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(Huffington Post)   New GOP bill would reduce the unemployment rate to zero - by eliminating the statistic altogether. No, I'm not making this up   (huffingtonpost.com) divider line 101
    More: Fail, GOP, National Association for Business Economics, economic statistics, American Community Survey, John Sides, business research, Scott DesJarlais, economic indicator  
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3236 clicks; posted to Politics » on 01 May 2013 at 2:12 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-05-01 11:21:06 AM  
abu ghraib abuse photos leaked? ban cameras in military prisons!
slaughter house abuse photos leaked? ban cameras in slaughter houses!
unemployment numbers bad? ban collecting unemployment numbers!

i think i see a pattern here...
 
2013-05-01 11:22:35 AM  
In breaking news, Barack Obama has reduced the unemployment rate to zero.
 
2013-05-01 11:44:27 AM  

Aarontology: In breaking news, Barack Obama has reduced the unemployment rate to zero.


They failed to think their cunning plan through


Sort of related:

I am reading through Thjomas Sowell's book "Basic Economics" which is written from the point of view that there is no better system than capitalism and there is never anything wrong with the system ever. Ever!

In the capitalist system, the natural unemployment level is supposed to be about 5%. Fine... but what do we do with the several million that are unemployed by a perfectly functioning capitalist system?

Economics != Public Policy and all the bills to ignore the unemployment rate can't change that
 
2013-05-01 11:46:46 AM  
How are you going to Gerrymander a district if you don't have a good idea of who lives where?
 
2013-05-01 11:53:58 AM  
We already have "U1" through "U6".  Why not call it "U0" and make it zero?  That way no one at the Labor Department loses their job.
 
2013-05-01 12:01:13 PM  
I can only assume this means unemployment is actually going down, and they don't want to track the numbers that might look good for Obama.
 
2013-05-01 12:09:07 PM  

God Is My Co-Pirate: I can only assume this means unemployment is actually going down, and they don't want to track the numbers that might look good for Obama.


This. And largely - this is the case. We're seeing growth in the private sector, UI claims are dropping, and businesses are reporting that they've expanded hiring.

So, it's probably pretty awkward to be doing so well under a D.
 
2013-05-01 12:09:20 PM  

AzDownboy: Aarontology: In breaking news, Barack Obama has reduced the unemployment rate to zero.

They failed to think their cunning plan through


Sort of related:

I am reading through Thjomas Sowell's book "Basic Economics" which is written from the point of view that there is no better system than capitalism and there is never anything wrong with the system ever. Ever!

In the capitalist system, the natural unemployment level is supposed to be about 5%. Fine... but what do we do with the several million that are unemployed by a perfectly functioning capitalist system?

Economics != Public Policy and all the bills to ignore the unemployment rate can't change that


Capitalism is also the theoretically perfect system, if the actors have perfect knowledge.  The suggestion here in TFA is to shut the lights out completely on government-generated statistics.
 
2013-05-01 12:23:21 PM  

FlashHarry: abu ghraib abuse photos leaked? ban cameras in military prisons!
slaughter house abuse photos leaked? ban cameras in slaughter houses!
unemployment numbers bad? ban collecting unemployment numbers!

i think i see a pattern here...


Also related to that pattern:

2004 Presidential Election, Ohio.

Exit pools showed John Kerry as having had a slight lead, but the official results had George W. Bush as the winner (after transferring the votes from the all-electronic Diebold machines in Ohio to an out-of-state company owned by a wealthy Bush donor for tabulation). The discrepancy between the exit polls and the official results was significantly greater than a reasonable margin of error.

The Ohio legislature responded by outlawing exit polling.

/oh, and that one guy was killed in an airplane "accident"
 
2013-05-01 12:26:09 PM  

FlashHarry: unemployment numbers bad? ban collecting unemployment numbers!


I think it's more "unemployment numbers are getting better despite us doing everything to make a democrat look evil? ban unemployment numbers!"
 
2013-05-01 12:27:00 PM  

Bontesla: God Is My Co-Pirate: I can only assume this means unemployment is actually going down, and they don't want to track the numbers that might look good for Obama.

This. And largely - this is the case. We're seeing growth in the private sector, UI claims are dropping, and businesses are reporting that they've expanded hiring.

So, it's probably pretty awkward to be doing so well under a D.


No, I think it's just another Bachmann-ite idiot teabagger who thinks the census is some sort of evil commie socialist plot. They can envision that the census asking how many toilets are in your house will lead to a federal registry of toilet owners to help the UN round up people who shiat in outhouses, but can't think far enough ahead to realize how much information the country and the economic markets need to fully function.
 
2013-05-01 12:27:25 PM  
"If it were Obama's dictatorship... I don't think it would have been in his interests seeking reelection to have put out data that showed the economy actually worsened under his presidency," Haver said

Uh...what?
 
2013-05-01 12:31:22 PM  

somedude210: FlashHarry: unemployment numbers bad? ban collecting unemployment numbers!

I think it's more "unemployment numbers are getting better despite us doing everything to make a democrat look evil? ban unemployment numbers!"


To be fair, the (low) unemployment numbers are bad for the GOP.
 
2013-05-01 12:54:19 PM  
This is so awesomely stupid someone's got to try it. I dare you, Kansas. Missouri will hold your beer.
 
2013-05-01 01:00:58 PM  

WI241TH: "If it were Obama's dictatorship... I don't think it would have been in his interests seeking reelection to have put out data that showed the economy actually worsened under his presidency," Haver said

Uh...what?


He said it's stupid to think that Obama made up the numbers. If you were going to do that, she might pick some GOOD ones.

His point is that the president doesn't have the POWER to make up the numbers.
 
2013-05-01 01:01:34 PM  

kingoomieiii: WI241TH: "If it were Obama's dictatorship... I don't think it would have been in his interests seeking reelection to have put out data that showed the economy actually worsened under his presidency," Haver said

Uh...what?

He said it's stupid to think that Obama made up the numbers. If you were going to do that, she might pick some GOOD ones.

His point is that the president doesn't have the POWER to make up the numbers.


Wow, thanks, voice recognition.
 
2013-05-01 01:16:12 PM  

WI241TH: "If it were Obama's dictatorship... I don't think it would have been in his interests seeking reelection to have put out data that showed the economy actually worsened under his presidency," Haver said

Uh...what?


If it were Obama's dictatorship, why would he be worried about reelection?
 
2013-05-01 01:51:07 PM  
3.bp.blogspot.com
 
2013-05-01 01:52:21 PM  
Constitutionalists.
 
2013-05-01 01:56:07 PM  
Meh, when politicians don't get the numbers they want, they just change the calculation until the numbers look good anyways.  The unemployment rate used to count people not looking for jobs, then that number got too high.  Then they just removed those people from the calculation and it magically went down a lot.  The number of people not looking for work could be a good indication of our economic health, as more people tend to give up and stop looking during economic downturns and vice versa.  That group of people isn't static - that number of people can fluctuate significantly and make a big difference.
 
2013-05-01 01:57:07 PM  

kingoomieiii: WI241TH: "If it were Obama's dictatorship... I don't think it would have been in his interests seeking reelection to have put out data that showed the economy actually worsened under his presidency," Haver said

Uh...what?

He said it's stupid to think that Obama made up the numbers. If you were going to do that, she might pick some GOOD ones.

His point is that the president doesn't have the POWER to make up the numbers.


I guess my question is more: Didn't the economy improve quite a bit during his first term? Wasn't that a pretty big factor of him getting re elected?
 
2013-05-01 02:02:48 PM  

King Something: Exit pools showed John Kerry as having had a slight lead, but the official results had George W. Bush as the winner (after transferring the votes from the all-electronic Diebold machines in Ohio to an out-of-state company owned by a wealthy Bush donor for tabulation). The discrepancy between the exit polls and the official results was significantly greater than a reasonable margin of error.

The Ohio legislature responded by outlawing exit polling.

/oh, and that one guy was killed in an airplane "accident"


goddamnitsomuch.
 
2013-05-01 02:12:14 PM  

SlothB77: The unemployment rate used to count people not looking for jobs, then that number got too high.  Then they just removed those people from the calculation and it magically went down a lot.


When was this?
 
2013-05-01 02:15:29 PM  
I think it's a sign that they're pretty confident of winning the White House in 2016 and don't want people able to track what happens under President Bachmann.
 
2013-05-01 02:18:42 PM  
Data and facts are anathema to the GOP.
 
2013-05-01 02:19:33 PM  

DamnYankees: SlothB77: The unemployment rate used to count people not looking for jobs, then that number got too high.  Then they just removed those people from the calculation and it magically went down a lot.

When was this?


forget it; he's trolling.
 
2013-05-01 02:19:39 PM  
I'm not entirely sure what the consequences would be overall (positive or negative impact), but sometimes you have to step back and let someone screw up.  Sometimes, I think this is just what people need to do when someone comes up with such a boneheaded idea like this.  When I was 2, my mother tried to stop me from sticking a key into an electric outlet; my grandpa stopped her saying, "let him do it--he'll only do it once."  He was right, but I could do without the twitch in my left eye...
 
2013-05-01 02:19:41 PM  
Thankfully, the business community realizes that a lot of these surveys the Census Bureau conducts benefit them and that there's no way to get the same quality information without making the surveys mandatory.
 
2013-05-01 02:19:42 PM  

FlashHarry: King Something: Exit pools showed John Kerry as having had a slight lead, but the official results had George W. Bush as the winner (after transferring the votes from the all-electronic Diebold machines in Ohio to an out-of-state company owned by a wealthy Bush donor for tabulation). The discrepancy between the exit polls and the official results was significantly greater than a reasonable margin of error.

The Ohio legislature responded by outlawing exit polling.

/oh, and that one guy was killed in an airplane "accident"

goddamnitsomuch.


Read all about it.  The guy that was murdered was Michael Connell. Connell served as the IT guru for the Bush family and Karl Rove. Connell ran the private IT firm GovTech that created the controversial system that transferred Ohio's vote count late on election night 2004 to a partisan Republican server site in Chattanooga, Tennessee owned by SmarTech.  There was no fail-over situation or any other reason to transfer everything to the back-up site with data input ability except to steal the election.

Bob Magnan, a state IT specialist for the secretary of state during the 2004 election, agreed that there was no failover scenario. Magnan said he was unexpectedly sent home at 9 p.m. on election night and private contractors ran the system for Blackwell.
 
2013-05-01 02:20:13 PM  

AzDownboy: In the capitalist system, the natural unemployment level is supposed to be about 5%. Fine... but what do we do with the several million that are unemployed by a perfectly functioning capitalist system?


Unemployment insurance. That's what we do.
 
2013-05-01 02:20:56 PM  
Now how can I be outraged when the unemployment rate decreased by an infinite percentage under President Black Muslim Hitler!?!?!
 
2013-05-01 02:25:11 PM  

sabreWulf07: Read all about it.


i remember watching the returns from ohio that night. i ran out and bought a bottle of champagne even. i remember my elation turning to horror as the results came in and thinking that something wasn't right.

that champagne sat in my fridge until 2006, when the dems took back the house.
 
2013-05-01 02:26:15 PM  
"There are those users of the data, like myself, who say this is so crazy, they just couldn't possibly believe it, so it has to be something they're just throwing out there because they want to be able to cite it in some tea party affair someplace," she said.

Haver also suggested there is a fundamental divide between people who are interested in solid, reality-based data and those who are not.

"If you know what you think, you don't need information to help you assess what's going on," she said. "The people that need information are the people who use it because they really want the truth, not people who think that because they believe it, it becomes the truth."



I like this lady.
 
2013-05-01 02:27:07 PM  

thurstonxhowell: AzDownboy: In the capitalist system, the natural unemployment level is supposed to be about 5%. Fine... but what do we do with the several million that are unemployed by a perfectly functioning capitalist system?

Unemployment insurance. That's what we do.


We should get rid of that. For freedom.
 
2013-05-01 02:28:11 PM  

DamnYankees: SlothB77: The unemployment rate used to count people not looking for jobs, then that number got too high.  Then they just removed those people from the calculation and it magically went down a lot.

When was this?


Every president since JFK has altered the calculation in one way or another.  Nixon was famous for getting two sets of calculations and releasing the ones that made him look better.
 
2013-05-01 02:28:44 PM  

AzDownboy: In the capitalist system, the natural unemployment level is supposed to be about 5%. Fine... but what do we do with the several million that are unemployed by a perfectly functioning capitalist system?


That 5% is not the same people every month. Some are students, some are seniors, some are disabled, some are between jobs, some live off investment income (or what-have-you).

I remember hearing this for the first time in the mid-90s when unemployment was sub-4 and employers were desperately looking for new talent. People were freaking out - wait, you mean job SEEKERS now have the upper hand in negotiations?!
 
2013-05-01 02:29:17 PM  

propasaurus: thurstonxhowell: AzDownboy: In the capitalist system, the natural unemployment level is supposed to be about 5%. Fine... but what do we do with the several million that are unemployed by a perfectly functioning capitalist system?

Unemployment insurance. That's what we do.

We should get rid of that. For freedom.


Well, Canada just put on a bunch of restrictions on receiving UI, which is really screwing over seasonal workers. So, if you want to be less SOCIALIST, I suggest you increase UI. UI FOR ALL!
 
2013-05-01 02:30:29 PM  

God Is My Co-Pirate: I can only assume this means unemployment is actually going down, and they don't want to track the numbers that might look good for Obama.


Nah, they didn't think that far ahead. This is just "DERP CENSUS IS OBUMMER'S SOSHULIST TAKEOVER OF MURRICA!" stuff, and they failed to think through the consequences of their actions, as usual.
 
2013-05-01 02:32:10 PM  

SlothB77: Meh, when politicians don't get the numbers they want, they just change the calculation until the numbers look good anyways.  The unemployment rate used to count people not looking for jobs, then that number got too high.  Then they just removed those people from the calculation and it magically went down a lot.  The number of people not looking for work could be a good indication of our economic health, as more people tend to give up and stop looking during economic downturns and vice versa.  That group of people isn't static - that number of people can fluctuate significantly and make a big difference.


Wow, that would sound really smart, except for the fact that they still calculate and publicly release all of those other unemployment statistics, they all have had a very strong correlation to one another since they've been calculated, and we currently focus on the one because it is the current globally accepted definition of unemployment rate.  Taking all those things into consideration, it kind of makes you sound like a dimwit.
 
2013-05-01 02:32:30 PM  
Well this is a new way for them to go "LA LA LA LALALALALALA I CAN'T HEAR YOU!!!!!!111"
 
2013-05-01 02:33:03 PM  

SlothB77: Meh, when politicians don't get the numbers they want, they just change the calculation until the numbers look good anyways.  The unemployment rate used to count people not looking for jobs, then that number got too high.  Then they just removed those people from the calculation and it magically went down a lot.  The number of people not looking for work could be a good indication of our economic health, as more people tend to give up and stop looking during economic downturns and vice versa.  That group of people isn't static - that number of people can fluctuate significantly and make a big difference.


You really are clueless when it comes to economics, aren't you?
 
2013-05-01 02:34:27 PM  
Just like Republicans prevent the CDC from collecting gun death statistics, for your protection. What you don't know won't hurt you, right?

slate article
 
2013-05-01 02:34:34 PM  

James!: How are you going to Gerrymander a district if you don't have a good idea of who lives where?


Are there brown skinned people there? DEM district it is!
 
2013-05-01 02:37:41 PM  

AzDownboy: In the capitalist system, the natural unemployment level is supposed to be about 5%. Fine... but what do we do with the several million that are unemployed by a perfectly functioning capitalist system?


Well, that's for a well-meaning capitalist to figure out.

For instance, a well-meaning capitalist may give a dollar to each of those unemployed so he could turn them into meat for the rest of the population.
 
2013-05-01 02:38:18 PM  

FlashHarry: unemployment numbers bad? ban collecting unemployment numbers!


but what would they want Obama to look good?
 
2013-05-01 02:38:27 PM  

God Is My Co-Pirate: I can only assume this means unemployment is actually going down, and they don't want to track the numbers that might look good for Obama.


For some reason, the GOP is still trying to make Obama a one-term president....
 
2013-05-01 02:38:32 PM  

Dr Dreidel: AzDownboy: In the capitalist system, the natural unemployment level is supposed to be about 5%. Fine... but what do we do with the several million that are unemployed by a perfectly functioning capitalist system?

That 5% is not the same people every month. Some are students, some are seniors, some are disabled, some are between jobs, some live off investment income (or what-have-you).



No. Only those looking for jobs are counted as unemployed. The students, seniors or those living off investment income are not working but they are not considered "unemployed". The natural unemployment rate (or structural unemployment) is comprised only of those who are between jobs.
 
2013-05-01 02:40:03 PM  
Republicans and right wingers; these are the idiots that are representing you in Congress.  Your party endorses their stupidity and votes lockstep with their stupid ideas.

A vote for a Republican is a vote for this bill.
 
2013-05-01 02:40:09 PM  
Wasn't it established that math was part of the LOPTOTGOPATA?  Clearly this is merely self-defense.
 
2013-05-01 02:44:15 PM  

FlashHarry: goddamnitsomuch.


Oh let it ride.  The fun part of this conspiracy is that unlike troofing and birfing it hasn't been thoroughly debunked, or even investigated that much.
 
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