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(Yahoo)   If you found a small amount of cash in a stray wallet on a park bench in New York City, would you take it? The NYPD hopes you do   (news.yahoo.com ) divider line
    More: Asinine, New York Police Department, chess tactics, New York Civil Liberties Union, possession of stolen property, habitual offender, old single  
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19877 clicks; posted to Main » on 14 Apr 2013 at 3:55 PM (3 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-04-14 04:24:04 PM  
RedPhoenix122: GAT_00: bronyaur1: WTF is up with the NYPD? They clearly have WAY too many resources and a truly bad attitude toward their citizens.

Look up the Lower Manhattan Security Initiative.

I'm afraid to.

It's fairly disturbing.  The NYPD basically has permanent martial law capabilities in lower Manhattan and it's extending north.  Plus use of basically every private security camera into a single feed to watch people all the time.
 
2013-04-14 04:25:11 PM  

Hector Remarkable: Like a foolish fool, I approached a police officer and pointed out her situation. I'll never forget the cop either, because he was only like five foot-six and his nameplate read "Cocks". Officer Cocks seemed real annoyed with me,  and suddenly a deluge of medical and police personnel appeared out of literally farking nowhere and swarmed around me and the scene. They propped the lady up and field tested her in front of me. She said she was fine, and they sent her on her way. A tall, stern looking medical type doctor man in a white body suit got in my face and loudly inquired, "Are you satisfied?"  I mumbled, "sure", not really fully grasping it yet.


I'm suspicious of your story.

It's more believable that NYPD would have beat the fark out of you or arrested you for interfering with their sting than that they'd bother to have a fake doctor on hand.
 
2013-04-14 04:25:24 PM  

nekom: These days, I'd be more worried that cops in such a situation would call in the bomb squad to detonate the `suspicious abandoned package'


NYPD don't give a shiat about abandoned packages (unless they planted them there themselves).
 
2013-04-14 04:25:45 PM  
If you've got to make crimes happen for an arrest, you've got too many cops on the payroll.
 
2013-04-14 04:30:17 PM  
Did someone say "Entrapment?"
upload.wikimedia.org
 
2013-04-14 04:33:05 PM  
I found a phone in the park. Good thing I wasn't in a hurry and was able to call the number under "home" right where I found it and didn't do it while continuing to walk to the restaurant I was headed to. I could have ended up in jail.
 
2013-04-14 04:33:14 PM  

The Pope of Manwich Village: Did someone say "Entrapment?"
[upload.wikimedia.org image 480x240]


Yesh
 
2013-04-14 04:33:27 PM  

Mugato: Isn't there a precedent here in the case of Finders vs Keepers?


Actually, it's Keepers v. Weepers...common mistake :)
 
2013-04-14 04:35:00 PM  

fnordfocus: Hector Remarkable: Like a foolish fool, I approached a police officer and pointed out her situation. I'll never forget the cop either, because he was only like five foot-six and his nameplate read "Cocks". Officer Cocks seemed real annoyed with me,  and suddenly a deluge of medical and police personnel appeared out of literally farking nowhere and swarmed around me and the scene. They propped the lady up and field tested her in front of me. She said she was fine, and they sent her on her way. A tall, stern looking medical type doctor man in a white body suit got in my face and loudly inquired, "Are you satisfied?"  I mumbled, "sure", not really fully grasping it yet.

I'm suspicious of your story.

It's more believable that NYPD would have beat the fark out of you or arrested you for interfering with their sting than that they'd bother to have a fake doctor on hand.


Well it's a true story. It was Rudy's New York then. And I think the guy was a real doctor, although he looked more like some German scientist from a Volkswagen commercial. It was all very odd. I also remember distinctly the whole scene being joined by this guy who had been, for the previous minutes, seemingly uninvolved and changing a car tire across the street, and yet now stood conversing with the authorities. I really didn't know what was going on. That was a great summer in New York, though. Ended with a bang, too.
 
2013-04-14 04:39:12 PM  
A few years ago, during the day, I found a passport on the sidewalk while walking to a bar in an area that police regularly drive through. I took it and figured I'd flag down the first officer I saw and turn it in, which I did. The third degree I received from the officer convinced me to never do a good deed like that again. Should the same situation arise, I will walk right by that passport.
 
2013-04-14 04:39:14 PM  

louiedog: I found a phone in the park. Good thing I wasn't in a hurry and was able to call the number under "home" right where I found it and didn't do it while continuing to walk to the restaurant I was headed to. I could have ended up in jail.



You obviously noticed the phone, so you still could have been charged with "possession of stolen property" like the woman in TFA even if all you did was look at it and walk away.
 
2013-04-14 04:39:51 PM  

lordargent: SilentStrider: an argument could be made, not that I'm saying it would be successful in court

It wouldn't.

// unless they put a sign on the purse saying "free purse".


Leave the freepers out of this. ;)
 
2013-04-14 04:41:40 PM  
SO the NYPD is practicing NRA level idiocy?
 
2013-04-14 04:42:12 PM  

the ha ha guy: louiedog: I found a phone in the park. Good thing I wasn't in a hurry and was able to call the number under "home" right where I found it and didn't do it while continuing to walk to the restaurant I was headed to. I could have ended up in jail.


You obviously noticed the phone, so you still could have been charged with "possession of stolen property" like the woman in TFA even if all you did was look at it and walk away.


I probably shouldn't have done anything then. The guy who answered at home was a dick and annoyed with me for bothering him. He then called his wife who was in the park with their daughter, the owner of the phone, who swung by 5 minutes later and barely acknowledged my presence and gave me a forced sounding thank you.
 
2013-04-14 04:42:52 PM  
I found a purse on my way to school from work a few years back. Used the various IDs inside to track down the owner and sent her an email and a text half an hour later saying I had her purse.
 
2013-04-14 04:43:04 PM  

ArcadianRefugee: Because the cops didn't give instructions to pick up the item; the person did it on their own.


Myers' daughter, seeing that the driver left the car door open, went over and peered inside to see personal items that included what looked like a bundle of cash - in reality, a dollar bill wrapped around pieces of newspaper. The girl had called her mother over when another set of police officers suddenly pulled up in a van and forced them to the ground, according to Myers' account.

Sorry, I missed the part where they picked anything up.
 
SH
2013-04-14 04:44:49 PM  
10 years ago I found a wallet in the parking lot of the local Kwicky Mart. It had $40ish and the usual stuff. I picked it up, put it in my pocket, bought whatever I went there to buy and went home. I Googled the name on the DL, found a similar name a few neighborhoods over, and called. Nobody answered so I hung up (no message).

I didn't leave it with the cashiers at the Kwicky Mart for obvious reasons. Several hours later I got an anonymous call, the people I called earlier were calling the number on their caller ID. I asked if they had lost a wallet, they answered their son might have. Long story short, he was close enough to walk to my place and claim it, offered me the $40 in it because everything was still there, I declined. my good deed for the week.

So, in NYC I'd be behind bars for this according to how I read this article. At what point does this good deed become a crime? Isn't the real crime here the cops setting up such a ridiculous sting just to make their numbers look good?
 
2013-04-14 04:48:51 PM  

Popcorn Johnny: Not feeling any sympathy for people who take shiat that isn't theirs and then walk past uniformed officers without reporting it.


Some organization tried an experiment years ago where they turned over wallets with money in them to cops, don't remember where. Something like half the wallets either didn't get turned in or had no cash when they were. Maybe NYPD ought to try that too and see how well their own officers do. Maybe they'll even be prosecuted (yeah right).
 
2013-04-14 04:49:12 PM  

fredklein: ArcadianRefugee: Because the cops didn't give instructions to pick up the item; the person did it on their own.

Myers' daughter, seeing that the driver left the car door open, went over and peered inside to see personal items that included what looked like a bundle of cash - in reality, a dollar bill wrapped around pieces of newspaper. The girl had called her mother over when another set of police officers suddenly pulled up in a van and forced them to the ground, according to Myers' account.

Sorry, I missed the part where they picked anything up.


Myers' account in the article differs from the state's account that said she entered the car and took the property, as well as differing from her own statements to the court, where she said that she intended to safeguard the property for the "arrestee". The article also seems to imply they peered inside while the cops were still chasing the subject, while the court decision states that they officers had the "arrestee" in custody and then left with him, leaving his car unlocked.
 
2013-04-14 04:49:25 PM  

penthesilea: I've picked up wallets and taken them home to try to find the owner myself.  There's always DL or student IDs, membership cards, etc.
There was only one time that there wasn't enough info to figure out who the owner was and how to get a hold of them.  That's when I turn the item in.

Do police actually bother trying to get found wallets to their owners?  The huge inventory at Stolen Item auctions always gave the impression that once they caught the thief, that was the end of it.  Original owners were just SOL.


The police department I worked at would attempt to contact the owner if able. The owner had a certain length of time to pick it up before the item was pulled from L&F and either sold at auction or destroyed.
 
2013-04-14 04:49:47 PM  
Entrapment is coercing somebody into committing a crime.   That's not what's happening here.  This is the police arresting people who haven't committed any crime.

Mens rea test, biatches.
 
2013-04-14 04:49:55 PM  
Farking pigs.
 
2013-04-14 04:50:01 PM  

SH: 10 years ago I found a wallet in the parking lot of the local Kwicky Mart. It had $40ish and the usual stuff....

I didn't leave it with the cashiers at the Kwicky Mart for obvious reasons.


What's the "obvious" reason?
 
2013-04-14 04:50:22 PM  
TFA provides the cops' true intention with these stings:  to smoke out actual criminals who are wanted for other offenses. These expensive, elaborate stings are employed only when and where crimes are rising.

In terms of motive, it's like the North Carolina bill that mandates warrant checks and referrals to LE on all welfare applicants.
 
2013-04-14 04:51:11 PM  

Mentat: How the fark is this not entrapment?  It's one thing to leave a car or bike in a high crime area and see if someone tries to openly steal it.  But to put on these performances designed to attract the curiosity of bystanders and then nab them for checking things out?  How can that be legal?


Legal? Laws do not apply to police officers, they do what they want.
 
2013-04-14 04:53:51 PM  

the ha ha guy: I alone am best: Maybe you should steal shiat from peoples cars retard.

Try reading TFA


I can barely read what he wrote, I doubt he's literate enough to read the article.
 
2013-04-14 04:54:01 PM  

louiedog: the ha ha guy: louiedog: I found a phone in the park. Good thing I wasn't in a hurry and was able to call the number under "home" right where I found it and didn't do it while continuing to walk to the restaurant I was headed to. I could have ended up in jail.


You obviously noticed the phone, so you still could have been charged with "possession of stolen property" like the woman in TFA even if all you did was look at it and walk away.

I probably shouldn't have done anything then. The guy who answered at home was a dick and annoyed with me for bothering him. He then called his wife who was in the park with their daughter, the owner of the phone, who swung by 5 minutes later and barely acknowledged my presence and gave me a forced sounding thank you.


Sounds almost like the time I found a phone in a 7-11 parking lot.

It was about 2 in the morning and I was on a break from work when I found it laying in the parking lot. So I called the number marked as mom and left a message saying I found the phone and I was leaving it at the counter of 7-11. So I give it to the guy at the counter and he said that he would hold it for whoever comes for it, and I though that was the end of it. Two days later I stop in the 7-11 before I went to work. The guy at the counter was telling me that a mother and daughter came in to claim the phone and the teen aged daughter was screaming and insisting that it wasn't lost, that it was stolen from her, and they wanted to know who turned it in. These two nuts even managed to get a cop there to fill out a report and told the guy at the counter to tell me to contact him to answer some questions the next time he saw me. We had a good laugh about that and that was the last I thought about it.
 
2013-04-14 04:56:18 PM  

Candygram4Mongo: So I should stop picking up those nickels I find on the sidewalk?


So YOU'RE the motherfarker we've been looking for
...
 
2013-04-14 04:57:58 PM  

mutt: A few years ago, during the day, I found a passport on the sidewalk while walking to a bar in an area that police regularly drive through. I took it and figured I'd flag down the first officer I saw and turn it in, which I did. The third degree I received from the officer convinced me to never do a good deed like that again. Should the same situation arise, I will walk right by that passport.


What sort of questions did he ask?
 
2013-04-14 04:58:02 PM  
"No fines, no probation, no thirty days in jail. It's the hook. The hook for stealing, for murder, for arson, for treason, for rape, for being a peeping Tom. Break a law - any damn law at all - and it's the hook. Everybody can understand that, and San Lorenzo is the best-behaved country in the world."
 
2013-04-14 04:58:59 PM  
After RTFA,  I suspect that she or her daughter actually did grab the "cash", but since the whole bait scheme was so over the top/bullshiat, the judge threw it out, and rightfully so.

Note that TFA is peppered with phrases "According to Myers' account", "Myers recalled", and "the lawsuit says".

Not defending the NYPD in any way, shape, or form...they decided to stage a police chase? Really? REALLY?
 
2013-04-14 05:00:11 PM  

oh_please: .they decided to stage a police chase? Really? REALLY?


Yeah, that was the most bizarre part about it.  It would be cheaper and more effective to just use a bait car like other PD's do.
 
2013-04-14 05:01:45 PM  

The Evil Home Brewer: Don't blame the cops on the beat..... These are folks who are just making a living trying to keep order in a f*cked up society. Blame their superiors who assign them to these crappy stakeouts to bust others doing what simply comes naturally to a lot of people in a poor financial condition.

Bottom line? If it is yours, if it has value? Don't leave it unattended somewhere


The "she was asking for it by dressing like a slut" school of victim culpability.
 
2013-04-14 05:01:46 PM  
It's actually illegal to be in NYC. The rest is just a matter of selective enforcement..
 
2013-04-14 05:01:46 PM  

fredklein: ArcadianRefugee: Because the cops didn't give instructions to pick up the item; the person did it on their own.

Myers' daughter, seeing that the driver left the car door open, went over and peered inside to see personal items that included what looked like a bundle of cash - in reality, a dollar bill wrapped around pieces of newspaper. The girl had called her mother over when another set of police officers suddenly pulled up in a van and forced them to the ground, according to Myers' account.

Sorry, I missed the part where they picked anything up.


Bolded that for you.
 
2013-04-14 05:05:46 PM  

Kiwimann: oh_please: .they decided to stage a police chase? Really? REALLY?

Yeah, that was the most bizarre part about it.  It would be cheaper and more effective to just use a bait car like other PD's do.


I think somebody in the NYPD has a secret desire to be a Broadway producer.
 
2013-04-14 05:06:50 PM  

oh_please: After RTFA,  I suspect that she or her daughter actually did grab the "cash", but since the whole bait scheme was so over the top/bullshiat, the judge threw it out, and rightfully so.

Note that TFA is peppered with phrases "According to Myers' account", "Myers recalled", and "the lawsuit says".

Not defending the NYPD in any way, shape, or form...they decided to stage a police chase? Really? REALLY?


The police chase was the most amazing thing to me.  How many people did they put in danger racing multiple cars down a crowded NYC street to try to entice someone into stealing a twenty?
 
2013-04-14 05:10:22 PM  

boyd1031: Read the article the lady that was charged did not take anything she just looked in to the vehicle after her daughter asked her motther to come look at this. Neither daughter nor mother touched or took anything but yet charged the mother!


Yeah, read the article. The only reason they didn't take anything was because the police pulled up before they could. Do you really expect me to believe that it's normal behavior for people to go snooping in a car that's been left open and unattended?
 
2013-04-14 05:11:39 PM  

louiedog: I probably shouldn't have done anything then. The guy who answered at home was a dick and annoyed with me for bothering him. He then called his wife who was in the park with their daughter, the owner of the phone, who swung by 5 minutes later and barely acknowledged my presence and gave me a forced sounding thank you.


I found a wallet ten years ago and drove to the guys home and he had a similar response, an almost rude "thank you".  I found another wallet nearby and returned it anonymously to the guy's porch a few minutes later.  After reading this, I'll likely just leave it next time.  Finders weepers, losers cops.
 
2013-04-14 05:12:43 PM  

ArcadianRefugee: Mentat: How the fark is this not entrapment?  It's one thing to leave a car or bike in a high crime area and see if someone tries to openly steal it.  But to put on these performances designed to attract the curiosity of bystanders and then nab them for checking things out?  How can that be legal?

Because the cops didn't give instructions to pick up the item; the person did it on their own.

If a[n undercover] cop said, "Go grab that wallet" or "please take the bag from my car and hide it" then it would be entrapment.

Leaving bait =/= entrapment.


Except they didn't pick it up. They just walked over and looked at it. Didn't even touch it.
 
2013-04-14 05:12:58 PM  

Popcorn Johnny: boyd1031: Read the article the lady that was charged did not take anything she just looked in to the vehicle after her daughter asked her motther to come look at this. Neither daughter nor mother touched or took anything but yet charged the mother!

Yeah, read the article. The only reason they didn't take anything was because the police pulled up before they could. Do you really expect me to believe that it's normal behavior for people to go snooping in a car that's been left open and unattended?


Two cars race by you.  People get out and start running down the street, leaving one of the cars open.  Nobody has normal behavior for that situation because it's not a normal situation.  Why wouldn't someone go over check the car for a baby, somebody shot in the back seat, or God only knows what?
 
2013-04-14 05:13:16 PM  

Popcorn Johnny: boyd1031: Read the article the lady that was charged did not take anything she just looked in to the vehicle after her daughter asked her motther to come look at this. Neither daughter nor mother touched or took anything but yet charged the mother!

Yeah, read the article. The only reason they didn't take anything was because the police pulled up before they could. Do you really expect me to believe that it's normal behavior for people to go snooping in a car that's been left open and unattended?


So they didn't still anything or break any law.

They might go and look inside of a car that the door is opened and it was just involved in a car chase that ended with the driver getting out of the car and running.
 
2013-04-14 05:17:57 PM  
Years ago, when I was a senior in high school I found a wallet in the hallway.  There were some personal notes that were folded up, no cash but a drivers license.  The license belonged to a student in the class that I was walking to next.  So I went to class with the wallet.  She was in a panic and was looking for it.  I stopped her and handed it to her, told her exactly where I found it.  The teacher stopped her and told her to tell me thank you.

She turned me into the principal for stealing the cash that was already taken from the wallet before I even found it.  Now, my friend was with me when I found it so he knows that the cash (assuming that there was any) was not even there.  So I learned the lesson that no good deed ever goes unpunished and to never return a missing wallet.

Hell, I don't even return lost cellphones.  Of the two I found, one I texted all the female contacts and asked for pic of their boobs, including the one labeled 'mom'.  His daughter was a bit concerned.  To his wife, I just texted her a notice about knocking up a 16 y.o. girl.  I then tossed it into a lake.  Of the other, I just texted one of those text here to donate $10 to this charity.  I did it until the battery ran down.
 
2013-04-14 05:19:29 PM  

fredklein: ArcadianRefugee: Because the cops didn't give instructions to pick up the item; the person did it on their own.

Myers' daughter, seeing that the driver left the car door open, went over and peered inside to see personal items that included what looked like a bundle of cash - in reality, a dollar bill wrapped around pieces of newspaper. The girl had called her mother over when another set of police officers suddenly pulled up in a van and forced them to the ground, according to Myers' account.

Sorry, I missed the part where they picked anything up.


Me too! But then again I was speaking to entrapment, and pointed out that it STILL WOULDN'T BE ENTRAPMENT. False arrest? Quite possibly. As I stated. Try sticking to one argument at a time.

Whether or not their arrest was warranted does not change the fact that the situation was not one of entrapment. Period.
 
2013-04-14 05:20:19 PM  

SilentStrider: lordargent: Mentat: How the fark is this not entrapment?

For it to be entrapment, you have to be coerced into doing something you were not naturally inclined to do.

IE, there would basically have to be an undercover cop telling you to "take the purse", then you would say "no", and then the cop would say "come on dude, nobody is looking, take the purse and let's get some beers", and you finally cave in.

an argument could be made, not that I'm saying it would be successful in court (but it should be, imho), that if the police didn't put the wallet there, there would be no reason for you to commit a crime.


couldn't say, a cop killer, make the same argument?  "I couldn't/wouldn't have killed that cop if he wasn't there in my house serving that warrant...."
 
2013-04-14 05:22:50 PM  

Karac: Two cars race by you.  People get out and start running down the street, leaving one of the cars open.  Nobody has normal behavior for that situation because it's not a normal situation.  Why wouldn't someone go over check the car for a baby, somebody shot in the back seat, or God only knows what?


Walking by a car and looking inside and actually going inside and looking around aren't even close to being the same. Had the cops not blown their wad too early, they were going to take something.
 
2013-04-14 05:24:50 PM  

serial_crusher: SilentStrider: lordargent: Mentat: How the fark is this not entrapment?

For it to be entrapment, you have to be coerced into doing something you were not naturally inclined to do.

IE, there would basically have to be an undercover cop telling you to "take the purse", then you would say "no", and then the cop would say "come on dude, nobody is looking, take the purse and let's get some beers", and you finally cave in.

an argument could be made, not that I'm saying it would be successful in court (but it should be, imho), that if the police didn't put the wallet there, there would be no reason for you to commit a crime.

couldn't say, a cop killer, make the same argument?  "I couldn't/wouldn't have killed that cop if he wasn't there in my house serving that warrant...."


I guess that analogy falls short in that the wallet was placed there to test whether or not you'd steal it, whereas to cop serving the warrant wasn't just there to see whether or not you'd murder him.  So I'll head that argument off with a modified example:  There's a known serial rapist on the loose who targets a very specific type of woman, so the cops set up a sting operation with an undercover cop who meets the profile.  Suspect attempts to rape the cop, and she arrests him.  Did she commit entrapment?
 
2013-04-14 05:25:32 PM  

poot_rootbeer: Entrapment is coercing somebody into committing a crime.   That's not what's happening here.  This is the police arresting people who haven't committed any crime.

Mens rea test, biatches.


Don't you know, not committing a crime in NYC is illegal.
 
2013-04-14 05:26:07 PM  

Popcorn Johnny: Karac: Two cars race by you.  People get out and start running down the street, leaving one of the cars open.  Nobody has normal behavior for that situation because it's not a normal situation.  Why wouldn't someone go over check the car for a baby, somebody shot in the back seat, or God only knows what?

Walking by a car and looking inside and actually going inside and looking around aren't even close to being the same. Had the cops not blown their wad too early, they were going to take something.


So you admit they didn't take anything, and didn't commit any crime then?  Or is the NYPD now employing precognatives?
 
2013-04-14 05:27:01 PM  

Great Janitor: Years ago, when I was a senior in high school I found a wallet in the hallway.  There were some personal notes that were folded up, no cash but a drivers license.  The license belonged to a student in the class that I was walking to next.  So I went to class with the wallet.  She was in a panic and was looking for it.  I stopped her and handed it to her, told her exactly where I found it.  The teacher stopped her and told her to tell me thank you.

She turned me into the principal for stealing the cash that was already taken from the wallet before I even found it.  Now, my friend was with me when I found it so he knows that the cash (assuming that there was any) was not even there.  So I learned the lesson that no good deed ever goes unpunished and to never return a missing wallet.

Hell, I don't even return lost cellphones.  Of the two I found, one I texted all the female contacts and asked for pic of their boobs, including the one labeled 'mom'.  His daughter was a bit concerned.  To his wife, I just texted her a notice about knocking up a 16 y.o. girl.  I then tossed it into a lake.  Of the other, I just texted one of those text here to donate $10 to this charity.  I did it until the battery ran down.


So because someone was once a dick to you, you are 10 times the asshole they were.

Cool story, bro.
 
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