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(The Verge)   [REDACTED] [REDACTED] transparency   (theverge.com) divider line 75
    More: Obvious, GPS tracking unit, foia requests  
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2801 clicks; posted to Politics » on 14 May 2013 at 1:09 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-05-13 11:54:27 PM
4.bp.blogspot.com.

/oblig
 
2013-05-13 11:59:06 PM
And so began the 1000 years of █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █
 
2013-05-14 12:26:07 AM
I've read lots of documents that have most of the words blacked out but all of them is new.  Cool!
 
2013-05-14 12:36:36 AM
Always the same farking story

i.imgur.com
 
2013-05-14 12:52:42 AM

Tatsuma: Always the same farking story

[i.imgur.com image 787x535]


I always wondered why Elrond didn't just push Isildur into the lava when he realized he had become a power-hungry douche.
 
2013-05-14 01:13:13 AM
When are we going to grow up?
 
2013-05-14 01:16:17 AM

MaudlinMutantMollusk: And so began the 1000 years of █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █


Pancakes?
 
2013-05-14 01:16:30 AM
Outside of military operations which must be kept secret for operational security's sake, the government really shouldn't be engaging in anything that should be kept secret, much less so secret that its entire document must be blacked out.
 
2013-05-14 01:18:02 AM

miss diminutive: I always wondered why Elrond didn't just push Isildur into the lava when he realized he had become a power-hungry douche.


King of Elves kills King of Humans? Elves already in decline? Genocide of elves in 3..2..1...

Wait, back on topic... Yet another 'if liberals were really liberals' example.
 
2013-05-14 01:18:57 AM

AverageAmericanGuy: Outside of military operations which must be kept secret for operational security's sake, the government really shouldn't be engaging in anything that should be kept secret, much less so secret that its entire document must be blacked out.


Get this, apparently there's this thing called the CIA? And I've not once been able to find a time in history they weren't being complete assholes.
 
2013-05-14 01:19:41 AM
And if they hadn't censored it, the right would be in here biatching about Obama giving away proprietary information.
 
2013-05-14 01:20:05 AM
That'll hit you right in the toner budget.
 
2013-05-14 01:20:30 AM

MaudlinMutantMollusk: And so began the 1000 years of █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █


I'd like to buy a vowel?
 
2013-05-14 01:26:19 AM

randomjsa: miss diminutive: I always wondered why Elrond didn't just push Isildur into the lava when he realized he had become a power-hungry douche.

King of Elves kills King of Humans? Elves already in decline? Genocide of elves in 3..2..1...

Wait, back on topic... Yet another 'if liberals were really liberals' example.


No one was there to see it. He could have just said he slipped.

But enough threadjack. I always assume that in 99 percent of cases, when a government classifies something it's not for national security reasons but for "we can't let anyone know what we're up to because it's illegal and violates the constitutional rights of our citizens" reasons.
 
2013-05-14 01:27:30 AM

Bonanza Jellybean: That'll hit you right in the toner budget.


Exactly what I was thinking... just how much toner is going to be wasted tomorrow by millions of office derpsters; especially ironic, the government worker derpsters. ;)
 
2013-05-14 01:28:19 AM
So....yeah, I'm not even gonna try to step up to the plate to pretend to defend this one because it's indefensible.

Aren't they supposed to work for us, not above us?

Kinda hard to have buyer's remorse when the alternative was Romney.

But remorse for the direction the system as a whole has gone? Oh yeah.
 
2013-05-14 01:43:04 AM

TalenLee: AverageAmericanGuy: Outside of military operations which must be kept secret for operational security's sake, the government really shouldn't be engaging in anything that should be kept secret, much less so secret that its entire document must be blacked out.

Get this, apparently there's this thing called the CIA? And I've not once been able to find a time in history they weren't being complete assholes.


This was the FBI. Since 9/11 they've gone totally off the rails. They've masterminded more terror plots since then than Al-Qaida and have a network of informants easily ten times the size that Hoover had during the height of COINTELPRO.

Reading this right now:

crooksandliars.com
 
2013-05-14 01:44:33 AM
Kind of silly that Tatsuma, who defends nearly every dastardly deed ever done in the name of Israel, from white phosphorus and assassinations to illegal settling, is so concerned that Obama is letting the FBI do the same shiat it has always done.  I guess our national security isn't worth as much as Israel's?

Well, that is hard to believe, since Tats insisted in a previous thread that dual citizens would never put one country first.  I'm sure there is a valid explanation for him being upset about Obama's rampant abuse of power here, right?
 
2013-05-14 01:45:31 AM

Tatsuma: Always the same farking story

[i.imgur.com image 787x535]


I really like that guy's style. He has a whole thread over at SA and he posts rough drafts and everything. It's kinda neat.

Anyways is anyone really surprised by this? A politician promises something and then goes back on it is like an everyday thing.
 
2013-05-14 01:55:40 AM
Presumably everyone agrees redaction is necessary at times, so why isn't it plausible that documents occasionally exist that need to be *completely* redacted?
 
2013-05-14 01:59:19 AM

randomjsa: miss diminutive: I always wondered why Elrond didn't just push Isildur into the lava when he realized he had become a power-hungry douche.

King of Elves kills King of Humans? Elves already in decline? Genocide of elves in 3..2..1...

Wait, back on topic... Yet another 'if liberals were really liberals' example.


Elrond bore  Vilya by that point in history.

Back on topic though...power corrupts or they are trying to quietly cover up the issue while using the same tools to do so.
 
2013-05-14 01:59:46 AM

fusillade762: This was the FBI.


Oh, sure. I'm sorry, I'm not trying to imply that the CIA are the root of all evil. My point is more that America has been acting like an evil empire for more than just the past five years, or even the past thirteen.
 
2013-05-14 02:01:28 AM

dookdookdook: Presumably everyone agrees redaction is necessary at times, so why isn't it plausible that documents occasionally exist that need to be *completely* redacted?


The Stargate Program
USAF
█ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ 

█ █ █ █ █ █ █ █
 █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █
 
2013-05-14 02:07:31 AM

dookdookdook: Presumably everyone agrees redaction is necessary at times, so why isn't it plausible that documents occasionally exist that need to be *completely* redacted?


Because we know the titles of the documents in question.

I don't need specifics about who is being watched in order to read the fbi guidance memos regarding how to watch people.

To redact those suggests an internal memo is telling agdnts to violate court decided laws - and while I lean conservative on many law enforcement issues, deliberatly violating things the court says requires a warrant isn't one of them.
 
2013-05-14 02:10:58 AM

Smackledorfer: To redact those suggests an internal memo is telling agdnts to violate court decided laws - and while I lean conservative on many law enforcement issues, deliberatly violating things the court says requires a warrant isn't one of them.


So redacting something is equivalent to a conspiracy to cover up something?
 
2013-05-14 02:13:25 AM

dookdookdook: So redacting something is equivalent to a conspiracy to cover up something?


Well they're obviously covering something up, that's the point of redacting an entire document.
 
2013-05-14 02:14:25 AM
miss diminutive:

 I always assume that in 99 percent of cases, when a government classifies something it's not for national security reasons but for "we can't let anyone know what we're up to because it's illegal and violates the constitutional rights of our citizens" reasons.

No, it is mostly what the cat had for dinner. Redaction is not about protecting "secrets" it is about showing who is the boss. Hint: not you.
 
2013-05-14 02:15:01 AM
If I want to see [RECACTED], I'd read SCP. And so far I doubt the FBI is a front to The Foundation

/don't read it late at night
//and sometimes don't when you're having lunch
 
2013-05-14 02:19:17 AM

TheJoe03: dookdookdook: So redacting something is equivalent to a conspiracy to cover up something?

Well they're obviously covering something up, that's the point of redacting an entire document.


Sort of like how Obama refusing to admit he secretly planned Benghazi proves he secretly planned Benghazi?
 
2013-05-14 02:30:27 AM

dookdookdook: Sort of like how Obama refusing to admit he secretly planned Benghazi proves he secretly planned Benghazi?


Not really. This is about an entire document that was redacted.
 
2013-05-14 02:45:21 AM
 
2013-05-14 02:57:58 AM

gozar_the_destroyer: dookdookdook: Presumably everyone agrees redaction is necessary at times, so why isn't it plausible that documents occasionally exist that need to be *completely* redacted?

The Stargate Program
USAF
█ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █

█ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █


Space Invaders?
/pew pew pew
 
2013-05-14 03:02:15 AM

dookdookdook: Smackledorfer: To redact those suggests an internal memo is telling agdnts to violate court decided laws - and while I lean conservative on many law enforcement issues, deliberatly violating things the court says requires a warrant isn't one of them.

So redacting something is equivalent to a conspiracy to cover up something?


Well, I suppose it is a conspiracy in some technical usage of the term.  I didn't think my post was so difficult to follow.

Perhaps I can clarify: I cannot think of a reason why a document with this title ""Guidance for the Minimization of Text Messages over Dual-Function Cellular Telephones" should need redacting.

I fully understand the redaction of specifics regarding ongoing cases, matters of national security, etc.  I do not, however, believe that a memo providing guidance on how the FBI should use trackers following a supreme court decision that says they need a warrant to use a tracker.  If the memo says anything other than "hey, agents, get a farking warrant before you start putting gps trackers on peoples cars, because it is now the law" then there is something fishy imo.  I cannot see why such a memo would require a complete redaction - even if it used an ongoing case as an example of proper or improper gps tracker usage, a partial redaction should still be sufficient.

So what, then, is the purpose for the redaction? My suspicion is that someone was stupid enough to send out a memo saying something like 'hey agents, go ahead and use the gps trackers anyways, and hopefully we can sneak around fruit-of-the-poisonous-tree stuff later on in our casework by pretending we never used them prior to getting a warrant'

Nothing should be redacted unless there is a reason.  This doesn't mean all redaction is a vile cover-up, but in the case of something like this, where I cannot envision a security reason for any level of redaction, much less a complete one, it certainly makes me wonder.

On a sidenote, this is why fark is going downhill:

Submitted links approved:98Bio:penis penis penispenis penis penispenis penis penispenis penis penispenis penis penispenis penis penis
 
2013-05-14 03:05:08 AM

Smackledorfer: My suspicion


There's a lot of this going around with plenty of "what if".
 
2013-05-14 03:10:24 AM

Smackledorfer: I cannot think of a reason why a document with this title ""Guidance for the Minimization of Text Messages over Dual-Function Cellular Telephones" should need redacting.


Perhaps because they gave instructions for a more secure method of communication and want to keep it under wraps for as long as possible.
 
2013-05-14 03:13:02 AM
Something something alex jones
 
2013-05-14 03:15:39 AM

Elmo Jones: gozar_the_destroyer: dookdookdook: Presumably everyone agrees redaction is necessary at times, so why isn't it plausible that documents occasionally exist that need to be *completely* redacted?

The Stargate Program
USAF
█ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █

█ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █  █ █ █ █ █ █ █ █

Space Invaders?
/pew pew pew


Major General? I thought you wanted nothing to do with operation WormholeXtreme.
 
2013-05-14 03:16:12 AM

rnld: Smackledorfer: My suspicion

There's a lot of this going around with plenty of "what if".


If you have a reasonable and valid reason for the FBI to redact this document, feel free to throw it out there.

I am open to possibilities, and I think in my posts I've been quite clear about my thought process. It isn't 'zomg redaction, therefore hypothetical worst case scenario' you know. Plus it isn't like the FBI has a perfect track record.

I am usually the farker defending the FBI when they come up in fark threads. I get called an authoritarian too often on this site to accept also being dismissed as somekind of tinfoil hat anti-federal conspiracy nutter too :)
 
2013-05-14 03:19:42 AM

MacWizard: Smackledorfer: I cannot think of a reason why a document with this title ""Guidance for the Minimization of Text Messages over Dual-Function Cellular Telephones" should need redacting.

Perhaps because they gave instructions for a more secure method of communication and want to keep it under wraps for as long as possible.


Perhaps, but I think the details could be successfully redacted without a 100% redaction of the document.

/shrug
 
2013-05-14 03:22:42 AM
 
2013-05-14 03:25:56 AM

tinfoil-hat maggie: Paint it black : )


Awesome.
 
2013-05-14 03:29:02 AM
I hear the scandals are so bad, the toilet paper in the White House is redacted.
 
2013-05-14 03:51:26 AM

miss diminutive: tinfoil-hat maggie: Paint it black : )

Awesome.


Heh, gotta love the Stones : )
 
2013-05-14 03:57:10 AM
The bad news is that everyone is being spied on all of the time, but the good news is that the spies are so incompetant that they can't even stop two terrorists who called, texted, and tweeted before, during, and after their attack.
 
2013-05-14 03:57:43 AM

Smackledorfer: MacWizard: Smackledorfer: I cannot think of a reason why a document with this title ""Guidance for the Minimization of Text Messages over Dual-Function Cellular Telephones" should need redacting.

Perhaps because they gave instructions for a more secure method of communication and want to keep it under wraps for as long as possible.

Perhaps, but I think the details could be successfully redacted without a 100% redaction of the document.

/shrug


Sure. But then they'd lose the side-effect of having the press focusing so hard on something that probably isn't very important.
 
2013-05-14 03:57:45 AM

miss diminutive: Tatsuma: Always the same farking story

[i.imgur.com image 787x535]

I always wondered why Elrond didn't just push Isildur into the lava when he realized he had become a power-hungry douche.


Because the movie would have been over?
 
2013-05-14 04:04:23 AM

Gyrfalcon: miss diminutive: Tatsuma: Always the same farking story

[i.imgur.com image 787x535]

I always wondered why Elrond didn't just push Isildur into the lava when he realized he had become a power-hungry douche.

Because the movie would have been over?


Because of the backup plan. It works just like the left over extra powers Bush got: Obama wants to use them for good now, but once he is gone the next may once again become the vessel of the Dark Lord.
 
2013-05-14 04:08:34 AM

gozar_the_destroyer: Gyrfalcon: miss diminutive: Tatsuma: Always the same farking story

[i.imgur.com image 787x535]

I always wondered why Elrond didn't just push Isildur into the lava when he realized he had become a power-hungry douche.

Because the movie would have been over?

Because of the backup plan. It works just like the left over extra powers Bush got: Obama wants to use them for good now, but once he is gone the next may once again become the vessel of the Dark Lord.


OK, I like the idea of leftover extra powers....
 
2013-05-14 04:14:11 AM

Gyrfalcon: miss diminutive: Tatsuma: Always the same farking story

[i.imgur.com image 787x535]

I always wondered why Elrond didn't just push Isildur into the lava when he realized he had become a power-hungry douche.

Because the movie would have been over?


No, it would have just been a different movie. Probably with more...

i.imgur.com
 
2013-05-14 04:15:01 AM

Gyrfalcon: miss diminutive: Tatsuma: Always the same farking story

[i.imgur.com image 787x535]

I always wondered why Elrond didn't just push Isildur into the lava when he realized he had become a power-hungry douche.

Because the movie would have been over?


It was in the script I tell ya : )
 
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