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(Slate)   Working parents who leave the office early are getting away with an "unfair practice" and are "killing office morale." Well, according to the people without kids who are just pissed they can't leave early   (slate.com) divider line 264
    More: Fail, working parent, Emily Yoffe, vacation time  
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6063 clicks; posted to Main » on 24 May 2013 at 6:42 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-05-24 04:01:50 PM  

Fear the Clam: Okay, why do watermelons have fancy weddings? Because they cantaloupe.


WATERMELON!

CANTELOUPE!


rhubarbrhubarb rhubarb rhubarb rhubarb rhubarb rhubarb

/obscure?
 
2013-05-24 05:07:30 PM  
Well I've never worked in an office, but...one of my old jobs involved pooling tips to split between everyone at the end of the week based on hours worked, and I was typically the one who counted up all the money and handed it out to people. The one woman in the joint who had kids (and therefore was obviously usually late, called out often, had to leave early all the time, blah blah) used to come up to me as I was counting the money and start acting all friendly and chatty and slip in "Hey so, when you hand out the money, please make sure you remember that I have two kids..." Haha farking really? That was a kick.
 
2013-05-24 05:09:49 PM  

wolfpaq777: The beauty of at-will employment, which we have in all 50 states of the USA, is that you can quit your job at any time for any reason and move on to something better.


Unless you have a non-compete that prevents you from doing that.  Luckily they're nigh-unenforceable in California.
 
2013-05-24 05:19:19 PM  
I mean, this entire article/threadrant is basically more the fault of the management culture at wherever this person works. I've worked at places that were great, very equitable. As long as things were covered, single parents, paired parents, single folks, whoever, as long as the work was getting done, you could get some time off if you needed it. I even was able to get a couple of months off because of a medical emergency in the family that required my presence in another city to make medical decisions.

But I do sympathise with the person in the article, because I've also been in places with, what can best be termed "activist" management. Where married folks, folks with kids, people with boyfriends and girlfriends, etc are all consistently given the best shifts, the most leniency with time off, etc, and the singletons get SHAFTED with odd shifts, working holidays so the people with "Families" can spend them with their families(because having a wife and kids is the only definition of family, right). Working odd hour shifts because "hey, you don't have anything going on anyway and all these people do". It's been a couple of years and I still want to punch that guy in the dick.

I've also had a manager straight up tell me that a job me and guywithnewbaby were both going for went to him because he needed it more being a new father despite the fact that I was the better performer, with nearly twice his work output. I being a single person without kids didn't need the job as much. So I got to stay where i was. I always suspected there was something flat out illegal about that, but I was too busy working 60hr weeks there, and too broke at the time to actually pursue it, and then they went out of business.

So I guess to sum up, good management can be good. Bad management is bad.
 
2013-05-24 05:56:07 PM  

neongoats: Where married folks, folks with kids, people with boyfriends and girlfriends, etc are all consistently given the best shifts, the most leniency with time off, etc



Really?  That's kind of random.  Meanwhile I'd rather work through the night than leave for any of the reasons parents have to suddenly leave.
 
2013-05-24 06:03:58 PM  

Abox: neongoats: Where married folks, folks with kids, people with boyfriends and girlfriends, etc are all consistently given the best shifts, the most leniency with time off, etc


Really?  That's kind of random.  Meanwhile I'd rather work through the night than leave for any of the reasons parents have to suddenly leave.


They were a couple that worked together. Sat together. Ate lunch together. So any change to one, without an identical change to the other and both would throw a fit

I did enjoy working at night, once I really learned what the culture of the company was. Visibility over work output, etc. And eventually left the company. Will never, ever, EVER work for a similarly large company again.
 
2013-05-24 06:30:10 PM  

mat catastrophe: No one bothers to ask why we still cling to a stupid concept like the 40-hour week.

No one questions why we no longer live in a country where most families can get by with only one parent working.


because feminism?
/and the Israel Palestine conflict
//and AssBurger's and the DSM-5
///and your mom
 
2013-05-24 07:06:12 PM  

coco ebert: I study work life in America. It's not as simple as "look elsewhere for a better deal". That presumes a marketplace chock full of an excess of choices. If there were so many excellent jobs with excellent benefits there wouldn't be so many posts such as the ones above.


It presumes no such thing.  Everything is a trade-off.  If holiday work requirements are of a high enough priority to you, you'll get a job where you get holidays off.  If you couldn't get a job that is as good in terms of salary or other considerations without those requirements, then that difference is the premium you are being paid for them.
 
2013-05-24 08:32:38 PM  

hubiestubert: It's called teamwork. Try it. Or maybe you can whine that you're not getting your cookie at the same time that others are. Because that's so attractive and shows your willingness to be a part of team...


Oh fark you.  It because of the MASSIVE IMBALANCE that people complain.  It's never teamwork, it's always the people with children taking advantage of the people without children, and the people without children never get fair consideration of their "personal needs".  Managers are frankly scared of challenging parents, and they figure they have nothing to lose by squeezing the lost productivity out of everyone else.

If it was fair my non-childed co-worker wouldn't have had to threaten legal action to be allowed to use her contractually guaranteed domestic leave to care for her dying mother (who was her dependent, and therefore fell under the "domestic leave" policy), when the parents are always dodging out without warning for often spurious child-related this and that and the other.  If it was fair my non-childed co-worker who is working on his degree would not have to use vacation leave to leave an hour early for class once a week, when there are parents who leave early or arrive late every week but are allowed to use "flex" time to do so.  Flex time is supposed to be for everyone's benefit.  Just don't try to use it if you don't have kids.

I am one of those people who always works through holiday periods so people with kids can take them away on a trip or look after them at home.   At Christmas that leaves me doing the work of four people for a few weeks.  Frankly I am sick to the back teeth of carrying other people's workload when because of their "personal commitments" they can never help me with mine, even after I've got behind in my own work because I've been doing theirs.

I am sick of the mummy who sits next to me "needing help" with her work after spending not insignificant time on the phone and texting every single day about or to her children, and getting to use "needing to pick up the kids" to leave early every day and therefore kicking some project meetings that should be her responsibility over to me because they happen after she's left. Her kids could get home fine on their own by taking a bus and walking.  She just doesn't want to make them (her kids are going to be helpless when they grow up).

And "as long as the work gets done" is also bullshiat.  My workplace clearly under resources on staffing deliberately.  There is always too much work to do for the number of staff we have.  So when the parents abuse their privilege, this makes the non-childed extra bitter because now there's even more "too much work" to do for those left.
 
2013-05-24 10:07:48 PM  

if_i_really_have_to: hubiestubert: It's called teamwork. Try it. Or maybe you can whine that you're not getting your cookie at the same time that others are. Because that's so attractive and shows your willingness to be a part of team...

Oh fark you.  It because of the MASSIVE IMBALANCE that people complain.  It's never teamwork, it's always the people with children taking advantage of the people without children, and the people without children never get fair consideration of their "personal needs".  Managers are frankly scared of challenging parents, and they figure they have nothing to lose by squeezing the lost productivity out of everyone else.

If it was fair my non-childed co-worker wouldn't have had to threaten legal action to be allowed to use her contractually guaranteed domestic leave to care for her dying mother (who was her dependent, and therefore fell under the "domestic leave" policy), when the parents are always dodging out without warning for often spurious child-related this and that and the other.  If it was fair my non-childed co-worker who is working on his degree would not have to use vacation leave to leave an hour early for class once a week, when there are parents who leave early or arrive late every week but are allowed to use "flex" time to do so.  Flex time is supposed to be for everyone's benefit.  Just don't try to use it if you don't have kids.

I am one of those people who always works through holiday periods so people with kids can take them away on a trip or look after them at home.   At Christmas that leaves me doing the work of four people for a few weeks.  Frankly I am sick to the back teeth of carrying other people's workload when because of their "personal commitments" they can never help me with mine, even after I've got behind in my own work because I've been doing theirs.

I am sick of the mummy who sits next to me "needing help" with her work after spending not insignificant time on the phone and texting every single day about or to her child ...


That rant is exactly why you are Farkied like you. Thanks for not failing me.
 
2013-05-25 12:27:20 AM  
I've seen just as many single/childless managers get all crotchy about subordinates with kids taking more sick days than the norm, etc, as I have the type of favoritism everyone is biatching about in this thread. It can cut both ways, you know. Everyone who speaks of an open, honest management culture that recognizes "hey, shiat happens" and cares more about output than clocks has it right.

In fact one time, my childless boss wanted me to make a strike against my supervisee in her annual review because "she was taking a lot of sick days for her kids." Well, she only used exactly what she was allotted (though she was always right near the limit) and most importantly, she got shiat done, and did quality work. What exactly was I supposed to ding her on?

It cuts both ways, that's all I'm saying.
 
2013-05-25 12:53:57 AM  

Pontious Pilates: I've seen just as many single/childless managers get all crotchy about subordinates with kids taking more sick days than the norm, etc, as I have the type of favoritism everyone is biatching about in this thread. It can cut both ways, you know. Everyone who speaks of an open, honest management culture that recognizes "hey, shiat happens" and cares more about output than clocks has it right.

In fact one time, my childless boss wanted me to make a strike against my supervisee in her annual review because "she was taking a lot of sick days for her kids." Well, she only used exactly what she was allotted (though she was always right near the limit) and most importantly, she got shiat done, and did quality work. What exactly was I supposed to ding her on?

It cuts both ways, that's all I'm saying.


I was at a company years ago that tried that, but the single folks were taking sick days for hangovers, and running up against the same sick day limit.  I asked why we were trying to penalize people for taking their allocated leave.  No one had an answer.

I still get a chuckle when one of my employees calls in and leaves a voice mail at 4am - "I'm too drunk to be worthwhile tomorrow, I'm taking a sick day."  It's perfectly fine and within their rights since everyone has 10 sick days to take each year.  I don't even need to know they are drunk - they just have to ask for a sick day.  But they like to brag about it.

All I've ever asked from any employee is to give me notice ahead of time before the morning starts, and to make sure their work is covered.  I've had a few occasions where someone wasn't doing their work and was calling in sick, but that's easily corrected.  They learn early on that as long as you have your work covered, you can get blottoed on Tuesday, fark the random French chick at the bar, and take Wednesday off.  But if you can't cover your work, or I don't know your status?  That's a firing.

The parents are a different breed.  They frequently have to take off early for unexpected crises with their kids, but I'll ask them to volunteer for weekend overnight work to compensate.  They can do it from home, but it lets someone else younger off the hook so they can go out and drink, fark, and be merry.

If you manage it all correctly, no one feels like they are getting the shaft.
 
2013-05-25 09:20:50 AM  

Pontious Pilates: I've seen just as many single/childless managers get all crotchy about subordinates with kids taking more sick days than the norm, etc, as I have the type of favoritism everyone is biatching about in this thread. It can cut both ways, you know.


But that is the fairer behavior right...not allowing anyone to take excessive time off?  Although I do agree that a boss complaining about someone taking their alloted days off is strange...our management actually encourages us to burn our remaining time off at year end so we don't lose it.  Where I work it's pretty common for folks on the fringe, either kid related or just high drama types, to go over their allotment.  They usually have other issues though and the attendance just ends up being the easy get for termination.
 
2013-05-25 11:51:34 AM  
I can sympathize with Walker.  I, too, have a specific time commitment I'm under because of co-workers.  Team of 2 people, 1 is supposed to be the early person, 1 working the late shift - 5 hour overlap.  They start out trading off every month, then all of a sudden 1 decides he's not going to pay for after-school care and is claiming the non-child-having co-worker is going to have to have to take the late shift so he can leave and pick up his kids.  Non-child-having co-worker complains to HR, and rather than management dealing with the problem, now BOTH of them work the early shift and I spend an extra hour a day in traffic, as well as the extra money for gas and parking going downtown (which boss says I can't expense because "you work where we tell you"), just so I can be available to answer a phone for 30 minutes a day from 5:00-5:30pm.  So no leaving early for me at all.

As far as vacations, out of the four people in my immediate group that can't schedule PTO at the same time, two of them have school-age kids and they're always bickering about who is taking off spring break and around Christmas.  More than once I've had to sit in a meeting with all of us and management and remind all of them that it doesn't matter that they have kids, they can't be given preferential treatment for time off if someone else asked first.  Both of them act like if they work it out between *themselves*, then that's all that matters.

/fark your "precious memories I'll never get to have again because they're only six once"
 
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