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(Aberdeen News)   "Let them protest... I don't care." This is a quote from: c.) the man who has put some land from Pine Ridge Indian Reservation on sale for $4.9 million dollars. Why, yes, that *is* where the Wounded Knee Massacre took place (link replaced)   (aberdeennews.com) divider line 260
    More: Interesting, Lakota, Indian Affairs, Indian Country, Rapid City, historic value, objections  
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8294 clicks; posted to Main » on 28 Apr 2013 at 11:17 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-04-28 10:35:04 AM  
It is Czywczynski's land. He paid the mortgage and taxes on it. He is free to do with it what he wants (outside of any zoning restrictions) and sell to whom he wants.

Tribal elders, really? The Lakota need to get over their second place finish and join the rest of us in the 21st Century .
 
2013-04-28 10:41:38 AM  
That miserable old coot just wants to extort money from the tribe.
 
ZAZ [TotalFark]
2013-04-28 10:49:19 AM  
The lesson is, if you're going to have a massacre make sure you get them all.

Quoting the Evil Overlord list: If an enemy I have just killed has a younger sibling or offspring anywhere, I will find them and have them killed immediately, instead of waiting for them to grow up harboring feelings of vengeance towards me in my old age.
 
2013-04-28 10:54:00 AM  
I'm confused, this site is in the middle of a reservation?  Or next to one?  And it is next to a cemetery?  So then, why doesn't the State's Historic Preservation Society assist with this?
 
2013-04-28 10:54:25 AM  

Nabb1: That miserable old coot just wants to extort money from the tribe.


Yeah, I feel the same way. Sounds like he's still pissed his business got burned down.
 
2013-04-28 11:14:24 AM  

raerae1980: I'm confused, this site is in the middle of a reservation?  Or next to one?  And it is next to a cemetery?  So then, why doesn't the State's Historic Preservation Society assist with this?


It says the land is in the "heart of the reservation" but doesn't say if maybe it was a carve out from when the lines were drawn. I don't think a private person can sell Indian land, that's the Feds, correct me if I'm wrong, I'm sure someone will.

My assumption from the article is that the guys wants a payoff for his buildings being burned, he's old and on the way out and wants to cash out. If he actually gets a real outside bidder, I'm sure a private foundation of even the BIA will just buy it from him at a reduced price and try to make the headlines and anger go away.

One would hope.
 
2013-04-28 11:18:51 AM  
This is where the internet got it's meme

tshirtvortex.net
 
ZAZ [TotalFark]
2013-04-28 11:19:10 AM  
NewportBarGuy

Quoting the article: Blindman said the Bureau of Indian Affairs made a mistake when it approved the original sale of land from its Lakota owners to a non-native couple in 1930. ... Blindman, pointing to documents from the 1930 sale, said that the agency neglected to consider the property's historical value and didn't consult tribal leaders.
 
2013-04-28 11:19:11 AM  

Nabb1: That miserable old coot just wants to extort money from the tribe.


He was taught not to be an Indian giver.
 
2013-04-28 11:19:18 AM  
Sucks when other people own something you want.  There should be a law against that.
 
2013-04-28 11:20:15 AM  
"buy Wounded Knee and plan to build there, and face the wrath of protesters."


Ooooooooo,we're gonna give you such a LOOK!
 
2013-04-28 11:21:30 AM  
Let's preserve every location on earth where anything historically significant happened, forever.
 
2013-04-28 11:22:19 AM  
If he owns it and they care enough then they can buy it.

Call it extortion all you want but if someone else is willing to buy it for that then it's just smart to sell it for as much as you can get.

I guess it is true, location location location
 
2013-04-28 11:22:19 AM  
If it's important enough to some people, those people can buy it.
 
2013-04-28 11:23:06 AM  
I heard Walmart is interested in the property.....
 
2013-04-28 11:26:00 AM  
And now the privileged racist white farks show up to rant about how they stole the land fair and square.
 
2013-04-28 11:26:29 AM  

The Stealth Hippopotamus: If he owns it and they care enough then they can buy it.


FTFA:

Czywczynski offered to sell the parcel, and another in Porcupine Butte, to the Oglala Lakota Nation for $4.9 million dollars.

Tribal officials have consistently scorned the price and deadline, which they view as bordering on extortion. The properties have a combined value of about $14,000, according to an appraisal by Shannon County.
 
2013-04-28 11:26:41 AM  
There's a Bioshock Infinite joke here, but I just can't find it...
 
2013-04-28 11:26:59 AM  
I frigging hate white people.  Myself included.
 
2013-04-28 11:27:51 AM  
"I'm trying to envision who would be so crass to make much of a tourist attraction."

Glenn Beck? Rush Limbaugh? Any number of right-wing meta trolls exercising their dog-given right to be an asshole?
 
2013-04-28 11:28:22 AM  
Oh, the black ilk of some people.
 
2013-04-28 11:28:50 AM  

James F. Campbell: And now the privileged racist white farks show up to rant about how they stole the land fair and square.


They never even got top the bronze age when the europeans started showing up.   They were thousands of years behind the rest of the world, technologically.  Don't act like you care about them.
 
2013-04-28 11:29:11 AM  
 
2013-04-28 11:29:43 AM  

ZAZ: NewportBarGuy

Quoting the article: Blindman said the Bureau of Indian Affairs made a mistake when it approved the original sale of land from its Lakota owners to a non-native couple in 1930. ... Blindman, pointing to documents from the 1930 sale, said that the agency neglected to consider the property's historical value and didn't consult tribal leaders.


That may be, but if they've had 85 years to protest the irregularity of the sale, why are they only doing so now? Did it not come up for sale before, or did nobody care till the owner they didn't like wanted to make a profit?
 
2013-04-28 11:31:27 AM  
images2.wikia.nocookie.net
Was this man seen nearby?
 
2013-04-28 11:31:35 AM  
I'm not sure if he's a shrewd businessman or just an old guy who doesn't give a shiat anymore. Either way, I think he'll be successful. This gets the word out and in the end, some wealthy beneficiary will probably purchase the land to give to the tribe.
 
2013-04-28 11:31:58 AM  

ZAZ: Quoting the Evil Overlord list: If an enemy I have just killed has a younger sibling or offspring anywhere, I will find them and have them killed immediately, instead of waiting for them to grow up harboring feelings of vengeance towards me in my old age.


Coming soon.
 
2013-04-28 11:32:28 AM  

radarlove: I frigging hate white people.  Myself included.


So when are you planning on moving back to Europe?
 
2013-04-28 11:32:30 AM  
Solution: Fed government steps in, ED's the land at pennies per dollar, tells old man to sit down/get off National Park's lawn.
 
2013-04-28 11:33:48 AM  
I've been to Pine Ridge and I can't imagine why anyone would live there.  It's a shiathole in the middle of nowhere with no jobs or sources of income unless you happen to own the local liquor store.
 
2013-04-28 11:35:05 AM  
Now is the land actually worth $4.9 million or is the owner just setting the price so high that the Lakota can't afford it?

That will determine what I think of this guy.
 
2013-04-28 11:35:06 AM  

NewportBarGuy: It says the land is in the "heart of the reservation" but doesn't say if maybe it was a carve out from when the lines were drawn. I don't think a private person can sell Indian land, that's the Feds, correct me if I'm wrong, I'm sure someone will.


According to the article, the land was sold without the consent of the tribe in 1930.
 
2013-04-28 11:35:26 AM  

NewportBarGuy: raerae1980: I'm confused, this site is in the middle of a reservation?  Or next to one?  And it is next to a cemetery?  So then, why doesn't the State's Historic Preservation Society assist with this?

It says the land is in the "heart of the reservation" but doesn't say if maybe it was a carve out from when the lines were drawn. I don't think a private person can sell Indian land, that's the Feds, correct me if I'm wrong, I'm sure someone will.

My assumption from the article is that the guys wants a payoff for his buildings being burned, he's old and on the way out and wants to cash out. If he actually gets a real outside bidder, I'm sure a private foundation of even the BIA will just buy it from him at a reduced price and try to make the headlines and anger go away.

One would hope.


Well, okay.  But that still doesn't explain why the State's Historical Preservation Society doesn't step in.  Now would be the perfect time, IMO, as the property is up for sale.
 
2013-04-28 11:37:02 AM  

Louisiana_Sitar_Club: "buy Wounded Knee and plan to build there, and face the wrath of protesters."


Ooooooooo,we're gonna give you such a LOOK!


last time they burned down his business
 
2013-04-28 11:37:51 AM  

Mrtraveler01: Now is the land actually worth $4.9 million or is the owner just setting the price so high that the Lakota can't afford it?

That will determine what I think of this guy.


Somewhere in the article it is mentioned that the property in question was valued at $14,000.  Far below the asking price.
 
2013-04-28 11:38:37 AM  

raerae1980: I'm confused, this site is in the middle of a reservation?  Or next to one?  And it is next to a cemetery?  So then, why doesn't the State's Historic Preservation Society assist with this?


Because no one in our state gives a fark.  Pine Ridge is the wart on the butt of SD.  "Historical Indian Sites" are a dime a dozen in west river South Dakota.    It's in a location where no one goes on purpose.  Sure, if you drive by you might think it's cool to stop by for a minute, but no one plans a vacation to Pine Ridge to see the Wounded Knee Massacre site.  It's not even really close enough to our main tourist attractions (Mount Rushmore, Crazy Horse, Sturgis, Custer, Deadwood) for it to be a side trip, so I just don't see millions in commercial revenue here.

The only way he'll get this money is if some idiot philanthropist buys it and gives it to the reservation.  What the tribe ought to do is just chalk it up to (another) mistake in the 30's and tell the guy they aren't interested.  When they close the door, the price will come down.
 
2013-04-28 11:38:39 AM  

Gaddiel: The Stealth Hippopotamus: If he owns it and they care enough then they can buy it.

FTFA:

Czywczynski offered to sell the parcel, and another in Porcupine Butte, to the Oglala Lakota Nation for $4.9 million dollars.

Tribal officials have consistently scorned the price and deadline, which they view as bordering on extortion. The properties have a combined value of about $14,000, according to an appraisal by Shannon County.


as pure prairie land. the property appraiser doesnt care about the historical value.
 
2013-04-28 11:39:50 AM  

snake_beater: There's a Bioshock Infinite joke here, but I just can't find it...


Skyrim

/I took an arrow to the knee
 
2013-04-28 11:40:33 AM  

ZAZ: NewportBarGuy

Quoting the article: Blindman said the Bureau of Indian Affairs made a mistake when it approved the original sale of land from its Lakota owners to a non-native couple in 1930. ... Blindman, pointing to documents from the 1930 sale, said that the agency neglected to consider the property's historical value and didn't consult tribal leaders.


Thanks, ZAZ. Looks like the best bet is to get BIA to pay for their mistake and just bring the land back into the reservation. Maybe he realizes that and that's why he's asking for $5 million because only the Govt. can afford that. Just offer him a million bucks, throw it back on the reservation plot and end it.

Seems like an easy fix to me. We owe the Lakota at least that much to resolve it.
 
2013-04-28 11:40:36 AM  

Gyrfalcon: ZAZ: NewportBarGuy

Quoting the article: Blindman said the Bureau of Indian Affairs made a mistake when it approved the original sale of land from its Lakota owners to a non-native couple in 1930. ... Blindman, pointing to documents from the 1930 sale, said that the agency neglected to consider the property's historical value and didn't consult tribal leaders.

That may be, but if they've had 85 years to protest the irregularity of the sale, why are they only doing so now? Did it not come up for sale before, or did nobody care till the owner they didn't like wanted to make a profit?


I think burning down anything that has ever been built on the land counts as haveing protested long before the guy decided to sell it.

The beauro of indian affairs back in the 30s was the most corrupt any part of the us government has ever been and that is including no bid contrast under bush the people that were affected had no recourse to take at the times and the courts just say that it happend a long time ago get over it
 
2013-04-28 11:41:56 AM  
They wanted to prevent him from using his own land, that he got permission from the tribe to buy in 1930, so they burned down his business and several houses.
Now people want to reward the terrorist action?
 
2013-04-28 11:42:55 AM  
put a casino on it. they pay off the mortgage in a week
 
2013-04-28 11:43:51 AM  

raerae1980: Well, okay.  But that still doesn't explain why the State's Historical Preservation Society doesn't step in.  Now would be the perfect time, IMO, as the property is up for sale.



You are assuming that South Dakota has millions of dollars available to purchase this (privately owned) land and preserve it, with no foreseeable income potential to help with maintaining it.

Have you been to see it?  What would YOU pay to come to South Dakota and see this?  Keep in mind that it's over two hours from anything interesting, and that gas on the reservation cost about $6 a gallon.
 
2013-04-28 11:44:09 AM  

poison_amy: raerae1980: I'm confused, this site is in the middle of a reservation?  Or next to one?  And it is next to a cemetery?  So then, why doesn't the State's Historic Preservation Society assist with this?

Because no one in our state gives a fark.  Pine Ridge is the wart on the butt of SD.  "Historical Indian Sites" are a dime a dozen in west river South Dakota.    It's in a location where no one goes on purpose.  Sure, if you drive by you might think it's cool to stop by for a minute, but no one plans a vacation to Pine Ridge to see the Wounded Knee Massacre site.  It's not even really close enough to our main tourist attractions (Mount Rushmore, Crazy Horse, Sturgis, Custer, Deadwood) for it to be a side trip, so I just don't see millions in commercial revenue here.

The only way he'll get this money is if some idiot philanthropist buys it and gives it to the reservation.  What the tribe ought to do is just chalk it up to (another) mistake in the 30's and tell the guy they aren't interested.  When they close the door, the price will come down.


I see.  Well...damn.
 
2013-04-28 11:44:11 AM  
That's OK, when the U.S. goes bankrupt and sells off all its assets, I hope the Lakota have the foresight to purchase the land and place an Indian Casino on the Little Bighorn.

/Custer wore Arrow Shirts
 
2013-04-28 11:45:16 AM  
A theme park surrounded by real Indians really on the warpath kinda makes sense.  You can't get that kind of authenticity at Disney World.
 
2013-04-28 11:45:37 AM  

tenpoundsofcheese: They wanted to prevent him from using his own land, that he got permission from the tribe to buy in 1930, so they burned down his business and several houses.
Now people want to reward the terrorist action?


3/10. Marked down for use of the 'T' word
 
2013-04-28 11:46:11 AM  

hasty ambush: Tribal elders, really? The Lakota need to get over their second place finish and join the rest of us in the 21st Century .


 You could have just typed "I don't know squat about American Indians" instead.
 
2013-04-28 11:46:28 AM  
Why are people so butte hurt over this?

They approved selling the land a long time ago.
He is giving them the first option to buy the land.
If they don't, there are groups that are willing to buy the land and donate it to them.
 
2013-04-28 11:47:35 AM  

UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: /Custer wore Arrow Shirts

was an asshole.

Fixed for historical accuracy.
 
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