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(NJ.com)   NJ cop from troubled police force busted for being drunk at a barbecue. In uniform. On duty   (nj.com) divider line 47
    More: Dumbass, Officer Varady, Attorney General's Office, police misconduct, age discrimination, law enforcement officials, National Occupational Standards  
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3037 clicks; posted to Main » on 05 Jun 2013 at 10:00 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



47 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2013-06-05 10:02:07 AM  
You gotta love that this guy was drinking on the job, in uniform, and he is suspended WITH PAY!

Who the hell is making that decision?!
 
2013-06-05 10:02:51 AM  

durbnpoisn: You gotta love that this guy was drinking on the job, in uniform, and he is suspended WITH PAY!

Who the hell is making that decision?!


His union.
 
2013-06-05 10:03:28 AM  
In his defense, he was drunk at the time he decided to do that.
 
2013-06-05 10:07:08 AM  
Oh, and New Jerseyans, he was not drinking at a barbecue. That was a cookout, where burgers and hot dogs were cooked on a grill. Barbecue is meat.
 
2013-06-05 10:09:34 AM  
Thank you for not turning the headline into a 'Not News/News/Fark' headline!!!
 
2013-06-05 10:12:08 AM  
Edison used to be associated with smarts, engineering, and progress.
 
2013-06-05 10:15:45 AM  
It would have been better if he'd crashed his cruiser. Maybe even got hurt. Lord knows he won't feel the "pain" the rest of us would feel with a DUI.

This is just another reason why cops, like Priests, are just people whose jobs have them wear costumes and aren't due any more respect than the person who cleans bathrooms or cuts down trees.
 
2013-06-05 10:21:28 AM  

Dirtybird971: It would have been better if he'd crashed his cruiser. Maybe even got hurt. Lord knows he won't feel the "pain" the rest of us would feel with a DUI.

This is just another reason why cops, like Priests, are just people whose jobs have them wear costumes and aren't due any more respect than the person who cleans bathrooms or cuts down trees.


not sure if serious?

I am sure that my landscaper would gladly rush to the scene of an on going violent crime and put himself in harms way to nullify the situation. Totally.
 
2013-06-05 10:21:52 AM  
Wow -   $131,500 a year, for a patrol officer

i0.kym-cdn.com
 
2013-06-05 10:22:54 AM  
Holy crap, these NJ cops get paid!

That other douche was making like 118k. This dude even more?!
 
2013-06-05 10:25:31 AM  
He was obviously using his flex time. No big deal, he'll be back on the job in no time.
 
2013-06-05 10:27:02 AM  
In his defense, the ribs were so good they probably were illegal.
 
2013-06-05 10:27:32 AM  

LaurenAguilera: Dirtybird971: It would have been better if he'd crashed his cruiser. Maybe even got hurt. Lord knows he won't feel the "pain" the rest of us would feel with a DUI.

This is just another reason why cops, like Priests, are just people whose jobs have them wear costumes and aren't due any more respect than the person who cleans bathrooms or cuts down trees.

not sure if serious?

I am sure that my landscaper would gladly rush to the scene of an on going violent crime and put himself in harms way to nullify the situation. Totally.


Leave firemen out of this.
 
2013-06-05 10:28:12 AM  

mbillips: Oh, and New Jerseyans, he was not drinking at a barbecue. That was a cookout, where burgers and hot dogs were cooked on a grill. Barbecue is meat.




This. Went to a fancy and expensive BBQ event in Delaware once. WTF hot dogs and hamburgers.
 
2013-06-05 10:30:46 AM  

BitwiseShift: mbillips: Oh, and New Jerseyans, he was not drinking at a barbecue. That was a cookout, where burgers and hot dogs were cooked on a grill. Barbecue is meat.

This. Went to a fancy and expensive BBQ event in Delaware once. WTF hot dogs and hamburgers.


My last barbecue had hotdogs and hamburgers.  And smoked chickens, chicken wings, pork ribs, pork loin, and turkey breast.  But that's because I'm awesome.
 
2013-06-05 10:35:55 AM  
The fact that anyone would jeopardize a 6 figure job so they could toss a few beers back at a cookout while they were supposed to be working tells you all you need to know about this 27 year HERO of law enforcement.

think about the sense of entitlement needed to do that while in uniform with your patrol car.
 
2013-06-05 10:41:54 AM  
Charges just got upgraded to a DUI.

Love my hometown.
 
2013-06-05 10:50:53 AM  
I have a brilliant idea. When we bust cops doing obviously against rules events such as this, discipline involves two options: you either quit, or we slice a digit off of your pension.
 
2013-06-05 10:58:25 AM  
$131k a year?  For what cops in a suburb do?  Seriously?
Funny though, I don't hear many complaints about this from the Teabaggers.  But let a 55 year old teacher with a masters make $80k and she's a leech.
 
2013-06-05 10:59:48 AM  

Job Creator: $131k a year?  For what cops in a suburb do?  Seriously?
Funny though, I don't hear many complaints about this from the Teabaggers.  But let a 55 year old teacher with a masters make $80k and she's a leech.


That's funny because most people I know who you would describe with such a stupid term, would actually be pointing this out, as well as the fact of his fat pension that will be paid too.
 
2013-06-05 11:02:07 AM  
Fark cops.
 
2013-06-05 11:02:16 AM  

MrJesus: Charges just got upgraded to a DUI.

Love my hometown.


I think he just got a loophole to beat the charge...
 
2013-06-05 11:04:42 AM  
LaurenAguilera


Smartest
Funniest

2013-06-05 10:21:28 AM


Dirtybird971: It would have been better if he'd crashed his cruiser. Maybe even got hurt. Lord knows he won't feel the "pain" the rest of us would feel with a DUI.

This is just another reason why cops, like Priests, are just people whose jobs have them wear costumes and aren't due any more respect than the person who cleans bathrooms or cuts down trees.

not sure if serious?

I am sure that my landscaper would gladly rush to the scene of an on going violent crime and put himself in harms way to nullify the situation. Totally.


yeah sorry, I really want to go fishing today.

BUT MAYBE...if you get a job as a cop someone should let you know beforehand that it's a dangerous job that requires you to be "better" than the average person. Especially while in uniform. And carrying a gun.
 
2013-06-05 11:05:10 AM  
This cop was just trying to downplay the stereotype of being a donut eater.
 
2013-06-05 11:44:27 AM  

stevegarbowski: durbnpoisn: You gotta love that this guy was drinking on the job, in uniform, and he is suspended WITH PAY!

Who the hell is making that decision?!

His union.


No, the union does not make decisions concerning disciplinary action taken by administration. What the union DOES do is represent its members to be sure they are being treated in accordance with the contract, personnel regulations and past practice.

Paid suspension is the most effective and efficient way for the administration to send a contract employee home immediately. The employee is in no position to claim he was harmed financially without due process, and it eliminates an avenue for the union to grieve he suspension.
 
2013-06-05 12:18:47 PM  

lizyrd: stevegarbowski: durbnpoisn: You gotta love that this guy was drinking on the job, in uniform, and he is suspended WITH PAY!

Who the hell is making that decision?!

His union.

No, the union does not make decisions concerning disciplinary action taken by administration. What the union DOES do is represent its members to be sure they are being treated in accordance with the contract, personnel regulations and past practice.

Paid suspension is the most effective and efficient way for the administration to send a contract employee home immediately. The employee is in no position to claim he was harmed financially without due process, and it eliminates an avenue for the union to grieve he suspension.


So you're saying it was his union.

/pro-union
//just calling it how it is
 
2013-06-05 12:24:32 PM  

jayphat: I have a brilliant idea. When we bust cops doing obviously against rules events such as this, discipline involves two options: you either quit, or we slice a digit off of your pensionhand.


I'd be on board with this.
 
2013-06-05 01:10:15 PM  
Sooo nothing out of the ordinary then.
 
2013-06-05 01:16:08 PM  

Altair: lizyrd: stevegarbowski: durbnpoisn: You gotta love that this guy was drinking on the job, in uniform, and he is suspended WITH PAY!

Who the hell is making that decision?!

His union.

No, the union does not make decisions concerning disciplinary action taken by administration. What the union DOES do is represent its members to be sure they are being treated in accordance with the contract, personnel regulations and past practice.

Paid suspension is the most effective and efficient way for the administration to send a contract employee home immediately. The employee is in no position to claim he was harmed financially without due process, and it eliminates an avenue for the union to grieve he suspension.

So you're saying it was his union.

/pro-union
//just calling it how it is


No. The city administration made the decision to suspend him with pay, probably in accordance with the city's personnel regulations. The decision may have been made out of a desire to avoid engaging the union in the grievance process at this time, but the decision was still made by management.

Suspension with pay is just for right now. The next step could be termination. Or to negotiate a return to work with forfeiture of some pay. Or whatever. Suspension with pay is just a first step in order to get the guy off-duty immediately with a minimum of difficulty.
 
2013-06-05 01:40:13 PM  

kindms: The fact that anyone would jeopardize a 6 figure job so they could toss a few beers back at a cookout while they were supposed to be working tells you all you need to know about this 27 year HERO of law enforcement.

think about the sense of entitlement needed to do that while in uniform with your patrol car.


=================

He's got 27 years in, he can't lose his pension over this. If he files for retirement today, his pension will be $88K per year plus medical, dental and vision.....no deductible, $10 copay for office visit and $5 prescription copay.   Survivors benefits are 70%, if he dies before his wife, she'll collect  $61K plus medical.

/NJ Highest Property Taxes in the USA
 
2013-06-05 02:10:31 PM  

Fissile: kindms: The fact that anyone would jeopardize a 6 figure job so they could toss a few beers back at a cookout while they were supposed to be working tells you all you need to know about this 27 year HERO of law enforcement.

think about the sense of entitlement needed to do that while in uniform with your patrol car.

=================

He's got 27 years in, he can't lose his pension over this. If he files for retirement today, his pension will be $88K per year plus medical, dental and vision.....no deductible, $10 copay for office visit and $5 prescription copay.   Survivors benefits are 70%, if he dies before his wife, she'll collect  $61K plus medical.

/NJ Highest Property Taxes in the USA


And this is why I stand by my idea.
 
2013-06-05 02:51:42 PM  

lizyrd: Altair: lizyrd: stevegarbowski: durbnpoisn: You gotta love that this guy was drinking on the job, in uniform, and he is suspended WITH PAY!

Who the hell is making that decision?!

His union.

No, the union does not make decisions concerning disciplinary action taken by administration. What the union DOES do is represent its members to be sure they are being treated in accordance with the contract, personnel regulations and past practice.

Paid suspension is the most effective and efficient way for the administration to send a contract employee home immediately. The employee is in no position to claim he was harmed financially without due process, and it eliminates an avenue for the union to grieve he suspension.

So you're saying it was his union.

/pro-union
//just calling it how it is

No. The city administration made the decision to suspend him with pay, probably in accordance with the city's personnel regulations. The decision may have been made out of a desire to avoid engaging the union in the grievance process at this time, but the decision was still made by management.

Suspension with pay is just for right now. The next step could be termination. Or to negotiate a return to work with forfeiture of some pay. Or whatever. Suspension with pay is just a first step in order to get the guy off-duty immediately with a minimum of difficulty.


So you're saying it was his union.

The most efficient and effective way to send someone home immediately is for a superior with prima facie evidence of gross misconduct in hand  to tell the employee to "go home, you're fired".  Of course, "efficient and effective" are relative terms.
 
2013-06-05 03:32:51 PM  
img.fark.net

/who doesn't like beer and  BBQ?
 
2013-06-05 05:11:31 PM  

Fissile: kindms: The fact that anyone would jeopardize a 6 figure job so they could toss a few beers back at a cookout while they were supposed to be working tells you all you need to know about this 27 year HERO of law enforcement.

think about the sense of entitlement needed to do that while in uniform with your patrol car.

=================

He's got 27 years in, he can't lose his pension over this. If he files for retirement today, his pension will be $88K per year plus medical, dental and vision.....no deductible, $10 copay for office visit and $5 prescription copay.   Survivors benefits are 70%, if he dies before his wife, she'll collect  $61K plus medical.

/NJ Highest Property Taxes in the USA


You're full of it, and so's the article. The guy may have EARNED $131k after overtime, but according to the Edison police contract, top step pay is $107k. Also, the contract states that the officers are in the NJPERS retirement plan. We'll get to that in a second.
Contract - http://www.perc.state.nj.us/publicsect orcontracts.nsf/Contracts%20By%2 0Employer/987FE5458569FF0D852579040058 2439/$File/Edison%20Tp%20and%20P BA%20Loc%2075%202009.pdf?OpenElement

The NJPERS pays 2% per year of service of the average of the top three years' base salary. Using the contract, I calculate his average base salary to be $104,459. With his 27 years, he gets 54%, or around $56,400.

NJPERS LEO Handbook - http://www.state.nj.us/treasury/pensio ns/pdf/handbook/sp0333-leo.pdf

Also of note, the NJPERS manual states that health benefits are by contract, and the Edison police contract states that retirees have the option to COBRA their benefits after retirement and have the opportunity to contribute to an HSA during their career.

So all-in-all, after bothering to do a little research (which I cited) I have come to the conclude that you're just making stuff up. $88,000 and full health coverage my ass.
 
2013-06-05 06:24:43 PM  

Dirtybird971: LaurenAguilera


Smartest
Funniest

2013-06-05 10:21:28 AM


Dirtybird971: It would have been better if he'd crashed his cruiser. Maybe even got hurt. Lord knows he won't feel the "pain" the rest of us would feel with a DUI.

This is just another reason why cops, like Priests, are just people whose jobs have them wear costumes and aren't due any more respect than the person who cleans bathrooms or cuts down trees.

not sure if serious?

I am sure that my landscaper would gladly rush to the scene of an on going violent crime and put himself in harms way to nullify the situation. Totally.

yeah sorry, I really want to go fishing today.

BUT MAYBE...if you get a job as a cop someone should let you know beforehand that it's a dangerous job that requires you to be "better" than the average person. Especially while in uniform. And carrying a gun.


... I was referring to your comment about how they are just persons whose jobs require them to wear costumes, and aren't due any more respect than anyone else.

As a soldier, that's kind of harsh, bra.
 
2013-06-05 08:33:29 PM  

lizyrd: Fissile: kindms: The fact that anyone would jeopardize a 6 figure job so they could toss a few beers back at a cookout while they were supposed to be working tells you all you need to know about this 27 year HERO of law enforcement.

think about the sense of entitlement needed to do that while in uniform with your patrol car.

=================

He's got 27 years in, he can't lose his pension over this. If he files for retirement today, his pension will be $88K per year plus medical, dental and vision.....no deductible, $10 copay for office visit and $5 prescription copay.   Survivors benefits are 70%, if he dies before his wife, she'll collect  $61K plus medical.

/NJ Highest Property Taxes in the USA

You're full of it, and so's the article. The guy may have EARNED $131k after overtime, but according to the Edison police contract, top step pay is $107k. Also, the contract states that the officers are in the NJPERS retirement plan. We'll get to that in a second.
Contract - http://www.perc.state.nj.us/publicsect orcontracts.nsf/Contracts%20By%2 0Employer/987FE5458569FF0D852579040058 2439/$File/Edison%20Tp%20and%20P BA%20Loc%2075%202009.pdf?OpenElement

The NJPERS pays 2% per year of service of the average of the top three years' base salary. Using the contract, I calculate his average base salary to be $104,459. With his 27 years, he gets 54%, or around $56,400.

NJPERS LEO Handbook - http://www.state.nj.us/treasury/pensio ns/pdf/handbook/sp0333-leo.pdf

Also of note, the NJPERS manual states that health benefits are by contract, and the Edison police contract states that retirees have the option to COBRA their benefits after retirement and have the opportunity to contribute to an HSA during their career.

So all-in-all, after bothering to do a little research (which I cited) I have come to the conclude that you're just making stuff up. $88,000 and full health coverage my ass.


==========

You've seen the Edison police contract?  You're saying that there aren't any retired Jersey cops getting $88K in pension?   What if I told you there are retired municipal Jersey cops getting over $100K in pension.  Call me a liar?

Here is the info for an Edison cop who retired in 2008.  His final salary was $138K, his pension is $97K  See for yourself http://php.app.com/retireNJ/details.php?recordID=28846   Yup, with healthcare until he turns 65, at which point he goes over to Medicare and the pension fund picks up the cost of a supplemental policy.

You sound like a cop who works someplace not North Jersey/Long Island.  I'm sure that mall cop job will be be enough to get you through every month after you retire on that big $32K per year.

BTW, how would you like to be paid for hundreds of unused sick/personal days when you retire?  Easy peasy if you're a NJ cop.  See here:  http://www.nj.com/jjournal-news/index.ssf/2013/06/four_retiring_jerse y _city_cops.html#incart_river
 
2013-06-05 09:03:26 PM  

IRQ12: lizyrd: Altair: lizyrd: stevegarbowski: durbnpoisn: You gotta love that this guy was drinking on the job, in uniform, and he is suspended WITH PAY!

Who the hell is making that decision?!

His union.

No, the union does not make decisions concerning disciplinary action taken by administration. What the union DOES do is represent its members to be sure they are being treated in accordance with the contract, personnel regulations and past practice.

Paid suspension is the most effective and efficient way for the administration to send a contract employee home immediately. The employee is in no position to claim he was harmed financially without due process, and it eliminates an avenue for the union to grieve he suspension.

So you're saying it was his union.

/pro-union
//just calling it how it is

No. The city administration made the decision to suspend him with pay, probably in accordance with the city's personnel regulations. The decision may have been made out of a desire to avoid engaging the union in the grievance process at this time, but the decision was still made by management.

Suspension with pay is just for right now. The next step could be termination. Or to negotiate a return to work with forfeiture of some pay. Or whatever. Suspension with pay is just a first step in order to get the guy off-duty immediately with a minimum of difficulty.

So you're saying it was his union.

The most efficient and effective way to send someone home immediately is for a superior with prima facie evidence of gross misconduct in hand  to tell the employee to "go home, you're fired".  Of course, "efficient and effective" are relative terms.



I'm sorry you had to explain it all out to him.

Just to make it clear, the union negotiated the "city's personnel regulations" with the city. So, it was the union.
 
2013-06-05 09:31:40 PM  
stevegarbowski: ....
I'm sorry you had to explain it all out to him.

Just to make it clear, the union negotiated the "city's personnel regulations" with the city. So, it was the union.


It's the frustrating thing about the whole union debate.  People don't get that a good tool like a union can be used to do bad things, and it's rampantly used for bad things when it comes to police unions.  An officer can shoot someone without cause, on video with multiple witnesses and a signed admission but if they didn't follow every single procedure in the intentionally and absurdly complex contract when terminating their employment they can and will get their job back, with back pay.

It's like the taser debate:  As sold to the public, it is a wonderful idea as an alternative to lethal force, but they immediately started using it as a cattle prod the moment someone doesn't immediately comply with their orders.

I don't think  any public service job should be unionized because the positions exist and are regulated by the collective will of the people via elected representation.
 
2013-06-05 10:19:36 PM  

Fissile: You've seen the Edison police contract?


I posted a link to the current Edison police contract.  You even quoted it when you hit reply.  Here it is again, since you seem to have missed it last go around:
http://www.perc.state.nj.us/publicsectorcontracts.nsf/Contracts%20By% 2 0Employer/987FE5458569FF0D8525790400582439/$File/Edison%20Tp%20and%20 PBA%20Loc%2075%202009.pdf?OpenElement   Their pay scale is in an addendum on the very last page.

Fissile: You're saying that there aren't any retired Jersey cops getting $88K in pension? What if I told you there are retired municipal Jersey cops getting over $100K in pension. Call me a liar?

I'm not saying that at all.  I'm sure there are cops making that kind of pension. I'm saying that this cop is not eligible for an $88,000 pension, based on the rules of his retirement system and his contractual base pay.

Fissile: Here is the info for an Edison cop who retired in 2008. His final salary was $138K, his pension is $97K See for yourself


And what was his rank at the time of his retirement?  I tried my best to find him, so I don't know for sure.  What I do know is that, according to the contract above, each rank increase is a 12.5% pay increase.  So if the guy were a police captain, and  top-step patrolmen made $100,000 at his time of retirement, that would put his base salary into the $140,000 area.  He also had 31 years of service, a 70% pension, and 5 years of COLA to get him to that 97,000 number.

Fissile: You sound like a cop who works someplace not North Jersey/Long Island. I'm sure that mall cop job will be be enough to get you through every month after you retire on that big $32K per year.


Nope, I'm just a poor fireman in a dirty, run down, dying East-coast city, making about 70% what the cops make.  But I get a bed, and the girls like us better, so it's a fair trade.

Fissile: BTW, how would you like to be paid for hundreds of unused sick/personal days when you retire? Easy peasy if you're a NJ cop. See here:


Yeah, but you can't blame the rank-and-file or the unions for what the deputy chiefs get.  They're management, and not covered by the union or the contract.  They make their own deal with the town.


I'm going to admit I was wrong about the health insurance.  I misread it the article about insurance, which can be found spanning pages 38 and 39, and they do indeed get coverage until age 65.  I was reading a subsection about using COBRA for dependents.  My mistake.
 
2013-06-05 10:26:42 PM  

lizyrd: I posted a link to the current Edison police contract. You even quoted it when you hit reply. Here it is again, since you seem to have missed it last go around:


Goddammit, Fark keeps eating my link to the damn thing, sticking spaces in where they don't belong.  Just google it if you give a damn.
 
2013-06-05 10:44:56 PM  

lizyrd: Fissile: You've seen the Edison police contract?

I posted a link to the current Edison police contract.  You even quoted it when you hit reply.  Here it is again, since you seem to have missed it last go around:
http://www.perc.state.nj.us/publicsectorcontracts.nsf/Contracts%20By% 2 0Employer/987FE5458569FF0D8525790400582439/$File/Edison%20Tp%20and%20 PBA%20Loc%2075%202009.pdf?OpenElement   Their pay scale is in an addendum on the very last page.

Fissile: You're saying that there aren't any retired Jersey cops getting $88K in pension? What if I told you there are retired municipal Jersey cops getting over $100K in pension. Call me a liar?
I'm not saying that at all.  I'm sure there are cops making that kind of pension. I'm saying that this cop is not eligible for an $88,000 pension, based on the rules of his retirement system and his contractual base pay.

Fissile: Here is the info for an Edison cop who retired in 2008. His final salary was $138K, his pension is $97K See for yourself

And what was his rank at the time of his retirement?  I tried my best to find him, so I don't know for sure.  What I do know is that, according to the contract above, each rank increase is a 12.5% pay increase.  So if the guy were a police captain, and  top-step patrolmen made $100,000 at his time of retirement, that would put his base salary into the $140,000 area.  He also had 31 years of service, a 70% pension, and 5 years of COLA to get him to that 97,000 number.

Fissile: You sound like a cop who works someplace not North Jersey/Long Island. I'm sure that mall cop job will be be enough to get you through every month after you retire on that big $32K per year.

Nope, I'm just a poor fireman in a dirty, run down, dying East-coast city, making about 70% what the cops make.  But I get a bed, and the girls like us better, so it's a fair trade.

Fissile: BTW, how would you like to be paid for hundreds of unused sick/personal days when you retire? Easy peasy if you're a NJ cop. See her ...


=============

Fireman, huh?  Check out how much some NJ fireman make.

http://www.nj.com/hudson/index.ssf/2013/04/retired_hoboken_firefight er s_s.html
 
2013-06-05 11:14:41 PM  

Fissile: lizyrd: Fissile: You've seen the Edison police contract?

I posted a link to the current Edison police contract.  You even quoted it when you hit reply.  Here it is again, since you seem to have missed it last go around:
http://www.perc.state.nj.us/publicsectorcontracts.nsf/Contracts%20By% 2 0Employer/987FE5458569FF0D8525790400582439/$File/Edison%20Tp%20and%20 PBA%20Loc%2075%202009.pdf?OpenElement   Their pay scale is in an addendum on the very last page.

Fissile: You're saying that there aren't any retired Jersey cops getting $88K in pension? What if I told you there are retired municipal Jersey cops getting over $100K in pension. Call me a liar?
I'm not saying that at all.  I'm sure there are cops making that kind of pension. I'm saying that this cop is not eligible for an $88,000 pension, based on the rules of his retirement system and his contractual base pay.

Fissile: Here is the info for an Edison cop who retired in 2008. His final salary was $138K, his pension is $97K See for yourself

And what was his rank at the time of his retirement?  I tried my best to find him, so I don't know for sure.  What I do know is that, according to the contract above, each rank increase is a 12.5% pay increase.  So if the guy were a police captain, and  top-step patrolmen made $100,000 at his time of retirement, that would put his base salary into the $140,000 area.  He also had 31 years of service, a 70% pension, and 5 years of COLA to get him to that 97,000 number.

Fissile: You sound like a cop who works someplace not North Jersey/Long Island. I'm sure that mall cop job will be be enough to get you through every month after you retire on that big $32K per year.

Nope, I'm just a poor fireman in a dirty, run down, dying East-coast city, making about 70% what the cops make.  But I get a bed, and the girls like us better, so it's a fair trade.

Fissile: BTW, how would you like to be paid for hundreds of unused sick/personal days when you retire? Easy peasy if you're a NJ cop. See her ...

=============

Fireman, huh?  Check out how much some NJ fireman make.

http://www.nj.com/hudson/index.ssf/2013/04/retired_hoboken_firefight er s_s.html


It's a lot more than I make, but as a justification:
I don't know much about Hoboken FD, but I'd guess the Battalion Chief in that article was responsible for the supervision of 20 to 30 men and around ten million dollars worth of equipment. $150,000 isn't completely out of the ballpark as far as reasonable compensation, especially in a high cost-of-living area. A Battalion where I work makes a bit under $100,000 but the cost of living here is quite a bit lower.

Believe me, I get what you're saying. Jersey sucks, taxes are high, and government is corrupt. But you might as well complain about water being wet.
 
2013-06-05 11:31:12 PM  

lizyrd: Fissile: lizyrd: Fissile: You've seen the Edison police contract?

I posted a link to the current Edison police contract.  You even quoted it when you hit reply.  Here it is again, since you seem to have missed it last go around:
http://www.perc.state.nj.us/publicsectorcontracts.nsf/Contracts%20By% 2 0Employer/987FE5458569FF0D8525790400582439/$File/Edison%20Tp%20and%20 PBA%20Loc%2075%202009.pdf?OpenElement   Their pay scale is in an addendum on the very last page.

Fissile: You're saying that there aren't any retired Jersey cops getting $88K in pension? What if I told you there are retired municipal Jersey cops getting over $100K in pension. Call me a liar?
I'm not saying that at all.  I'm sure there are cops making that kind of pension. I'm saying that this cop is not eligible for an $88,000 pension, based on the rules of his retirement system and his contractual base pay.

Fissile: Here is the info for an Edison cop who retired in 2008. His final salary was $138K, his pension is $97K See for yourself

And what was his rank at the time of his retirement?  I tried my best to find him, so I don't know for sure.  What I do know is that, according to the contract above, each rank increase is a 12.5% pay increase.  So if the guy were a police captain, and  top-step patrolmen made $100,000 at his time of retirement, that would put his base salary into the $140,000 area.  He also had 31 years of service, a 70% pension, and 5 years of COLA to get him to that 97,000 number.

Fissile: You sound like a cop who works someplace not North Jersey/Long Island. I'm sure that mall cop job will be be enough to get you through every month after you retire on that big $32K per year.

Nope, I'm just a poor fireman in a dirty, run down, dying East-coast city, making about 70% what the cops make.  But I get a bed, and the girls like us better, so it's a fair trade.

Fissile: BTW, how would you like to be paid for hundreds of unused sick/personal days when you retire? Easy peasy if you're ...


===================

This guy is not a battalion chief....on the job for 12 years, and Ridgewood isn't even a city, it's a suburb.

http://php.app.com/NJpublicemployees13/details.php?recordID=256863
 
2013-06-06 07:25:08 AM  

Fissile: lizyrd: Fissile: lizyrd: Fissile: You've seen the Edison police contract?

I posted a link to the current Edison police contract.  You even quoted it when you hit reply.  Here it is again, since you seem to have missed it last go around:
http://www.perc.state.nj.us/publicsectorcontracts.nsf/Contracts%20By% 2 0Employer/987FE5458569FF0D8525790400582439/$File/Edison%20Tp%20and%20 PBA%20Loc%2075%202009.pdf?OpenElement   Their pay scale is in an addendum on the very last page.

Fissile: You're saying that there aren't any retired Jersey cops getting $88K in pension? What if I told you there are retired municipal Jersey cops getting over $100K in pension. Call me a liar?
I'm not saying that at all.  I'm sure there are cops making that kind of pension. I'm saying that this cop is not eligible for an $88,000 pension, based on the rules of his retirement system and his contractual base pay.

Fissile: Here is the info for an Edison cop who retired in 2008. His final salary was $138K, his pension is $97K See for yourself

And what was his rank at the time of his retirement?  I tried my best to find him, so I don't know for sure.  What I do know is that, according to the contract above, each rank increase is a 12.5% pay increase.  So if the guy were a police captain, and  top-step patrolmen made $100,000 at his time of retirement, that would put his base salary into the $140,000 area.  He also had 31 years of service, a 70% pension, and 5 years of COLA to get him to that 97,000 number.

Fissile: You sound like a cop who works someplace not North Jersey/Long Island. I'm sure that mall cop job will be be enough to get you through every month after you retire on that big $32K per year.

Nope, I'm just a poor fireman in a dirty, run down, dying East-coast city, making about 70% what the cops make.  But I get a bed, and the girls like us better, so it's a fair trade.

Fissile: BTW, how would you like to be paid for hundreds of unused sick/personal days when you retire? Easy peasy if you're ...

===================

This guy is not a battalion chief....on the job for 12 years, and Ridgewood isn't even a city, it's a suburb.

http://php.app.com/NJpublicemployees13/details.php?recordID=256863


Okay, and again-
The man you linked to is a Lieutenant, responsible for the direct supervision of several men and around a half million to a million and a half dollars worth of equipment. Additionally, there are three shifts in that department, so his base schedule is a 56-hour workweek.

Link to Ridgewood Village FD's organizational structure: http://www.fmbalocal47.org/index.cfm?S ection=10&pagenum=207&titles=0

Additionally, the median home value in Ridgewood is over $600,000, and nearby communities are in the $325k to 600k range. As smaller departments like that usually rely on call-backs for larger fires, there is often a "you must live within a X mile radius of town hall" clause in the contract. The town has to pay a salary that allows a level of comfortable living in a high cost-of-living area.

Link to house values near Ridgewood Village - http://www.zillow.com/local-info/NJ-Ri dgewood-home-value/r_20176/
 
2013-06-06 09:20:17 AM  
lizyrd:
Okay, and again-
The man you linked to is a Lieutenant, responsible for the direct supervision of several men and around a half million to a million and a half dollars worth of equipment. Additionally, there are three shifts in that department, so his base schedule is a 56-hour workweek.

Link to Ridgewood Village FD's organizational structure: http://www.fmbalocal47.org/index.cfm?S ection=10&pagenum=207&titles=0

Additionally, the median home value in Ridgewood is over $600,000, and nearby communities are in the $325k to 600k range. As smaller departments like that usually rely on call-backs for larger fires, there is often a "you must live within a X mile radius of town hall" clause in the contract. The town has to pay a salary that allows a level of comfortable living in a high cost-of-living area.

Link to house values near Ridgewood Village - http://www.zillow.com/local-info/NJ-Ri dgewood-home-value/r_20176/

===========================

You don't like Ridgewood as an example?   Try Hackensack, which is definitely a low rent city.

http://php.app.com/NJpublicemployees13/details.php?recordID=253546

Here is my point:  I made some claims about how much these people were making in salary, and how much they were getting in benefits, and you called me a liar.   So, I'm a liar, huh?

Do you know how you get one of these jobs in Jersey?  It's all nepotism and patronage.  Think I'm lying?  Want me to prove it?   I'm getting killed with property taxes because of bullshiat like this.  The average property tax bill for a single family house in Jersey is now over $10K.  You people outside of Jersey need to take a good look at what's going on here as an example of how NOT to run municipal and county government.

BTW, you want me to post what some of the local teachers and school administrators are getting paid?   2/3 of my property tax bill goes to local schools.
 
2013-06-06 10:30:19 AM  

Fissile: lizyrd:
Okay, and again-
The man you linked to is a Lieutenant, responsible for the direct supervision of several men and around a half million to a million and a half dollars worth of equipment. Additionally, there are three shifts in that department, so his base schedule is a 56-hour workweek.

Link to Ridgewood Village FD's organizational structure: http://www.fmbalocal47.org/index.cfm?S ection=10&pagenum=207&titles=0

Additionally, the median home value in Ridgewood is over $600,000, and nearby communities are in the $325k to 600k range. As smaller departments like that usually rely on call-backs for larger fires, there is often a "you must live within a X mile radius of town hall" clause in the contract. The town has to pay a salary that allows a level of comfortable living in a high cost-of-living area.

Link to house values near Ridgewood Village - http://www.zillow.com/local-info/NJ-Ri dgewood-home-value/r_20176/
===========================

You don't like Ridgewood as an example?   Try Hackensack, which is definitely a low rent city.

http://php.app.com/NJpublicemployees13/details.php?recordID=253546

Here is my point:  I made some claims about how much these people were making in salary, and how much they were getting in benefits, and you called me a liar.   So, I'm a liar, huh?

Do you know how you get one of these jobs in Jersey?  It's all nepotism and patronage.  Think I'm lying?  Want me to prove it?   I'm getting killed with property taxes because of bullshiat like this.  The average property tax bill for a single family house in Jersey is now over $10K.  You people outside of Jersey need to take a good look at what's going on here as an example of how NOT to run municipal and county government.

BTW, you want me to post what some of the local teachers and school administrators are getting paid?   2/3 of my property tax bill goes to local schools.


Oh, you mean Deputy Chief Charles Grieco? A 4th level supervisor, with BCs, Captains and LTs below him? Keep trotting out examples of upper-level supervisors and management making 150,000 and conflating that with rank-and-file fire fighters making 150k.

Once again, the only thing I called you out on was your assertation that the cop in THIS ARTICLE was eligible for an $88,000 pension. He is not. Both his contract and his retirement plan are public record and available on the internet with a minimum of searching, and the math is easy to do. I already apologized for being incorrect about his retirement health benefits.
 
2013-06-06 10:43:12 AM  
LaurenAguilera
Dirtybird971: LaurenAguilera
Dirtybird971: It would have been better if he'd crashed his cruiser. Maybe even got hurt. Lord knows he won't feel the "pain" the rest of us would feel with a DUI.

This is just another reason why cops, like Priests, are just people whose jobs have them wear costumes and aren't due any more respect than the person who cleans bathrooms or cuts down trees.

not sure if serious?

I am sure that my landscaper would gladly rush to the scene of an on going violent crime and put himself in harms way to nullify the situation. Totally.

yeah sorry, I really want to go fishing today.

BUT MAYBE...if you get a job as a cop someone should let you know beforehand that it's a dangerous job that requires you to be "better" than the average person. Especially while in uniform. And carrying a gun.

... I was referring to your comment about how they are just persons whose jobs require them to wear costumes, and aren't due any more respect than anyone else.

As a soldier, that's kind of harsh, bra.


Did you just call me a piece of women's undergarments? :)

Cops are not soldiers, Thank you for your service.
 
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