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(The Raw Story)   Former Secretary of Defense Robert Gates: Republicans have a "cartoonish impression" of US military capability. OH SNAP   (rawstory.com) divider line 596
    More: Interesting, Secretary of Defense Robert Gates, Benghazi, Special Forced, Bob Schieffer  
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6893 clicks; posted to Politics » on 12 May 2013 at 6:11 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-05-12 09:27:20 PM

Fart_Machine: glmorrs1: Yes, I guess in hindsight, there was a problem. It was 9/11, crazy bad shiat could go down on 9/11! How could we not see that Libya, farking Libya of all places, would be attacked on that date and that we'd need one of those "half a dozen small units" on alert and stationed nearby to take care of it?

According to Gates the biggest problem was the danger of sending small units into an unknown situation.


I find it really funny that people think a small team of special forces people could put down that attack. It's like people think that the special forces are some type of super human bullet proof killing machines or something.
 
2013-05-12 09:27:49 PM
i44.tinypic.com
 
2013-05-12 09:29:04 PM

Popcorn Johnny: 19 Kilo: So, you were a pogue-ass pouge who served during the coldest point in the cold war?  Man, I hope when I need a rotary wing mechanic to explain force on force conflict to me, you're around.

What's wrong, test scores not high enough for aviation?


You actually pulled the elitist card for an MOS with a 105 Mechanical Maintenance minimum score?  That has to the saddest attempt at an OH SNAP I've ever seen.
 
2013-05-12 09:34:38 PM

Hobodeluxe: [1.bp.blogspot.com image 580x270]


GI Joe is full of pussies.  Now Chuck Norris knows where its at:

www.the-other-view.com
 
2013-05-12 09:35:01 PM

Sgt Otter: You actually pulled the elitist card for an MOS with a 105 Mechanical Maintenance minimum score?  That has to the saddest attempt at an OH SNAP I've ever seen.


The test score requirements for my MOS were certainly higher than yours.
 
2013-05-12 09:35:32 PM

Popcorn Johnny: buckler: Tell me, Johnny, when and where did you serve, and in what branch?

US Army 1986 to 1994. Rank: SSG MOS: 67V
Served in Korea, Germany, Texas and Iraq.
Any other questions?


Yes: Seeing as you've been a helicopter mechanic, why don't you have any clue about the unrefueled range of the machines and whether pilots would be in any shape to run a mission in a hostile environment without ground spotters, SAM suppression, or andy logistics on the ground there? Did you farking sleep through BNCOC?
 
2013-05-12 09:39:59 PM

kpaxoid: SunsetLament: what Gates
 Plus, non-experts know more than experts.


Facts aren't as important as believing something really hard.
 
2013-05-12 09:42:48 PM

Popcorn Johnny: 19 Kilo: So, you were a pogue-ass pouge who served during the coldest point in the cold war?  Man, I hope when I need a rotary wing mechanic to explain force on force conflict to me, you're around.

What's wrong, test scores not high enough for aviation?


Herr  Otter schools you a couple posts down, so I'll just content myself with knowing you were one of those dudes who talked about banging wives and TA50 while real soldiers were deployed to combat zones.
 
2013-05-12 09:44:13 PM

demaL-demaL-yeH: Popcorn Johnny: buckler: Tell me, Johnny, when and where did you serve, and in what branch?

US Army 1986 to 1994. Rank: SSG MOS: 67V
Served in Korea, Germany, Texas and Iraq.
Any other questions?

Yes: Seeing as you've been a helicopter mechanic, why don't you have any clue about the unrefueled range of the machines and whether pilots would be in any shape to run a mission in a hostile environment without ground spotters, SAM suppression, or andy logistics on the ground there? Did you farking sleep through BNCOC?


Shush.  His ASVAB score was  really big.  He clearly knows about gunfights.
 
2013-05-12 09:48:11 PM

demaL-demaL-yeH: Yes: Seeing as you've been a helicopter mechanic, why don't you have any clue about the unrefueled range of the machines and whether pilots would be in any shape to run a mission in a hostile environment without ground spotters, SAM suppression, or andy logistics on the ground there? Did you farking sleep through BNCOC?


What in the hell are you talking about? I don't remember laying out an attack plan, so I have no idea what you're trying to argue here.
 
2013-05-12 09:49:47 PM
Wow, Popcorn Johnny's Internet Tough Guy credentials are getting shot down pretty fast.
 
2013-05-12 09:49:51 PM

fusillade762: Bane of Broone: buckler: Bane of Broone: Popcorn Johnny: And democrats are cowards so I guess it all evens out.

[sd.keepcalm-o-matic.co.uk image 600x700]

Huh. Back in the eighties, when I voluntarily offered to give my life to my country in the Army if needed, I was a Democrat. Tell me, Johnny, when and where did you serve, and in what branch?

Johnny doesn't even vote.

JOHNNY DON'T SURF!


Johnny can barely string three words together.
 
2013-05-12 09:52:16 PM

demaL-demaL-yeH: Popcorn Johnny: buckler: Tell me, Johnny, when and where did you serve, and in what branch?

US Army 1986 to 1994. Rank: SSG MOS: 67V
Served in Korea, Germany, Texas and Iraq.
Any other questions?

Yes: Seeing as you've been a helicopter mechanic, why don't you have any clue about the unrefueled range of the machines and whether pilots would be in any shape to run a mission in a hostile environment without ground spotters, SAM suppression, or andy logistics on the ground there? Did you farking sleep through BNCOC?


Tread carefully, you're daring to doubt the military strategery of a REMF.
 
2013-05-12 09:52:48 PM

Evil High Priest: fusillade762: Bane of Broone: buckler: Bane of Broone: Popcorn Johnny: And democrats are cowards so I guess it all evens out.

[sd.keepcalm-o-matic.co.uk image 600x700]

Huh. Back in the eighties, when I voluntarily offered to give my life to my country in the Army if needed, I was a Democrat. Tell me, Johnny, when and where did you serve, and in what branch?

Johnny doesn't even vote.

JOHNNY DON'T SURF!

Johnny can barely string three words together.


Can Johnn climb a flight of stairs without getting wheezy?
 
2013-05-12 09:54:10 PM

BSABSVR: Well, if we are going to schlep troops back and forth randomly based on days that may or may not be symbolic to Islamic militants, then we need to have troops on hot standby on:

January 1st
February 26th
April 18th
June 14th
June 25th
July 4th
August 7th
September 5th
September 11th
October 12th
November 17th
December 25th
The start of Ramadan
The end of Ramadan
Eid Al-Fitr
Eid Al-Adha
The start of Hanukkah
the end of Hannukah
And every other major Jewish holiday
Etc.


And then the wingnuts piss and moan and blame B. Hussein Osama for the deficit going up.

img196.imageshack.us
 
2013-05-12 09:54:36 PM

Gergesa: Hobodeluxe: [1.bp.blogspot.com image 580x270]

GI Joe is full of pussies.  Now Chuck Norris knows where its at:

[www.the-other-view.com image 500x375]


Feh.....Rank amateurs compared:

1.bp.blogspot.com

/Fark yeah!
 
2013-05-12 09:55:14 PM
This thread reminds me of my time in the Army, jealous grunts angry over not being able to qualify for an aviation MOS. I'll leave you guys to your growing circle jerk, much like when I was serving, we tried to keep away from the unwashed masses in combat arms.
 
2013-05-12 09:55:40 PM

EnviroDude: Gates: 911, please send the fire department to my house - I see flames.
911: I´m sorry, they couldn´t possibly get there in time.
Gates: How do you know? Please, please.
911: You have a cartoonish view of fire department capability.

/ripped from RPool


That is a bizarre comparison.

But, attention received.  Congratulations.
 
2013-05-12 09:55:41 PM
Popcorn Johnny: demaL-demaL-yeH:  Did you farking sleep through BNCOC?

What in the hell are you talking about? I don't remember laying out an attack plan, so I have no idea what you're trying to argue here.


That certainly answers my question. Thanks.

/I'll stick with DAT's assessment, then.
 
2013-05-12 09:58:18 PM

Popcorn Johnny: This thread reminds me of my time in the Army, jealous grunts angry over not being able to qualify for an aviation MOS. I'll leave you guys to your growing circle jerk, much like when I was serving, we tried to keep away from the unwashed masses in combat arms.


This was my favorite chairborne ranger retrograde maneuver ever.

demaL-demaL-yeH: Popcorn Johnny: demaL-demaL-yeH:  Did you farking sleep through BNCOC?

What in the hell are you talking about? I don't remember laying out an attack plan, so I have no idea what you're trying to argue here.

That certainly answers my question. Thanks.

/I'll stick with DAT's assessment, then.


Did you just call me a DAT?
 
2013-05-12 09:58:55 PM

ratman999: Why can't we all be adults


Because nearly half of our elected officials are retarded loons with fascist tendencies?
 
2013-05-12 09:59:02 PM

max_pooper: Wow, Popcorn Johnny's Internet Tough Guy credentials are getting shot down pretty fast.


www.empowernetwork.com
 
2013-05-12 09:59:55 PM

Popcorn Johnny: This thread reminds me of my time in the Army, jealous grunts angry over not being able to qualify for an aviation MOS. I'll leave you guys to your growing circle jerk, much like when I was serving, we tried to keep away from the unwashed masses in combat arms.


I see someone has to get to the gym in 26 minutes.
 
2013-05-12 10:01:42 PM
COME on gung-ho right wing themed troll accounts, answer!

If Obama had personally ordered a squad of under armed Navy Seals into Benghazi with zero planning and all of them died, would you have completely been fine and let it go or would you be calling for his impeachment over that?

Please, give me your honest answers on that.
 
2013-05-12 10:02:09 PM

zappaisfrank: [fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net image 500x376]


s3.vidimg02.popscreen.com

Some soups are fuuuunnyyyyy...
 
2013-05-12 10:02:11 PM
19 Kilo:
demaL-demaL-yeH: Popcorn Johnny: demaL-demaL-yeH:  Did you farking sleep through BNCOC?

What in the hell are you talking about? I don't remember laying out an attack plan, so I have no idea what you're trying to argue here.

That certainly answers my question. Thanks.

/I'll stick with DAT's assessment, then.

Did you just call me a DAT?


I was poking fun at his assumed higher ASVAB score superiority complex.
/If you're upset, call me a "crunchy" and we're even.
//Started out 8" SP ARTY.
 
2013-05-12 10:05:01 PM

MisterRonbo: Gyrfalcon: In the same way, sure, four of our Special Forces guys were willing to go to Benghazi, and there was a C-130 that could have taken them, and it's a 4-hour flight from Tripoli-

And what seldom gets mentioned is that the four Special Forces guys in Tripoli weren't equipped for combat. They were on a fact-finding mission, and armed only with 9mm sidearms.  No rifles, no body armor, no grenades, no comm equipment. Dropping off four officers armed with pistols to fight their way through a crowd armed with AKs - gee, what could possibly go wrong?


There was a Marine detachment at the embassy equipped with M-4 assault rifles, shotguns, M203 grenade launchers, hand grenades, body armor, and  possibly a SAW or two.  I think that if the President or someone in their chain of command in the pentagon had ordered the marines, they might have loaned the special forces troops some hardware, don't you?
 
2013-05-12 10:07:06 PM
So If I understand this correctly this means that the GOP have cast Obama in the Role of Black Lex Luthor.
 
2013-05-12 10:07:43 PM

HK-MP5-SD: MisterRonbo: Gyrfalcon: In the same way, sure, four of our Special Forces guys were willing to go to Benghazi, and there was a C-130 that could have taken them, and it's a 4-hour flight from Tripoli-

And what seldom gets mentioned is that the four Special Forces guys in Tripoli weren't equipped for combat. They were on a fact-finding mission, and armed only with 9mm sidearms.  No rifles, no body armor, no grenades, no comm equipment. Dropping off four officers armed with pistols to fight their way through a crowd armed with AKs - gee, what could possibly go wrong?

There was a Marine detachment at the embassy equipped with M-4 assault rifles, shotguns, M203 grenade launchers, hand grenades, body armor, and  possibly a SAW or two.  I think that if the President or someone in their chain of command in the pentagon had ordered the marines, they might have loaned the special forces troops some hardware, don't you?


Too bad the attack didn't happen at the embassy, it happened at the consulate which because it was a consulate, isn't as heavily guarded.
 
2013-05-12 10:07:51 PM

HK-MP5-SD: There was a Marine detachment at the embassy equipped with M-4 assault rifles, shotguns, M203 grenade launchers, hand grenades, body armor, and possibly a SAW or two. I think that if the President or someone in their chain of command in the pentagon had ordered the marines, they might have loaned the special forces troops some hardware, don't you?


I can't tell if you're trolling or just an idiot.
 
2013-05-12 10:08:08 PM

HK-MP5-SD: MisterRonbo: Gyrfalcon: In the same way, sure, four of our Special Forces guys were willing to go to Benghazi, and there was a C-130 that could have taken them, and it's a 4-hour flight from Tripoli-

And what seldom gets mentioned is that the four Special Forces guys in Tripoli weren't equipped for combat. They were on a fact-finding mission, and armed only with 9mm sidearms.  No rifles, no body armor, no grenades, no comm equipment. Dropping off four officers armed with pistols to fight their way through a crowd armed with AKs - gee, what could possibly go wrong?

There was a Marine detachment at the embassy equipped with M-4 assault rifles, shotguns, M203 grenade launchers, hand grenades, body armor, and  possibly a SAW or two.  I think that if the President or someone in their chain of command in the pentagon had ordered the marines, they might have loaned the special forces troops some hardware, don't you?


So you think that when a consulate is attacked the proper response would be disarm the embassy?
 
2013-05-12 10:09:19 PM

HK-MP5-SD: MisterRonbo: Gyrfalcon: In the same way, sure, four of our Special Forces guys were willing to go to Benghazi, and there was a C-130 that could have taken them, and it's a 4-hour flight from Tripoli-

And what seldom gets mentioned is that the four Special Forces guys in Tripoli weren't equipped for combat. They were on a fact-finding mission, and armed only with 9mm sidearms.  No rifles, no body armor, no grenades, no comm equipment. Dropping off four officers armed with pistols to fight their way through a crowd armed with AKs - gee, what could possibly go wrong?

There was a Marine detachment at the embassy equipped with M-4 assault rifles, shotguns, M203 grenade launchers, hand grenades, body armor, and  possibly a SAW or two.  I think that if the President or someone in their chain of command in the pentagon had ordered the marines, they might have loaned the special forces troops some hardware, don't you?


Let's see .... Would the Marine CO loan out equipment to four guys so they can head into a situation with no backup and limited intel to save a consulate that had already been evacuated.  Or would he have kept every weapon he had pointing out over the walls of the embassy he was guarding in case of an attack there?

Decisions, decisions...
 
2013-05-12 10:09:40 PM

HK-MP5-SD: MisterRonbo: Gyrfalcon: In the same way, sure, four of our Special Forces guys were willing to go to Benghazi, and there was a C-130 that could have taken them, and it's a 4-hour flight from Tripoli-

And what seldom gets mentioned is that the four Special Forces guys in Tripoli weren't equipped for combat. They were on a fact-finding mission, and armed only with 9mm sidearms.  No rifles, no body armor, no grenades, no comm equipment. Dropping off four officers armed with pistols to fight their way through a crowd armed with AKs - gee, what could possibly go wrong?

There was a Marine detachment at the embassy equipped with M-4 assault rifles, shotguns, M203 grenade launchers, hand grenades, body armor, and  possibly a SAW or two.  I think that if the President or someone in their chain of command in the pentagon had ordered the marines, they might have loaned the special forces troops some hardware, don't you?


And what, exactly, do you think those four guys could have done against an unknown number of assailants with heavy weapons in a crowded city, even assuming they got there in time to do anything? And who would have taken on the mission they had already been assigned?
 
2013-05-12 10:11:37 PM

HK-MP5-SD: MisterRonbo: Gyrfalcon: In the same way, sure, four of our Special Forces guys were willing to go to Benghazi, and there was a C-130 that could have taken them, and it's a 4-hour flight from Tripoli-

And what seldom gets mentioned is that the four Special Forces guys in Tripoli weren't equipped for combat. They were on a fact-finding mission, and armed only with 9mm sidearms.  No rifles, no body armor, no grenades, no comm equipment. Dropping off four officers armed with pistols to fight their way through a crowd armed with AKs - gee, what could possibly go wrong?

There was a Marine detachment at the embassy equipped with M-4 assault rifles, shotguns, M203 grenade launchers, hand grenades, body armor, and  possibly a SAW or two.  I think that if the President or someone in their chain of command in the pentagon had ordered the marines, they might have loaned the special forces troops some hardware, don't you?


So there was a marine detachment at the "embassy" that was a consulate and they didn't/couldn't fight off the crowd?  So, you're saying Marines are pussies?

Why do you hate America, guy who's online name is a German gun?

/hitler.
//godwin.
 
2013-05-12 10:13:34 PM

draa: Considering most Republicans have never served a day in our military this is no surprise. Fantasize is what chickenhawks do best.


I'm trying to find the exact quote and who said it, but...

War is a grand adventure to those who've never been in one.
 
2013-05-12 10:13:37 PM

19 Kilo: Popcorn Johnny: buckler: Tell me, Johnny, when and where did you serve, and in what branch?

US Army 1986 to 1994. Rank: SSG MOS: 67V

Served in Korea, Germany, Texas and Iraq.

Any other questions?

So, you were a pogue-ass pouge who served during the coldest point in the cold war?  Man, I hope when I need a rotary wing mechanic to explain force on force conflict to me, you're around.


He kind of reminds me of back when Pat Robertson was running for President and started bragging about his service in Korea. Then, some of his servicemates pointed out that his main job was making sure the bars at the Base Camp Officers Club stayed stocked. One retired officer said "The closest Pat Robertson ever came to action was at a Tokyo whorehouse."
 
2013-05-12 10:17:17 PM

stoli n coke: 19 Kilo: Popcorn Johnny: buckler: Tell me, Johnny, when and where did you serve, and in what branch?

US Army 1986 to 1994. Rank: SSG MOS: 67V

Served in Korea, Germany, Texas and Iraq.

Any other questions?

So, you were a pogue-ass pouge who served during the coldest point in the cold war?  Man, I hope when I need a rotary wing mechanic to explain force on force conflict to me, you're around.

He kind of reminds me of back when Pat Robertson was running for President and started bragging about his service in Korea. Then, some of his servicemates pointed out that his main job was making sure the bars at the Base Camp Officers Club stayed stocked. One retired officer said "The closest Pat Robertson ever came to action was at a Tokyo whorehouse."


I hate to defend Pat Robertson but keeping the bar stocked is a very important job.
 
2013-05-12 10:18:55 PM

Radioactive Ass: hubiestubert: Well, he's right. Folks seem to think that their military is sitting in a room waiting to be unleashed like a video game. You have X amount of units, and they can respond immediately to any threat within their area of operations at a moment's notice. That we have everyone on alert, 24 hours a day, and that units are just waiting to be sent out, planes and helicopters gassed up and ready, and already armed with various payloads, and pilots just pick the plane or chopper that is right for the mission like it's some kind of game.

Sh*t ain't like that. And that we have folks on the Armed Services Committee without any working knowledge of how our military works, is damn frightening.

I'd just say that this comment by Gates:

"We don't have a ready force standing by in the Middle East - despite all the turmoil that's going on - with planes on strip alert, troops ready to deploy at a moment's notice. And so, getting somebody there in a timely way would have been very difficult, if not impossible."

Is a problem. Let's just say it. It's September 11th, in the Middle East, with known turmoil going on, Why the hell wouldn't you have some forces in the area on standby in case something does happen and they are needed? The guys in the consulate wouldn't know that you didn't. It's not exactly an unreasonable (or "Cartoonish") idea to assume that you had someone in charge who could think ahead enough to be prepared just in case.

If it had happened on, say, the 11th of February or whatever then I could understand it. You are correct, we don't usually have troops on hot standby 24\7 and haven't for a very long time (Cold war era). But to have to go to Norther Italy, Spain and Croatia for men and equipment (and even then they aren't on standby, on Sept. 11th) is a major screw up by someone.


How many 9-11th have gone by with nothing?
 
2013-05-12 10:19:01 PM

glmorrs1: You should be asking this to Radioactive Ass, he's the one that said we just needed half a dozen units to take care of any problem that may arise anywhere in world on a moments notice.


Oops, sorry man... Easy to lose track of what's flippant and what isn't in a thread like this.

Philip Francis Queeg: THats not diplomatically possible. Consulate security is always the responsibility of the host country. The US would never allow a foreign military presence at every consulate in the US.


You just double-tapped one of the underlying points right between the eyes. If a bunch of American nutbars protested a Muslim diplomatic facility on our soil, and things got out of hand, we would never allow foreign special forces to land 12 hours later and start firing randomly into the crowd. We would insist those Americans responsible be arrested by American law enforcement officers, be given an American defense attorney, be tried in an American court, and sent to an American prison if convicted.

When citizens from a nation like Libya resort to violence, the onus to defuse the situation is upon them. They didn't do it. One of the first Muslim nations to ever sign a treaty with the United States failed to live up to their side of the bargain... and our reaction is to blame the administration for not instantly sending US troops through a magic portal.

In the future, any nation that doesn't provide a swift, local response should be dealt with by losing all diplomatic relations and foreign aid, and hit with immediate trade sanctions. Either act like a 21st century government, or say goodbye.  Turkey, Qatar, Kuwait, Malaysia, or Indonesia would have had every pair of boots within 50 miles curb-stomping that mob into submission if it happened inside their countries.
 
2013-05-12 10:20:49 PM

HK-MP5-SD: MisterRonbo: Gyrfalcon: In the same way, sure, four of our Special Forces guys were willing to go to Benghazi, and there was a C-130 that could have taken them, and it's a 4-hour flight from Tripoli-

And what seldom gets mentioned is that the four Special Forces guys in Tripoli weren't equipped for combat. They were on a fact-finding mission, and armed only with 9mm sidearms.  No rifles, no body armor, no grenades, no comm equipment. Dropping off four officers armed with pistols to fight their way through a crowd armed with AKs - gee, what could possibly go wrong?

There was a Marine detachment at the embassy equipped with M-4 assault rifles, shotguns, M203 grenade launchers, hand grenades, body armor, and  possibly a SAW or two.  I think that if the President or someone in their chain of command in the pentagon had ordered the marines, they might have loaned the special forces troops some hardware, don't you?


Oh, hey, another person that has no clue about military logistics.  First of all, SF isn't hostage rescue, they aren't infantry, they aren't equipped or trained to handle this type of situation.  Those 4 guys wanted to do the right thing, but were ill equipped to do so.  Second of all, why would the Libyans have let the SF team leave when they still hadn't let the CIA/Contractor team leave?  Third, why would you shift resources away from the embassy when the embassy is on alert?
 
2013-05-12 10:21:27 PM

Popcorn Johnny: This thread reminds me of my time in the Army, jealous grunts angry over not being able to qualify for an aviation MOS. I'll leave you guys to your growing circle jerk, much like when I was serving, we tried to keep away from the unwashed masses in combat arms.


Sir Johnny bravely ran away!
 
2013-05-12 10:27:27 PM
Republicans have a cartoonish impression of everything. Nothing in their worldview is based on reality.
 
2013-05-12 10:28:41 PM

Lionel Mandrake: Popcorn Johnny: This thread reminds me of my time in the Army, jealous grunts angry over not being able to qualify for an aviation MOS. I'll leave you guys to your growing circle jerk, much like when I was serving, we tried to keep away from the unwashed masses in combat arms.

Sir Johnny bravely ran away!


When danger reared its ugly head he bravely turned his tail and fled.

Yes, Sir Johnny turned about and gallantly he chickened out.

Bravely taking to his feet he beat a very brave retreat.
 
2013-05-12 10:30:51 PM

Mrtraveler01: SunsetLament: Listen, I don't give a fark what Gates said ... if an American Ambassador in a war zone says "We are under attack" you don't fark around and say "Oh, well, we don't have a plan in place so we can't help." - you farking send whatever you have available and improvise and do your best.  Gates' comments are embarrassing.  Anybody who believes what Gates said is too farking incompetent to be in a leadership position in our military (or federal law enforcement); end of story.  You don't leave people on the battlefield (where it may be) because you haven't farking gameplanned out all the scenarios.  And while we're at it; this was an consulate in the middle of one of the most dangerous places in the world ... why wasn't there a farking "Holy shiat we're under attack, we need to save a mass of people who have been driven out of the buildings IMMEDIATELY" plan?

Embarrassing.

So whose word should I value more, someone who has been in the military for decades and is the Secretary of Defense...or some guy on the internet?

Yes...let's just throw more people into the situation without thinking about it. Because evaluating the pros and cons of a situation is for pussies.


Who has the most to lose.? The administration that lied to us from day one about why this happen? The state and defense departments that got their arses handed to them?

The guys trying to save their careers?

Or the dead guys?
 
2013-05-12 10:31:16 PM

Popcorn Johnny: This thread reminds me of my time in my fantasy Army, jealous grunts angry over not being able to qualify for an aviation MOS, my GI Joe doll giving me the silent treatment yet again because I refuse to put clothes on him, instead choosing to promote my Cabbage Patch doll to the rank of Brigadier General. I'll leave you so I can imagine you guys to your growing circle jerk, much like when I was serving in my bedroom, we tried to keep away from the unwashed masses in combat arms, but then mom would call out for dinner and I'd have to put on my big boy pants.


FIFY.
 
2013-05-12 10:34:06 PM

fusillade762: Bane of Broone: buckler: Bane of Broone: Popcorn Johnny: And democrats are cowards so I guess it all evens out.

[sd.keepcalm-o-matic.co.uk image 600x700]

Huh. Back in the eighties, when I voluntarily offered to give my life to my country in the Army if needed, I was a Democrat. Tell me, Johnny, when and where did you serve, and in what branch?

Johnny doesn't even vote.

JOHNNY DON'T SURF!


Does not approve
 
2013-05-12 10:34:20 PM

Philip Francis Queeg: well then tell us exactly what response time you think should been in place throughout the mid east. two hours? 4? 12?


4 to 5 depending upon the location would have been reasonable in my opinion (from getting the word to go until landing).

Karac: That's, at most, an hour and 45 minutes between the beginning of the attack and the death of the ambassador. You say that the military should have had someone standing by that could have saved their lives. One hour to just get to Benghazi is consistent with your requirement since they'd still need time to fight off the attackers.

Nice of you to admit that your own criteria are cartoonish.


What? That was not what my comments are addressing at all. I'm saying that apparently nobody even thought that it might be a good idea to have some people being more prepared than what they were on that particular date. I have already said that I don't know if it would have helped or not. Nobody else could have known that at the time or a week before that either for that matter. However they knew that the date had some importance and that there was already ongoing turmoil and apparently took no steps to prepare for the increased likelihood that someone might try something violent against some of our interests in the Middle East.
 
2013-05-12 10:35:23 PM

Popcorn Johnny: clkeagle: And in urban settings

Tanks are very effective in urban settings.


Sometimes . . .

stevenhomartialarts.com
 
2013-05-12 10:35:56 PM

Empty Matchbook: fusillade762: Bane of Broone: buckler: Bane of Broone: Popcorn Johnny: And democrats are cowards so I guess it all evens out.

[sd.keepcalm-o-matic.co.uk image 600x700]

Huh. Back in the eighties, when I voluntarily offered to give my life to my country in the Army if needed, I was a Democrat. Tell me, Johnny, when and where did you serve, and in what branch?

Johnny doesn't even vote.

JOHNNY DON'T SURF!


Let's try that again WITH the preview button!

mimg.ugo.com

Does not approve!
 
2013-05-12 10:41:11 PM

EnviroDude: Who has the most to lose.? The administration that lied to us from day one about why this happen? The state and defense departments that got their arses handed to them?

The guys trying to save their careers?

Or the dead guys?


Why should anybody have anything to lose from this? Why hasn't a single person involved with the perpetuation of this so-called scandal and said "hey, maybe bickering and pointing fingers isn't going to bring them back to life. Maybe we should sit Republicans, Democrats, State, Defense, and Intelligence officials down like adults, and figure out how to prevent a future attack?"

The only groups who seem to think they have anything to lose by doing what I said:
1. Elected officials with an "R" by their names
2. Fox News' shareholders
 
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