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(SanDiegoUnionTribune)   Here's how to take the law into your own hands: Neighbors frustrated with stubborn city engineers put up their own stop signs   (utsandiego.com) divider line 74
    More: Cool, stop signs, Point Loma  
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12788 clicks; posted to Main » on 18 Apr 2013 at 4:57 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-04-18 08:39:33 AM
Google clearly supports traffic laws that are less restrictive.


i.imgur.com
i.imgur.com
 
2013-04-18 08:50:50 AM
All I can think of is the "Why the fork not" story from a year or so ago....
 
2013-04-18 08:53:42 AM
 
2013-04-18 08:56:39 AM

MugzyBrown: I don't know why Americans are obsessed with signs and stop signs.

My wife's home town in Argentina is a city of about 600,000.  A large percentage of the intersections have no lights or stop signs... works pretty well with a good deal of traffic.


Once you've driven in any country other than the USA, you suddenly realize how grossly inefficient intersections are in the US.  Both with lights and stop signs.

Traffic doesn't flow in the US, it sits and waits at lights for no one.  Or it stops 30 cars on the main drag to let 1 guy from the cross street in.  People in other countries drive responsive to the other cars around them.  People in the US drive oblivious to the other cars around them, but responsive to the traffic signals.

Take for instance left hand turns at signals in Germany.  Dedicated left-hand turn signals are almost non-existent.  Why? Cause they're grossly inefficient.  Instead, when there are small gaps in oncoming traffic, people make the left-hand turn (and don't dilly dally when doing it).  However, there is no screeching of tires or horn blowing from the oncoming traffic.  The oncoming traffic merely slows down giving the guy enough time to make the left hand turn. Why? Cause it's expected.  But if you tried that in the US there's a 90% chance you'd get T-boned cause the oncoming traffic doesn't expect you to squeeze in a turn, or just isn't paying attention to you altogether.
 
2013-04-18 09:38:25 AM
Stupidly "helpful" people strike again.
 
2013-04-18 09:48:05 AM
I live on the corner of a sorta weird intersection, the yield sign on the right turn west needs to be changed to a stop sign, they also need to put in a begin two way sign across the street, i see people driving down the wrong side of that street every single day.
 
2013-04-18 10:27:28 AM

serial_crusher: So, I can just ignore all signs in that neighborhood, since I don't know which ones are real and which aren't?  I'll get right on that.


This is actually closer to the truth than you think.

People (usually "for the children!" Types) think that stop signs are magical devices that cause drivers to obey speed limits and drive safely. The problem is that when stop signs are installed in places where they aren't warranted, people tend to ignore them, and the reduced impact of the signs carries over to other signs, even ones that are warranted.

People try to use stop signs to make drivers slow down, but unless the stop sign meets strict engineering criteria, it actually results in even worse driver behavior (rolling through stops, speeding between stop signs out f frustration, ignoring well-placed stop signs, etc...)

TL;DR - stop signs have a very specific purpose, and when used for other purposes tend to actually make a bad situation worse.
 
2013-04-18 10:34:39 AM

SuperDuper28: Well that's why they have traffic engineers that get paid money to see which signs are appropriate. If they say no stop sign then that means the traffic flow and the design of the street doesn't warrant a stop sign.

Signs on private property aren't binding either. That includes business and residential.


Think of the children! Somebody's kid is going to get killed unless a magical red sign is out up! You monster
 
2013-04-18 10:42:44 AM

durbnpoisn: WhiskeyBoy: I've seen this image in a few places around the internet.  Not sure if true.

[img705.imageshack.us image 750x408]

It is true.  And it happened in my neighborhood a few years ago.  I don't know who put up the signs.  But they had them at every single cross street for a 1/4 mile stretch on one road, that happens to be loaded with kids.  They were there for a few months.  Then they suddenly disappeared.

Around here though, it's more common for people to erect speed bumps to slow the traffic.


I prefer spikes.
 
2013-04-18 12:06:49 PM

italie: Yeah...I can't see the local law enforcement having a problem with that at all......

CSB:
"Vandals" used to get silly with a stop sign near my house. First it was painted green, and the word GO was written in white lettering. Then around Halloween, it turned into a pumpkin. Christmas time it was painted with a decorative wreath. This went on for about a year, each time the city put up a brand new sign a few days later. It stopped shortly after a fake camera was put up on a power pole nearby.


My friends and I swiped a sign that read "Slow Children at Play."

/punctuation, it matters
//buddy still has it 13 years later
 
2013-04-18 12:08:37 PM
faos.imageg.net

Some helicopter mom in my neighborhood keeps putting one of these goddamn things in the MIDDLE OF THE FARKING STREET...it's not a road I normally travel, but if it were I don't know if I could resist the temptation to plow right over the stupid thing...
 
ZAZ [TotalFark]
2013-04-18 12:25:54 PM
Loaf's Tray

There are at least two of those within a mile of me, almost always hiding in front of a parked car where it is invisible except for maybe a trace of yellow corner. I hope for a chance to run one over. No luck yet.
 
2013-04-18 12:49:01 PM
Forget putting up signs.... I'll put up a toll both and make some cash.
 
2013-04-18 01:40:37 PM
I know in Maryland signs on private property are binding. If you run a stop sign on mall property and cause an accident youre in trouble. This happend when I was a kid and a guy hurt a bunch of people because he was too busy to stop and said the stop sign was not legal yada yada. The law spanked him good when they brought up the statute that it was.

In my neighborhood we had a state rep, on his street there were speed bumps, none on any other street though.
 
2013-04-18 01:51:39 PM

Loaf's Tray: [faos.imageg.net image 500x500]

Some helicopter mom in my neighborhood keeps putting one of these goddamn things in the MIDDLE OF THE FARKING STREET...it's not a road I normally travel, but if it were I don't know if I could resist the temptation to plow right over the stupid thing...


One of my friends used to live at the end of a long cul de sac and his neighbors were that type.  I'd come barreling in doing a whole 25 mph and they would yell at me to slow down while making the accompanying hand gestures.  This is a very wide strait residential street with no obstructions on the side of the road or anywhere a kid might stumble from.

One time they're having a party or something and they have like 30 farking people gingerly walking down the middle of the road.  I slow down a bit and cover the brake and this one asshat tries to prove a point by jumping in front of my car.  They thing was I didn't even have to stop or slow down and just drove around him at speed.  The look on his face was priceless.

Well, the HOA somehow got in a tizzy about people 'speeding', so my friend asked me to go slow to appease his neighbortards.  Next time I drove down that road I slowed to a crawl.  Guess what happened?  The copter moms gave me dirty looks for driving too slow and complained about that, thinking I must want to kiddiddle their children.  Why aren't these people ever inside?

Meanwhile the posted limit is 25mph, what I had been doing before.  Some people.
 
2013-04-18 02:11:34 PM

wingnut396: Tenatra: Just come to my neighborhood, hell make that nearly any residential neighborhood in Sedalia, Mo.

I've been there.  I see no reason to go back.


Missouri State Fair is the only reason people come here. I like how some of the historic downtown has been preserved (as well as some of the larger homes from the early 1900s) but that's all we got going for us. I'm going to flee sometime within the year but not sure exactly where I want to move to yet.
 
TKM
2013-04-18 02:14:34 PM
It is a profoundly wealthy neighborhood, lots of soccer mom entitlement nonsense.
 
2013-04-18 02:30:40 PM
Im going to say this once. Having been a small town elected official. Stop signs like traffic lights are designed to regulate the flow of traffic and access to roads NOT  to get asshats to slow down.  Look the people in TFA did the right thing by going to the local government but  jebus you cannot have every interesection in a town be a four way stop that is just stupid. If there are a lot of accidents or  schools or  parks then sure because you need to provide for pededstrians and you can make exceptions if the traffic doesn't warrant this.  If you really feel the need to slow down traffic consider traffic circles or speed bumps but stop making things worse by putting up stupid stop signs where they are not needed.
 
ZAZ [TotalFark]
2013-04-18 02:47:35 PM
Thrakkorzog

Some people set up voluntary tolls on public roads to raise money for charity. I have seen that done on Main Street in Lee, Massachusetts and on NY route 22A in the Catskills. They don't use a proper toll booth with a gate.


groppet

The law of my state, and probably of most states, says you can still be considered at fault for running an unenforceable stop sign and crashing into somebody who expected to have right of way. At fault means financially liable, possibly guilty of reckless driving, but not guilty of running a stop sign.
 
2013-04-18 03:14:48 PM

zamboni: Well, since you get to put up your own signs as you see fit, I guess they won't mind if I slap up a few of my own.

Of course, the speed limit is too low, so a few 70mph signs should do the trick to improve traffic flow. Hey, people got to get to where they are going... right? Maybe a few "douchebag" crossing signs too... I'm still working on the design for that one.


In a douchebag crossing, the car has the right of way and the pedestrian should learn to move.
 
2013-04-18 03:33:10 PM

ZAZ: Some people set up voluntary tolls on public roads


They do that around here too, but the difference is we call it panhandling and it's illegal.
 
2013-04-18 03:52:20 PM

zamboni: Of course, the speed limit is too low, so a few 70mph signs should do the trick to improve traffic flow.


Someone has painted one of our 30mph signs to 3000mph. Sadly, no one attempted to do ~Mach 4.
 
2013-04-18 08:20:38 PM

Tenatra: zamboni: Of course, the speed limit is too low, so a few 70mph signs should do the trick to improve traffic flow.

Someone has painted one of our 30mph signs to 3000mph. Sadly, no one attempted to do ~Mach 4.


Negative, Maverick... the pattern is full!

Goddammit!!!
 
2013-04-19 02:46:57 PM

groppet: I know in Maryland signs on private property are binding. If you run a stop sign on mall property and cause an accident youre in trouble. This happend when I was a kid and a guy hurt a bunch of people because he was too busy to stop and said the stop sign was not legal yada yada. The law spanked him good when they brought up the statute that it was.

In my neighborhood we had a state rep, on his street there were speed bumps, none on any other street though.


If you fail to yield, you break the law in any of the 50 states, whether you're legally required to stop or not. An illegal sign doesn't give you a green light to plow through anyone coming the other way.

nickerj1: Take for instance left hand turns at signals in Germany. Dedicated left-hand turn signals are almost non-existent. Why? Cause they're grossly inefficient. Instead, when there are small gaps in oncoming traffic, people make the left-hand turn (and don't dilly dally when doing it). However, there is no screeching of tires or horn blowing from the oncoming traffic. The oncoming traffic merely slows down giving the guy enough time to make the left hand turn. Why? Cause it's expected. But if you tried that in the US there's a 90% chance you'd get T-boned cause the oncoming traffic doesn't expect you to squeeze in a turn, or just isn't paying attention to you altogether.


You couldn't remove the protected left from many US city traffic intersections, the grid system and heavy traffic across 3+ lanes makes it much too dangerous, especially with more than one turn lane. However, you could get rid of the odd notion that protected lefts have to exist in a vacuum, rather than allowing unprotected lefts while the main road is green, and only switching to protected left if there are still cars over the sensor when the through traffic turns red. And of course, changing the timings based on the time of day, which so many old hidebound traffic engineers resolutely refuse to put any time or effort on.

Traffic engineering is a weird discipline. Fads come and go multiple times over the years. I grew up in a city that did a good job of allowing traffic through, but Bay Area transplants started causing accidents so they've been removing that. Moved to one with purely protected lefts for one lane of traffic. Just got back from Las Vegas, where they shrug and allow unprotected lefts against 5 lanes of Las Vegas Blvd on some intersections, although they have their own weird traffic patterns as soon as you leave the strip.
 
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