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(Daily Mail)   Jobless mother-of-ten needs more help from the NHS to have another baby because her benefits are too low   (dailymail.co.uk) divider line 134
    More: Asinine, NHS, Iona Heaton, child welfare  
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11945 clicks; posted to Main » on 10 Apr 2013 at 9:19 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-04-11 12:17:26 AM
And yet last week there was an article regarding minimum wage there was a woman with 7 children, who demanded ~$15/hr for fast food work and farkers agreed with her. How is this any different?
 
2013-04-11 12:30:27 AM
Liberalism...how does it work?
 
2013-04-11 12:50:20 AM

TerminalEchoes: Liberalism...how does it work?


Would you prefer food riots?
 
2013-04-11 01:26:45 AM

StoPPeRmobile: TerminalEchoes: Liberalism...how does it work?

Would you prefer food riots?


Shhhh, he's posting his incisive political commentary! It's so deep and fleshed out.

/Like subby's mom.
 
2013-04-11 01:48:26 AM
come on, you gotta like a girl who loves dick that much
 
2013-04-11 01:51:35 AM

GoldSpider: StoPPeRmobile: Market adjustment. The pain you are experiencing is the value of your education lowering.

Perhaps we should stop selling our youth the idea that they need a degree to succeed when "the market" shows us the exact opposite is true.


MichiganFTL: StoPPeRmobile: MichiganFTL: GoldSpider: Marine1: They get a better one than produce stocker at a Walmart in northeastern Missouri.

Ask any of the college graduates working multiple minimum-wage jobs just to pay off their predatory school loans.

The banks have already robbed them of their financial freedom.  I don't see how robbing them of their reproductive rights is going to help.

Two things come to mind:

Anthropology major? To teach? The cycle continues.

Underwater basket weaving?

Is there a statistic which shows the top 5 degrees with the highest unemployment and/or lowest wages? I'll try to duck the English and sociology majors coming out in defense.

BubbleMarket adjustment. The pain you are experiencing is the value of your education lowering.

I was one of the people who got their masters and took a crappy job during it bc I couldn't find crap with my degree. 80k later I do have a good job, but honestly that's only because of the experience I had at the crappy job giving me my foot in the door. I don't use anything I learned on a daily basis from my education, but I sure pay my monthly bills because they say I am edumacated now.  When are we going to give up this 'everyone must go to college' thing and realize some people are not cut out for it and it will be worse for them. Lets promote vocational schools and apprenticeships to learn trades again.




Approves.
upload.wikimedia.org
 
2013-04-11 02:00:28 AM
dangit
 
2013-04-11 02:19:20 AM
She might ads for fertility treatment but she won't even be considered by the NHS. Got a child already? No help for you.

Daily Fail fails again.
 
2013-04-11 02:54:06 AM
Two children max for each woman/couple and then forced sterilization. Want more? Adopt. All countries need to make this a law.

Seriously, with the overpopulation problem and the fact that very few kids die in infancy these days, there is absolutely no reason to have more than a couple kids. None.
 
2013-04-11 03:46:49 AM
thanks obama
 
2013-04-11 03:52:47 AM

Bhruic: AdolfOliverPanties: You want to live on the dole, then you should be forced to stop at maybe three kids, maximum.  Benefits do not go up at all after that third spawning.

Honest question - how do they stop it?  Force abortions on women who get pregnant after 3 kids?  Just stop giving them money, so that the kids end up suffering?  There's no good answer to the problem that doesn't end up hurting the children more than the parents.  And the kids are innocent.


I know how I'd do it. RISUG on every boy once he turns 13. Then to have children, you must pass a parenting licence course or test. (Like adoption?) you pass? RISUG is removed, wham bam.
/not sure how you'd deal with the rise in STIs though.
//Godwin?
 
2013-04-11 04:18:39 AM
frozenhotchocolate:This is better than importing immigrants that will live off the dole anyways but not assimilate into society as easily.

I'm an immigrant to the UK

benefits that they have not paid into are not available to the vast majority of immigrants in the UK. For the over whelming majority, if they are receiving benefits, it's illegal and they can be kicked out for it. If you know someone who's illegally receiving benefits, report them. (as in, I have a right to the contribution part of job-seekers (the part I pay out of my salary), but not to the public funds part)

Exceptions are made for amnesty cases, and once you are naturalised, you have the same rights as any British person

a British person is not allowed to bring even a spouse into the country if they cannot prove they have an income that will keep them off benefits.
 
2013-04-11 05:22:04 AM
I can't get over how successfully the daily fail trolls Fark. It's a racist, bigoted rag of a publication, and still they get greenlit here every day.
 
2013-04-11 05:35:24 AM

The Evil That Lies In The Hearts Of Men: Daily Mail - I'd take this with a pinch of salt.


lmao....every f-ing time......
 
2013-04-11 06:05:23 AM

DesktopHippie: I can't get over how successfully the daily fail trolls Fark. It's a racist, bigoted rag of a publication, and still they get greenlit here every day.


I believe they pay for the service. All Daily Mail article have a "Submit this to Fark" button amongst the "like" (Facebook, Pinterest, Twitter and so on) options.
 
2013-04-11 06:26:49 AM
Not to repeat the obvious, but the Mail has a remarkable lack of credibility.

Having said that, a few more points:

1. Whilst there are a few families like this in the UK, they are the outliers. This has come up for a lot of analysis recently, with government benefit cuts under the microscope - the number of families with > nine children, on benefits, is at most in double figures. In a population of over 60 million, this is  not very many.

2. Whilst I'm not a big fan of "Have more kids! More benefit!", there are both social and economic factors that make the current situation the least-worst alternative. Firstly, the amount of money gained from each additional child is...small. Personally I don't see how it's worth it. Secondly, as already noted above, the idea of removing benefits from people after their <x> child has a disproportionate impact on those children. Thirdly, for those advocating removing the children from the equation, it's more expensive to take them into care and maintain them that way than it would be to pay the extra benefit,  andis more disruptive to the children.

3. People in council houses rent them from the council. They don't just get 'given a house'. They do, in some way, have to pay for it. Amusingly, they will often do so through 'housing benefit', also provided by the government under certain criteria, but it's not just "Poor=Free house, waargh!" That said, people below the povery line do need somewhere to live. Or they live on the street. And start rioting. The social safety net is there both to sustain the population and keep them under control.

4. The benefits system in the UK is not, by any means, immoderately generous, when compared to other parts of Europe. Compared to the US, of course, it's practically Shangri-La, but i do hope that model is not one we would aspire to. Leaving aside the edge cases, this is a system designed to help people get back on their feet after unexpected unemployment (not exactly an unlikely occurence these days) or to help supplement a family income to make it livable and keep families out of poverty (which, overall, is good for  everyone).

5. Some of the things provided as benefits in the UK are probably covered under different names by other countries - for example, 'Child tax credit', given on birth of a child, is a 'benefit' and I can't believe there isn't a US equivalent.

6. There are some things that the US audience does not class as 'benefits' which seem outrageously beneficient to those of us elsewhere - the mortgage interest tax deduction, for example, is one every householder in the UK would give their right arm to receive. Whilst discursing on the horrors of 'welfarism', keep in mind that in many cases it's all labeling.
 
2013-04-11 06:38:10 AM

swingerofbirches: Why was this article written? Why did the subject agree to be interviewed?

Why would a woman who was going to be scorned by the public go to the Daily Mail and say, "Please write about me leeching off the government."


cash.
 
2013-04-11 06:43:51 AM
Parent benefit, not child benefit. If you are a parent looking after your children you get parent benefit no matter how many you have.

Two parents? twice as much.

No more than a 3 bedroom place on benefits however many kids you have. Over a certain amount of kids and it`s up to you what you do. Get a job to pay for them or stop having them.

Encourages traditional two parent families and not having loads of kids to get a bigger house (as in this case) or more money.

problem solved.
 
2013-04-11 06:46:04 AM

CroakerBC: 5. Some of the things provided as benefits in the UK are probably covered under different names by other countries - for example, 'Child tax credit', given on birth of a child, is a 'benefit' and I can't believe there isn't a US equivalent.


yearly tax deduction per dependent (including yourself)
 
2013-04-11 07:21:50 AM
Daily Mail Definitions


Jobless working class mother: Benefit scrounger, lazy, feckless

Jobless middle class mother: Housewife, ideal, a woman's place.

Jobless upper class mother: What is a "job"?
 
2013-04-11 07:32:23 AM

frozenhotchocolate: England much like many European nations is generous with incentives to mothers because their birthrate is so low. This is better than importing immigrants that will live off the dole anyways but not assimilate into society as easily.


Good point.

Maybe we can try that here. "Ok folks either welfare babies or anchor babies. You pick."
 
2013-04-11 08:11:53 AM
This woman is a disgusting parasite and exemplary of so much that is wrong with humankind in modern society.
 
2013-04-11 08:32:15 AM

The Snow Dog: [3.bp.blogspot.com image 550x317]


That movie is a Goddamn documentry. It's really sad, but very true.
 
2013-04-11 09:11:32 AM

TheBigJerk: frozenhotchocolate: England much like many European nations is generous with incentives to mothers because their birthrate is so low. This is better than importing immigrants that will live off the dole anyways but not assimilate into society as easily.

True, I mean at least she's white.

/surprise racism


You're conflating race with culture.  Be careful how far you go down this road.
 
2013-04-11 09:16:31 AM
Can the welfare system in the UK really be as bad as the trash tabloid articles make it out to be?  Or is this the 1 in a thousand case where a person found a loophole?

FLMountainMan: TheBigJerk: frozenhotchocolate: England much like many European nations is generous with incentives to mothers because their birthrate is so low. This is better than importing immigrants that will live off the dole anyways but not assimilate into society as easily.

True, I mean at least she's white.

/surprise racism

You're conflating race with culture.  Be careful how far you go down this road.


Don't go down thaht roahd...

www.planetpulp.dk
 
2013-04-11 11:00:50 AM

StoPPeRmobile: Must be something in the air.


Her ankles?
 
2013-04-11 11:25:24 AM
I have no idea how you would implement birth control for people on full government assistance, but it wouldn't be a bad thing.

Since that would be hard then maybe we reward them for not pumping out kids.  That may sound perverse, but if it works at a lower cost than what they do now in the UK (assuming just letting her kids die is not an option) then why not?
 
2013-04-11 11:38:23 AM

nocturnal001: I have no idea how you would implement birth control for people on full government assistance, but it wouldn't be a bad thing.

Since that would be hard then maybe we reward them for not pumping out kids.  That may sound perverse, but if it works at a lower cost than what they do now in the UK (assuming just letting her kids die is not an option) then why not?


I know that sounds nice on the surface, but it ends up the same as punishing the kid for being born by not helping someone on benefits care for their kids.

The money they receive would reduce the more kids they have, same as not helping with the cost of caring for the new kid.

I think there are probably "better" ways out their than strictly money, but they all involve a lot more community involvement in the lives of people with children. And a lot more work understanding the reasons people live their lives on benefits. (as in, how many people are truly that lazy vs under educated, unskilled, in need of mental health services, in need of rehab, scared of leaving the life they've known since they were born)
 
2013-04-11 11:58:28 AM
FTFA: The couple now live in a spacious three bedroom semi-detached home with large gardens worth more than £180,000 in a leafy part of Blackburn, Lancashire.

So now we know it only takes one hole to fill the Albert Hall (with people)?
 
2013-04-11 12:17:32 PM
encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com

Wish I could have found a clearer picture of the "My 75 Kids" sketch from SNL.
"OK, who all has a birthday today?!?"
 
xcv
2013-04-11 12:36:17 PM

thisone: nocturnal001: I have no idea how you would implement birth control for people on full government assistance, but it wouldn't be a bad thing.

Since that would be hard then maybe we reward them for not pumping out kids.  That may sound perverse, but if it works at a lower cost than what they do now in the UK (assuming just letting her kids die is not an option) then why not?

I know that sounds nice on the surface, but it ends up the same as punishing the kid for being born by not helping someone on benefits care for their kids.

The money they receive would reduce the more kids they have, same as not helping with the cost of caring for the new kid.

I think there are probably "better" ways out their than strictly money, but they all involve a lot more community involvement in the lives of people with children. And a lot more work understanding the reasons people live their lives on benefits. (as in, how many people are truly that lazy vs under educated, unskilled, in need of mental health services, in need of rehab, scared of leaving the life they've known since they were born)


Just my 1.5 cents: lottery. Uneducated poor people farking love the lottery.

Everyone on welfare gets a base of say 1,000 raffle tickets a month free in the special welfare lottery.

If you have a second kid and you start getting an additional $200 more a month in food stamps and child assistance cash, then you lose 200 tickets and only get 800 a month from now on.

Have a third kid while on welfare and you're welfare assistance increases to $400 worth of food stamps and welfare cash? Now you're only getting 600 tickets a month.
And so on.


The uneducated poor would send birth control company stocks soaring for the low cost of a few prizes a month, and nobody is depriving the children of large welfare families of cash and food assistance.
 
2013-04-11 10:20:04 PM

wrenchboy: xcv: A better way would be rewarding welfare recipients for not having additional children.

This is really a great idea in theory. Give them education and child care services while they attend school AND use birth control.

But it makes too much sense, will never happen.

What need to happen is bring back the stigma that unwed mothers and their babby daddys are scum of the earth. I mean Jevus friggin condoms are so cheap there is no excuse for getting knocked up 3 times before the age of 18.


It will never happen. Republicans love the stupid and uneducated, while Democrats love the poor and minorities. Both are potential votes for them.
 
2013-04-12 06:16:16 AM
Parent benefit, not child benefit so there is no extra money if you want an extra kid (unless already born of course) and a cap on social housing. You want more than a three bed place? Get a job and pay for it.

Then the stigma of wanting another child happens within the family home.

"We just can`t afford another one" said no person on benefits ever...
 
2013-04-12 02:18:51 PM
machoprogrammer: All Politicians love the stupid and uneducated, poor and minorities.

FTFE
 
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