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(Opposing Views)   Teen gets his entire track team DQed because he pointed at the sky while crossing the finish line. WTFark: The school DOESN'T prohibit religious expression   (opposingviews.com) divider line 63
    More: Stupid, Hay Point, says, state championships, relay team  
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12897 clicks; posted to Main » on 04 May 2013 at 5:31 PM (50 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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Archived thread
2013-05-04 03:35:32 PM
8 votes:
Quite sure that the sky pointing is not humble and Jesus-like. Praising God as you finish is taunting everyone else by saying God favored you and not them. It's an insult, regardless of the other runner's faiths.

The refs couldn't have been punishing him for being a Christian because he wasn't being one.
2013-05-04 01:54:00 PM
7 votes:
It's called unsportsmanlike conduct, you don't act like an idiot on the field. You can make an idiot of yourself afterwards.
2013-05-04 05:47:10 PM
6 votes:
He wasn't disqualified for religious demonstration.   The argument is being made that he should be excused because it was religious.  I really do not have an opinion  about that.   I do not think it matters why he raised his arms.

I want to know when raising your hands / arms at the end of a race became 'excessive celebration'?    How sensitive does the losing team have to be to be intimidated by the raising of arms?    Have we, as a society become such a bunch of complete wusses that we can be so easily offended?     And I have always wanted to ask,  ' when did it become a 'right' to not be offended.   If you are offended so easily,  stay home.

If watching the winner of a race raise his arms puts you off, maybe competing in athletics isn't your thing?
2013-05-04 05:37:52 PM
4 votes:
School policy has nothing to do with it. State athletic policy against celebrating has everything to do with it.
2013-05-04 04:57:06 PM
3 votes:
Apos:

Point taken, but surely they could have used an alternate or two? Better that they be allowed to go on with their second best "anchor" than....this. This is grossly unfair.

The race was over.  In order to replace this one runner, they would have to re-stage the event, and giving the DQ'd kid's team a fresh anchor while the other teams were re-running the same 4 guys who had just exhausted themselves doesn't really seem fair.

I suspect that if this kid was caught goofing around before the race, they would have done exactly that - the coach would have yanked him and put in someone else.  Once the race is over, not much can be done.
2013-05-04 03:38:25 PM
3 votes:
Its showboating, and its been against the rules in high school and college forever.  Argue the rule all you want, but its the rule.
2013-05-04 03:35:59 PM
3 votes:
If the rules say "no dancing around," you can't dance around.  Being very fond of Jesus does not exempt you from the rules.  This isn't prison; you don't get special privileges just for being religious.
2013-05-04 02:53:36 PM
3 votes:
Yeah - it DOES, however, prohibit acting like an asshole to the officials, which, if you RTFA, he did.
2013-05-04 08:28:19 PM
2 votes:
newsblogs.chicagotribune.com
pla
2013-05-04 08:13:58 PM
2 votes:
What gives with this annoying "unsportsmanlike behavior" BS?  A contest has a winner and a loser.  How he acts after winning may affect his PR, but the kid still won.  End of farking story.  Sorry that you goddamned nannies won't stop until everyone wears a chain so they all need to cross the finish line together, but sports means WINNING.  Not humility.

He won.  Change the books all you want, but everyone will remember the "official" winners as "oh yeah, those LOSERS who advanced a slot on a technicality".

Pathetic.  We deserve the asteroid.
2013-05-04 07:24:04 PM
2 votes:

OnlyM3: If the kid had made a Peace sign, the support of the FARK bigots herein would not be the same.


If the kid had made a peace sign, this wouldn't have made the news - he simply would've been disqualified.

In Texas, mind you. Y'know, clearly the land of anti-Christian sentiment.
2013-05-04 07:03:29 PM
2 votes:
Political correctness is farking everything up.

People that enforce or encourage political correctness are douchbags.
2013-05-04 05:58:21 PM
2 votes:

eraser8: I don't understand why it's so hard simply to participate in an athletic event and leave it at that.

Why do people feel the need to dance?  Or, point at the sky?  Or, helicopter with their penis?

Okay, the last one I can sort of understand...but, the others?  WTF?


Never won anything have you?
2013-05-04 05:51:40 PM
2 votes:

Benevolent Misanthrope: Yeah - it DOES, however, prohibit acting like an asshole to the officials, which, if you RTFA, he did.


Maybe I spent too much time in math and science classes in college and neglected my reading, but I must ask you where in the article does it mention he acted like an asshole?
2013-05-04 05:35:09 PM
2 votes:
Without wading into the whole oh so delightful atheism/religion farkfest once again, my guess is that 99% of the story has nothing to do with what was reported.

I'm guessing that he'd severely pissed off the officials in some other fashion, or someone else on his team had, or someone at some point came to that race bound and determined to stir up some shiat one way or another, and this is the end result.

Just a guess, but there's a lot of psychodrama at any youth athletic event, most of it in the heads of people NOT competing.
2013-05-04 04:55:35 PM
2 votes:

Apos: FloydA: Apos: Why disqualify the entire team for one member's conduct? This is the part that makes very little sense.

He was the anchor in the 4X100 relay.  Without all four positions, there is no team.

Point taken, but surely they could have used an alternate or two? Better that they be allowed to go on with their second best "anchor" than....this. This is grossly unfair.


He did it at the end of the race.... the team running that race was DQ'd. It's not that the whole school team was DQ'd from the entire track meet -- just the one race, as if they'd run out of the lines or missed a baton handoff.
2013-05-04 04:38:57 PM
2 votes:

Apos: Why disqualify the entire team for one member's conduct? This is the part that makes very little sense.


He was the anchor in the 4X100 relay.  Without all four positions, there is no team.
2013-05-04 04:20:48 PM
2 votes:

Benevolent Misanthrope: You guys do realize that TFA ha the school specifically saying it wasn't because of a religious gesture but because he was disrespectful to officials, right?


Yeah, it was "excessive celebration."  The fact that the "celebration" had a religious theme was beside the point.  Any unsportsmanlike conduct would be treated the same way.
2013-05-04 02:55:15 PM
2 votes:
Man, that's a really low threshold for "excessive".

Subby, what school prohibits religious expression by the individual student?
2013-05-04 01:50:48 PM
2 votes:
Somehow in the list of things wrong with the world, a high-school athlete pointing to the sky in front of the judges just doesn't seem all that bad.

Depending on which finger he pointed with...
2013-05-05 06:10:30 PM
1 votes:
It's amazing how the Christians in here keep whining and crying about being persecuted when an idiot kid breaks the rules and tries "but Jesus!" as his defense. What, is being the dominant religion in the US, having 500X more churches than any other country, putting the Ten Commandments in front of courthouses, and trying to force everyone else to follow you still not enough?

You also might want to be careful, you're doing exactly what your god and his kid told you NOT to do. Or does the Bible only matter when it comes to your bigotry against gays?
2013-05-04 11:44:55 PM
1 votes:
He should have claimed it was show of support for Jason Collins being the greatest American here in the history of ever. Then he'd have not only not been disqualified, he'd have shamed the other runners and officials for not acknowledging Jason Collins as the greatest hero in American history.
2013-05-04 10:20:28 PM
1 votes:
They should stop being happy when they win.
2013-05-04 09:44:49 PM
1 votes:
And the lesson he learned this day is that there are a lot of ass holes in the world.

upload.wikimedia.org
2013-05-04 09:31:46 PM
1 votes:

camelclub: Political correctness is farking everything up.

People that enforce or encourage political correctness are douchbags.


We had "political correctness" back when I was young too.  Back then, we called it "being polite."

Go ahead and use derogatory terms for people; nobody can stop you.  There are no PC word police.  But be aware that everyone will know that you're an asshole.  Freedom of speech does not mean freedom from consequences.
2013-05-04 09:05:12 PM
1 votes:

JohnnyRebel88: As you so eloquently put, he should be allowed to act like an idiot "afterwards" is exactly what he did. He crossed the line, thus the race has ended.


Sorry, no.  I did athletics (track and field) in my youth in not-America and you are not off the field until you are off the field.  As in off it.  Not "past the finish line" but physically off the playing field and in the stands.

Rules of conduct apply until you are off the field.  You can get disqualified if you leave your lane without permission or walk back over the finish line to leave the track after a race, or exit the circle (in the throwing events) through the front instead of the back, or before your throw has landed.  That's how sensitive athletics is to behaviour.

This is not some new-fangled American snowflakes thing.  The IAAF rulebook is pretty hefty and old as balls and if you are involved in track and field you know this.  This kid knew this.

Professional athletes in general though - especially in America which is attention whore showboat central - set a very poor example of sportsmanship with their behaviour.  For example in professional track meets the runners almost always leave their lanes when they finish running - sometimes straight in front of another runner.  That would probably get you disqualified in a school meet.
2013-05-04 08:59:09 PM
1 votes:

FormlessOne: The part folks seem to gloss over:

The meet official indicated the athlete crossed the finish line and gestured upward with his arm and finger and behaved disrespectfully toward meet officials, in their opinion.

I suspect there's a bit more here than just "I pointed at my sky-fairy."


I suspect that, if there were more here, the kind of officials who describe "the athlete crossed the finish line and gestured upward with his arm and finger" would have no trouble specifying the actual additional behavior instead of just characterizing it as disrespectful. I suspect that if pressed they would say the kid looked at the officials in a way they didn't like (or alternatively admit that their wording is misleading and the gesture and disrespectful behavior were one and the same).

I doubt there's a religious angle here. Mostly it looks like prick officials jumping at a chance to fark someone with overzealously enforcement of a stupid rule.
2013-05-04 08:56:06 PM
1 votes:

Bashar and Asma's Infinite Playlist: The All-Powerful Atheismo: betelgeux: Benevolent Misanthrope: Yeah - it DOES, however, prohibit acting like an asshole to the officials, which, if you RTFA, he did.

Maybe I spent too much time in math and science classes in college and neglected my reading, but I must ask you where in the article does it mention he acted like an asshole?

Well there is the part where the officials said they did it because he was being disrespectful to them.

This rule has been around awhile, so the event probably went down as such:

"I'm gonna do it if I win."
"You better not."
"I'm gonna do it if I win..."
"I am strongly warning you against that..."


Wait, so we're now divining a conversation which happened between the athlete and someone, maybe an official at the race?  What if I speculate the conversation went like this
Judge 1:  I frakking hate my life, my whore of a wife is banging my neighbor.

Judge 2:  I hear you man.  My life is no bed of roses either, my daughter is pregnant by a dead beat
                 in-and-out of jail bozo.

Judge 1:  Did you see what that a-hole did on the track?  He pointed to the sky, in a non-threatening
                 manner, it was almost imperceptible, but I saw him point to the sky!

Judge 2:  That shiat is ridiculous, I want to disqualify him and his entire team.  Christians are such pricks
                 for flaunting it and forcing it into our faces all the time.

Judge 1:  I agree, he's probably affiliated with that Westboro Baptist Church.  Disqualified, indeed!

I mean, if we're making shiat up, why is your story any more probable than mine?  I'm not a christian, religious, or spiritual.  Maybe that's why I don't get pissed off when someone whispers a prayer, or thanks a god for luck.  It doesn't hurt me, and it's not excessive if it went down exactly as described in the article (which is all I have to go on).
2013-05-04 08:39:52 PM
1 votes:
Wow, the Christian haters are really stretching it.  Pointing to the sky is disrespectful?  Then you want to complain when Hannity cries about Christians being prosecuted.  He's got a point when pointing to the sky is considered disrespectful
2013-05-04 08:37:45 PM
1 votes:

Farking Canuck: Wow ... the officials from this very religious state say that they have no rules against religious displays and they explicitly say that this decision has nothing to do with religion.

And yet look at this thread full of hate spewing out of fark "christians".

"I like your Christ. I don't like your Christians. They are so unlike your Christ."
- Mahatma Ghandi


Why would someone care about what a bigot like Ghandi likes?
2013-05-04 07:53:33 PM
1 votes:

EatenTheSun: Man, that's a really low threshold for "excessive".


Yeah.  And vague.  It's like a homeowners association fining someone because they don't like the way you look, and using any rule to vaguely cover the decision.  Frightened little would-be morality police grab power in whatever little ways they can.
2013-05-04 07:48:49 PM
1 votes:
Perhaps they were upset that he was acknowledging the theory that the earth rotates about the sun.
2013-05-04 07:45:16 PM
1 votes:

tenpoundsofcheese: Benevolent Misanthrope: Yeah - it DOES, however, prohibit acting like an asshole to the officials, which, if you RTFA, he did.

No, that is not what TFA article said.

"...was disqualified by local meet officials for an unsporting act at the conclusion of the boys 4 x100 meter relay.
 The meet official indicated the athlete crossed the finish line and gestured upward with his arm and finger and behaved disrespectfully toward meet officials, in their opinion. In the judgment of the official, this was a violation of NFHS track & field rule 4-6-1.


The violation was specified as excessive celebration.  The act of this excessive celebration is what was perceived as being disrespectful.

TFA states that they convened after they witnessed this excessive celebration, not due to his "acting like an asshole to officials".

Stop making things up.


Ooooooh!   Using the button is fun!  Look, I can do it, too!  So, nyah.
2013-05-04 07:35:30 PM
1 votes:
In other news, America spends waaaaaaayyyyy too much time caring about high school sports
2013-05-04 07:34:46 PM
1 votes:

Mrtraveler01: Fallout Boy: Fark atheists give /r/atheism a run for their money.

You know this story has nothing to do with religion right?

But I guess you have to nurse that persecution complex that some Christians seem to have somehow.


What are you talking about? I am referring to the farkers in this thread who didn't RTFA and said that he deserved to be DQed because he thanked god, and not because it was excessive celebration.

Listen, I know that part of your job as an internet atheist is to jump on anyone that appear to disagree with the world view that you have perfectly figured out, often before giving yourself the time to rub your two brain cells together, but next time, do me a favor and drop that "you are with us or against us" bullshiat. Just because I disagree with atheists in this thread doesn't automatically make me a Christian.
2013-05-04 07:30:13 PM
1 votes:

semiotix: Without wading into the whole oh so delightful atheism/religion farkfest once again, my guess is that 99% of the story has nothing to do with what was reported.

I'm guessing that he'd severely pissed off the officials in some other fashion, or someone else on his team had, or someone at some point came to that race bound and determined to stir up some shiat one way or another, and this is the end result.

Just a guess, but there's a lot of psychodrama at any youth athletic event, most of it in the heads of people NOT competing.


I agree, sounds like a grudge about something totally unrelated, perhaps involving the coach or the school, got vented in this childish and ridiculous way by the judges.

This is why I don't enjoy the so-called 'sports' where the judging decides the winner, like gymnastics or any of the various kinds of dance.

Even a good boxing match can be screwed up, when it goes to the judges.

Sad to see this mentality leaking over into something usually so clear as winning a race.
2013-05-04 07:22:07 PM
1 votes:
The part folks seem to gloss over:

The meet official indicated the athlete crossed the finish line and gestured upward with his arm and finger and behaved disrespectfully toward meet officials, in their opinion.

I suspect there's a bit more here than just "I pointed at my sky-fairy."
2013-05-04 07:21:36 PM
1 votes:
If the kid had made a Peace sign, the support of the FARK bigots herein would not be the same.
2013-05-04 07:19:18 PM
1 votes:
Mrtraveler01
... has nothing to do with religion right?
Bullshiat.

people have been doing silly TD celebrations for decades. Some QB drops to his knee last season and there's 400 FARK threads with whiny little bigots complaining.

It is about religious bigotry. You're just a lair.
2013-05-04 07:10:38 PM
1 votes:
FTFA: In the judgment of the official, this was a violation of NFHS track & field rule 4-6-1.

Okay, so 4-6-1 states:  "Unsporting conduct is behavior that is unethical or dishonorable. It
includes, but is not limited to: disrespectfully addressing an official, any flagrant behavior, intentional contact, taunting, criticizing or using profanity directed toward someone. "

So point your finger in the air is considered "flagrant behavior"?

The penalty doesn't say that the whole team gets DQd
2013-05-04 06:57:29 PM
1 votes:
Joe USer

It's called unsportsmanlike conduct, you don't act like an idiot on the field. You can make an idiot of yourself afterwards.

awww did your widddle fewings get hurt by somebowdy pointing up? When you're mommie's done on main street show here where it hurts and have her kiss it and make it alllll bettter.
2013-05-04 06:47:32 PM
1 votes:
I dunno. I am an atheist, but I I saw no problem with him pointing to his favorite non-existent deity.
2013-05-04 06:32:59 PM
1 votes:

iheartscotch: School policy has nothing to do with it. State athletic policy against celebrating has everything to do with it.


MA and TX both have "no celebration" rules in football. There was a MA football team that lost a TD in a championship game due to an arm raised.

This is getting to a point where the wild celebrations during and after "Miracle on Ice" will be penalized, and kids will play like the automaton Soviets.
2013-05-04 06:32:48 PM
1 votes:

Joe USer: It's called unsportsmanlike conduct, you don't act like an idiot on the field. You can make an idiot of yourself afterwards.


As you so eloquently put, he should be allowed to act like an idiot "afterwards" is exactly what he did.  He crossed the line, thus the race has ended.  I guess we all define "idiot" differently.

Learn how to read...
High school track runner Derrick Hayes did exactly that last weekend after finishing a race in first place.
2013-05-04 06:31:49 PM
1 votes:
I didn't know the NFL was running the track meets down in Texas.

It isn't a religion thing, it's a don't show off thing.

But even I think this is excessive. But doesn't warrant the persecution complex some Christians like to bring into these debates.
2013-05-04 06:31:45 PM
1 votes:

TexasRedbud: He wasn't disqualified for religious demonstration.   The argument is being made that he should be excused because it was religious.  I really do not have an opinion  about that.   I do not think it matters why he raised his arms.

I want to know when raising your hands / arms at the end of a race became 'excessive celebration'?    How sensitive does the losing team have to be to be intimidated by the raising of arms?    Have we, as a society become such a bunch of complete wusses that we can be so easily offended?     And I have always wanted to ask,  ' when did it become a 'right' to not be offended.   If you are offended so easily,  stay home.

If watching the winner of a race raise his arms puts you off, maybe competing in athletics isn't your thing?


This.
2013-05-04 06:27:47 PM
1 votes:
Obligatory:

img197.imageshack.us
2013-05-04 06:20:44 PM
1 votes:
I don't care if it was religious or not.  Pointing at the sky shouldn't considered excessive, by any stretch of the imagination.

F*cking let kids have some fun.  If it's ok for world-recording breaking Olympic athletes to do, it ought to be acceptable for high school kids to do.

I played high school football.  You couldn't do an end-zone dance or spike the ball, but the whole team could jump around and raise their arms for a touchdown.

f*cking people are idiots.
2013-05-04 06:17:35 PM
1 votes:
So every time I scored a goal in high school and raised my hockey stick they should have called the game and made us forfeit the win?????   The pussification of this generation of kids marches on.
2013-05-04 06:05:31 PM
1 votes:

Bashar and Asma's Infinite Playlist: No Time To Explain: Good

/God didn't get you the win, and if you think the almighty did, he also gave you the disqualification
//mysterious ways

God should stop meddling in high school track meets and just let the kids win or lose on their merits.


But then the terrorists won if that happens!

/the only thing that can stop God's bad intentions is God's God intentions
//I'm a bit rusty, I think I need a beer
2013-05-04 06:05:22 PM
1 votes:
Officials feeling bad for students feeling bad because they lost.  Hurt feelings all around.  Celebrations are unfair and don't make anyone but the winners feel good and that's just not fair.  Ahhh.  Poor weak people.
2013-05-04 06:02:30 PM
1 votes:
Thanks for helping me run from point A to point B a little faster than the other kids, Jesus.
2013-05-04 06:01:12 PM
1 votes:
Since the article provides only the barest minimum of details and invites all kinds of wild speculation, here's my entry for the "What Really Happened" guessing game:

The kid was a cocky douche who made a big showy "I'm number one!" gesture directed at the judges. When they got honked off about it, his dad tried to cover by claiming it was really a humble thank you to God, and therefore protected religious speech. When that didn't fly either, douchey kid got extra douchey and the judges unloaded a big heaping scoop of DQ on the self-fingering little snowflake.

/ahh, sweet uninformed opinion. Are there no questions you cannot answer?
2013-05-04 05:55:37 PM
1 votes:
What a load of bull.
2013-05-04 05:53:00 PM
1 votes:

betelgeux: Benevolent Misanthrope: Yeah - it DOES, however, prohibit acting like an asshole to the officials, which, if you RTFA, he did.

Maybe I spent too much time in math and science classes in college and neglected my reading, but I must ask you where in the article does it mention he acted like an asshole?


Well there is the part where the officials said they did it because he was being disrespectful to them.
2013-05-04 05:48:36 PM
1 votes:

Benevolent Misanthrope: Yeah - it DOES, however, prohibit acting like an asshole to the officials, which, if you RTFA, he did.


What was assholish to either the officials or the other team?  He pointed to the sky, not to the other team, like neeners, we won.  He didn't point to the officials with the middle finger.  That is a pretty low threshold for celebration imo.  Since I wasnt on the rules committee, meh but he wasn't doing the Dirty Bird out there.
2013-05-04 05:32:59 PM
1 votes:

eraser8: Or, helicopter with their penis?


What athletic events are YOU going to?
2013-05-04 04:32:16 PM
1 votes:
Why disqualify the entire team for one member's conduct? This is the part that makes very little sense.
2013-05-04 04:29:46 PM
1 votes:
It would have been helpful if the article actually stated what he was doing that was disrespectful to the officials. Just pointing the sky doesn't seem so bad.
2013-05-04 04:07:53 PM
1 votes:
You guys do realize that TFA ha the school specifically saying it wasn't because of a religious gesture but because he was disrespectful to officials, right?
2013-05-04 04:01:41 PM
1 votes:
And the Lone State hasn't earned its own Fark tag yet because.......?
2013-05-04 03:49:49 PM
1 votes:
dairy queened?  just for doin that?? impossible
2013-05-04 03:03:34 PM
1 votes:
I don't understand why it's so hard simply to participate in an athletic event and leave it at that.

Why do people feel the need to dance?  Or, point at the sky?  Or, helicopter with their penis?

Okay, the last one I can sort of understand...but, the others?  WTF?
 
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