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(ESPN FC)   One year after winning the team's first title in 44 years, and taking the team to second place this year, Manchester City fires coach Roberto Mancini. Bonus: he had four years remaining on his contract. Also, this is your stealth midweek EPL thread   (espnfc.com) divider line 159
    More: Strange, Roberto Mancini, Manchester City, FA Cup Final, director of football, Samir Nasri, Pep Guardiola, UEFA Champions League, Van Persie  
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437 clicks; posted to Sports » on 14 May 2013 at 12:52 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-05-14 12:20:49 PM
Watching the game today may give me a goddamn ulcer.
 
2013-05-14 12:40:31 PM
And on topic, I don't think Mancini is really that broken-hearted about leaving.
 
2013-05-14 01:06:07 PM
Mancini got fired after winning 7 titles in four years at Inter. He's probably used to it.
 
2013-05-14 01:06:33 PM
C'mon, you plucky Little Team That Could- avoid relegation!
 
2013-05-14 01:08:32 PM
Man City have a HUGE payroll. Wigan have nothing. You just know that Sheikh who owns them thinks it's like horse racing: you pour enough money into it, you win. And if you come in second...you get put down.
 
2013-05-14 01:14:55 PM

Langston: Watching the game today may give me a goddamn ulcer.


Whether you're a Spurs fan or Arsenal fan... THIS.

/COYS
 
2013-05-14 01:16:01 PM

star_topology: Langston: Watching the game today may give me a goddamn ulcer.

Whether you're a Spurs fan or Arsenal fan... THIS.

/COYS


What he said, on all counts.
 
2013-05-14 01:19:47 PM

whistleridge: Man City have a HUGE payroll. Wigan have nothing. You just know that Sheikh who owns them thinks it's like horse racing: you pour enough money into it, you win. And if you come in second...you get put down.


*shudders*
 
2013-05-14 01:20:44 PM

Gonz: C'mon, you plucky Little Team That Could- avoid relegation!


I'd said earlier that it would be really problematic if Arsenal were to drop today's game (not just CL qualifying, but would affect everything down to their wage structure), but regardless of the outcome, it's hard to dislike Wigan.

star_topology: Whether you're a Spurs fan or Arsenal fan... THIS.


I told another Arsenal friend of mine that I wished last year that it sucked that your guys played so well all season and earned fourth place, only to get bumped out with Chelski's surprise upset win against Bayern. I'd honestly rather see Chelski stumble out of the CL.
 
2013-05-14 01:21:03 PM
I think the UEFA Champions League group stage (lack of) performance was the coup de grace.  Everything since was a lame duck scenario.  The players performed well enough to secure top 4, then turned off (mediocre since the MU win and Chelsea FA Cup semi win).  The players take the blame for losing the FA Cup, but really Mancini was done long before then.

Sadly, the MCFC true fans deserve better, but that's the life with lavish ownership now.  It'll be interesting to see the fan response, Chelsea fans never gave up their disgust for sacking RDM.
 
2013-05-14 01:24:18 PM
Isn't Wigan also getting relegated?
 
2013-05-14 01:24:45 PM

Langston: Watching the game today may give me a goddamn ulcer.


I'll share the bottles of antacid I just bought with you.

About Mancini, you knew he was long for the sack when he got physical with Balotelli.  From what I've head he wasn't a people person to either the board or his players.
 
2013-05-14 01:24:50 PM
One more thought,

Mancini never hid his hatred for not getting the players he wanted in the summer.  I think that the front office splashed last minute and picked up Scott Sinclair.  Mancini, to be spiteful, never played him.  The signing made no sense and it was a power play between coach and GM.  Sadly, Sinclair is the one that suffers and is destined to be a loanee until his contract runs out.

/Bring on Arsenal/Wigan
 
2013-05-14 01:25:10 PM
This firing is not strange or unexpected. Mancini had a job to do and after crashing out in the Champions League again he had one job to do which was to win the league. He had arguably a better squad than every other team in the Premier League and he couldn't get the job done. Mix that with his failures in the Cups and his performance just wasn't good enough.

I always enjoy watching these plastic clubs fail.
 
2013-05-14 01:26:03 PM

soupafi: Isn't Wigan also getting relegated?


Likely, but depends on whether they ruin Arsenal's day and become the hero's of North London.
 
2013-05-14 01:28:39 PM

bennett311: One more thought,

Mancini never hid his hatred for not getting the players he wanted in the summer.  I think that the front office splashed last minute and picked up Scott Sinclair.  Mancini, to be spiteful, never played him.  The signing made no sense and it was a power play between coach and GM.  Sadly, Sinclair is the one that suffers and is destined to be a loanee until his contract runs out.


Yeah, pretty much.  Mancini sounded like an old-school manager which in this day and age is an anachronism.  Even SAF had to change his ways; although he still would give ya the hairdryer treatment if you farked up.
 
2013-05-14 01:28:52 PM

Langston: Gonz: C'mon, you plucky Little Team That Could- avoid relegation!

I'd said earlier that it would be really problematic if Arsenal were to drop today's game (not just CL qualifying, but would affect everything down to their wage structure), but regardless of the outcome, it's hard to dislike Wigan.

star_topology: Whether you're a Spurs fan or Arsenal fan... THIS.

I told another Arsenal friend of mine that I wished last year that it sucked that your guys played so well all season and earned fourth place, only to get bumped out with Chelski's surprise upset win against Bayern. I'd honestly rather see Chelski stumble out of the CL.


Based on that, and it might seem like sour grapes, but I truly believe PL deserves a 5th (maybe even 6th) qualifying place, just based on the  competitiveness of the past few seasons.
 
2013-05-14 01:31:09 PM
star_topology:

Based on that, and it might seem like sour grapes, but I truly believe PL deserves a 5th (maybe even 6th) qualifying place, just based on the  competitiveness of the past few seasons.

Yeah, that's not going to happen.  At least not with of the other continental leagues getting their own berths.  Not to mention that Platini wanted more clubs from smaller countries in the CL.
 
2013-05-14 01:32:00 PM

bennett311: I think the UEFA Champions League group stage (lack of) performance was the coup de grace.  Everything since was a lame duck scenario.  The players performed well enough to secure top 4, then turned off (mediocre since the MU win and Chelsea FA Cup semi win).  The players take the blame for losing the FA Cup, but really Mancini was done long before then.

Sadly, the MCFC true fans deserve better, but that's the life with lavish ownership now.  It'll be interesting to see the fan response, Chelsea fans never gave up their disgust for sacking RDM.


DiMatteo won the FA Cup and the Champion's League but got the boot 8 months into being put in as manager -- why wouldn't the team's fans be disgusted?
 
2013-05-14 01:34:38 PM

star_topology: Langston: Watching the game today may give me a goddamn ulcer.

Whether you're a Spurs fan or Arsenal fan... THIS.

/COYS


Don't leave the Wigan fans out. They have a lot riding on today too.
 
2013-05-14 01:35:12 PM

star_topology: Langston: Gonz: C'mon, you plucky Little Team That Could- avoid relegation!

I'd said earlier that it would be really problematic if Arsenal were to drop today's game (not just CL qualifying, but would affect everything down to their wage structure), but regardless of the outcome, it's hard to dislike Wigan.

star_topology: Whether you're a Spurs fan or Arsenal fan... THIS.

I told another Arsenal friend of mine that I wished last year that it sucked that your guys played so well all season and earned fourth place, only to get bumped out with Chelski's surprise upset win against Bayern. I'd honestly rather see Chelski stumble out of the CL.

Based on that, and it might seem like sour grapes, but I truly believe PL deserves a 5th (maybe even 6th) qualifying place, just based on the  competitiveness of the past few seasons.


Especially considering how many EPL teams made the Round of 16 this year.
 
2013-05-14 01:36:23 PM
Good God! Are Gerald Myers and Kent Hance* running the show over there?

*Who, along with Craig James, can eat the peanuts from my shiat.
 
2013-05-14 01:38:15 PM

meanmutton: bennett311: I think the UEFA Champions League group stage (lack of) performance was the coup de grace.  Everything since was a lame duck scenario.  The players performed well enough to secure top 4, then turned off (mediocre since the MU win and Chelsea FA Cup semi win).  The players take the blame for losing the FA Cup, but really Mancini was done long before then.

Sadly, the MCFC true fans deserve better, but that's the life with lavish ownership now.  It'll be interesting to see the fan response, Chelsea fans never gave up their disgust for sacking RDM.


From what I heard in the FA Cup, fans were chanting (paraphrasing): "You can stick Pellegrini up your a**."

So yeah, I don't think they'll be too happy if he does come in.  Mancini can't whine about this either since he was waiting in the wings while Mark Hughes was left twisting in the wind.

DiMatteo won the FA Cup and the Champion's League but got the boot 8 months into being put in as manager -- why wouldn't the team's fans be disgusted?

I seriously doubt that Abramovich is going to swallow his pride and bring Mourinho back.
 
2013-05-14 01:39:26 PM
C'mon Wigan, I believe in you!

/enters his FFPL 2-0 Arsenal victory prediction.
//chews nails
 
2013-05-14 01:44:13 PM

Mr_H: C'mon Wigan, I believe in you!

/enters his FFPL 2-0 Arsenal victory prediction.
//chews nails


It's a sad day indeed when your scoreline prediction was even more optimistic than mine.
 
2013-05-14 01:48:33 PM

star_topology: Based on that, and it might seem like sour grapes, but I truly believe PL deserves a 5th (maybe even 6th) qualifying place, just based on the competitiveness of the past few seasons.


Six EPL teams in the Champion's League?  At what point would it make more sense to just dissolve the EPL, create a European superleague and have the FA revert back to the old DIvision 1 through 4 format?  The bottom 10-12 EPL teams aren't that far removed from Championship teams as it stands now anyway...which is more of a compliment to the Championship than a shot at the EPL, honestly...
 
2013-05-14 01:48:36 PM

Mr_H: C'mon Wigan, I believe in you!

/enters his FFPL 2-0 Arsenal victory prediction.
//chews nails


As an Arsenal fan I'm insulted that it had to go this far.  I want Arsenal to win tonight and Sunday...but there's a side of me that thinks sliding down to that Europa League spot would be the slap in the face the club and Wenger have needed for a very long time.  It's magnified by a) Swansea out-Arsenaling Arsenal and b) both Swansea and Wigan winning trophies with far smaller squads than Arsenal.

It annoyed me that Wenger didn't even consider signing someone other than Monreal in January.  Even more so that he thought that Giroud and Podolski would make up for losing RvP.

Maybe the beatdown Munich gave them was even more of a wake up call...but I'll believe that Arsenal are serious about spending big when they actually do in the summer.
 
2013-05-14 01:49:25 PM

StRalphTheLiar: star_topology: Langston: Watching the game today may give me a goddamn ulcer.

Whether you're a Spurs fan or Arsenal fan... THIS.

/COYS

Don't leave the Wigan fans out. They have a lot riding on today too.


Of course.  Come on you ... Wigans!

/knows they're the Latics
 
2013-05-14 01:55:32 PM

Langston: Mr_H: C'mon Wigan, I believe in you!

/enters his FFPL 2-0 Arsenal victory prediction.
//chews nails

It's a sad day indeed when your scoreline prediction was even more optimistic than mine.


I actually put in the prediction Friday.  I'm finding myself contemplating changing it though, as I wonder if Wigan's win plus the fact that they MUST win is gonna give them an extra edge. Of course,  Arsenal has to win too, so....
 
2013-05-14 01:56:01 PM

TheMatchHare: star_topology: Based on that, and it might seem like sour grapes, but I truly believe PL deserves a 5th (maybe even 6th) qualifying place, just based on the competitiveness of the past few seasons.

Six EPL teams in the Champion's League?  At what point would it make more sense to just dissolve the EPL, create a European superleague and have the FA revert back to the old DIvision 1 through 4 format?  The bottom 10-12 EPL teams aren't that far removed from Championship teams as it stands now anyway...which is more of a compliment to the Championship than a shot at the EPL, honestly...


Sadly. I have no clue what you're talking about. I've been watching and paying attention to the global soccer landscape since World Cup 2010, so my historical knowledge of the sport has a long way to go so obviously what you're saying is true, and I would agree with that. Wouldn't make much sense. Adding more EPL teams would only make it a "rich get richer" as the bottom half the EPL teams (like Wigan) appear to be feeder teams anyway, I agree.

And it's strange--I've never played a single minute of soccer in my life, and it's become one of my favorite sports, I'm from Texas too, so that says something, but I'm not sure what... I do know that I play FIFA like I used to play Madden... And I'm 29. I think it's strange anyway. XD

On a tangential note, I just started playing Football Manager 2013. OH. MY. GOD.
 
2013-05-14 01:56:23 PM

Langston: I told another Arsenal friend of mine that I wished last year that it sucked that your guys played so well all season and earned fourth place, only to get bumped out with Chelski's surprise upset win against Bayern. I'd honestly rather see Chelski stumble out of the CL.


As a Spurs supporter, I'm contractually required to hold Arsenal in some disdain, but I agree with you that it would be much, much sweeter to see Chelsea shut out of the CL.

The only reason I'd feel otherwise is one Arsenal fan who was here last year on the final day of the season, late in the thread. After that amazing day of football, where we all kinda said "That was a real thing that just happened". The regulars had mostly left by that point, and one lone Gunner came in out of nowhere crowing about "St. Totteringham's Day is finally here!"

I just remember reading that and thinking "Wow, on the final day of the season, when your team qualified for the CL, you're more ate up by a team that finished one point (and tied in goal differential) behind you." Like it was somehow a massive failure of a season by Spurs, since the end result was virtually identical to Arsenal's.

For some reason, that dude really rubbed me the wrong way.
 
2013-05-14 01:57:42 PM
star_topology:

On a tangential note, I just started playing Football Manager 2013. OH. MY. GOD.

I had to uninstall FM 2012...it was taking up far too much of my time.
 
2013-05-14 02:01:11 PM

star_topology: I've been watching and paying attention to the global soccer landscape since World Cup 2010


Just out of curiosity, how'd you end up pulling for Spurs?
 
2013-05-14 02:05:49 PM
Am I the only one not on Roberto Martinez's balls? It's great that Wigan narrowly dodge relegation every year and win some impressive games along the way. But why are they in a position to be relegated right now? And why last year? Manage your team correctly in October and you don't have to pull wins out of your ass in May.

/Off the soapbox
//please win, Arsenal. Please
 
2013-05-14 02:09:52 PM
Really want Wigan to stay up. This game is the roadblock, Aston Villa sans Benteke should be an easier three points that Arsenal trying to get in the CL for the umpteenth time in a row. Really want to hear Macca and Darke call the Wigan - Villa game on the final day.
 
2013-05-14 02:13:42 PM
any feed for the match today?
 
2013-05-14 02:13:56 PM
And David Platt leaves too. Hmm. Wonder if Brian Kidd leaves at the end of the season.
 
2013-05-14 02:30:07 PM

Gonz: star_topology: I've been watching and paying attention to the global soccer landscape since World Cup 2010

Just out of curiosity, how'd you end up pulling for Spurs?


In before "'Cause he's a tosser." Or something.

To be honest, it was pretty simplistic at first.

I recognized a lot of the names for England's World Cup Squad--Dawson, Lenon, King, Defoe, PETER CROOOUCH.  Keep in mind this was before I even knew about Bale. So I won't be switchingallegiances if he leaves in the summer.

I knew I didn't want to root for United or Chelsea, they were the New York Yankees of the EPL to me. Then I read up on the club's history for a bit, and decided that based on the player familiarity, combined with...

The club's kit, logo and motto. "To Dare Is to Do" has a little bit of meaning in my personal life.

And the long-suffering fan base. Their successful run in the Champions League was really fun to watch, and I would enjoy seeing them get rewarded in some way like that again, but anything other than a Europa title admittedly seems impossible.

And there you have it. Spurs fan.
 
2013-05-14 02:35:08 PM
Please tell me Gus Johnson is not calling today's game
 
2013-05-14 02:35:16 PM

iamreptar: any feed for the match today?


Look on firstrow1.eu
 
2013-05-14 02:42:53 PM

iamreptar: any feed for the match today?


There's a couple on vipbox.tv as well.
 
2013-05-14 02:45:30 PM

ADubs86: Really want Wigan to stay up. This game is the roadblock, Aston Villa sans Benteke should be an easier three points that Arsenal trying to get in the CL for the umpteenth time in a row. Really want to hear Macca and Darke call the Wigan - Villa game on the final day.


If Wigan wins, ESPN will grab the "best" game.  I think you would get your wish.
 
2013-05-14 02:46:45 PM

Rwa2play: Yeah, pretty much. Mancini sounded like an old-school manager which in this day and age is an anachronism. Even SAF had to change his ways; although he still would give ya the hairdryer treatment if you farked up.


I don't think an old school manager is going to work well with a front office that says:

This, combined with an identified need to develop a holistic approach to all aspects of football at the club,

da fuq?
 
2013-05-14 02:47:24 PM

StRalphTheLiar: Please tell me Gus Johnson is not calling today's game


Just think about it, after this weekend, we will never have to hear him announce another league game...

/FIIIIIRRRREESSSS!
 
2013-05-14 02:48:07 PM

StRalphTheLiar: Please tell me Gus Johnson is not calling today's game


Nah, he's too tired from calling the Leafs-Bruins game last night.
 
2013-05-14 02:48:59 PM

soupafi: Isn't Wigan also getting relegated?


They're safe if they win their last two, with probably Aston Villa or Sunderland getting relegated.  But of course beating Arsenal today will be a tall order.
 
2013-05-14 02:49:23 PM
Arsenal full of intent early.  Wigan playing same squad as Saturday.  High line at the back for Wigan again.
 
2013-05-14 02:55:06 PM
Fired? All for losing the FA Cup final to a team that's likely to be relegated?

Wait...
 
2013-05-14 02:55:45 PM
There it is!!
 
2013-05-14 02:55:57 PM
POLDI!!!!!
 
2013-05-14 02:56:23 PM
Christ, Wigan looked like Arsenal defending that corner.
 
2013-05-14 02:56:26 PM
Podolski header from a corner.  1-0 to the Arsenal!
 
2013-05-14 02:57:06 PM
now get 3 or 4 more
 
2013-05-14 02:58:10 PM

StRalphTheLiar: now get 3 or 4 more

 
2013-05-14 03:00:11 PM
I know that Coquelin's nickname is Le Coq but honestly it's Koscielny's hair that reminds me of a rooster's comb
 
2013-05-14 03:01:08 PM

Langston: StRalphTheLiar: now get 3 or 4 more


.
 
2013-05-14 03:08:27 PM

mitchcumstein1: Christ, Wigan looked like Arsenal Citeh defending that corner.

 
2013-05-14 03:09:47 PM

Mr_H: iamreptar: any feed for the match today?

There's a couple on vipbox.tv as well.


Is that site better than firstrow? Some of the streams on here are absolute crap.
 
2013-05-14 03:11:23 PM

star_topology: Mr_H: iamreptar: any feed for the match today?

There's a couple on vipbox.tv as well.

Is that site better than firstrow? Some of the streams on here are absolute crap.


Half of one, six of the others.  Think it all depends on the streams they find.  Occasionally I find the same streams on vipbox and firstrow.
I do think Vipbox's is organized a bit better personally.
 
2013-05-14 03:12:08 PM

star_topology: Mr_H: iamreptar: any feed for the match today?

There's a couple on vipbox.tv as well.

Is that site better than firstrow? Some of the streams on here are absolute crap.


Specifically, I'll ask if it's worth downloading the desktop app for HD streaming.
 
2013-05-14 03:13:16 PM

Mr_H: star_topology: Mr_H: iamreptar: any feed for the match today?

There's a couple on vipbox.tv as well.

Is that site better than firstrow? Some of the streams on here are absolute crap.

Half of one, six of the others.  Think it all depends on the streams they find.  Occasionally I find the same streams on vipbox and firstrow.
I do think Vipbox's is organized a bit better personally.


Oops, I was too slow on the post button. Thanks!
 
2013-05-14 03:13:25 PM
Ramsey you suck
 
2013-05-14 03:14:36 PM

star_topology: star_topology: Mr_H: iamreptar: any feed for the match today?

There's a couple on vipbox.tv as well.

Is that site better than firstrow? Some of the streams on here are absolute crap.

Specifically, I'll ask if it's worth downloading the desktop app for HD streaming.


Can't comment on the app, never used it.  I only watch the streams when I'm at work and don't want to download extra things here.
 
2013-05-14 03:17:44 PM
Part of me hopes Wigan goes down, just so we can say City lost to a Championship club.
 
2013-05-14 03:24:30 PM
Koscielny you suck
 
2013-05-14 03:26:43 PM
Szczesny...
 
2013-05-14 03:28:28 PM
Mike Dean is a useless piece of shiat.
 
2013-05-14 03:29:06 PM
Suddenly, a game of leap frog broke out...
 
2013-05-14 03:30:12 PM
MALONEY!
 
2013-05-14 03:30:14 PM
fark
 
2013-05-14 03:30:30 PM
F*ck.

F*ck, f*ck, f*ck.
 
2013-05-14 03:30:36 PM
Wigan OMG!
 
2013-05-14 03:31:05 PM
If Podolski jumps he blocks that.
 
2013-05-14 03:33:40 PM

Mr_H: star_topology:

On a tangential note, I just started playing Football Manager 2013. OH. MY. GOD.

I had to uninstall FM 2012...it was taking up far too much of my time.


Question:
Is there any real "skill" to the game or does it just scratch the itch of managing a club, wheeling and dealing, developing the youth squad, experimenting with tactics, etc?

I've started two campaigns, one with Aston Villa and one with Tottenham. I use similar tactics but still admittedly have a lot of homework to do on that, but it seems that it's all about personnel, there's no overachieving or underachieving ... My Spurs team scores a ton of goals while Villa's concede a metric ton of them, and I went on a 12 game winless run to start a season.
 
2013-05-14 03:34:47 PM
Mike Dean you suck
 
2013-05-14 03:35:33 PM
MALONEY! BEAUTY!
 
2013-05-14 03:40:15 PM
Brilliant goal from City.
 
2013-05-14 03:40:50 PM

star_topology: Mr_H: star_topology:

On a tangential note, I just started playing Football Manager 2013. OH. MY. GOD.

I had to uninstall FM 2012...it was taking up far too much of my time.

Question:
Is there any real "skill" to the game or does it just scratch the itch of managing a club, wheeling and dealing, developing the youth squad, experimenting with tactics, etc?

I've started two campaigns, one with Aston Villa and one with Tottenham. I use similar tactics but still admittedly have a lot of homework to do on that, but it seems that it's all about personnel, there's no overachieving or underachieving ... My Spurs team scores a ton of goals while Villa's concede a metric ton of them, and I went on a 12 game winless run to start a season.


I think it's almost more of a numbers game (which I admittedly suck at).   I let the AI handle a lot of stuff and just slowly picked up individual bits.  I tried Tottenham and struggled, but found I had better luck when I went to a lower league team (Stevenage).  Probably cause there's less you have to worry about/less pressure?

There's so much to the game, it's probably best to learn small tidbits at a time.  I intend to load it up again, someday, when I have more free time.
 
2013-05-14 03:45:20 PM
Yes! COME ON WIGAN!

/Spurs fan.
 
2013-05-14 03:46:46 PM
I took my banker off City and put it on Arsenal???

When that f*ck did I do that?
 
2013-05-14 03:49:55 PM

mitchcumstein1: I took my banker off City and put it on Arsenal???

When that f*ck did I do that?


Were you exceedingly drunk this weekend?
 
2013-05-14 03:51:33 PM

cameroncrazy1984: mitchcumstein1: I took my banker off City and put it on Arsenal???

When that f*ck did I do that?

Were you exceedingly drunk this weekend?


Yeah. Sh*t.
 
2013-05-14 03:53:15 PM
CLOSE!
 
2013-05-14 03:53:20 PM
These f*ckers are trying to kill me.
 
2013-05-14 03:53:25 PM
Ugh
 
2013-05-14 03:53:31 PM
This is going to be a crazy, crazy half of football.
 
2013-05-14 03:53:54 PM
Crazy start to the 2nd half, both sides nearly scoring.
 
2013-05-14 03:54:11 PM
So much for a 'boring' game.  Sweet saves/plays/shots!
 
2013-05-14 03:57:43 PM
Ramsey is terrible.  Someone already pointed that our earlier, but christ it needs to be mentioned again.
 
2013-05-14 03:58:19 PM
Mike Dean is a farking cock
 
2013-05-14 03:58:22 PM

HaywoodJablonski: Ramsey you suck

 
2013-05-14 04:00:23 PM
Di Santo on for Callum Mcmanaman, reason appears to be injury
 
2013-05-14 04:03:20 PM

bennett311: Callum Mcmanaman


This is not a real name.
 
2013-05-14 04:04:01 PM
The last 30 minutes of this match are going to be bonkers.
 
2013-05-14 04:05:06 PM
Ramsey doing his best to play in the Europa league next season....
 
2013-05-14 04:05:20 PM
Better
 
2013-05-14 04:05:24 PM
THEO!!!!!!
 
2013-05-14 04:05:48 PM
WALCOTT, 2-1 Arsenal!!!
 
2013-05-14 04:06:10 PM

cameroncrazy1984: bennett311: Callum Mcmanaman

This is not a real name.


First thing I thought of:
images2.wikia.nocookie.net
 
2013-05-14 04:06:33 PM
I'm growing a pencil thin mustache, and it shall be called Theo.
 
2013-05-14 04:09:31 PM
Ramsey. Seriously
 
2013-05-14 04:10:27 PM
Whew
 
2013-05-14 04:10:36 PM
C'mon Wigan, there's still....ahh...nevermind.
 
2013-05-14 04:10:38 PM
Bah. Well shiat.
 
2013-05-14 04:10:42 PM
3-1!!!! Poldolski chips in another!!!!
 
2013-05-14 04:10:49 PM
POLDI!!!
 
2013-05-14 04:11:12 PM
3 assists for Cazorla
 
2013-05-14 04:12:00 PM
Ramsey still sucks.
 
2013-05-14 04:12:03 PM

star_topology: Mr_H: star_topology:

On a tangential note, I just started playing Football Manager 2013. OH. MY. GOD.

I had to uninstall FM 2012...it was taking up far too much of my time.

Question:
Is there any real "skill" to the game or does it just scratch the itch of managing a club, wheeling and dealing, developing the youth squad, experimenting with tactics, etc?

I've started two campaigns, one with Aston Villa and one with Tottenham. I use similar tactics but still admittedly have a lot of homework to do on that, but it seems that it's all about personnel, there's no overachieving or underachieving ... My Spurs team scores a ton of goals while Villa's concede a metric ton of them, and I went on a 12 game winless run to start a season.


I'm not sure there is.  It seems like Football Manager is either dead easy or the hardest game in the world, at least to me.  I've played three versions of FM.  First one (I think it was 1998) they made you start in the Conference, and I had to cheat massively just to make it to what was then called Division Three only to get relegated again.  Second one (2000) I started with Aberdeen FC and won the Champions League in season three (4-0 against Real Madrid in the final).  I tried again this year with 2013 and it seemed like the game never let me take any control...my Oxford City club would win several games running then start losing games to crazy own goals, missed penalties, and phantom red cards.  Not that it mattered, our club was losing shedloads of money because even when we got to 2nd in the league we were drawing bumper crowds of 200.
 
2013-05-14 04:13:21 PM

TonnageVT: Part of me hopes Wigan goes down, just so we can say City lost to a Championship club.


BTW, any words on Moyes taking over?
 
2013-05-14 04:13:34 PM
Ramsey getting in on the act.
 
2013-05-14 04:13:42 PM
I stand by my statement.
 
2013-05-14 04:13:54 PM
Ramsey?!!?!?!?!??!?!

***checks out the window for locusts....

4-1 Arsenal
 
2013-05-14 04:13:54 PM
Ramsey scored?!

REPENT, FOR THE END IS NIGH
 
2013-05-14 04:14:21 PM
Is that a 4th assist for Cazorla? Ramsey still sucks. Agreed
 
2013-05-14 04:14:58 PM

Langston: Ramsey scored?!

REPENT, FOR THE END IS NIGH


Somebody famous is gonna kick the bucket...and Wigan will be going down.

/Sorry Latics
 
2013-05-14 04:15:00 PM
Just last night, a team came back from a 4-1 deficit in a decisive game...

We can dream, can't we?
 
2013-05-14 04:16:22 PM
Wow, when Wigan collapses....

They still got a chance, but, yeah...probably not.
The Third Man:

I'm not sure there is.  It seems like Football Manager is either dead easy or the hardest game in the world, at least to me.

Some matches I destroyed the opposition (10-0), other times I get destroyed.  I probably should adjust the difficulty level down or something.
 
2013-05-14 04:16:55 PM

star_topology: Just last night, a team came back from a 4-1 deficit in a decisive game...

We can dream, can't we?


We can. We can also hit ourselves in the shins with a ball-peen hammer.

Neither are good ideas.
 
2013-05-14 04:17:07 PM
Confirmed 4 assists for Cazorla
 
2013-05-14 04:17:53 PM
Well that game went downhill in a hurry.
 
2013-05-14 04:18:38 PM

The Third Man: star_topology: Mr_H: star_topology:

On a tangential note, I just started playing Football Manager 2013. OH. MY. GOD.

I had to uninstall FM 2012...it was taking up far too much of my time.

Question:
Is there any real "skill" to the game or does it just scratch the itch of managing a club, wheeling and dealing, developing the youth squad, experimenting with tactics, etc?

I've started two campaigns, one with Aston Villa and one with Tottenham. I use similar tactics but still admittedly have a lot of homework to do on that, but it seems that it's all about personnel, there's no overachieving or underachieving ... My Spurs team scores a ton of goals while Villa's concede a metric ton of them, and I went on a 12 game winless run to start a season.

I'm not sure there is.  It seems like Football Manager is either dead easy or the hardest game in the world, at least to me.  I've played three versions of FM.  First one (I think it was 1998) they made you start in the Conference, and I had to cheat massively just to make it to what was then called Division Three only to get relegated again.  Second one (2000) I started with Aberdeen FC and won the Champions League in season three (4-0 against Real Madrid in the final).  I tried again this year with 2013 and it seemed like the game never let me take any control...my Oxford City club would win several games running then start losing games to crazy own goals, missed penalties, and phantom red cards.  Not that it mattered, our club was losing shedloads of money because even when we got to 2nd in the league we were drawing bumper crowds of 200.



It's probably what Mr_Hsuggested, a lot of baby steps and fine-tuning.

I am finding though that the in-game tactics help a little bit. For Villa, I shout to "lob crosses" for Benteke when he's playing. Not sure how to make that a default tactic though and I think I have more success using a "Instant Result" rather than watching the games play out.
 
2013-05-14 04:19:00 PM

cameroncrazy1984: Well that game went downhill in a hurry.


And Citeh fans are wondering "Why couldn't we do that to them at the weekend?!"

/Because you're not Arsenal
 
2013-05-14 04:19:49 PM
I repeat myself from earlier. If Wigan and Roberto Martinez are such hot shiat, why do they only have 35 points and why are they getting relegated?
 
2013-05-14 04:20:23 PM
Why play Wilshere at this point? He's not 100% and you don't need him.
 
2013-05-14 04:20:32 PM
star_topology:
I am finding though that the in-game tactics help a little bit. For Villa, I shout to "lob crosses" for Benteke when he's playing. Not sure how to make that a default tactic though and I think I have more success using a "Instant Result" rather than watching the games play out.

When I watch the game play out I have more chances to try and micromanage and thus screw up.  Instant Result probably saves you from yourself.
 
2013-05-14 04:22:46 PM

Rwa2play: cameroncrazy1984: Well that game went downhill in a hurry.

And Citeh fans are wondering "Why couldn't we do that to them at the weekend?!"



Because NIAC
 
2013-05-14 04:23:23 PM

HaywoodJablonski: I repeat myself from earlier. If Wigan and Roberto Martinez are such hot shiat, why do they only have 35 points and why are they getting relegated?


I'm wondering if it's more to do with the players, who deep down must know they are part of a feeder club, who might have their sights set on a transfer to a bigger club and thus "winning" isn't really on their collective minds?
 
2013-05-14 04:25:14 PM

star_topology: HaywoodJablonski: I repeat myself from earlier. If Wigan and Roberto Martinez are such hot shiat, why do they only have 35 points and why are they getting relegated?

I'm wondering if it's more to do with the players, who deep down must know they are part of a feeder club, who might have their sights set on a transfer to a bigger club and thus "winning" isn't really on their collective minds?


I'm going to bet that professional athletes, of any kind, are wildly competitive and want to win more than anything in the world.
 
2013-05-14 04:25:50 PM

HaywoodJablonski: I repeat myself from earlier. If Wigan and Roberto Martinez are such hot shiat, why do they only have 35 points and why are they getting relegated?


Injuries and Kone in Africa cup plays a part too.  But every team has to deal with that too.  What's impressive about Roberto is that he put together a competitive (inexperienced) squad with minimal budget.  couple that with each year he loses players via transfers.

But I agree, the EPL is probably better off without Wigan.
 
2013-05-14 04:26:34 PM

mitchcumstein1: Why play Wilshere at this point? He's not 100% and you don't need him.


I'd bet it's to just find a balance between keeping him relatively match fit without giving him enough time to do any real damage.

StRalphTheLiar: Because NIAC


Yes.
 
2013-05-14 04:28:31 PM
Is Squillaci on the bench? He needs to get into the stat sheet this season!
 
2013-05-14 04:29:06 PM

bennett311: HaywoodJablonski: I repeat myself from earlier. If Wigan and Roberto Martinez are such hot shiat, why do they only have 35 points and why are they getting relegated?

Injuries and Kone in Africa cup plays a part too.  But every team has to deal with that too.  What's impressive about Roberto is that he put together a competitive (inexperienced) squad with minimal budget.  couple that with each year he loses players via transfers.

But I agree, the EPL is probably better off without Wigan.


Yeah we lost Gervinho and stopped sucking for a bit

/don't actually remember what happened when he was away
 
2013-05-14 04:29:35 PM

Langston: I'd bet it's to just find a balance between keeping him relatively match fit without giving him enough time to do any real damage.


I get that, but he's having surgery to fix his ankle, and it appears that they're playing in a monsoon, just seems like a risk that doesn't need to be taken.

Granted, Wenger has forgotten more about the game than I could ever know, but it just seems silly.
 
2013-05-14 04:36:11 PM
I'm glad Villa is safe. I'm optimistic about what that group of players can achieve, if they stick together.
 
2013-05-14 04:36:11 PM

mitchcumstein1: star_topology: HaywoodJablonski: I repeat myself from earlier. If Wigan and Roberto Martinez are such hot shiat, why do they only have 35 points and why are they getting relegated?

I'm wondering if it's more to do with the players, who deep down must know they are part of a feeder club, who might have their sights set on a transfer to a bigger club and thus "winning" isn't really on their collective minds?

I'm going to bet that professional athletes, of any kind, are wildly competitive and want to win more than anything in the world.


upload.wikimedia.org
www.underconsideration.com
You'd think so...
 
2013-05-14 04:36:36 PM
Welcome to musical managers, MCFC.  It blows, as your manager can never get a system in place in build around it before he's fired and there's a new plan.

/Chelsea
 
2013-05-14 04:36:49 PM

Rwa2play: TonnageVT: Part of me hopes Wigan goes down, just so we can say City lost to a Championship club.

BTW, any words on Moyes taking over?


Extremely delighted it's him over Mourinho, extremely excited, yet anxious, to see what he does over the off season.

Overall, I'm very happy with the appointment. He's a class manager, he's done amazingly well with Everton's budget, now it's time to see what he does with United.

/Bringing over Baines would be a good start
 
2013-05-14 04:38:30 PM

star_topology: HaywoodJablonski: I repeat myself from earlier. If Wigan and Roberto Martinez are such hot shiat, why do they only have 35 points and why are they getting relegated?

I'm wondering if it's more to do with the players, who deep down must know they are part of a feeder club, who might have their sights set on a transfer to a bigger club and thus "winning" isn't really on their collective minds?


I mean Swansea had the quality and, hey, they'll be in the League next season.  Wigan did have some significant injuries that they had to deal with.  For a paper thin squad like theirs, that's not helpful.
 
2013-05-14 04:39:33 PM
And that's that for Wigan Athletic.

Sadly, they may never come back up again; especially if Martinez moves on.
 
2013-05-14 04:41:10 PM

Trocadero: You'd think so...


The Bobcats are terribly managed.

The Astros?? Those guys probably just aren't good enough to be Major League players.
 
2013-05-14 04:45:52 PM

Daniels: Welcome to musical managers, MCFC.  It blows, as your manager can never get a system in place in build around it before he's fired and there's a new plan.

/Chelsea


Yep. It seems to be the double-edged sword of the billionaire owner(s) that they like to buy great players, but have little patience for their coaches. It's a shame.
 
2013-05-14 04:48:11 PM
Been fun Wigan.
 
2013-05-14 04:52:35 PM

StRalphTheLiar: Is Squillaci on the bench? He needs to get into the stat sheet this season!


So now that I said that, I had to go see if he has actually played this season, and I found 2 interesting tidbits.

1. He did make a single appearance in the CL group stage.
Sebastien started against Olympiacos in the Champions League and was an unused substitute in the Capital One Cup defeat to Bradford.

2. Someone must have made a very convincing fake ID to get him into an Under-21 game.
Sebastien did not feature for the first team in March, though he did make an appearance in Arsenal Under-21s' 1-1 draw at West Ham United.
 
2013-05-14 04:56:52 PM
Let this sink in for a minute....

After 37 rounds, Arsenal have the 2nd best defensive record in the PL.
 
2013-05-14 04:57:30 PM

ADubs86: Been fun Wigan.


Yep.

So we know who's going down. Saturday's all about the CL, right? 3 teams for 2 spots?
 
2013-05-14 05:05:18 PM

StRalphTheLiar: Let this sink in for a minute....

After 37 rounds, Arsenal have the 2nd best defensive record in the PL.


Had they not sold RvP or replaced him with a decent goal scorer, they'd be at least 2nd, if not winning the title.
 
2013-05-14 05:22:43 PM

Gonz: ADubs86: Been fun Wigan.

Yep.

So we know who's going down. Saturday's Sunday's all about the CL, right? 3 teams for 2 spots?


2 Teams essentially. Chelsea have 72, the max Tottenham can get, and have a way superior goal difference. They're in unless they lose huge to Everton and Spurs win huge against Sunderland. A 17 goal swing is necessary to take the Blues out of CL now.

I surmise that Fox Soccer and ESPN will flip a coin, just like last season. One will take the Arsenal game, the other takes the Spurs game. Seeing as Arsenal are ahead in the table right now, I'd bet ESPN takes Newcastle - Arsenal.
 
2013-05-14 06:00:36 PM
UPDATE

Chelsea: Everton
Arsenal: @Newcastle
Spurs: Sunderland

3rd place - Believe it or not, still in play! A Chelsea loss and Arsenal win would make Arsenal 3rd. A Chelsea draw and an Arsenal win by 2 gives Arsenal the edge. There is also a scenario where Arsenal wins 3rd with a 1 goal win, but it's more complicated.

4th place - The above scenarios would leave Chelsea in 4th; Spurs cannot reasonably make up the goal difference on either opponent. Between Arsenal and Spurs, Spurs can only pass Arsenal with a win and an Arsenal draw or loss.
 
2013-05-14 06:03:08 PM

Rwa2play: Mr_H: C'mon Wigan, I believe in you!

/enters his FFPL 2-0 Arsenal victory prediction.
//chews nails

As an Arsenal fan I'm insulted that it had to go this far.  I want Arsenal to win tonight and Sunday...but there's a side of me that thinks sliding down to that Europa League spot would be the slap in the face the club and Wenger have needed for a very long time.  It's magnified by a) Swansea out-Arsenaling Arsenal and b) both Swansea and Wigan winning trophies with far smaller squads than Arsenal.

It annoyed me that Wenger didn't even consider signing someone other than Monreal in January.  Even more so that he thought that Giroud and Podolski would make up for losing RvP.

Maybe the beatdown Munich gave them was even more of a wake up call...but I'll believe that Arsenal are serious about spending big when they actually do in the summer.


Neymar, make it happen
 
2013-05-14 09:23:29 PM

star_topology: Langston: Gonz: C'mon, you plucky Little Team That Could- avoid relegation!

I'd said earlier that it would be really problematic if Arsenal were to drop today's game (not just CL qualifying, but would affect everything down to their wage structure), but regardless of the outcome, it's hard to dislike Wigan.

star_topology: Whether you're a Spurs fan or Arsenal fan... THIS.

I told another Arsenal friend of mine that I wished last year that it sucked that your guys played so well all season and earned fourth place, only to get bumped out with Chelski's surprise upset win against Bayern. I'd honestly rather see Chelski stumble out of the CL.

Based on that, and it might seem like sour grapes, but I truly believe PL deserves a 5th (maybe even 6th) qualifying place, just based on the  competitiveness of the past few seasons.


I have to disagree. In no way, shape or form does the EPL deserve another spot in the UCL, especially when you take into consideration that Germany only has three, and yet here we stand with two German teams in the final, and one of those teams has been in the final three times in the last four years. So if any country deserves another spot, it's Germany.

England's current battle for the top four isn't more exciting that Spain's at the moment either. Real Sociedad (who just came up from relegation) Valencia, Malaga (who won't be able to compete next season in the UCL because of financial issues) and Real Betis can all claim the #4 spot in La Liga. It's actually more exciting in a way, because if Valencia shait the bed and don't get into the Top Four, they'll have to sell stars like Soldado and Guaita. (Guaita has, for my money, been the best keeper in Spain this season.)

The EPL's performances in Europe were terrible this season. They just don't deserve another spot.

/Bayern fan.
//Massive soft spot for La Liga.
///Don't hate the EPL, I just don't watch it as much.
 
2013-05-14 09:45:47 PM

Zyme: Rwa2play: Mr_H: C'mon Wigan, I believe in you!

/enters his FFPL 2-0 Arsenal victory prediction.
//chews nails

As an Arsenal fan I'm insulted that it had to go this far.  I want Arsenal to win tonight and Sunday...but there's a side of me that thinks sliding down to that Europa League spot would be the slap in the face the club and Wenger have needed for a very long time.  It's magnified by a) Swansea out-Arsenaling Arsenal and b) both Swansea and Wigan winning trophies with far smaller squads than Arsenal.

It annoyed me that Wenger didn't even consider signing someone other than Monreal in January.  Even more so that he thought that Giroud and Podolski would make up for losing RvP.

Maybe the beatdown Munich gave them was even more of a wake up call...but I'll believe that Arsenal are serious about spending big when they actually do in the summer.

Neymar, make it happen


If we're gonna spend that type of money, only one player comes to mind: Cavani from Napoli.
 
2013-05-14 09:48:12 PM

Trocadero: mitchcumstein1: star_topology: HaywoodJablonski: I repeat myself from earlier. If Wigan and Roberto Martinez are such hot shiat, why do they only have 35 points and why are they getting relegated?

I'm wondering if it's more to do with the players, who deep down must know they are part of a feeder club, who might have their sights set on a transfer to a bigger club and thus "winning" isn't really on their collective minds?

I'm going to bet that professional athletes, of any kind, are wildly competitive and want to win more than anything in the world.

[upload.wikimedia.org image 200x140]
[www.underconsideration.com image 574x480]
You'd think so...


They have the will to win. They just don't have the ability.
 
2013-05-15 04:30:46 AM
As another Gunner I have mentally prepared for the inevitable drop out of the CL. This seems to be the only significant event that will force the bigger decisions. They can't go on with medium quality players throughout the squad. I have experienced them this season as lackluster and inconsistent. Moments of brilliance mixed with amateur actions. There are a number of players that are good, but have definite weaknesses, and not really any stars. This is my POV...

Also don't forget that the goals last night mainly came from poor defensive strategies, or just plain lapse on the Wigan side.

To be champions a team needs more than what the current Arsenal has, even if it is just belief or desire.
 
2013-05-15 06:31:08 AM

Rwa2play: If we're gonna spend that type of money, only one player comes to mind: Cavani from Napoli.


Arsenal are going to be a selling club for at least another 5 years, if not more. If they didn't have Wenger and the constant competitiveness he has been able to manage without really spending much (relatively speaking), they would probably have "done a Leeds" long ago and had to declare bankruptcy, lose most of their players and been relegated.

http://www.forbes.com/soccer-valuations/list/#page:1_sort:4_directio n: desc_search:
 
2013-05-15 07:03:36 AM

KaisertheCoyote: star_topology: Langston: Gonz: C'mon, you plucky Little Team That Could- avoid relegation!

I'd said earlier that it would be really problematic if Arsenal were to drop today's game (not just CL qualifying, but would affect everything down to their wage structure), but regardless of the outcome, it's hard to dislike Wigan.

star_topology: Whether you're a Spurs fan or Arsenal fan... THIS.

I told another Arsenal friend of mine that I wished last year that it sucked that your guys played so well all season and earned fourth place, only to get bumped out with Chelski's surprise upset win against Bayern. I'd honestly rather see Chelski stumble out of the CL.

Based on that, and it might seem like sour grapes, but I truly believe PL deserves a 5th (maybe even 6th) qualifying place, just based on the  competitiveness of the past few seasons.

I have to disagree. In no way, shape or form does the EPL deserve another spot in the UCL, especially when you take into consideration that Germany only has three, and yet here we stand with two German teams in the final, and one of those teams has been in the final three times in the last four years. So if any country deserves another spot, it's Germany.

England's current battle for the top four isn't more exciting that Spain's at the moment either. Real Sociedad (who just came up from relegation) Valencia, Malaga (who won't be able to compete next season in the UCL because of financial issues) and Real Betis can all claim the #4 spot in La Liga. It's actually more exciting in a way, because if Valencia shait the bed and don't get into the Top Four, they'll have to sell stars like Soldado and Guaita. (Guaita has, for my money, been the best keeper in Spain this season.)

The EPL's performances in Europe were terrible this season. They just don't deserve another spot.

/Bayern fan.
//Massive soft spot for La Liga.
///Don't hate the EPL, I just don't watch it as much.


Germany will be getting 4 spots next season with Italy dropping down to 3. I don't think the EPL deserves more than 5, but Chelsea will most likely win the Europa league and United were a horrible red card away from taking out Madrid. Chelsea won the Champs league last year and England has been the most consistent country in Europe in the last 5-7 years.
 
2013-05-15 12:29:09 PM

xria: Rwa2play: If we're gonna spend that type of money, only one player comes to mind: Cavani from Napoli.

Arsenal are going to be a selling club for at least another 5 years, if not more. If they didn't have Wenger and the constant competitiveness he has been able to manage without really spending much (relatively speaking), they would probably have "done a Leeds" long ago and had to declare bankruptcy, lose most of their players and been relegated.

http://www.forbes.com/soccer-valuations/list/#page:1_sort:4_directio n: desc_search:


This. I don't know where the meme "Wenger won't spend" came from, it's completely obvious he never has any funds and is perfectly fine taking the heat for it. People seem to think he's farking Scrooge McDuck or something, swimming in transfer funds that he can't bring himself to spend.
 
2013-05-15 02:45:50 PM
Benficas' coach is Jesus?
 
2013-05-15 02:48:29 PM
Just as a heads-up to anybody that's looking to discuss the Europa league final; I bumped a fresh thread to the top of the Sports tab a few moments ago.
 
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