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(Slashdot)   Brain-computer interface makes learning as simple as saying "Tank, I need a pilot program for a V-212 helicopter"   (science.slashdot.org) divider line 30
    More: Interesting, computer interfaces, tanks, pilot experiments, neurodegenerative diseases, prosthetic limbs  
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3010 clicks; posted to Geek » on 12 Jun 2013 at 12:17 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



30 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2013-06-12 11:33:28 AM  
That's not what the article says subby. fark you.
 
2013-06-12 11:55:29 AM  
Ahh, the old V-212. Made by the Vell Helicopter company.
 
2013-06-12 12:36:04 PM  
I know Kung-Fu
 
2013-06-12 12:36:15 PM  
That's why the Matrix movies are bullshiat. If, in real life, you were to download instructions on how to fly a helicopter from the internet and install them into your brain, you'd wind up with:

a. a trojan-infected brain
b. instructions for operating a hand-cranked corn shucker, mislabeled as "helicopter pilot instructions"
c. instructions that allow you to get the helicopter up in the air, and then pop up a window saying "want instructions on how to land? Insert your credit card now."
d. instructions written by some 13-year old kid who copied half of it out of a helicopter manual, and then added his own "improvements" to the other half: "to land, push forward on the collective if you want, but it probably won't do anything. I just jump out and that seems to work. Bend your knees when you hit the ground, though. LOL!"
e. decent instructions, but accompanied by some too-loud dubstep or metal song that blasts in your brain and you can't shut it off.
 
2013-06-12 12:36:58 PM  
Whoa.
 
2013-06-12 12:37:37 PM  
I'd be more about the blonde/brunette/redhead program.
 
2013-06-12 12:39:34 PM  

Uzzah: That's why the Matrix movies are bullshiat. If, in real life, you were to download instructions on how to fly a helicopter from the internet and install them into your brain, you'd wind up with:

a. a trojan-infected brain
b. instructions for operating a hand-cranked corn shucker, mislabeled as "helicopter pilot instructions"
c. instructions that allow you to get the helicopter up in the air, and then pop up a window saying "want instructions on how to land? Insert your credit card now."
d. instructions written by some 13-year old kid who copied half of it out of a helicopter manual, and then added his own "improvements" to the other half: "to land, push forward on the collective if you want, but it probably won't do anything. I just jump out and that seems to work. Bend your knees when you hit the ground, though. LOL!"
e. decent instructions, but accompanied by some too-loud dubstep or metal song that blasts in your brain and you can't shut it off.


pr0n.

FTFY
 
2013-06-12 12:40:43 PM  
I never understood how that would work anyway.
Even when Gibson used to write about it, I had a problem with it.

I understand that it would be possible to have extra knowledge on a chip or memory stick, but it's the instant integration as learning that I stumble over.

Picturing it as a file on a USB drive, but the usb drive is connected to you. You can access the file, but you would still have to read an understand the material it contains.
If it was instant knowledge, then as soon as the chip was removed, you would have strange knowledge gaps when you tried to remember the event.

I'm not sure the brain could process trying to remember a period of time when you could fly a helicopter without some type of mental break, if you no longer can remember how you did it on some level.

Then again, the article isn't anything like the headline.
 
2013-06-12 12:42:47 PM  
ghostlightning.files.wordpress.com
 
2013-06-12 12:44:53 PM  
You must think in Russian.
 
2013-06-12 01:00:17 PM  

FrancoFile: You must think in Russian.


Would that put me at risk for chatting up empty chairs on national tv?
 
2013-06-12 01:00:27 PM  
B-212.  B.

Boeing hasn't used the Vertol name for a long time now.
 
2013-06-12 01:12:24 PM  
I think, and my thoughts cross the barrier into the synapses of the
machine, just as the good doctor intended. But what I cannot shake,
and what hints at things to come, is that thoughts cross back. In my
dreams, the sensibility of the machine invades the periphery of my
consciousness: dark, rigid, cold, alien. Evolution is at work here,
but just what is evolving remains to be seen.


-Commissioner Pravin Lal,"Man and Machine"
 
2013-06-12 01:23:56 PM  
I could use that right now.

"Tank, I need a CCNA program right away...in fact just go ahead and upload CCIE please."
 
2013-06-12 01:33:42 PM  
i.qkme.me
 
2013-06-12 01:55:59 PM  
I'm counting on brain implant technology to first keep Alzheimers at bay, and eventually to improve education beyond schools. Learning things may just become as simple as the headline suggests.
 
2013-06-12 01:58:47 PM  
Even if the brain can be considered a simple hard drive that data can be uploaded into, there's still the question of physical skill. Practicing a skill causes physical changes to the associated dendrites (part of the neurons in the brain that carry signals) making them more efficient, thus allowing you to perform those practiced skills at a higher/better/faster level. So while you might have the knowledge of how to fly a helicopter you wouldn't be as good as someone who's actually put in the thousands of hours of flight time.

Unless, of course, you were indeed in the Matrix, where actual physicality doesn't enter into it.
 
2013-06-12 02:00:12 PM  

Virtual Pariah: I never understood how that would work anyway.
Even when Gibson used to write about it, I had a problem with it.

I understand that it would be possible to have extra knowledge on a chip or memory stick, but it's the instant integration as learning that I stumble over.

Picturing it as a file on a USB drive, but the usb drive is connected to you. You can access the file, but you would still have to read an understand the material it contains.
If it was instant knowledge, then as soon as the chip was removed, you would have strange knowledge gaps when you tried to remember the event.

I'm not sure the brain could process trying to remember a period of time when you could fly a helicopter without some type of mental break, if you no longer can remember how you did it on some level.

Then again, the article isn't anything like the headline.


Why remove it?

But if you did, I always assumed it would be something like reading a text book at breakneck speed the night before an exam, but without the fatigue of physically moving through it. For a while, that knowledge is present and fresh, but it starts fading rapidly. The shorter the time you took to learn it, the faster the decay. You'd look back at "I knew how to fly a helicopter yesterday" with the same feeling you'd look back and go, "damn, 7 years ago, I had an operation knowledge of differential equations."

One way around the understanding/parsing time would be if there was some way to model the brain and "precompile" the knowledge into the form most easily parsed by a given person. As if it were nothing but a chain of those, *click* "Oh, I totally get it now" moments.
 
2013-06-12 02:11:01 PM  

Uzzah: That's why the Matrix movies are bullshiat. If, in real life, you were to download instructions on how to fly a helicopter from the internet and install them into your brain, you'd wind up with:

a. a trojan-infected brain
b. instructions for operating a hand-cranked corn shucker, mislabeled as "helicopter pilot instructions"
c. instructions that allow you to get the helicopter up in the air, and then pop up a window saying "want instructions on how to land? Insert your credit card now."
d. instructions written by some 13-year old kid who copied half of it out of a helicopter manual, and then added his own "improvements" to the other half: "to land, push forward on the collective if you want, but it probably won't do anything. I just jump out and that seems to work. Bend your knees when you hit the ground, though. LOL!"
e. decent instructions, but accompanied by some too-loud dubstep or metal song that blasts in your brain and you can't shut it off.


Don't forget the occasional rick roll or Microsoft shutting your brain down if you don't connect to their server once a day.
 
2013-06-12 02:22:32 PM  
spyware
malware
bugs

/'nuff said...I've got enough to deal with up there already.
 
2013-06-12 02:26:49 PM  

Flint Ironstag: Ahh, the old V-212. Made by the Vell Helicopter company.


CSB:
Heading to Gathering of the Vibes festival in CT last year, we passed right by the Sikorsky plant. Read a bit about Igor Sikorsky - responsible, essentially, for everything we know about modern helicoptering.

// also, Kevin Nealon's dad worked there, and Kev himself assumed he'd end up there as well
 
2013-06-12 02:29:20 PM  

Dinobot: I know Kung-Fu


Came here to say this.
 
2013-06-12 02:30:45 PM  
Helicopter schmelicopter, where's that lady in the red dress?
 
2013-06-12 02:47:00 PM  

nocturnal001: Uzzah: That's why the Matrix movies are bullshiat. If, in real life, you were to download instructions on how to fly a helicopter from the internet and install them into your brain, you'd wind up with:

a. a trojan-infected brain
b. instructions for operating a hand-cranked corn shucker, mislabeled as "helicopter pilot instructions"
c. instructions that allow you to get the helicopter up in the air, and then pop up a window saying "want instructions on how to land? Insert your credit card now."
d. instructions written by some 13-year old kid who copied half of it out of a helicopter manual, and then added his own "improvements" to the other half: "to land, push forward on the collective if you want, but it probably won't do anything. I just jump out and that seems to work. Bend your knees when you hit the ground, though. LOL!"
e. decent instructions, but accompanied by some too-loud dubstep or metal song that blasts in your brain and you can't shut it off.

Don't forget the occasional rick roll or Microsoft shutting your brain down if you don't connect to their server once a day.


Blue Brain of Death?

How do you hard reset a brain? Push in both nipples and pull your thumb?


The removal thing was a throwback to Neuromancer when the tech was on chip that was supposed to be hot swappable.
 
2013-06-12 04:45:42 PM  

Virtual Pariah: Then again, the article isn't anything like the headline.


Its suggesting the opposite, technically.

Instead of instantly understanding the machine and being able to pilot it, the machine instantly understands you.   Its less like grabbing a joystick and using your skills, more like putting on a pair of shoes and going for a walk in the sky.

Which, if it worked reliably, would be an awesome and safe way to operate big machinery.

dl.dropboxusercontent.com
 
2013-06-12 05:31:13 PM  

FrancoFile: You must think in Russian.


While squinting.
 
2013-06-12 06:47:07 PM  
is Dr Hawking aware of this tech? sounds a lot better than his current rig.
 
2013-06-12 07:42:18 PM  

Kimpak: I could use that right now.

"Tank, I need a CCNA program right away...in fact just go ahead and upload CCIE please."


Just make up a half dozen acronyms and string them together with some verbs into a sentence.  Voila; That is your excuse and you're sticking to it.

/Ahh the CCNA, the MCSE of the 21rst century
 
2013-06-12 09:19:47 PM  

mayIFark: Dinobot: I know Kung-Fu

Came here to say this.


Deja vu.
 
2013-06-13 10:41:56 AM  

Virtual Pariah: I never understood how that would work anyway.
Even when Gibson used to write about it, I had a problem with it.

I understand that it would be possible to have extra knowledge on a chip or memory stick, but it's the instant integration as learning that I stumble over.

Picturing it as a file on a USB drive, but the usb drive is connected to you. You can access the file, but you would still have to read an understand the material it contains.
If it was instant knowledge, then as soon as the chip was removed, you would have strange knowledge gaps when you tried to remember the event.

I'm not sure the brain could process trying to remember a period of time when you could fly a helicopter without some type of mental break, if you no longer can remember how you did it on some level.

Then again, the article isn't anything like the headline.


Yeah, the trick is not the "brain has direct access to this file on a chip."  The trick is to copy the information on the chip to the "wetware" of the brain, converting it to whatever "knowledge" is in the meantime.

That, there's an ever bigger difficulty getting from "knowledge" to "muscle memory" of physical skills.  Otherwise, Neo wouldn't have "known" Kung-Fu, he would have just quickly memorized a book on the subject.

===========================================

Weisenheimer: Unless, of course, you were indeed in the Matrix, where actual physicality doesn't enter into it.


Hah!  You think an "actual physicality" even exists?  How quaint.
 
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