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(USA Today)   Boston Bombing suspect Dzhokhar Tsarnaev is awake and responding to questions via writing   (usatoday.com) divider line 561
    More: Followup, Tsarnaev, Dzhokhar A. Tsarnaev, Boston, Michael McCaul, Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center, Massachusetts State Police, Boston Police, law enforcement officials  
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18425 clicks; posted to Main » on 21 Apr 2013 at 9:11 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-04-21 10:11:33 PM
If I were a federal investigator, I'd get an agent fluent in Russian to pose as a doctor. When alone in the room, he'd pretend to sympathize with the kid. Maybe even pretend to be an undercover Chechen agent working on springing him out. 19 year olds are stupid, expecially when traumatized and drugged. Get him to say things he won't say to guys with badges.

It's possible I've seen too much Mission: Impossible.
 
2013-04-21 10:11:41 PM
The only question they should ask him is "when we stick ya in the electric chair, ya want original or extra crispy?"
 
2013-04-21 10:11:44 PM

HideAndGoFarkYourself: BrieBelle00: I wonder what they're asking him at this point... has it been for-sure decided where he'll be tried, yet (military or civi court)?

He'll be tried in a civilcriminal court, likely federal for the terrorism related crimes, and/or state for the murder related crimes.

There is literally no way that he'll be tried as an enemy combatant.  If we were in a declared war, with a clear enemy, and he was working as an agent for that enemy to attack us here, he'd be tried in a tribunal, most likely.

As is, he's an American citizen, who committed a very henous act of terrorism/murder.  That's it.


He is not being sued.
 
2013-04-21 10:12:00 PM
The brothers' uncle, Ruslan Tsarni, told the Associated Press that Dzhokhar Tsarnaev was "used" by his older brother to carry out the bombing. "He's not been understanding anything," Tsarni said. "He's a 19-year-old boy."

/Ya, i'm not buying that shiat dude. I can understand your family's pain at being relations to terrorists, but he's 19, MORE than old enough to know that planting bombs and blowing up innocent men, women, and children is wrong. Esp since he's been in country this long. I don't doubt that his brother was a major teacher of hate and intolerance, but he had his own mind, and unless you can prove he's a sociopath, he knew EXACTLY what he was doing, and its consequences.
 
2013-04-21 10:12:27 PM

itazurakko: jaytkay: He can be charged by the Feds, just like the 1993 WTC bombers and McVeigh. The news is describing the possible Federal charge as "use of a weapon of mass destruction to kill people".

...which is ludicrous.  It was a pressure cooker bomb.  That is not a weapon of mass destruction.

....



Your GED in law has been recalled.  A weapon of mass destruction under federal law is

18 USC § 2332a - Use of weapons of mass destruction
(2)the term "weapon of mass destruction" means-
(A) any destructive device as defined in section 921


18 USC § 921 - Definitions
(4)The term "destructive device" means-
(A) any explosive, incendiary, or poison gas-(i) bomb,(ii) grenade,(iii) rocket having a propellant charge of more than four ounces,(iv) missile having an explosive or incendiary charge of more than one-quarter ounce,(v) mine, or(vi) device similar to any of the devices described in the preceding clauses;
 
2013-04-21 10:13:02 PM
i.imgur.com
 
2013-04-21 10:13:10 PM

saturn badger: He is not being sued.


...yet. :)
 
2013-04-21 10:13:24 PM

JohnBigBootay: American citizen, American soil, not the member of any military. Why would we even have a discussion about a military tribunal? To what end? So he had less rights? Who gives a shiat? The shiattiest prosecutor in history couldn't screw this up.


I believe the US Attorney in Boston is Carmen Ortiz, most recently in the news for the prosecution of Aaron Swartz.
 
2013-04-21 10:13:50 PM

itazurakko: jaytkay: Injuring 180+ people is pretty "mass" in my opinion. I guess that's commonplace where you live.

"Weapons of Mass Destruction" began as a euphemism for NUCLEAR WEAPONS.  They were then broadened to include things like mass chemical weapons (not pepper spray!) and other things that will take out entire cities.  Weapons that even "civilized" armies aren't supposed to use.

So no. 180+ people injured is not remotely "mass" in the sense of  "weapons of mass destruction."

The US invaded Iraq on suspicion of "weapons of mass destruction." None were found.  Meanwhile, tons of IEDs far more lethal than this Boston pressure cooker bomb are all over the place - they are not "weapons of mass destruction."


Whatever. There's a Federal law he can be charged with.

Look it up if you want to know how weapon of mass destruction is defined. See if it meets with your approval.

I'm sure Federal prosecutors will be anxiously awaiting your OK before they proceed.
 
2013-04-21 10:13:56 PM

Samwise Gamgee: If I were a federal investigator, I'd get an agent fluent in Russian to pose as a doctor. When alone in the room, he'd pretend to sympathize with the kid. Maybe even pretend to be an undercover Chechen agent working on springing him out. 19 year olds are stupid, expecially when traumatized and drugged. Get him to say things he won't say to guys with badges.

It's possible I've seen too much Mission: Impossible.


I think that happened in Rainbow 6.
 
2013-04-21 10:14:02 PM

Alonjar: After several minutes, the elder brother, Tamerlan, walked toward the officers, firing his gun until he appeared to run out of bullets, Deveau said. Officers tackled him and were trying to get handcuffs on him, when the stolen SUV came roaring at them, the younger brother at the wheel. The officers scattered and the SUV plowed over Tamerlan Tsarnaev, who was dragged briefly under the car, he said.


You're reading that as he intentionally killed his brother. I'm reading it as he killed his brother trying to get away.

Neither of us will know until more information comes out. The only thing I was asserting is that he has to live with the fact that he killed his brother. Maybe that's why he tried to kill himself. It's all supposition.
 
ZAZ [TotalFark]
2013-04-21 10:15:15 PM
So no. 180+ people injured is not remotely "mass" in the sense of "weapons of mass destruction."

For purposes of federal criminal law, a "weapon of mass destruction" includes any "destructive device." 18 USC 2332a. A "destructive device" includes any bomb, grenade, rocket with more than four ounces of propellant, and any projectile launcher with a caliber over .50 inches (except for Attorney General approved shotguns). 18 USC 921. A potato gun is a weapon of mass destruction, if "designed for use as a weapon" and used against a U.S. national.
 
2013-04-21 10:16:20 PM

Weaver95: ZAZ: He's so full of drugs it doesn't matter whether he got his Miranda warning. State courts would not consider a confession under the circumstances to be voluntary.

I don't think we're gonna care about a confession.  we're just gonna strip him of his rights, torture the f*ck outta him, and then kill him.  he might get a show trial of some sort but he's a dead man walking and i'm sure he knows it.


Ted Kaczynski, by himself, killed just as many people as this guy did with bombs and he's alive in prison. There's no reason to kill Tsarnaev now and keeping him alive might help us better understand bombers in the future.
 
2013-04-21 10:16:22 PM
D-R-I-N-K M-O-R-E O-V-A-L-T-I-N-E
 
2013-04-21 10:16:34 PM

sdd2000: 18 USC § 921 - Definitions
(4)The term "destructive device" means-
(A) any explosive, incendiary, or poison gas-(i) bomb,(ii) grenade,(iii) rocket having a propellant charge of more than four ounces,(iv) missile having an explosive or incendiary charge of more than one-quarter ounce,(v) mine, or(vi) device similar to any of the devices described in the preceding clauses;


Well, it started with a properly different meaning. If it's been watered down to this, I still think it's ridiculous.  It was originally about "non-conventional weapons."
 
2013-04-21 10:16:58 PM

Great Janitor: As for making it federal, it depends on how terrorism is viewed by the courts. If he is classified as a terrorist, that could bump him up to the Federal level.


Were any of the 180 or so injured military or federal employees? That's probably the angle they'll use.

I also wouldn't be surprised if they check every piece of equipment they used. If they went to New Hampshire to buy the backpack and save the sales tax, they'll make it a federal crime that crossed state lines.
 
2013-04-21 10:17:22 PM

BrieBelle00: saturn badger: BrieBelle00: I wonder what they're asking him at this point... has it been for-sure decided where he'll be tried, yet (military or civi court)?

Military or civil? Not sure where you got that idea. Neither apply here. My guess would be criminal court.

It wasn't  my idea, it was the republicans who were discussing trying to get the Bush-era debates going again so this kid could be moved to a tribunal. I know he doesn't qualify for anything other than State or Federal.


I didn't get that from your comment and have been tuned out of the news the last few days. Been out chillin' and partying. Sometimes that is a better place to be.
 
2013-04-21 10:17:37 PM

Mugato: jaytkay: Mugato: Well since they call pretty much any violent act "terrorism" nowadays, I'm not sure there is an official definition that anyone actually follows.

Laws are an "official definition".  You can only charge someone with a crime that's on the books.

Blowing people up is a crime that's on the books. The question was whether they are calling it terrorism.


Remote bombs used to kill and maim people while they were watching a race, sending the message that you are not safe, that we can kill you in this city, that's terrorism.
 
2013-04-21 10:17:42 PM

El Supe: BravadoGT: The simple solution to this is to make the citizenship of naturalized aliens revokable upon arrest for terror-related charges.

He can be stripped of his naturalized citizenship for lying or misleading on his citizenship application.  So there it is, strip him of citizenship, administer some sodium pentathol and try him as enemy combatant.


And the purpose of all that would be.....?
 
2013-04-21 10:17:54 PM
 
2013-04-21 10:17:59 PM

jaytkay: I'm sure Federal prosecutors will be anxiously awaiting your OK before they proceed.


Oh, I very much doubt that. Doesn't mean people can't criticize the mad rush to call everything under the sun "terrorism" now.
 
2013-04-21 10:18:10 PM
The brothers' uncle, Ruslan Tsarni, told the Associated Press that Dzhokhar Tsarnaev was "used" by his older brother to carry out the bombing. "He's not been understanding anything," Tsarni said. "He's a 19-year-old boy."

I knew this pathetic defense was going to rear its head. He lost any chance at that when he decided to fire an automatic weapon at police officers attempting to apprehend him. Death penalty. I don't give a shiat if he's 19. Death penalty.
 
2013-04-21 10:18:11 PM

NewportBarGuy: Alonjar: After several minutes, the elder brother, Tamerlan, walked toward the officers, firing his gun until he appeared to run out of bullets, Deveau said. Officers tackled him and were trying to get handcuffs on him, when the stolen SUV came roaring at them, the younger brother at the wheel. The officers scattered and the SUV plowed over Tamerlan Tsarnaev, who was dragged briefly under the car, he said.

You're reading that as he intentionally killed his brother. I'm reading it as he killed his brother trying to get away.

Neither of us will know until more information comes out. The only thing I was asserting is that he has to live with the fact that he killed his brother. Maybe that's why he tried to kill himself. It's all supposition.


Maybe he was master and his brother was blaster.

#2 was #1 and planned the whole thing and took advantage of his older brothers budding religious radicalism, he ran over his brother to keep him from talking.
 
2013-04-21 10:18:33 PM

ZAZ: So no. 180+ people injured is not remotely "mass" in the sense of "weapons of mass destruction."

For purposes of federal criminal law, a "weapon of mass destruction" includes any "destructive device." 18 USC 2332a. A "destructive device" includes any bomb, grenade, rocket with more than four ounces of propellant, and any projectile launcher with a caliber over .50 inches (except for Attorney General approved shotguns). 18 USC 921. A potato gun is a weapon of mass destruction, if "designed for use as a weapon" and used against a U.S. national.


Oh yeah?  Well, the law also says that "mass can neither be created nor destroyed, although it may be rearranged in space, or the entities associated with it may be changed in form."

So weapons of mass destruction don't exist anywhere!
 
2013-04-21 10:18:55 PM

ManateeGag: He hasn't been read his rights!  This is 0bummer's America!  He's going to have us all under marshal law!  Illegal home searches!


i0.kym-cdn.com
 
2013-04-21 10:19:01 PM

tirob: I hope for his sake that none of the people taking care of him is related to that kid that was killed in the bombings.


His doctors are actually Israeli. So lulz.
 
2013-04-21 10:19:03 PM

Nem Wan: Weaver95: I think it's safe to say that the rules are gonna get suspended on this one.

Used to be, the highest profile cases were when you made extra damn sure the rules were followed. When did we decide that the best way to "send a message" was to demonstrate willingness to break our own rules? And who, exactly, is supposed to be impressed by that?


Usually, people too stupid and/or ignorant to understand the historical relevance of the rules, and the importance of holding them sacred so that they don't eventually degrade into tyranny against the populous.  I sure as hell expect the government to prosecute this guy effectively without their incompetence resulting in the rules having to be bent, or allowing the casus belli de jour to determine our legal standards.

 I forget, is this one of those situations where we let the law be "modified" because we trust the government, or because we're worried about them?  I just want to know what argument is going to be used in the next gun thread.
 
2013-04-21 10:19:06 PM
I hope it's pork chop day at the hospital.
 
2013-04-21 10:19:20 PM
Will Sgt Fury interrogate him?
 
2013-04-21 10:19:52 PM

BravadoGT: The simple solution to this is to make the citizenship of naturalized aliens revokable upon arrest for terror-related charges.


Why? So we can deport them? I'm not sure why that would help. Maybe you can explain it.
 
2013-04-21 10:21:21 PM

ManateeGag: He hasn't been read his rights!  This is 0bummer's America!  He's going to have us all under marshal law!  Illegal home searches!


Well at least I see you're hooked on phonics.
 
2013-04-21 10:21:35 PM

awalkingecho: tirob: I hope for his sake that none of the people taking care of him is related to that kid that was killed in the bombings.

His doctors are actually Israeli. So lulz.


Citation on the Israeli doctors in case anyone wants it
 
2013-04-21 10:21:46 PM
A lot better way for communicating with others than using bombs.   He should have just started out writing and skipped all the violence.
 
2013-04-21 10:21:53 PM

IntertubeUser: Fark you, Scorecard Reseach!


Ghostery is your friend.
 
2013-04-21 10:22:29 PM

ZAZ: I thought the dimwits in Congress were still trying to get it moved to the Military Courts.

A politician was blowing his mouth off. They do that sometimes. A military trial would have to be based on the global war on terror and the 2001 authorization for use of military force against terrorists. At this point there isn't any evidence of international terrorism or even domestic terrorism. Terrorism is not the same as killing a lot of people.

I heard an interview with Alan Dershowitz. He said he would flunk anybody in his class who suggested a military tribunal under the circumstances.


Sounds like a terrorist.
 
2013-04-21 10:23:22 PM
Can someone here please explain why stripping him of his citizenship is so important?
 
2013-04-21 10:23:54 PM
What I want to know is what have police done with the third man? The naked man who they captured the night of the MIT shooting. How is he related to the bombing brothers? What about the naked man!
 
2013-04-21 10:23:57 PM
I find it interesting that there is no mention of the guns they used. Not the usual AK-47, Glock, assault rifle you usually hear, and in the gun control frenzy the politicians are in right now.
 
2013-04-21 10:25:02 PM

dr_blasto: I would expect this to play out just like McVeigh's trial and end in a similar fashion.


It'd better.
 
2013-04-21 10:25:15 PM

rkiller1: Alonjar: NewportBarGuy: djkutch: know your ran over your brother's body during your get away? Feels?

From the vague reports, sounds like he probably killed his brother. Yes, please live with that for a few years.

You guys are clueless.  According to the police, the older (dead) brother had run out of ammunition, and two police officers had actually tackled and subdued him.  Thats when the younger brother tried to run all 3 down.  It wasnt an accident.  They most likely made a pact to not be taken alive or something similar, and when he saw that his brother had been incapacitated, unable to even blow himself up, he decided that killing them all himself was the best solution.

Quit acting like he will feel remorse.. he did his brother a favor.

Trying to follow your logic.  It then follows that the younger brother should've committed suicide, as he had many chances including popping out of the boat like Rambo.  Or shooting his own brains out.


That's exactly what the reports out now are saying - that his neck injury was him eating a bullet. He put the gun in his mouth and fired straight back through his neck, and not up through his head.
 
ZAZ [TotalFark]
2013-04-21 10:25:18 PM
In federal criminal law, terrorism is defined to include only acts that
"appear to be intended-
(i) to intimidate or coerce a civilian population;
(ii) to influence the policy of a government by intimidation or coercion; or
(iii) to affect the conduct of a government by mass destruction, assassination, or kidnapping"
18 USC 2331
 
2013-04-21 10:26:11 PM

awalkingecho: His doctors are actually Israeli.



You realize the nationality of his doctor has nothing to do with anything, unless you are an overt racist, right?
 
2013-04-21 10:26:41 PM

Arthur Jumbles: What I want to know is what have police done with the third man? The naked man who they captured the night of the MIT shooting. How is he related to the bombing brothers? What about the naked man!


I'm pretty sure they stripped him when they carjacked his car, as either a change of clothes or to leave behind as a distraction. Or at least that's what I heard circulating. Not sure if accurate.

hunh: I find it interesting that there is no mention of the guns they used. Not the usual AK-47, Glock, assault rifle you usually hear, and in the gun control frenzy the politicians are in right now.


I'll try and find the source but one of the police reports I read said they had semi-auto pistols at the first encounter.
 
2013-04-21 10:26:46 PM

Arthur Jumbles: What I want to know is what have police done with the third man? The naked man who they captured the night of the MIT shooting. How is he related to the bombing brothers? What about the naked man!


The naked man, it's my best move.  Works two out of three times.

My favorite naked man pose is the Captain Morgan.
 
2013-04-21 10:27:10 PM

Lionel Mandrake: Can someone here please explain why stripping him of his citizenship is so important?


Because we're really mad or something and it's harder to do horrible things to citizens maybe.
 
2013-04-21 10:27:45 PM

AliceBToklasLives: ka1axy: Give him the best medical care possible (Boston is a great place for that) and a fair trial. Life in prison is far worse than the death penalty.

I think he would prefer to get the federal death penalty than life in a state prison.  He killed a child.  That will make him very unpopular among the general prison population.

Great Janitor:
As for making it federal, it depends on how terrorism is viewed by the courts.  If he is classified as a terrorist, that could bump him up to the Federal level.

Of course they will classify his case as terrorism and make it a federal case.  Good test of our nation = do we bend the rules 'cause the guy's evil, or do we go by the book based solely on the fact that we are talking about a U.S. citizen?


Federal case under
18 U.S.C. 2332a Murder by the use of a weapon of mass destruction

Take your pick
 
2013-04-21 10:28:19 PM

Alonjar: One of his officers put his cruiser into gear and jumped out of it, letting it roll at the suspects to draw fire, he said. The suspects peppered the car with bullets.


That is awesome. That officer's quick use of tactics may have saved the lives of him and others.
 
2013-04-21 10:28:25 PM

Lionel Mandrake: Can someone here please explain why stripping him of his citizenship is so important?


That way we can string him and drag his body through town behind a horse.
At least I think that's what they're getting at.
 
2013-04-21 10:28:26 PM
I hope we can learn from Dzhokhar Tsarnaev everything we possibly can!
A Boston Cop friend of mine sent me a graphic picture of his brother  Tamerlan dead on a gurney.
Pretty sick and definitely not suitable for posting.
As a former Bostonian I pray for all that are affected.
Boston Strong!
 
2013-04-21 10:28:45 PM

Arthur Jumbles: What I want to know is what have police done with the third man? The naked man who they captured the night of the MIT shooting. How is he related to the bombing brothers? What about the naked man!


The naked man was naked because the police made him strip in case he had a bomb on him, like the older brother did.
 
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