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(Telegraph)   Jenny McCarthy is now behind the Taliban in scientific literacy   (telegraph.co.uk) divider line 11
    More: Interesting, Taliban, scientific literacy, Jenny McCarthy, polio, Nuristan, Kabul, World Health Organisation, New Delhi  
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2878 clicks; posted to Politics » on 14 May 2013 at 10:00 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-05-14 04:14:22 PM
1 votes:

Zasteva: DeaH: One of my favorite cousins (on just about any other matter) is also an anti-vaxer. I am not sure why because, on there matters, she is not a stupid woman. I have sent her articles on other reasons, more logical reasons, for the rise in autism diagnoses, but she remains staunch in her belief that vaccines are the key. It makes me very sad.

People have a hard time disassociating cause and effect from statistical correlation, and there are convincing articles that claim a correlation between vaccines and autism. I don't know if those claims are correct, but even if they are, that wouldn't prove causation.

The most interesting thing I've read suggested that what might be happening is that fevers (a common side effect of vaccination) might trigger the onset of autism in children who have the genes for it. If that is true (and it's a big "if" in my opinion) then the questions are -- is there a time window in which fevers can trigger autism, or is it inevitable at the first fever?

Anyone else seen anything like this before, especially info from scientific studies of this question?

Could be total BS for all I know.


The more interesting articles I've seen seem to indicate three main things:

1) A rise in the age of fathers (sperm has better genes when men are under 30)
2) Tech culture is bringing together parents who have have more of a predisposition (mom and dad are both tech workers, and. though both mom and dad are normal, they each have certain traits that indicate they carry genes that may cause autism).
3) In utero factors.

None of these have anything to do with vaccines, and I haven;t found anything that really points to vaccines. What I do know is that the dangers of not vaccinating a significant portion of children is going to cause problems. Actually, it already is, as evidenced by the whooping cough epidemics. My grandmother lost her first husband (my biological grand-dad), her youngest son, and an infant daughter to a whooping cough epidemic in the late 1920s. And now it's back.
2013-05-14 03:37:13 PM
1 votes:

DeaH: To be fair, the polio vaccine was found in the 1950s and became readily available in the late 1950s/early 1960s. So, at least on this matter, they are a mere half century behind.


Yeah, but the basic technology of vaccination is older than that.

Zasteva: Anyone else seen anything like this before, especially info from scientific studies of this question?


This would seem to suggest that autism involves something in pre-natal development, rather than any post-natal environmental factors; relatedly, the journal article (doi:10.1016/j.molmed.2011.03.001) suggests that it may be in part from immune reactions in the mother during pregnancy. In other words, the big factor may not be the kid having a fever, but the mother having one during critical points in development. (Contrariwise, it may be that later fevers are a function of the kid having an underlying autoimmune hypersensitivity.)

There also may be connections to maternal celiac disease and other family history of autoimmune conditions. Interestingly, celiac conditions have increased in recent decades; it's been conjectured to be a result of wheat strains introduced in the "Green Revolution" being more irritating to celiac conditions and/or changes in the amount of wheat in the western diet that increased production from the "Green Revolution" allowed.

But all I know is what I read in random technical journal articles.
2013-05-14 03:17:53 PM
1 votes:

Whiskey Pete: Any idea why they were against it in the first place?


Have we seriously already forgotten about Osama bin Laden?!
2013-05-14 12:35:36 PM
1 votes:
But Jen has nicer tits and less facial hair.
2013-05-14 12:21:04 PM
1 votes:
Okay, investigated a bit for my self. Found interesting stuff, but there's no clear answer.

Fever Plus Mitochondrial Disease Could Be Risk Factors for Autistic Regression -  http://jcn.sagepub.com/content/25/4/429.abstract

Why Fever Helps Autism: A New Theory -  http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1889436,00.html
2013-05-14 12:08:30 PM
1 votes:

DeaH: One of my favorite cousins (on just about any other matter) is also an anti-vaxer. I am not sure why because, on there matters, she is not a stupid woman. I have sent her articles on other reasons, more logical reasons, for the rise in autism diagnoses, but she remains staunch in her belief that vaccines are the key. It makes me very sad.


People have a hard time disassociating cause and effect from statistical correlation, and there are convincing articles that claim a correlation between vaccines and autism. I don't know if those claims are correct, but even if they are, that wouldn't prove causation.

The most interesting thing I've read suggested that what might be happening is that fevers (a common side effect of vaccination) might trigger the onset of autism in children who have the genes for it. If that is true (and it's a big "if" in my opinion) then the questions are -- is there a time window in which fevers can trigger autism, or is it inevitable at the first fever?

Anyone else seen anything like this before, especially info from scientific studies of this question?

Could be total BS for all I know.
2013-05-14 11:37:27 AM
1 votes:

Whiskey Pete: WippitGuud: Whiskey Pete: Any idea why they were against it in the first place?

FTA: "Opposition to the vaccination programme has been driven by conservative clerics who claim it is a plot to sterilise Muslim children, and Taliban commanders who fear it is being used to gather intelligence in their strongholds. "

Thanks..guess i should have read the whole article..


It pretty much the same reasoning as over in some parts of the US and UK. It rather sad we are getting outbreaks of diseases thought to have been eradicated decades ago.
2013-05-14 10:57:51 AM
1 votes:
It's because the CIA used vaccination volunteers as spies to figure out which compound Bin Laden was located... and then came out publicly admitting it.

Intelligence is gathered in all kinds of unsavory ways... but the CIA should think of the big picture when releasing their sources.
2013-05-14 10:10:50 AM
1 votes:

palelizard: Whiskey Pete: Any idea why they were against it in the first place?

They didn't realize how useful autistic bombmakers.


are.
2013-05-14 10:10:09 AM
1 votes:

Whiskey Pete: Any idea why they were against it in the first place?


They didn't realize how useful autistic bombmakers.
2013-05-14 09:41:16 AM
1 votes:
"The Taliban has ended its war on polio vaccination workers and admitted immunisation is the only way to protect children from the disease, its leadership said in a statement issued today. "

...The statement went on, "...Sorry about that whole killing innocent women and 16 year-old girls thing.  Our bad."
 
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