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(NJ.com)   Good day, sir. Let me see your license, registration, insurance card and cell phone   (nj.com) divider line 92
    More: Interesting, New Jersey, National Motorists Association, Let Me See, legal debate, open bottle, Fourth Amendment to the United States Constitution  
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11688 clicks; posted to Main » on 10 Jun 2013 at 12:33 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-06-10 12:00:28 PM  
Oh hells no!
 
2013-06-10 12:05:27 PM  
Just put a password on it and plea the 5th when asked for it. Book it. Done.
 
2013-06-10 12:07:55 PM  
Can't they get the same information from subpoenaing your phone records? But of course that would cause them to do some work and provide a valid reason why they should have access to them.
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2013-06-10 12:19:51 PM  

ongbok: Can't they get the same information from subpoenaing your phone records? But of course that would cause them to do some work and provide a valid reason why they should have access to them.


Well, investigating an accident and wanting to see if the driver was texting or talking on the phone instead of driving would usually be a good reason, but reading TFA would be some work.
 
2013-06-10 12:34:35 PM  
Can't they just ask the White House for that information?
 
2013-06-10 12:36:02 PM  
It requires officers to have "reasonable grounds" to believe the law was broken.

IOW "no grounds"
 
2013-06-10 12:36:08 PM  
Good.
 
2013-06-10 12:36:10 PM  
"Go ask the NSA because I don't recall the password my fine civil servant."
 
2013-06-10 12:37:19 PM  
so what happens when you have to hand over your cellphone that your passenger was using to make a call/text on?  how will they differentiate that between you using it?
 
2013-06-10 12:38:00 PM  
We're living in a very narrow period of history that people will look back on with horror and amusement, much like we do with infant mortality in hospitals before the widespread adoption of germ theory.

/Just wait a few year for the robot drivers, FFS
//then you can text/sleep/fark/eat your happy little heart out in the car
 
2013-06-10 12:38:28 PM  
Pull the battery and hand it over to them.  They yell "Yeahhh!!!  What now biatches!!!??!!"
 
2013-06-10 12:39:10 PM  
Like the GEICO commercial where the pig hands the cop his phone displaying his insurance info.  Yea, I'm sure the government would just love that feature. "Let me take this back to the cruiser to download everything you have, I'll be right back with it"
 
2013-06-10 12:39:36 PM  
"He's dispatched, and by the time he gets there - unless they're unconscious and the phone is in their hands, or some passenger says they were on the phone - then he's got to do what? Subpoena the service to see if the phone was actively used or not?"

...Yes.  Exactly that.

Whew, and I thought this was going to be a complicated one.
 
2013-06-10 12:39:59 PM  
Will they check to see if I changed mt playlist at the time if crash also? Maybe I watching youtube videos while driving.

Nope just gonna check the phone record. Ok then.
 
2013-06-10 12:40:14 PM  
"Think about it: The chances of the cop witnessing the accident are slim to none," said the bill's sponsor, state Sen. James Holzapfel (R-Ocean), the bill's sponsor, who has worked as a county and municipal prosecutor. "He's dispatched, and by the time he gets there - unless they're unconscious and the phone is in their hands, or some passenger says they were on the phone - then he's got to do what? Subpoena the service to see if the phone was actively used or not?"

Uh ... yeah, pretty much.

I wonder if the phone has a lock code if the cop will be allowed to taser you until you give it up.

I have an idea for a new app: when the phone detects a sudden deceleration from a velocity above 15mph, it automatically deletes texts that are less than 15 minutes old.
 
2013-06-10 12:41:33 PM  

uber humper: Like the GEICO commercial where the pig hands the cop his phone displaying his insurance info.  Yea, I'm sure the government would just love that feature. "Let me take this back to the cruiser to download everything you have, I'll be right back with it"


The pig hands the person his insurance info. Is it opposite day?
 
2013-06-10 12:41:51 PM  
FTFA "reasonable grounds"

Meaning, I'm a cop fark you that's why.
 
2013-06-10 12:42:01 PM  

vpb: ongbok: Can't they get the same information from subpoenaing your phone records? But of course that would cause them to do some work and provide a valid reason why they should have access to them.

Well, investigating an accident and wanting to see if the driver was texting or talking on the phone instead of driving would usually be a good reason, but reading TFA would be some work.


I'm sorry officer but bluetooth...  try another cause.
 
2013-06-10 12:42:41 PM  
My phone ain't gonna help them.  One glance at the mountain of McDonalds wrappers in my back seat and they'll know that eating McRibs and spilling coffee caused me to careen out of control.
 
2013-06-10 12:42:52 PM  
Why does the cop need to know, right there and then at the accident, who's fault it is?  Can't that wait a couple days?
 
2013-06-10 12:43:54 PM  

nmemkha: "Go ask the NSA because I don't recall the password my fine civil servant."


"enjoy your time in jail for your arrest under ambiguous "catch all" laws fine citizen"..."oh and please question the arrest so I can hit you with my taser and then a charge of resisting without violence"
 
2013-06-10 12:44:27 PM  

wotthefark: uber humper: Like the GEICO commercial where the pig hands the cop his phone displaying his insurance info.  Yea, I'm sure the government would just love that feature. "Let me take this back to the cruiser to download everything you have, I'll be right back with it"

The pig hands the person his insurance info. Is it opposite day?


the answer is C. Two pigs in the story.

img.youtube.com
 
2013-06-10 12:45:53 PM  
Meanwhile when the officer crashes the squad car, he reminds everyone that he is exempt from the peasants laws.

radar gun displays, cell phone, radio, computer laptop with display for 'automatic license plate recognition', coffee, emergency light switches, gotta pee real bad.

/If the officer believes the driver was texting, he can get a warrant, providing he knows the exact time before/of the crash.
//An injured driver texting just after the crash(along with a 911 call) could result in a 'texting while driving' charge.
 
2013-06-10 12:45:58 PM  
I got no cell phone.
I got no problem.
 
2013-06-10 12:46:00 PM  
I don't have a problem with this. Of course, I also don't talk or text with my phone while driving.

But what the cops should do is give the general public the same "training" they receive so that we can know how drive and talk on the phone too.
 
2013-06-10 12:47:18 PM  

vudukungfu: I got no cell phone.
I got no problem.


Which means you have no woman. Is why you no cry.
 
2013-06-10 12:50:19 PM  
i have seen too many near hits
almost every study says it does not matter if it is hands free it is a distraction (too much for some)
it would be great if they took off the cell transition part and you had to sit still
 
2013-06-10 12:50:53 PM  
Just as soon as you have a live video feed from a badge-mounted camera (with immediate dismissal from the force and charges of evidence tampering if any of the video goes "missing" absent a technical problem not sourced to malice), officer.

Let's hold our LEOs to a higher standard - maybe we'll start getting better LEOs out of the deal.
 
2013-06-10 12:52:22 PM  
So how is the cop supposed to differentiate between a conversation I'm having with my hands-free system, or a text that I just had Siri send for me?  Technology has already advanced past this law.
 
2013-06-10 12:57:50 PM  

uber humper: Like the GEICO commercial where the pig hands the cop his phone displaying his insurance info.  Yea, I'm sure the government would just love that feature. "Let me take this back to the cruiser to download everything you have, I'll be right back with it"


Got pulled over in Tinton Falls, NJ in January.  When I showed the cop my GEICO insurance card on my phone, he just handed the phone back.  He also wrote me a ticket for not having my insurance card.  Went to court and the prosecutor said I had to have a physical card on me & wouldn't dismiss the ticket.  Luckily, the judge was more reasonable.  He dismissed the ticket & chewed out the cop & prosecutor.

/Not looking to threadjack
//Just pointing out that a cop, even an asshole cop like that one, simply handed the phone back.
 
2013-06-10 12:59:03 PM  
Just turn the 1984 ratchet a little more. Good citizen. Next year we will have another turn, and another until your home is monitored and you'll be ok with this because after all, if you have not done anything wrong you have nothing to hide. By the way, we don't appreciate your drinking large soda pops and fried food.
 
2013-06-10 12:59:37 PM  

Dirtybird971: I don't have a problem with this. Of course, I also don't talk or text with my phone while driving.

But what the cops should do is give the general public the same "training" they receive so that we can know how drive and talk on the phone too.


You don't have a problem w/cops going through your phone & text records without a warrant?  How nice of you to give up your 4th Amendment rights like that.  Some of us, who actually understand the Constitution, have a problem with this.
 
2013-06-10 01:03:04 PM  

Most popular iPhone background in New Jersey:


If I am not being detained,
I would like to go now.

I do not consent to any
searches or seizures.

Any questions you have may
be directed to my lawyer at
the Fourth and Fifth Amendment
Law Firm PLC at your expense.
 
2013-06-10 01:04:15 PM  

Dirtybird971: I don't have a problem with this. Of course, I also don't talk or text with my phone while driving.


I also don't talk or text while driving, but I do have a problem with this.
 
2013-06-10 01:04:37 PM  
Get a warrant if he believes the driver was texting and won't cooperate insists upon using their civil liberties.

They have no problem doing this to get a car searched when they want that done.

/Stop making cops lazy and giving up our civil liberties.
//Shut up and drive.
 
2013-06-10 01:05:18 PM  

Altair: Just put a password on it and plea the 5th when asked for it. Book it. Done.


And then your license is suspended, your car may be impounded, and they seize your phone while they get a warrant.

The only crime to be investigated is whether I was using the phone while driving. This bill may survive if it's very narrowly tailored so that only the dates and times of calls, texts, and other uses are admissible as evidence or grounds for investigation of other crimes.  It's not the cop's business who I called or what I took a picture of.
 
2013-06-10 01:08:23 PM  

brigid_fitch: uber humper: Like the GEICO commercial where the pig hands the cop his phone displaying his insurance info.  Yea, I'm sure the government would just love that feature. "Let me take this back to the cruiser to download everything you have, I'll be right back with it"

Got pulled over in Tinton Falls, NJ in January.  When I showed the cop my GEICO insurance card on my phone, he just handed the phone back.  He also wrote me a ticket for not having my insurance card.  Went to court and the prosecutor said I had to have a physical card on me & wouldn't dismiss the ticket.  Luckily, the judge was more reasonable.  He dismissed the ticket & chewed out the cop & prosecutor.

/Not looking to threadjack
//Just pointing out that a cop, even an asshole cop like that one, simply handed the phone back.


Yeah, NJ.   They can't even pass a law that allows insurance cards to be the same size as driver licenses and registrations.  Right now they are almost twice the size of a license and can't be carried in a wallet unless you fold them.  Most people just leave them in the car.
 
2013-06-10 01:10:46 PM  

BarkingUnicorn: Altair: Just put a password on it and plea the 5th when asked for it. Book it. Done.

And then your license is suspended, your car may be impounded, and they seize your phone while they get a warrant.


Is that in the bill?  Or did you just make it up?
 
2013-06-10 01:10:56 PM  

brigid_fitch: Got pulled over in Tinton Falls, NJ in January. When I showed the cop my GEICO insurance card on my phone, he just handed the phone back. He also wrote me a ticket for not having my insurance card. Went to court and the prosecutor said I had to have a physical card on me & wouldn't dismiss the ticket. Luckily, the judge was more reasonable. He dismissed the ticket & chewed out the cop & prosecutor.

/Not looking to threadjack
//Just pointing out that a cop, even an asshole cop like that one, simply handed the phone back.


I agree most cops are not assholes. Vast majority are upright people.

I just have a problem with people getting used to the idea that it's ok to hand a cop their phone (too much personal info). It's not that any one person may have anything hide, it's that as a society we cannot allow the government to ask for such personal info, that's handing the government the keys of tyranny. GPS records, phone records, videos, etc can all be used against people. In a honest goverment we have nothing to worry about, when the goverment stop doing honest things (thus being a corrupt goverment) is when we have reason to worry -- at that point, the more tools they have, the more trouble we're in. We cannot allow it to begin with.

</thread jack>
 
2013-06-10 01:11:25 PM  
http://www.njleg.state.nj.us/2012/Bills/S3000/2783_I1.PDF  Here ya go. I guess they never heard of Siri....
 
2013-06-10 01:12:31 PM  

brigid_fitch: CSB

Got pulled over in Tinton Falls, NJ in January.  When I showed the cop my GEICO insurance card on my phone, he just handed the phone back.  He also wrote me a ticket for not having my insurance card.  Went to court and the prosecutor said I had to have a physical card on me & wouldn't dismiss the ticket.  Luckily, the judge was more reasonable.  He dismissed the ticket & chewed out the cop & prosecutor.


FTFY
Cool story, brosis
 
2013-06-10 01:14:07 PM  
FTA: "then he's got to do what? Subpoena the service to see if the phone was actively used or not? "

DUH!!!   YES
 
2013-06-10 01:14:14 PM  
They should also be allowed to look in your briefcase, in case your phone is in there.
Also, they should be allowed to demand access to your computer, in case you used skype.
Also, they should have the right to water board you, in case you're lying about not having a cell phone.
 
ows
2013-06-10 01:16:10 PM  
1-800-ax-gary

fat diabetic black woman.
 
2013-06-10 01:17:26 PM  

flucto: They should also be allowed to look in your briefcase, in case your phone is in there.
Also, they should be allowed to demand access to your computer, in case you used skype.
Also, they should have the right to water board you, in case you're lying about not having a cell phone.


I just hope they pass a law requiring KY. Dry just hurts.
 
2013-06-10 01:18:51 PM  
BarkingUnicorn,
Altair: Just put a password on it and plea the 5th when asked for it. Book it. Done.
And then your license is suspended, your car may be impounded, and they seize your phone while they get a warrant.
The only crime to be investigated is whether I was using the phone while driving. This bill may survive if it's very narrowly tailored so that only the dates and times of calls, texts, and other uses are admissible as evidence or grounds for investigation of other crimes. It's not the cop's business who I called or what I took a picture of.


Give cops an in and the law will eventually expand enough for them to get creative.

Where as police don't have a problem getting warrants to search cars when people refuse, they should not have a problem getting a warrant defining the purpose of the search.
 
2013-06-10 01:22:06 PM  

NkThrasher: "He's dispatched, and by the time he gets there - unless they're unconscious and the phone is in their hands, or some passenger says they were on the phone - then he's got to do what? Subpoena the service to see if the phone was actively used or not?"

...Yes.  Exactly that.

Whew, and I thought this was going to be a complicated one.


And we're done.  Well said, thrsher.
 
2013-06-10 01:28:23 PM  

Altair: Just put a password on it and plea the 5th when asked for it. Book it. Done.


Reasonable search and seizure at the event of a crime, but nice try.

And frankly, I'm all for it, since I'm not a member of the 90% population that's a waste of self-absorbed skin with their attention on their phones chatting about the color of the eggs they had for breakfast 100% of the time. You dun goofed an that's why you crashed into me, anything that gets to that conclusion faster is fine with me.
 
2013-06-10 01:33:41 PM  

doonerpjenkins: http://www.njleg.state.nj.us/2012/Bills/S3000/2783_I1.PDF  Here ya go. I guess they never heard of Siri....


Haven't heard of cameras, either.  Talking is less distracting than looking through a viewfinder.  Call history doesn't cover all the bases.
 
2013-06-10 01:39:02 PM  

NkThrasher: "He's dispatched, and by the time he gets there - unless they're unconscious and the phone is in their hands, or some passenger says they were on the phone - then he's got to do what? Subpoena the service to see if the phone was actively used or not?"

...Yes.  Exactly that.

Whew, and I thought this was going to be a complicated one.


I said the same thing to myself as I read the article. Just another reason to stay out of NJ, although I fear these kinds of laws will spread.
 
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