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(Newser)   George Zimmerman's legal team has been digging up some less-than-flattering background information about Trayvon Martin-but one story that made the rounds Friday, turns out not to be true   (newser.com) divider line 589
    More: Followup, George Zimmerman  
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16763 clicks; posted to Main » on 03 Jun 2013 at 1:48 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-06-03 04:00:51 PM

Smelly Pirate Hooker: You'd think one person being unarmed and dead and the other person being alive with a gun would have made this a relatively simple manslaughter case.


FACT: You can't defend yourself unless your attacker is armed.
 
2013-06-03 04:00:59 PM

PsyLord: So basically, you can be a hired hitman and 'bump' into someone 'accidentally'. Get into an argument, let the guy start pounding on you, then pull out your weapon and 'defend yourself' (with extreme prejudice).


Ummm. No.

BojanglesPaladin: Unless it was your INTENT to do that and kill the person, yes. In certain circumstances, and if you can convince investigators, DAs, a judge and jury that you did not INTEND to kill that person, yes.


If you were a HITMAN, then it would be your INTENT to kill that person, and you would presumably not be in fear for your life.

You would also be a particularly stupid and inept hitman, becasue you would be intentionally involving authorities, put yourself through a whiole investigation and trial, and rack up enormous legal fees, and probably ruin your life.

But you probably already knew that. Are we arguing ad absurdim here?
 
2013-06-03 04:02:34 PM

Cataholic: ongbok: So chasing after somebody who is running away from you doesn't constitute an intentional, unlawful threat by word or act to do violence? Or running at somebody who is minding their own business?

Be honest here, please.

If someone comes running toward me, I don't automatically assume they are going to kill me.  Maybe I dropped my wallet and they are bringing it.  Maybe it's someone who thinks I am their long lost cousin (who looks a lot like me).  Maybe they are running from someone else and are coming to me to ask for help.  Maybe you think Hispanic people running toward you only want to do violence?


So if you are running away from a person, and they chase you down you won't do anything?

I love the complete dishonesty about this that the pro Zimmerman crowd brings to the argument.
 
2013-06-03 04:02:34 PM

Mambo Bananapatch: He will write a book, sell the story rights to Steven Spielberg, and become very wealthy.


Honestly?  After his character assassination, the guy deserves it.
 
2013-06-03 04:02:36 PM

Mambo Bananapatch: Other than Zimmerman, of course. If he walks. He will write a book, sell the story rights to Steven Spielberg, and become very wealthy.


That is unless he loses the civil wrongful death case. In that case, all his monies will belong to the Martin family.
 
2013-06-03 04:02:48 PM

ChuDogg: FACT: You can't defend yourself unless your attacker is armed.


Martin had arms. Two of them.

(One holding Skittles, and one holding a Sprite)
 
2013-06-03 04:03:29 PM
You guys wouldn't be arguing like this if Trayvon Martin was a German Shepherd and George Zimmerman was a perfectly-cooked and seasoned, medium-rare rib eye steak!
 
2013-06-03 04:04:07 PM

ChuDogg: Smelly Pirate Hooker: You'd think one person being unarmed and dead and the other person being alive with a gun would have made this a relatively simple manslaughter case.

FACT: You can't defend yourself unless your attacker is armed.


I really hope you are not serious.
 
2013-06-03 04:06:34 PM

ongbok: So if you are running away from a person, and they chase you down you won't do anything?

I love the complete dishonesty about this that the pro Zimmerman crowd brings to the argument.


What exactly are you arguing here? That *IF* Zimmerman, did in fact "chase" Martin down, that Martin was justified in administering a beating?
(and that while Martin was justified in giving a beating for being "chased", that Zimmerman, was NOT justified in shooting Martin even while being beaten, and should have just taken that beating, because after all - he chased a guy?

I think Zimmerman is to bolame here just as much as Martin, but yo9u seem to be arguing that Zimmerman following Martin gave Martin carte blanche to do whatever. Is that your position? Could you clarify?
 
2013-06-03 04:07:09 PM
Just can't wait till he is cleared, and he sues all kinds of people and corporations for brazillions.

Major media outlet doctoring 911 tapes on national TV to make George look bad is going to be worth a very large sum of money.

Still amazes me how stupid liberals are with their weird version of events and made up laws, to defend a gangsta who got killed. Not only do you ignore all evidence, you actually make up your own and really believe it. Crazy.
 
2013-06-03 04:07:18 PM
frepnog:   Had he been white he would probably still be sitting on death row


Tell that to Casey Anthony. Sorry, but the LAPD/DA farking things up + him being a celebrity? That equals a walk. If he wasn't famous you'd better believe he'd be locked up right now.
 
2013-06-03 04:10:39 PM

Thunderpipes: Still amazes me how stupid liberals are with their weird version of events and made up laws, to defend a gangsta who got killed.


I don't believe that there has been any evidence that Martin was a member of a gang, or had a history of violence.

Unless by "gangsta", you mean that he exhibited certain mannerisms and accoutrement common to black youth who take on certain affectations to bolster their own self image? In which case, do you mean to convey that people who act and dress in a certain way are more acceptably killed than people who act in a different way?
 
2013-06-03 04:11:14 PM

CrazyCracka420: Elegy: CrazyCracka420: To the people saying Zimmerman had injuries so that proves his case...logic isn't your strong suit.  You can start a fight with someone, and still get your ass kicked.  Just because you get your ass handed to you, doesn't mean you couldn't have still been the aggressor.

Just because you are the aggressor, doesn't mean you can't claim self defense.

Lrn2law

And it's a ridiculous law and why "stand your ground" is a farking retarded.

Start a fight
Get ass kicked
Pull out a gun
Shoot the person you attacked
?
Profit


I have my own problems with SYG, but SYG has nothing to do with this case. Zimmerman waived his rights to a pre-trial SYG hearing.

The claim of self-defense that Zimmerman will use in trial is just that - a self-defense law. IIRC, many other states have a similar law that allow you to claim self defense even if you are the aggressor.

You can't even claim that this is the fault of "no duty to retreat" laws. If the physical evidence and witness testimony are to be believed, Zimmerman couldn't retreat once he was being pummeled.

It's just plain self defense, of the sort that has always been on the books. Sorry that doesn't advance your political agenda.
 
2013-06-03 04:11:39 PM

PsyLord: So, what are the odds of rioting in FL if he is found not guilty?


Why are you so eager to see people with certain characteristics behave shamefully because it would reinforce your prejudicial opinions of them?
 
2013-06-03 04:12:02 PM

ongbok: Cataholic: ongbok: So chasing after somebody who is running away from you doesn't constitute an intentional, unlawful threat by word or act to do violence? Or running at somebody who is minding their own business?

Be honest here, please.

If someone comes running toward me, I don't automatically assume they are going to kill me.  Maybe I dropped my wallet and they are bringing it.  Maybe it's someone who thinks I am their long lost cousin (who looks a lot like me).  Maybe they are running from someone else and are coming to me to ask for help.  Maybe you think Hispanic people running toward you only want to do violence?

So if you are running away from a person, and they chase you down you won't do anything?

I love the complete dishonesty about this that the pro Zimmerman crowd brings to the argument.


No.  I won't.  Mainly because I don't wish to go to jail.  You have no right to punch someone just because they ran up to you.
 
2013-06-03 04:12:14 PM

Tatsuma: arentol: By this reasoning (it doesn't matter how he got in the situation) I could walk into a bank with a gun out, shout "I am robbing this bank", then shoot the security guard when he reaches for his gun.... And claim it was self defense.

Zimmerman was not doing anything illegal that's a shiat example.




This is why we are having a trial, lots of rumors still being thrown around.

I think the issue is Martin wasn't doing anything wrong either. An argument could be made that Martin was acting in self defense. A strange man followed him in a car, then when Martin got scared and change directions, the guy followed him on foot. Perhaps he felt his life was endangered. Perhaps He saw Zimmerman had a gun and started attacking?

While I don't think Zimmerman murdered Martin, he certainly bears some sort of responsibility.Getting out of the car was the stupidest decision in the world.
 
2013-06-03 04:12:44 PM

ChuDogg: Smelly Pirate Hooker: You'd think one person being unarmed and dead and the other person being alive with a gun would have made this a relatively simple manslaughter case.

FACT: You can't defend yourself unless your attacker is armed.


So if a no-armed man kicks me in the balls, I have to just stand there and take it?
 
2013-06-03 04:12:54 PM

BojanglesPaladin: What exactly are you arguing here? That *IF* Zimmerman, did in fact "chase" Martin down, that Martin was justified in administering a beating?
(and that while Martin was justified in giving a beating for being "chased", that Zimmerman, was NOT justified in shooting Martin even while being beaten, and should have just taken that beating, because after all - he chased a guy?


It shows the idiocy of SYG laws.  You can pick fights and shoot your way out of them when you're losing.
 
2013-06-03 04:13:30 PM

BojanglesPaladin: ongbok: So if you are running away from a person, and they chase you down you won't do anything?

I love the complete dishonesty about this that the pro Zimmerman crowd brings to the argument.

What exactly are you arguing here? That *IF* Zimmerman, did in fact "chase" Martin down, that Martin was justified in administering a beating?
(and that while Martin was justified in giving a beating for being "chased", that Zimmerman, was NOT justified in shooting Martin even while being beaten, and should have just taken that beating, because after all - he chased a guy?

I think Zimmerman is to bolame here just as much as Martin, but yo9u seem to be arguing that Zimmerman following Martin gave Martin carte blanche to do whatever. Is that your position? Could you clarify?


This went past Zimmerman following him. At a point Trayvon ran away from Zimmerman, clearly showing he feared Zimmerman and was trying to avoid a confrontation with him. Zimmerman even said he is running away on the 911 call. Zimmerman chased him and caught him. At the point Martin had reason to believe that his life was in danger, and he had every right to defend himself.

Don't tell me you wouldn't do the same thing if you decided to run away from a person and they caught up to you.

Or are you going to deny that Trayvon ran away from him?
 
2013-06-03 04:14:16 PM

poot_rootbeer: PsyLord: So, what are the odds of rioting in FL if he is found not guilty?

Why are you so eager to see people with certain characteristics behave shamefully because it would reinforce your prejudicial opinions of them?


There will be a riot.  Florida will even prepare for one.  Or are you saying a bunch of people already using emotional reasoning won't make another emotional choice and riot because they don't understand how this could have happened?  Derp.
 
2013-06-03 04:17:23 PM

Tatsuma: Triple Oak: You can tell the defense is trending towards implausible white superiority,

He's not white when will farking idiots try to pretend that he is? For fark's sake this is a white guy?

[i.imgur.com image 640x360]



"At least he's not jewish", is what you're saying?
 
2013-06-03 04:17:30 PM

tricycleracer: BojanglesPaladin: What exactly are you arguing here? That *IF* Zimmerman, did in fact "chase" Martin down, that Martin was justified in administering a beating?
(and that while Martin was justified in giving a beating for being "chased", that Zimmerman, was NOT justified in shooting Martin even while being beaten, and should have just taken that beating, because after all - he chased a guy?

It shows the idiocy of SYG laws.  You can pick fights and shoot your way out of them when you're losing.


Shows the idiocy of you, since this is what you think happened, contrary to all evidence.
 
2013-06-03 04:17:37 PM

Cataholic: ongbok: Cataholic: ongbok: So chasing after somebody who is running away from you doesn't constitute an intentional, unlawful threat by word or act to do violence? Or running at somebody who is minding their own business?

Be honest here, please.

If someone comes running toward me, I don't automatically assume they are going to kill me.  Maybe I dropped my wallet and they are bringing it.  Maybe it's someone who thinks I am their long lost cousin (who looks a lot like me).  Maybe they are running from someone else and are coming to me to ask for help.  Maybe you think Hispanic people running toward you only want to do violence?

So if you are running away from a person, and they chase you down you won't do anything?

I love the complete dishonesty about this that the pro Zimmerman crowd brings to the argument.

No.  I won't.  Mainly because I don't wish to go to jail.  You have no right to punch someone just because they ran up to you.


You didn't answer the question. i asked you ran away from a person and they chased you and caught up to you would you defend yourself?

But don't worry, you will never answer the question that I asked you, you will just keep deflecting because you know you would do the same thing that Trayvon did.
 
2013-06-03 04:19:50 PM

BojanglesPaladin: Thunderpipes: Still amazes me how stupid liberals are with their weird version of events and made up laws, to defend a gangsta who got killed.

I don't believe that there has been any evidence that Martin was a member of a gang, or had a history of violence.

Unless by "gangsta", you mean that he exhibited certain mannerisms and accoutrement common to black youth who take on certain affectations to bolster their own self image? In which case, do you mean to convey that people who act and dress in a certain way are more acceptably killed than people who act in a different way?


Is that moron still posting his same stick? I bet he included the word liberal in his post. I thought everyone had that idiot on ignore.
 
2013-06-03 04:20:23 PM

BojanglesPaladin: I think Zimmerman is to bolame here just as much as Martin, but yo9u seem to be arguing that Zimmerman following Martin gave Martin carte blanche to do whatever. Is that your position? Could you clarify?


Apparently you don't know the LAW and can't use simple LOGIC! If you somebody is following you and looking at you the wrong way you should absolutely have every right to defend yourself and attack them. Treyvon was standing HIS ground from some freaky white guy giving him the stink eye.  And Martin was unarmed so Zimmerman has no right to use his gun for self defense.   That's the LAW.  He shouldn't have been waving around menacing in the first place.  Zimmerman should have just taken his beating like a man if you lost the fight after looking at the wrong dude the wrong way. That's life.
 
2013-06-03 04:20:31 PM

ongbok: BojanglesPaladin: ongbok: So if you are running away from a person, and they chase you down you won't do anything?

I love the complete dishonesty about this that the pro Zimmerman crowd brings to the argument.

What exactly are you arguing here? That *IF* Zimmerman, did in fact "chase" Martin down, that Martin was justified in administering a beating?
(and that while Martin was justified in giving a beating for being "chased", that Zimmerman, was NOT justified in shooting Martin even while being beaten, and should have just taken that beating, because after all - he chased a guy?

I think Zimmerman is to bolame here just as much as Martin, but yo9u seem to be arguing that Zimmerman following Martin gave Martin carte blanche to do whatever. Is that your position? Could you clarify?

This went past Zimmerman following him. At a point Trayvon ran away from Zimmerman, clearly showing he feared Zimmerman and was trying to avoid a confrontation with him. Zimmerman even said he is running away on the 911 call. Zimmerman chased him and caught him. At the point Martin had reason to believe that his life was in danger, and he had every right to defend himself.

Don't tell me you wouldn't do the same thing if you decided to run away from a person and they caught up to you.

Or are you going to deny that Trayvon ran away from him?


That doesn't matter. How many times do we have to go over this. The only things that matter are:

-Zimmerman's story that he was on the ground screaming for help while Martin pummeled him

-Zimmerman's copious physical injuries and defensive wounds versus Martin's none (barring the gunshot wound)

-The witness that corroborate it was Zimmerman on the ground screaming for help and getting pummeled for Martin.

Answer me this: why does Zimmerman get all the blame for following Martin, yet Martin gets none of the blame for continuing to beat on Zimmerman? Because it would seem to me that (following a person
 
2013-06-03 04:21:07 PM

ongbok: At the point Martin had reason to believe that his life was in danger, and he had every right to defend himself.


I don;t know how you get from "Hey kid!" to life endangerment, but based on your comments, you DO seem to be arguing that becasue Martin was being "chased" he was fully entitled to adminsiter a beating to Zimmerman. Fine.

But if being chased and yelled at entitles you to beat someone, surely getting physically attacked and beaten entitles a man to defend themselves as well?

Or should Zimmerman have simply said "Whelp! This head to concrete things and the broken nose sure do smart, but I guess I had it coming. After all, I did chase after the fellah. I sure do hope that he stops bludgeoning me soon. I already need medical attention, I just hope he stops before I die".

You have NO IDEA what actually went down, and neither do I.

I just find it odd that you seem to support a violent response to being chased, but apparantly NOT a violent response to being beaten. That seems weird to me.
 
2013-06-03 04:21:17 PM

BojanglesPaladin: ongbok: So if you are running away from a person, and they chase you down you won't do anything?

I love the complete dishonesty about this that the pro Zimmerman crowd brings to the argument.

What exactly are you arguing here? That *IF* Zimmerman, did in fact "chase" Martin down, that Martin was justified in administering a beating?
(and that while Martin was justified in giving a beating for being "chased", that Zimmerman, was NOT justified in shooting Martin even while being beaten, and should have just taken that beating, because after all - he chased a guy?

I think Zimmerman is to bolame here just as much as Martin, but yo9u seem to be arguing that Zimmerman following Martin gave Martin carte blanche to do whatever. Is that your position? Could you clarify?


If someone follows me from an isolated area at night into an even MORE isolated area, at what point do I assume they're not up to anything good?

Zimmerman is going to jail, and probably for a very, very long time.
 
2013-06-03 04:21:51 PM
Trayvon Martin beat up a homeless guy.

Trayvon Martin stole Marcellus Wallace's soul.

Trayvon Martin shot Abraham Lincoln.

Trayvon Martin is responsible for global warming and killing pandas.

Trayvon Martin is white people's excuse for everything they love to stereotype about black people.
 
2013-06-03 04:22:14 PM
Poor Travon ...
... he just wandered over to watch some Ultimate Bum Shock Fights.

/hot like those gloves
 
2013-06-03 04:22:43 PM

gshepnyc: What does any of this  have to do wwith what we already know to be facts? Martin was where he was allowed to be. Martin was unarmed. Zimmerman was a self-appointed "neighborhood watch" guy who took it upon himseld to be armed and who gave himself the title of "captain." Zimmerman was told not to pursue Martin. Zimmerman was armed and pursued anyway. Zimmerman made hotheaded remarks. Zimmerman shot Martin to death.


I think there might be some facts you're missing here...
 
2013-06-03 04:23:18 PM

ongbok: Cataholic: ongbok: Cataholic: ongbok: So chasing after somebody who is running away from you doesn't constitute an intentional, unlawful threat by word or act to do violence? Or running at somebody who is minding their own business?

Be honest here, please.

If someone comes running toward me, I don't automatically assume they are going to kill me.  Maybe I dropped my wallet and they are bringing it.  Maybe it's someone who thinks I am their long lost cousin (who looks a lot like me).  Maybe they are running from someone else and are coming to me to ask for help.  Maybe you think Hispanic people running toward you only want to do violence?

So if you are running away from a person, and they chase you down you won't do anything?

I love the complete dishonesty about this that the pro Zimmerman crowd brings to the argument.

No.  I won't.  Mainly because I don't wish to go to jail.  You have no right to punch someone just because they ran up to you.

You didn't answer the question. i asked you ran away from a person and they chased you and caught up to you would you defend yourself?

But don't worry, you will never answer the question that I asked you, you will just keep deflecting because you know you would do the same thing that Trayvon did.


Actually, if the guy I was pounding on started screaming for help while I was on top of him, I would probably stop hitting him.

Because, you know, hitting someone over and over who is on the ground and clearly doesn't want to fight anymore is wrong.

So no, I wouldn't do what Trayvon did.
 
2013-06-03 04:23:20 PM

CrazyCracka420: Elegy: CrazyCracka420: To the people saying Zimmerman had injuries so that proves his case...logic isn't your strong suit.  You can start a fight with someone, and still get your ass kicked.  Just because you get your ass handed to you, doesn't mean you couldn't have still been the aggressor.

Just because you are the aggressor, doesn't mean you can't claim self defense.

Lrn2law

And it's a ridiculous law and why "stand your ground" is a farking retarded.

Start a fight
Get ass kicked
Pull out a gun
Shoot the person you attacked
?
Profit


And here's the crux.   THIS is why this case is such a big farking deal.  People who are for more gun control HATE stand-your-ground.  It makes perfect sense.

If someone attacks you, you have the ability to defend yourself with lethal force if you are at risk of death or great bodily harm.  PERIOD.  That's what stand-your-ground is.  It is not all of these paranoid fantasies of people instigating fights and then shooting the other guys and yelling "He was coming right at us!" South Park style and getting away with it.

Martin wasn't simply warding off an attacker.  He was on top of Zimmerman bashing his head into the concrete.  Was it smart for Zimmerman to follow him?  Maybe not.  Did that justify a severe beatdown?  Absolutely not.  Was Zimmerman justified in shooting?  According to the evidence we have seen so far, yes he was.

This case is idiotic.  If it hadn't been for the irresponsible reporting at the outset, this would have been a page 3 story.
 
2013-06-03 04:24:29 PM
Darn, animated gif fail.

Here is a linky
 
2013-06-03 04:24:36 PM

MFAWG: If someone follows me from an isolated area at night into an even MORE isolated area, at what point do I assume they're not up to anything good?


I think that depends on the circumstances. Can you tell me when exactly are you justified in jumping that person and beating them?
 
2013-06-03 04:24:42 PM

The First Four Black Sabbath Albums: You guys wouldn't be arguing like this if Trayvon Martin was a German Shepherd and George Zimmerman was a perfectly-cooked and seasoned, medium-rare rib eye steak!


thumbnails.hulu.com

HEY!  If George Zimmerman were made of Trayvon Martin, would you eat George Zimmerman!?  It's not rocket science!
Worried you might choose Mad Cow.

/stared at the sun with a pair of binoculars for over an hour
//friends call him whiskers
///HEY!
 
2013-06-03 04:25:11 PM

MFAWG: BojanglesPaladin: ongbok: So if you are running away from a person, and they chase you down you won't do anything?

I love the complete dishonesty about this that the pro Zimmerman crowd brings to the argument.

What exactly are you arguing here? That *IF* Zimmerman, did in fact "chase" Martin down, that Martin was justified in administering a beating?
(and that while Martin was justified in giving a beating for being "chased", that Zimmerman, was NOT justified in shooting Martin even while being beaten, and should have just taken that beating, because after all - he chased a guy?

I think Zimmerman is to bolame here just as much as Martin, but yo9u seem to be arguing that Zimmerman following Martin gave Martin carte blanche to do whatever. Is that your position? Could you clarify?

If someone follows me from an isolated area at night into an even MORE isolated area, at what point do I assume they're not up to anything good?

Zimmerman is going to jail, and probably for a very, very long time.


Want to bet?

1 month TF.

I win if he walks.
You win if he's convicted for murder 2.
Nobody wins if he pleas out, if there's a hung jury, or if he's guilty of a lesser charge.
 
2013-06-03 04:25:16 PM

NightOwl2255: BojanglesPaladin: Thunderpipes: Still amazes me how stupid liberals are with their weird version of events and made up laws, to defend a gangsta who got killed.

I don't believe that there has been any evidence that Martin was a member of a gang, or had a history of violence.

Unless by "gangsta", you mean that he exhibited certain mannerisms and accoutrement common to black youth who take on certain affectations to bolster their own self image? In which case, do you mean to convey that people who act and dress in a certain way are more acceptably killed than people who act in a different way?

Is that moron still posting his same stick? I bet he included the word liberal in his post. I thought everyone had that idiot on ignore.


And yet I am right, 100% of the time. Burns you up huh?
By Gangsta, I mean pot dealing, theft, getting kicked out of school, and jumping a guy for fun.

Farkers just can't face facts.
 
2013-06-03 04:25:51 PM

Elegy: So no, I wouldn't do what it is alleged that Trayvon did.


FTF&Y.
 
2013-06-03 04:26:43 PM
Hmm, it says over 300 posts yet when I come into the thread to read it, it only says 89...I wonder why?
 
2013-06-03 04:27:01 PM

OnlyM3: Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom [TotalFark]
2013-06-03 12:39:01 PM


Zimmerman got really farking fat. Good god, easy on the churros, dude.
I'd bet you'd be screaming bloody murder -and hitting the report button- if some fool said something about t.martin and fried chicken & watermelon.

Racism is oh so funny when TotalFarkers do it.


That comment is GODDAMN HILARIOUS coming from you.
 
2013-06-03 04:27:57 PM

ChuDogg: BojanglesPaladin: I think Zimmerman is to bolame here just as much as Martin, but yo9u seem to be arguing that Zimmerman following Martin gave Martin carte blanche to do whatever. Is that your position? Could you clarify?

Apparently you don't know the LAW and can't use simple LOGIC! If you somebody is following you and looking at you the wrong way you should absolutely have every right to defend yourself and attack them. Treyvon was standing HIS ground from some freaky white guy giving him the stink eye.  And Martin was unarmed so Zimmerman has no right to use his gun for self defense.   That's the LAW.  He shouldn't have been waving around menacing in the first place.  Zimmerman should have just taken his beating like a man if you lost the fight after looking at the wrong dude the wrong way. That's life.


You couldn't possibly have been wrong on any more of your points.  You cannot attack for being followed.  Your assailant being armed has NOTHING to to with self-defense legally, fear of death or great bodily harm does. There is no indication that Zimmerman had his firearm out before the final confrontation.  You condone someone aggressively attacking for "looking at the wrong dude the wrong way" but vilify reasonable self-defense?  I really hope you don't work for the legal system.
 
2013-06-03 04:28:54 PM

elffster: Hmm, it says over 300 posts yet when I come into the thread to read it, it only says 89...I wonder why?


comprehensive ignore list?
 
2013-06-03 04:28:56 PM

Thunderpipes: By Gangsta, I mean pot dealing, theft, getting kicked out of school, and jumping a guy for fun.


Dealing? Cite please.
Jumping a guy for FUN? Cite please?

I am not aware of anything that has been presented that puts Martin substantially out of the norm for your average white suburban kid of any reace or ethnicity.
 
2013-06-03 04:29:33 PM

Tatsuma: Triple Oak: You can tell the defense is trending towards implausible white superiority,

He's not white when will farking idiots try to pretend that he is? For fark's sake this is a white guy?


Well he's not black and that's enough for some people. There are a lot of people who seem to think they know exactly what happened and those who are far right politically know that Zimmerman is 100% innocent and those that are far left know that Zimmerman is 100% guilty.

The Freepers know Zimmerman is not only innocent but a hero for standing up to a bad black man and a good example of why we should all be heavily armed at all times. They even compiled a list of "the facts that we here on Free Republic know to be true." Apparently only facts that point to Zimmerman being innocent are known to be true.
 
2013-06-03 04:30:07 PM

AngryDragon: You couldn't possibly have been wrong on any more of your points.


(You might want to adjust your sarcasm meter)
 
2013-06-03 04:31:17 PM

BojanglesPaladin: Elegy: So no, I wouldn't do what it is alleged that Trayvon did.

FTF&Y.


Are you suggesting Zimmerman beat himself up?
 
2013-06-03 04:31:36 PM
Half-white guy is elected president: C-C-C-COMBO BREAKER!

Half-white guy shoots a black kid: OMG WHITE RACIST!

Seems consistent.
 
2013-06-03 04:31:42 PM

ongbok: Cataholic: ongbok: Cataholic: ongbok: So chasing after somebody who is running away from you doesn't constitute an intentional, unlawful threat by word or act to do violence? Or running at somebody who is minding their own business?

Be honest here, please.

If someone comes running toward me, I don't automatically assume they are going to kill me.  Maybe I dropped my wallet and they are bringing it.  Maybe it's someone who thinks I am their long lost cousin (who looks a lot like me).  Maybe they are running from someone else and are coming to me to ask for help.  Maybe you think Hispanic people running toward you only want to do violence?

So if you are running away from a person, and they chase you down you won't do anything?

I love the complete dishonesty about this that the pro Zimmerman crowd brings to the argument.

No.  I won't.  Mainly because I don't wish to go to jail.  You have no right to punch someone just because they ran up to you.

You didn't answer the question. i asked you ran away from a person and they chased you and caught up to you would you defend yourself?

But don't worry, you will never answer the question that I asked you, you will just keep deflecting because you know you would do the same thing that Trayvon did.


No.  I would not defend myself just because they caught up to  me.  I'm not sure how much more clear I can be.  You do not have the right to defend yourself (physically) until it becomes evident that the other person is going to harm you.  Paranoid delusions of what someone might do to you because they are chasing after you isn't enough.  As I said earlier, there are plenty of legitimate reasons for someone to need to speak with you.  Punching someone who caught up to you so they could tell you someone just sideswiped your parked car is a crime.
 
2013-06-03 04:32:05 PM

BojanglesPaladin: ongbok: At the point Martin had reason to believe that his life was in danger, and he had every right to defend himself.

I don;t know how you get from "Hey kid!" to life endangerment, but based on your comments, you DO seem to be arguing that becasue Martin was being "chased" he was fully entitled to adminsiter a beating to Zimmerman. Fine.

But if being chased and yelled at entitles you to beat someone, surely getting physically attacked and beaten entitles a man to defend themselves as well?

Or should Zimmerman have simply said "Whelp! This head to concrete things and the broken nose sure do smart, but I guess I had it coming. After all, I did chase after the fellah. I sure do hope that he stops bludgeoning me soon. I already need medical attention, I just hope he stops before I die".

You have NO IDEA what actually went down, and neither do I.

I just find it odd that you seem to support a violent response to being chased, but apparantly NOT a violent response to being beaten. That seems weird to me.


We do have some idea of what happened. First we know that Trayvon ran away from Zimmerman. We know this because Zimmerman said so. We know that Zimmerman was mad because he ran away. We know this because Zimmerman said so. We also know that Zimmerman continued to pursue Trayvon. We know this because of where the confrontation happened.
 
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