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(Minot Daily News)   You remember how North Dakota was supposed to have 3.6 billion barrels of recoverable oil? About that   (minotdailynews.com) divider line 29
    More: Cool, North Dakota, oil resources, U.S. Geological Survey, paid survey, Bakken formation, Interior Secretary Ken Salazar  
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26720 clicks; posted to Main » on 01 May 2013 at 2:44 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-05-01 12:31:27 AM
4 votes:
The good news: we have accessible reserves
The bad news: our zeal to be "energy independent" doesn't change the price of gas

/personally I think it's a better strategy to keep burning imported oil while it's cheap and plentiful
//then if things do get tight we don't need to import as much, if any at all, to meet our national interests
///YMMV
2013-05-01 12:19:20 AM
4 votes:
FTFA: "This is clearly great news for North Dakota and great news for the nation," Hoeven said. "It will further serve to enhance our state's role as an energy powerhouse for the nation. More than two years ago I persuaded former Interior Secretary Ken Salazar to initiate a new USGS study of the Williston Basin to stimulate more private-sector investment in infrastructure like housing, hotels, retail stores and other services to meet the needs of a rapidly growing western North Dakota. This new USGS study further confirms and reinforces the fact that the Williston Basin is a sustainable, long-term play warranting strong private-sector investment for decades into the future."

In the meantime, gasoline will go up to $7.50 per gallon, and natural gas will be so expensive that only rich people will be able to afford to heat their homes with it. The rest of the world will move away from natural gas and oil to other fuel sources. Fifty years from now, our grandchildren will be wanting to know WTF we were thinking.
2013-05-01 10:35:22 AM
3 votes:
News flash: oil shale and other forms of heavy crude can never lead to cheap oil, no matter how much of it there is.  These fields will not be a sufficient replacement for the light crude fields in Saudi Arabia which are beginning to go into decline. When those dry up, prices will skyrocket.
2013-05-01 04:50:36 AM
2 votes:

Lukeonia1: FTA: The report also estimates there to be 0.7 trillion cubic feet of natural gas.

Meanwhile, that natural gas is all being flared off because they can't earn enough selling it to justify building the infrastructure to recover it. The flares are visible from space.


No citation... told by customers in the industry that the main problem until recently was technology--they were unable to contain it, package it, and make it into something they could sell.  Now, the main problem is catching up.  They have the problem of storage--to keep up production of liquid petroleum they have to let the gas blow by, because you can't exactly let it puddle on the ground or flow it into an above-ground pool. It is either burn it or vent it (venting not allowed for obvious reasons) for want of storage or transport, and they are busting ass to get the gas into production everywhere.  Liquid is easy to store and transport, compared to vapor.

Not that they haven't had this problem from the very start and should have foreseen the polite request that they knock it off with all the burning.  Surely it is a contributor to global [INSERT CAUSE].  They are stupid for not being on the ball.  The development of recovery technology has been too slow.  They missed out, we missed out--but it *is* happening.

My company sells starters, alternators and automotive electronics to industrial and municipal fleets as well as to the general public and businesses.  We have seen a large increase in customers running vapor fuel, especially on the last 2-5 years.  One of our oldest customers now specializes in conversions.  My unscientific appraisal of fleets and equipment that have converted to natural gas is that their under-hood components have longer service lives.  The only factor that has changed is the removal of gasoline or diesel from the system--run it on literal gas and the fiddly bits last significantly longer.  Starter and alternator cores from vapor based systems tend to be less greasy and longer lived then their liquid fuel cousins.  Components like relays, sensors and lowly harnesses have longer service lives as a result of reduced under-hood grime--an effect which must be cutting into our consumption of steel, copper and brass.  This effect is hard to measure, but it definitely exists.

When you talk to fleet supervisors about reduced maintenance costs, you have to duck to avoid being concussed by the resultant erections.  These are the people that will demand nation wide vapor fuel stations and elicit an actual result, something that electric vehicle proponents can only wish for.  Change will come incrementally as over-the-road fleets create demand for vapor fuel at truck stops.

Any exhaust guys out there?  Any reduction in corrosion on your vapor fuel equipment?  I know the mechanics like it.  Of course, the lubricant has to be liquid, but who knows if that will be the case in the long run?

The amusing thing is that the *GREEN* transition to vapor fuel is relatively spontaneous.  No celebrities flailing their egos in distress, no silly hippie histrionics, no coalition against this or that; Companies are choosing to use vapor fuel because it is better, not because it is popular. Z O M G
2013-05-01 03:26:04 AM
2 votes:
Cool. I own mineral rights up there.

Whoever fell for that one the first time.... 'Sure, I'll sell you this land, but if there is any oil I can do whatever I want, as long as it is at least 100ft from your buildings....'
2013-05-01 02:57:20 AM
2 votes:
Hopefully none of it is on any Indian reservations, or the Freedom-Loving conservatives in ND might have to displace a few people and ignore a treaty or two.
2013-05-01 12:58:24 AM
2 votes:
FTA: The report also estimates there to be 0.7 trillion cubic feet of natural gas.

Meanwhile, that natural gas is all being flared off because they can't earn enough selling it to justify building the infrastructure to recover it. The flares are visible from space.
2013-05-01 12:32:59 AM
2 votes:
It IS an estimate so don't get too excited.
2013-05-01 12:03:17 AM
2 votes:
This state was a lot more fun before Big Oil showed up with their right-wing lobby friends and turned it into a social conservative playground. This all but guarantees more of the same.

On the bright side, they might actually get around to fixing the damn roads.
2013-05-01 11:17:44 AM
1 votes:
cool!  let's just keep right on pumping carbon into the atmosphere and perpetuating the economic / social / cultural memes attached to deliberate inefficiency-for-profit.  seriously, who gives a flying shiat about what's prudent from a efficiency, technological, or public health standpoint?  all that matters is that a portion of financially fluid americans get to play out their Dream for a few more years before the system collapses under the weight of its own unequal distribution.  can't wait for that pity party: "oh, we never saw this coming!  those evil corporations!"  right, it has nothing to do with a constituency utterly addicted to and complacent with the unsustainable conveniences affordable by the ecocidal, homocidal, classist, criminally negligent "free-market" economy.  give me a break.  none of this is necessary, just the cost of the hubris of a small number of people with a large amount of power, who have, over time, convinced the public by example that their lack of empathy and insane narcissism are sound american values.  after all, it's easier to compete when you have no regard for the consequences of your actions.  anyway, that's enough to put out there for now.

pro-tip: pour money into technology, education, health, and infrastructure (before ultimately getting rid of money).  so much wasted resources and energy on literally useless crap that people "want."  at the end of the day, i hope a dollar burrito or cheap plastic fan is worth the cost of a habitable environment and life-improving technology.  or that your Mercedes Benz was worth the resources that could've been spent saving someone's life or doing something else not completely farking self-indulgent.  the irony is that maximizing technological efficiency will afford us more leeway in available materials -- but our smart use of them will ensure they last much, much longer than they would now.  in short, if we actually assign the economy a series of these type of goals, we can raise the standard of living equitably to a level unimaginable today.  "HOW" that gets done is a different debate, but that it must is not even a question to anyone half-paying attention.
2013-05-01 10:17:40 AM
1 votes:
Neat. Now let's leave it there.
2013-05-01 09:37:15 AM
1 votes:

unyon: UsikFark: Lukeonia1: FTA: The report also estimates there to be 0.7 trillion cubic feet of natural gas.

Meanwhile, that natural gas is all being flared off because they can't earn enough selling it to justify building the infrastructure to recover it. The flares are visible from space.

That's so sad. I hope they are at least collecting the helium, if the concentrations are high enough.

Gas goes to flare all the time.  When wells or gas plants are serviced, the output is frequently sent to flare.  That happens far less frequently than it used to.  These days, it's common for gas-fired electrical cogen stations to be built near gas plants to benefit from production or fuel gas that would have previously gone up the stack.  But flaring will never be zero- it's how lines are purged prior to servicing.

/worked in a number of gas plants


Apparently you've never been to ND.  No they are not doing any of that.  They are just burning it all off.
2013-05-01 09:30:22 AM
1 votes:

Tatterdemalian: Crackpipe: I like burning gas as much as the next guy, but where does this end? I don't have any doubt that human civilization is going to burn the Earths entire endowment of fossil fuels. Even if we know we shouldn't, we won't be able to stop. So what's the result of extracting every ounce of fossil fuel from the Earth and burning and exhausting it into the atmosphere?

Well, if we manage to hang on to a capitalist economy, it will keep getting more expensive until the few people who still have some aren't willing to burn it for anything less than saving their own lives. If we switch to any kind of planned economy, we'll waste it all in an unfortunate bureaucratic mishap (Al Gore needs his helicopter rides downtown, comrade!), and won't even be able to get it to save lives any more.

The effect on the atmosphere? Negligible, the moon's tidal forces bleed off the extra anthropogenic outgas the same way it bleeds off the natural outgas, preventing our atmosphere from assuming a Venusian thickness. CO2 will have a higher concentration, but that will be countered by plant and algae growth.


Oh, the planet will still bop along with some things living on it. They won't necessarily be the same things, and only the teeninsiest change is needed to make a planet that can JUST accommodate 7 billion people into a planet that can't accommodate that many. And that number doesn't have to go into deficit very far before all bets are off. War, plague, loss of technology.

Ask the Mayans and the Easter Islanders how benign the effect of human consumption of resources can be on a civilization. Also, too, study up on the tragedy of the commons.
2013-05-01 09:07:22 AM
1 votes:
It still isn't renewable - it just allows us to stay on crutches a while longer. We should be smarter than this by now...
2013-05-01 09:03:58 AM
1 votes:

Tatterdemalian: Crackpipe: I like burning gas as much as the next guy, but where does this end? I don't have any doubt that human civilization is going to burn the Earths entire endowment of fossil fuels. Even if we know we shouldn't, we won't be able to stop. So what's the result of extracting every ounce of fossil fuel from the Earth and burning and exhausting it into the atmosphere?

Well, if we manage to hang on to a capitalist economy, it will keep getting more expensive until the few people who still have some aren't willing to burn it for anything less than saving their own lives. If we switch to any kind of planned economy, we'll waste it all in an unfortunate bureaucratic mishap (Al Gore needs his helicopter rides downtown, comrade!), and won't even be able to get it to save lives any more.

The effect on the atmosphere? Negligible, the moon's tidal forces bleed off the extra anthropogenic outgas the same way it bleeds off the natural outgas, preventing our atmosphere from assuming a Venusian thickness. CO2 will have a higher concentration, but that will be countered by plant and algae growth.


Pseudo science bullshiat. Stop lying.
2013-05-01 06:51:27 AM
1 votes:

cygnusx13: "..rapidly growing western North Dakota." So 100 people live there now?


I keep getting job offers for that area... I keep turning them down because it's North farking Dakota...
2013-05-01 06:29:56 AM
1 votes:

PunGent: jaybeezey: erik-k: Eh, another billion tons of CO2 up into the air, no biggie.

/Goes to cry thinking of where we'd be if we'd blown a trillion dollars on renewable energy instead of Iraq

We can only afford so many Solyndras and A123's.

Yeah, wouldn't want to cut into our subsidies for the fossil fuel industry.

/free market my ass


Not for the subsidy but it is cheaper and a better return that what we got with the whole green energy jobs thing when you look at taxes paid and jobs.
2013-05-01 06:10:17 AM
1 votes:
www.global-air.com

The local Motel 6 rents rooms for $129.95 a night. The Williston General Motors dealership has become the number one seller of Corvettes in the upper Midwest. Strip clubs are sending "babe buses", complete with live entertainment, out into the area to pick up customers.   More . (new window)
2013-05-01 05:27:42 AM
1 votes:

jaybeezey: erik-k: Eh, another billion tons of CO2 up into the air, no biggie.

/Goes to cry thinking of where we'd be if we'd blown a trillion dollars on renewable energy instead of Iraq

We can only afford so many Solyndras and A123's.


Yeah, wouldn't want to cut into our subsidies for the fossil fuel industry.

/free market my ass
2013-05-01 04:09:05 AM
1 votes:
FTFA: approximately 7.4 billion barrels of technically recoverable oil....

and it's sold on the global market. We are another country whose natura; resource wealth is not shared among its people.
2013-05-01 03:55:39 AM
1 votes:

tuna fingers: filter: Cool. I own mineral rights up there.

Whoever fell for that one the first time.... 'Sure, I'll sell you this land, but if there is any oil I can do whatever I want, as long as it is at least 100ft from your buildings....'

LOL.They've figured that out. You get nothing. Zilch. Nada.
[scm-l3.technorati.com image 400x265]


What?

i.imgur.com
2013-05-01 03:43:12 AM
1 votes:
Every time you call for price controls, God kills an economist.
2013-05-01 03:34:57 AM
1 votes:

filter: Cool. I own mineral rights up there.

Whoever fell for that one the first time.... 'Sure, I'll sell you this land, but if there is any oil I can do whatever I want, as long as it is at least 100ft from your buildings....'


LOL.

They've figured that out. You get nothing. Zilch. Nada.


scm-l3.technorati.com

2013-05-01 03:27:25 AM
1 votes:
Fark Me To Tears:

Fifty years from now, our grandchildren will be wanting to know WTF we were thinking when the hell you thought built your family home within 30 miles of the inundating coast was a good idea
2013-05-01 03:04:03 AM
1 votes:

Lukeonia1: FTA: The report also estimates there to be 0.7 trillion cubic feet of natural gas.

Meanwhile, that natural gas is all being flared off because they can't earn enough selling it to justify building the infrastructure to recover it. The flares are visible from space.


That's so sad. I hope they are at least collecting the helium, if the concentrations are high enough.
2013-05-01 02:56:25 AM
1 votes:
This is still high sulfur hard to refine and doesn't make a profit unless prices are high oil, right?

At least it's not tar sands...
2013-05-01 02:53:43 AM
1 votes:
I don't know why we don't have price controls on gas.

Fer Christ's sakes; we have controls on grains and dairy, but not on gas.

/ it just seems to me that, for now, the American public is a captive market to gas prices.

// at the very least; we shouldn't be trading gas futures. That screws with the price.
2013-05-01 02:50:41 AM
1 votes:

MaudlinMutantMollusk: Bucky Katt: It IS an estimate so don't get too excited.

Uh oh... are we talking potential oil-cop math here?


Please.  Cop math would be 7.4 trillion barrels.

www.netbooknews.com
2013-05-01 12:12:15 AM
1 votes:

Charlie Freak: This state was a lot more fun before Big Oil showed up with their right-wing lobby friends and turned it into a social conservative playground. This all but guarantees more of the same.

On the bright side, they might actually get around to fixing the damn roads.


You mean I won't see gas prices of $.99/gal again?  Dammit Obama!
 
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