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(CBS News)   Justice Department files morning after appeal to abort morning-after pill   (cbsnews.com) divider line 131
    More: Followup, Justice Department, Center for Reproductive Rights, cabinet secretary, morning-after pills, Kathleen Sebelius, Nancy Northup, appeal  
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2019 clicks; posted to Politics » on 02 May 2013 at 7:49 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-05-02 07:03:35 AM
Why is the Obama administration fighting this?
 
2013-05-02 07:18:55 AM

cman: Why is the Obama administration fighting this?


Trolling Republicans
 
2013-05-02 07:50:20 AM

Peter von Nostrand: cman: Why is the Obama administration fighting this?

Trolling Republicans


Wait...because republicans are trolling, or he's trolling republicans?
 
2013-05-02 07:54:03 AM

HotWingConspiracy: Peter von Nostrand: cman: Why is the Obama administration fighting this?

Trolling Republicans

Wait...because republicans are trolling, or he's trolling republicans?


Obama is trying to get Republicans to oppose his opposition to the morning after pill.  Tomorrow we'll see Cantor arguing that the pill needs to be given away to all girls at school.
 
2013-05-02 07:54:51 AM
"Social conservatives were outraged by the FDA's move to lower the age limits for Plan B - as well as the possibility that Korman's ruling might take effect and lift age restrictions altogether."

Social conservatives are idiotic busy bodies.
 
2013-05-02 07:56:24 AM
Tell me again how Obama is the libbiest lib that ever libbed?
 
2013-05-02 07:57:51 AM

Free Radical: "Social conservatives were outraged by the FDA's move to lower the age limits for Plan B - as well as the possibility that Korman's ruling might take effect and lift age restrictions altogether."

Social conservatives are idiotic busy bodies.


"But my daughter's abortion was different!"
 
2013-05-02 07:58:04 AM

HotWingConspiracy: Peter von Nostrand: cman: Why is the Obama administration fighting this?

Trolling Republicans

Wait...because republicans are trolling, or he's trolling republicans?


It is probably because allowing 11 year olds to buy it to avoid getting pregnant will be spun as "Obama is okay with 11 year olds having sex"
 
2013-05-02 07:59:12 AM

Even With A Chainsaw: Tell me again how Obama is the libbiest lib that ever libbed?


If this was 1983 instead of 2013 his policies would be considered conservative republican.
 
2013-05-02 08:00:14 AM
Sometimes I wonder who's in charge of the Justice Department.  Do they still have a ton of Liberty University grads there?
 
2013-05-02 08:01:56 AM
Oh great, thanks Obama.

Now we're going to have 10 year olds addicted to recreational abortions.

/wtf is this guys problem?
 
2013-05-02 08:04:42 AM
WTF is wrong with you Obama? Are you turning into George Bush? You don't wanna go there man. Trust me.
img.photobucket.com
 
2013-05-02 08:08:27 AM
Just what we need........both sides intruding on a woman's reproductive rights.  This should be a decision made between a woman and her physician.  The FDA made a step in the right direction yesterday, and now the Justice Dept wants to reverse that.  Women, especially teenagers, need better access to birth control.  Some of these politicians should step foot in my clinic once in a while and see the number of teenagers who end up pregnant.
 
2013-05-02 08:10:18 AM

cman: Why is the Obama administration fighting this?


He's a lot more conservative than a lot of people, conservatives and liberals, think he is.
 
2013-05-02 08:11:40 AM
Derptardment?
 
2013-05-02 08:14:10 AM

cman: Why is the Obama administration fighting this?


The government demand authority.  Even when it goes against the interests of the people.  Even when it goes against the interests of the current administration, the juggernaut must proceed.
 
2013-05-02 08:14:46 AM

Target Builder: cman: Why is the Obama administration fighting this?

He's a lot more conservative than a lot of people, conservatives and liberals, think he is.


I think the word you are looking for is authoritarian.
 
2013-05-02 08:19:05 AM

TheWizard: Target Builder: cman: Why is the Obama administration fighting this?

He's a lot more conservative than a lot of people, conservatives and liberals, think he is.

I think the word you are looking for is authoritarian.


Sure, if you're looking for a synonym for "conservative."
 
2013-05-02 08:30:55 AM

TheWizard: Target Builder: cman: Why is the Obama administration fighting this?

He's a lot more conservative than a lot of people, conservatives and liberals, think he is.

I think the word you are looking for is authoritarian.


Hope-n-change?
 
2013-05-02 08:35:04 AM

Blathering Idjut: TheWizard: Target Builder: cman: Why is the Obama administration fighting this?

He's a lot more conservative than a lot of people, conservatives and liberals, think he is.

I think the word you are looking for is authoritarian.

Sure, if you're looking for a synonym for "conservative."


You know who else was a lib that hated abortion.  That's right...

img.timeinc.net

Most communist commie that ever communed.
 
2013-05-02 08:36:18 AM
Oh look, the Bigot Research Council thinks teen girls should old be treated like incubators if they have sex.

What a shock.
 
2013-05-02 08:36:20 AM

xria: HotWingConspiracy: Peter von Nostrand: cman: Why is the Obama administration fighting this?

Trolling Republicans

Wait...because republicans are trolling, or he's trolling republicans?

It is probably because allowing 11 year olds to buy it to avoid getting pregnant will be spun as "Obama is okay with 11 year olds having sex"


What the hell does he care what those assclowns say?  He's not running for reelection.

If he were to resign, all the republicans in congress would say he was just taking the coward's way out.

If he were to shoot himself, they would complain he used the wrong caliber gun, or make some shiatty passive aggressive comment about gun control.
 
2013-05-02 08:37:12 AM

Lawyers With Nukes: TheWizard: Target Builder: cman: Why is the Obama administration fighting this?

He's a lot more conservative than a lot of people, conservatives and liberals, think he is.

I think the word you are looking for is authoritarian.

Hope-n-change?


That's why I voted for RON PAUL!
 
2013-05-02 08:40:10 AM

DubyaHater: Just what we need........both sides intruding on a woman's reproductive rights.  This should be a decision made between a woman and her physician.  The FDA made a step in the right direction yesterday, and now the Justice Dept wants to reverse that.  Women, especially teenagers, need better access to birth control.  Some of these politicians should step foot in my clinic once in a while and see the number of teenagers who end up pregnant.


Uh dude, the court decision is that young girls of any age don't NEED to see a physician, or even speak to a pharmacist, to buy the morning after pill.  I'm all for "a woman's health is hers and her doctor's concern only" but that's not what this is about.

At the same time, I really don't think we should be giving out hormonal birth control anything without even a consult with the pharmacist, but I do understand how young girls might be too intimidated to ask.
 
2013-05-02 08:40:14 AM
While your at it, how about you just let me buy some cold medicine without jumping through hoops?
 
2013-05-02 08:41:42 AM
100% of the blame goes to Obama for this
 
2013-05-02 08:42:12 AM
They should just look forward and move on.
 
2013-05-02 08:43:21 AM

Lexx: DubyaHater: Just what we need........both sides intruding on a woman's reproductive rights.  This should be a decision made between a woman and her physician.  The FDA made a step in the right direction yesterday, and now the Justice Dept wants to reverse that.  Women, especially teenagers, need better access to birth control.  Some of these politicians should step foot in my clinic once in a while and see the number of teenagers who end up pregnant.

Uh dude, the court decision is that young girls of any age don't NEED to see a physician, or even speak to a pharmacist, to buy the morning after pill.  I'm all for "a woman's health is hers and her doctor's concern only" but that's not what this is about.

At the same time, I really don't think we should be giving out hormonal birth control anything without even a consult with the pharmacist, but I do understand how young girls might be too intimidated to ask.


The only question is whether it is safe or not. Unless you are a gynocologist, shut up on the matter.
 
2013-05-02 08:44:58 AM

badhatharry: While your at it, how about you just let me buy some cold medicine without jumping through hoops?


OR a decent cough suppressant.
 
2013-05-02 08:45:41 AM

Lost Thought 00: Lexx: DubyaHater: Just what we need........both sides intruding on a woman's reproductive rights.  This should be a decision made between a woman and her physician.  The FDA made a step in the right direction yesterday, and now the Justice Dept wants to reverse that.  Women, especially teenagers, need better access to birth control.  Some of these politicians should step foot in my clinic once in a while and see the number of teenagers who end up pregnant.

Uh dude, the court decision is that young girls of any age don't NEED to see a physician, or even speak to a pharmacist, to buy the morning after pill.  I'm all for "a woman's health is hers and her doctor's concern only" but that's not what this is about.

At the same time, I really don't think we should be giving out hormonal birth control anything without even a consult with the pharmacist, but I do understand how young girls might be too intimidated to ask.

The only question is whether it is safe or not. Unless you are a gynocologist, shut up on the matter.


My understanding is that it's safe to use as indicated.  We're not considering the use case where girls who can't get access to the pill attempt to use "Plan B" as a regular birth control?
 
2013-05-02 08:46:48 AM
"We are deeply disappointed that just days after President Obama proclaimed his commitment to women's reproductive rights, his administration has decided once again to deprive women of their right to obtain emergency contraception without unjustified and burdensome restrictions," said Nancy Northup, president of the Center for Reproductive Rights, which filed the lawsuit that prompted Korman's ruling.

I think we can officially add 'Obama' to the list of people stubbornly standing in the way of the Obama Administration.  What a useless twat he's turned out to be.
 
2013-05-02 08:48:48 AM

Lexx: At the same time, I really don't think we should be giving out hormonal birth control anything without even a consult with the pharmacist, but I do understand how young girls might be too intimidated to ask.


Birth control and sex hormone treatments are among the safest drugs ever produced. Waaaay safer than aspirin, acetaminophen, robitussin, etc. Should teens have to consult a doc or pharmacist to take those?
 
2013-05-02 08:49:01 AM

cman: Why is the Obama administration fighting this?



Because they have to.  It's the first time a court has reversed a decision by the FDA with regard to how a medication is prescribed.  It sets a precedent for the courts to decide how drugs are approved.Albeit, the FDA really screwed this up by letting politics get in the way of the approval process of Plan B.I guess no one at the FDA thought through the consequences when they made that decision.
 
2013-05-02 08:51:30 AM

Lost Thought 00: 100% of the blame goes to Obama for this


I genuinely have no idea why he's pursuing this. Obama cannot be so knuckledraggingly stupid that he thinks GOPers will lend him support because he makes birth control harder to get. (Same as with the ramped up deportations and cannabis prosecutions.)
 
2013-05-02 08:52:26 AM
Why does Obama hate women?
 
2013-05-02 08:53:09 AM
The republicans will counter with a suit to make Viagra, the morning before pill, available to younger voters over the counter.
 
2013-05-02 08:53:34 AM
Great.  Stem cell research is next on the chopping block.  God damn Obama, why do you have to be so liberal conservative?
 
2013-05-02 08:55:09 AM
In before "Fark Liberal Elite Circle Jerk Club (need to find that badge someone created) is showing their unilateral support for Obama regardless of his position even though all evidence in this thread is to the contrary!"
 
2013-05-02 08:56:18 AM

Emposter: Oh look, the Bigot Research Council thinks teen girls should old be treated like incubators if they have sex.

What a shock.


MUST BE PUNISHED
 
2013-05-02 08:56:32 AM

TofuTheAlmighty: Lost Thought 00: 100% of the blame goes to Obama for this

I genuinely have no idea why he's pursuing this. Obama cannot be so knuckledraggingly stupid that he thinks GOPers will lend him support because he makes birth control harder to get. (Same as with the ramped up deportations and cannabis prosecutions.)


This is like watching your favorite team make some boneheaded play and cost themselves the game.  I don't know what the heck he's thinking with this.  He could singlehandedly reduce unemployment to 4%, increase middle class wealth, and bring peace and secular stability to the Middle East and Republicans still wouldn't have the decency to piss on his leg if it was on fire.  I don't know what his thought process is behind this one.  I'm really disappointed.
 
2013-05-02 08:58:12 AM

Lexx: My understanding is that it's safe to use as indicated.  We're not considering the use case where girls who can't get access to the pill attempt to use "Plan B" as a regular birth control?


Plan-B is priced at about $40. How many teenagers do you think can afford Plan-B but can't get regular birth control? Even if that were an issue, it's more of an argument to make regular birth control more accessible.

/plan-b: most shoplifted product of all time
 
2013-05-02 08:59:48 AM

Tomahawk513: TofuTheAlmighty: Lost Thought 00: 100% of the blame goes to Obama for this

I genuinely have no idea why he's pursuing this. Obama cannot be so knuckledraggingly stupid that he thinks GOPers will lend him support because he makes birth control harder to get. (Same as with the ramped up deportations and cannabis prosecutions.)

This is like watching your favorite team make some boneheaded play and cost themselves the game.  I don't know what the heck he's thinking with this.  He could singlehandedly reduce unemployment to 4%, increase middle class wealth, and bring peace and secular stability to the Middle East and Republicans still wouldn't have the decency to piss on his leg if it was on fire.  I don't know what his thought process is behind this one.  I'm really disappointed.


He did this because  the judge undermined the rulemaking of his administration and that cannot stand.  It is pure authoritarianism bleeding through.
 
2013-05-02 09:00:49 AM
Here's what I don't get.  The conservatives rail against welfare, but then they rail against systems that would limit the number of children being placed in the welfare system (contraception, abortion.)

It doesn't make sense.

At least with contraception, there's no ethical concerns over killing a developed fetus (at best, the morning after pill stops a fetus that's barely even began division?)

It only leads to fewer unwanted children on the welfare system.  People can ramble about abstinence all they want, but in practicality, contraception works much better than abstinence.

And yeah, I don't understand Obama's gameplan here.
 
2013-05-02 09:01:02 AM

coeyagi: In before "Fark Liberal Elite Circle Jerk Club (need to find that badge someone created) is showing their unilateral support for Obama regardless of his position even though all evidence in this thread is to the contrary!"


i.imgur.com
 
2013-05-02 09:04:29 AM

Jackson Herring: Emposter: Oh look, the Bigot Research Council thinks teen girls should old be treated like incubators if they have sex.

What a shock.

MUST BE PUNISHED


Has the FRC ever been right about anything? Certainly nothing is coming to mind. Their spokesperson must be the spiritual love child of Michelle Bachmann and Wayne La Pierre.
 
2013-05-02 09:06:07 AM

Saiga410: He did this because  the judge undermined the rulemaking of his administration and that cannot stand.  It is pure authoritarianism bleeding through.


1. Administration makes a decision
2. Judge rules to override that decision
3. Administration appeals ruling to return to original policy

I'm pretty sure this is handled by a reasonably simple shell script running on a server under someone's desk. No need to get all "Obama is teh authoritarianz" about it. The administration made their policy based on what they probably think is sound reasoning and don't want to see it overridden by one guy with an ax to grind.
 
2013-05-02 09:06:20 AM

heinekenftw: Here's what I don't get.  The conservatives rail against welfare, but then they rail against systems that would limit the number of children being placed in the welfare system (contraception, abortion.)

It doesn't make sense.

At least with contraception, there's no ethical concerns over killing a developed fetus (at best, the morning after pill stops a fetus that's barely even began division?)

It only leads to fewer unwanted children on the welfare system.  People can ramble about abstinence all they want, but in practicality, contraception works much better than abstinence.

And yeah, I don't understand Obama's gameplan here.


It's part of the prosperity gospel.  Conservatives think that people are poor because of their sinful/bad decisions and lack of work ethic, and thus they SHOULDN'T thrive or be helped, because to help them would be to reward such immoral behavior.  Basically: "See honey, see that single mom working a dead end job without health insurance? Guess she should've KEPT HER LEGS SHUT!"
 
2013-05-02 09:07:19 AM
Stupid.
 
2013-05-02 09:07:54 AM
This isn't surprising; as someone noted, having the courts decides what is and is not a controlled prescription drug sets a risky precedent for the government in general and the FDA in particular.

The Obama administration, though, ought to be fully vilified for allowing the FDA to make the original choice as a political consideration and not a health consideration. That's where he shiat the bed on this subject and that is where he should have originally been held accountable for the bad policy and bad decision. The FDA should be making decisions based on scientific evidence and not politics.
 
2013-05-02 09:09:27 AM
WTF Obama
 
2013-05-02 09:10:33 AM
With the appeal, the government is making clear that it's willing to ease access to emergency contraception only a certain amount - not nearly as broadly as doctors' groups and contraception advocates have urged.

Because why should the government listen to experts.
 
2013-05-02 09:11:10 AM

Monkeyhouse Zendo: Saiga410: He did this because  the judge undermined the rulemaking of his administration and that cannot stand.  It is pure authoritarianism bleeding through.

1. Administration makes a decision
2. Judge rules to override that decision
3. Administration appeals ruling to return to original policy

I'm pretty sure this is handled by a reasonably simple shell script running on a server under someone's desk. No need to get all "Obama is teh authoritarianz" about it. The administration made their policy based on what they probably think is sound reasoning and don't want to see it overridden by one guy with an ax to grind.


The original decision was purely political and represented the administration cowering to social conservative interests for political gain, not scientific evidence that age limits were necessary for public health reasons. The administration, FDA in particular, made bad policy for the wrong reasons.
 
2013-05-02 09:11:11 AM

Jackson Herring: coeyagi: In before "Fark Liberal Elite Circle Jerk Club (need to find that badge someone created) is showing their unilateral support for Obama regardless of his position even though all evidence in this thread is to the contrary!"

[i.imgur.com image 301x376]


Ok, but can you add an obese dog into that badge?

//jk
 
2013-05-02 09:12:49 AM

coeyagi: Jackson Herring: coeyagi: In before "Fark Liberal Elite Circle Jerk Club (need to find that badge someone created) is showing their unilateral support for Obama regardless of his position even though all evidence in this thread is to the contrary!"

[i.imgur.com image 301x376]

Ok, but can you add an obese dog into that badge?

//jk


25.media.tumblr.com
 
2013-05-02 09:13:28 AM

ZaxTrax: cman: Why is the Obama administration fighting this?


Because they have to.  It's the first time a court has reversed a decision by the FDA with regard to how a medication is prescribed.  It sets a precedent for the courts to decide how drugs are approved.Albeit, the FDA really screwed this up by letting politics get in the way of the approval process of Plan B.I guess no one at the FDA thought through the consequences when they made that decision.


That makes a lot of sense.
 
2013-05-02 09:15:32 AM

Monkeyhouse Zendo: Saiga410: He did this because  the judge undermined the rulemaking of his administration and that cannot stand.  It is pure authoritarianism bleeding through.

1. Administration makes a decision
2. Judge rules to override that decision
3. Administration appeals ruling to return to original policy

I'm pretty sure this is handled by a reasonably simple shell script running on a server under someone's desk. No need to get all "Obama is teh authoritarianz" about it. The administration made their policy based on what they probably think is sound reasoning and don't want to see it overridden by one guy with an ax to grind.


The appeal seems right to me, as much as I dislike the FDAs decision. Its one thing for the judge to say "you ignored your own experts and medical science. In doing so, your rule is arbitrary and capricious. Go back and do it right this time.". Its a whole different ballgame to tack "oh, btw, let me just write your new rule for you" on at the end...even if the result is the same. The process and separation of powers is important.

/on my phone, didn't read the new rule or decision
 
2013-05-02 09:19:04 AM

heinekenftw: It doesn't make sense.


It's a legal issue, the judge ruled that there be absolutely no age restrictions and the FDA put the age requirement at 15 instead.  The Justice department is appealing the judge's ruling in favor of that of the FDA.  Which it should, they can't just go against the judge's ruling, they have to appeal it and see if the ruling gets overturned.

You can buy condoms in gas station bathrooms.
 
2013-05-02 09:19:31 AM
Uh, didn't he get reelected?  Why is he STILL trying to appeal to social conservatives?  It's not like they'll give him any honoraria when he's ex-President.
 
2013-05-02 09:22:16 AM
So they're arguing to put the age limit at 15.  ZOMG, worst president ever.
 
2013-05-02 09:24:11 AM

heinekenftw: Here's what I don't get.  The conservatives rail against welfare, but then they rail against systems that would limit the number of children being placed in the welfare system (contraception, abortion.)

It doesn't make sense.

At least with contraception, there's no ethical concerns over killing a developed fetus (at best, the morning after pill stops a fetus that's barely even began division?)

It only leads to fewer unwanted children on the welfare system.  People can ramble about abstinence all they want, but in practicality, contraception works much better than abstinence.

And yeah, I don't understand Obama's gameplan here.


Many abortion opponents sincerely believe that the termination of a fertilized egg, even one that has not divided once, is an act of willful, premeditated murder equivalent to the killing of a five-year old human child. If such a belief is incomprehensible or nonsensical to you, consider that you lack the perspective of someone who is completely insane and who willfully ignores reality.
 
2013-05-02 09:25:26 AM

Target Builder: ZaxTrax: cman: Why is the Obama administration fighting this?


Because they have to.  It's the first time a court has reversed a decision by the FDA with regard to how a medication is prescribed.  It sets a precedent for the courts to decide how drugs are approved.Albeit, the FDA really screwed this up by letting politics get in the way of the approval process of Plan B.I guess no one at the FDA thought through the consequences when they made that decision.

That makes a lot of sense.


Yes.
And Big Pharma ain't having any of that. Not for a New York minute.
 
2013-05-02 09:25:27 AM
i895.photobucket.com i895.photobucket.com i895.photobucket.com i895.photobucket.com i895.photobucket.com
An age limit!!
 
2013-05-02 09:28:07 AM

HotIgneous Intruder: Target Builder: ZaxTrax: cman: Why is the Obama administration fighting this?


Because they have to.  It's the first time a court has reversed a decision by the FDA with regard to how a medication is prescribed.  It sets a precedent for the courts to decide how drugs are approved.Albeit, the FDA really screwed this up by letting politics get in the way of the approval process of Plan B.I guess no one at the FDA thought through the consequences when they made that decision.

That makes a lot of sense.

Yes.
And Big Pharma ain't having any of that. Not for a New York minute.


This also strips the genertic from the shelves while keeping planb available.....  doesn't big pharma have deep pockets?
 
2013-05-02 09:28:28 AM
The FDA shouldn't allow politics or personal opinions intrude in decisions it makes regarding the safety and availability of medical treatments.
 
2013-05-02 09:30:52 AM

Saiga410: HotIgneous Intruder: Target Builder: ZaxTrax: cman: Why is the Obama administration fighting this?


Because they have to.  It's the first time a court has reversed a decision by the FDA with regard to how a medication is prescribed.  It sets a precedent for the courts to decide how drugs are approved.Albeit, the FDA really screwed this up by letting politics get in the way of the approval process of Plan B.I guess no one at the FDA thought through the consequences when they made that decision.

That makes a lot of sense.

Yes.
And Big Pharma ain't having any of that. Not for a New York minute.

This also strips the genertic from the shelves while keeping planb available.....  doesn't big pharma have deep pockets?


It only removes the generic from the shelves if the appeals court stays the lower courts decision while they hear the case. The original decision would have allowed the generic to also be available.
 
2013-05-02 09:33:49 AM

Target Builder: cman: Why is the Obama administration fighting this?

He's a lot more conservative than a lot of people, conservatives and liberals, think he is.


He is solidly an economic liberal.  That is all.  Everything else is issue based.  He happens to pro-choice and pro-gay, which is wonderful, but he doesn't get there by way of having an individual rights position that he stands by, or you would see it across a range of other issues.  It's an a le carte selection, not a matter of declaring a set of principles and standing by them even when they favor something you find distasteful.   Labels that apply here are "leftist" and "Democrat."
 
2013-05-02 09:36:06 AM

Lexx: DubyaHater: Just what we need........both sides intruding on a woman's reproductive rights.  This should be a decision made between a woman and her physician.  The FDA made a step in the right direction yesterday, and now the Justice Dept wants to reverse that.  Women, especially teenagers, need better access to birth control.  Some of these politicians should step foot in my clinic once in a while and see the number of teenagers who end up pregnant.

Uh dude, the court decision is that young girls of any age don't NEED to see a physician, or even speak to a pharmacist, to buy the morning after pill.  I'm all for "a woman's health is hers and her doctor's concern only" but that's not what this is about.

At the same time, I really don't think we should be giving out hormonal birth control anything without even a consult with the pharmacist, but I do understand how young girls might be too intimidated to ask.


And pharmacists might be too republican to help young girls in need, as we've seen like dozens of times over the last decade.
 
2013-05-02 09:39:32 AM

dr_blasto: This isn't surprising; as someone noted, having the courts decides what is and is not a controlled prescription drug sets a risky precedent for the government in general and the FDA in particular.

The Obama administration, though, ought to be fully vilified for allowing the FDA to make the original choice as a political consideration and not a health consideration. That's where he shiat the bed on this subject and that is where he should have originally been held accountable for the bad policy and bad decision. The FDA should be making decisions based on scientific evidence and not politics.


Like global warming?
 
2013-05-02 09:47:07 AM

James!: So they're arguing to put the age limit at 15.  ZOMG, worst president ever.


No, the Justice Department is trying to overturn the judges decision lowering the age from 17 to 15.
 
2013-05-02 09:55:25 AM

Jackson Herring: James!: So they're arguing to put the age limit at 15.  ZOMG, worst president ever.

No, the Justice Department is trying to overturn the judges decision lowering the age from 17 to 15.


Read the first two paragraphs of the article.
 
2013-05-02 10:01:00 AM

ikanreed: Lexx: DubyaHater: Just what we need........both sides intruding on a woman's reproductive rights.  This should be a decision made between a woman and her physician.  The FDA made a step in the right direction yesterday, and now the Justice Dept wants to reverse that.  Women, especially teenagers, need better access to birth control.  Some of these politicians should step foot in my clinic once in a while and see the number of teenagers who end up pregnant.

Uh dude, the court decision is that young girls of any age don't NEED to see a physician, or even speak to a pharmacist, to buy the morning after pill.  I'm all for "a woman's health is hers and her doctor's concern only" but that's not what this is about.

At the same time, I really don't think we should be giving out hormonal birth control anything without even a consult with the pharmacist, but I do understand how young girls might be too intimidated to ask.

And pharmacists might be too republican to help young girls in need, as we've seen like dozens of times over the last decade.


That's a whole other issue, and personally I think that pharmacists should have their license pulled for pulling that kind of bullshiat.
 
2013-05-02 10:05:41 AM

Rapmaster2000: You know who else was a lib that hated abortion.  That's right...

Most communist commie that ever communed.


well, at least romania gave him a shot. and his wife.

/tyrannical dictator ≠ "lib"
 
2013-05-02 10:14:28 AM

ComicBookGuy: Uh, didn't he get reelected?  Why is he STILL trying to appeal to social conservatives?  It's not like they'll give him any honoraria when he's ex-President.


Because he himself is pretty conservative on just about every issue. If you haven't caught on at this point you should probably wear water wings whenever you eat soup from now on.

So turn the question around. Why should he do anything to appeal to liberals? He isn't running for reelection.
 
2013-05-02 10:17:10 AM

mrshowrules: dr_blasto: This isn't surprising; as someone noted, having the courts decides what is and is not a controlled prescription drug sets a risky precedent for the government in general and the FDA in particular.

The Obama administration, though, ought to be fully vilified for allowing the FDA to make the original choice as a political consideration and not a health consideration. That's where he shiat the bed on this subject and that is where he should have originally been held accountable for the bad policy and bad decision. The FDA should be making decisions based on scientific evidence and not politics.

Like global warming?


Well, I'm not sure what the FDA has to do with climate change, but for the appropriate regulatory agencies, yes.
 
2013-05-02 10:30:34 AM

James!: So they're arguing to put the age limit at 15.  ZOMG, worst president ever.


The issue isn't age; it's that now a government issued ID is required for purchase.  My 15-year-old didn't have an ID.  And as we know from the last election, a statistically significant portion of the population doesn't.

Further, this med cost $50.  If an 11-year-old is eating Plan B like candy, she has too much allowance.
 
2013-05-02 10:35:36 AM

cman: Why is the Obama administration fighting this?


You can come up with a lot of politically motivated reasons, but I'd bet that it's because it is generally the position of the Justice Department to advocate for standing law to the best of their ability in court, and no one in the administration feels like this is an important enough issue to give it special consideration.

The default is for them to defend the law.
 
2013-05-02 10:40:18 AM

Wendolyn the Wired: James!: So they're arguing to put the age limit at 15.  ZOMG, worst president ever.

The issue isn't age; it's that now a government issued ID is required for purchase.  My 15-year-old didn't have an ID.  And as we know from the last election, a statistically significant portion of the population doesn't.

Further, this med cost $50.  If an 11-year-old is eating Plan B like candy, she has too much allowance.


If an 11 year old is eating Plan B at all there is a serious problem going on in their lives.
 
2013-05-02 11:01:07 AM
The FDA actually had been poised to lift all age limits and let Plan B sell over the counter in late 2011, when Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius overruled her own scientists. Sebelius said some girls as young as 11 were physically capable of bearing children but shouldn't be able to buy the pregnancy-preventing pill on their own.

... because 11 year olds who have sex should be forced to get pregnant? What kind of sick fark wants pregnant 11 year olds?
 
2013-05-02 11:12:24 AM

Theaetetus: The FDA actually had been poised to lift all age limits and let Plan B sell over the counter in late 2011, when Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius overruled her own scientists. Sebelius said some girls as young as 11 were physically capable of bearing children but shouldn't be able to buy the pregnancy-preventing pill on their own.

... because 11 year olds who have sex should be forced to get pregnant? What kind of sick fark wants pregnant 11 year olds?


Basically if an 11 year old can't walk into a pharmacy and buy plan B no questions asked there are no alternatives for her and she will have to have the child.  It's a cruel world.
 
2013-05-02 11:20:46 AM

James!: Theaetetus: The FDA actually had been poised to lift all age limits and let Plan B sell over the counter in late 2011, when Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius overruled her own scientists. Sebelius said some girls as young as 11 were physically capable of bearing children but shouldn't be able to buy the pregnancy-preventing pill on their own.

... because 11 year olds who have sex should be forced to get pregnant? What kind of sick fark wants pregnant 11 year olds?

Basically if an 11 year old can't walk into a pharmacy and buy plan B no questions asked there are no alternatives for her and she will have to have the child.  It's a cruel world.


If I was a Pharmacist, I would place it on the counter in front of her and say.  "I'm going on break now".
 
2013-05-02 11:34:15 AM

Theaetetus: What kind of sick fark wants pregnant 11 year olds?


Probably the same dude that's f*ckin' 'em.
 
2013-05-02 11:35:37 AM

mrshowrules: James!: Theaetetus: The FDA actually had been poised to lift all age limits and let Plan B sell over the counter in late 2011, when Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius overruled her own scientists. Sebelius said some girls as young as 11 were physically capable of bearing children but shouldn't be able to buy the pregnancy-preventing pill on their own.

... because 11 year olds who have sex should be forced to get pregnant? What kind of sick fark wants pregnant 11 year olds?

Basically if an 11 year old can't walk into a pharmacy and buy plan B no questions asked there are no alternatives for her and she will have to have the child.  It's a cruel world.

If I was a Pharmacist, I would place it on the counter in front of her and say.  "I'm going on break now".


Probably not a bad idea, after you ask her if she needs any help or if someone is hurting her.
 
2013-05-02 11:54:20 AM
FTA - "allow girls and women of any age to buy "

are men not allowed to buy this product? I know in the past I could have used it as a solution or a bargaining chip.
 
2013-05-02 12:26:51 PM
WHY IS THIS AN ISSUE?
 
2013-05-02 12:46:24 PM

cman: Why is the Obama administration fighting this?


Because, despite what the ravings of Tea Partiers might lead you to believe, President Obama is not particularly liberal. He's arguably the most conservative democrat to hold the presidency since FDR first won office.

Wendolyn the Wired: The issue isn't age; it's that now a government issued ID is required for purchase. My 15-year-old didn't have an ID. And as we know from the last election, a statistically significant portion of the population doesn't.


Generally tending to be poorer, and thus less likely to be able to afford regular use of contraceptive techniques less failure prone than rhythm/prayer methods, and whose economic margin will be more heavily impacted by having a baby.
 
2013-05-02 12:50:15 PM
Deptartment?
 
2013-05-02 01:11:09 PM
On what possible grounds can they oppose this?  I don't see them taking a stance against any other medicines that are out on the shelves, this is just hypocrisy that hurts young women.
 
2013-05-02 01:20:44 PM

James!: Theaetetus: The FDA actually had been poised to lift all age limits and let Plan B sell over the counter in late 2011, when Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius overruled her own scientists. Sebelius said some girls as young as 11 were physically capable of bearing children but shouldn't be able to buy the pregnancy-preventing pill on their own.

... because 11 year olds who have sex should be forced to get pregnant? What kind of sick fark wants pregnant 11 year olds?

Basically if an 11 year old can't walk into a pharmacy and buy plan B no questions asked there are no alternatives for her and she will have to have the child.  It's a cruel world.


When you're done fighting that strawman, you could explain why it's better that an 11 year old should go through an invasive surgical procedure rather than take a pill that prevents pregnancy.
 
2013-05-02 01:24:57 PM

Theaetetus: James!: Theaetetus: The FDA actually had been poised to lift all age limits and let Plan B sell over the counter in late 2011, when Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius overruled her own scientists. Sebelius said some girls as young as 11 were physically capable of bearing children but shouldn't be able to buy the pregnancy-preventing pill on their own.

... because 11 year olds who have sex should be forced to get pregnant? What kind of sick fark wants pregnant 11 year olds?

Basically if an 11 year old can't walk into a pharmacy and buy plan B no questions asked there are no alternatives for her and she will have to have the child.  It's a cruel world.

When you're done fighting that strawman, you could explain why it's better that an 11 year old should go through an invasive surgical procedure rather than take a pill that prevents pregnancy.


Really? Abortion is the only other option if the hypothetical 11 year old can't just walk in and buy plan B? It's unfettered access, abortion or having a kid? Why have we been cursed with only three options!?
 
2013-05-02 01:30:21 PM

James!: Theaetetus: James!: Theaetetus: The FDA actually had been poised to lift all age limits and let Plan B sell over the counter in late 2011, when Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius overruled her own scientists. Sebelius said some girls as young as 11 were physically capable of bearing children but shouldn't be able to buy the pregnancy-preventing pill on their own.

... because 11 year olds who have sex should be forced to get pregnant? What kind of sick fark wants pregnant 11 year olds?

Basically if an 11 year old can't walk into a pharmacy and buy plan B no questions asked there are no alternatives for her and she will have to have the child.  It's a cruel world.

When you're done fighting that strawman, you could explain why it's better that an 11 year old should go through an invasive surgical procedure rather than take a pill that prevents pregnancy.

Really? Abortion is the only other option if the hypothetical 11 year old can't just walk in and buy plan B? It's unfettered access, abortion or having a kid? Why have we been cursed with only three options!?


Well, since we lack the ability to teleport fetuses from the womb, I'm not sure what else you're suggesting. You've got an 11 year old with a fertilized egg in transit. It's not going to end well in any way, but Plan B is the best option, and you've got limited time.

Of course, I know what you're suggesting with your concern trolling. But what you're implying is that, yes, you want pregnant 11 year olds to either have abortions or go through labor. And that's pretty despicable.
 
2013-05-02 01:35:33 PM

Theaetetus: James!: Theaetetus: James!: Theaetetus: The FDA actually had been poised to lift all age limits and let Plan B sell over the counter in late 2011, when Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius overruled her own scientists. Sebelius said some girls as young as 11 were physically capable of bearing children but shouldn't be able to buy the pregnancy-preventing pill on their own.

... because 11 year olds who have sex should be forced to get pregnant? What kind of sick fark wants pregnant 11 year olds?

Basically if an 11 year old can't walk into a pharmacy and buy plan B no questions asked there are no alternatives for her and she will have to have the child.  It's a cruel world.

When you're done fighting that strawman, you could explain why it's better that an 11 year old should go through an invasive surgical procedure rather than take a pill that prevents pregnancy.

Really? Abortion is the only other option if the hypothetical 11 year old can't just walk in and buy plan B? It's unfettered access, abortion or having a kid? Why have we been cursed with only three options!?

Well, since we lack the ability to teleport fetuses from the womb, I'm not sure what else you're suggesting. You've got an 11 year old with a fertilized egg in transit. It's not going to end well in any way, but Plan B is the best option, and you've got limited time.

Of course, I know what you're suggesting with your concern trolling. But what you're implying is that, yes, you want pregnant 11 year olds to either have abortions or go through labor. And that's pretty despicable.


Who afflicted is with only these limited choices? WHAT KIND OF GOD ALLOWS ONLY THREE VERY SPECIFIC OPTIONS FOR THESE CHILDREN!?!?!
 
2013-05-02 01:36:15 PM
Honestly though, I'm starting to think you aren't even aware of what's being debated here.
 
2013-05-02 01:44:16 PM
I just love coming into threads about the Justice Department doing whatever-the-fark and seeing people blame Obama personally for their actions. It feels great knowing I share this country with you mouthbreathers.

/sarcasm off
 
2013-05-02 01:45:37 PM

James!: Theaetetus: James!: Theaetetus: James!: Theaetetus: The FDA actually had been poised to lift all age limits and let Plan B sell over the counter in late 2011, when Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius overruled her own scientists. Sebelius said some girls as young as 11 were physically capable of bearing children but shouldn't be able to buy the pregnancy-preventing pill on their own.

... because 11 year olds who have sex should be forced to get pregnant? What kind of sick fark wants pregnant 11 year olds?

Basically if an 11 year old can't walk into a pharmacy and buy plan B no questions asked there are no alternatives for her and she will have to have the child.  It's a cruel world.

When you're done fighting that strawman, you could explain why it's better that an 11 year old should go through an invasive surgical procedure rather than take a pill that prevents pregnancy.

Really? Abortion is the only other option if the hypothetical 11 year old can't just walk in and buy plan B? It's unfettered access, abortion or having a kid? Why have we been cursed with only three options!?

Well, since we lack the ability to teleport fetuses from the womb, I'm not sure what else you're suggesting. You've got an 11 year old with a fertilized egg in transit. It's not going to end well in any way, but Plan B is the best option, and you've got limited time.

Of course, I know what you're suggesting with your concern trolling. But what you're implying is that, yes, you want pregnant 11 year olds to either have abortions or go through labor. And that's pretty despicable.

Who afflicted is with only these limited choices? WHAT KIND OF GOD ALLOWS ONLY THREE VERY SPECIFIC OPTIONS FOR THESE CHILDREN!?!?!


[eyeroll]
When you're done with your hysterics, would you like to suggest a third option for a pregnant 11 year old? Or would you like to admit that you don't actually have anything to offer other than trolling?
 
2013-05-02 01:48:48 PM

Theaetetus: [eyeroll]
When you're done with your hysterics, would you like to suggest a third option for a pregnant 11 year old? Or would you like to admit that you don't actually have anything to offer other than trolling?


Simple, she could speak to an adult.  Say a parent or school counselor or a doctor and have them procure plan B for her.

You definition of trolling is deep and wide my friend. Just because people don't agree with you or give you the deference you think you deserve it doesn't mean they're trolling you.
 
2013-05-02 01:50:50 PM

James!: Simple, she could speak to an adult.  Say a parent or school counselor or a doctor and have them procure plan B for her.


In New York or Cali, this sounds like a good idea.

I fear for the girl's health in a midwestern/southern state. All it takes is her speaking to a fundie idiot for the shiat to hit the fan.
 
2013-05-02 01:54:34 PM

James!: Theaetetus: [eyeroll]
When you're done with your hysterics, would you like to suggest a third option for a pregnant 11 year old? Or would you like to admit that you don't actually have anything to offer other than trolling?

Simple, she could speak to an adult.  Say a parent or school counselor or a doctor and have them procure plan B for her.


WHAAAAAAT?!! But YOU just said that there were OTHER options than Plan B, abortion, or labor!! HOW CAN THIS BEEEEEEE?!! WHAT KIND OF GOD WOULD ALLOW YOU TO BE SUCH A DOUCHE!?!?

Anyways, fark off, you trolling piece of shiat.
 
2013-05-02 01:54:45 PM

un4gvn666: James!: Simple, she could speak to an adult.  Say a parent or school counselor or a doctor and have them procure plan B for her.

In New York or Cali, this sounds like a good idea.

I fear for the girl's health in a midwestern/southern state. All it takes is her speaking to a fundie idiot for the shiat to hit the fan.


If it's as bad as you say then the pharmacist/drug store cashier is just as risky.
 
2013-05-02 01:56:33 PM

Theaetetus: James!: Theaetetus: [eyeroll]
When you're done with your hysterics, would you like to suggest a third option for a pregnant 11 year old? Or would you like to admit that you don't actually have anything to offer other than trolling?

Simple, she could speak to an adult.  Say a parent or school counselor or a doctor and have them procure plan B for her.

WHAAAAAAT?!! But YOU just said that there were OTHER options than Plan B, abortion, or labor!! HOW CAN THIS BEEEEEEE?!! WHAT KIND OF GOD WOULD ALLOW YOU TO BE SUCH A DOUCHE!?!?

Anyways, fark off, you trolling piece of shiat.


Oh so you don't know what anyone is talking about.  The question, friend, is if an 11 year old should be able to buy it by herself.  We are talking about an age restriction at 15.

Unless it gets your rocks off to come into a thread and completely miss what everyone else is talking about and then flame them.
 
2013-05-02 01:57:37 PM
Reading into this more http://www.politico.com/story/2013/05/justice-department-appeals-morn i ng-after-pill-ruling-90842_Page2.html
It seems what is really happening is that the Justice Department is trying to stop the idea that District Courts can set FDA policy nation-wide. This isn't about the morning after pill as much is it about jurisdiction.
 
2013-05-02 01:59:14 PM

James!: If it's as bad as you say then the pharmacist/drug store cashier is just as risky.


Well, pharmacists aren't in the picture (the ruling takes them out of the equation). The only person that might impede the girl getting Plan B would be the store cashier. What are they going to do, say "No, you can't buy that?" Worst case scenario, she leaves the Walgreens and goes across the street to CVS to get it there (why are there always one of each of these right next to each other, btw?).

A parent or school counselor can fark up your life because they know you personally. And how an 11-year-old girl is going to see a doctor without their parent knowing is a mystery to me, but either way, it's still not advantageous.
 
2013-05-02 02:01:19 PM

James!: Theaetetus: James!: Theaetetus: [eyeroll]
When you're done with your hysterics, would you like to suggest a third option for a pregnant 11 year old? Or would you like to admit that you don't actually have anything to offer other than trolling?

Simple, she could speak to an adult.  Say a parent or school counselor or a doctor and have them procure plan B for her.

WHAAAAAAT?!! But YOU just said that there were OTHER options than Plan B, abortion, or labor!! HOW CAN THIS BEEEEEEE?!! WHAT KIND OF GOD WOULD ALLOW YOU TO BE SUCH A DOUCHE!?!?

Anyways, fark off, you trolling piece of shiat.

Oh so you don't know what anyone is talking about.  The question, friend, is if an 11 year old should be able to buy it by herself.  We are talking about an age restriction at 15.

Unless it gets your rocks off to come into a thread and completely miss what everyone else is talking about and then flame them.


Nice try, troll. You never raised that as an issue - you specifically said that there were other options for dealing with pregnancy, not that she could do the same option in a different way. It's not my fault that you're an imbecile who wanted to make a different argument than he actually did.
 
2013-05-02 02:01:26 PM

un4gvn666: James!: If it's as bad as you say then the pharmacist/drug store cashier is just as risky.

Well, pharmacists aren't in the picture (the ruling takes them out of the equation). The only person that might impede the girl getting Plan B would be the store cashier. What are they going to do, say "No, you can't buy that?" Worst case scenario, she leaves the Walgreens and goes across the street to CVS to get it there (why are there always one of each of these right next to each other, btw?).

A parent or school counselor can fark up your life because they know you personally. And how an 11-year-old girl is going to see a doctor without their parent knowing is a mystery to me, but either way, it's still not advantageous.


In the event that every authority figure in a girl's life is ready to turn on her just for being teen pregnant she has a serious set of problems beyond.  But you are painting yourself into a pretty strict hypothetical.
 
2013-05-02 02:02:13 PM

Target Builder: cman: Why is the Obama administration fighting this?

He's a lot more conservative than a lot of people, conservatives and liberals, think he is.


This was my first thought.

Muta: HotWingConspiracy: Peter von Nostrand: cman: Why is the Obama administration fighting this?

Trolling Republicans

Wait...because republicans are trolling, or he's trolling republicans?

Obama is trying to get Republicans to oppose his opposition to the morning after pill.  Tomorrow we'll see Cantor arguing that the pill needs to be given away to all girls at school.


This is what I hope it is.

/let's see if the Republicans stick to their "Party of NO!" stance
//as if Republicans stick to anything
 
2013-05-02 02:03:25 PM

James!: un4gvn666: James!: If it's as bad as you say then the pharmacist/drug store cashier is just as risky.

Well, pharmacists aren't in the picture (the ruling takes them out of the equation). The only person that might impede the girl getting Plan B would be the store cashier. What are they going to do, say "No, you can't buy that?" Worst case scenario, she leaves the Walgreens and goes across the street to CVS to get it there (why are there always one of each of these right next to each other, btw?).

A parent or school counselor can fark up your life because they know you personally. And how an 11-year-old girl is going to see a doctor without their parent knowing is a mystery to me, but either way, it's still not advantageous.

In the event that every authority figure in a girl's life is ready to turn on her just for being teen pregnant she has a serious set of problems beyond.  But you are painting yourself into a pretty strict hypothetical.


Which is why I like to avoid the hypothetical entirely, and would advocate that any girl of any age who gets pregnant should be free to choose to take Plan B when and if they want to. Parent's religious beliefs/personal opinions should have nothing to do with it.
 
2013-05-02 02:03:40 PM

Theaetetus: James!: Theaetetus: James!: Theaetetus: [eyeroll]
When you're done with your hysterics, would you like to suggest a third option for a pregnant 11 year old? Or would you like to admit that you don't actually have anything to offer other than trolling?

Simple, she could speak to an adult.  Say a parent or school counselor or a doctor and have them procure plan B for her.

WHAAAAAAT?!! But YOU just said that there were OTHER options than Plan B, abortion, or labor!! HOW CAN THIS BEEEEEEE?!! WHAT KIND OF GOD WOULD ALLOW YOU TO BE SUCH A DOUCHE!?!?

Anyways, fark off, you trolling piece of shiat.

Oh so you don't know what anyone is talking about.  The question, friend, is if an 11 year old should be able to buy it by herself.  We are talking about an age restriction at 15.

Unless it gets your rocks off to come into a thread and completely miss what everyone else is talking about and then flame them.

Nice try, troll. You never raised that as an issue - you specifically said that there were other options for dealing with pregnancy, not that she could do the same option in a different way. It's not my fault that you're an imbecile who wanted to make a different argument than he actually did.


Oh you get pretty into personal attacks when you're lost.

Did you perhaps read the article?  The issue did not need to be raised beyond it being THE farkING POINT OF CONTENTION BETWEEN THE FDA AND THE COURTS.  Judge says no age restrictions, FDA says 15.  I assumed you didn't need that spelled out to you, but obviously I was giving you too much credit.
 
2013-05-02 02:06:22 PM

un4gvn666: James!: un4gvn666: James!: If it's as bad as you say then the pharmacist/drug store cashier is just as risky.

Well, pharmacists aren't in the picture (the ruling takes them out of the equation). The only person that might impede the girl getting Plan B would be the store cashier. What are they going to do, say "No, you can't buy that?" Worst case scenario, she leaves the Walgreens and goes across the street to CVS to get it there (why are there always one of each of these right next to each other, btw?).

A parent or school counselor can fark up your life because they know you personally. And how an 11-year-old girl is going to see a doctor without their parent knowing is a mystery to me, but either way, it's still not advantageous.

In the event that every authority figure in a girl's life is ready to turn on her just for being teen pregnant she has a serious set of problems beyond.  But you are painting yourself into a pretty strict hypothetical.

Which is why I like to avoid the hypothetical entirely, and would advocate that any girl of any age who gets pregnant should be free to choose to take Plan B when and if they want to. Parent's religious beliefs/personal opinions should have nothing to do with it.


Right, I'm not even sure where I land on the question.  On the one hand if an 11 year old is getting pregnant I'd hope that someone would be looking into how and if she's being harmed in any way, on the other hand I understand where you're coming from as well.

At the end of the day I am glad it isn't my decision to make.
 
2013-05-02 02:06:46 PM

Tomahawk513: TofuTheAlmighty: Lost Thought 00: 100% of the blame goes to Obama for this

I genuinely have no idea why he's pursuing this. Obama cannot be so knuckledraggingly stupid that he thinks GOPers will lend him support because he makes birth control harder to get. (Same as with the ramped up deportations and cannabis prosecutions.)

This is like watching your favorite team make some boneheaded play and cost themselves the game.  I don't know what the heck he's thinking with this.  He could singlehandedly reduce unemployment to 4%, increase middle class wealth, and bring peace and secular stability to the Middle East and Republicans still wouldn't have the decency to piss on his leg if it was on fire.  I don't know what his thought process is behind this one.  I'm really disappointed.


Because he's authoritarian, a conservative, and a corporate whore?  Just like 99% of all politicians we've elected?
 
2013-05-02 02:07:42 PM

James!: At the end of the day I am glad it isn't my decision to make.


Damn straight.

Male gender FTW.
 
2013-05-02 02:08:25 PM

un4gvn666: James!: At the end of the day I am glad it isn't my decision to make.

Damn straight.

Male gender FTW.


CHEST BUMP WITHOUT HURTING OUR BOOBS!!
 
2013-05-02 02:10:51 PM

James!: un4gvn666: James!: At the end of the day I am glad it isn't my decision to make.

Damn straight.

Male gender FTW.

CHEST BUMP WITHOUT HURTING OUR BOOBS!!


AND THEN WE PEE OFF A BRIDGE STANDING UP, JUST BECAUSE WE CAN!
 
2013-05-02 02:11:32 PM

un4gvn666: James!: un4gvn666: James!: At the end of the day I am glad it isn't my decision to make.

Damn straight.

Male gender FTW.

CHEST BUMP WITHOUT HURTING OUR BOOBS!!

AND THEN WE PEE OFF A BRIDGE STANDING UP, JUST BECAUSE WE CAN!


DO YOU WANT TO GO ON A TRIP TO SEE A DEAD BODY!!?
 
2013-05-02 02:15:38 PM
Speaking from personal experience:

I was 14 when I went to get contraception (BC pills) at the student health center at the community college I attended. I had a great conversation with the nurse, who informed me that while I would need parental consent for a TB test, I could get the birth control pills without. I did, however, have to get a gyn exam, which cost $40, and the pills were $6 a month. BF at the time paid for all of it.

I did actually ask my mother beforehand to get them for me, and she said no. Keep in mind we're in California, and we're both pretty liberal, so it's not like she was doing it out of any religious concern (we're both atheists).

I'm now almost 30. I don't have kids, and thank farking god.

So yeah, can we just be honest about the fact that kids are gonna get curious about their bodies? I remember having very clear sexual thoughts at 5, as in, actually wanting to have sex, not just "Ooh, you have different parts than me!" Why the fark are we insisting that they be punished for life for curiosity?

/really tired of this "one mistake and you're done for life" shtick. I blame the internet in general and Facebook in specific.
 
2013-05-02 02:15:40 PM

James!: un4gvn666: James!: un4gvn666: James!: At the end of the day I am glad it isn't my decision to make.

Damn straight.

Male gender FTW.

CHEST BUMP WITHOUT HURTING OUR BOOBS!!

AND THEN WE PEE OFF A BRIDGE STANDING UP, JUST BECAUSE WE CAN!

DO YOU WANT TO GO ON A TRIP TO SEE A DEAD BODY!!?


ONLY AFTER WE DO A SUPER-SECRET HANDSHAKE, AND MAKE SURE THERE ARE NO COOTIE-CARRYING GIRLS AROUND!

/I'm not gonna get shiat done at work today, am I?
/No, other Barry, no I am not.
 
2013-05-02 02:20:15 PM

un4gvn666: James!: un4gvn666: James!: un4gvn666: James!: At the end of the day I am glad it isn't my decision to make.

Damn straight.

Male gender FTW.

CHEST BUMP WITHOUT HURTING OUR BOOBS!!

AND THEN WE PEE OFF A BRIDGE STANDING UP, JUST BECAUSE WE CAN!

DO YOU WANT TO GO ON A TRIP TO SEE A DEAD BODY!!?

ONLY AFTER WE DO A SUPER-SECRET HANDSHAKE, AND MAKE SURE THERE ARE NO COOTIE-CARRYING GIRLS AROUND!

/I'm not gonna get shiat done at work today, am I?
/No, other Barry, no I am not.


I HAVE A TREE HOUSE WE CAN USE AS A FORT!
 
2013-05-02 02:22:00 PM

James!: Did you perhaps read the article?


Let's rewind and review the tape. Here, we see my post, quoting from the article:

Theaetetus: The FDA actually had been poised to lift all age limits and let Plan B sell over the counter in late 2011, when Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius overruled her own scientists. Sebelius said some girls as young as 11 were physically capable of bearing children but shouldn't be able to buy the pregnancy-preventing pill on their own.

... because 11 year olds who have sex should be forced to get pregnant? What kind of sick fark wants pregnant 11 year olds?


And then we see your post:

James!: Basically if an 11 year old can't walk into a pharmacy and buy plan B no questions asked there are no alternatives for her and she will have to have the child.  It's a cruel world.


But you really were suggesting that the 11 year old should take plan B, and I'm the one being obtuse for not recognizing you were really talking about age restrictions?

Here's the thing... "troll" is not a personal attack. It's an apt description for your posts. Particularly the three in a row with nothing of substance, but just the fake hysteria and concern. Don't want to be a troll? Then argue with people over issues, rather than just being a douche.
 
2013-05-02 02:25:42 PM

Theaetetus: James!: Did you perhaps read the article?

Let's rewind and review the tape. Here, we see my post, quoting from the article:
Theaetetus: The FDA actually had been poised to lift all age limits and let Plan B sell over the counter in late 2011, when Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius overruled her own scientists. Sebelius said some girls as young as 11 were physically capable of bearing children but shouldn't be able to buy the pregnancy-preventing pill on their own.

... because 11 year olds who have sex should be forced to get pregnant? What kind of sick fark wants pregnant 11 year olds?

And then we see your post:
James!: Basically if an 11 year old can't walk into a pharmacy and buy plan B no questions asked there are no alternatives for her and she will have to have the child.  It's a cruel world.

But you really were suggesting that the 11 year old should take plan B, and I'm the one being obtuse for not recognizing you were really talking about age restrictions?

Here's the thing... "troll" is not a personal attack. It's an apt description for your posts. Particularly the three in a row with nothing of substance, but just the fake hysteria and concern. Don't want to be a troll? Then argue with people over issues, rather than just being a douche.


Someone's not invited into the tree house/fort...
 
2013-05-02 02:26:29 PM

Theaetetus: James!: Did you perhaps read the article?

Let's rewind and review the tape. Here, we see my post, quoting from the article:
Theaetetus: The FDA actually had been poised to lift all age limits and let Plan B sell over the counter in late 2011, when Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius overruled her own scientists. Sebelius said some girls as young as 11 were physically capable of bearing children but shouldn't be able to buy the pregnancy-preventing pill on their own.

... because 11 year olds who have sex should be forced to get pregnant? What kind of sick fark wants pregnant 11 year olds?

And then we see your post:
James!: Basically if an 11 year old can't walk into a pharmacy and buy plan B no questions asked there are no alternatives for her and she will have to have the child.  It's a cruel world.

But you really were suggesting that the 11 year old should take plan B, and I'm the one being obtuse for not recognizing you were really talking about age restrictions?

Here's the thing... "troll" is not a personal attack. It's an apt description for your posts. Particularly the three in a row with nothing of substance, but just the fake hysteria and concern. Don't want to be a troll? Then argue with people over issues, rather than just being a douche.


Look at the bold bit.  Do you see it? Did you understand it?

Second, no one is obligated to take you seriously or respond the way you want them to.  You flew into a tantrum because I wouldn't engage you in the way you though I should.  I assume that you are an adult in the real world and you don't behave that way.  But I assumed earlier that you knew what the thread was about, so who knows.
 
2013-05-02 02:29:04 PM

Lexx: DubyaHater: Just what we need........both sides intruding on a woman's reproductive rights.  This should be a decision made between a woman and her physician.  The FDA made a step in the right direction yesterday, and now the Justice Dept wants to reverse that.  Women, especially teenagers, need better access to birth control.  Some of these politicians should step foot in my clinic once in a while and see the number of teenagers who end up pregnant.

Uh dude, the court decision is that young girls of any age don't NEED to see a physician, or even speak to a pharmacist, to buy the morning after pill.  I'm all for "a woman's health is hers and her doctor's concern only" but that's not what this is about.

At the same time, I really don't think we should be giving out hormonal birth control anything without even a consult with the pharmacist, but I do understand how young girls might be too intimidated to ask.


OTOH, if an 11 year old has unprotected sex, whether willingly or unwillingly, and has the intelligence to understand the ramifications AND can get to a drug store...just sell her the damn stuff already.  Yes, yes, yes, we ALL hope 11 year olds aren't having sex, but that's not the reality of our world now, is it?
 
2013-05-02 02:31:14 PM

James!: Second, no one is obligated to take you seriously or respond the way you want them to.   You flew into a tantrum because I wouldn't engage you in the way you though I should.


James!: Who afflicted is with only these limited choices? WHAT KIND OF GOD ALLOWS ONLY THREE VERY SPECIFIC OPTIONS FOR THESE CHILDREN!?!?!


Mmhmm. You got pissy because I called you out for trolling. Don't try to do the "no u" game. It's childish, which is a bit hypocritical in view of your last post.
 
2013-05-02 02:32:38 PM

Theaetetus: James!: Second, no one is obligated to take you seriously or respond the way you want them to.   You flew into a tantrum because I wouldn't engage you in the way you though I should.

James!: Who afflicted is with only these limited choices? WHAT KIND OF GOD ALLOWS ONLY THREE VERY SPECIFIC OPTIONS FOR THESE CHILDREN!?!?!

Mmhmm. You got pissy because I called you out for trolling. Don't try to do the "no u" game. It's childish, which is a bit hypocritical in view of your last post.


Oh dear, you thought that comment was serious.  Just go back to ignoring me, man.  I'm not going to be able to teach you how to behave.
 
2013-05-02 02:34:53 PM

James!: Theaetetus: James!: Second, no one is obligated to take you seriously or respond the way you want them to.   You flew into a tantrum because I wouldn't engage you in the way you though I should.

James!: Who afflicted is with only these limited choices? WHAT KIND OF GOD ALLOWS ONLY THREE VERY SPECIFIC OPTIONS FOR THESE CHILDREN!?!?!

Mmhmm. You got pissy because I called you out for trolling. Don't try to do the "no u" game. It's childish, which is a bit hypocritical in view of your last post.

Oh dear, you thought that comment was serious.  Just go back to ignoring me, man.  I'm not going to be able to teach you how to behave.


Apparently you don't know what trolling means. Odd that you're so good at it.
 
2013-05-02 02:38:22 PM

Theaetetus: James!: Theaetetus: James!: Second, no one is obligated to take you seriously or respond the way you want them to.   You flew into a tantrum because I wouldn't engage you in the way you though I should.

James!: Who afflicted is with only these limited choices? WHAT KIND OF GOD ALLOWS ONLY THREE VERY SPECIFIC OPTIONS FOR THESE CHILDREN!?!?!

Mmhmm. You got pissy because I called you out for trolling. Don't try to do the "no u" game. It's childish, which is a bit hypocritical in view of your last post.

Oh dear, you thought that comment was serious.  Just go back to ignoring me, man.  I'm not going to be able to teach you how to behave.

Apparently you don't know what trolling means. Odd that you're so good at it.


I forgot how we had to be completely serious and always say only exactly what we mean or Theaetetus throws a tantrum.  I was making fun of you.  I though that would have been obvious.  I have been giving you WAY too much credit.  See, sometimes people will exaggerate your point to illustrate how ridiculous it is.

You are hopeless.
 
2013-05-02 02:43:45 PM

James!: I forgot how we had to be completely serious and always say only exactly what we mean or Theaetetus throws a tantrum.  I was making fun of you.  I though that would have been obvious.  I have been giving you WAY too much credit.  See, sometimes people will exaggerate your point to illustrate how ridiculous it is.

You are hopeless.


"I'm not going to respond substantively, I'm just going to make fun of you!"
"Okay, troll."
"What?! Why did you call me a troll?!! You're throwing a tantrum! You're a child! You're hopeless!"

You're right, that all makes perfect sense. Bye.
 
2013-05-02 02:48:34 PM

Theaetetus: James!: I forgot how we had to be completely serious and always say only exactly what we mean or Theaetetus throws a tantrum.  I was making fun of you.  I though that would have been obvious.  I have been giving you WAY too much credit.  See, sometimes people will exaggerate your point to illustrate how ridiculous it is.

You are hopeless.

"I'm not going to respond substantively, I'm just going to make fun of you!"
"Okay, troll."
"What?! Why did you call me a troll?!! You're throwing a tantrum! You're a child! You're hopeless!"

You're right, that all makes perfect sense. Bye.


Finally.
 
2013-05-02 02:48:54 PM

DubyaHater: Just what we need........both sides intruding on a woman's reproductive rights.  This should be a decision made between a woman and her physician.  The FDA made a step in the right direction yesterday, and now the Justice Dept wants to reverse that.  Women, especially teenagers, need better access to birth control.  Some of these politicians should step foot in my clinic once in a while and see the number of teenagers who end up pregnant.


I am a huge fan of Plan B (which, by the way, will not abort a fertilized egg). I am an even huger fan of having it OTC and out where I don't have to ask a pharmacist for it. But I get the issue with age.

While I think 15 (what the law would allow) is probably an okay age, there is some danger that young girls will use this like regular birth control. It shouldn't be. If a girl is using Plan B each time she has sex, it will mess with her periods. Plan B should be use when there's a failure with primary birth control, like when a condom breaks or when you realize you forgot to take your pill at the regular time. Plan B is not meant to replace regular birth control.

Here's the issue, though. For most young girls, getting birth control means getting parental consent. It was not always like that. In the 1970s, when I was in high school, girls could go to Planned Parenthood and get a prescription. The nurse at Planned Parenthood would explain the rules - the pill is only effective when taken every day and at the same time every day. Don't trust the pill for birth control safety until you've had at least two periods while on the pill. The best part? Mom and Dad did not have to know. Sure, Mom might have been cool with it, or you might end up grounded and your parents might call the cops on your boyfriend. Or worse. We changed the laws in the 1980s (a huge mistake). Girls still have sex, but they have more risky sex.

So, along comes Plan B. Unlike the pill, you can get Plan B without parental permission. Also, there's no nurse to explain things, like there was at Planned Parenthood. So, how much of a chance do you think there is for abuse of Plan B among high school girls? My experience as a former high school girl says there's a damned good chance. Of course, the smart thing to do wouldn't be to continue to restrict access. The smart thing to do would be a public health campaign and good sex education. But, honestly, how much of a chance do you think the president has pushing that through?
 
2013-05-02 03:22:23 PM

DeaH: While I think 15 (what the law would allow) is probably an okay age, there is some danger that young girls will use this like regular birth control. It shouldn't be. If a girl is using Plan B each time she has sex, it will mess with her periods. she will be vomiting, and cramping in horrible agony.


FTFY. Before being concerned that young girls will "use this like regular birth control," you should probably look up the side effects of Plan B. Unlike regular birth control, it causes nausea, cramping, headaches, dizziness, and onset of menstruation. There's a reason they're not Plan A, and even if someone thinks that using them as birth control is a wonderful idea, they're going to change their mind the first time they take them.
Not to mention that they're $50 a pop.

In short, this whole "but what about the childrens!" problem is a manufactured one. It's not real. There's no need for the age restriction, and there are many good reasons  not to have an age restriction, the most important one being that if there is an 11 year old that just had unprotected sex, you want them to get access to Plan B as fast as possible. Not a month later after their parents refuse to buy it for them and they had to go to a judge, not weeks later after they work up the courage to talk to their parents, not even days later when they talk to the school nurse. You have 12 hours.
 
2013-05-02 04:17:48 PM

heinekenftw: Here's what I don't get.  The conservatives rail against welfare, but then they rail against systems that would limit the number of children being placed in the welfare system (contraception, abortion.)

It doesn't make sense.


It doesn't make sense because they are inconsistent and irrational.

When it comes to Sex, the attitude is that if you're having sex outside of marriage, you should be Punished. If you get pregnant, that's God Punishing you for being a slut. If you have an STD, that's God punishing you. Therefore contraception and abortion are ways of being a whore and avoiding your Punishment. Sex ed is all about teaching kids to avoid STDs and pregnancy, which is again, teaching them to avoid being PUNISHED.

It's the same reason they can rail against Abortion, but as soon as that child is born, they don't give two shiats about the child's health or education. It's all about forcing the whores to be punished for being whores. If that child was important, then they would be all for care, feeding, etc.

You see the "if something bad happens to you, then you deserved it" come up in their policy towards the poors. The poor are poor because they're lazy and stupid and God didn't want them to be rich. The Rich are rich because they're skilled and God is rewarding them.
 
2013-05-02 05:24:15 PM

cman: Why is the Obama administration fighting this?


Defending separation of powers.  A district judge ordered an executive agency implement a rule of his own creation.  DoJ is saying that, at most, the judge could only block the FDA rule.
 
2013-05-02 05:27:53 PM
FTA: "
The order by U.S. District Judge Edward Korman of New York would allow girls and women of any age to buy not only Plan B but its cheaper generic competition as easily as they can buy aspirin. Korman gave the FDA 30 days to comply, and the Monday deadline was approaching fast.

In Wednesday's filing, the Justice Department said Korman exceeded his authority and that his decision should be suspended while that appeal is under way, meaning only Plan B One-Step would appear on drugstore shelves until the case is finally settled."

Drug company called Obama to complain about allowing generic version to be sold and to remember the big campaign contributions they gave him?
 
2013-05-02 09:24:27 PM
WTF Obama?
 
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