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(Stabley Times)   Why Apple will never launch a competitor to Pandora and Spotify   (stableytimes.com) divider line 31
    More: Interesting, Spotify, iRadio, iOS, Apple Rumors, killer, air launch, iTunes Store  
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2219 clicks; posted to Geek » on 12 Apr 2013 at 10:22 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



31 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2013-04-12 10:28:50 AM  
Without reading the article, let me guess the reason: because streaming music services don't make any money. They're just marketing tools for artists.
 
2013-04-12 10:32:12 AM  
Because Pandora is free and Apple doesn't play that, homey.
 
2013-04-12 10:46:28 AM  
Streaming music is a low-margin, mature market with plenty of competition. That is not Apple's business, and everyone with half a brain knows that it isn't. So congratulations on having argued the obvious against the supposed speculation of a vaguely defined 'someone' you haven't even bothered linking to.

Your blog sucks.
 
2013-04-12 10:46:39 AM  
As Power Man said, "where's my money, honey?"
 
2013-04-12 10:49:46 AM  

pkjun: Streaming music is a low-margin, mature market with plenty of competition. That is not Apple's business, and everyone with half a brain knows that it isn't. So congratulations on having argued the obvious against the supposed speculation of a vaguely defined 'someone' you haven't even bothered linking to.

Your blog sucks.


His blog may suck, but his point is clear and correct: Apple don't play for free.
 
2013-04-12 10:53:41 AM  
Your blog sucks.
 
2013-04-12 10:55:51 AM  
My teenager used to buy iTunes.  We would give her gift cards for things like Christmas.  Seemed like win win since she was going to buy the music anyway and I could save the money on a real gift.  I noticed this year she hasn't even spent the money.  She just uses Pandora.  I presume the sales of iTunes music has been reduced significantly over the past year or so but have no evidence.  We still will rent/buy movies on the Apple TV though.
 
2013-04-12 10:57:43 AM  
Apple is on its way down again, and with no Jobs to come and resurrect it again, they will not be back. Streaming or no streaming.

/every Apple thread is an Apple hate thread
//Hahaha I'm an idiot because iPhone still popular
 
2013-04-12 11:03:15 AM  
Don't forget last.fm, as well.

Between last.fm, Rhapsody and a CD ripper/DRM stripper, I'm set for music for life. I just wish last.fm would get theirs to work with Rhapsody- it was amazing with Napster.
 
2013-04-12 11:09:18 AM  

Stone Meadow: pkjun: Streaming music is a low-margin, mature market with plenty of competition. That is not Apple's business, and everyone with half a brain knows that it isn't. So congratulations on having argued the obvious against the supposed speculation of a vaguely defined 'someone' you haven't even bothered linking to.

Your blog sucks.

His blog may suck, but his point is clear and correct: Apple don't play for free.


Sure, it's clear that the Apple model virtually incompatible with the Pandora/Spotify model. It's so clear, in fact, that the blogger doesn't even bother supporting the argument beyond saying, in so many words, 'Of course Apple wouldn't do that, only dumbs think they would.'

Meaning that this particular bit of blogsuck has approximately zero value to anyone but the suck-blogger himself.
 
2013-04-12 11:09:29 AM  

brandent: My teenager used to buy iTunes.  We would give her gift cards for things like Christmas.  Seemed like win win since she was going to buy the music anyway and I could save the money on a real gift.  I noticed this year she hasn't even spent the money.  She just uses Pandora.  I presume the sales of iTunes music has been reduced significantly over the past year or so but have no evidence.  We still will rent/buy movies on the Apple TV though.


Most of Apple's revenue through iTunes comes from Apps and movies.
 
2013-04-12 11:12:46 AM  

brandent: My teenager used to buy iTunes.  We would give her gift cards for things like Christmas.  Seemed like win win since she was going to buy the music anyway and I could save the money on a real gift.  I noticed this year she hasn't even spent the money.  She just uses Pandora.  I presume the sales of iTunes music has been reduced significantly over the past year or so but have no evidence.  We still will rent/buy movies on the Apple TV though.


I believe that's going to change as more and more interent providers (both wireless and land) began instituting strict data caps.

And we're going to see more of this as wireless providers start doing what T-mobile is doing with its new data pricing structure.
 
2013-04-12 11:22:33 AM  

sure haven't: Apple is on its way down again, and with no Jobs to come and resurrect it again, they will not be back. Streaming or no streaming.

/every Apple thread is an Apple hate thread
//Hahaha I'm an idiot because iPhone still popular


Everyone loves betting against Apple, and yet, Apple always wins in the end.

When they come out for the iWatch their stock will go back to 800.
 
2013-04-12 11:28:46 AM  
They could put one out there and charge $99 for it. Apple iDiots will buy it.
 
zez
2013-04-12 11:42:22 AM  
The article read like it was written for a high school debate assignment.  Also, doesn't apple already have a streaming service where you can listen to whatever you've bought from itunes?
 
2013-04-12 11:47:25 AM  

pkjun: Stone Meadow: His blog may suck, but his point is clear and correct: Apple don't play for free.

Sure, it's clear that the Apple model virtually incompatible with the Pandora/Spotify model. It's so clear, in fact, that the blogger doesn't even bother supporting the argument beyond saying, in so many words, 'Of course Apple wouldn't do that, only dumbs think they would.'

Meaning that this particular bit of blogsuck has approximately zero value to anyone but the suck-blogger himself.


Yeah, to him...and the other several million fanboyz who've idly wondered why there is no iRadio.

/no iDevices
//85% deaf
///doesn't listen to music
 
2013-04-12 11:58:22 AM  

thornhill: Everyone loves betting against Apple, and yet, Apple always wins in the end.


You need to look up the definition to always.

When they come out for the iWatch their stock will go back to 800.

If you buy me totalfark (I actually do not want totalfark but that seems to be the bet around here) until they get to $800, I'll buy you totalfark for as long as they are or over. Sounds fair to me.

As for the main article, PEOPLE may not be willing to pay for a music service. But I bet iPEOPLE will.
 
2013-04-12 12:15:56 PM  
FTA: "The reason the iTunes model works so swimmingly is because it makes about thirty cents profit for Apple per purchased song."

Doubtful.  Apple may take thirty percent of the revenue for each 99-cent song they sell, but that has to cover Apple's costs for running the iTunes store, maintaining systems to keep track of and distribute royalties, and operating a server environment capable of remembering purchase data and offering redownload rights indefinitely.  Revenue and profit are different.

None of that is relevant to the argument whether Apple will launch a streaming service or not.

Pandora, et al are on tenuous ground right now, and if the regulations are ever corrected so that artists get fair compensation for the use of their work, instead of the pittance currently mandated, it will bankrupt them.
 
2013-04-12 12:42:08 PM  

JohnBigBootay: thornhill: Everyone loves betting against Apple, and yet, Apple always wins in the end.

You need to look up the definition to always.

When they come out for the iWatch their stock will go back to 800.

If you buy me totalfark (I actually do not want totalfark but that seems to be the bet around here) until they get to $800, I'll buy you totalfark for as long as they are or over. Sounds fair to me.

As for the main article, PEOPLE may not be willing to pay for a music service. But I bet iPEOPLE will.


I would never bet on stock prices like that because so much of it is driven by uninformed perceptions.

The fact that their stock price is down is merely because they haven't had a big press event in a while. The fundamentals of the company are still extremely strong. They have a huge market share in smart phones and tablets, have the largest ap marketplace, largest download music store, and a larger stockpile of cash than god.
 
2013-04-12 01:09:56 PM  

thornhill: I would never bet on stock prices like that because so much of it is driven by uninformed perceptions.

The fact that their stock price is down is merely because they haven't had a big press event in a while.


Speaking of uninformed perceptions... the reason their stock price is down is because their earnings growth the last three years was like (close enough) 70, 39, 11. One does not need analyst to tell you which way that stock price is going to go. No one said they aren't profitable. They are. Investors however, are looking for earnings GROWTH. Apples earnings growth has been rapidly decreasing, and it's not because they haven't had a new commercial.
 
2013-04-12 01:21:41 PM  

JohnBigBootay: thornhill: I would never bet on stock prices like that because so much of it is driven by uninformed perceptions.

The fact that their stock price is down is merely because they haven't had a big press event in a while.

Speaking of uninformed perceptions... the reason their stock price is down is because their earnings growth the last three years was like (close enough) 70, 39, 11. One does not need analyst to tell you which way that stock price is going to go. No one said they aren't profitable. They are. Investors however, are looking for earnings GROWTH. Apples earnings growth has been rapidly decreasing, and it's not because they haven't had a new commercial.


Which people are dim about because there hasn't been a new product launch in a while. As soon as they have a new product announced, namely the iWatch, their growth potential will shoot up and it will be like the last 12 months never happened.
 
2013-04-12 01:31:09 PM  
 
2013-04-12 01:39:28 PM  

thornhill: JohnBigBootay: thornhill: I would never bet on stock prices like that because so much of it is driven by uninformed perceptions.

The fact that their stock price is down is merely because they haven't had a big press event in a while.

Speaking of uninformed perceptions... the reason their stock price is down is because their earnings growth the last three years was like (close enough) 70, 39, 11. One does not need analyst to tell you which way that stock price is going to go. No one said they aren't profitable. They are. Investors however, are looking for earnings GROWTH. Apples earnings growth has been rapidly decreasing, and it's not because they haven't had a new commercial.

Which people are dim about because there hasn't been a new product launch in a while. As soon as they have a new product announced, namely the iWatch, their growth potential will shoot up and it will be like the last 12 months never happened.


Or the iWatch will be the point where Apple jumps the shark and ends up as a total flop.  Seriously?  iWatch?  Sounds so farking stupid to me I cannot even believe its a real product.  Apple has coasted pretty much over the inital hype generated from the success of the iPod and iPhone,and at this point I think they may be pushing their luck too far in terms of taking the same successful product and repackaging it over and over again with very little in way of improvements.  They've become like the Call of Duty franchise in video games.  Don't get me wrong, my last 3 phones have been iPhones, and I give credit where credit is due, its a good product, but iWatch? Seriously? What's next? iSneakers?  iBelt?  iChewableMorphine?
 
2013-04-12 02:04:27 PM  

JohnBigBootay: If you buy me totalfark (I actually do not want totalfark but that seems to be the bet around here) until they get to $800, I'll buy you totalfark for as long as they are or over. Sounds fair to me.


If only there was some way to play the stock market with actual money instead of TotalFark!

Apple will begin it's "decline", AKA about a decade of spectacularly outperforming its competition until it falters and becomes just like every other company, with the usual ups and downs. It's the most successful American business of all time, so it has a long way to fall.
 
2013-04-12 02:13:16 PM  

brandent: My teenager used to buy iTunes.  We would give her gift cards for things like Christmas.  Seemed like win win since she was going to buy the music anyway and I could save the money on a real gift.  I noticed this year she hasn't even spent the money.  She just uses Pandora.  I presume the sales of iTunes music has been reduced significantly over the past year or so but have no evidence.  We still will rent/buy movies on the Apple TV though.


That's okay, most people posting here have no evidence. But here are the facts: Link

Summary: iTunes music sales up 10% year over year, overall iTunes Store sales up 50%.
 
2013-04-12 03:55:38 PM  
Native app with Siri and IOS integration and the ability to stream to Airplay that will drive music discovery and potentially increase traffic to the itunes store.....sounds pretty likely to me, regardless of the info in this sucky blog article.
 
2013-04-12 03:56:44 PM  
Well, Apple has a couple of things Pandora and Spotify don't.

Primarily, they have 600 million users. All of them have credit cards attached to the account. All of them are trained like lab monkeys to click a button to buy something in iTunes. They do this to the tune of something on the order of $10 Billion a year already.

Second, they can bake their radio service right into the system. Almost no marketing effort required. You upgrade to iOS 7, you click a button to subscribe to streaming and you are done. No having to find a streaming service, download an app, make a new account, type in your credit card info and learn some interface designed around bizarre play-count rules.

Finally, their entire system would be linked to a massive catalog of purchasable music, allowing them to convert streamers into buyers far more efficiently than Pandora, Spotify or Last.fm ever could. Music companies are ho-hum about streaming revenue - they clearly prefer it to piracy, but they would much rather have people pay $0.99 per track. Apple's pathway to make that happen is far more efficient than any other service. They could even bake in an auto-purchase mechanism where if you play a song a whole lot, it automatically buys it for you. Or turn something like a $10 month subscription into store credit; not only do you get full featured streaming, you can also buy 10 songs a month.

Apple fouls up a lot of the  top level details these days. iOS is clearly falling behind the times and the magic has long since worn off. Apple's cloud and online offerings still suck. Much of Apple's software is rickety and has annoying limitations baked in (like App Store search parsing). Even so, the company's fundamental business has evolved into a very powerful platform that gives Apple the potential to do stuff no other company possibly could.
 
2013-04-12 05:33:10 PM  

dr-shotgun: Well, Apple has a couple of things Pandora and Spotify don't.

Primarily, they have 600 million users. All of them have credit cards attached to the account. All of them are trained like lab monkeys to click a button to buy something in iTunes. They do this to the tune of something on the order of $10 Billion a year already.

Second, they can bake their radio service right into the system. Almost no marketing effort required. You upgrade to iOS 7, you click a button to subscribe to streaming and you are done. No having to find a streaming service, download an app, make a new account, type in your credit card info and learn some interface designed around bizarre play-count rules.

Finally, their entire system would be linked to a massive catalog of purchasable music, allowing them to convert streamers into buyers far more efficiently than Pandora, Spotify or Last.fm ever could. Music companies are ho-hum about streaming revenue - they clearly prefer it to piracy, but they would much rather have people pay $0.99 per track. Apple's pathway to make that happen is far more efficient than any other service. They could even bake in an auto-purchase mechanism where if you play a song a whole lot, it automatically buys it for you. Or turn something like a $10 month subscription into store credit; not only do you get full featured streaming, you can also buy 10 songs a month.


Yeah I think these are all great ideas.  As an example here is my process of discovering and purchasing new music digitally:

I have a spotify premium account, I listen to music enough to justify the $10/month and probably would be willing to even go up to $25/month for the service.  My only complaint on spotify is that the radio, recommended albums, and similar artists features are all kind of shiatty.  Not to mention theres some high profile stuff that doesnt get released right away or at all that iTunes has.  So to a large degree I'm left to my own devices (last.fm / RYM / review sites) to figure out what new stuff I should be checking out.  Anyways, if I find an album I really enjoy on spotify, I sometimes will purchase it from itunes as well so I can play it in my car (less frequently do I go out and buy individual tracks, but thats just since my listening style has shifted more towards whole albums over single tracks).  So I don't see why Apple doesn't want to cut out the middle man in this process.  And in the process of doing so they might get me to bite on purchasing albums more often, as right now I might say "wow this album is great I should buy it on itunes" after listening to it on spotify, but end up getting distracted or forgetting about it if I don't drop everything and open itunes to buy it.

Also from my pre-spotify days I did occasionally give Genius's recommendations a shot and they weren't half bad, so they already have the algorithms and framework in place to establish a streaming radio type of service.  their algorithms might require some more fine tuning, but still its not like they would have much to build from scratch.  I'm not familiar with the cost implications with respect to copyright and royalties, but if spotify and these other services are able to get by, I imagine someone with as much cash  and branding as Apple should be able to pull it off as well.  Or maybe they woudl be too popular and the record co's would not be as keen on having the 600 million user base potentially shifting to the less desireable streaming revenue stream.  .

And to expand on your comments, one of the things spotify seems to be trying to push is 3rd party apps.  Apps are one of itunes/apples strong suits, so they could also allow development of third party apps and add ons to the streaming service that they could charge 0.99 - 1.99 for in addition.  You really like genre xyz? - well theres an app for 0.99 that will improve your recommendations in that genre.
 
2013-04-12 06:18:07 PM  
not one mention of Apple Corps. sad.
 
2013-04-12 07:59:49 PM  

thornhill: Which people are dim about because there hasn't been a new product launch in a while. As soon as they have a new product announced, namely the iWatch, their growth potential will shoot up and it will be like the last 12 months never happened.


You have completely lost your mind. the slowdoen happened gradually over three years. A farking watch is not gonna send them back up to 70% earnings growth. They need a new product simply to maintain the staus quo and not sink further. The market they have dominated has greatly mature in the last three years and competition has done what competition always does.
 
2013-04-12 11:08:28 PM  
Or because it's not profitable enough to go another round with Apple Records.

chocolate covered poop: Or the iWatch will be the point where Apple jumps the shark and ends up as a total flop.  Seriously?  iWatch?  Sounds so farking stupid to me I cannot even believe its a real product.  Apple has coasted pretty much over the inital hype generated from the success of the iPod and iPhone,and at this point I think they may be pushing their luck too far in terms of taking the same successful product and repackaging it over and over again with very little in way of improvements.  They've become like the Call of Duty franchise in video games.  Don't get me wrong, my last 3 phones have been iPhones, and I give credit where credit is due, its a good product, but iWatch? Seriously? What's next? iSneakers?  iBelt?  iChewableMorphine?


My co-worker has a watch that works with his iPhone and it's pretty cool.   Assuming that (among other features) it will display texts, facebook posts, and tweets, from the iPhone, the iWatch is going to make Apple a ton of money.  Hell, it'll make R&D money back from school kids alone.
 
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