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(Salon)   Scientific research displeases reporter, who promptly sues scientific journal, university for private papers, e-mails, names of peer reviewers, and the political opinions of the scientists involved   (salon.com) divider line 88
    More: Florida, scientific journals, scientific research, Southern Illinois University, Elsevier, Mark Regnerus, freelance journalist, public records  
•       •       •

5048 clicks; posted to Geek » on 20 Apr 2013 at 7:21 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-04-20 04:42:37 PM  
Wow I don't care if some one is gay or not, but 25000 years of hetrosexual marriages seems to pass the test as to working. Besides it seems gay couples are self limiting as they cannot reproduce with out a different sex partner. Just a thought.
 
2013-04-20 04:59:06 PM  
Did the submitter read beyond the first paragraph?
 
2013-04-20 05:03:13 PM  
Given the retractions for methodological problems (including downright falsifying data) that has been occurring in the social sciences, this is a fair request.
 
ZAZ [TotalFark]
2013-04-20 05:50:48 PM  
"These records are open to any citizen who wants to inspect them and we will vigorously enforce Mr. Becker's constitutional right to obtain the records from UCF"

My policy is to assume any lawyer who uses the word "vigorously" is in the wrong.

If the facts are on the side, pounds the facts. If the law is on your side, pound the law. If neither is on your side, get vigorous.
 
2013-04-20 06:00:13 PM  

ZAZ: "These records are open to any citizen who wants to inspect them and we will vigorously enforce Mr. Becker's constitutional right to obtain the records from UCF"

My policy is to assume any lawyer who uses the word "vigorously" is in the wrong.

If the facts are on the side, pounds the facts. If the law is on your side, pound the law. If neither is on your side, get vigorous.


upload.wikimedia.org

Approves
 
2013-04-20 06:03:57 PM  
Ummm...this would suggest that the  submitterdidn't actually read the article:


Becker

Last summer's publication of Regnerus' explosive study - which found negative outcomes for children raised in same-sex households compared to children raised by married heterosexual parents - culminated in a widespread consensus that Regnerus' study was methodologically flawed. Questions were raised about the political motivations of Regnerus' conservative funders, as well as the seemingly rushed rate of publication.

As The American Independent

As Wright and others have noted in the past, the publication of Regnerus' article in the June 2012 issue of Social Science Research was speedier than most. A mere six weeks lapsed between the paper's submission and publication. Some of the articles published in the same issue took around a year between submission and acceptance.

"What we're hoping is that the documents might shine some light onto the reason that it was rushed to publish," Becker said in an interview with The American Independent.
 
2013-04-20 06:04:55 PM  

maxalt: Wow I don't care if some one is gay or not, but 25000 years of hetrosexual marriages


I could be wrong, but I'm not so sure you can prove that marriage of any sort has existed for 25,000 years.
 
2013-04-20 06:08:07 PM  

ZAZ: "These records are open to any citizen who wants to inspect them and we will vigorously enforce Mr. Becker's constitutional right to obtain the records from UCF"

My policy is to assume any lawyer who uses the word "vigorously" is in the wrong.

If the facts are on the side, pounds the facts. If the law is on your side, pound the law. If neither is on your side, get vigorous.


The term "vigorous" comes up when referring to an attorney's duty to their client quite often, so it really isn't unusual to see an attorney use that term.
 
2013-04-20 06:15:36 PM  
With all due respect to the journalist in question, fark off.  Science can handle itself.
 
2013-04-20 06:29:31 PM  

Mentat: With all due respect to the journalist in question, fark off.  Science can handle itself.


You are correct. Journalists have no justifiable reason to demand that state-funded institutions adhere to established law.
 
2013-04-20 06:30:04 PM  

Relatively Obscure: maxalt: Wow I don't care if some one is gay or not, but 25000 years of hetrosexual marriages

I could be wrong, but I'm not so sure you can prove that marriage of any sort has existed for 25,000 years.


Yea just about, going back to prehistoric days just from artifacts.
 
2013-04-20 06:34:54 PM  

Mentat: With all due respect to the journalist in question, fark off.  Science can handle itself.


This was my first reaction, but since it is a publicly funded University and these supposed to be public records then if the University will not produce them voluntarily they should be compelled to do so by the courts.

I suspect there is a turd in a file drawer which will demonstrate this study to be less than unbiased.
 
2013-04-20 06:36:08 PM  

maxalt: Yea just about, going back to prehistoric days just from artifacts.


i0.kym-cdn.com
 
2013-04-20 06:52:41 PM  

maxalt: w I don't care if some one is gay or not, but 25000 years of hetrosexual marriages seems to pass the test as to working.


As no one who advocates legalizing same-sex marriage simultaneously advocates abolishing opposite-sex marriage, your statement lacks relevance or meaning.
 
2013-04-20 06:57:18 PM  

whistleridge: the publication of Regnerus' article in the June 2012 issue of Social Science Research was speedier than most. A mere six weeks lapsed between the paper's submission and publication.


A speedy publication means that the paper sailed through peer review without generating much criticism.
 
2013-04-20 06:57:33 PM  

Ennuipoet: maxalt: Yea just about, going back to prehistoric days just from artifacts.

[i0.kym-cdn.com image 604x453]


Why what a genius you turn out to be, and sooo original, I await on your next stolen insult with the greatest of anticipation. On your  recommended reading list  "Insults for the Complete Idiot", but don't worry it uses small words and has many pictures.
 
2013-04-20 07:08:45 PM  

maxalt: Wow I don't care if some one is gay or not, but 25000 years of hetrosexual marriages seems to pass the test as to working. Besides it seems gay couples are self limiting as they cannot reproduce with out a different sex partner. Just a thought.


Not your best work.

3/10
 
2013-04-20 07:10:21 PM  

maxalt: Relatively Obscure: maxalt: Wow I don't care if some one is gay or not, but 25000 years of hetrosexual marriages

I could be wrong, but I'm not so sure you can prove that marriage of any sort has existed for 25,000 years.

Yea just about, going back to prehistoric days just from artifacts.


Interesting.  I'll have to do some digging when I'm not at work. I'm curious to see what sort of marriage artifacts there are from back then; I've never heard of such.
 
2013-04-20 07:24:31 PM  

Relatively Obscure: maxalt: Relatively Obscure: maxalt: Wow I don't care if some one is gay or not, but 25000 years of hetrosexual marriages

I could be wrong, but I'm not so sure you can prove that marriage of any sort has existed for 25,000 years.

Yea just about, going back to prehistoric days just from artifacts.

Interesting.  I'll have to do some digging when I'm not at work. I'm curious to see what sort of marriage artifacts there are from back then; I've never heard of such.


Showing pics carved in rock from≈20000 bc, in the near east from what I've read,  also the heads on Easter Island could be over 15000 years old from a race in Peru who valued the family. Just what I read wasn't there when it happened.
 
2013-04-20 07:25:50 PM  
Last summer's publication of Regnerus' explosive study - which found negative outcomes for children raised in same-sex households compared to children raised by married heterosexual parents - culminated in a widespread consensus that Regnerus' study was methodologically flawed. Questions were raised about the political motivations of Regnerus' conservative funders, as well as the seemingly rushed rate of publication.

As The American Independent reported recently, many of these suspicions were justified.


In contrast to those of Virginia AG Cuccinelli....
 
2013-04-20 07:29:28 PM  
"sues scientific journal..."
"Sociology..."
www.ridelust.com
I think I found your problem...
 
2013-04-20 07:30:56 PM  

RodneyToady: Given the retractions for methodological problems (including downright falsifying data) that has been occurring in the social sciences, this is a fair request.


No. No it is not. The paper may have been crap and the reviewers may be idiots, but that is no reason to screw with the system of anonymous reviewers. Anonymous reviews are absolutely necessary to the academic review process. While they aren't perfect, obviously, allowing reviewers to be unmasked would totally undermine the whole process. If the publisher (Elsevier, which sucks too), wants to blacklist the reviewers, I'm fine with it. But this hack journalist had no idea what he's doing and should STFU and get back to his muckraking.
 
2013-04-20 07:47:39 PM  

maxalt: Ennuipoet: maxalt: Yea just about, going back to prehistoric days just from artifacts.

[i0.kym-cdn.com image 604x453]

Why what a genius you turn out to be, and sooo original, I await on your next stolen insult with the greatest of anticipation. On your  recommended reading list  "Insults for the Complete Idiot", but don't worry it uses small words and has many pictures.


www.preparationh.com
There you go, and let me add another one
firedaily.com

There, are we happy now?
 
2013-04-20 07:56:27 PM  
I fail to see anything wrong with what they're asking for. I don't know if anyone else here does research at a University, but this is actually standard. All research is on the public record including all emails between researchers and editors of journals.

First day at my job they warned us that every email we send regarding our work is on the public record and we can be legally compelled to hand over all of them at any time by anyone. This extends to our raw data and methodology. My whole team is aware that the emails we send each day in the office, up to and including those scheduling the lab BBQ, are public records. Every document written about our work, published or not, every note, must be turned over for public scrutiny as soon as any such request is made by anyone. The requests don't even have to come from journalists.

Fortunately most people don't want to sift through thousands of emails about all the mundane stuff nor the mountains of spreadsheets, and therefore such requests are rare. I've never actually had one. Then again my research doesn't have the potential to be controversial. If I was researching anything to do with humans, however mundane, even just what collects between your toes, I would expect inquiries way more often.

The only reason the University would deny such a request would be if they suspected scrutiny of the records would make them look bad. Their excuse here is bull. Turn over the records, if there's something peculiar call out the researcher, doing this makes them look guilty.
 
2013-04-20 08:00:56 PM  

maxalt: Wow I don't care if some one is gay or not, but 25000 years of hetrosexual marriages seems to pass the test as to working. Besides it seems gay couples are self limiting as they cannot reproduce with out a different sex partner. Just a thought.


The next time you have a thought, I strongly suggest you keep it to yourself.
 
2013-04-20 08:02:39 PM  

ChubbyTiger: RodneyToady: Given the retractions for methodological problems (including downright falsifying data) that has been occurring in the social sciences, this is a fair request.

No. No it is not. The paper may have been crap and the reviewers may be idiots, but that is no reason to screw with the system of anonymous reviewers. Anonymous reviews are absolutely necessary to the academic review process. While they aren't perfect, obviously, allowing reviewers to be unmasked would totally undermine the whole process. If the publisher (Elsevier, which sucks too), wants to blacklist the reviewers, I'm fine with it. But this hack journalist had no idea what he's doing and should STFU and get back to his muckraking.


I agree, to some extent. It's not totally an either or thing. Reviewers should never be selected for political reasons, or afraid of giving a good review because of politics. I can easily see where a reviewer might feel pressured to give a good review for a terrible study. So how about turning over all communications and blanking out the reviewers names? I think this satisfies everyone. The important thing is that research done at a University is public record and that includes all communications. The integrity of the peer review process must be maintained, and that means anonymity to everyone but the publishers, so black out the names and send out the records.

The journalist is doing no wrong. He has every right to those records. Every word of them. Every email and every data point. He does not have a right tot he reviewers names, just what they said.
 
2013-04-20 08:04:00 PM  
I would be upset if there was any real science involved.
 
2013-04-20 08:22:00 PM  
the university denied his records request, arguing that the information he was seeking is the product of Elsevier, which publishes Social Science Research.

If the records belong to an independent publisher, they probably are exempt.
 
2013-04-20 08:24:30 PM  

That's what you get for publishing a study that doesn't support the left's agenda -- and they really DO need the names (and addresses) of the researchers.  How else will they be able to picket and throw eggs at the researchers' children at school?

As a public study, the data should be made available, including researcher comments of the peer-review process.  All names and personally identifying information, however, should be redacted.

 
2013-04-20 08:36:14 PM  
Elsevier is involved. They are scum.
 
2013-04-20 08:47:03 PM  

Ennuipoet: maxalt: Ennuipoet: maxalt: Yea just about, going back to prehistoric days just from artifacts.

[i0.kym-cdn.com image 604x453]

Why what a genius you turn out to be, and sooo original, I await on your next stolen insult with the greatest of anticipation. On your  recommended reading list  "Insults for the Complete Idiot", but don't worry it uses small words and has many pictures.

[www.preparationh.com image 371x167]
There you go, and let me add another one
[firedaily.com image 299x223]

There, are we happy now?


Your are getting better still not on target though. The problem here and it is not just you is that you all went to the government indoctrination centers public schools. Although global warming studies have been shown to be falsified, no one here will believe it. That the government is not your friend and no one believes it, that we are waging wars for oil was wrong when Bush did it but it is OK when Obama does it.  Most people here don't look behind the curtain to see who is pulling the strings. I have done so much in my life, owned businesses, got patents, designed equipment to help clean the air, make cars get better gas mileage. Designed computer hard drives, before you had even seen a computer. I'm telling you that if you continue scratching each others backs and praising each other and the government you will be sorry in the end. Government is nothing but force there is no in between, we can not fly with out having the government giving us an anal probe. And now what useless measure will be next after Boston? The government had the guy years ago and let him go when people had told the government he was dangerous, do you think that was a mistake?.If it was the people who freed him should be fired, and I hate to think what if it wasn't a mistake. I succeed in spite of the government putting road blocks in my way. Now the have universal health care, no company is going to let people work more than 30 hours, I know I would not if I still had my businesses. A business is out to make money, not to give people jobs. When I owned businesses I paid my workers usually more than I paid myself, because I needed high skilled workers and I wanted them to be there for me when the time arrived. But I did not pay the kid who cleaned the shop high dollar, I paid him minimum wage because that is all he was worth to me. If I had to buy the kid health care I would have fired him and cleaned the shop myself. I did not go into business to make sure someone had a job, I like every other business owner went into business to make money for myself. I took all the risks so I deserve all the gains, you can sit around complaining that the world is not fair, and you are correct. But the decisions one makes can make it close to fair. My Grandfather Papa, who earned a fortune in his life and died poor because he gave it all away told me the best piece of advise I ever got from anyone. He said "You are where you are because of decisions you made in the past" Wait to have children until you can afford to give your children ever chance to make it in life. Kids need a permanent home, two loving involved parents. Children should never have a worry in their lives if you as a parent can ease their worries. Well I see my soapbox is starting to wobble under my weight and I have ranted enough. Oh to answer the question as to why I am not out making money now? I had two heart attacks,several strokes and survived the West Nine Virus all in a two year period. But don't pity me tell me where I am full of it. Also that was a good insult brought a smile to my face, but I'll never admit it.
 
2013-04-20 08:48:05 PM  

czetie: maxalt: Wow I don't care if some one is gay or not, but 25000 years of hetrosexual marriages seems to pass the test as to working. Besides it seems gay couples are self limiting as they cannot reproduce with out a different sex partner. Just a thought.

The next time you have a thought, I strongly suggest you keep it to yourself.


Don't read me if you don't care for me no one has a gun to your head.
 
2013-04-20 08:55:56 PM  

maxalt: Ennuipoet: maxalt: Ennuipoet: maxalt: Yea just about, going back to prehistoric days just from artifacts.

[i0.kym-cdn.com image 604x453]

Why what a genius you turn out to be, and sooo original, I await on your next stolen insult with the greatest of anticipation. On your  recommended reading list  "Insults for the Complete Idiot", but don't worry it uses small words and has many pictures.

[www.preparationh.com image 371x167]
There you go, and let me add another one
[firedaily.com image 299x223]

There, are we happy now?

Your are getting better still not on target though. The problem here and it is not just you is that you all went to the government indoctrination centers public schools. Although global warming studies have been shown to be falsified, no one here will believe it. That the government is not your friend and no one believes it, that we are waging wars for oil was wrong when Bush did it but it is OK when Obama does it.  Most people here don't look behind the curtain to see who is pulling the strings. I have done so much in my life, owned businesses, got patents, designed equipment to help clean the air, make cars get better gas mileage. Designed computer hard drives, before you had even seen a computer. I'm telling you that if you continue scratching each others backs and praising each other and the government you will be sorry in the end. Government is nothing but force there is no in between, we can not fly with out having the government giving us an anal probe. And now what useless measure will be next after Boston? The government had the guy years ago and let him go when people had told the government he was dangerous, do you think that was a mistake?.If it was the people who freed him should be fired, and I hate to think what if it wasn't a mistake. I succeed in spite of the government putting road blocks in my way. Now the have universal health care, no company is going to let people work more than 30 hours, I know I would not if I still had my businesses. A business is out to make money, not to give people jobs. When I owned businesses I paid my workers usually more than I paid myself, because I needed high skilled workers and I wanted them to be there for me when the time arrived. But I did not pay the kid who cleaned the shop high dollar, I paid him minimum wage because that is all he was worth to me. If I had to buy the kid health care I would have fired him and cleaned the shop myself. I did not go into business to make sure someone had a job, I like every other business owner went into business to make money for myself. I took all the risks so I deserve all the gains, you can sit around complaining that the world is not fair, and you are correct. But the decisions one makes can make it close to fair. My Grandfather Papa, who earned a fortune in his life and died poor because he gave it all away told me the best piece of advise I ever got from anyone. He said "You are where you are because of decisions you made in the past" Wait to have children until you can afford to give your children ever chance to make it in life. Kids need a permanent home, two loving involved parents. Children should never have a worry in their lives if you as a parent can ease their worries. Well I see my soapbox is starting to wobble under my weight and I have ranted enough. Oh to answer the question as to why I am not out making money now? I had two heart attacks,several strokes and survived the West Nine Virus all in a two year period. But don't pity me tell me where I am full of it. Also that was a good insult brought a smile to my face, but I'll never admit it.


TL;DR

Though now I wonder if you're barking mad?
 
2013-04-20 09:20:49 PM  

maxalt: Wow I don't care if some one is gay or not, but 25000 years of hetrosexual marriages seems to pass the test as to working. Besides it seems gay couples are self limiting as they cannot reproduce with out a different sex partner. Just a thought.


Hint: Heterosexual marriages produce homosexual children all the time.  So much for "self-limiting".

Second hint: We allow heterosexual couples to get married even if they cannot have children, or choose not to.  The ability to produce children has no bearing on the validity or quality of a marriage.
 
2013-04-20 09:21:46 PM  

maxalt: Wow I don't care if some one is gay or not, but 25000 years of hetrosexual marriages seems to pass the test as to working. Besides it seems gay couples are self limiting as they cannot reproduce with out a different sex partner. Just a thought.


Must've been a relief to get that number out of your ass.
 
2013-04-20 09:24:36 PM  

Ennuipoet: maxalt: Ennuipoet: maxalt: Ennuipoet: maxalt: Yea just about, going back to prehistoric days just from artifacts.

[i0.kym-cdn.com image 604x453]

Why what a genius you turn out to be, and sooo original, I await on your next stolen insult with the greatest of anticipation. On your  recommended reading list  "Insults for the Complete Idiot", but don't worry it uses small words and has many pictures.

[www.preparationh.com image 371x167]
There you go, and let me add another one
[firedaily.com image 299x223]

There, are we happy now?

Your are getting better still not on target though. The problem here and it is not just you is that you all went to the government indoctrination centers public schools. Although global warming studies have been shown to be falsified, no one here will believe it. That the government is not your friend and no one believes it, that we are waging wars for oil was wrong when Bush did it but it is OK when Obama does it.  Most people here don't look behind the curtain to see who is pulling the strings. I have done so much in my life, owned businesses, got patents, designed equipment to help clean the air, make cars get better gas mileage. Designed computer hard drives, before you had even seen a computer. I'm telling you that if you continue scratching each others backs and praising each other and the government you will be sorry in the end. Government is nothing but force there is no in between, we can not fly with out having the government giving us an anal probe. And now what useless measure will be next after Boston? The government had the guy years ago and let him go when people had told the government he was dangerous, do you think that was a mistake?.If it was the people who freed him should be fired, and I hate to think what if it wasn't a mistake. I succeed in spite of the government putting road blocks in my way. Now the have universal health care, no company is going to let people work more than 30 hours, I know I would not if I stil ...


The Great Wall of Text: Keeping Barbarians out of Northern Farkistan for the pats 25,000 years.
 
2013-04-20 09:26:53 PM  

maxalt: Ennuipoet: maxalt: Ennuipoet: maxalt: Yea just about, going back to prehistoric days just from artifacts.

[i0.kym-cdn.com image 604x453]

Why what a genius you turn out to be, and sooo original, I await on your next stolen insult with the greatest of anticipation. On your  recommended reading list  "Insults for the Complete Idiot", but don't worry it uses small words and has many pictures.

[www.preparationh.com image 371x167]
There you go, and let me add another one
[firedaily.com image 299x223]

There, are we happy now?

Your are getting better still not on target though. The problem here and it is not just you is that you all went to the government indoctrination centers public schools. Although global warming studies have been shown to be falsified, no one here will believe it. That the government is not your friend and no one believes it, that we are waging wars for oil was wrong when Bush did it but it is OK when Obama does it.  Most people here don't look behind the curtain to see who is pulling the strings. I have done so much in my life, owned businesses, got patents, designed equipment to help clean the air, make cars get better gas mileage. Designed computer hard drives, before you had even seen a computer. I'm telling you that if you continue scratching each others backs and praising each other and the government you will be sorry in the end. Government is nothing but force there is no in between, we can not fly with out having the government giving us an anal probe. And now what useless measure will be next after Boston? The government had the guy years ago and let him go when people had told the government he was dangerous, do you think that was a mistake?.If it was the people who freed him should be fired, and I hate to think what if it wasn't a mistake. I succeed in spite of the government putting road blocks in my way. Now the have universal health care, no company is going to let people work more than 30 hours, I know I would not if I still had my ...


Good to see that cocaine's kicking in.
 
2013-04-20 09:28:16 PM  

maxalt: The problem here and it is not just you is that you all went to the government indoctrination centers public schools.


Timecube guy?   Is that you?
 
2013-04-20 09:32:31 PM  

maxalt: czetie: maxalt: Wow I don't care if some one is gay or not, but 25000 years of hetrosexual marriages seems to pass the test as to working. Besides it seems gay couples are self limiting as they cannot reproduce with out a different sex partner. Just a thought.

The next time you have a thought, I strongly suggest you keep it to yourself.

Don't read me if you don't care for me no one has a gun to your head.


Right back at ya, althole.
 
2013-04-20 09:33:26 PM  

Ennuipoet: Mentat: With all due respect to the journalist in question, fark off.  Science can handle itself.

This was my first reaction, but since it is a publicly funded University and these supposed to be public records then if the University will not produce them voluntarily they should be compelled to do so by the courts.

I suspect there is a turd in a file drawer which will demonstrate this study to be less than unbiased.


If you start down that path, there's no end to it.  This isn't the first time a paper like this has gone out and it won't be the last.  But the mechanisms in place ensure that eventually, the truth will come to light.  Look at the austerity Excel paper for proof.  If we start down this path, there will be no end to it.  It's bad enough that we have Sarah Palin complaining about spending money on fruit fly research (which just happens to be the basis of the fields of genetics and evolutionary development), but if this goes through, every crank and ideologue in the country will start lobbing lawsuits at universities every time a paper is published that they don't like.  The system works.  Let it.
 
2013-04-20 09:39:33 PM  

Mentat: Ennuipoet: Mentat: With all due respect to the journalist in question, fark off.  Science can handle itself.

This was my first reaction, but since it is a publicly funded University and these supposed to be public records then if the University will not produce them voluntarily they should be compelled to do so by the courts.

I suspect there is a turd in a file drawer which will demonstrate this study to be less than unbiased.

If you start down that path, there's no end to it.  This isn't the first time a paper like this has gone out and it won't be the last.  But the mechanisms in place ensure that eventually, the truth will come to light.  Look at the austerity Excel paper for proof.  If we start down this path, there will be no end to it.  It's bad enough that we have Sarah Palin complaining about spending money on fruit fly research (which just happens to be the basis of the fields of genetics and evolutionary development), but if this goes through, every crank and ideologue in the country will start lobbing lawsuits at universities every time a paper is published that they don't like.  The system works.  Let it.


That's a fair call, I can see the well oiled incline of which you speak.
 
2013-04-20 09:43:52 PM  

Ennuipoet: maxalt: Yea just about, going back to prehistoric days just from artifacts.

[i0.kym-cdn.com image 604x453]


The guy announces what he is right there in his login.
 
2013-04-20 09:51:41 PM  
Whatever the open records laws in Florida dictate, the university and researcher are required to comply with any open record request that falls within the letter of the law.  This really should not be in question.

As for the reporter, while it seems he MAY have a political agenda, as long as his open records request falls within the letter of the law, then he has every right to expect the requested records.

I do think however, and this would apply to any reporter/article trying to refute the findings of an "academic study" the reporter should at a minimum provide a link to any "expert's" bio so the readers could judge the veracity of any counter claims.
 
2013-04-20 09:54:02 PM  

chimp_ninja: maxalt: Wow I don't care if some one is gay or not, but 25000 years of hetrosexual marriages seems to pass the test as to working. Besides it seems gay couples are self limiting as they cannot reproduce with out a different sex partner. Just a thought.

Hint: Heterosexual marriages produce homosexual children all the time.  So much for "self-limiting".

Second hint: We allow heterosexual couples to get married even if they cannot have children, or choose not to.  The ability to produce children has no bearing on the validity or quality of a marriage.


I dunno, my childless aunt and uncle seem way more happy than my parents ever did...
 
2013-04-20 09:57:38 PM  
Ok seriously I hate people who use caps and bold to make a point but here it is justified

SOCIOLOGY IS NOT A SCIENCE!!!
 
2013-04-20 10:06:42 PM  

maxalt: Ennuipoet: maxalt: Ennuipoet: maxalt: Yea just about, going back to prehistoric days just from artifacts.

[i0.kym-cdn.com image 604x453]

Why what a genius you turn out to be, and sooo original, I await on your next stolen insult with the greatest of anticipation. On your  recommended reading list  "Insults for the Complete Idiot", but don't worry it uses small words and has many pictures.

[www.preparationh.com image 371x167]
There you go, and let me add another one
[firedaily.com image 299x223]

There, are we happy now?

Your are getting better still not on target though. The problem here and it is not just you is that you all went to the government indoctrination centers public schools. Although global warming studies have been shown to be falsified, no one here will believe it. That the government is not your friend and no one believes it, that we are waging wars for oil was wrong when Bush did it but it is OK when Obama does it.  Most people here don't look behind the curtain to see who is pulling the strings. I have done so much in my life, owned businesses, got patents, designed equipment to help clean the air, make cars get better gas mileage. Designed computer hard drives, before you had even seen a computer. I'm telling you that if you continue scratching each others backs and praising each other and the government you will be sorry in the end. Government is nothing but force there is no in between, we can not fly with out having the government giving us an anal probe. And now what useless measure will be next after Boston? The government had the guy years ago and let him go when people had told the government he was dangerous, do you think that was a mistake?.If it was the people who freed him should be fired, and I hate to think what if it wasn't a mistake. I succeed in spite of the government putting road blocks in my way. Now the have universal health care, no company is going to let people work more than 30 hours, I know I would not if I still had my ...


i.qkme.me
 
2013-04-20 10:24:23 PM  

jpo2269: As for the reporter, while it seems he MAY have a political agenda, as long as his open records request falls within the letter of the law, then he has every right to expect the requested records.


No may about it but at least Becker is open about his political agenda unlike Mark Regnerus or the people over at  Elsevier who gave this paper a suspiciously speedy green light. That noted, yeah, turning the records over sans the names of the peer reviewers works for me.

fta: In 2011, Becker went undercover at a Christian counseling clinic co-owned by Rep. Michele Bachmann (R-Minn.) and her husband, Marcus, posing as a conflicted gay man seeking therapy to change his sexual orientation to heterosexual.

That was pretty cool.
 
2013-04-20 11:32:24 PM  

Old enough to know better: maxalt: Wow I don't care if some one is gay or not, but 25000 years of hetrosexual marriages seems to pass the test as to working. Besides it seems gay couples are self limiting as they cannot reproduce with out a different sex partner. Just a thought.

Must've been a relief to get that number out of your ass.


Ha! +1
 
2013-04-20 11:40:48 PM  
Is maxalt skinnyhead? Am I late to the game, or is it just coincidence that neither of them have a particularly good grasp of the English language, can never support their points with facts, and seem genuinely ridiculous? Or are they both merely conservative trolls?...

Deep thoughts with skinnyhead.jpg?
 
2013-04-20 11:44:10 PM  

Relatively Obscure: maxalt: Ennuipoet: maxalt: Ennuipoet: maxalt: Yea just about, going back to prehistoric days just from artifacts.

[i0.kym-cdn.com image 604x453]

Why what a genius you turn out to be, and sooo original, I await on your next stolen insult with the greatest of anticipation. On your  recommended reading list  "Insults for the Complete Idiot", but don't worry it uses small words and has many pictures.

[www.preparationh.com image 371x167]
There you go, and let me add another one
[firedaily.com image 299x223]

There, are we happy now?

Your are getting better still not on target though. The problem here and it is not just you is that you all went to the government indoctrination centers public schools. Although global warming studies have been shown to be falsified, no one here will believe it. That the government is not your friend and no one believes it, that we are waging wars for oil was wrong when Bush did it but it is OK when Obama does it.  Most people here don't look behind the curtain to see who is pulling the strings. I have done so much in my life, owned businesses, got patents, designed equipment to help clean the air, make cars get better gas mileage. Designed computer hard drives, before you had even seen a computer. I'm telling you that if you continue scratching each others backs and praising each other and the government you will be sorry in the end. Government is nothing but force there is no in between, we can not fly with out having the government giving us an anal probe. And now what useless measure will be next after Boston? The government had the guy years ago and let him go when people had told the government he was dangerous, do you think that was a mistake?.If it was the people who freed him should be fired, and I hate to think what if it wasn't a mistake. I succeed in spite of the government putting road blocks in my way. Now the have universal health care, no company is going to let people work more than 30 hours, I know I would not if I stil ...


Don't do drugs since ≈ 1970 then just pot, got no use for them just wastes time and money. I see you will stay in your little world. I think of the world as a challenge and I want to win. I don't have use for negativity around me. Everyone can say "It can't be done", but successful people say "How can I do it and make some money at the same time and if possible help my fellow man". If you want to stay wandering around in the bushes up to you I guess I miss judged your talent and ambition. Any way good luck on your journey.
 
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