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(Extreme Tech)   My cold fusion device has 10,000 times the energy density of gasoline. No, really. Stop laughing. Guys, I'm serious, stop laughing   (extremetech.com) divider line 100
    More: Unlikely  
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5209 clicks; posted to Geek » on 22 May 2013 at 7:41 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-05-22 06:00:37 PM  
Can it generate up to 1.21 gigawatts?
 
2013-05-22 06:00:44 PM  
But what happens when it goes ka-boom?
 
2013-05-22 06:05:08 PM  

bluorangefyre: But what happens when it goes ka-boom?


They don't go kaboom. They just quit.
 
2013-05-22 06:11:14 PM  

Old_Chief_Scott: bluorangefyre: But what happens when it goes ka-boom?

They don't go kaboom. They just quit.


A ka-boom. There is supposed to be an earth-shattering ka-boom!

www.fedupusa.org
 
2013-05-22 06:14:16 PM  

Old_Chief_Scott: bluorangefyre: But what happens when it goes ka-boom?

They don't go kaboom. They just quit.


Oh really?
www.imcdb.org

\movies are always accurate right?
 
2013-05-22 06:17:59 PM  
Rossi has been claiming for the past two years that he had finally cracked cold fusion, but much to the chagrin of the scientific community he hasn't allowed anyone to independently analyze the device

Why do all these cold fusion discoverers always refuse to have their tests peer reviewed until they are a laughing stock?
 
2013-05-22 06:33:53 PM  
If it's a 30 hr. old article from ExtremeTech and you haven't heard a peep from the rest of the scientific community, you know it's true as steel.
 
2013-05-22 06:53:10 PM  

Dinki: Rossi has been claiming for the past two years that he had finally cracked cold fusion, but much to the chagrin of the scientific community he hasn't allowed anyone to independently analyze the device

Why do all these cold fusion discoverers always refuse to have their tests peer reviewed until they are a laughing stock?


Why did you cut off the end of the sentence? " -- until now."  Now, I don't know enough about any of this to even begin to discuss the technical validity of his claims, but "seven scientists, all from good European universities, obviously felt confident enough with their findings to publish the research paper" probably do.  My interest is at least piqued.  Hell, the fact is that if this is real, it should bring on the biggest shift in humanity since... well, ever.  And it would be really interesting to see what happens to oil rich countries when their primary source of income is rendered nearly valueless.  There will always be a need for petroleum, but something like this would relegate it to plastics and other non-energy uses.
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2013-05-22 07:03:59 PM  

gameshowhost: If it's a 30 hr. old article from ExtremeTech and you haven't heard a peep from the rest of the scientific community, you know it's true as steel.


That's because the scientific community laughed it off long ago.
 
2013-05-22 07:07:17 PM  

timujin: Dinki: Rossi has been claiming for the past two years that he had finally cracked cold fusion, but much to the chagrin of the scientific community he hasn't allowed anyone to independently analyze the device

Why do all these cold fusion discoverers always refuse to have their tests peer reviewed until they are a laughing stock?

Why did you cut off the end of the sentence? " -- until now."  Now, I don't know enough about any of this to even begin to discuss the technical validity of his claims, but "seven scientists, all from good European universities, obviously felt confident enough with their findings to publish the research paper" probably do.  My interest is at least piqued.  Hell, the fact is that if this is real, it should bring on the biggest shift in humanity since... well, ever.  And it would be really interesting to see what happens to oil rich countries when their primary source of income is rendered nearly valueless.  There will always be a need for petroleum, but something like this would relegate it to plastics and other non-energy uses.


The onus is kinda on the guy who proclaims to have invented a device 100 others proclaimed to have invented in the past, when all 100 of the previous declarants were lying.

/dnrtfa
 
2013-05-22 07:17:34 PM  
Rossi again? Yeah, I thought I'd read about this a couple years ago.

If neutron capture is taking place, there should be farktons of gamma coming out of it, and it should be (relatively) easy to look at the isotopic ratios of the copper supposedly created within the device and compare it with the isotopic ratios of the copper found naturally on earth. Count me among the skeptics until proven otherwise.
 
2013-05-22 07:23:39 PM  

timujin: but "seven scientists, all from good European universities


Seven un-named scientists from unspecified but "good" universities have written a paper that may or may not have actually been submitted for peer-review (just putting it on arXiv doesn't mean anything).

Sounds totally legit.
 
2013-05-22 07:41:24 PM  

vpb: gameshowhost: If it's a 30 hr. old article from ExtremeTech and you haven't heard a peep from the rest of the scientific community, you know it's true as steel.

That's because the scientific community laughed it off long ago.


*sobbing* ... that shred of hope... gone...

:P
 
2013-05-22 07:44:52 PM  

timujin: Dinki: Rossi has been claiming for the past two years that he had finally cracked cold fusion, but much to the chagrin of the scientific community he hasn't allowed anyone to independently analyze the device

Why do all these cold fusion discoverers always refuse to have their tests peer reviewed until they are a laughing stock?

Why did you cut off the end of the sentence? " -- until now."  Now, I don't know enough about any of this to even begin to discuss the technical validity of his claims, but "seven scientists, all from good European universities, obviously felt confident enough with their findings to publish the research paper" probably do.  My interest is at least piqued.  Hell, the fact is that if this is real, it should bring on the biggest shift in humanity since... well, ever.  And it would be really interesting to see what happens to oil rich countries when their primary source of income is rendered nearly valueless.  There will always be a need for petroleum, but something like this would relegate it to plastics and other non-energy uses.


Your PocketNinja impression is indeed a good one sir.
 
2013-05-22 07:53:17 PM  
I'm sure it's 100% bs. Why be secretive about it? For profit? The world would fete the man who gave it technology like this with a million hot women and all the free anything he could ever want forever, without him having to form a company himself or actually sell a farking thing.
 
2013-05-22 07:54:58 PM  
A. Cold fusion does not exist. Rossi has been convicted of fraud several times and served jail time in Italy for one spectacular scam that took years and millions of Euros to clean up.

B. Companies (like Mitsubishi, Toyota and US agencies like JPL) that are working on Low Energy Nuclear Reactions are very much at the laboratory stage, but are getting reproducible results.
 
2013-05-22 07:55:42 PM  
Key phrase: "hasn't yet undergone peer review".

We're done here.
 
2013-05-22 07:59:36 PM  
...total protonic reversal?
 
2013-05-22 08:01:38 PM  
Cold fusion has been around a while... it's just ridiculously expensive and impractical... which, for the moment, totally defeats the whole purpose.
 
2013-05-22 08:02:37 PM  
The fawning credulity in that article is a sight to behold.
 
2013-05-22 08:02:41 PM  

Three Crooked Squirrels: timujin: Dinki: Rossi has been claiming for the past two years that he had finally cracked cold fusion, but much to the chagrin of the scientific community he hasn't allowed anyone to independently analyze the device

Why do all these cold fusion discoverers always refuse to have their tests peer reviewed until they are a laughing stock?

Why did you cut off the end of the sentence? " -- until now."  Now, I don't know enough about any of this to even begin to discuss the technical validity of his claims, but "seven scientists, all from good European universities, obviously felt confident enough with their findings to publish the research paper" probably do.  My interest is at least piqued.  Hell, the fact is that if this is real, it should bring on the biggest shift in humanity since... well, ever.  And it would be really interesting to see what happens to oil rich countries when their primary source of income is rendered nearly valueless.  There will always be a need for petroleum, but something like this would relegate it to plastics and other non-energy uses.

The onus is kinda on the guy who proclaims to have invented a device 100 others proclaimed to have invented in the past, when all 100 of the previous declarants were lying.

/dnrtfa


The technologies of failure have failed, we must make them work again.
 
2013-05-22 08:04:28 PM  

jake3988: Cold fusion has been around a while... it's just ridiculously expensive and impractical... which, for the moment, totally defeats the whole purpose.


Citation required.
 
2013-05-22 08:08:56 PM  

t3knomanser: timujin: but "seven scientists, all from good European universities

Seven un-named scientists from unspecified but "good" universities have written a paper that may or may not have actually been submitted for peer-review (just putting it on arXiv doesn't mean anything).

Sounds totally legit.


Here is the paper. All duly referenced and posted by Cornell Univ.

http://arxiv.org/abs/1305.3913
 
2013-05-22 08:09:05 PM  
Ok I just set fire to my pickup truck as obviously I will be able to get a new one that runs on this cold fusion reactor tomorrow right?

/Anyone have a fire extinguisher?
 
2013-05-22 08:16:45 PM  

neongoats: I'm sure it's 100% bs. Why be secretive about it? For profit? The energy companies would kill world would fete the man who gave it technology like this with a million hot suns women and all the free anything eternal hell he could ever want forever, without him having to form a company himself or actually sell a farking thing.


Or this?   I mean, I am not saying I believe that someone has secret engine that run on tap water, or this assertion holds much merit, but, if someone did, I would be walking very carefully with it considering the types of people who would go down hard.
 
2013-05-22 08:19:58 PM  

dletter: neongoats: I'm sure it's 100% bs. Why be secretive about it? For profit? The energy companies would kill world would fete the man who gave it technology like this with a million hot suns women and all the free anything eternal hell he could ever want forever, without him having to form a company himself or actually sell a farking thing.

Or this?   I mean, I am not saying I believe that someone has secret engine that run on tap water, or this assertion holds much merit, but, if someone did, I would be walking very carefully with it considering the types of people who would go down hard.


Screw that.  I'd very publicly auction it off to the highest bidder under condition that they have to use the technology.  Al large company (say Exxon) buys it, licences it out and phases out oil.  They win (make huge money without the stress of drilling and refining and we get our wonder car.
 
2013-05-22 08:20:16 PM  

neongoats: I'm sure it's 100% bs. Why be secretive about it? For profit? The world would fete the man who gave it technology like this with a million hot women and all the free anything he could ever want forever, without him having to form a company himself or actually sell a farking thing.


Or it would just kill him and take it.

Or kill him and destroy it.

/the world is a harsh place. Those in power like things to stay that way.
 
2013-05-22 08:22:23 PM  

czetie: jake3988: Cold fusion has been around a while... it's just ridiculously expensive and impractical... which, for the moment, totally defeats the whole purpose.

Citation required.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyroelectric_fusion

Luddite.
 
2013-05-22 08:25:23 PM  
fc08.deviantart.net
 
2013-05-22 08:25:41 PM  

SurfaceTension: Old_Chief_Scott: bluorangefyre: But what happens when it goes ka-boom?

They don't go kaboom. They just quit.

A ka-boom. There is supposed to be an earth-shattering ka-boom!

[www.fedupusa.org image 222x303]


No ka-boom today.  Maybe ka-boom tomorrow.

/there's always a ka-boom tomorrow
//someone's gotta keep some damn perspective around here
 
2013-05-22 08:25:45 PM  

neongoats: I'm sure it's 100% bs. Why be secretive about it? For profit? The world would fete the man who gave it technology like this with a million hot women and all the free anything he could ever want forever, without him having to form a company himself or actually sell a farking thing.


No, more likely a few venture capitalists would move and "fund" him only to take credit and said accolades while he dies penniless...
 
2013-05-22 08:32:34 PM  

bluorangefyre: But what happens when it goes ka-boom?


Teenagers are like that..

images3.wikia.nocookie.net
 
2013-05-22 08:33:45 PM  
Three Crooked Squirrels:
The onus is kinda on the guy who proclaims to have invented a device 100 others proclaimed to have invented in the past, when all 100 of the previous declarants were lying.

/dnrtfa


Ah,  So there ought to be some trouble, however, when the oil-replacement hits the onus.
 
2013-05-22 08:34:03 PM  

exboyracer: t3knomanser: timujin: but "seven scientists, all from good European universities

Seven un-named scientists from unspecified but "good" universities have written a paper that may or may not have actually been submitted for peer-review (just putting it on arXiv doesn't mean anything).

Sounds totally legit.

Here is the paper. All duly referenced and posted by Cornell Univ.

http://arxiv.org/abs/1305.3913


From the arXiv help page:
Disclaimer: Papers will be entered in the listings in order of receipt on an impartial basis and appearance of a paper is not intended in any way to convey tacit approval of its assumptions, methods, or conclusions by any agent (electronic, mechanical, or other).
 
2013-05-22 08:34:10 PM  

exboyracer: All duly referenced and posted by Cornell Univ.


No. Duly uploaded to arXiv. arXiv is not a journal. It is an archive of papers. Anyone can submit to arXiv, and arXiv wants to be very clear: "appearance of a paper is not intended in any way to convey tacit approval of its assumptions, methods, or conclusions by any agent (electronic, mechanical, or other)".
 
2013-05-22 08:38:42 PM  

bluorangefyre: But what happens when it goes ka-boom?


It destabilizes space-time such that the shockwave from the blast ripples back in time and debunks itself.
 
2013-05-22 08:38:52 PM  

t3knomanser: exboyracer: All duly referenced and posted by Cornell Univ.

No. Duly uploaded to arXiv. arXiv is not a journal. It is an archive of papers. Anyone can submit to arXiv, and arXiv wants to be very clear: "appearance of a paper is not intended in any way to convey tacit approval of its assumptions, methods, or conclusions by any agent (electronic, mechanical, or other)".


Hah! 7 seconds!!!
 
2013-05-22 08:42:01 PM  

neongoats: I'm sure it's 100% bs. Why be secretive about it? For profit? The world would fete the man who gave it technology like this with a million hot women and all the free anything he could ever want forever, without him having to form a company himself or actually sell a farking thing.


The world is run by people who are rich because of the status quo.  And the status quo is oil.

/this is five nines of bullshiat, though
//rounded up
 
2013-05-22 08:42:14 PM  

t3knomanser: timujin: but "seven scientists, all from good European universities

Seven un-named scientists from unspecified but "good" universities have written a paper that may or may not have actually been submitted for peer-review (just putting it on arXiv doesn't mean anything).

Sounds totally legit.


fta:  "The research paper, which hasn't yet undergone peer review, "
 
2013-05-22 08:44:48 PM  
A fb friend of mine fell for this, so I did some reading up. This "independent" test was run in Rossi's lab on Rossi's equipment. The "experts" weren't allowed to touch the device, let alone examine it.
 
2013-05-22 08:47:08 PM  

Snuffybud: t3knomanser: exboyracer: All duly referenced and posted by Cornell Univ.

No. Duly uploaded to arXiv. arXiv is not a journal. It is an archive of papers. Anyone can submit to arXiv, and arXiv wants to be very clear: "appearance of a paper is not intended in any way to convey tacit approval of its assumptions, methods, or conclusions by any agent (electronic, mechanical, or other)".

Hah! 7 seconds!!!


The response was to the poster that said that they were anon investigators without reputations to protect -- they aren't the paper states their names and institutions.  The paper is not peer reviewed but that wasn't the assertion.    It will be very interesting if a peer review bears this out. Very interesting.
 
2013-05-22 08:48:02 PM  
Wow, that is awesome. What's the math look like? Oh, you don't have any math? "Show your work" wasn't just an annoying demand from your highschool math teacher.
 
2013-05-22 08:53:21 PM  
Actually I'd like to say that I would be willing to believe this without releasing any sort of underlying math, or theory or peer reviewed articles. If he could show it working. Publishing a paper and getting it peer reviewed is the quickest way to establish that it's not a scam, but if he wants to just manufacture a bunch of them as Black Box devices that just generate a huge amount of power from some nickel and hydrogen then that's fine too.

(But, of course, neither of these are going to happen.)
 
2013-05-22 08:57:35 PM  

exboyracer: t3knomanser: timujin: but "seven scientists, all from good European universities

Seven un-named scientists from unspecified but "good" universities have written a paper that may or may not have actually been submitted for peer-review (just putting it on arXiv doesn't mean anything).

Sounds totally legit.

Here is the paper. All duly referenced and posted by Cornell Univ.

http://arxiv.org/abs/1305.3913


That paper was a exercise in extreme tap dancing, I can forgive the secrecy around the "additive" that supposedly makes this work but I cannot forgive the lax scrutiny they gave to the test setup, they went into great detail about how they measured the reaction until it came to the gamma readings, those they brushed off with a "contact us if ya want em" note then ran off into more meaningless measurements, why meaningless? because they did not insure that the test was clean, no isolation of the inputs, this test (or pair of tests) was the same as the previous ones where there was a unmeasured ground or neutral wire, when a third party asked about why there was no measuring devices placed on it he was brushed off with a "trust me there is nothing flowing in it" but if ya wanted to fake excess heat the easiest way is to have a extra coil that you energize through the supposed ground wires, the scientists in this trial went to great lengths to verify that the heat output of the two catalyzing coils matched the input but did not monitor the other wires at all as far as I could find when a simple precaution such as a thermal camera trained on the input/output jacks would have shown any anomalous flows as a heat spike in the supposed ground wires, As far as I could tell there was no monitoring of the assembly of the test vessel either which could have uncovered any anomalous coils or other sources of the heat supposedly produced. And that is only the beginning of the red flags that popped up as I read this.
Am I calling the scientists that measured the test corrupt? not necessarily, too many people are taken in by a good charlatan to think that they were complicit in any fraud that may have occurred, this guy has canceled several exhibitions with this device that were to be attended by trained investigators, I think personally he just kept inviting universities to send investigators until he found a group he could "work" then ran with it and snagged 7 of them to write this paper
 
2013-05-22 08:59:41 PM  

exboyracer: Snuffybud: t3knomanser: exboyracer: All duly referenced and posted by Cornell Univ.

No. Duly uploaded to arXiv. arXiv is not a journal. It is an archive of papers. Anyone can submit to arXiv, and arXiv wants to be very clear: "appearance of a paper is not intended in any way to convey tacit approval of its assumptions, methods, or conclusions by any agent (electronic, mechanical, or other)".

Hah! 7 seconds!!!

The response was to the poster that said that they were anon investigators without reputations to protect -- they aren't the paper states their names and institutions.  The paper is not peer reviewed but that wasn't the assertion.    It will be very interesting if a peer review bears this out. Very interesting.



You implied by your post that this "research" was endorsed by Cornell. It certainly has not been endorsed by Cornell, simply posted there. You could have just as easily posted the same disclaimer as the 2 of us did (me 7 seconds sooner, thus the "hah"). Popular Science ripped Rossi and his "research" last fall, I see nothing in this article that refutes anything that they published. Rossi is a convicted scammer attempting to pull another scam, and you seem to have fallen for it.
 
2013-05-22 09:00:37 PM  
Did D-Wave calculate the energy density?
 
2013-05-22 09:09:47 PM  

Pribar: exboyracer: t3knomanser: timujin: but "seven scientists, all from good European universities

Seven un-named scientists from unspecified but "good" universities have written a paper that may or may not have actually been submitted for peer-review (just putting it on arXiv doesn't mean anything).

Sounds totally legit.

Here is the paper. All duly referenced and posted by Cornell Univ.

http://arxiv.org/abs/1305.3913

That paper was a exercise in extreme tap dancing, I can forgive the secrecy around the "additive" that supposedly makes this work but I cannot forgive the lax scrutiny they gave to the test setup, they went into great detail about how they measured the reaction until it came to the gamma readings, those they brushed off with a "contact us if ya want em" note then ran off into more meaningless measurements, why meaningless? because they did not insure that the test was clean, no isolation of the inputs, this test (or pair of tests) was the same as the previous ones where there was a unmeasured ground or neutral wire, when a third party asked about why there was no measuring devices placed on it he was brushed off with a "trust me there is nothing flowing in it" but if ya wanted to fake excess heat the easiest way is to have a extra coil that you energize through the supposed ground wires, the scientists in this trial went to great lengths to verify that the heat output of the two catalyzing coils matched the input but did not monitor the other wires at all as far as I could find when a simple precaution such as a thermal camera trained on the input/output jacks would have shown any anomalous flows as a heat spike in the supposed ground wires, As far as I could tell there was no monitoring of the assembly of the test vessel either which could have uncovered any anomalous coils or other sources of the heat supposedly produced. And that is only the beginning of the red flags that popped up as I read this.
Am I calling the scientists that measured the test c ...


I found out what the "additive" is:

images3.wikia.nocookie.net
 
2013-05-22 09:24:15 PM  
The smartest thing anyone could do if they did discover something like this is to immediately send it out (spam-style) to every possible person they could.  Yes, they wouldn't get money for it, but they also wouldn't get dead from it.  The internet is the great equalizer as far as information distribution.  However, going through proper channels the inventor would probably get lead poisoning or shoot himself in the back 5 times or meet some other bad fate.

//Generally not a conspiracy theorist, but anyone that would upset the apple cart that much would get killed.
 
2013-05-22 09:41:44 PM  

mjbok: /Generally not a conspiracy theorist, but anyone that would upset the apple cart that much would get killed.


Like that guy who invented the integrated circuit that could have led to word processing, threatening Big Typewriter.
 
2013-05-22 09:44:59 PM  

Quantum Apostrophe: czetie: jake3988: Cold fusion has been around a while... it's just ridiculously expensive and impractical... which, for the moment, totally defeats the whole purpose.

Citation required.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyroelectric_fusion

Luddite.


It's a neutron generator that does not remotely resemble "cold fusion" as understood by anybody else on the planet. If you think that counts as "cold fusion", you're just playing silly word games.
 
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