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(Daily Mail)   "Like you said Colonel, he went home"   (dailymail.co.uk) divider line 35
    More: Interesting, Army Special Forces, Vietnam  
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11801 clicks; posted to Main » on 30 Apr 2013 at 9:17 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-04-30 09:22:43 AM
The sister knows it's him, but refuses a DNA test that will prove it?
 
2013-04-30 09:25:39 AM

ChrisDe: The sister knows it's him, but refuses a DNA test that will prove it?


'The horror.  The horror.'

/don't get out of the boat
 
2013-04-30 09:29:04 AM
Well.. that's one way to get away from the nag of a spouse....
 
2013-04-30 09:31:24 AM
Interesting that they don't want American MIA's coming home.
 
2013-04-30 09:32:07 AM

ChrisDe: The sister knows it's him, but refuses a DNA test that will prove it?


Women are like that sometimes.  My wife says she knows the kids are mine, but won't get a test to prove it.
 
2013-04-30 09:33:57 AM
It first looked like a pure BS story to me.  But it does have conclusive photos of silhouettes.
I may have to go with my first impression.
 
2013-04-30 09:42:43 AM
I'm really curious what happens to the whole POW MIA organization after the Vietnam generation passes due to old age. The Iraq and Afghanistan wars so far have had only two people confirmed as MIA.

The whole thing seems like an odd confluence of factors. It seems some combination of the Vietnamese being assholes after the war and not repatriating prisoners well and returning remains properly, their country being really good at making corpses disappear due to the general sogginess of the place, and the Boomers seemingly being really bad at the whole "never leave a man behind" thing. It's just another example of how huge a clusterfark Vietnam was all around that we just don't have closure on so many MIAs even now. It's really sad that so many families are still left wondering all these years afterwards.
 
2013-04-30 09:44:20 AM
You getcha one of those cute lil' Montagnard women to keep a hooch for ya, and you ain't coming back.
Di di mau into the bush, man, 'cause FTA.
You don' t KNOW,man, you weren't there.
 
2013-04-30 09:51:22 AM

ChrisDe: The sister knows it's him, but refuses a DNA test that will prove it?


His family (now-ex-wife and children) initially said they'd do DNA tests, but backed out.  My guess is that there's something hinky about the dude doing this documentary, and they want to keep their distance from him.
 
2013-04-30 10:05:10 AM

stevarooni: ChrisDe: The sister knows it's him, but refuses a DNA test that will prove it?

His family (now-ex-wife and children) initially said they'd do DNA tests, but backed out.  My guess is that there's something hinky about the dude doing this documentary, and they want to keep their distance from him.


That, or there is/has been some sort of survivor benefits that they might lose? IANAL....
 
2013-04-30 10:06:49 AM

Lt. Cheese Weasel: ChrisDe: The sister knows it's him, but refuses a DNA test that will prove it?

'The horror.  The horror.'

/don't get out of the boat


I cried, I wept like some grandmother. I wanted to tear my teeth out; I didn't know what I wanted to do.

si0.twimg.com
 
2013-04-30 10:09:42 AM
i like how there was doubt because of the lack of language. 

my grandfather couldn't say 5 words in lithuanian with very similar time removed from his original language... and had little accent in english.  that would seem expected.
 
2013-04-30 10:12:14 AM

stevarooni: ChrisDe: The sister knows it's him, but refuses a DNA test that will prove it?

His family (now-ex-wife and children) initially said they'd do DNA tests, but backed out.  My guess is that there's something hinky about the dude doing this documentary, and they want to keep their distance from him.


They were perhaps curious but then counseled on the fact that they will most likely lose their survivor benefits if he is still alive.
 
2013-04-30 10:13:59 AM
Dear Henry Kissinger:

Please hurry up and put this man on a boat on a river in Laos or Cambodia or Thailand then have it sunk by the "enemy" .

You wouldn't want your nice shiny Nobel Peace Prize to get tarnished, would you Henry?

/How many did you leave behind in Laos, Cambodia, Thailand, etc? Come on, Henry. Clear your conscience. Oh, wait. Nevermind.
 
2013-04-30 10:22:55 AM
It seems the guy driving this is very driven to prove that it is indeed him. That always raises eyebrows. To be honest, I wouldn't be surprised if there were a few Americans living in the highlands. Lots of Green Beret activity and some of them guys went a little crazy up there.

Then again it could a French dude who is farking with somebody. Who knows.
 
2013-04-30 10:24:45 AM
It's a hoax.    As you would expect.

It' been debunked on several sites
 
2013-04-30 10:25:43 AM
cache.blippitt.com
 
2013-04-30 10:34:52 AM
Covey Leader calling Raven. Come on, Raven.
 
2013-04-30 10:36:11 AM

Mad_Radhu: and the Boomers seemingly being really bad at the whole "never leave a man behind" thing.


I've always assumed the military just didn't like reporting fleeing hot LZs with tails between legs, leaving bodies of KIAs behind, so they changed the KIAs to MIAs in exactly the same way children and old ladies turned into Viet Cong fighters once they were dead. The Army consistently exaggerated enemy dead, so why not minimize unit losses the same way? My buddy's Army-lifer dad doesn't like my theory very much, but he's gonna hear it every time he wants to wear a POW/MIA t-shirt to the 4th of July cookout.
 
2013-04-30 10:36:28 AM
If that Robertson's related to this guy, expect his mental faculties are shot and have been for a long time.

vscdn.s3.amazonaws.com
 
2013-04-30 10:40:23 AM

macadamnut: Mad_Radhu: and the Boomers seemingly being really bad at the whole "never leave a man behind" thing.

I've always assumed the military just didn't like reporting fleeing hot LZs with tails between legs, leaving bodies of KIAs behind, so they changed the KIAs to MIAs in exactly the same way children and old ladies turned into Viet Cong fighters once they were dead. The Army consistently exaggerated enemy dead, so why not minimize unit losses the same way? My buddy's Army-lifer dad doesn't like my theory very much, but he's gonna hear it every time he wants to wear a POW/MIA t-shirt to the 4th of July cookout.


Part of the problem, apparently, is we were fighting illegal wars in Laos, Cambodia, Thailand and/or who knows elsewhere. When we signed the peace accords, we dealt with some but not all of the conflicts. And apparently we struck off a lot of names of men we felt were prisoners somewhere in Southeast Asia.

Realpolitik.
 
2013-04-30 10:46:55 AM

TheShavingofOccam123: macadamnut: Mad_Radhu: and the Boomers seemingly being really bad at the whole "never leave a man behind" thing.

I've always assumed the military just didn't like reporting fleeing hot LZs with tails between legs, leaving bodies of KIAs behind, so they changed the KIAs to MIAs in exactly the same way children and old ladies turned into Viet Cong fighters once they were dead. The Army consistently exaggerated enemy dead, so why not minimize unit losses the same way? My buddy's Army-lifer dad doesn't like my theory very much, but he's gonna hear it every time he wants to wear a POW/MIA t-shirt to the 4th of July cookout.

Part of the problem, apparently, is we were fighting illegal wars in Laos, Cambodia, Thailand and/or who knows elsewhere. When we signed the peace accords, we dealt with some but not all of the conflicts. And apparently we struck off a lot of names of men we felt were prisoners somewhere in Southeast Asia.

Realpolitik.


Like a said, an epic clusterfark. Everyone involved with planning that war should be ashamed of themselves. The troops did the best they could, but they really got handed a shiat sandwich by the guys at the top.
 
2013-04-30 10:48:43 AM

giantpiraterobot: i like how there was doubt because of the lack of language. 

my grandfather couldn't say 5 words in lithuanian with very similar time removed from his original language... and had little accent in english.  that would seem expected.


You don't forget your native language at age 33.
 
2013-04-30 10:51:04 AM

TheShavingofOccam123: macadamnut: Mad_Radhu: and the Boomers seemingly being really bad at the whole "never leave a man behind" thing.

I've always assumed the military just didn't like reporting fleeing hot LZs with tails between legs, leaving bodies of KIAs behind, so they changed the KIAs to MIAs in exactly the same way children and old ladies turned into Viet Cong fighters once they were dead. The Army consistently exaggerated enemy dead, so why not minimize unit losses the same way? My buddy's Army-lifer dad doesn't like my theory very much, but he's gonna hear it every time he wants to wear a POW/MIA t-shirt to the 4th of July cookout.

Part of the problem, apparently, is we were fighting illegal wars in Laos, Cambodia, Thailand and/or who knows elsewhere. When we signed the peace accords, we dealt with some but not all of the conflicts. And apparently we struck off a lot of names of men we felt were prisoners somewhere in Southeast Asia.

Realpolitik.


From a strictly Realist point of view, the illegal wars were designed to shut down the supply lines to the Viet Cong and other guerrilla forces throughout the South. The political limitations the US faced forced them to basically plug holes in the dike. Nixon wanted to take out the supply centers at the source, meaning Laos and Cambodia. Both states were cooperative but so weak that they were unable to do anything about the NVA presence.
 
2013-04-30 10:51:16 AM
Great fiction novel about Viet Nam special ops if you haven't heard of it.

ecx.images-amazon.com
 
2013-04-30 10:54:10 AM
If they prove it is him will the government try to take back the survivor benefits paid to the family?
 
2013-04-30 11:05:05 AM

Lt. Cheese Weasel: ChrisDe: The sister knows it's him, but refuses a DNA test that will prove it?

'The horror.  The horror.'

/don't get out of the boat


Not unless you're willing to go all the way.
 
2013-04-30 11:34:00 AM
Murdock: No, not just mine Trautman. We're talkin' about a nation here! Besides, it was your hero's fault. Now if your warrior had gone in and done what the hell he was supposed to do, we'd be out of this clean and simple. He was just supposed to take pictures!
Trautman: And if those pictures showed something they would have been... lost... wouldn't they?
Murdock: Oh Trautman, I still don't think you understand what this is all about.
Trautman: The same as it always is! Money! In '72 we were supposed to pay the Cong four-and-a-half billion in war reparations. We reneged, they kept the POWs... and you're doing the same thing all over again.
Murdock: And what the hell would you do, Trautman? Pay blackmail money to ransom our own men and finance the war effort against our allies? What if some burn-out POW shows up on the six o-clock news? What do you want to do... start the war all over again? You wanna bomb Hanoi? You want everybody screaming for armed invasion? Do you honestly think somebody's gonna get up on the floor of the United States Senate, and ask for billions of dollars for a couple of forgotten ghosts?
Trautman: Men, Goddamn it! Men... who fought for their country!
Murdock: That's enough! Trautman, I'm gonna forget this conversation ever took place.
Trautman: You bastard!
Murdock: And if I were you... I'd never make the mistake of bringing this subject up again.
Trautman: Oh you're the one who's making the mistake.
Murdock: Yeah? What mistake?
Trautman: Rambo.
 
2013-04-30 12:56:57 PM

Mad_Radhu: I'm really curious what happens to the whole POW MIA organization after the Vietnam generation passes due to old age. The Iraq and Afghanistan wars so far have had only two people confirmed as MIA.

The whole thing seems like an odd confluence of factors. It seems some combination of the Vietnamese being assholes after the war and not repatriating prisoners well and returning remains properly, their country being really good at making corpses disappear due to the general sogginess of the place, and the Boomers seemingly being really bad at the whole "never leave a man behind" thing. It's just another example of how huge a clusterfark Vietnam was all around that we just don't have closure on so many MIAs even now. It's really sad that so many families are still left wondering all these years afterwards.


Not to mention that the people responsible for sending them there made millions in stead of being imprisoned themselves.
 
2013-04-30 01:25:20 PM

DemoKnite: stevarooni: ChrisDe: The sister knows it's him, but refuses a DNA test that will prove it?

His family (now-ex-wife and children) initially said they'd do DNA tests, but backed out.  My guess is that there's something hinky about the dude doing this documentary, and they want to keep their distance from him.

They were perhaps curious but then counseled on the fact that they will most likely lose their survivor benefits if he is still alive.


He was declared dead in 1976, so presumably his paychecks stopped, and the family got cut a check for any life insurance policies.

If he is still alive and has been a POW or MIA all these years, presumably they'd do some determination that if he was unable to return through no fault of his own, they'd give him 44 years of back-pay, as an E-8.
 
2013-04-30 01:25:35 PM
I remember this from years ago when the FBI sent investigators to interview him.  Interestingly, a that time, after they determined his fingerprints did not match the service records and he confessed he was not Robertson, they closed their investigation.
I wonder if the documentary mentions that?
 
2013-04-30 08:41:40 PM

Mad_Radhu: I'm really curious what happens to the whole POW MIA organization after the Vietnam generation passes due to old age. The Iraq and Afghanistan wars so far have had only two people confirmed as MIA.

The whole thing seems like an odd confluence of factors. It seems some combination of the Vietnamese being assholes after the war


Seriously?  check out the relative casualties...they've got a TON more missing, to this day, than we do.

I'm surprised they're as forgiving as they are, frankly.
 
2013-04-30 08:44:05 PM

Maud Dib: Great fiction novel about Viet Nam special ops if you haven't heard of it.

[ecx.images-amazon.com image 300x300]


Huh, haven't heard of it.

Check out Matterhorn, great novel.

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_ss_i_1_7?url=search-alias%3Dstripb oo ks&field-keywords=matterhorn%20a%20novel%20of%20the%20vietnam%20war&sp refix=matterh%2Cstripbooks%2C182
 
2013-04-30 09:48:37 PM
the way i see it,the man managed to survive nearly 40 years sheerly thru his wits. he was beaten and surely thought he was forever lost but somehow found a way to survive. suppose he felt the best thing to do was just go along with the hand that had been dealt him. sorry for his stateside  family but he found a life he could live.
would be kinda cruel to uproot him now. let him be who he became.
 
2013-04-30 10:00:00 PM
"Dear Henry Kissinger:

Please hurry up and put this man on a boat on a river in Laos or Cambodia or Thailand then have it sunk by the "enemy" .

You wouldn't want your nice shiny Nobel Peace Prize to get tarnished, would you Henry?

/How many did you leave behind in Laos, Cambodia, Thailand, etc? Come on, Henry. Clear your conscience. Oh, wait. Nevermind"
This so very farkin much. Proof that if there is a God he is not just. This miserable SOB war criminal is not burning in hell. Fark him!.
 
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