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(Daily Herald)   Reminding the students you teach that they are also protected by the 5th amendment? That's a suspendin'   (dailyherald.com) divider line 156
    More: Asinine, Batavia, chief academic officer, John Dryden, current affairs  
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15632 clicks; posted to Main » on 26 May 2013 at 4:41 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-05-26 04:26:17 PM
SEE! Obama's brown shirts have infiltrated our skoolz.
 
2013-05-26 04:45:32 PM

jehovahs witness protection: SEE! Obama's brown shirts have infiltrated our skoolz.


You're trying too hard kid.
 
2013-05-26 04:46:46 PM
Area teacher abides
www.dailyherald.com
 
2013-05-26 04:47:02 PM
Dealing with BS from the State level is why my Dad jumped at the early retirement offer when it was offered. Who the heck thought that asking these kinds of questions in an non-anonymous manner was a good idea?
 
2013-05-26 04:50:08 PM

Mrtraveler01: jehovahs witness protection: SEE! Obama's brown shirts have infiltrated our skoolz.

You're trying too hard kid.


Dyd eye speel two guud?
 
2013-05-26 04:51:30 PM
If Clarence Thomas had his way, none of those students would have any Constitutional rights until they hit their 18th birthday.
 
2013-05-26 04:53:15 PM
The answer is always C, so what's the big deal?
 
2013-05-26 04:53:52 PM
The school is teaching these kids some valuable lesson: Grownups can't be trusted. And people with power act arbitrarily and capriciously.
 
2013-05-26 04:53:55 PM
and the contents are proprietary business information

Why yes, Virginia, targeted assassinations by legitimate businessmen or mob hits as they are know on the street are proprietary business information.

And collusion by a government official with a private business to deprive a protected group of their Constitutional rights is going to sell a lot of Depends to that school board.

elizabethemkenussenate2012.files.wordpress.com
 
2013-05-26 04:54:07 PM

jaytkay: Area teacher abides
[www.dailyherald.com image 170x247]


^5..
First thing I thought of as soon as I saw his picture
 
2013-05-26 04:54:30 PM
*lessons. Dang incomplete rewrites.
 
2013-05-26 04:55:15 PM
This will be an invaluable civics lesson for his students. Hopefully.
 
2013-05-26 04:55:45 PM
So when will the ACLU be raided for interfering with the educational process?

/because there's some administrator/school system that would ramp that up to SCOTUS if given a legal warchest
 
2013-05-26 04:56:30 PM

jehovahs witness protection: Mrtraveler01: jehovahs witness protection: SEE! Obama's brown shirts have infiltrated our skoolz.

You're trying too hard kid.

Dyd eye speel two guud?


Perhaps, but changing Obama to 0bama would have improved your score. We would have also accepted Fartbongo Antichrist Bin Laden.
 
2013-05-26 04:59:44 PM
School district officials declined to provide a copy of the survey to the Daily Herald, saying the district bought the survey from a private company, Multi-Health Systems Inc., and the contents are proprietary business information.

The publicity person who said that with a straight face deserve some type of award and then the superintendent some type of firing for being a dumbass.
 
2013-05-26 05:00:43 PM
Fifth amendment?  I'm gonna go with no.

"...nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself..."

This is not a criminal case.  Fifth amendment right does not apply.  That being said, any student certainly has the right to call bullshiat on a survey and refuse to answer.  It's just not a bill of rights issue.
 
2013-05-26 05:01:35 PM

Anderson's Pooper: Dealing with BS from the State level is why my Dad jumped at the early retirement offer when it was offered. Who the heck thought that asking these kinds of questions in an non-anonymous manner was a good idea?


I should say.  Any survey like that I saw in school had, at best, questions on your gender and maybe racial background.  Having your name on the test is just retarded.
 
2013-05-26 05:01:48 PM

Mega Steve: jehovahs witness protection: Mrtraveler01: jehovahs witness protection: SEE! Obama's brown shirts have infiltrated our skoolz.

You're trying too hard kid.

Dyd eye speel two guud?

Perhaps, but changing Obama to 0bama would have improved your score. We would have also accepted Fartbongo Antichrist Bin Laden.


Taking notes. Thanks!
I'm new at this whole trolling thing.
 
2013-05-26 05:03:04 PM

Radak: Fifth amendment?  I'm gonna go with no.

"...nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself..."

This is not a criminal case.  Fifth amendment right does not apply.  That being said, any student certainly has the right to call bullshiat on a survey and refuse to answer.  It's just not a bill of rights issue.


Sounds like a second amendment solution is needed, to me.

Click-click
 
2013-05-26 05:03:45 PM
The question really is, who gets custody of the data once it is collected?  Will it be available to mine by third parties (I have a feeling it will).  So, yes.  The teacher was right to bring up that point.  Not so much that underaged drinking and sex are probably going to be documented.  But the other personal medical information that can be gleaned.
 
2013-05-26 05:08:07 PM
I junderstand teachers and school officials concern about the childrens wefare. But it seems they should have known better than to think it would be OK to collect potentially damaging info without making sure the kids and parents were made fully aware.
 
2013-05-26 05:10:21 PM
social-emotional learning standards

What the fark does that even mean in English?
 
2013-05-26 05:14:39 PM

jehovahs witness protection: Mega Steve: jehovahs witness protection: Mrtraveler01: jehovahs witness protection: SEE! Obama's brown shirts have infiltrated our skoolz.

You're trying too hard kid.

Dyd eye speel two guud?

Perhaps, but changing Obama to 0bama would have improved your score. We would have also accepted Fartbongo Antichrist Bin Laden.

Taking notes. Thanks!
I'm new at this whole trolling thing.


Also, if you really want bites, put it in the trolling tab.
 
2013-05-26 05:14:59 PM

jaytkay: Area teacher abides
[www.dailyherald.com image 170x247]


Very Dudish quote, too:  "I'm not a martyr," he said. "I'm trying to refocus people's attentions. Calm down."
 
2013-05-26 05:15:32 PM

meanmutton: jehovahs witness protection: Mega Steve: jehovahs witness protection: Mrtraveler01: jehovahs witness protection: SEE! Obama's brown shirts have infiltrated our skoolz.

You're trying too hard kid.

Dyd eye speel two guud?

Perhaps, but changing Obama to 0bama would have improved your score. We would have also accepted Fartbongo Antichrist Bin Laden.

Taking notes. Thanks!
I'm new at this whole trolling thing.

Also, if you really want bites, put it in the trolling tab.


Politics tab. Freudian slip.
 
2013-05-26 05:15:50 PM
Of course, there's this:

The survey is part of measuring how students meet the social-emotional learning standards set by the state.

So now teachers are not only responsible for teaching to the test on math, spelling, things like that; they ALSO have to teach to a test about whether your child has developed the proper social skills and emotional bullshiat that the school district feels essential for his/her grade level?

And they're worried about what The Dude taught instead?
 
2013-05-26 05:15:55 PM
Ahahahaha.... anyone who thinks that the kids who answered yes on the drug/alcohol questions weren't going to be name-dropped to the cop stationed in the school are delusional.

Of course, it would never be in writing, but names would be mentioned.
 
2013-05-26 05:16:05 PM
FTA: "We can't help them if we aren't aware of their needs,"

Heard this in my head with evil Nazi accent. "Vee simply vant to help help zee juden azzimilate mit Der brethren in zee beautiful vork camps."
 
2013-05-26 05:16:21 PM

Anderson's Pooper: Dealing with BS from the State level is why my Dad jumped at the early retirement offer when it was offered. Who the heck thought that asking these kinds of questions in an non-anonymous manner was a good idea?


One of the most intelligence-impaired species on the planet.  School officials.
And we put these mental midgets in charge of educating our kids,

There really needs to be a website set up. Call it "StupidSchoolBoardTricks.com"

And the internet can ridicule and shame these individuals because that's the only way the system can be fixed.
 
2013-05-26 05:17:19 PM

dj_bigbird: social-emotional learning standards

What the fark does that even mean in English?


The short: they want to parent your kids for you, substituting their values on drugs, sex, violence, and dangerous activities for yours.
 
2013-05-26 05:17:24 PM
The surveys included the names of the students?

Yeah, they're going to be 100% truthful there.
 
2013-05-26 05:19:14 PM

ClavellBCMI: If Clarence Thomas had his way, none of those students would have any Constitutional rights until they hit their 18th birthday.


Can they be aborted?
 
2013-05-26 05:19:28 PM

Radak: Fifth amendment?  I'm gonna go with no.

"...nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself..."

This is not a criminal case.  Fifth amendment right does not apply.  That being said, any student certainly has the right to call bullshiat on a survey and refuse to answer.  It's just not a bill of rights issue.


From Barron's Law Dictionary:

SELF-INCRIMINATION, PRIVILEGE AGAINST the constitutional right of a person to refuse to answer questions or otherwise give testimony against himself or herself which will subject him or her to an incrimination. This right under the Fifth Amendment (often called simply PLEADING THE FIFTH) is now applicable to the states through the due process clause of the Fourteenth Amendment, 378 U.S. 1,8, and is applicable in any situation, civil or criminal where the state attempts to compel incriminating testimony. (There are many caveats following this section.)
 
2013-05-26 05:22:26 PM

HighlanderRPI: Ahahahaha.... anyone who thinks that the kids who answered yes on the drug/alcohol questions weren't going to be name-dropped to the cop stationed in the school are delusional.

Of course, it would never be in writing, but names would be mentioned.


symptomoftheuniverse: FTA: "We can't help them if we aren't aware of their needs,"

Heard this in my head with evil Nazi accent. "Vee simply vant to help help zee juden azzimilate mit Der brethren in zee beautiful vork camps."


These.
 
2013-05-26 05:24:30 PM

Radak: Fifth amendment?  I'm gonna go with no.

"...nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself..."

This is not a criminal case.  Fifth amendment right does not apply.


The Supreme Court a long time ago expanded the use of the 5A beyond criminal cases; it basically now means any testimony under oath. The situation here is a complicated one both because they are students and because it is not clear to me what legal effect filling out the survey has under the law of that state. The 5A might apply and it might not.

My gut reaction is that the state probably has a legal right to force them to take the survey but has no legal basis for forcing them to fill it out honestly.
 
2013-05-26 05:25:06 PM

Radak: Fifth amendment?  I'm gonna go with no.

"...nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself..."

This is not a criminal case.  Fifth amendment right does not apply.  That being said, any student certainly has the right to call bullshiat on a survey and refuse to answer.  It's just not a bill of rights issue.


Yet.  Considering that authorities can lie to you to get evidence, the only smart move is to answer anything even remotely incriminating with "I plead the Fifth". "This is not a criminal proceeding" is to be countered with "(1) And you are able to prove that negative with 100% certainty how?, and (2) I plan to keep it that way."  Considering the general chuckle-farkery of the US law enforcement apparatus and the courts' erosion of defendant rights, I would invoke the Fifth when the cops came to talk to me as the  victim of a crime.  It may not apply in all instances, but better to invoke it when it is not needed, than to not invoke it when it is.
 
2013-05-26 05:26:10 PM
FTFA: "The survey is part of measuring how students meet the social-emotional learning standards set by the state."

Social-emotional learning standards?  WTF is that about?
 
2013-05-26 05:26:21 PM

editer: The school is teaching these kids some valuable lesson: Grownups can't be trusted. And people with power act arbitrarily and capriciously.


When I was a kid we taught kids that lesson by drafting them and sending them to Vietnam.
 
2013-05-26 05:27:06 PM

meanmutton: meanmutton: jehovahs witness protection: Mega Steve: jehovahs witness protection: Mrtraveler01: jehovahs witness protection: SEE! Obama's brown shirts have infiltrated our skoolz.

You're trying too hard kid.

Dyd eye speel two guud?

Perhaps, but changing Obama to 0bama would have improved your score. We would have also accepted Fartbongo Antichrist Bin Laden.

Taking notes. Thanks!
I'm new at this whole trolling thing.

Also, if you really want bites, put it in the trolling tab.

Politics tab. Freudian slip.


LOL
 
2013-05-26 05:27:27 PM
by answering questions on the survey, which had each student's name printed on it.

What the hell? We used similar surveys in the district I worked for and, not only were the surveys not imprinted with students' names, but the students were specifically told to not put their names on them. The few that we got back that did have a name written on it we simply shredded without reading (and certainly not turning them over to the survey agency for inclusion).

Seriously, what the hell?
 
2013-05-26 05:29:05 PM

jacjacatk: and is applicable in any situation, civil or criminal where the state attempts to compel incriminating testimony


[...and others pointing out similar...]

Aha.  I try not to follow much American law, so I wasn't aware of this extension to the words in the constitution.  Thank you all for the education!
 
2013-05-26 05:29:05 PM
Ah, I see the problem:

The results were to be reviewed by school officials, including social workers, counselors and psychologists. The survey was not a diagnostic tool, but a "screener" to figure out which students might need specific help, Newkirk said.

This wasn't one of those national "state of our children" surveys they do; this was this one particular place being incredibly intrusive. "For the children's sake." Uh huh.
 
2013-05-26 05:30:29 PM

Indolent: FTFA: "The survey is part of measuring how students meet the social-emotional learning standards set by the state."

Social-emotional learning standards?  WTF is that about?


Are they good little automatons who blindly follow authority figures.
 
2013-05-26 05:30:45 PM

ArcadianRefugee: by answering questions on the survey, which had each student's name printed on it.

What the hell? We used similar surveys in the district I worked for and, not only were the surveys not imprinted with students' names, but the students were specifically told to not put their names on them. The few that we got back that did have a name written on it we simply shredded without reading (and certainly not turning them over to the survey agency for inclusion).

Seriously, what the hell?


How else will administration know who to flag for expulsion?
 
2013-05-26 05:32:10 PM
The teacher deserves a Hero tag.
 
2013-05-26 05:32:12 PM

Gyrfalcon: social-emotional learning standards set by the state.


That phrase alone is one of the biggest reasons why this nation is doomed....and that a little reset might be a great thing. "The state" has grown far too big for anyone's good.
 
2013-05-26 05:34:21 PM

Indolent: FTFA: "The survey is part of measuring how students meet the social-emotional learning standards set by the state."

Social-emotional learning standards?  WTF is that about?


Do you act like a normal person of your age-group. "Social" meaning you can interact with others in an appropriate manner, and "emotional" that your emotional responses are appropriate to situations.  If, upon meeting a person for the first time, you scream in homicidal rage and start fling your own feces at them, yelling "I will gut you with my bare hands and then use your stomach as a cum-receptacle", you have not met the social-emotional learning standards (not even of pre-K {unless your pre-K is run by Tartars}).

It is jargon-speak for socialization, which schools are supposed to impart unto students
 
2013-05-26 05:35:25 PM

Radak: Fifth amendment?  I'm gonna go with no.

"...nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself..."

This is not a criminal case.  Fifth amendment right does not apply.  That being said, any student certainly has the right to call bullshiat on a survey and refuse to answer.  It's just not a bill of rights issue.



It doesn't have to be a criminal case for the 5th to apply. SCOTUS rulings through the years have established that. For instance, it's not a "criminal case" when a police officer pulls you over while driving and demands you provide him with incriminating statements and yet you are still entitled to your 5th amendment rights.
 
2013-05-26 05:35:55 PM

phalamir: Indolent: FTFA: "The survey is part of measuring how students meet the social-emotional learning standards set by the state."

Social-emotional learning standards?  WTF is that about?

Do you act like a normal person of your age-group. "Social" meaning you can interact with others in an appropriate manner, and "emotional" that your emotional responses are appropriate to situations.  If, upon meeting a person for the first time, you scream in homicidal rage and start fling your own feces at them, yelling "I will gut you with my bare hands and then use your stomach as a cum-receptacle", you have not met the social-emotional learning standards (not even of pre-K {unless your pre-K is run by Tartars}).

It is jargon-speak for socialization, which schools are supposed to impart unto students


Yeah I know and that's fine.  WTF is the state doing setting a standard for that?
 
2013-05-26 05:36:35 PM

taurusowner: Gyrfalcon: social-emotional learning standards set by the state.

That phrase alone is one of the biggest reasons why this nation is doomed....and that a little reset might be a great thing. "The state" has grown far too big for anyone's good.


Really?  Because my N Florida rural redneck school in the 70s and 80s did this.  It was called "teaching you manners", and I don't seem to recall parents being up in arms that the school wasn't Thunderdome
 
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