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(CNN)   Has "Hope and Change" fallen to the to the level of truth as "trickle down economics"?   (cnn.com) divider line 164
    More: Interesting, obama, domestic spying, clandestine operations, Jameel Jaffer, Obama Presidency  
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1257 clicks; posted to Politics » on 08 Jun 2013 at 9:43 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-06-08 07:53:52 AM  
It's way, way, way, way harder to convince and prod and push the US government towards self-serving decision that are easy than massive changes which are disruptive.

Hell, on top of that, the people don't want to deal with it. They just want things to be improved through no action or effort of their own.

We're a lazy, ignorant people who have created exactly the government we deserve.
 
2013-06-08 08:21:08 AM  
a shiatload of stuff has changed (obamacare, winding down two wars, financial reform, no second great depression, etc.) and i'm still way more hopeful than i would have been had a president mccain or president romney been in the WH.
 
2013-06-08 08:34:22 AM  
Butthurt much? Republicans were all for giving up civil liberties in the name of security when Bush was in charge. We told you we'd never get that Geni back in the bottle.

Also, trickle-down economics as always a cynical lie designed to enrich the rich. The Patriot Act was a misguided panic reaction to 9/11. Very different things, but both were Republican brain-children.
 
2013-06-08 08:40:36 AM  

FlashHarry: a shiatload of stuff has changed (obamacare, winding down two wars, financial reform, no second great depression, etc.) and i'm still way more hopeful than i would have been had a president mccain or president romney been in the WH.


This.
 
2013-06-08 09:11:39 AM  

cameroncrazy1984: FlashHarry: a shiatload of stuff has changed (obamacare, winding down two wars, financial reform, no second great depression, etc.) and i'm still way more hopeful than i would have been had a president mccain or president romney been in the WH.

This.


I second that.
 And typical moronic conservitard post- lets compare two completely different things and say they are the same!
 
2013-06-08 09:14:52 AM  
So CNN is concern trolling now?
 
2013-06-08 09:16:40 AM  

MrBallou: Butthurt much? Republicans were all for giving up civil liberties in the name of security when Bush was in charge. We told you we'd never get that Geni back in the bottle.

Also, trickle-down economics as always a cynical lie designed to enrich the rich. The Patriot Act was a misguided panic reaction to 9/11. Very different things, but both were Republican brain-children.


THAT
 
2013-06-08 09:53:32 AM  
"Has fallen to the level as"?
"to the to the"?

...why do conservative trolls always get such a raging hard-on about their point that they can't even think enough to type a simple sentence correctly?
 
2013-06-08 09:53:53 AM  
The simple truth is, all politicians are self-serving assclowns. Another simple truth is that this particular assclown is a far better choice than what was offered as an alternative in the two previous elections. I think Hope and Change are alive and well.

Republicans: If you really want to have one of yours elected as president, try putting forth someone who isn't certifiably insane or a corporate goon. And good luck with that.
 
2013-06-08 09:57:08 AM  

sammyk: So CNN is concern trolling now?


Pretty much.  The Republican fishing expedition isn't going so well and everybody is getting pissed about how the Republicans are holding up everything and then blaming Obama for it.  It's amazing that in the span of thirteen years that the Republicans went from having a very good hold on the media to now being unable to turn opinion on anything at all.  Of course, it's also interesting how they preach one thing like 'liberal media' and then act shocked when people stop trusting that same media and find it's just loaded with more Republican nonsense.

The Republicans have several problems, but one that's coming to the forefront is how unable they are to contain their own tactics or are able to find a way to stand for something.  By placing Obama on the pedestal, they've made it all about him, and have given him the power.  Obama, more or less, has a lot of control over the Republican Party that they cannot really handle well, and it's remarkable as a social experiment to see the end result of this bigotry controlling and ruining what once was a major political party.  The Republicans are the premier example of what happens with bigotry as a whole.
 
2013-06-08 10:02:20 AM  

FlashHarry: a shiatload of stuff has changed (obamacare, winding down two wars, financial reform, no second great depression, etc.) and i'm still way more hopeful than i would have been had a president mccain or president romney been in the WH.


I agree.  And just because people may be outraged over certain policies and are organizing around them doesn't mean they are joining the "worst president evah!" derptards.  I keep getting the impression the media wants us to consider Obama to be either a saint or an evil monster and nothing in between.
 
2013-06-08 10:03:36 AM  
Subby,

1) try to learn to write a single coherent sentence,
2) stop whining that your side doesn't win every single election,
3) yes Obama has continued what Dubya began, both are to blame, but nobody buys that Obama started it
 
2013-06-08 10:07:03 AM  
Yeah imagine that. The President isn't all powerful and can't get his agenda pushed through a racist, obstructionist, ignorant and often downright hostile Congress.
 
2013-06-08 10:07:57 AM  
Yeah well that's what happens when "hope and change" hit the brick wall of minority opposition at all costs and damn the consequences.
 
2013-06-08 10:09:11 AM  
He killed the occupy movement at least.
 
2013-06-08 10:09:40 AM  

Xythero: FlashHarry: a shiatload of stuff has changed (obamacare, winding down two wars, financial reform, no second great depression, etc.) and i'm still way more hopeful than i would have been had a president mccain or president romney been in the WH.

I agree.  And just because people may be outraged over certain policies and are organizing around them doesn't mean they are joining the "worst president evah!" derptards.  I keep getting the impression the media wants us to consider Obama to be either a saint or an evil monster and nothing in between.


There's a certain subset (in the media, in whatever) where things are the polar extremes, and there are no middle ground. The same way that if you aren't on one team, then you MUST be on the other, etc.

Once again, the GOP sure changes its tune about power and authority when they aren't in control of it. Remember when the spying thing was A-OK? But then, if you notice, most of Congress appears to be silent on this matter (Republicans AND Dems).
 
2013-06-08 10:10:05 AM  

burning_bridge: Yeah well that's what happens when "hope and change" hit the brick wall of minority opposition at all costs and damn the consequences.


no, this article has actually zero to do with obstructionism. Look for another prop in the Big Old Lefty Bag of Deflective Tricks
 
2013-06-08 10:10:14 AM  
Right, subby.  Because we don't all ride unicorns to work on roads made of rainbows, Obama is exactly like Bush and nothing has changed, la la la la la la la la cant hear you.

Good luck with that.
 
2013-06-08 10:10:26 AM  

mikaloyd: He killed the occupy movement at least.


Obama didn't do that. Occupy did that on it's own when they failed to capitalize on their message.

Elizabeth Warren has done more to spread their message than those guys have.
 
2013-06-08 10:11:06 AM  
This all seems very familiar and Deja vu ish
 
2013-06-08 10:11:14 AM  
farm7.static.flickr.com
 
2013-06-08 10:12:59 AM  

skullkrusher: burning_bridge: Yeah well that's what happens when "hope and change" hit the brick wall of minority opposition at all costs and damn the consequences.

no, this article has actually zero to do with obstructionism. Look for another prop in the Big Old Lefty Bag of Deflective Tricks


Record usage of filibuster is me deflecting?  Yeah, sure pal.  Tell me, are the clouds made of cotton candy in the world you live in?
 
2013-06-08 10:13:26 AM  

skullkrusher: burning_bridge: Yeah well that's what happens when "hope and change" hit the brick wall of minority opposition at all costs and damn the consequences.

no, this article has actually zero to do with obstructionism. Look for another prop in the Big Old Fark Lefty Bag of Deflective Tricks


want to be fair to actual lefties
 
2013-06-08 10:14:25 AM  

burning_bridge: skullkrusher: burning_bridge: Yeah well that's what happens when "hope and change" hit the brick wall of minority opposition at all costs and damn the consequences.

no, this article has actually zero to do with obstructionism. Look for another prop in the Big Old Lefty Bag of Deflective Tricks

Record usage of filibuster is me deflecting?  Yeah, sure pal.  Tell me, are the clouds made of cotton candy in the world you live in?


Did you read TFA or is this just a reflexive reaction from deep within the reptilian core of your brain?
 
2013-06-08 10:17:20 AM  
"Hope and Change" didn't give the wealthy massive tax breaks, so no, no it's not.
 
2013-06-08 10:18:39 AM  
David Brooks said that running metadata through an algorithm to look for flags is not troubling.  But of course righties need to make hay, so here we are.

Echelon NO CARRIER
 
2013-06-08 10:19:17 AM  

Marcus Aurelius: "Hope and Change" didn't give the wealthy massive tax breaks, so no, no it's not.


hmm... so we're up to saying people earning $400k aren't wealthy now. I guess that's progress.
 
2013-06-08 10:20:59 AM  

skullkrusher: Marcus Aurelius: "Hope and Change" didn't give the wealthy massive tax breaks, so no, no it's not.

hmm... so we're up to saying people earning $400k aren't wealthy now. I guess that's progress.


As Chris Rock says, Shaq is rich. The man who signs his checks is wealthy.
 
2013-06-08 10:22:23 AM  

Mrtraveler01: mikaloyd: He killed the occupy movement at least.

Obama didn't do that. Occupy did that on it's own when they failed to capitalize on their message.

Elizabeth Warren has done more to spread their message than those guys have.


What OWS did was wake up the Democratic Party and make them realize that a good chunk of the American people were tired of being screwed over by the 1% of the country that owns the GOP.

Don't think for a second that his 2012 election strat of 'tax the rich' would have happened if it wasn't for the OWS movement.

OWS made the Democrats realize that there's support for regulation of Wall Street and forcing the rich to do more for their country.

Now, on topic:

No. The GOP 'wants' to discredit 'hope and change'.  They've been trying to do that for 5 years now.  They want the American people to get cynical and distrustful of the Obama WH.  And it bothers them that we're not holding Obama with as much distaste as we did GWB, but they can't and won't understand the differences between the two.
 
2013-06-08 10:23:06 AM  
Alternate Earth: Is Obama weak on intelligence? Why is Obama doing nothing to prevent another attack? Are we less safe under Obama?
 
2013-06-08 10:23:39 AM  

Lackofname: There's a certain subset (in the media, in whatever) where things are the polar extremes, and there are no middle ground. The same way that if you aren't on one team, then you MUST be on the other, etc.


I just feel like we are being told to either throw his whole presidency out the window because it wasn't worth it, or to give him pass on this because a Republican president would have been worse. If you're angry and organize around this then you've joined the hate Obama team so lets appeal Obamacare and cut taxes while we're at it!
 
2013-06-08 10:23:56 AM  

skullkrusher: burning_bridge: skullkrusher: burning_bridge: Yeah well that's what happens when "hope and change" hit the brick wall of minority opposition at all costs and damn the consequences.

no, this article has actually zero to do with obstructionism. Look for another prop in the Big Old Lefty Bag of Deflective Tricks

Record usage of filibuster is me deflecting?  Yeah, sure pal.  Tell me, are the clouds made of cotton candy in the world you live in?

Did you read TFA or is this just a reflexive reaction from deep within the reptilian core of your brain?


"The article isn't about the filibuster therefore it doesn't count therefore the dems can't claim that there is any obstructionism."  That about sum up what you were thinking?  Can't win the argument so you'll define its parameters?  Keep trying.  Maybe if you think more you'll actually have an intelligent thought.
 
2013-06-08 10:27:21 AM  

Kumana Wanalaia: David Brooks said that running metadata through an algorithm to look for flags is not troubling.  But of course righties need to make hay, so here we are.

Echelon NO CARRIER


https://www.aclu.org/secure/sem-emergency-action-stop-massive-govern me nt-spying-americans?ms=gad_SEM_Google_Search-VerizonNSA_na_nsa%20veriz on_b_26162556622

http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/closeread/2013/06/the-nsa-veri zo n-scandal.html

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2013/06/nsa-verizon-call-records/

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/06/06/1214128/-Government-collect in g-Americans-phone-records-under-secret-court-order

upload.wikimedia.org

upload.wikimedia.org
/ACLU, The New Yorker, Wired.com, DailyKos.com, Senator Ron Wyden (D-OR) and Senator Mark Udall (D-CO)
//just some righties making hay
 
2013-06-08 10:28:50 AM  
I would've (and still would) liked to have seen Democrats AND Republicans in charge grow a pair regarding this nonsense, but it's only being blown out of proportion right now because .. well, look at all the other "scandals."

Throw it on the wall. See if it sticks.
 
2013-06-08 10:29:25 AM  

burning_bridge: "The article isn't about the filibuster therefore it doesn't count therefore the dems can't claim that there is any obstructionism." That about sum up what you were thinking? Can't win the argument so you'll define its parameters? Keep trying. Maybe if you think more you'll actually have an intelligent thought.


so your defense on this topic is something that has nothing whatsoever to do with it... (hint: that's what deflection is, Aristotle) and I'm the one looking for an intelligent thought?
 
2013-06-08 10:31:37 AM  

Kumana Wanalaia: Alternate Earth: Is Obama weak on intelligence? Why is Obama doing nothing to prevent another attack? Are we less safe under Obama?


jesus. no shiat.

for many, many years, america was safe, protected by two oceans, while the rest of the world dealt with terrorism. if you lived in europe, you knew that a bomb could go off any time, whether from baader meinhof or the red brigades or the IRA or whatever. cops carried machine guns and cars were searched. you dealt with it. now, after 9/11, we're finally dealing with the inconveniences that are necessary for protection. as long as they're not actually listening to conversations or using this stuff to go after non-terroristic crimes, then i think it's probably worth the tradeoff. i'm not saying i like it; i'm just saying that i prefer it to being blown up.
 
2013-06-08 10:32:57 AM  

sammyk: So CNN is concern trolling now?


[JAMES EARL JONES VOICE]

This.... is CNN trying to be like Fox News!

[/JAMES EARL JONES VOICE]
 
2013-06-08 10:33:27 AM  

FlashHarry: Kumana Wanalaia: Alternate Earth: Is Obama weak on intelligence? Why is Obama doing nothing to prevent another attack? Are we less safe under Obama?

jesus. no shiat.

for many, many years, america was safe, protected by two oceans, while the rest of the world dealt with terrorism. if you lived in europe, you knew that a bomb could go off any time, whether from baader meinhof or the red brigades or the IRA or whatever. cops carried machine guns and cars were searched. you dealt with it. now, after 9/11, we're finally dealing with the inconveniences that are necessary for protection. as long as they're not actually listening to conversations or using this stuff to go after non-terroristic crimes, then i think it's probably worth the tradeoff. i'm not saying i like it; i'm just saying that i prefer it to being blown up.


Are those really our only two options?  Give up privacy or get blown up?
 
2013-06-08 10:34:20 AM  

Infernalist: Mrtraveler01: mikaloyd: He killed the occupy movement at least.

Obama didn't do that. Occupy did that on it's own when they failed to capitalize on their message.

Elizabeth Warren has done more to spread their message than those guys have.

What OWS did was wake up the Democratic Party and make them realize that a good chunk of the American people were tired of being screwed over by the 1% of the country that owns the GOP.

Don't think for a second that his 2012 election strat of 'tax the rich' would have happened if it wasn't for the OWS movement.

OWS made the Democrats realize that there's support for regulation of Wall Street and forcing the rich to do more for their country.

Now, on topic:

No. The GOP 'wants' to discredit 'hope and change'.  They've been trying to do that for 5 years now.  They want the American people to get cynical and distrustful of the Obama WH.  And it bothers them that we're not holding Obama with as much distaste as we did GWB, but they can't and won't understand the differences between the two.


Occupy raped and looted for a few months. They also tried to blow up a bridge in Ohio. Obama unleashed the Feds and police brutality to squash the movement. Obama killed occupy Wall Street.
 
2013-06-08 10:36:59 AM  
Dems in 2012: Vote for Obama!  He'll become really liberal in his second term!
Reps in 2012: Don't vote for Obama!  He'll become really liberal in his second term!
Reality: Obama becomes even more conservative in his second term.
 
2013-06-08 10:37:51 AM  

Infernalist: No. The GOP 'wants' to discredit 'hope and change'. They've been trying to do that for 5 years now. They want the American people to get cynical and distrustful of the Obama WH. And it bothers them that we're not holding Obama with as much distaste as we did GWB, but they can't and won't understand the differences between the two.


They can't and won't because they're in a pickle:  They can't go back to Nixon, Reagan's been overplayed, H.W. Bush got defeated by Clinton, and Dubya is such a gigantic failure that he pretty much no longer exists.  The Republicans really have no good past to look back towards, so they're going after Obama to fit their naive and pathetic 'both sides are the same' nonsense that anybody can see won't work when you're dealing with Dubya's pathetic legacy.
 
2013-06-08 10:38:38 AM  

LouDobbsAwaaaay: Dems in 2012: Vote for Obama!  He'll become really liberal in his second term!
Reps in 2012: Don't vote for Obama!  He'll become really liberal in his second term!
Reality: Obama becomes even more conservative in his second term.


I didn't think he'd become more liberal because we'd still have the GOP House stonewalling every effort to do so.

If you haven't realized that Obama is governing from the Center yet, then you might be a moron.
 
2013-06-08 10:41:07 AM  

LouDobbsAwaaaay: Dems in 2012: Vote for Obama!  He'll become really liberal in his second term!
Reps in 2012: Don't vote for Obama!  He'll become really liberal in his second term!
Reality: Obama becomes even more conservative in his second term.


LouDobbsAwaaaay will still breathlessly defend him at every t urn

Mrtraveler01: LouDobbsAwaaaay: Dems in 2012: Vote for Obama!  He'll become really liberal in his second term!
Reps in 2012: Don't vote for Obama!  He'll become really liberal in his second term!
Reality: Obama becomes even more conservative in his second term.

I didn't think he'd become more liberal because we'd still have the GOP House stonewalling every effort to do so.

If you haven't realized that Obama is governing from the Center yet, then you might be a moron.


there is no "might" when talking about LouDobbsAway in such a sense.
 
2013-06-08 10:41:26 AM  

Mrtraveler01: LouDobbsAwaaaay: Dems in 2012: Vote for Obama!  He'll become really liberal in his second term!
Reps in 2012: Don't vote for Obama!  He'll become really liberal in his second term!
Reality: Obama becomes even more conservative in his second term.

I didn't think he'd become more liberal because we'd still have the GOP House stonewalling every effort to do so.

If you haven't realized that Obama is governing from the Center yet, then you might be a moron.


I knew he was governing from the center from the start.  Hell, I think he even did a couple of speeches referring to the fact that Americans, most Americans, vote from the center.

That said, the American people 'are' moving further to the left.  The shocking shift on gay marriage is only the most obvious of these moves.  There's also the support for stronger regulation of Wall Street, the huge support for higher taxes and the support for the ACA when you strip away the rhetoric and names that they've been conditioned to hate on.
 
2013-06-08 10:43:15 AM  

Kumana Wanalaia: Alternate Earth: Is Obama weak on intelligence? Why is Obama doing nothing to prevent another attack? Are we less safe under Obama?


And we're done.
 
2013-06-08 10:43:55 AM  

MrBallou: Butthurt much? Republicans were all for giving up civil liberties in the name of security when Bush was in charge. We told you we'd never get that Geni back in the bottle.

Also, trickle-down economics as always a cynical lie designed to enrich the rich. The Patriot Act was a misguided panic reaction to 9/11. Very different things, but both were Republican brain-children.


We?  Do liberals intentionally forget what the vote call was passing the Patriot Act?  Even in 2011 when Obama re-authorized it?

Liberals have a fun time rewriting history.
 
2013-06-08 10:44:14 AM  

ghare: Kumana Wanalaia: Alternate Earth: Is Obama weak on intelligence? Why is Obama doing nothing to prevent another attack? Are we less safe under Obama?

And we're done.


if your goal is partisansh... oh,  wait, of course that's your goal.
 
2013-06-08 10:45:07 AM  

MyRandomName: MrBallou: Butthurt much? Republicans were all for giving up civil liberties in the name of security when Bush was in charge. We told you we'd never get that Geni back in the bottle.

Also, trickle-down economics as always a cynical lie designed to enrich the rich. The Patriot Act was a misguided panic reaction to 9/11. Very different things, but both were Republican brain-children.

We?  Do liberals intentionally forget what the vote call was passing the Patriot Act?  Even in 2011 when Obama re-authorized it?

Liberals have a fun time rewriting history.


I love the fact that you're saying 'Democrats are just as bad as the GOP!' and you think it's a solid retort.
 
2013-06-08 10:45:15 AM  

MyRandomName: MrBallou: Butthurt much? Republicans were all for giving up civil liberties in the name of security when Bush was in charge. We told you we'd never get that Geni back in the bottle.

Also, trickle-down economics as always a cynical lie designed to enrich the rich. The Patriot Act was a misguided panic reaction to 9/11. Very different things, but both were Republican brain-children.

We?  Do liberals intentionally forget what the vote call was passing the Patriot Act?  Even in 2011 when Obama re-authorized it?

Liberals have a fun time rewriting history.


It's true. Both sides were bad.

Now what?
 
2013-06-08 10:45:57 AM  

Bendal: Yeah imagine that. The President isn't all powerful and can't get his agenda pushed through a racist, obstructionist, ignorant and often downright hostile Congress.


OMG, a president has to work with a Congress that may not simply rubber stamp his proposals!  This has never happened before!  Reagan never worked with Tip O'Niel.  Clinton never worked with Gingrich.  Bush II never worked with Ted Kennedy!  This has never happened before!!!

Liberals really are an uninformed bunch.
 
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