsack-blinded friend, you'll never know...


Anonymous has been giving me the trojan war helmet!
 
2013-06-14 02:52:10 PM

Fifi Le Pew: POOG JUST WANT KNOW WHAT HAPPEN AT BONEGAZI.  THAT ALL.


LEAVE ME ALONE.
 
2013-06-14 02:52:11 PM
THAG HONESTLY BELIEVE ALL LUBURTARAN HAVE LONG OILY BEARD AND COMIC TABLET T-SHIRT TUCKED INTO SWEATPANTS. AGAINST ALL EVIDENCE LUBURTARIAN CLUTCH POINTY STICK AND BELIEVE APEX PREDATOR.

BUT APEX PREDATOR IS REALLY SMILODON. LUBURTARAN WITH STICK JUST FOOD FOR SMILODON. IS WHY LIVE IN CAVES TOGETHER. THAG SIMPLY FEED GREASY FAT LUBURTARAN TO SMILODON INSTEAD OF RUN AWAY. IS THAGUNIST WAY.
 
2013-06-14 02:52:17 PM
Mercutio74:

And it does seem curiously vicious considering the site is free. It's not like Drew sneaks into your bedroom at night and rests his ballsack on your forehead. If anything, Drew's post admits that the mods who approve stuff for the poltics tab generally do a shiat job.

Wait, he doesn't??? Then which one of you rock throwing bastids has been?  I'm more than a little tired of ballslime on my pillows!
 
2013-06-14 02:52:30 PM

Mrtraveler01: I've been on Fark for a little longer than he has (discovered it in March 2007) and I really can't tell a noticeable difference between Fark in 2007 and Fark today.


2002 here and lurked since before 9/11.  Disregarding the lack of main pages foobies threads, the over all comment rate seems close to the same.

BTW, my initial entry in the thread is a reference to the Pickle Incident, if it wasn't clear.  If you don't know what it is, don't go looking for it at work.
 
2013-06-14 02:52:57 PM

HAMMERTOE: The two political parties which hold the political process in a monopoly leave the majority with a choice between voting for the Tyranny of the Aristocracy or the Tyranny of the Bureaucracy. In the simplest terms, you're going to get screwed no matter which way you go and your vote is really for whom you would prefer to do the screwing. A third party needs to be advanced, based upon the rights and advantage of the individual, to force the two main parties back into some kind of reality.

Does it really matter which rich people run away with the country? That's what you're really debating.



You're not necessarily going to get screwed, IF the people granted power are honest, competent, prudent with money and know enough to walk away from it all before they find themselves "going native". But does that sound anything like Washington politicians to anybody?

You're also not going to get screwed, IF the citizenry holds legislators' feet to the fire and are willing to jump to another option regardless of personal or party loyalty. Does that sound anything like American voters to anybody? Voters in South Carolina stayed blindly loyal to Strom Thurmond despite his bigotry; in Massachusetts they stayed blindly loyal to Ted Kennedy despite his being an entitled drunken lout. Was there some sort of shortage of conservatives in South Carolina or liberals in Massachusetts that these particular shiatheads were THAT essential to the process?

You're also not going to get screwed if you realize that certain aspects of your life are best controlled by yourself, even if it's a pain in the ass to do so at the time. I was flipping through a recent Consumer Reports (no can find linky) piece on health care that stated 70% of our health care costs are due to our own shiatty choices. It's not the government's fault or Monsanto's fault or anybody's fault but our own if we are unwilling to govern our own choices. We eat poorly, we don't exercise, and when we do get sick we blow off our medication and don't follow doctor's recommendations. I'm overweight. I didn't get that way because of the sinister bacon-industrial complex or because government subsidizes big agribusiness (although that doesn't help). I got that way because I like beer and pizza and chicken korma and strawberry pie and bacon and sushi and fusilli carbonara and barbecue and Rioja and cheese coneys and maple syrup and Ted's Jumbo Red Hots and zonking out on the couch watching movies with my wife. And now I'm trying to undo the damage I did, while still enjoying the good stuff once in a while.

I couldn't give two shiats about 'pure' libertarianism, whatever that is. My own definition of libertarian is somebody who may have a general preference for one party's philosophy or another, grounded in the belief that power should reside in government only when obviously essential and then it should reside in the lowest feasible level of government, and who will ditch that party if the members focus more on accumulating power than on maintaining principles...and when they ditch that party, they don't necessarily run into the arms of the other major party, but find themselves a third option.

Or just boil it down to 'there ain't no such thing as a free lunch'. If you're not willing to take care of what can and should be taken care of yourself, dealing with what happens after that is going to be either a business decision, a political decision, or some unholy combination of both. The idea behind practical libertarianism should be to avoid placing yourself at somebody else's mercy whenever possible. If you won't exercise power over yourself, somebody else will exercise it over you.
 
2013-06-14 02:53:06 PM
Hey assholes!

I never frkking said I was a goddam libertarian!!

I just know what they are.

They believe that the private sector can do a better job than the govt.
I never said I wanted my fire dept privatized or that the market shouldn't be regulated.

jeez....FARK does turn folks into jackasses.
 
2013-06-14 02:53:12 PM
Aarontology:

TROG PAUL

This made me laugh so hard I lodged a piece of banana I was eating in my sinuses.
 
2013-06-14 02:53:17 PM

TheWhaleShark: Grand_Moff_Joseph: Libertarianism isn't even an ideal.  It's a fantasy world, populated by raw milk fanatics who want to pay for everything in gold bars, and career college kids who just want free weed.

I'm just popping in to say that this is my favorite quote of the thread. I'll leave the rest of you to your rock-throwing.


Thanks!  :)
 
2013-06-14 02:53:24 PM

Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: GROG USE COMPLEX SYSTEM OF SATIRE TO UNDERMINE SHINY ROCK WORSHIPERS, SMACK THEM ON HEAD WITH CLUB.


GROG BE CAREFUL, HARD TO TELL DIFFERENCE FROM REAL WORSHIPPERS AND GROG.  SOMEONE SHOULD WRITE THAT ON CAVE WALL... CALL IT GROG'S LAW.
 
2013-06-14 02:54:01 PM

Obama's Reptiloid Master: THAG HONESTLY BELIEVE ALL LUBURTARAN HAVE LONG OILY BEARD AND COMIC TABLET T-SHIRT TUCKED INTO SWEATPANTS.


i believe the taxonomic designation for this phenomena is known as 'Homo UnixAdministratus.
 
2013-06-14 02:54:53 PM

Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: GROG USE COMPLEX SYSTEM OF SATIRE TO UNDERMINE SHINY ROCK WORSHIPERS, SMACK THEM ON HEAD WITH CLUB.


FORGET GROG. IT SLANT EYE CAVE.
 
2013-06-14 02:55:01 PM

verbaltoxin: iawai: Mercutio74: FuzedBox: Libertarianism is not anarchy, nor even close to it. Sure there's anarcho-libertarianism, a form of libertarianism but they are not the majority. Libertarianism in and of it self does not want to abolish government; it wants to streamline it and prune the branches.

But let's face it.  Libertarianism is a terrible idea.  All it does is transfer power and resources to people with the most power and resources.  Without governmental regulation and enforcement, there's no way an individual has any ability to move up in the world except by the grace of the people already in charge.

But let's face it.  Statism is a terrible idea.  All it does is transfer power and resources to people with the most power and resources.  Without governmental regulation and enforcement, the rich and powerful have no ability to crush all the possible competition in the world.

So strip all those regulations and leave all the rich and powerful with the resources they already have! It'll all work itself out in no time, guys!


When Nike was using sweatshop labor in the '00s was it consumer sentiment or govt action that made them stop?

When BP FUBAR'ed the Gulf, was it consumer sentiment or govt action that placed a liability cap on their damage and protected the executives from personal liability? And which one set the rules that drove them off the easier tapped on-land and shallow deposits and out into the deep water? And which one claimed the ability to "lease" the deep-water location to BP?

When the banks and other big businesses nearly collapsed a few years ago - who decided that they needed to be able to keep doing what they were doing with no criminal charges, but with massive monetary rewards in the form of bailouts?

I understand that people think that the govt is necessary, and without them the rich would get richer and enslave the poor while polluting the Earth - but it's been the vary fact that govt is running things that has kept the rich getting richer, the poor enslaved, and pollution given the okay. Central power is a GREAT thing for big corporations who have no qualms about harming people and don't want to meet the demands of their consumers.
 
2013-06-14 02:55:41 PM

ISO15693: Aarontology:

TROG PAUL

This made me laugh so hard I lodged a piece of banana I was eating in my sinuses.


WAIT, WHERE YOU GET THESE 'BANANAS'?  YOU GO TO EVERFREE FOREST???   :D
 
2013-06-14 02:55:41 PM

heap: Obama's Reptiloid Master: THAG HONESTLY BELIEVE ALL LUBURTARAN HAVE LONG OILY BEARD AND COMIC TABLET T-SHIRT TUCKED INTO SWEATPANTS.

i believe the taxonomic designation for this phenomena is known as 'Homo UnixAdministratus.


lawls!
 
2013-06-14 02:55:43 PM

bglove25: Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: GROG USE COMPLEX SYSTEM OF SATIRE TO UNDERMINE SHINY ROCK WORSHIPERS, SMACK THEM ON HEAD WITH CLUB.

FORGET GROG. IT SLANT EYE CAVE.


HEAP BIG SNORT LAUGH. MAKE NOSE BUBBLE. NOSE BUBBLE POP.
 
2013-06-14 02:55:43 PM

Mercutio74: iawai: But let's face it. Statism is a terrible idea. All it does is transfer power and resources to people with the most power and resources. Without governmental regulation and enforcement, the rich and powerful have no ability to crush all the possible competition in the world.

The industrial revolution would like a word with you.  That's probably the closest modern society has ever gotten to a libertarian ideal.  It was great if you were a factory owner, not so much if you were working class.


Evidence?
 
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