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(NBC News) NewsFlash US officials report Israeli airstrike hits targets in Syria   (worldnews.nbcnews.com) divider line 370
    More: NewsFlash, Israelis, officials report, Hezbollah in Lebanon, Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel, chemical weapons, Scud missile, airstrike, NBC News  
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16172 clicks; posted to Main » on 03 May 2013 at 11:40 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»


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2013-05-04 05:07:24 AM

whatshisname: Zeppelininthesky: I am hoping nothing will come of this.

It won't. Syria is a pariah state and anybody can do anything to them and nobody will blink. Even Russia's given up on them.


Has Russia stopped backing them?  wouldn't suprise me, just hadn't heard that.

Syria's arms-purchasing budget must be empty...
 
2013-05-04 05:11:48 AM

TuteTibiImperes: Popcorn Johnny: Fark is gonna be awesome once all the kids get drafted.

There will never be another draft.  Warfare isn't waged primarily through boots on the ground anymore.  It's air, missile, and drone strikes followed by much smaller numbers of troops to root out the insurgents and keep the conquered from remounting any kind of organized resistance.


It would be nice, but, never say never.

The modern nation state still deals with existential threats by 1) throwing money at the problem, and 2) throwing bodies, usually young male bodies, at the problem.

The U.S. had the draft in the 19th and 20th centuries; I wouldn't bet any amount of money we won't see it again in the 21st.
 
2013-05-04 05:14:43 AM

omnibus_necanda_sunt: tuna fingers: AverageAmericanGuy: tuna fingers: Help  me out here.
I'm one to read the comments on liveleak, and it appears that the opinions there support the govt.  The rebels are mostly "terrorists" according to liveleak presusers.  That doesn't sit right with me.  Has the Arab Spring just gone tired?
Who is in the right here?

Pretty simple. Assad is a secular strongman. He and his father have used extremely violent tactics to suppress opposition.

The opposition is radical Muslim fanatics. They have been put down by Assad many times. Thomas Friedman describes Assad's philosophy as 'Hama rules', a reference to the destruction of the Islamist hotbed town of Hama when it tried to rise up against Assad's father.

So you support the strongman or you support terrorists. In a way it's Iraq all over again. If the strongman goes, the radical extremists take over. If the strongman stays, human rights violations will continue.

There's no good reason to get involved.

I'm gonna guess we are already involved.  I'll assume that many international corporations (including American ones) are stripping the countryside of their resources.  They pay off the fat and happy elite, while the common folk can't afford food.  Amirite?

I hate to say it, but the only solution would be a massive economic stimulus, such as an adjustable-rate IMF loan to the final form of the Syrian transitional government, sending in Arabic-speaking Western experts as educators and engineers, get every member of the Arab League ass-deep in keeping the program steady, and have the IMF pull the rug out from under them if ethnic cleansing starts up again.


I might be wrong, but my impression of the Arab League is that half of them would prefer that any given operation like that fail miserably...
 
2013-05-04 05:32:15 AM
Assholes in the Middle East are fighting each other?

How incredibly odd. Surely nobody could ever have possibly predicted this.

Here is my shocked face:
 
2013-05-04 05:57:56 AM

clyph: I am disturbed by the lack of hot IDF chicks in this thread.   Y'all are slipping.


That is seriously the most retarded meme ever.

Why not just post pics of "hot Kim Jong-un concubines" while you're at it?
 
2013-05-04 06:07:08 AM

kgloverfl: Little boy and fat man? Acceptable or not? Must have been acceptable because the World Police didn't bomb us afterward.


Oh goodie, we're going into historical revisionism now with badly construed moral comparisons and ignoring historical factors that make it totally different.

Let's start off, shall we.

1) Hiroshima and Nagasaki were legitimate military targets. This is one of the most important key factors that revisionists like to ignore, or paint as untrue.
2) Japan was given multiple instances where they would have been allowed to surrender and not suffer the wrath of the Allies through the bombings. The whole reason to demand an unconditional surrender was so that the Emperor could not remain in power as a "living God" to his people, and begin another era of Japanese imperialism.
3) The civilian people of Japan were warned through massive leaflet drop campaigns to GTFO.
4) Even after the bomb was dropped, elements of the Imperial Japanese Army stormed the imperial palace in an attempt to keep the Emperor from surrendering, and ending the war.
5) Dropping the bombs saved hundreds of thousands of lives on the Allied side, as well as possibly kept the entire Japanese people from being slaughtered, and the destruction of Japanese culture from occurring.
6) Since this event, the use of Nuclear Weapons has been deemed so horrendous and unthinkable that the world coined the phrase mutually assured destruction, and acted based on that philosophy.

But yes. Let's continue comparing this with the indiscriminate use of chemical weapons in a modern age against a civilian population with the lesser choice between two unthinkable choices during World War II.
 
2013-05-04 06:33:21 AM

ShawnDoc: This can't be a real thing, it's not at the top of the Drudge Report.  Surely Isreal launching an airstrike against chemical weapons being transferred from Syria to Hezbollah is more important than Obama talking about guns being purchased in the US and smuggled into Mexico.


Wut?

You mean like Eric holders plan to just sell the cartels guns directly and then?.. What? Profit? Who farking knows right because fast and furious was under a democrat so no uproar?


Or that bankers that orchestrated/are orchestrating one of the biggest frauds against the American people in like ever? But are "too big to jail" in his own words?

I hope your double secret negative post baiting..
 
2013-05-04 06:48:23 AM

Trapper439: Assholes in the Middle East are fighting each other?

How incredibly odd. Surely nobody could ever have possibly predicted this.

Here is my shocked face:


Lol, if I'm alive 50 years from now and get to read the kids comment from Hong Kong that is exactly that but about the former us, well, I'll just smile.
 
2013-05-04 07:48:53 AM
FTA:  Ya'alon said any Syrian delivery of sophisticated weapons to rogue elements like Hezbollah would be a "red line" for Israel and "when they crossed this red line, we operated. We acted."

i.chzbgr.com
 
2013-05-04 07:59:20 AM
The US needs to stay the fark out. That is, unless we change how we fight wars. No more vietnams, or Iraq type fighting. If a country is unstable and rife with human rights issues then we go in instantly remove the controlling regime, and after 10 years living under our defined law it becomes a US territory with a secular democracy. Basically, if you suck you lose your sovereignty.
 
2013-05-04 08:14:04 AM

bugmn99: Cytokine Storm: What does CNN have to say?

Israeli missiles struck a Target in Secaucus.


At 15 times the speed of light.
 
2013-05-04 08:24:25 AM

MayoSlather: The US needs to stay the fark out. That is, unless we change how we fight wars. No more vietnams, or Iraq type fighting. If a country is unstable and rife with human rights issues then we go in instantly remove the controlling regime, and after 10 years living under our defined law it becomes a US territory with a secular democracy. Basically, if you suck you lose your sovereignty.


Thats how the British Empire rationalized itself. And the French, and the Belgians and the Spanish. It's funny how nationalists and reactionaries consider their own perception to be the only legitimate and acceptable one. WE don't like what YOU are doing, because what YOU are doing is interfering with our bankers and industrialists desires to rob you farking blind. If you do not cease to interfere with our robbery, we will kill you and everyone we deem as having a resemblance to you.

This line of thought has always been the legitimacy offered to the domestic population of the Nation doing the conquering.  Even the "educated, enlightened liberal pacifist" types accepted the British Crown's propaganda about it during the Zulu and Boer Wars and the slaughters in Kenya, Rhodesia, Burma and India. Germany systematically executed 11 million people in WW2, and inflicted another 15-20 million casualties through combat action. They had a long country mile to go before they would have caught up with the British, French and Belgians over the 250 years previous to WW2.
 
2013-05-04 08:28:58 AM
See? They're big boys and don't need our blood and money. Good luck out there, Israel. Try not to sink any American ships.
 
2013-05-04 08:29:20 AM

omnibus_necanda_sunt: hydrazine


Hydrazine you say? Very interesting..... now where did I see that Astralite recipe..?
 
2013-05-04 08:38:40 AM

Psylence: omnibus_necanda_sunt: hydrazine

Hydrazine you say? Very interesting..... now where did I see that Astralite recipe..?


You do NOT wanna fark with hydrazine. It melts things.
 
2013-05-04 08:43:41 AM
i.imgur.com

/seriously not happening
//would be freaking awesome though if it was.
 
2013-05-04 08:47:23 AM

TeddyRooseveltsMustache: Revek: Its to bad the Jews and  the muslims over there don't love their children.

Pedo.


You need to work on your technique.
 
2013-05-04 08:47:41 AM

Deathfrogg: MayoSlather: The US needs to stay the fark out. That is, unless we change how we fight wars. No more vietnams, or Iraq type fighting. If a country is unstable and rife with human rights issues then we go in instantly remove the controlling regime, and after 10 years living under our defined law it becomes a US territory with a secular democracy. Basically, if you suck you lose your sovereignty.

Thats how the British Empire rationalized itself. And the French, and the Belgians and the Spanish. It's funny how nationalists and reactionaries consider their own perception to be the only legitimate and acceptable one. WE don't like what YOU are doing, because what YOU are doing is interfering with our bankers and industrialists desires to rob you farking blind. If you do not cease to interfere with our robbery, we will kill you and everyone we deem as having a resemblance to you.

This line of thought has always been the legitimacy offered to the domestic population of the Nation doing the conquering.  Even the "educated, enlightened liberal pacifist" types accepted the British Crown's propaganda about it during the Zulu and Boer Wars and the slaughters in Kenya, Rhodesia, Burma and India. Germany systematically executed 11 million people in WW2, and inflicted another 15-20 million casualties through combat action. They had a long country mile to go before they would have caught up with the British, French and Belgians over the 250 years previous to WW2.


Point taken, and certainly greed has been a motivation to bring civility to the barbarians in the past, but at the same time we cannot justify war in the current manner in which we fight it.

However do we allow human rights violations to continue, or do we intervene with a permanent game plan or a temporary one. Perhaps becoming a US territory is unneeded after the fact, but in these human rights situations instant sovereignty with a democracy is not the answer. They need a generation to grow up in relative peace and a decent education before natural change will occur, and that won't happen if the same type of assholes are allowed to reconstruct the government.
 
2013-05-04 08:49:04 AM
Highly corrosive AND toxic to boot, and you can make the most powerful non-nuclear explosive with it. Thankfully outside the skillset of your average dumbassed wannabe jihadi.
 
2013-05-04 08:51:23 AM
img.fark.net

PEW PEW PEW
 
2013-05-04 08:53:15 AM

MayoSlather: The US needs to stay the fark out. That is, unless we change how we fight wars. No more vietnams, or Iraq type fighting. If a country is unstable and rife with human rights issues then we go in instantly remove the controlling regime, and after 10 years living under our defined law it becomes a US territory with a secular democracy. Basically, if you suck you lose your sovereignty.


Oh you're saying we need to go back a few hundred years to an imperialist stance and conquer those savages in the middle east.  It's this holier than thou attitude that got us into the messes in Vietnam and Iraq, and I don't care how we fight, its our very mindset that makes these puppet regimes untenable.  It's a noble cause to want to end human rights violations, but it needs to be done by the will of these countries' own people without the intervention of any third parties.  The US or Israel rolling in with their big swinging dicks just makes it harder for the side that fights for liberty to maintain their momentum, it makes it easier to turn youth and the uneducated to the side of the authoritarians.   Can you blame common Afghani's, Iraqi's, South Vietnamese, for being apprehensive when a bunch of foreigners roll into their town like they own place? It becomes incredibly easy to convince the masses that these foreigners are lying/corrupt and are going to take over the country. These civil wars and revolutions, as bloody and lousy as they are, need to be let to run their own, organic, course...they need to be fully owned by the Syrian people, if the cause gets "corporate sponsorship" from some random other country, it just ends up doing more harm than good.

The best we can do is just to cut off any economic relationship with the regimes that are guilty of human rights violations.  This is easier said than done, especially when the regime(s) in question sit in a region that is loaded with huge deposits of oil...
 
2013-05-04 09:03:59 AM

chocolate covered poop: MayoSlather: The US needs to stay the fark out. That is, unless we change how we fight wars. No more vietnams, or Iraq type fighting. If a country is unstable and rife with human rights issues then we go in instantly remove the controlling regime, and after 10 years living under our defined law it becomes a US territory with a secular democracy. Basically, if you suck you lose your sovereignty.

Oh you're saying we need to go back a few hundred years to an imperialist stance and conquer those savages in the middle east.  It's this holier than thou attitude that got us into the messes in Vietnam and Iraq, and I don't care how we fight, its our very mindset that makes these puppet regimes untenable.  It's a noble cause to want to end human rights violations, but it needs to be done by the will of these countries' own people without the intervention of any third parties.  The US or Israel rolling in with their big swinging dicks just makes it harder for the side that fights for liberty to maintain their momentum, it makes it easier to turn youth and the uneducated to the side of the authoritarians.   Can you blame common Afghani's, Iraqi's, South Vietnamese, for being apprehensive when a bunch of foreigners roll into their town like they own place? It becomes incredibly easy to convince the masses that these foreigners are lying/corrupt and are going to take over the country. These civil wars and revolutions, as bloody and lousy as they are, need to be let to run their own, organic, course...they need to be fully owned by the Syrian people, if the cause gets "corporate sponsorship" from some random other country, it just ends up doing more harm than good.

The best we can do is just to cut off any economic relationship with the regimes that are guilty of human rights violations.  This is easier said than done, especially when the regime(s) in question sit in a region that is loaded with huge deposits of oil...


I've always been of the persuasion that whenever we invade a country like Iraq, or Afghanistan, we should just stay there. Grant them statehood and make their citizens American citizens who now fall under American law. It's not colonizing, it's just adding another state to the union.
 
2013-05-04 09:07:33 AM

spiderpaz: Using Israel to carry out any of these kind of strikes is the dumbest tactic possible.  Our best, most valuable ally in this theater is and has always been Turkey.  ANYTHING Israel does will be viewed in the worst light possible.  There is too much baggage there.


I agree if they went after chemical weapons, but if other articles are corre t they went after a convoy that had ground to ground missiles that were going to Hezbollah in Lebanon.
 
2013-05-04 09:09:58 AM
Untwist your panties, there ain't gonna be no war, the Israelis identified a potential threat in Syrian territory and eliminated it. It wasn't the first time and it won't be the last. The Israelis are not interested in starting a Syrian war and the Syrians are too busy brutally murdering each other to get involved in an Israeli war; the Egyptians are too busy spending the copious bribe money we send them each year to start swinging their teeny tiny dicks militarily. much as many of them would like to. Didn't Turkey carry out some airstrikes in Syria a few months ago? Why is it bad only when the Israelis protect themselves against an obvious threat?
 
2013-05-04 09:11:45 AM
www.usmagazine.com
 
2013-05-04 09:15:03 AM

Amos Quito: Your Average Witty Fark User: They can just keep going until Syria no longer exists for all I care.


Or until Israel becomes Wasrael.


bluebuddies.com
 
2013-05-04 09:16:39 AM

sheep snorter: Religious wars are fun. More souls for the stew.

[i.imgur.com image 640x444]


Holy moley I love that poster. I shall shamelessly poach it. YOINK!
 
2013-05-04 09:30:52 AM

Apik0r0s:


Why am I not surprised you are agreeing with that clown despite the civil war going on for months?
 
2013-05-04 09:42:07 AM

sheep snorter: Religious wars are fun. More souls for the stew.

[i.imgur.com image 640x444]


The Gospel of John says the Serpent and Christ are kindred spirits.

John 9 & 10 tells the story of Jesus healing a blind apostate of Judaism. The story mirrors the structure of the Genesis story, featuring a man "blind since birth." Just as Adam and Eve disobeyed Jehovah by following the Serpent, so did the blind man disobey the religious authorities of his day by following Jesus. Just as Jehovah interrogates Adam and Eve after they eat from the tree, so do the pharisees interrogate the blind man after he is healed. Just as Jehovah expelled Adam and Eve for their disobedience, so do the pharisees expel the blind man from the temple for his.

Several passages indicate the Genesis reference is intentional, and intended to convey a relationship between the Serpent and Christ. First, the story uses the phrase "opened his eyes" to describe what Jesus did to the blind man. Genesis uses the phrase "opened their eyes" to describe what happened after Adam and Eve ate the fruit.

Moreover, John 9:32 says "Since the world began was it not heard that any man opened the eyes of one that was born blind." Clearly calling to mind Genesis. And again using the phrase "opened the eyes," just as Genesis uses the same phrase when Adam and Eve gain their sight.

10:19-21 features Jews debating whether or not Jesus is from God, or is a demon possessed madman. A credulous Jew resolves the issue with the rhetorical question "These are not the sayings of a man possessed by a demon. Can a demon open the eyes of the blind?" The apparent import of the question being that Jesus must have come from God, because demons cannot possibly open the eyes of the blind.

But if demons can't open the eyes of the blind, then how did the Serpent? Don't get hung up on the word "demon" either. Some translations say "devil." Some say "evil spirit." The point of the question is that Jesus could not have been demon/devil/evil spirit possessed because none of them can open the eyes of the blind.

There is one answer that can rescue the orthodox Genesis interpretation from the implications of John 9 & 10. That is that the Serpent didn't open anyone's eyes, the fruit did. All the Serpent did was tell Eve to eat it. But this argument ignores all the obviously intentional parallels between the stories to get hung up on a turn of phrase. I find much more persuasive the proposition the story is intended to convey that the Serpent and Jesus came from the same place.

What is that place? Some believe John was written by a "gnostic" Christian. And if my interpretation of John 9 & 10 is correct, I would have to guess the author was what was called a "Sethian Gnostic." Sethian Gnostics in particular believed that Jehovah was the demiurge, who they viewed as a malevolent being who enslaved humans for his own narcissistic gratification. They cited numerous Old Testament passages for the proposition that Jehovah was less than omnipotent, vain, and cruel; all in all, just not very god like. The place both Jesus and the Serpent came from, to them, was called the Pleroma, or what most would think of as heaven.

So maybe it wasn't Jesus who was Satan, but Jehovah.

tl;dr John 9 & 10 suggests Jesus and the Serpent both came from God, because John 9 & 10 parallels the structure of story of the fall, uses similar language to describe what Jesus and the Serpent did, and ends with a rhetorical question the apparent answer to which indicates that neither Jesus nor the Serpent were demons/devils/evil spirits.
 
2013-05-04 09:51:01 AM

TheGregiss: chocolate covered poop: MayoSlather: The US needs to stay the fark out. That is, unless we change how we fight wars. No more vietnams, or Iraq type fighting. If a country is unstable and rife with human rights issues then we go in instantly remove the controlling regime, and after 10 years living under our defined law it becomes a US territory with a secular democracy. Basically, if you suck you lose your sovereignty.

I've always been of the persuasion .

..that whenever we invade a country like Iraq, or Afghanistan, we should just stay there. Grant them statehood and make their citizens American citizens who now fall under American law. It's not colonizing, it's just adding another state to the union.

If their citizens democratically choose to become a territory/state of the US, then I wouldn't take any issue.  Just showing up and saying "We saved you!!! you're officially AmericansTMnow! Congratulations, here's your American flag lapel pins..." doesn't work for me however.
 
2013-05-04 09:59:22 AM

TheGregiss: [i.imgur.com image 680x512]

/seriously not happening
//would be freaking awesome though if it was.


Good thing we live in a different ecosystem .....wait...what do you mean it's the same one? Well son of a.......
 
2013-05-04 10:03:50 AM
What happens if we bomb all sides. Or the entire middle east. Then would all of this sh*t end?
 
2013-05-04 10:14:37 AM

indarwinsshadow: What happens if we bomb all sides. Or the entire middle east. Then would all of this sh*t end?


a collective sigh of relief would be heard round the world.
the dow would dip, then jump.
we'd get over it.
 
2013-05-04 10:19:06 AM
If they want to pock to hornet's nest fine, don't expect us to back you up.
 
2013-05-04 10:22:17 AM

indarwinsshadow: What happens if we bomb all sides. Or the entire middle east. Then would all of this sh*t end?


"We can bomb the world to pieces
But we can't bomb it into peace"
 
2013-05-04 10:22:19 AM
4.bp.blogspot.com
 
2013-05-04 10:41:51 AM
Last time Israel attacked Syria like this, they bombed a reactor under construction. The Syrians came in and cleaned it all up and pretended that nothing ever happened, so don't count on this starting a war.
 
2013-05-04 10:54:12 AM

tuna fingers: Help me out here.
I'm one to read the comments on liveleak, and it appears that the opinions there support the govt. The rebels are mostly "terrorists" according to liveleak presusers. That doesn't sit right with me. Has the Arab Spring just gone tired?
Who is in the right here?


The "Arab Spring" has been an illusion all along.  While the people might want the dictators gone they're just replacing moderate dictators with Islamist ones.  This is a case of jumping from the frying pan to the fire.

KarmicDisaster: Last time Israel attacked Syria like this, they bombed a reactor under construction. The Syrians came in and cleaned it all up and pretended that nothing ever happened, so don't count on this starting a war.


No.  Last time was a shipment of missiles to Hezbollah.  Syria claimed a research facility was bombed but when you look the booms were in the parking lot.

You're thinking of a previous attack.
 
2013-05-04 10:56:29 AM

omnibus_necanda_sunt: spiderpaz: Deathfrogg: kgloverfl: Deathfrogg: kgloverfl: Killing people with bullets = ok
Killing people with chemical weapons = not ok

Got it.

Bullets are legal to sell.

So is ammonia and bleach...

Not when mixed together.

What does it make when you mix them?

/Answer that and you're a terrorist

Chloramine, dichloramine, and hydrazine. Basic redox chemistry.

/Goddamned k3wls.


That's nothing compared to this unconventional recipe for
dioxygen difluoride (O2F2) :  http://what-if.xkcd.com/40/

Now that's some scary shiat.
 
2013-05-04 11:02:04 AM
This wouldn't bother me if Israel wasn't reliant on the US and state-side lobbyists in order for such action to even be considered. They're like the mouthy b*tch at the bar who hides behind her boyfriend while throwing drinks at people. The US really needs to crack down on Israel and make all aid dependent on them being 100% transparent (including getting Mossad the f*ck out of the US) and not taking any action without permission first.
 
2013-05-04 11:05:17 AM
malvasiabianca.org
 
2013-05-04 11:05:57 AM
They didn't hit targets in Syria, they hit Syria.

Calling them targets is a subtle way of implying they should have been hit. Well played.
 
2013-05-04 11:16:10 AM
Can I hook this up to a 3D printer and create my own Israeli airstrike at home?
 
2013-05-04 11:19:41 AM
Does the media still try to give Obama credit for the Arab Spring?
 
2013-05-04 11:20:58 AM
So, if Israel performed these bombings aligned with rebel interests, and one of the major rebel supporters is al-Qaeda, is Israel then aligning itself with radical Islamists?
 
2013-05-04 11:21:17 AM

bugontherug: Sethian Gnostics in particular believed that Jehovah was the demiurge, who they viewed as a malevolent being who enslaved humans for his own narcissistic gratification.


This is always fun to bring up with Bible/Koran/Torah thumpers. All Abrahamic religion is based on picking-and-choosing what is convenient from the mythical traditions and events of the day and ignoring the stuff that gets (got) in the way of the desired message. For some reason, some seem to think age = credibility...sorry, just because a religion is old doesn't make it less laughable, folks.

The Sethians viewpoints actually make a lot more sense than the more common viewpoint that the murderous and morally ambivalent douchebag of a god in the Old Testament was actually worthy of adoration.
 
2013-05-04 11:24:00 AM

Nemo's Brother: Does the media still try to give Obama credit for the Arab Spring?


No, that was all Bush. He showed just how positive it was when you remove the head of state. Rainbows and little chocolates for everyone.
 
2013-05-04 11:28:47 AM

MrEricSir: Would be hard to argue that a crazy dictator's chemical weapons being destroyed is a bad thing, especially if we had nothing (directly) to do with it.


I am really confused...  So cock-blocking terrorists is now a good thing only if we are not involved?
 
2013-05-04 11:32:32 AM

NewportBarGuy: Can I hook this up to a 3D printer and create my own Israeli airstrike at home?


For fark's sake, not everything is related to the American gun debate. fark that shiat right off.
 
2013-05-04 11:41:22 AM

omnibus_necanda_sunt: NewportBarGuy: Can I hook this up to a 3D printer and create my own Israeli airstrike at home?

For fark's sake, not everything is related to the American gun debate. fark that shiat right off.


Nothing to do with guns, pal. I think the technology is incredibly cool. I was just making a joke. Relax.
 
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