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(NPR)   Other than reactionary gun nuts stockpiling because the NRA instilled within them a fear of President Obama "restricting their guns," is there another reason the US has an ammunition shortage?   (npr.org) divider line 50
    More: Interesting, NRA, President Obama, ammunition shortage, ammunition  
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11789 clicks; posted to Main » on 17 May 2013 at 9:59 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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Archived thread
2013-05-17 07:51:03 AM
8 votes:
What the article kind of dances around is that gun owners, or at least a significant segment of them, tend to be very political.  Trying to explain this using pure economic theory is going to fall flat on its face because simple supply and demand doesn't take into account the ideology of those buying the goods.

A large fraction of gun owners are willing to take severe action against those whom they consider "traitors".  Witness what happened to Smith and Wesson when they signed the deal with the Clinton Administration, or what happened to Jim Zumbo when he called AR-15's "terrorist rifles", and even what happened to the Eastern States Outdoor Show, which was canceled due to boycotts after they announced a "no assault weapons" policy, and the parent company lost the biggest gun related show in the World, the SHOT Show, because of it.

There is a fairly large subset of gun owners who just *LOVE* to "knife perceived traitors in the back", so a gun store that relies on repeat customers has to tread lightly for fear of being perceived as a traitor by a large number of their customers.  It's not like a gas station or a supermarket.
2013-05-17 08:42:33 AM
4 votes:

HoustonNick: Lucky LaRue: HoustonNick: Don't forget that DHS purchased 1.6 Billion rounds.  Regardless of whether those purchases were or were not justified, the purchases did reduce the available ammunition supply.

I hope it was for the purpose of causing scarcity - that would be the best use of my tax dollars EVAR

I hope you still feel that way when your local Police Dept runs out of ammo.


If the idea of a shortage of ammo makes them just a bit more circumspect in their use of deadly force, well, I consider that a feature, not a bug.
2013-05-17 10:57:55 AM
3 votes:

doglover: Frank N Stein: There's that. But I doubt in the context of civilian law enforcement that suppressing fire is much needed or warranted

Tell that to those Mexican chicks the LAPD lit up like Christmas. Without even killing one, I might add.


oi39.tinypic.com
2013-05-17 08:43:21 AM
3 votes:

HoustonNick: dr_blasto: HoustonNick: Don't forget that DHS purchased 1.6 Billion rounds.  Regardless of whether those purchases were or were not justified, the purchases did reduce the available ammunition supply.

No, they didn't. What they did was get a contract for a suppliers to provide "up to" that amount over five years. They reduced the amount recently.


But they have purchased some of that 1.6 and it is a reduction of the available supply.  Its pure match:

Production equals X,
Purchases (Gov't or Private Citizens) equal Y,
Available Supply equals X minus Y.


They're always buying ammo. shiat, we've been in two wars--where were all the 5.56 shortages when we were sending thousands of little bits of lead at insurgents on a daily basis?

The simplest answer is that because the natural production cycles slow down in winter, bad shiat happens in December and nutters panic and buy ammunition to stockpile in case of new restrictions causes shelves to be bare. This leads to other nutters noting the bare shelves and when they do see ammunition, they buy ALL of it. Other nutters notice it's become even harder to find ammo, so they buy palletloads. Wash, rinse, repeat.

The government isn't buying .22LR; why can't you find that?
2013-05-17 08:20:40 AM
3 votes:

HoustonNick: Don't forget that DHS purchased 1.6 Billion rounds.  Regardless of whether those purchases were or were not justified, the purchases did reduce the available ammunition supply.


No, they didn't. What they did was get a contract for a suppliers to provide "up to" that amount over five years. They reduced the amount recently.

The government purchases aren't reducing supply at all. This is almost all panic buying at a time when manufacturers slow down production as part of a normal cycle (less production in winter months due to less shooting). Combine the nutters with normal slowdowns and here you are.
2013-05-17 11:41:40 AM
2 votes:
www.guns.com

2.bp.blogspot.com
excellentquotations.com

votingamerican.files.wordpress.com
3.bp.blogspot.com
2013-05-17 11:20:39 AM
2 votes:
Subby's headline fails, since article has nothing to do with the CAUSE of the shortage, but rather the economics (or lack thereof) of prices remaining stable during the shortage.

When the commodity becomes scarce then as a seller you can do one of three things 1) ignore it; 2) raise prices to reduce consumption; or 3) ration sales to reduce consumption.

Apparently the store-front businesses don't want to do #2 because they think their customers will brand them as thieves, traitors, and evil.  Since their ammo customers belong to a segment of society that has proven itself irrational, vindictive and incapable of understanding market forces numerous times already I sort of understand that.  So the smart stores are doing #3.  The much smarter stores should be emptying their own shelves and re-selling it at TRUE market rates (whatever people will pay) online through a front that won't be clearly tracked back to them.
2013-05-17 11:00:52 AM
2 votes:
Sigh.  Yes, some nutters stock up on ammunition because they are a bunch of paranoid conspiracy morans.  A lot of shooters and hunters, however, stock up when ammunition goes on sale BECAUSE IT SAVES THEM MONEY!
2013-05-17 10:29:17 AM
2 votes:

HoustonNick: FYI, its not like gun owners made up what Obama, Biden, Feinstein, Bloomberg, et al were doing, they were in fact trying to get new gun ban legislation passed. That caused gun owners to react before the legislation could get passed.


Actually, the only gun action Obama took in his entire first term was expanding concealed-carry rights on public land.

From the moment the 2008 election was decided, gun stores were going with a "stock up while you can, before the scary gun-grabber grabs your guns!" message. And why wouldn't they? It's a proven effective marketing scheme. I saw it work during the Clinton years, I saw a gun store in Tennessee (and I thought this was brilliant) with a "Don't trust Florida" message during the 2000 recount, and I saw it work when the Democrats took control of Congress in 2006. At all these points in time, the mere fact that Democrats had political influence was reason enough for gun stores to push the "they're a-gonna take yer guns!" marketing message, and it apparently proved effective to its target audience.

There's a certain segment of America that is just really susceptible to having guns sold to them in this manner. "Act now, before the politicians repeal the Second Amendment" is an easy way to get them to respond like Pavlov's dogs.
2013-05-17 10:22:11 AM
2 votes:

HoustonNick: 2. What about innocent victims being killed because they cannot find ammunition to defend themselves.


Where the fark do you think you live, Phobos?

We're not being invaded by the Sons of Horus and the World Eaters. Bullets are not a limited resource being sold individually at auction like in Outlaw Star. Even a minimum wage job can afford you a box of 100 rounds rather easily.

There's a minor shortage of munitions driving up the price. It's not like all the bullets are gone and aliens stole all the brass so we can't make any more. If demand really increases, they'll make more of them.
2013-05-17 10:03:37 AM
2 votes:

HoustonNick: 1.  So you trust criminals more than cops?


Those two sets aren't 100% mutually exclusive.  And I say that as someone who has friends on the local PD, state troopers, and in the FBI.
2013-05-17 09:16:30 AM
2 votes:

HoustonNick: dittybopper: HoustonNick: dittybopper:

I hope you still feel that way when your local Police Dept runs out of ammo.

If the idea of a shortage of ammo makes them just a bit more circumspect in their use of deadly force, well, I consider that a feature, not a bug.

And what if an innocent victim - or the policie officer - gets killed - would you consider that a feature or a bug?

I'll throw it right back at you:  What if someone innocent doesn't die or get injured because Officer Friendly doesn't empty his gun *TWICE* at a person reaching for their identification, or even someone innocent in the background?

Also, I said "a bit more circumspect in their use of deadly force", not "unarmed like a London Bobby".

I'm still wondering if you would call an innocent victim - or a police officer - getting killed a feature or a bug?  I didn't see your answer.


Nor did I see yours.

You're begging the question:  Your assumption is automatically that less use of deadly force = innocent victim or police officer killed.  That's not necessarily the outcome, and you know it.
2013-05-17 09:10:32 AM
2 votes:
Endless wars?

dittybopper: so a gun store that relies on repeat customers has to tread lightly for fear of being perceived as a traitor by a large number of their customers.


What you're describing is a limited market with an overabundance of suppliers.Kind of shows the gun owner lobby has influence way out of proportion to it's relative population in the country.

/and there are lots of us with guns who wouldn't join the NRA for anything...
2013-05-17 08:26:28 AM
2 votes:

dr_blasto: HoustonNick: Don't forget that DHS purchased 1.6 Billion rounds.  Regardless of whether those purchases were or were not justified, the purchases did reduce the available ammunition supply.

No, they didn't. What they did was get a contract for a suppliers to provide "up to" that amount over five years. They reduced the amount recently.



But they have purchased some of that 1.6 and it is a reduction of the available supply.  Its pure match:

Production equals X,
Purchases (Gov't or Private Citizens) equal Y,
Available Supply equals X minus Y.
2013-05-17 08:14:52 AM
2 votes:
Don't forget that DHS purchased 1.6 Billion rounds.  Regardless of whether those purchases were or were not justified, the purchases did reduce the available ammunition supply.
2013-05-17 03:40:31 PM
1 votes:
I haven't really had a hard time finding 9x18 makarov rounds, so meh./Hungarian PA-63. First and only pistol. Fits my hand well, shoots like a dream.
2013-05-17 03:38:19 PM
1 votes:

Dr Dreidel: JustGetItRight: Dr Dreidel: dittybopper: There is a fairly large subset of gun owners who just *LOVE* to "knife perceived traitors in the back", so a gun store that relies on repeat customers has to tread lightly for fear of being perceived as a traitor by a large number of their customers.

So you're admitting that gun owners, as a group, are reactionary nutbars?

So you're saying a lib that doesn't shop at Wal-Mart because they don't like the company's policies towards organized labor and international sweatshops are reactionary nutbars?

Based on a single data point - OMG they don't have the same opinion of guns that I do! - like the cited Eastern States Outdoor Show, where gun owners were pissed that the show wouldn't carry assault rifles even though they WOULD carry the same model Sig .40 they'd buy at Earl's Gun Show and Feed Lot the following week.

Rather than WalMart, who gets almost all of their products from sweatshop labor.

Not liking someone's politics is fine - as American as apfelstrudel - but taking it to the level the gun people dittybopper mentioned did takes you into "nutbar" territory. It can be both.

// a nuanced argument, to be sure
// and FTR, people that boycott WalMart are indeed "reactionaries"


I fail to see it as nutbar.  The business took a position the majority of the customer base found unacceptable so they took their business elsewhere.

The only difference between union/Wal-mart, LGBT/Chic-fil-a, or any other hot button issue where a  segment of the customer base gets enraged is that these customers were effective.  They closed down the business that offended them.  Ruger and Earl's feed and seed still got their money next week, the customers still got their weapons and ammo, and Eastern States Outdoor Show learned that pissing on your #1 demographic is really bad for business.
2013-05-17 03:20:56 PM
1 votes:

Anayalator: ZOMG! What in the world will the gov't do against you and your AR-15?

[hellpapers.com image 710x399]


Wait:  I thought tanks and jets "weren't particularly useful against an insurgency"?  Or does that just apply to *FOREIGN* insurgencies?
2013-05-17 01:02:20 PM
1 votes:

orclover: smitton: orclover.....how do you reload 22 shells....never heard of such a thing

No farking clue.  How bad is it that it would even be close to considered cost effective?


It's possible, but highly inadvisable.  It isn't likely cost effective for .22 LR, but for .22 WMR, 5mm, and similar it possibly is.  Those tend to cost closer to what 9mm rounds do.

I haven't tried any of the below, but I have researched it before as a matter of curiosity.

The first issue is that you need to swage them or use some other method to re-form the rim.  Without doing this the round may work, but only if the firing pin strikes a 'fresh' part of the rim, so this is more a reliability issue than anything.

The bigger issue is re-priming.  It requires having a priming compound, which tend to be highly explosive.  Half a teaspoon can probably do a thousand rounds, but it can also kill you just for lucking at it funny.  You have to work with it wet and coat the bottom of the case by spinning it in a drill or something similar, then let it dry.

After that, powder, but that's trivial, and many common powders are fine.

Finally you have to find a bullet that will work properly.  For a .22 WMR I understand you can use some commercially available bullets, but there isn't really anything out there for .22 LR.  You'll probably have to invest a couple hundred in a casting furnace, custom molds and the usual casting accessories.

You can refit a .25ACP shell holder and dies to do the seating and crimping.

Not worth it, really.
2013-05-17 11:53:32 AM
1 votes:

gja: Saborlas: [i970.photobucket.com image 179x281]

Perfect. What's next? Markley's law infraction? I guess your ability to constructively engage in this discussion is nil.


That *IS* a Markley's Law infraction:  It equates firearms with a penis.
2013-05-17 11:18:37 AM
1 votes:

dittybopper: Birnone: It's speculators.   People are buying ammo to make money of it by reselling at high prices.

More like hoarders.


Yeah, if it were speculators, the commodity would eventually find its way back to the market.  For the hoarders, it is time to forget about it because it is gone until the estate sale.
2013-05-17 11:14:57 AM
1 votes:

Birnone: It's speculators.   People are buying ammo to make money of it by reselling at high prices.


More like hoarders.
2013-05-17 11:14:05 AM
1 votes:

Gonz: Actually, the only gun action Obama took in his entire first term was expanding concealed-carry rights on public land.


Bzzt.  Wrong.
2013-05-17 11:04:30 AM
1 votes:

orclover: dittybopper: Remington is expanding their ammo manufacturing at their plant in Arkansas, including the construction of a whole new building.

Yay! so I can jam up my guns even more!

No seriously they make the most crappy .22lr ammo I have ever seen in my life.


Do you own a 10/22?
2013-05-17 11:01:55 AM
1 votes:

dittybopper


The problem is that ammunition demand was pretty much at the capacity of the manufacturers to provide it for years, and when the current rush for ammo happened, supply exceeded demand demand exceeded supply.


We knew what you meant - just a polite correction before some jackarse rolls in with a derptastic correction.
2013-05-17 10:59:58 AM
1 votes:
GT has .22LR AMMO! 1 box of any ammo per person max.  .22lr ammo in 500 round box (brick) selling for...........$40 bucks.  Same price as the auction scalpers online.   Thats maybe 2 days of plinking.  Hooooleeeeeeshiat.


Im done, i'm farking done, farkit, I quit.  My kids too small to be doing skeet shooting with an 870 home defense shotgun and target shooting juts turned into a rich mans sport.  Ironically black powder is still affordable so we could go blow up trashcans if I didn't mind committing felony's and teaching him how to be an anarchist.

Hmmm leads still cheap.  Black powder is still cheap.   Anybody got a musket or old blackpowder sixshooter they wanna sell cheap?  No DL needed since its archaic.  EIP.

/TAO!
assets.diylol.com
2013-05-17 10:58:36 AM
1 votes:

madgonad: However, in normal capitalism if the market really did expand that much there would be massive new investment in ammunition production. Businesses would be scrambling to get loans to build or expand new plants to capitalize on that demand. That didn't happen. Some plants extended shifts to increase production, but that isn't an investment. Nobody is investing more money to meet this demand.


Actually, yes they are.

Hornady even has an FAQ about how they've been expanding their manufacturing capacity.

Remington is expanding their ammo manufacturing at their plant in Arkansas, including the construction of a whole new building.

The problem is that ammunition demand was pretty much at the capacity of the manufacturers to provide it for years, and when the current rush for ammo happened, supply exceeded demand.

The manufacturers are working to correct that, but it's going to take time to add the capacity.
2013-05-17 10:57:47 AM
1 votes:

Oblio13: catusr: I have 40 9mm bullets in my ammo box.  For me, that is a five year supply.  I shoot off a single magazine (8 bullets) once a year.  I think that's good enough to stay familiar with the pistol.  I sure hope this ammo shortage is all over with by 2018, because I'll be wanting to buy a box of ammo by then.

If I get into a gunfight, I hope it's with you.


I was thinking the same thing; only 8 rounds a year? We only go to the range a few times a year (expensive hobby right now, unfortunately), but we still shoot around 100 rounds every time we go. It's basically an expensive paper weight if you don't practice with it.
2013-05-17 10:49:01 AM
1 votes:
Academy called.  Truck comes in betwen 5 and 7pm on thursday and fridays.  They are getting roughly 15 boxes of .22lr in at a time which is alot more than they used to a few years ago.  A group of people will typically wait around the desk waiting on the truck to come in and the ammo sells out within 10 minutes.  They are rationing 1 box per person right now which equals some upset people (who may be making a living off this).

Calling GT.
2013-05-17 10:38:36 AM
1 votes:
Ammo IS getting more expensive, but this has a lot more to do with materials prices than anything else.

And leave it to the Liberals at NPR to find the idea of fairness inexplicable. This story told me far more about the author than about ammunition.
2013-05-17 10:36:03 AM
1 votes:
orclover.....how do you reload 22 shells....never heard of such a thing
2013-05-17 10:32:19 AM
1 votes:
Price gouge and blame Obama.  Can't go wrong with that.
gja [TotalFark]
2013-05-17 10:31:25 AM
1 votes:

Dr. Goldshnoz: its funny I always see people get so zealous about gun owners and gun lobby. if you spent half as much time realizing the damage caused by legal gun owners is statistically tiny, and the 'disproportionate' lobby power is exactly the same as with every other group in the history of lobbying, you might be able to apply all your 15 minutes of faux rage at issues that actually seriously affect this country and the world like, oh, I don't know; the disproportionate power of the bank lobby, or the petroleum lobby, or the christian lobby, or the drug war lobby, or the anti woman's rights lobby, or the warmongers lobby, or any of dozens of other things advocated with a full intention of farking over everyone in the country and world for a quick buck.

where's your bleeding heart for people farked by banks?

where's your bleeding heart for people sick from fossil fuel poisons?

you harp on gun owners because its easy and you are lazy in your theatre at giving a shiat.


I almost wish you weren't already a TF'er so I could gift you some.
2013-05-17 10:30:43 AM
1 votes:

ajgeek: This is why I stock up on det cord and arrows.


them Duke boys...
2013-05-17 10:21:27 AM
1 votes:
its funny I always see people get so zealous about gun owners and gun lobby. if you spent half as much time realizing the damage caused by legal gun owners is statistically tiny, and the 'disproportionate' lobby power is exactly the same as with every other group in the history of lobbying, you might be able to apply all your 15 minutes of faux rage at issues that actually seriously affect this country and the world like, oh, I don't know; the disproportionate power of the bank lobby, or the petroleum lobby, or the christian lobby, or the drug war lobby, or the anti woman's rights lobby, or the warmongers lobby, or any of dozens of other things advocated with a full intention of farking over everyone in the country and world for a quick buck.

where's your bleeding heart for people farked by banks?

where's your bleeding heart for people sick from fossil fuel poisons?

you harp on gun owners because its easy and you are lazy in your theatre at giving a shiat.
2013-05-17 10:17:55 AM
1 votes:
Blah. Cost of resources + massive demand + people making money by artificially restricting the supply == shortage, panic, and conspiracy theories.
2013-05-17 10:15:52 AM
1 votes:

HoustonNick: No, but unlike you apparently, I do not view people as mere numbers.


So you're OK with 10 people dying instead of 5?  Isn't that worse?
2013-05-17 10:15:49 AM
1 votes:

Carlip: Your liberal scare tactic, " you won't saying that if the cops can't X" is the weakest argument evar created. Do you have a fire extinguisher, if so why... There is always the fire department.


Your conservative scare tactic, "The government is wasteful, corrupt and stupid, but is ALSO just itching at the chance to suppress and send us to FEMA camps!" is pretty useful on dumbass white guys with money, though.
2013-05-17 10:08:31 AM
1 votes:
American Taliban.
They loves them some guns and pickups and Jesus.
2013-05-17 10:08:23 AM
1 votes:

HoustonNick: dittybopper:

You're begging the question:  Your assumption is automatically that less use of deadly force = innocent victim or police officer killed.  That's not necessarily the outcome, and you know it.

Actually you entirely missing my point.  You indicated that scarcity was a good thing - "I hope it was for the purpose of causing scarcity - that would be the best use of my tax dollars EVAR",and my question to you is whether you thought it would be a good thing if that scarcity caused an innocent victim or police officer to get killed ? - but you wouldn't answer.

As for your question, if scarcity prevents an innocent suspect from getting killed - that is great news.  I am in favor of innocent persons not getting killed.  Including innocent suspects, innocent victims, innocent police officers, innocent dogs, cats, etc.

So now will you answer my question.


Why should anyone answer your buzzard poisoned hypotheticals?
2013-05-17 09:42:50 AM
1 votes:

HoustonNick: dittybopper:

I hope you still feel that way when your local Police Dept runs out of ammo.

If the idea of a shortage of ammo makes them just a bit more circumspect in their use of deadly force, well, I consider that a feature, not a bug.

And what if an innocent victim - or the policie officer - gets killed - would you consider that a feature or a bug?


Cops are usually the last people you'd trust to be shooting though.

If you run out of ammo, that's a very bad situation. If the cops run out of ammo, it's probably their own damn fault.
2013-05-17 09:38:51 AM
1 votes:

HoustonNick: dittybopper:

You're begging the question:  Your assumption is automatically that less use of deadly force = innocent victim or police officer killed.  That's not necessarily the outcome, and you know it.

Actually you entirely missing my point.  You indicated that scarcity was a good thing - "I hope it was for the purpose of causing scarcity - that would be the best use of my tax dollars EVAR",and my question to you is whether you thought it would be a good thing if that scarcity caused an innocent victim or police officer to get killed ? - but you wouldn't answer.


Don't use double quotes unless you are actually directly quoting someone.  I never said that.  So right there, you're being dishonest.

As for your question, if scarcity prevents an innocent suspect from getting killed - that is great news.  I am in favor of innocent persons not getting killed.  Including innocent suspects, innocent victims, innocent police officers, innocent dogs, cats, etc.

So now will you answer my question.


Sure.

I'd look at both sides of the equation, and see what the net result is.  If there are 10 fewer innocents/cops killed because an ammo shortage prevents criminals from shooting, but that same ammo shortage causes 5 deaths that wouldn't have happened because the police didn't have enough ammo, you still come out ahead.

Of course. to some people a net gain of 5 lives is a bad thing, because *COPS*!  *INNOCENT VICTIMS*!.

In other words, you'd have to demonstrate to me that there is an actual net negative value before I would reconsider my position.
2013-05-17 09:13:02 AM
1 votes:

HoustonNick: dr_blasto:

The simplest answer is that because the natural production cycles slow down in winter, bad shiat happens in December and nutters panic and buy ammunition to stockpile in case of new restrictions causes shelves to be bare. This leads to other nutters noting the bare shelves and when they do see ammunition, they buy ALL of it. Other nutters notice it's become even harder to find ammo, so they buy palletloads. Wash, rinse, repeat.

The government isn't buying .22LR; why can't you find that?

Lots of biased (e.g. "nutters") assumptions there.

Does liking to target practice and shoot competively make you a Nutter?
What if you are a Liberal who likes to shoot, is the Liberal a  Nutter?
Are the Olympic Athletes who shoot Nutters?

I not sure why you can't find .22LR but from what I saw at the range, a lot of shooters switched to their .22s to reduce the cost (FYI, some articles have falsely stated that ammunition costs didn't increase.  Point in fact they did but generally in the 10-20% per box range.).  I know I started shooting my .22 more, but than all of a sudden I could find 9mm ammo everywhere, but no .22 ammo, so I switched back.

The other anomaly is that everyone, everywhere has shotgun shells - another product the Gov't isn't buying.


I don't state that people shooting are nutters. I am saying the paranoid people buying all the ammunition up just to stockpile tens of thousands of rounds for when 0bama comes to take their guns are nutters. They are nutters.

I'm an avid shooter. I own a few firearms; throughout the wars at their peak(s), I never had an issue feeding any of my rifles or pistols, most of which use common NATO rounds like 5.56 or 9mm.

On the subject of .22LR, most people would buy by the brick as it was so friggin cheap. It takes a while to load and fire that shiat. I'm sure people still have quite a bit, but I haven't seen it on a shelf since early December. Some of my other shooting sports friends tell me that they think that mess was because the zombie/survivalist/endofworld types bought metric ass-tons up to store for 12/21/12, the end of times shiat. Whatever the reason, the government isn't buying that shiat, yet none is available.
2013-05-17 09:12:19 AM
1 votes:

vartian: HoustonNick: But they have purchased some of that 1.6 and it is a reduction of the available supply.  Its pure match:

In advance, with plenty of notice. So you are saying bullet manufactures are incompetent.


No, they were caught off guard by the increased demand caused by the gun ban efforts of Obama, Biden, Feinstein, Bloomber, et al, plus the increased chance of success as a result of the horror at Sandy Hook.  Admittedly, gun owners increased their ammo (and gun) purchases as a result, and the market was not prepared for either.

As indicated in one of my earlier posts - the purchases were by both Gov't and Private Citizens - and when all purchases increased, it reduced available supply.

FYI, its not like gun owners made up what Obama, Biden, Feinstein, Bloomberg, et al were doing, they were in fact trying to get new gun ban legislation passed.  That caused gun owners to react before the legislation could get passed.
2013-05-17 08:54:53 AM
1 votes:

HoustonNick: dittybopper:

I hope you still feel that way when your local Police Dept runs out of ammo.

If the idea of a shortage of ammo makes them just a bit more circumspect in their use of deadly force, well, I consider that a feature, not a bug.

And what if an innocent victim - or the policie officer - gets killed - would you consider that a feature or a bug?


I'll throw it right back at you:  What if someone innocent doesn't die or get injured because Officer Friendly doesn't empty his gun *TWICE* at a person reaching for their identification, or even someone innocent in the background?

Also, I said "a bit more circumspect in their use of deadly force", not "unarmed like a London Bobby".
2013-05-17 08:50:23 AM
1 votes:

dr_blasto: They're always buying ammo. shiat, we've been in two wars--where were all the 5.56 shortages when we were sending thousands of little bits of lead at insurgents on a daily basis?


There were some minor shortages of strictly military calibers like .223 Remington/5/56mm NATO and 9mm Parabellum back a few years ago but it was hardly noticeable because the two wars you mention weren't "small arms intensive", and the military was able to draw from a large stockpile it already had to smooth out the demand.
2013-05-17 08:37:57 AM
1 votes:
I have 40 9mm bullets in my ammo box.  For me, that is a five year supply.  I shoot off a single magazine (8 bullets) once a year.  I think that's good enough to stay familiar with the pistol.  I sure hope this ammo shortage is all over with by 2018, because I'll be wanting to buy a box of ammo by then.
2013-05-17 08:32:15 AM
1 votes:

Lucky LaRue: HoustonNick: Don't forget that DHS purchased 1.6 Billion rounds.  Regardless of whether those purchases were or were not justified, the purchases did reduce the available ammunition supply.

I hope it was for the purpose of causing scarcity - that would be the best use of my tax dollars EVAR


I hope you still feel that way when your local Police Dept runs out of ammo.
2013-05-17 08:27:35 AM
1 votes:

HoustonNick: Don't forget that DHS purchased 1.6 Billion rounds.  Regardless of whether those purchases were or were not justified, the purchases did reduce the available ammunition supply.


I hope it was for the purpose of causing scarcity - that would be the best use of my tax dollars EVAR.
2013-05-17 08:10:48 AM
1 votes:
I've been told that the national weather service has purchased in excess of seventy trillion rounds of hollow-point armor piercing incindiery anti-personnel ammunition, so this is probably to blame
 
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