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(Daily Mail)   American Psychiatric Association new guidelines : A Three Year Old throws a temper tantrum? Mental Disorder. Five Year Old picks a scab? Mental Disorder. Sanity? Not in this book   (dailymail.co.uk) divider line 195
    More: Asinine, American Psychiatric Association, Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, mental disorders, The Daily Beast, sex addiction, DSM  
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9000 clicks; posted to Main » on 14 Apr 2013 at 1:45 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-04-14 01:30:44 AM  
Oh fun, it's another round of these articles again. I'll wait for the same copy-paste article in mid-May right before the new DSM or the end of May after some people "discover" that they believe everyone has a disorder now.
 
2013-04-14 01:46:34 AM  
Gotta drum up business somehow.
 
2013-04-14 01:50:22 AM  
THIS:

The whole "autism" and "depression" thing was the straw that broke the camel's back for me. Lack of discipline and being mopey are not mental disorders, and never will be.

Man up and take responsibilities, show initiative, and be yourself. That's all a person needs, and it worked perfectly well for me and millions of others.

Thank god my religion expressly forbids dealing with these quacks.
 
2013-04-14 01:50:26 AM  
What's my Fark addiction covered under?
 
2013-04-14 01:52:49 AM  
Reading Daily Fail?  Mental Disorder!
 
2013-04-14 01:53:22 AM  
When even some of the guys that wrote the DSM-IV thinks the DSM-V is little more than a farktarded handjob to pharma companies, there is very probably some truth to all the hate dumped upon it.
 
2013-04-14 01:53:26 AM  

fusillade762: What's my Fark addiction covered under?


Stockholm Syndrome.
 
2013-04-14 01:53:48 AM  
Anothernew criterion under obsessive-compulsive related disorders is skin-picking.

This applies to those who consistently pick blemishes, pimples or scabs and 'do extensive damage' to their body as a result.


In other words, you need to have already caused yourself significant physical damage, before a doctor would consider your repetitive self-injury to be an indicator of a mental disorder.

Article is as stupid and misleading as saying that the US executes dozens of people every year for wiggling their finger - without mentioning that the finger was wrapped around the trigger of a gun which was pointed at someone.
 
2013-04-14 01:53:54 AM  
 
2013-04-14 01:59:19 AM  
Lower the threshold, sell them the pills. It's the American way...
 
2013-04-14 02:00:39 AM  

CliChe Guevara: When even some of the guys that wrote the DSM-IV thinks the DSM-V is little more than a farktarded handjob to pharma companies, there is very probably some truth to all the hate dumped upon it.


rohar: Gotta drum up business somehow.


These.
 
2013-04-14 02:00:53 AM  
I could already guess that it was a bunch of hyperbole on the Daily Mail's part

.

super_grass: THIS:

The whole "autism" and "depression" thing was the straw that broke the camel's back for me. Lack of discipline and being mopey are not mental disorders, and never will be.

Man up and take responsibilities, show initiative, and be yourself. That's all a person needs, and it worked perfectly well for me and millions of others.

Thank god my religion expressly forbids dealing with these quacks.

Why the fark should we be getting psychiatry advice from a Scientologist?
 
2013-04-14 02:01:14 AM  
Well, it's hard to argue that hoarding is a separate disorder from OCD; that's been known for some time, since most of the behavioral markers are quite different. I'm still puzzled how and why so many people--doctors, parents and random people right here on Fark--think that very small children can be diagnosed with ANY mood disorder, much less treated with psychotropic drugs. Something like this:

He said the new diagnosis of 'disruptive mood dysregulation disorder'(DMDD) - a term used to describe children's temper tantrums combined with mood swings - is one of the most worrying entries
  isn't really worrying because kids can't have mood swings--they do--but that it's pretty much normal for ANYONE to have mood swings; and temper tantrums are how children learn to regulate their moods in the first place. It's only when you approach adulthood and your mood swings become really cataclysmic and you're still having uncontrollable temper tantrums that you MIGHT have a mental illness. And even then, it's probably not a cause for drugs unless there's just no other way to fix it.


What this smacks of to me isn't a conspiracy by psychiatrists and drug manufacturers; it's a consortium of worried parents who can't figure out why Junior isn't perfectly behaved 24/7; and a public who seems to feel that children should be perfectly behaved 24/7; and a society in general that thinks everyone should be cheerful and happy morning till night and feeling unhappy is some kind of serious aberration.

And I say this as someone with clinical bipolar depression that has to be medically controlled.
 
2013-04-14 02:01:48 AM  

AbbeySomeone: CliChe Guevara: When even some of the guys that wrote the DSM-IV thinks the DSM-V is little more than a farktarded handjob to pharma companies, there is very probably some truth to all the hate dumped upon it.

rohar: Gotta drum up business somehow.

These.


Says the anti-vaxer.
 
2013-04-14 02:02:01 AM  

super_grass: THIS:

Thank god my religion expressly forbids dealing with these quacks.


Lovely troll, really. I'm not sure whether you're just a jerk, or a "Christian Scientist" or  "Scientologist"-flavored jerk.
 
2013-04-14 02:02:37 AM  

RedPhoenix122: fusillade762: What's my Fark addiction covered under?

Stockholm Syndrome.


That was just beautiful.
*sniffle* *sniffle* /tears
 
2013-04-14 02:03:53 AM  

Gyrfalcon: Well, it's hard to argue that hoarding is a separate disorder from OCD; that's been known for some time, since most of the behavioral markers are quite different. I'm still puzzled how and why so many people--doctors, parents and random people right here on Fark--think that very small children can be diagnosed with ANY mood disorder, much less treated with psychotropic drugs. Something like this:

He said the new diagnosis of 'disruptive mood dysregulation disorder'(DMDD) - a term used to describe children's temper tantrums combined with mood swings - is one of the most worrying entries
  isn't really worrying because kids can't have mood swings--they do--but that it's pretty much normal for ANYONE to have mood swings; and temper tantrums are how children learn to regulate their moods in the first place. It's only when you approach adulthood and your mood swings become really cataclysmic and you're still having uncontrollable temper tantrums that you MIGHT have a mental illness. And even then, it's probably not a cause for drugs unless there's just no other way to fix it.


What this smacks of to me isn't a conspiracy by psychiatrists and drug manufacturers; it's a consortium of worried parents who can't figure out why Junior isn't perfectly behaved 24/7; and a public who seems to feel that children should be perfectly behaved 24/7; and a society in general that thinks everyone should be cheerful and happy morning till night and feeling unhappy is some kind of serious aberration.

And I say this as someone with clinical bipolar depression that has to be medically controlled.


That
 
2013-04-14 02:04:39 AM  
 
2013-04-14 02:07:09 AM  

thatboyoverthere: AbbeySomeone: CliChe Guevara: When even some of the guys that wrote the DSM-IV thinks the DSM-V is little more than a farktarded handjob to pharma companies, there is very probably some truth to all the hate dumped upon it.

rohar: Gotta drum up business somehow.

These.

Says the anti-vaxer with the perfectly healthy child.


I  didn't let her eat junk either so there's that. Btw, she did get chicken pox after getting the vaccine.
Most of these 'disorders' are due to poor diet, bad parenting , lousy environment.
 
2013-04-14 02:11:18 AM  
pmpaspeakingofprecision.files.wordpress.com
Subby still believes there's a sanity clause?
 
2013-04-14 02:12:35 AM  

super_grass: THIS:

The whole "autism" and "depression" thing was the straw that broke the camel's back for me. Lack of discipline and being mopey are not mental disorders, and never will be.

Man up and take responsibilities, show initiative, and be yourself. That's all a person needs, and it worked perfectly well for me and millions of others.

Thank god my religion expressly forbids dealing with these quacks.


Depression isn't just "being mopey." Being depressed is not getting out of bed, taking no joy from anything, not eating because you feel there is no point to it.

It is classified as a mental illness, sure, but for most people it is just a chemical imbalance,

No go away, and say hello to Tom Cruise for me at your next meeting.
 
2013-04-14 02:14:56 AM  

Gyrfalcon: it's a consortium of worried parents who can't figure out why Junior isn't perfectly behaved 24/7; and a public who seems to feel that children should be perfectly behaved 24/7


That's because nowadays giving junior a smack on the bottom when they throw a temper tantrum in the grocery store is considered due cause for sicking CPS on you for child abuse when the real child abuse is letting them think that a temper tantrum is the way to get what they want because it worked before.
 
2013-04-14 02:18:29 AM  
Autism's getting a bad rap because it and Asperger's have become fashionable, for lack of a better word. The definition of the spectrum has expanded so much that my bright, socially-awkward kid who still needs a little speech therapy ends up having it classified under "autism services" at school. He's not MR and not a behavioral problem, so it gets shuffled into that category pretty much by default. But hardcore autism is the real deal, and I have nothing but sympathy for anyone who has to try and care for and understand a child who simply doesn't seem to have an interest in communicating with the outside world and cannot learn to speak. I have a very hard time believing that a complete or almost complete lack of speech is the product of being spoiled or fed too many carbs or whatever; the normal brain is wired to pick up speech even under less than optimal circumstances. As for being spoiled, the really spoiled kids I know are all too happy to speak so they can start making clear demands and giving marching orders to their spineless parents.
 
2013-04-14 02:18:43 AM  
I eat cheese fries for dinner a few times a month.  Typically I'll have had a vegan lunch of tofu, broccoli, rice, hot sauce, and various veggies.  It's great, but I always end up with leftovers that last two days, so by day three I want some farking cheese after work.

So yeah, 12 times in 3 months means I have a binge eating disorder.  I eat a lot of healthy food, but I like to binge eat fried starch and melted animal fat.  So farking what?  That means I'm mentally ill?

/i probably am mentally ill by their definitions
//i'd rather not throw out stuff without a good reason, but it's more for environmental reasons
///all my "stuff" fits in a 10 foot truck, so i'm definitely not a hoarder
 
2013-04-14 02:19:06 AM  
Checked in before bed, thread is still in the early phases of the DSM-V thread cycle. It's due for an Autism rant though, a few legit stories/debates, an anti-benzos statement, and then around post 75 when things slow down someone will actually take the time to list the changes and reasons for them in a considerate manner (basically it isn't forcing you to get diagnosed but the goal is to help those who could qualify get help covered by insurance). Have fun all.
 
2013-04-14 02:19:14 AM  

super_grass: THIS:

The whole "autism" and "depression" thing was the straw that broke the camel's back for me. Lack of discipline and being mopey are not mental disorders, and never will be.

Man up and take responsibilities, show initiative, and be yourself. That's all a person needs, and it worked perfectly well for me and millions of others.

Thank god my religion expressly forbids dealing with these quacks.


But what will the women do? Won't somebody please think of the women???

/Lovejoy
 
2013-04-14 02:19:29 AM  
You can't be around people with mental and emotional issues all the time and NOT have some of those problems rub-off on you. Hell, even CEOs and working stiffs bring their work and problems home with them.

How many psychiatrists actually see therapists of thier own to be able separate work from their personal life? Especially when it comes to keeping their own identities. How soon before your patients problems become your own, and you start "diagnosing" everyone in the world with autoritative judgement because you read too far into things.

Resulting of course on frequent, inappropriate diagnoses that ultimately result in crap like this.
 
2013-04-14 02:21:49 AM  

AbbeySomeone: I didn't let her eat junk either so there's that. Btw, she did get chicken pox after getting the vaccine.
Most of these 'disorders' are due to poor diet, bad parenting , lousy environment.


So that magically makes it so that they aren't harmful or cause distress to the person suffering from them?
 
2013-04-14 02:22:22 AM  

Claude Ballse: How many psychiatrists actually see therapists of thier own to be able separate work from their personal life?


Most of them do. It's almost in the job description.
 
2013-04-14 02:24:21 AM  

Claude Ballse: You can't be around people with mental and emotional issues all the time and NOT have some of those problems rub-off on you. Hell, even CEOs and working stiffs bring their work and problems home with them.

How many psychiatrists actually see therapists of thier own to be able separate work from their personal life? Especially when it comes to keeping their own identities. How soon before your patients problems become your own, and you start "diagnosing" everyone in the world with autoritative judgement because you read too far into things.

Resulting of course on frequent, inappropriate diagnoses that ultimately result in crap like this.


Not to mention a lot of Therapists get into the field because they themselves have mental disorders and want to figure out why they act the way they do.
/Similar to how a lot of former drug addicts go into addiction counseling. They know what they are going through.
 
2013-04-14 02:27:07 AM  

Radioactive Ass: Claude Ballse: How many psychiatrists actually see therapists of thier own to be able separate work from their personal life?

Most of them do. It's almost in the job description.


Forgot to mention. A lot of psychatrist (at least the ones that manage to last more then a couple of years) learn to switch on and switch off their therapist mode. When they are in the office with a client they are completely different then when they are out of it. At least the ones that deal with more then just people dealing with stress, family issues, and depression. Those three are the most common and easiest to deal with on the psychiatrist standpoint.
/Medication and therapy can make life a lot more manageable.
 
2013-04-14 02:30:34 AM  
Oh look. It's this thread again.
 
2013-04-14 02:32:17 AM  

RenownedCurator: my bright, socially-awkward kid who still needs a little speech therapy ends up having it classified under "autism services" at school. He's not MR and not a behavioral problem, so it gets shuffled into that category pretty much by default.


That sounds like my situation as well. I think part of the problem is there is such a difference between the services that are given to a kid with an autism diagnosis and kids that don't have a diagnosis. The psychologists look at the kid and see a kid that might be autistic, or might not, and they err on the side of the kid getting services. Then folks like us want to be good parents, so we trust the experts and put them through the whole program.

I also think parents (myself included) have a tendency to think "oh, my kid couldn't possibly have something wrong with them" and to gloss over real problems, or to not realize that something is as big of a problem as it actually is.
 
2013-04-14 02:32:17 AM  
If the new DSM hasn't been released yet, how does the Daily Fail know what's in it?
 
2013-04-14 02:32:45 AM  

AbbeySomeone: Btw, she did get chicken pox after getting the vaccine.


It's only 90% effective.  It doesn't always stop it, just most of the time.

Let me get some action from the back section.  We need herd immunization, not perfection.  Let your backbone flip but don't slip a disc.  Let your immune system just take a risk.
 
2013-04-14 02:32:48 AM  

davidphogan: I eat cheese fries for dinner a few times a month.  Typically I'll have had a vegan lunch of tofu, broccoli, rice, hot sauce, and various veggies.  It's great, but I always end up with leftovers that last two days, so by day three I want some farking cheese after work.

So yeah, 12 times in 3 months means I have a binge eating disorder.  I eat a lot of healthy food, but I like to binge eat fried starch and melted animal fat.  So farking what?  That means I'm mentally ill?

/i probably am mentally ill by their definitions
//i'd rather not throw out stuff without a good reason, but it's more for environmental reasons
///all my "stuff" fits in a 10 foot truck, so i'm definitely not a hoarder


No, it means that behavior is a sign that you MIGHT have an eating disorder. The qualifying word is 'disorder' in that it must have caused you some problem.

A bad diet isn't 'an eating disorder' if it isn't causing you to gain or lose 10 pounds in a week, lose teeth, or some other harm. The guy who prays to Batman every night may have all the signs of a psychosis, but unless he causes some harm it's nothing more than a religion.

None of that means that some Primary Care doctor won't use the DSM-V as an excuse to give out drugs. I've seen someone depressed because a family member died diagnosed as suffering from depression (being depressed and suffering depression are two totally different things) who kept feeling like crap til they stopped the anti-depressants. So maybe the DSM-V needs a warning to 'keep away from those who aren't psychiatric board certified'.

/but then we'd have fewer stories like this.
 
2013-04-14 02:36:52 AM  

ykarie: None of that means that some Primary Care doctor won't use the DSM-V as an excuse to give out drugs.


That was more of my concern.  I've been offered antidepressants because in passing, when a doctor asked how things were, I mentioned that my boss was kind of a dick.  It wasn't a big deal, I was just making small talk, and my boss at that time was, in fact, kind of a dick.

A lot of doctors just want to hand out drugs.  It's easier to throw out a referral and some drugs and take the kickbacks than tell someone they're probably fine.
 
2013-04-14 02:37:04 AM  
give these kids ak- 500 and 57's, with magnum john wayne buck shot clips and let them fend for themselves.
 
2013-04-14 02:39:13 AM  

davidphogan: ykarie: None of that means that some Primary Care doctor won't use the DSM-V as an excuse to give out drugs.

That was more of my concern.  I've been offered antidepressants because in passing, when a doctor asked how things were, I mentioned that my boss was kind of a dick.  It wasn't a big deal, I was just making small talk, and my boss at that time was, in fact, kind of a dick.

A lot of doctors just want to hand out drugs.  It's easier to throw out a referral and some drugs and take the kickbacks than tell someone they're probably fine.


It's also beneficial if the patient has to keep returning for refills, as that's another guaranteed overpriced session with the head shrinker
 
2013-04-14 02:39:40 AM  
Questioning psychiatric manual?

MENTAL DISORDER!!!
 
2013-04-14 02:40:30 AM  

ykarie: davidphogan: I eat cheese fries for dinner a few times a month.  Typically I'll have had a vegan lunch of tofu, broccoli, rice, hot sauce, and various veggies.  It's great, but I always end up with leftovers that last two days, so by day three I want some farking cheese after work.

So yeah, 12 times in 3 months means I have a binge eating disorder.  I eat a lot of healthy food, but I like to binge eat fried starch and melted animal fat.  So farking what?  That means I'm mentally ill?

/i probably am mentally ill by their definitions
//i'd rather not throw out stuff without a good reason, but it's more for environmental reasons
///all my "stuff" fits in a 10 foot truck, so i'm definitely not a hoarder

No, it means that behavior is a sign that you MIGHT have an eating disorder. The qualifying word is 'disorder' in that it must have caused you some problem.

A bad diet isn't 'an eating disorder' if it isn't causing you to gain or lose 10 pounds in a week, lose teeth, or some other harm. The guy who prays to Batman every night may have all the signs of a psychosis, but unless he causes some harm it's nothing more than a religion.

None of that means that some Primary Care doctor won't use the DSM-V as an excuse to give out drugs. I've seen someone depressed because a family member died diagnosed as suffering from depression (being depressed and suffering depression are two totally different things) who kept feeling like crap til they stopped the anti-depressants. So maybe the DSM-V needs a warning to 'keep away from those who aren't psychiatric board certified'.

/but then we'd have fewer stories like this.


THIS!
 
2013-04-14 02:40:58 AM  

GGracie: RedPhoenix122: fusillade762: What's my Fark addiction covered under?

Stockholm Syndrome.

That was just beautiful.


I had the same reaction GGracie.


For the record, it bugs me when psychologists get all the blame for their made-up disorders because the fact is that most people want a label for what they believe ails them. It is like blaming a judge for deciding a case at bar. If you do not want the judge to decide, do not sue. If you do sue do not get annoyed when he uses words like collateral estoppel to deny your arguments.
 
2013-04-14 02:41:48 AM  
Nobody's crazier than a shrink in bed with Big Pharma
 
2013-04-14 02:41:51 AM  
if you have a kid and they are under 12 years old, if they are on some drugs that would knock out a rhino - you need to check yourself.

if you can't handle your own kids, pills aren't going to help. stop having kids.
 
2013-04-14 02:44:00 AM  

Smeggy Smurf: Nobody's crazier than a shrink in bed with Big Pharma


or the parents of some angel that think narcotics is the answer to their little angles recovery
 
2013-04-14 02:44:56 AM  
Another liberal arts major writing about something they don't understand (science).  The state of science "journalism" these days is atrocious.
 
2013-04-14 02:47:09 AM  

maram500: super_grass: THIS:

The whole "autism" and "depression" thing was the straw that broke the camel's back for me. Lack of discipline and being mopey are not mental disorders, and never will be.

Man up and take responsibilities, show initiative, and be yourself. That's all a person needs, and it worked perfectly well for me and millions of others.

Thank god my religion expressly forbids dealing with these quacks.

Depression isn't just "being mopey." Being depressed is not getting out of bed, taking no joy from anything, not eating because you feel there is no point to it.

It is classified as a mental illness, sure, but for most people it is just a chemical imbalance,

No go away, and say hello to Tom Cruise for me at your next meeting.


I have to play the Devil's advocate on this one - the popular concepts of those illnesses are a load of horseshiat.  The problem is that a lot of people are getting trigger-happy with self-diagnosing, and they don't know what the technical parameters of these diseases are.  Try asking someone on the street how they feel about the incidence of dysthymia in the US.  They'll think it's an STD or something.

/Firefox doesn't recognize dysthymia as a word even
//keeps trying to correct it to "isthmus"
 
2013-04-14 02:48:26 AM  

What_Would_Jimi_Do: Smeggy Smurf: Nobody's crazier than a shrink in bed with Big Pharma

or the parents of some angel that think narcotics is the answer to their little angles recovery


It makes the parents feel good that they "did something" for their snowflake.  The truth is, the parents are worthless not the kid.
 
2013-04-14 02:50:18 AM  
it is hard to judge people here based on age, but i am sure alot of you were raised on these drugs, the correction to attitude in the late 70's was an ass beating. even into the 80's. if you were raised on these drugs, go biatch slap your parents. better yet, go thank you parents that they didn't drive you and your siblings into a lake, where you probably deserved to end up.
 
2013-04-14 02:52:51 AM  

Smeggy Smurf: The truth is, the parents are worthless not the kid.


the snowflake and parents are worthless.
 
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