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(C|Net)   NSA chief hints at ISP and email wiretapping. If you haven't curled up into a ball and renounced your religion because there is no god yet, now may be a good time   (news.cnet.com) divider line 386
    More: Interesting, ISP, NSA, Julian Sanchez, Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court, Patriot Act, Fort Meade, warrantless wiretapping, Internet Protocol  
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7357 clicks; posted to Main » on 13 Jun 2013 at 9:30 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-06-13 11:22:59 AM  
Bombs, ricin, drones, governtment overthrow, pressure cooker, false flag, OWS, anarchist, guns, treason, allah, bronies.

There, now this thread is monitored.

/you're welcome
 
2013-06-13 11:23:20 AM  
Skleenar
But so far, it has not been about tapping US persons comm content, at least to my knowledge.

Why do you keep saying this? I showed you yesterday that content is exactly what PRISM targets, according to the person who leaked the information on it. Are you just trolling? Deliberately spreading disinformation?
 
2013-06-13 11:23:46 AM  

Agent 84: hobberwickey: Actually my dad had a good idea about this. If millions of people just put signature in their emails with a bunch of keywords like "bomb, terror, infidels, etc..." we could basically DDOS their search algorithms and render the whole thing useless. Anyone want to pass this along to Anonymous?

Anonymous? Maybe to the opposite sex! Hell, the only reason we haven't issued a Black Bag order and shipped them to our Idaho FEMA camp Guantanamo Bay is because of all the laughs they give us around the office.


Maybe so, but the one thing they seem to know how to do well is flood network traffic.
 
2013-06-13 11:23:51 AM  

trappedspirit: Bombs, ricin, drones, governtment overthrow, pressure cooker, false flag, OWS, anarchist, guns, treason, allah, bronies.

There, now this thread is monitored.

/you're welcome


That's a lot of typing wasting when you could have just said "Federal Reserve"
 
2013-06-13 11:25:18 AM  
I saw this coming, and so did anyone else with a farking brain.
So- many of you are brainless.
 
2013-06-13 11:26:18 AM  
Deneb81
And as of yet I haven't seen (may have missed but haven't seen) any difference between Skype or mail or Verizon - call logs (who, when, how long) are allowed. Call CONTENT is not and is protected.

Communication content is *exactly* what PRISM targets. If you weren't aware of that it's because you haven't actually listened to anything Greenwald reported or Snowden revealed.
 
2013-06-13 11:26:29 AM  

trappedspirit: Bombs, ricin, drones, governtment overthrow, pressure cooker, false flag, OWS, anarchist, guns, treason, allah, bronies.

There, now this thread is monitored.

/you're welcome


Like it wasn't already. Don't you know that Drew has NSA equipment in his bedroom closet, so that Obama can tap into fark threads and sniff out the paid-per-post guys. But if you ask him about it, he has to physically copy those threads to a thumb drive and physically hand it off to them!
 
2013-06-13 11:26:45 AM  

DubtodaIll: trappedspirit: Bombs, ricin, drones, governtment overthrow, pressure cooker, false flag, OWS, anarchist, guns, treason, allah, bronies.

There, now this thread is monitored.

/you're welcome

That's a lot of typing wasting when you could have just said "Federal Reserve"


Or "I'm in the Air Force"

If you want things to be noticed, you've gotta put them in bold. Geez, people
 
2013-06-13 11:26:53 AM  
What if we collectively fought back against the NSA by contributing (orders of magnitude) more garbage communication in an attempt to overwhelm their metadata collection efforts? For example: let's say we all run a program that for every email we send, we send thousands of variations of that same email differing only slightly in nearly every aspect with regard to its metadata, recipients, content, etc. And then do the same via SMS and whatever other communication system the government is tracking. I know it would amount to spam, but i would be willing to deal with that so long as would help make this program as expensive and fruitless as can be imagined.

I'm sure they are able to filter through most of it, but anything that can be done to undermine their efforts can and should be done.

I don't buy the idea of, "It's only secret in that it's classified" WTF Ever that means. Or, "Every member of Conress was briefed, Secret Courts have to approve of X, Y and Z" as if ANY OF US CARE that government is monitoring government.

We apparently show our naked bodies to the TSA every time we travel (or opt out and get a good ol fashioned groping) Allow them to read our email, internet searches, browse ANYTHING we have stored in the "cloud", look at who we call, text, etc. Meanwhile, the USA incarcerates millions of our citizens for crimes ranging from minor drug possession up on through everything else. We permanently stamp everyone ever charged with a crime in their record so they can either be embarrassed by a future employer or just not hired altogether.

It really makes me wonder what is meant by the word "freedom" and how much of it is left. I just don't think it's enough to say, "I just assumed they have been doing that anyway." Fark that.
 
2013-06-13 11:27:08 AM  
Don't worry, it's not like governments ever abuse power
 
2013-06-13 11:27:52 AM  
When the feds announce that there will be a complete revamping of the data infrastructure and every man jack in the US will soon have Über fast lightpipe bringing data, telephony and TeeVee to their door for cheap, you may officially start sh*tting in your pants.
 
2013-06-13 11:28:32 AM  

Stoker: I saw this coming, and so did anyone else with a farking brain.
So- many of you are brainless.


I think so.  That's why so many people are OK with it.  They've seen it in Hollywood movies so many times they believe it existed without a leak.
 
2013-06-13 11:30:12 AM  

Stoker: I saw this coming, and so did anyone else with a farking brain.
So- many of you are brainless.


Your smugness is like a shield that protects us all.
 
2013-06-13 11:30:48 AM  
A secret interpretation of the Patriot Act led .
The state is god. Bow before the ISP.
 
2013-06-13 11:31:20 AM  
I still don't know whether to be enraged and concerned

I guess it doesnt matter whether I'm either, they're not going to stop doing it
 
2013-06-13 11:31:33 AM  

D135: Don't worry, it's not like governments ever abuse power


People will learn.  Historically speaking, governments almost always go corrupt, eventually. Always working toward a critical mass -- very rarely stepping back.

More people have been killed by the hands of their own governments than by invaders.
 
2013-06-13 11:32:54 AM  

uber humper: If you want things to be noticed, you've gotta put them in bold. Geez, people


Actually, the algorithm responds better to all caps. Speaking of which, please ask your Uncle to lay off the caps lock in his emails. I know he's unhappy that Obama was elected, but he really needs to learn how to use the Shift key.
 
2013-06-13 11:33:09 AM  
So?  Governments have always used interstate commerce as a way to enforce power.  Since the internet crosses many borders, why would anyone be surprised?  I always assumed they were reading anything they wanted.

Life is much simpler and happier when you don't get bogged down with pipe dreams of privacy a thinking person knew was never possible.  You want privacy?  Stop using electricity.  You cannot be researched if you never plug anything in and pay cash.
 
2013-06-13 11:33:20 AM  

basemetal: It's for the children, citizen, don't you care about all the children this will save?


I pay full price.
 
2013-06-13 11:34:52 AM  

Lady J: I still don't know whether to be enraged and concerned

I guess it doesnt matter whether I'm either, they're not going to stop doing it


When the President or a Supreme Court Justice get taken down because some dick leaked their affair with a dead boy or live woman, they will stop doing this.  Until then, just use code words like target and hit and explode.
 
2013-06-13 11:34:55 AM  

tylerdurden217: What if we collectively fought back against the NSA by contributing (orders of magnitude) more garbage communication in an attempt to overwhelm their metadata collection efforts?


Fraa Jad sees through your bulshytte scheme.
 
2013-06-13 11:35:17 AM  

Lady J: I still don't know whether to be enraged and concerned

I guess it doesnt matter whether I'm either, they're not going to stop doing it


That's the spirit!

You can't fight the government, and you have no power to control it.

America!  Way better than shiatholes like China!
 
2013-06-13 11:35:19 AM  

tylerdurden217: What if we collectively fought back against the NSA by contributing (orders of magnitude) more garbage communication in an attempt to overwhelm their metadata collection efforts?


Uh, take a look around you.
 
2013-06-13 11:35:26 AM  

Agent 84: uber humper: If you want things to be noticed, you've gotta put them in bold. Geez, people

Actually, the algorithm responds better to all caps. Speaking of which, please ask your Uncle to lay off the caps lock in his emails. I know he's unhappy that Obama was elected, but he really needs to learn how to use the Shift key.


As I understand it doesn't search Arabic, that would be racist. Maybe if we change font's to an Arabic font, then change back on the other end, we can plan that bank heist.
 
2013-06-13 11:37:58 AM  
We, the elected officials and agencies who have sworn to uphold and protect the constitution of the united states of america double dog dare you to try and find a workaround for the sh*t we're pulling.  Go on.  Try.
 
2013-06-13 11:39:50 AM  

fickenchucker: So? Governments have always used interstate commerce as a way to enforce power. Since the internet crosses many borders, why would anyone be surprised? I always assumed they were reading anything they wanted.

Life is much simpler and happier when you don't get bogged down with pipe dreams of privacy a thinking person knew was never possible. You want privacy? Stop using electricity. You cannot be researched if you never plug anything in and pay cash.


It's about misuse.  I remember the owner of a club I used to hang out at was jailed for bribing city and county officials in LV and San Diego.  The FBI used the Patriot Act to bust him.  http://www.sfgate.com/opinion/editorials/article/Time-to-fix-the-Patr i ot-Act-2717306.php  It's a slippery slope.  It starts like this case, becomes more and more common, then we will be in an absolute police state.

You've been wearing rose colored glasses if you think this is as far as it will go. It has to stop, and stop here.
 
2013-06-13 11:42:39 AM  

fickenchucker: So?  Governments have always used interstate commerce as a way to enforce power.  Since the internet crosses many borders, why would anyone be surprised?  I always assumed they were reading anything they wanted.


"I'm farking your girlfriend.  But its cool.  I've always been farking her."
 
2013-06-13 11:43:01 AM  
sendtodave

Lady J: I still don't know whether to be enraged and concerned

I guess it doesnt matter whether I'm either, they're not going to stop doing it

That's the spirit!

You can't fight the government, and you have no power to control it.

America!  Way better than shiatholes like China!


im british actually, but I imagine if you're doing it we are

what would you suggest? making a MASSIVE fuss is a way to get my emails read by a human being rather than an algorithm (or whatever.. not in IT)

even if you successfully did make a massive fuss, and got a government elected that didn't do this, it wouldnt last. i imagine it's just too valuable a tool

at least now we all know, people will find other ways to plot their suicide bombings / do their drug deals / exchange their photos of etc etc
 
2013-06-13 11:43:27 AM  

neongoats: trappedspirit: Bombs, ricin, drones, governtment overthrow, pressure cooker, false flag, OWS, anarchist, guns, treason, allah, bronies.

There, now this thread is monitored.

/you're welcome

Like it wasn't already. Don't you know that Drew has NSA equipment in his bedroom closet, so that Obama can tap into fark threads and sniff out the paid-per-post guys. But if you ask him about it, he has to physically copy those threads to a thumb drive and physically hand it off to them!


The truth is that forum posts and other public data is Hoovered up with abandon. All the better to "watch your ideas form" with, m'dear.
 
2013-06-13 11:46:11 AM  

kindms: Rep. Loretta Sanchez (D-Calif.) said lawmakers learned "significantly more" about the spy programs at the National Security Agency (NSA) during a briefing on Tuesday with counterterrorism officials.
"What we learned in there," Sanchez said, "is significantly more than what is out in the media today."

"I think it's just broader than most people even realize, and I think that's, in one way, what astounded most of us, too," Sanchez said of the briefing.

http://thehill.com/video/house/305047-dem-rep-lawmakers-learned-sign if icantly-more-about-surveillance-programs-in-nsa-briefing



Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed
 
2013-06-13 11:46:17 AM  

I_C_Weener: fickenchucker: So?  Governments have always used interstate commerce as a way to enforce power.  Since the internet crosses many borders, why would anyone be surprised?  I always assumed they were reading anything they wanted.

"I'm farking your girlfriend.  But its cool.  I've always been farking her."


If the guy's "always been farking her", then she'd be his girlfriend. So it would indeed be "cool".
 
2013-06-13 11:46:33 AM  

uber humper: It's a slippery slope.  It starts like this case, becomes more and more common, then we will be in an absolute police state.


Do you own a small business?

That's suspicious.

Are you late for work a lot?

That's suspicious.

Do you own an off road capable vehicle?

That's suspicious.

Do you own a commercial truck but don't have a business that requires one?

That's suspicious.

Do you send and receive e-mails from persons known to associate with persons of interest?

That's suspicious.

Have you recently purchased a home or any item over 10,000.00?

That's suspicious.

Do you have an unusually high amount of large file downloads?

That's suspicious.

Are you studying subjects at university that might lend themselves to terrorist activities?

That's suspicious.

Do you have a non VoIP land line?

That's suspicious.

Do you eat, sleep and sh*t?

That's suspicious.
 
2013-06-13 11:47:14 AM  

mrexcess: neongoats: trappedspirit: Bombs, ricin, drones, governtment overthrow, pressure cooker, false flag, OWS, anarchist, guns, treason, allah, bronies.

There, now this thread is monitored.

/you're welcome

Like it wasn't already. Don't you know that Drew has NSA equipment in his bedroom closet, so that Obama can tap into fark threads and sniff out the paid-per-post guys. But if you ask him about it, he has to physically copy those threads to a thumb drive and physically hand it off to them!

The truth is that forum posts and other public data is Hoovered up with abandon. All the better to "watch your ideas form" with, m'dear.


Wait until they strengthen the laws on sedition and start combing forum access logs and comparing IPs with ISP records. You past (posts here) can come back to haunt you.

/although, they'll probably put an end to anonymous posting before that.  That will make it even easier.
 
2013-06-13 11:48:31 AM  

uber humper: Agent 84: uber humper: If you want things to be noticed, you've gotta put them in bold. Geez, people

Actually, the algorithm responds better to all caps. Speaking of which, please ask your Uncle to lay off the caps lock in his emails. I know he's unhappy that Obama was elected, but he really needs to learn how to use the Shift key.

As I understand it doesn't search Arabic, that would be racist. Maybe if we change font's to an Arabic font, then change back on the other end, we can plan that bank heist.


Don't worry, all of our numbers are Arabic, giving them cause to rifle through your dirty undies if you put 3.14159 in your message.
 
2013-06-13 11:49:13 AM  

Biological Ali: I_C_Weener: fickenchucker: So?  Governments have always used interstate commerce as a way to enforce power.  Since the internet crosses many borders, why would anyone be surprised?  I always assumed they were reading anything they wanted.

"I'm farking your girlfriend.  But its cool.  I've always been farking her."

If the guy's "always been farking her", then she'd be his girlfriend. So it would indeed be "cool".


"I've been skimming money off your bank account.  But its cool, I've been doing it since you first got the account under the old bank's name."
 
2013-06-13 11:49:37 AM  

bunner: uber humper: It's a slippery slope.  It starts like this case, becomes more and more common, then we will be in an absolute police state.

Do you own a small business?

That's suspicious.

Are you late for work a lot?

That's suspicious.

Do you own an off road capable vehicle?

That's suspicious.

Do you own a commercial truck but don't have a business that requires one?

That's suspicious.

Do you send and receive e-mails from persons known to associate with persons of interest?

That's suspicious.

Have you recently purchased a home or any item over 10,000.00?

That's suspicious.

Do you have an unusually high amount of large file downloads?

That's suspicious.

Are you studying subjects at university that might lend themselves to terrorist activities?

That's suspicious.

Do you have a non VoIP land line?

That's suspicious.

Do you eat, sleep and sh*t?

That's suspicious.


Damn, I checked all of those off except the non-voip.  Who the hell uses copper?

/Yea, I know the joke, the copper is in the ground but that doesn't mean it's dead.
 
2013-06-13 11:50:19 AM  

neongoats: uber humper: Agent 84: uber humper: If you want things to be noticed, you've gotta put them in bold. Geez, people

Actually, the algorithm responds better to all caps. Speaking of which, please ask your Uncle to lay off the caps lock in his emails. I know he's unhappy that Obama was elected, but he really needs to learn how to use the Shift key.

As I understand it doesn't search Arabic, that would be racist. Maybe if we change font's to an Arabic font, then change back on the other end, we can plan that bank heist.

Don't worry, all of our numbers are Arabic, giving them cause to rifle through your dirty undies if you put 3.14159 in your message.


Filthy terrorist numbers!!!

This is my IX post today.
 
2013-06-13 11:50:38 AM  

uber humper: Agent 84: uber humper: If you want things to be noticed, you've gotta put them in bold. Geez, people

Actually, the algorithm responds better to all caps. Speaking of which, please ask your Uncle to lay off the caps lock in his emails. I know he's unhappy that Obama was elected, but he really needs to learn how to use the Shift key.

As I understand it doesn't search Arabic, that would be racist. Maybe if we change font's to an Arabic font, then change back on the other end, we can plan that bank heist.


We can parse Arabic just fine. Klingon on the other hand-crap, said too much.
 
2013-06-13 11:50:53 AM  

uber humper: Who the hell uses copper?


A whole lot of federal employees, attorneys and consultants with their access panels installed inside the house.
 
2013-06-13 11:51:31 AM  
I work for a company that makes Fibre storage equipment, so I hope at least this will be good for business. We did see a strong uptick in Federal sales last quarter.
 
2013-06-13 11:52:36 AM  
tylerdurden217
What if we collectively fought back against the NSA by contributing (orders of magnitude) more garbage communication in an attempt to overwhelm their metadata collection efforts? For example: let's say we all run a program that for every email we send, we send thousands of variations of that same email differing only slightly in nearly every aspect with regard to its metadata, recipients, content, etc. And then do the same via SMS and whatever other communication system the government is tracking. I know it would amount to spam, but i would be willing to deal with that so long as would help make this program as expensive and fruitless as can be imagined.

That's the spirit. That actual implementation wouldn't be very useful, because it would be too easy to filter. However, other noise-generating "jamming" techniques that broke correlation and imparted plausible deniability could work.

It really makes me wonder what is meant by the word "freedom" and how much of it is left. I just don't think it's enough to say, "I just assumed they have been doing that anyway." Fark that.

Freedom means whatever we force -- or allow other to force -- it to mean. American citizens have been passive riders on the bus for too long. It's driving for the cliff, we can see it happening, and we need to take back the power from the propagandists, media moguls, wealth-mongers, and big brother so that we can stop it. It's a daunting task in the abstract until you view it as a series of battles instead of one big war. This is one such battle.
 
2013-06-13 11:52:47 AM  

neongoats: uber humper: Agent 84: uber humper: If you want things to be noticed, you've gotta put them in bold. Geez, people

Actually, the algorithm responds better to all caps. Speaking of which, please ask your Uncle to lay off the caps lock in his emails. I know he's unhappy that Obama was elected, but he really needs to learn how to use the Shift key.

As I understand it doesn't search Arabic, that would be racist. Maybe if we change font's to an Arabic font, then change back on the other end, we can plan that bank heist.

Don't worry, all of our numbers are Arabic, giving them cause to rifle through your dirty undies if you put 3.14159 in your message.


I know they are called Arabic numerals, but... Well, the "one" does look similar

emersonkent.com
 
2013-06-13 11:52:53 AM  

Agent 84: We can parse Arabic just fine. Klingon on the other hand-crap, said too much.


I'm going to allow for the sake of argument that you are what you portend to be.  In that context, let me ask you something.  Does the smug make Hitler's dick taste better?   :  )
 
2013-06-13 11:52:55 AM  

Skleenar: tenpoundsofcheese: Well, not to take the bait, but how does that enable them to stop or disrupt attacks?

The theory is that using metadata, you can establish patterns that are useful in identifying suspicious persons or activity.

http://kieranhealy.org/blog/archives/2013/06/09/using-metadata-to-fi nd -paul-revere/

And I believe that it is useful for this sort of thing.

However, it would also be useful in finding just about any sort of pattern you find interesting, not just ones that are related to national security (i.e. politcal leanings, affairs, etc.).

It's not without the potential for abuse.  What it is, however, is a streamlined way to find the data you really want without having to collect all of it and read through it.


The AOL search history closure from a few years back demonstrated that just abstracted meta-data can identify specific people.
 
2013-06-13 11:53:11 AM  

uber humper: It's about misuse.  I remember the owner of a club I used to hang out at was jailed for bribing city and county officials in LV and San Diego.  The FBI used the Patriot Act to bust him.  http://www.sfgate.com/opinion/editorials/article/Time-to-fix-the-Patr i ot-Act-2717306.php  It's a slippery slope.  It starts like this case, becomes more and more common, then we will be in an absolute police state.

You've been wearing rose colored glasses if you think this is as far as it will go. It has to stop, and stop here.


Exactly. It's inevitable that the federal government decides that, in order to get more value out of all of the data that is collected, they start using it for other purposes. It IS NOT comforting to hear that out of all of the data that has been collected there have been handfuls (dozens?) of cases in which that has helped disrupt plots... as if they fight terrorism with a Philip K Dick style "precrime" system. So in other words, the ROI on the sacrifice of our civil liberties has been really farking low. That won't mean that they kill the program, but instead, add value to it by increasing its scope. Fark that.

Instead of dismantling the systems that the Bush administration put into place in the name of the War on Terror... Obama has further cemented it, building a strong foundation for future administrations to use it as they please. Well, at least due process is gone. Saves time when looking for a lawyer so you can just get better at Sudoku while you waste away your best years behind bars. But crime rates are down! It's working!

Jeeezus I'm paranoid.
 
2013-06-13 11:55:54 AM  
Who cares? Come election time the plebs will forget all of this, lap up the same tired pandering lies, and reelect these idiots.
 
2013-06-13 11:56:20 AM  
Sock Ruh Tease: netweavr: This is like Gay Rights. The older generation is upset and despondent that they exist. The younger generation doesn't care.

The older generation will die off and this "scandal" will disappear.

The younger generation understands the logistics that would be required to read every message and figuresASSUMES the government focuses on known terrorists and their plots, not my text to my BFF Jill.

& assuming things always works out so well

/younger generations brought up with no expectation of privacy & that the gov't has their best interest in mind

or

/so distracted and consumed with frivolous technology and that any & everyone gives two shiats about every boring detail of their life that there really isn't time to worry about much else

/slashies with options
 
2013-06-13 11:56:47 AM  

bunner: uber humper: Who the hell uses copper?

A whole lot of federal employees, attorneys and consultants with their access panels installed inside the house.


They'd do better running their own PBX. I use Elasix, for both business and personal (makes it easy to connect both boxes together).  PBX in a Flash is pretty good for beginners.
 
2013-06-13 11:57:02 AM  
uber humper
Wait until they strengthen the laws on sedition and start combing forum access logs and comparing IPs with ISP records. You past (posts here) can come back to haunt you

They are already doing this, at least the correlation part. Why do you think that "metadata" is so handy? They know who you are, and they are "watching your ideas form as you type them".
 
2013-06-13 11:57:45 AM  

bunner: I'm going to allow for the sake of argument that you are what you portend to be. In that context, let me ask you something. Does the smug make Hitler's dick taste better? : )


I know we seem a little ominous, but we're pretty good guys if you get to know us.

Oh, and just for that little shot of snark, I am now flagging you as "Communist Al-Qaeda Sympathizer". Watch your back! ; )
 
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