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(New York Daily News)   If 3D plastic guns are outlawed, only 3D plastic criminals will have them   (nydailynews.com) divider line 359
    More: Asinine, Chuck Schumer, Defense Distributed, Liberator, Security checkpoint, plastic guns  
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8303 clicks; posted to Main » on 05 May 2013 at 5:47 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-05-05 07:58:13 PM

redmid17: Vlad_the_Inaner: redmid17: Vlad_the_Inaner: vadum: I have never worked for the TSA, but unless they are using plastic bullets, I think they can still detect them.

I have invented this very hard but non-metallic material.

I think I'll call it....'glass'

[ecx.images-amazon.com image 160x160]

Sweet let me know when you figure out a way to propel it at high velocity without gun powder.

you're right.  I'll start working on non-metallic gun power right away!

/done!

You don't know much about airport security do you? I'm guessing you also don't know what would happen to glass if it were subjected to the kind of pressure that would gun powder would produce.


Fly out of the barrel and hit it's target intact? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aMTZTIdD0A8
 
2013-05-05 07:58:20 PM
redmid17 et al.: You don't know much about airport security do you? I'm guessing you also don't know what would happen to glass if it were subjected to the kind of pressure that would gun powder would produce.

gun powder already is non-metallic. the brass is the issue. you're gonna have to load spider silk ink into your printer to replicate the brass that holds modern rounds.
 
2013-05-05 07:58:40 PM
For the love of Christ, would you people stop banning every damn thing you see!?
Turning America into another miserable police state isn't supposed to be a farking race between politicians.

/Now You're banning things that barely even exist yet.
/and when they do, they will not even replace existing home made weapons.
/doesn't Schumer have things like poverty and corruption to solve?  He's got an awfully empty schedule to be worrying about crap like this.
 
2013-05-05 08:01:01 PM
Another growing trend in 3D printing is sex toys. Folks are sharing design files and printing up their own. Refer to the picture I posted up thread of the rough surface of home printed items. I predict more folks will be injured or even die from infections from impossible to clean dildos covered in nooks and crannies than from 3D printed weapons in the near future.
 
2013-05-05 08:01:06 PM

PaLarkin: A plastic gun used for an assassination only needs to be fired once or twice.  Since it's made of plastic it can easily be burned or melted beyond recognition.


a remington 700 in .308 with a leupould scope will run you about 1400 and will give you time to leave the grassy knoll.
 
2013-05-05 08:03:15 PM

vygramul: albuquerquehalsey: Tellingthem: Oh I know but things will get there someday.

they won't

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_density

Antimatter power-packs?

Nuclear batteries?

Berillium Spheres?


I believe the folks a CERN are working on efficiently cooling and capturing antihydrogen without annihilating nearly 100% of what they make. iirc
 
2013-05-05 08:05:20 PM

Jon iz teh kewl: Marmite


no, i'd order it from a chinese chemical shop. like i currently do. both methylcobalamin and cyanocobalamin. and we're working on getting adenosylcobalamin, although it's $8000 a kilo or something.
 
2013-05-05 08:06:16 PM

utah dude: redmid17 et al.: You don't know much about airport security do you? I'm guessing you also don't know what would happen to glass if it were subjected to the kind of pressure that would gun powder would produce.

gun powder already is non-metallic. the brass is the issue. you're gonna have to load spider silk ink into your printer to replicate the brass that holds modern rounds.


Airport security looks for gun powder. That was my point.

GUTSU: redmid17: Vlad_the_Inaner: redmid17: Vlad_the_Inaner: vadum: I have never worked for the TSA, but unless they are using plastic bullets, I think they can still detect them.

I have invented this very hard but non-metallic material.

I think I'll call it....'glass'

[ecx.images-amazon.com image 160x160]

Sweet let me know when you figure out a way to propel it at high velocity without gun powder.

you're right.  I'll start working on non-metallic gun power right away!

/done!

You don't know much about airport security do you? I'm guessing you also don't know what would happen to glass if it were subjected to the kind of pressure that would gun powder would produce.

Fly out of the barrel and hit it's target intact? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aMTZTIdD0A8


That is enlightening.
 
2013-05-05 08:07:37 PM

way south: /Now You're banning things that barely even exist yet.


we're trying to ban gay marriage but the liberals won't let us.
 
2013-05-05 08:11:19 PM

utah dude: PaLarkin: A plastic gun used for an assassination only needs to be fired once or twice.  Since it's made of plastic it can easily be burned or melted beyond recognition.

a remington 700 in .308 with a leupould scope will run you about 1400 and will give you time to leave the grassy knoll.


That's one helluva markup. I could get the same setup at Walmart for $800 easy.
 
2013-05-05 08:13:12 PM

jayphat: utah dude: PaLarkin: A plastic gun used for an assassination only needs to be fired once or twice.  Since it's made of plastic it can easily be burned or melted beyond recognition.

a remington 700 in .308 with a leupould scope will run you about 1400 and will give you time to leave the grassy knoll.

That's one helluva markup. I could get the same setup at Walmart for $800 easy.


not with those optics you won't
 
2013-05-05 08:14:49 PM

utah dude: Jon iz teh kewl: Marmite

no, i'd order it from a chinese chemical shop. like i currently do. both methylcobalamin and cyanocobalamin. and we're working on getting adenosylcobalamin, although it's $8000 a kilo or something.


why don't you order MDPV too (for your sexual health)
 
2013-05-05 08:15:32 PM
F Schumer.
 
2013-05-05 08:17:43 PM
Because, yeah, banning the sharing of information has worked so well in the past.

img105.imageshack.us
 
2013-05-05 08:19:20 PM

utah dude: jayphat: utah dude: PaLarkin: A plastic gun used for an assassination only needs to be fired once or twice.  Since it's made of plastic it can easily be burned or melted beyond recognition.

a remington 700 in .308 with a leupould scope will run you about 1400 and will give you time to leave the grassy knoll.

That's one helluva markup. I could get the same setup at Walmart for $800 easy.

not with those optics you won't


A $600 rifle and $200 scope?
 
2013-05-05 08:20:23 PM

Jon iz teh kewl: utah dude: Jon iz teh kewl: Marmite

no, i'd order it from a chinese chemical shop. like i currently do. both methylcobalamin and cyanocobalamin. and we're working on getting adenosylcobalamin, although it's $8000 a kilo or something.

why don't you order MDPV too (for your sexual health)


sexual health? isn't it better for chewing the faces off of guys in florida?

b12 is a supplement/vitamin, man, not something from erowid/lycaeum.
 
2013-05-05 08:20:58 PM

vygramul: Thunderboy: Something tells me it would be a lot cheaper and easier to just buy a shiat .22 on the street than it would be to buy a Makerbot, supplies, ammunition (or are they printing that too?), download the schematic, print a test run, then print the actual gun.

What makes you think you're limited to a semiautomatic 3D printed gun?


Huh?
 
2013-05-05 08:21:21 PM

utah dude: Jon iz teh kewl: utah dude: Jon iz teh kewl: Marmite

no, i'd order it from a chinese chemical shop. like i currently do. both methylcobalamin and cyanocobalamin. and we're working on getting adenosylcobalamin, although it's $8000 a kilo or something.

why don't you order MDPV too (for your sexual health)

sexual health? isn't it better for chewing the faces off of guys in florida?

b12 is a supplement/vitamin, man, not something from erowid/lycaeum.


it's a powder.  powders are ALL the same
 
2013-05-05 08:21:27 PM

jayphat: utah dude: jayphat: utah dude: PaLarkin: A plastic gun used for an assassination only needs to be fired once or twice.  Since it's made of plastic it can easily be burned or melted beyond recognition.

a remington 700 in .308 with a leupould scope will run you about 1400 and will give you time to leave the grassy knoll.

That's one helluva markup. I could get the same setup at Walmart for $800 easy.

not with those optics you won't

A $600 rifle and $200 scope?


i was thinking about 700 for both, brah.
 
2013-05-05 08:22:33 PM
sexual health? isn't it better for chewing the faces off of guys in florida?

b12 is a supplement/vitamin, man, not something from erowid/lycaeum.

it's a powder.  powders are ALL the same


except b12 is a bright red purple and everything else is 'free flowing white powder'.
 
2013-05-05 08:27:18 PM

utah dude: sexual health? isn't it better for chewing the faces off of guys in florida?

b12 is a supplement/vitamin, man, not something from erowid/lycaeum.

it's a powder.  powders are ALL the same

except b12 is a bright red purple and everything else is 'free flowing white powder'.


Dude, he's just a yapping little lap dog. He lacks the finesse to be a troll even.
 
2013-05-05 08:28:44 PM

redmid17: You don't know much about airport security do you? I'm guessing you also don't know what would happen to glass if it were subjected to the kind of pressure that would gun powder would produce.


Sure dude, its unpossible!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aMTZTIdD0A8ith regard to plastic guns

/topic started on metal detectors with regard to plastic guns.  Yes, I do know how those work.  Talk about backscatter xrays, etc, came later in the thread
 
2013-05-05 08:29:28 PM

redsquid: The above items were produced with consumer level 3D printers. Look at how rough and imperfect the surface is. This technology will not produce the tolerances necessary for a working gun.


And here's what a hobbyist level machines are capable of. Note that complaining about surface finish is kinda useless without scale reference...

i.imm.io

4.bp.blogspot.com

=Smidge=
 
2013-05-05 08:30:52 PM

utah dude: jayphat: utah dude: jayphat: utah dude: PaLarkin: A plastic gun used for an assassination only needs to be fired once or twice.  Since it's made of plastic it can easily be burned or melted beyond recognition.

a remington 700 in .308 with a leupould scope will run you about 1400 and will give you time to leave the grassy knoll.

That's one helluva markup. I could get the same setup at Walmart for $800 easy.

not with those optics you won't

A $600 rifle and $200 scope?

i was thinking about 700 for both, brah.


That's what I was originally. Where is this guy getting 1400?
 
2013-05-05 08:31:34 PM
bah,
I wasted time trying to find a reference on civil was glass musket balls
 
2013-05-05 08:35:39 PM

Thunderboy: vygramul: Thunderboy: Something tells me it would be a lot cheaper and easier to just buy a shiat .22 on the street than it would be to buy a Makerbot, supplies, ammunition (or are they printing that too?), download the schematic, print a test run, then print the actual gun.

What makes you think you're limited to a semiautomatic 3D printed gun?

Huh?


It's probably a lot cheaper and easier to buy a Makerbot and supplies, download the schematic, print a test run, then print the actual gun (ammunition has to be bought for both, so you can't list that in only one column of expenses) than trying to buy an M-60 on the street.

That's the real threat. Al Qeda doesn't have to send or buy weapons here. Just get the guys here with some money, and they have everything they need.
 
2013-05-05 08:38:31 PM

Smidge204: redsquid: The above items were produced with consumer level 3D printers. Look at how rough and imperfect the surface is. This technology will not produce the tolerances necessary for a working gun.

And here's what a hobbyist level machines are capable of. Note that complaining about surface finish is kinda useless without scale reference...

[i.imm.io image 800x623]

[4.bp.blogspot.com image 850x637]

=Smidge=


Even if the plastic was strong enough to handle the forces (it isn't), that still wouldn't be smooth enough to create a good enough seal to achieve decent muzzle velocity. It's a non-issue and it will be for quite some time. This fear mongering just clouds the real issue of how 3D printing technologies will be implemented in the home. My prediction is that they won't become nearly as ubiquitous as paper printers, despite the boosterism from the enthusiasts.
 
2013-05-05 08:41:28 PM
Make a gun?  Seriously, most geeks with a 3D printer will probably try to make a real doll.
 
2013-05-05 08:44:50 PM

PsyLord: Make a gun?  Seriously, most geeks with a 3D printer will probably try to make a real doll.


Ah, the Kwame angle

didn't occur to me
 
2013-05-05 08:45:50 PM
As long as I can still print out my bitcoins.
 
2013-05-05 08:46:05 PM

redsquid: Even if the plastic was strong enough to handle the forces (it isn't)


It is.

redsquid: that still wouldn't be smooth enough to create a good enough seal to achieve decent muzzle velocity.


Depends on what you're trying to accomplish. I agree that nobody will be printing sniper or large caliber hunting rifles any time soon, but people have been making serviceable firearms out of common household items since practically the invention of firearms.

That said, I think these guys trying to grab all this media attention about printed guns need a beatdown. A**holes ruining it for everyone, IMHO. This is why we can't have nice things.

Nice job moving that goalpost, BTW.
=Smidge=
 
2013-05-05 08:46:32 PM
Listening to the left talk about guns is starting to become detrimental to our health
 
2013-05-05 08:54:31 PM
Never underestimate the ingenuity of a human being, why not use glass projectiles and a compressed gas propellant? Think paintball gun, but much higher pressures. No cartridge, no explosion, repeat fire and can be made entirely out of plastic with NO metal parts.

/would be totally legal too
//10 watt laser would be deadly as well
 
2013-05-05 08:54:45 PM

BarkingUnicorn: Antivirus companies can play their game in this market and make some money.  Add software to 3D printers that checks each file against a signature database and rejects files that print guns.  Charge subscription fees for updates.  Same business model they follow now.  Make it mandatory for all 3D printers and buyers.

Of course signature-based protection isn't complete.  For an additional fee, we can give you behavioral and heuristic real-time protection against uncatalogued "threats."  Anything that might be a gun part will be rejected.


What happens when they 3d print 3d printers that don't have that requirement, wise guy? Or if they 3d print those 3d printers they used to 3d print the 3d printers to print the 3d guns? Betcha didn't consider that.
 
2013-05-05 08:58:28 PM

GUTSU: redsquid: [farm5.staticflickr.com image 240x180]

[s3files.core77.com image 468x597]

The above items were produced with consumer level 3D printers. Look at how rough and imperfect the surface is. This technology will not produce the tolerances necessary for a working gun. This isn't even considering the weakness of the thermoplastic used in the lower end 3D printers. Fear exists in the absence of knowledge.

[i.imgur.com image 577x428]
Yes, look at the extreme precision of the the tooling on this firearm, such tolerances far beyond anything a machine could do!


Stop trying to educate the ignorant. This is the internet dammit.
 
2013-05-05 08:59:53 PM

BraveNewCheneyWorld: So why have regular metalworking tools been legal forever?  The general public has had access to metal working tools which can very easily make guns.  Illegal gun manufacturing has never been a significant issue in this country, so why is it now, when a device that can print shoes isn't far out of reach, that politicians suddenly care about illegally manufactured guns?

This isn't about guns, this is about manufacturers trying to keep you from being able to make your own products.


Yes. This is about distribution control in the nine gazillion bazillion dollar stuff market. All the rest: the guns (and all the other ooga booga that is sure to pop up in the coming years) is just a distraction to slow things down, so the People Who Make Stuff can try to figure out how to regain control before things really get out of hand.

Go through your house folks, and add up the retail value of everything small enough to hold in your hand: shoes, reading glasses, dishes... Do it, down to the last item, then multiply that number by seven or eight billion.

THAT'S what this is about. The rest is just entertainment.
 
2013-05-05 09:04:51 PM

Oh_Enough_Already: The vast majority of the murders in this country are committed by semi-illiterate big city gangbangers who couldn't spell "3" let alone "3-D Plastic Printer."

We're supposed to be worried about this why, again, exactly?


Actually, I didn't think about this, but you've got a good point...kinda.  We shouldn't be afraid of gangbangers printing out guns via a 3D printer.  It's kind of hard to look like a bad ass thug when your gun is plastic and just came out of the same printer your girlfriend used to print out a Bratz doll for her daughter.  It's really tough to imagine a thug saying "You stole your $500 gun, pish, I printed mine out for nothing.  I'm okay shooting some fools, but I will not steal a gun, and I won't pass a background check, so I printed mine off."
 
2013-05-05 09:07:18 PM

jjorsett: "Now anyone, a terrorist, someone who is mentally ill, a spousal abuser, a felon, can essentially open a gun factory in their garage," he said. "It must be stopped."

How, Chuck? You've got 3D printers, which you say you have no problem with, and you have digital design files, which are essentially abstractions out there in the ether. What are you going to make illegal that could possibly stop somebody from obtaining and putting these two things together if they want? You're trying to ban an idea, you dope.


He's a borderline senile old fool who has two, and only two, loyalties: keeping his butt in his congressional seat, and the power of control.

When something scares him, he has to a) make sure it doesn't threaten his power of control, and b) make sure it doesn't make him appear to not be "doing something" and therefore threaten his job.  The answer to both those problems is "make a law to ban it."

Will the law work?  Can the law work?  Is it constitutional?  Does he even understand what he's passing a law about?  Is it a good idea?

Who cares!  BAN IT.
 
2013-05-05 09:08:20 PM

Thunderboy: thenumber5:  good thing there "Plastic Gun" has the metal barrel

No, it doesn't.


yet it does, you can see it in the pics
 
2013-05-05 09:12:30 PM

thenumber5: Thunderboy: thenumber5:  good thing there "Plastic Gun" has the metal barrel

No, it doesn't.

yet it does, you can see it in the pics


It does not. The only metal parts are the firing pin and a steel slug to make it detectable and comply with federal law.
 
2013-05-05 09:14:17 PM

Smidge204: redsquid: Even if the plastic was strong enough to handle the forces (it isn't)

It is.


So the guy put a totally unnecessary metal barrel and firing pin in?  And printed it with a broken trigger on purpose?
 
2013-05-05 09:18:35 PM

vygramul: thenumber5: Thunderboy: thenumber5:  good thing there "Plastic Gun" has the metal barrel

No, it doesn't.

yet it does, you can see it in the pics

It does not. The only metal parts are the firing pin and a steel slug to make it detectable and comply with federal law.


The firing pin is metal not to comply with federal law, but so it would work.  The firing pin is what hits the bullet causing the explosion to propel the bullet.  I am not sure how you could build one out of plastic and expect it to work.
 
2013-05-05 09:18:57 PM

RickN99: Smidge204: redsquid: Even if the plastic was strong enough to handle the forces (it isn't)

It is.

So the guy put a totally unnecessary metal barrel and firing pin in?  And printed it with a broken trigger on purpose?


No metal barrel, according to other articles. Metal firing pin, yes. And a metal slug in order to comply with federal laws about detectability.
 
2013-05-05 09:20:00 PM

Great Janitor: vygramul: thenumber5: Thunderboy: thenumber5:  good thing there "Plastic Gun" has the metal barrel

No, it doesn't.

yet it does, you can see it in the pics

It does not. The only metal parts are the firing pin and a steel slug to make it detectable and comply with federal law.

The firing pin is metal not to comply with federal law, but so it would work.  The firing pin is what hits the bullet causing the explosion to propel the bullet.  I am not sure how you could build one out of plastic and expect it to work.


I understand, the steel slug is the thing that complies with federal law. The firing pin is metal because a plastic one is problematic at best, apparently.
 
2013-05-05 09:22:03 PM

Great Janitor: The firing pin is metal not to comply with federal law, but so it would work.  The firing pin is what hits the bullet causing the explosion to propel the bullet.  I am not sure how you could build one out of plastic and expect it to work.


Firing pins aren't very big.  Get a hard enough piece of plastic and there's no reason it shouldn't work.
 
2013-05-05 09:22:56 PM
You guys realize bullets set off metal detectors, right?

Plastic gun doesnt mean shiat
 
2013-05-05 09:26:35 PM

bugontherug: Tellingthem: "Now anyone, a terrorist, someone who is mentally ill, a spousal abuser, a felon, can essentially open a gun factory in their garage," he said. "It must be stopped."


It's too late. As soon as someone uploads the files online you are already too late. You can ban the guns, you can ban the files, you can ban printing the guns, but it is already too late. You can't stop the internet, you can only slow it down. And just wait until hand held lasers become more powerful. We will then have untraceable phasers. No need to worry about bullets or noise suppression. Just a click and you can kill someone.

Same applies to child porn, of course. As soon as someone uploads the files online you are already too late. You can ban the child porn, you can ban the files, you can ban printing the child porn, but it is already too late. You can't stop the internet, you can only slow it down. And just wait until virtual reality makes child porn even more realistic...


3d printed children need to be protected from predators.
 
2013-05-05 09:26:40 PM

Alonjar: You guys realize bullets set off metal detectors, right?

Plastic gun doesnt mean shiat


Careful, you're pointing out the complete cluelessness of the people who write our laws.  That's dangerous ground you tread on, brother...
 
2013-05-05 09:27:10 PM
This guy is nothing more than an attention whore...

www.tailgatingideas.com
 
2013-05-05 09:27:18 PM
Lol they should just outlaw SCIENCE and TECHNOLOGY if they fear everything is only meant to destroy mankind!

Do they even know how fragile those 3D printed things are and how expensive it is to create something big and full of volume? Do they know that creating a 5 inch item already costs way too much than its worth? Ever bought a $30 one inch miniature of a cube?

What are 3D criminals going to do? Make weapons using ceramics and cheap plastic because using metal is too damn expensive?

What the hell, just outlaw pens as well! Pens can easily be used to stab eyes out! I've even heard of weapons being made out of toilet paper tubes, let's outlaw those as well! Oh crap, humans are naturally evil, let's all just commit a species suicide so as not to endanger each other anymore!
 
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