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(Huffington Post)   Not News: Students protest tuition increase. News: They take over president's office Fark: Tuition increase is $19,000   (huffingtonpost.com) divider line 129
    More: PSA, Cooper Union, tuition  
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15087 clicks; posted to Main » on 13 May 2013 at 1:14 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-05-13 12:54:16 AM
And the increase doesn't even apply to the students protesting.
 
2013-05-13 01:04:39 AM

Krieghund: And the increase doesn't even apply to the students protesting.


Doesn't mean they shouldn't protest the tuition hike. In fact, that's actually related to why they're protesting:

"All the people upstairs and doing these sorts of actions to keep this school free -- we're not fighting for ourselves," senior Aaron Graham told the Village Voice. "We're fighting for future students because we're all already guaranteed the scholarship we've been given."
 
2013-05-13 01:09:50 AM
So let me get this straight, they have been getting this for free for a long time and now are mad that the next group of students, who can afford it according to the article, might have to actually pay for it?
 
2013-05-13 01:19:14 AM
2.bp.blogspot.com

Gutter is a tool!
 
2013-05-13 01:20:39 AM
Starting in the fall of 2014, new students with the ability to pay will be billed for half the tuition costs, currently $19,000 per semester. Current students won't be affected.

The writing has me confused as to whether this $19K is the full tuition or half; that aside, only students who can afford it will pay.
 
2013-05-13 01:21:19 AM
I'm just curious what kind of alternative solution is being proposed by the protesting students.

How come all I'm hearing is the sound of crickets?

That's what I thought... protestors without an answer.
 
2013-05-13 01:24:11 AM
Tantrum throwing in the face of reality and tough choices doesn't make things change.
 
2013-05-13 01:24:44 AM
It's cute how the students think college is about them.
 
2013-05-13 01:24:51 AM
They're locking the barn door after the horse has left.

Cooper Union financially leveraged themselves into this position years ago. The money simply isn't there, and a protest won't change that. Short of a huge donation to the endowment, I doubt the situation will change.
 
2013-05-13 01:25:11 AM

King Something: Doesn't mean they shouldn't protest the tuition hike. In fact, that's actually related to why they're protesting:


Please read my original comment in a tone of admiration. I'm sorry I didn't make myself clear.
 
2013-05-13 01:25:42 AM
Protest fail! 19k is a lot yeah, but nothing compared to what a lot of schools are charging.

And the school said up front that's only half the full cost, so they actually sound like they're being reasonable, since they're hurting for money.

Stupid whiny kids, get of their lawn.
 
2013-05-13 01:25:45 AM

remus: So let me get this straight, they have been getting this for free for a long time and now are mad that the next group of students, who can afford it according to the article, might have to actually pay for it?


I sort-of understand why people delegitimize protesters as greedy when those protesters have a financial stake in the outcome. However, I will never understand why people delegitimize protesters for the apparent crime of not being motivated by personal monetary gain.

A university that only accepts students it is comfortable offering full-ride scholarships to--an institution that relies on its endowment to provide education without financial burden--is a remarkable thing. Wall-street mismanagement has ended it. For students who have a personal emotional stake in their alma mater, that regrettable betrayal of the university's core principles is clearly worth raising a fuss over.
 
2013-05-13 01:30:40 AM

randomjsa: Tantrum throwing in the face of reality and tough choices doesn't make things change.


except that it frequently does
 
2013-05-13 01:34:40 AM
Health care and education should be subsidized by taxes.
 
2013-05-13 01:35:44 AM

ds394: I'm just curious what kind of alternative solution is being proposed by the protesting students.

How come all I'm hearing is the sound of crickets?

That's what I thought... protestors without an answer.


Step one: irresponsible short-sighted management.

Step two: a fiscal catastrophe necessitating in bailouts or golden parachutes for the rich, and massive cuts to services or pension/wage/benefit cuts for everyone else.

Step three: protests over the fact that, yet again, rich dudes farked up and now everyone else has to make sacrifices on their behalf.

Step four: protests ignored. It's too late to fix this particular crisis. The horses has left the barn. The money is spent, the bills are due, and you've just got to tighten our belts. Goddamned whiners is what they are.

Step five: Step one.
 
2013-05-13 01:37:20 AM
I broke the school.
 
2013-05-13 01:37:41 AM
If the school can no longer provide an education at a price students can afford why don't they just go out of business?
 
2013-05-13 01:39:09 AM

libranoelrose: Health care and education should be subsidized by taxes.


They are. Big time. Both of them. Even before Obamacare healthcare was subsidized (Medicare/Medicaid), and student loans can be either subsidized or unsubsidized, but in either case at ages 18-22 you will NEVER get a better interest rate on a loan than you will with government money. That government money has to come from somewhere.
 
2013-05-13 01:39:32 AM

Ned Stark: randomjsa: Tantrum throwing in the face of reality and tough choices doesn't make things change.

except that it frequently does


When I was in college, I had several professors say that you could get whatever you wanted as long as the school continued to get your money and you yelled loud enough.
 
2013-05-13 01:40:33 AM

Ned Stark: randomjsa: Tantrum throwing in the face of reality and tough choices doesn't make things change.

except that it frequently does


I'm going to have to go with randomjsa on this one... if anyone knows tantrums, it's him
 
2013-05-13 01:42:21 AM

libranoelrose: Health care and education should be subsidized by taxes.


They are. And since the goals set have no upper limit we can keep expecting them to get more expensive.
 
2013-05-13 01:46:43 AM

Krieghund: King Something: Doesn't mean they shouldn't protest the tuition hike. In fact, that's actually related to why they're protesting:

Please read my original comment in a tone of admiration. I'm sorry I didn't make myself clear.


Same here. Good on them for not having the "I got mine, fark you" attitude.


Adolf Oliver Nipples: libranoelrose: Health care and education should be subsidized by taxes.

They are. Big time. Both of them. Even before Obamacare healthcare was subsidized (Medicare/Medicaid), and student loans can be either subsidized or unsubsidized, but in either case at ages 18-22 you will NEVER get a better interest rate on a loan than you will with government money.


Unless you're a bank.
 
2013-05-13 01:47:53 AM

Mrbogey: libranoelrose: Health care and education should be subsidized by taxes.

They are. And since the goals set have no upper limit we can keep expecting them to get more expensive.


If only we had a government that was willing to use its position as a semi-monopsonist buyer to negotiate the prices it pays.

But that is socialism.
 
2013-05-13 01:48:43 AM
Elitist people problems.................
 
2013-05-13 01:53:08 AM
College students always thing they can change the world.... until they are hit with the sledgehammer of reality.
 
2013-05-13 01:53:19 AM
$19,000?  If you take off the 1 and a 0, that takes me back to the way before when one of my roommates was complaining that tuition had just gone up to $900/quarter.

/off the lawn!
 
2013-05-13 01:56:35 AM
19k a semester? Don't think I've paid that, total, and I'm almost through a Master's...
 
2013-05-13 02:03:36 AM

libranoelrose: Health care and education should be subsidized by taxes.


Medicare and Medicaid make up around 20% of the federal budget, and education is more or less locally driven.  California spends around 40% of its budget on education(k-12 and higher ed) and 25% of its budget on medical services, which makes up about 2/3 of the state annual budget.  I don't think this is income from investments or payments for products delivered/services rendered.  Pretty sure it's funded from tax income and debt(future tax income).
 
2013-05-13 02:17:26 AM
If $19k is not a drop in the bucket to you, then you come from a stupid loser family anyway. And in that case, you aren't college material AT ALL.
 
2013-05-13 02:20:54 AM
 
2013-05-13 02:24:27 AM

The All-Powerful Atheismo: Ned Stark: randomjsa: Tantrum throwing in the face of reality and tough choices doesn't make things change.

except that it frequently does

I'm going to have to go with randomjsa on this one... if anyone knows tantrums, it's him
24.media.tumblr.com

 
2013-05-13 02:49:28 AM

BarkingUnicorn: Here's a thorough dissection of what Cooper Union did wrong

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/11/business/how-cooper-unions-endowme nt -failed-in-its-mission.html


Without clicking that link I can tell you that since I see the word business in there this will be how investments were used incorrectly and how the free market should be trusted.
 
2013-05-13 02:52:33 AM

SevenizGud: If $19k is not a drop in the bucket to you, then you come from a stupid loser family anyway. And in that case, you aren't college material AT ALL.


thelastofthemillenniums.files.wordpress.com
 
2013-05-13 03:01:23 AM

libranoelrose: BarkingUnicorn: Here's a thorough dissection of what Cooper Union did wrong

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/11/business/how-cooper-unions-endowme nt -failed-in-its-mission.html

Without clicking that link I can tell you that since I see the word business in there this will be how investments were used incorrectly and how the free market should be trusted.


Used up all your free NYT articles for this month already?
 
2013-05-13 03:02:12 AM

SevenizGud: If $19k is not a drop in the bucket to you, then you come from a stupid loser family anyway. And in that case, you aren't college material AT ALL.


I wish you were more transparent more often.
 
2013-05-13 03:03:35 AM

BarkingUnicorn: libranoelrose: BarkingUnicorn: Here's a thorough dissection of what Cooper Union did wrong

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/11/business/how-cooper-unions-endowme nt -failed-in-its-mission.html

Without clicking that link I can tell you that since I see the word business in there this will be how investments were used incorrectly and how the free market should be trusted.

Used up all your free NYT articles for this month already?


haha, nope

i think it is crazy that people still don't block sites from tracking them
 
2013-05-13 03:13:39 AM

BarkingUnicorn: Here's a thorough dissection of what Cooper Union did wrong

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/11/business/how-cooper-unions-endowme nt -failed-in-its-mission.html


So here's the lesson for these kids: when the rich and powerful screws up, there is no accountability and no one will be held responsible, and it is up to everyone at the bottom (you) to pay the price. If you dare complain, you are afraid of hard work and is everything that is wrong with America.

What a joke; a fading republic.
 
2013-05-13 03:18:33 AM
$19,000 a semester? Do the give you a 24 carat gold diploma after you finish?

/ knew a kid that went to some artsy fartsy art school in NEW YORK CITY; kid said he expected to have $200,000 in loan debt by the time he was done. All for a photography degree.

// He felt his talents were wasted on the biatchy, spoiled girls that pay $500 to get prom pictures. So; he was going to trade that for no guarentee of future income, a mountian of debt and even biatchier models.

/ I told him that he'd probably end up homeless in Central Park; giving BJs to rich business
 
2013-05-13 03:23:21 AM

libranoelrose: Health care and education should be subsidized by taxes.


No.  They should get good grades in HS that can be applied to private grants and work full time while taking more than 18 credit hours a semester in college like I did.  I worked/studied my ass off and still had enough time to drink and smoke dope like a pro...but I had this weird condition called motivation that seems to be scarce among the "I want it now" Veruca Salt generation.that passes for students these days.

/Second Bachelors earned in '04
//Get off my worked for lawn
 
2013-05-13 03:31:38 AM
At this point, only a certain percentage of colleges even give you a positive ROI after 30 years: http://www.payscale.com/college-education-value-2013

/Alum of #70
 
2013-05-13 03:41:32 AM

iheartscotch: $19,000 a semester? Do the give you a 24 carat gold diploma after you finish?

/ knew a kid that went to some artsy fartsy art school in NEW YORK CITY; kid said he expected to have $200,000 in loan debt by the time he was done. All for a photography degree.

// He felt his talents were wasted on the biatchy, spoiled girls that pay $500 to get prom pictures. So; he was going to trade that for no guarentee of future income, a mountian of debt and even biatchier models.

/ I told him that he'd probably end up homeless in Central Park; giving BJs to rich business


That is not particularly high. The average 4-year college degree now costs $33,000 per year, while the market value of having a B.A. drops year to year, and entry-level wages are lower in real terms than at any point in the past half-century.

Of course, all this is probably just because spoiled, elitist Millennials are too lazy to figure out how to bootstrap.
 
2013-05-13 03:48:43 AM

Virtuoso80: At this point, only a certain percentage of colleges even give you a positive ROI after 30 years: http://www.payscale.com/college-education-value-2013

/Alum of #70


Well, then let's tell our kids to just shoot for that high school diploma, amirite? After all, employers don't really want to pay college grad wages anyway. By skipping college, the kids can get out into the workforce four years earlier.
 
2013-05-13 04:21:03 AM

SevenizGud: If $19k is not a drop in the bucket to you, then you come from a stupid loser family anyway. And in that case, you aren't college material AT ALL.


9/10  Keep up the good work.
 
2013-05-13 04:27:23 AM

ypsifly: .but I had this weird condition called motivation that seems to be scarce among the "I want it now" Veruca Salt generation.that passes for students these days.


in the case of Cooper Union you have students that could go to literally any college they want. It's a very very very selective college when it comes to admissions. The people who go there are far from lazy or lacking motivation.
 
2013-05-13 04:48:24 AM

ypsifly: libranoelrose: Health care and education should be subsidized by taxes.

No.  They should get good grades in HS that can be applied to private grants and work full time while taking more than 18 credit hours a semester in college like I did.  I worked/studied my ass off and still had enough time to drink and smoke dope like a pro...but I had this weird condition called motivation that seems to be scarce among the "I want it now" Veruca Salt generation.that passes for students these days.

/Second Bachelors earned in '04
//Get off my worked for lawn


But have you ever ridden a Buffalo?
 
2013-05-13 04:55:15 AM

sbutler: They're locking the barn door after the horse has left.

Cooper Union financially leveraged themselves into this position years ago. The money simply isn't there, and a protest won't change that. Short of a huge donation to the endowment, I doubt the situation will change.


Don't know about Cooper, but there's a LOT of colleges in trouble...despite tuition rising faster than inflation in many cases.

From friends in academia, I know THEY aren't getting raises...but there's more and more administrators and alumni development officers every budget cycle, with fancier offices.  The hilariously tragic ones are where the alumni fundraising is losing money on overhead, and management decides the solution is to hire MORE fundraisers.

Even a college kid should be able to figure that one out :)

Seems to be an iron law of organizations...those doing the actual work eventually lose out to those with time to focus on empire-building.
 
2013-05-13 05:35:10 AM

dj_bigbird: It's cute how the students think college is about them.


What does this even mean?
 
2013-05-13 05:49:55 AM
you're talking to gas pumpers and pizza delivery guys, who are of course going to be the jealous type that want everyone else to work/pay through college and end up owing ~35k for a community college experience.
The whole point of cooper union was the free scholarship and that they were extremely selective.  Sure they have a 12 million dollar shortfall, but i read somewhere that their president makes 750k which is more than double the norm.  So the problem is really a self created one.  Going from 0 tuition to 19k is a huge jump.  I wonder how much all the upper admissions executives make at that school.  I'm fairly sure by eliminating most of those positions you could probably save a few million a year.  Those protesters also have proposals for how to make up that deficit.
 
2013-05-13 05:55:34 AM

iheartscotch: / knew a kid that went to some artsy fartsy art school in NEW YORK CITY; kid said he expected to have $200,000 in loan debt by the time he was done. All for a photography degree.

// He felt his talents were wasted on the biatchy, spoiled girls that pay $500 to get prom pictures. So; he was going to trade that for no guarentee of future income, a mountian of debt and even biatchier models.


I have no idea why people are doing photography degrees. The main reason for doing a degree is to have a piece of paper that says you have knowledge in something. In photography, you just show people your photos. That's it.

And most of the theory can be learnt in a few months.

I know a guy who recently went into industrial photography. He'd been a very good amateur and decided it was what he wanted to do. He got kitted out with a reasonable camera (but only a £1500 one) and then did a load of courses, workshops and masterclasses.

A school friend of mine is a pro sports photographer. No qualifications in it.
 
2013-05-13 06:02:28 AM
FTFA: "will be billed for half the tuition costs, currently $19,000 per semester"

Even so, it's still over 9000.
 
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