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(Huffington Post)   GOP Rep Trent Franks: "The incidence of rape resulting in pregnancy are very low." Sounds legitimate   (huffingtonpost.com) divider line 27
    More: Asinine, humans, The Arizona Republic, House Judiciary, Equal Pay Act, St. Louis Public Radio, Paycheck Fairness Act, Jerry Nadler, obstetrics  
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854 clicks; posted to Politics » on 13 Jun 2013 at 8:12 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-06-13 08:26:29 AM
4 votes:

RussianPooper: He could very well be right about that fact, but it's a stupid basis for his position. What the hell does the incidence rate have to do with anything?


Exactly.  If this is true, then allowing the victims of rape the ability to control whether or not they go through the additional trauma of a 9 month pregnancy and prevent the government from forcing her to give birth to her rapist's baby should be even more of a no brainer, since it would occur "so rarely."

As for the "fact" that rape rarely results in pregnancy, you'd also have to look into how often pregnancies due to rape are prevented by the use of emergency doses of birth control which are given at the time rape kits are taken.  Birth control which many evangelicals would like to see outlawed.
2013-06-13 08:36:25 AM
3 votes:
You know what I find amazing?  It's not that he thinks how many women would have to carry their rapists baby to term makes a difference on whether ANY should be forced to.

No, what I can't fathom is why the National Republican Congressional Committee hasn't gone around to every Republican congressman, Senator, and candidate and waterboarded them until they develop a psychological block against saying the word 'rape' - in any context.

NRCC: Trent.  Say 'rape'.
Rep: It's a crime to rape.
NRCC: Douse him boys.
...
NRCC: Trent.  Say 'rape'.
Rep: .... potato?
NRCC: That's a good boy.  Have a cookie.
2013-06-13 08:25:46 AM
3 votes:
i.imgur.com
2013-06-13 10:10:02 AM
2 votes:

D135: What peer reviewed study is his opinion based on?


It's based on Nazi research. No, really.

And it's been thoroughly discredited. (Warning: PDF) Women who are assaulted are more likely to ovulate out-of-cycle than women in a random sexual encounter. And women who partake of random sexual encounters are more likely to have some form of protection.
2013-06-13 09:51:46 AM
2 votes:

MyRandomName: EvilEgg: Slam Dunkz: I think the whole "rape exception" argument is beyond stupid.  Either you are allowed to abort or not.  Just because you don't like the father shouldn't change one thing about however you view an embryo and its relevance to the abortion question.  If it does you are a hypocrite.

The entire argument is ridiculous.

I can see why we might let someone avoid turning a single trauma into a nine month trauma.

This bill allows the woman 5 months to decide. I so t get your ire. She can still abort her fetus.


Combine that with all the other BS laws in various states and it becomes a big problem. Abortion clinics required to have admitting privileges at hospitals, waiting periods, being forced to listen to a heartbeat, get an ultra-sound, be given bullshiat phony information about risks of breast cancer.  It was funny reading you complain about there being too many laws on the books.
2013-06-13 08:54:58 AM
2 votes:

EvilEgg: I would guess it is lower than the incidence from mutually consensual sex.

Mainly because science says women are hornier when they are fertile, so this would probably make it more likely that they are having consensual sex at that time.  Where as rapes would happen at a random time in their cycle.

The source of all of this information is a vaguely recalled article and my ass.


This is exactly how the GOP spreads it's message, by starting with something completely inaccurate, and having enough idiots repeat it until people who can't be bothered to actually research what they're saying (and why would they research something so stupid) start to try to figure out why so many people are saying this seemingly stupid thing. Our brains are very good at rationalizing things even when they don't make sense, so once people start to think about 'why are so many people saying this' they come up with some stupid reason why it could possibly be true and from there, as the lie is repeated over and over that 'possibly true' becomes 'I don't know' becomes 'the science is still out' becomes 'DERP THE GOVERNMENT IS KEEPING THIS FROM US DERP'.

Admittedly the science on this is a little tougher to dig up than on some other subjects since no one wants to talk about rape, but the science is out there and it's conclusive that there's no difference in chances of getting pregnant from being raped than from having consensual sex. Here's a great article on the actual science of it http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/context-and-variation/2012/08/20/ h ere-is-some-legitimate-science-on-pregnancy-and-rape/. Note the actual studies and real numbers.

Just for comparison's sake, here's a Christian "it doesn't happen that much" article.http://www.christianliferesources.com/article/rape-pregnancies -are-rar e-461. Note the numbers pulled almost entirely out of thin air. 

Basically the moral is that if you find yourself thinking, 'well I guess that could be true' take 20 minutes out of your day and look at the science behind this stuff and vote these idiots out of office.
2013-06-13 08:53:53 AM
2 votes:

phenn: For all the taxpayer dollars wasted on bringing these proposals forward over the years, each state could receive small coffers to establish pregnancy resource centers. The one in my former town of Clearwater was self-reliant in 4 years - using thrift store sales and local donations to keep going.


I've come to believe that the real reason they push these sorts of things is that they want to punish what they perceive to be "immoral" women.

I think these idiots and their supporters earnestly believe that women are raped because either:

a) They don't have a man around to protect them or
b) They "dress like sluts" and engage in activities that make them "deserving" of rape

I honestly don't believe people like Franks see rape victims as victims. I think they see rape victims as women who got what was coming to them and that now they're just looking to further destroy "moral fabric" by killing a "child".

I don't believe these.... things.... like Franks, see women as equals and they're taking their frustrations over modern views of a woman's place in society out by pushing this sort of malicious legislation. I think they believe women should be subservient to men in all facets of life and they're quietly boiling with rage that their troglodyte views on the matter are dying.

The GOP simply hates any woman who doesn't fit into their bullshiat views of the picturesque 1950s America that never actually existed anywhere but their own twisted brains.
2013-06-13 08:40:21 AM
2 votes:

thatboyoverthere: Oh fark you. Women are more likely to get pregnant from a rape since the vaginal trauma makes it more likely for a fertilized egg to implant.
/Of course I'm using big words that would just make him scream liberal at me.


And it's a fact that per encounter male potency is higher for a first/single encounter than in a long term relationship (look up the concept of "sperm warfare") so even without the trauma factor a rape is more likely to lead to pregnancy than if the woman slept with a long-term partner.

It's true that rape doesn't usually lead to pregnancy, but that's just because the likelihood of any single sexual encounter leading to a successful birth is very low. Considering there are ~200,000 sexual assaults in this country every year, trying to say "it's more likely you won't get pregnant than you will from a rape!" doesn't mean that pregnancy from rape is a non-issue.
2013-06-13 08:28:57 AM
2 votes:
I think the whole "rape exception" argument is beyond stupid.  Either you are allowed to abort or not.  Just because you don't like the father shouldn't change one thing about however you view an embryo and its relevance to the abortion question.  If it does you are a hypocrite.

The entire argument is ridiculous.
2013-06-13 08:28:32 AM
2 votes:

hobberwickey: randomjsa: Is this an inaccurate statement?

Simple answers, yes.


Simple answer, irrelevant. Arguing if the statement is true or not just gets on a tangent from the main point. His premise, true or not, does not support his conclusion.
2013-06-13 08:18:29 AM
2 votes:
He could very well be right about that fact, but it's a stupid basis for his position. What the hell does the incidence rate have to do with anything?
2013-06-13 12:57:36 PM
1 votes:
i43.tinypic.com
2013-06-13 10:08:21 AM
1 votes:

Mercutio74: abortion out of medical necessity should be on the table up until birth.


Which is really the part of all this where the GOP has decided not only to shoot itself in the foot, but to continue on up the entire leg.

Few people really support completely unfettered access to abortion. Most people view elective abortion in general as seedy and irresponsible but specifically view it past viability as an outright affront.

But the GOP is rapidly radicalizing people against any abortion controls by putting forward these absolutely insane bills that completely ignore all sensible health and wellness concerns in favor of letting some old, white men yell and screech on a chamber floor.

As far as I'm concerned at this point, all attempts to restrict any abortion at all should be vigorously opposed just because these assholes have proven so completely untrustworthy on the matter.
2013-06-13 09:59:24 AM
1 votes:
My girlie parts are nobody's bee's wax but my own.
2013-06-13 09:54:14 AM
1 votes:

MyRandomName: Do rape victims neef extra time to decide?


I don't know. Having never been impregnated by a rapist I don't presume to know the emotional complexity of such a scenario.

Why, do you?

That said, I reject the initial assumption that there is any justification for setting the ban at all. Feel free to provide some objective defense.
2013-06-13 09:47:03 AM
1 votes:

MyRandomName: Slam Dunkz: Knight of the Woeful Countenance: thatboyoverthere: Oh fark you. Women are more likely to get pregnant from a rape since the vaginal trauma makes it more likely for a fertilized egg to implant.
/Of course I'm using big words that would just make him scream liberal at me.

I'm no doctor, but how is it easier for a fertilized egg to implant itself within the uterus when the vagina has all the trauma?

/legit question, I don't understand how that would work.

It doesn't.  This is someone parroting bullshiat they read somewhere.  The research showed no discernible effect on pregnancy rates due to rape.

He never said rape affected incidence rates.

Are liberals really this dumb? The bill is for abortion after 5 months. Do rape victims neef extra time to decide? Nobody is saying no abortions for rape victims. He didn't say rape doesn't cause pregnancy. Idiot liberals arr twisting both the law and what he said to make a stupid political point.


5 months also may not be sufficient to determine fetal viability (regardless of the means of conception).  This bill would require women to carry non-viable fetuses to term.
2013-06-13 09:35:08 AM
1 votes:

buckler: hobberwickey: This is exactly how the GOP spreads it's message, by starting with something completely inaccurate, and having enough idiots repeat it until people who can't be bothered to actually research what they're saying (and why would they research something so stupid) start to try to figure out why so many people are saying this seemingly stupid thing.

I'd tend to disagree. Remember that the target audience for this drivel is primarily made up of authoritarian followers, who put full faith in whatever is said by their chosen and trusted authority figures. They won't research it because it a) confirms their worldview and beliefs, and b) is said by an "authority", and thus they believe it even more.


I didn't say this is how the GOP convinces their followers. You're right they don't really have to do that. What I was describing was how their message disseminates through the larger culture of otherwise smart people. It's how we're always smelling their bullshiat.
2013-06-13 08:55:02 AM
1 votes:
I'm torn between PLEASE SHUT THE HELL UP FOR THE REST OF YOUR MISERABLE LIFE, and
"please proceed, keep pulling your party straight down the shiatter".

Just can't decide.
2013-06-13 08:40:12 AM
1 votes:

EvilEgg: Slam Dunkz: I think the whole "rape exception" argument is beyond stupid.  Either you are allowed to abort or not.  Just because you don't like the father shouldn't change one thing about however you view an embryo and its relevance to the abortion question.  If it does you are a hypocrite.

The entire argument is ridiculous.

I can see why we might let someone avoid turning a single trauma into a nine month trauma.


If you're pro-choice it's a moot point.  The whole "rape exception" thing is used in cases where people think abortion is wrong and they are providing an exception for rape/incest.  If you think abortion is wrong because it's a life and should be allowed to live, even in cases of rape/incest it's *still* a life.  That doesn't change.  That's where the hypocrisy comes in.
2013-06-13 08:39:59 AM
1 votes:

thatboyoverthere: Oh fark you. Women are more likely to get pregnant from a rape since the vaginal trauma makes it more likely for a fertilized egg to implant.
/Of course I'm using big words that would just make him scream liberal at me.


I'm no doctor, but how is it easier for a fertilized egg to implant itself within the uterus when the vagina has all the trauma?

/legit question, I don't understand how that would work.
2013-06-13 08:37:52 AM
1 votes:
I honestly believe these people don't actually want bans on abortion because it would take away that arguing chip that makes them look like big men to their idiot supporters.

For all the taxpayer dollars wasted on bringing these proposals forward over the years, each state could receive small coffers to establish pregnancy resource centers. The one in my former town of Clearwater was self-reliant in 4 years - using thrift store sales and local donations to keep going.

They do a far better (and far more compassionate) job at reducing abortion numbers than these ridiculous proposals and slut-shaming could hope to do.

If legislators truly cared about life, they would work in that direction. They don't. They care about getting reelected.

Very sad.
2013-06-13 08:34:55 AM
1 votes:

Skarekrough: MmmmBacon: Another GOP politician that doesn't want to be re-elected, I see.

It isn't the getting re-elected that's the issue.  Mostly it's that it, once again, confirms the status of the party when it comes to being wholly ignorant about a potential 50% of the voters.

I gotta wonder if the DNC offices are just closing early on Friday and they're going to play mini-golf and have a few rounds when things like this happen.


I get that, but you would think the GOP would be extra-sensitive to statements like this, knowing it cost them many key races in 2012, and that the DNC will use these statements as a bludgeon every chance they can in 2014 and beyond. Any politician who would make such a foolhardy mistake is either deliberately trying to tank their own chances for re-election or too stupid to tie their own shoes.
2013-06-13 08:32:27 AM
1 votes:

Slam Dunkz: I think the whole "rape exception" argument is beyond stupid.  Either you are allowed to abort or not.  Just because you don't like the father shouldn't change one thing about however you view an embryo and its relevance to the abortion question.  If it does you are a hypocrite.

The entire argument is ridiculous.


I can see why we might let someone avoid turning a single trauma into a nine month trauma.
2013-06-13 08:32:05 AM
1 votes:
encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com
2013-06-13 08:31:33 AM
1 votes:

thatboyoverthere: Oh fark you. Women are more likely to get pregnant from a rape since the vaginal trauma makes it more likely for a fertilized egg to implant.
/Of course I'm using big words that would just make him scream liberal at me.


He didnt say that women who get raped are less likely to get pregnant. He said the incident of pregnancy resulting from a rape is low. There is a big difference there. I dont have the numbers so I have no idea how accurate of a statement it was, but youre just reading what you want to read with no regard to what was actually said.
2013-06-13 08:22:03 AM
1 votes:
The incidence rate of people killing someone who's attempting to murder them is low, so there shouldn't be an exemption for that.
2013-06-13 08:17:09 AM
1 votes:
Oh fark you. Women are more likely to get pregnant from a rape since the vaginal trauma makes it more likely for a fertilized egg to implant.
/Of course I'm using big words that would just make him scream liberal at me.
 
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