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(Some Cathol)   10 myths about gay marriage or: Oh God, people really believe this?   (adiscipleshipcourse.com) divider line 22
    More: Stupid, intestinal tract, plural marriage, interracial marriages, Dennis Prager  
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1197 clicks; posted to FarkUs » on 10 Apr 2013 at 8:41 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-04-10 05:12:28 AM
Because I'm awake and have nothing better to do, I'm going to tackle this list one by one.

MYTH #1
To be against gay marriage is to be a hate-filled bigot.


Irrelevant and not the point. We're talking about the legality of gay marriage. When interracial marriage was finally made lawful in the southern US states, whether people against it were racists or not is completely irrelevant to the ruling.

MYTH #2
Gay people should have the same civil rights as straight people.

...However, it should be remembered that no society in history, even those where homosexual behavior was celebrated (as in ancient Greece), ever broadened the word "marriage" to include gay commitments.

Once again, irrelevant. No society in history had private property, or corporate entity rights similar to those we have now. Terms such as "legal voter" and "person under the law" have been changed and broadened over time.  Societies change and evolve, to hold our past as an unchanging blueprint for our future is pointless.

MYTH #3
Marriage is simply a legal contract between two people.
But this does not change the fact that the institution of marriage itself has almost always implied an openness to children when conception is possible. Also, the complementarity of the two sexes in marriage provides children with an understanding of the differences between maleness and femaleness even when, over time, the distinct roles of men and women have changed.


In this day and age when adoption, surrogacy and in-vitro fertilization is possible, the notion of conception through solely heterosexual marriage is antiquated. The complementarity of the two sexes is not a necessary requirement for children to understand the differences between the sexes, as many children of single parents have clearly demonstrated.

MYTH #4
Children raised by same-sex parents do not suffer any discernible deprivation.


This particular line of reasoning always spikes my bullshiat meter. Since when is possible deprivation of future children a concern when heterosexual marriage is concerned? A convicted sex offender, mass-murderer, thief, adulterer, fraud, domestic abuser can marry anyone they so choose under the law, providing it's someone of the opposite gender. Where is the concern for the future offspring of this individual? Can we deny them the right to marry because their children might experience deprivation? No. So why is such an argument ever mentioned with regards to gay marriage? If anything, since couples who cannot procreate on their own must adopt children, they'll be exposed to much more rigorous standards than those whose sole prerequisites for child bearing involve having the necessary matching chromosomes.

MYTH #5
The acceptance of gay marriage will not influence impressionable young people's sexual orientation.


This is only a concern if you truly believe that there is something wrong with homosexuality. Plus, as many people have questioned, how do all these heterosexual parents keep having gay children?

MYTH #6
Gay marriage demonstrates the same kind of loving commitment as heterosexual marriage.
Here one needs to talk percentages. While adultery does occur in many heterosexual marriages, rarely are these marriages "open" to multiple sexual partners. However, surveys have shown that 95% of homosexual partnerships are intentionally "open" so that outside sexual liaisons are permitted. Moreover, the duration of homosexual partnerships is significantly shorter when compared to heterosexual marriages. Nor can it be demonstrated that by making these homosexual partnerships into "marriages" they will last longer. Where homosexual marriage presently is legal, the same shorter duration seems to be the norm


Irrelevant misdirection. When two people fill out a marriage certificate there isn't a portion titled "How many people have you farked in the last year and how many do you plan to fark in the future?", just as there isn't a section to determine how long you plan to stay married. An open marriage is just as legally binding as one that isn't, all this talk of promiscuity, marriage duration and number of partners is completely irrelevant since they're not conditions or variables applied to heterosexual marriages.

MYTH #7
There is nothing unsafe or unhealthy about gay sex.


Irrelevant. How two married people choose to express themselves sexually has no bearing on the legal definition of marriage.

MYTH #8
Gay marriage will not open the door to plural marriage or polygamy.
As Jewish writer Dennis Prager has argued, the "sexual revolution" initiated by the ancient Hebrews in which one man was to be committed to one woman -- a revolution that was continued, of course, by Christianity -- elevated women from being mere wombs to being persons worthy of dignity, respect, and protection


You mean those marriages so common in the Bible? As for women being persons worthy of dignity, respect and protection under Christianity? Strange that it took secular democratic institutions until the 19th century to grant women rights such as the right to own land, the right to control their own earnings and the right to choose their marriage partner.

MYTH #9
Divergent views about sexual behavior and the nature of marriage will continue to be respected.


What? You mean the nature of marriage that YOU hold sacred?


MYTH #10
Churches and clergy will be exempt from performing gay marriages.


How about we actually consider nations where same sex marriage is legal? Canada, for instance (which has had same-sex marriage since 2003), cannot force a church or denomination to marry same sex couples.
 
2013-04-10 05:32:26 AM

miss diminutive: Because I'm awake and have nothing better to do, I'm going to tackle this list one by one.


You didn't have to do that. The guy had just submitted this as a letter to the editor to the paper and I wanted to share the derp.
 
2013-04-10 08:21:34 AM
Currently the right to civil unions virtually guarantees the same legal rights to gay people as marriage does

Wait, this list has way more than 10 myths
 
2013-04-10 08:25:32 AM

serial_crusher: Currently the right to civil unions virtually guarantees the same legal rights to gay people as marriage does

Wait, this list has way more than 10 myths


About the only things that weren't myths were the 10 things he listed as myths.
 
2013-04-10 08:33:28 AM
Your blog sucks.

/and I'm not allowing Javascript for your site just to read that drivel.
 
2013-04-10 08:39:36 AM
Sure, people truly believe this. The ones that want to discriminate against gays marrying already by and large have convinced themselves that stories from 2000 years old sheepherders and fishermen about sky wizards and a magic zombie son are real. They also have convinced themselves that society never "redefined marriage" before, even though here in America we don't keep and marry our slave girls, and we don't condone raping women in order to force them to marry us.

Its interesting how much in common the anti gay marriage bigots have in common with the Taliban though.
 
2013-04-10 08:43:13 AM
Looks like marriage is an entitlement program for straight people.
 
2013-04-10 09:31:01 AM

Diogenes: Looks like marriage is an entitlement program for straight people.


Gotta do something to encourage them to be responsible for all those "oops" babies.
 
2013-04-10 10:09:10 AM
MYTH #4
Children raised by same-sex parents do not suffer any discernible deprivation.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r15EzL-D1p4
 
2013-04-10 10:12:21 AM
Be against gay marriage if you want, but don't pretend you have "facts" to back up your agruement when you don't.
 
2013-04-10 10:14:06 AM
MYTH #11
The author is not a douchebag.

FACT:
The author is a douchebag.
 
2013-04-10 10:17:18 AM
Reposted for Relevance...

Top Ten Reasons to Make Gay Marriage Illegal

01) Being gay is not natural. Real Americans always reject unnatural things like eyeglasses, polyester, and air conditioning.

02) Gay marriage will encourage people to be gay, in the same way that hanging around tall people will make you tall.

03) Legalizing gay marriage will open the door to all kinds of crazy behavior. People may even wish to marry their pets because a dog has legal standing and can sign a marriage contract.

04) Straight marriage has been around a long time and hasn't changed at all like many of the principles on which this great country was founded; women are still property, blacks still can't marry whites, and divorce is still illegal.

05) Straight marriage will be less meaningful if gay marriage were allowed; the sanctity of marriages like Britney Spears' 55-hour just-for-fun marriage would be destroyed.

06) Straight marriages are valid because they produce children. Gay couples, infertile couples, and old people shouldn't be allowed to marry because our orphanages aren't full yet, and the world needs more children.

07) Obviously gay parents will raise gay children, since straight parents only raise straight children.

08) Gay marriage is not supported by religion. In a theocracy like ours, the values of one religion are imposed on the entire country. That's why we have only one religion in America.

09) Children can never succeed without a male and a female role model at home. That's why we as a society expressly forbid single parents to raise children.

10) Gay marriage will change the foundation of society; we could never adapt to new social norms. Just like we haven't adapted to cars, the service-sector economy, or longer life spans.
 
2013-04-10 11:36:04 AM

Generation_D: The ones that want to discriminate against gays marrying already by and large have convinced themselves that stories from 2000 years old sheepherders and fishermen about sky wizards and a magic zombie son are real.


And yet lectures from the "magic zombie son" about the golden rule and do unto others as you would have done to you are one of the main reasons I've been supportive of gay rights.
Looks like prejudice has bit you directly on the ass.
/don't confuse Christianity with US right wing conservatism
 
2013-04-10 11:40:43 AM
Just wanted to add a point or two, so butting in.


miss diminutive: Because I'm awake and have nothing better to do, I'm going to tackle this list one by one.

MYTH #4
Children raised by same-sex parents do not suffer any discernible deprivation.

This particular line of reasoning always spikes my bullshiat meter. Since when is possible deprivation of future ...


It is also impossible to accurately judge this at this point.  Gay couples with children, in almost every instance, are still marginalized to some degree or another in this society.  I would be willing to bet every child of a gay couple has been teased and ostracized because of it at least once, likely more often.  I'd expect a slightly higher number of farkups out of this demographic.  This doesn't mean gay couples shouldn't have children; this will pass as society continues to change.  Do you think mixed race kids 60 years ago had it any easier?


MYTH #10
Churches and clergy will be exempt from performing gay marriages


This is such incredible BS.  Clergy can refuse to perform any marriage they want on religious grounds, just like they already do.  I know this first hand - I'm a Christian married to a Jew, and we had a hell of a time finding a Rabbi willing to officiate for us (ironically we ended up having a Secular Humanist officiate, which is another story).  All were justified in not taking the job, and I bear them no ill will for it.

There are those who may be forced to officiate weddings they don't want to, but not clergy; judges, justices of the peace, court clerks, and a few other government officials who are qualified to officiate.  I believe this one is untested yet in a court of law, but I would expect it to go the same as a government official who refuses to perform an interfaith or interracial marriage based upon religious beliefs.
 
2013-04-10 12:02:52 PM

Generation_D: we don't condone raping women in order to force them to marry us.


Speak for yourself.
 
2013-04-10 01:49:12 PM

Kurmudgeon: Generation_D: The ones that want to discriminate against gays marrying already by and large have convinced themselves that stories from 2000 years old sheepherders and fishermen about sky wizards and a magic zombie son are real.

And yet lectures from the "magic zombie son" about the golden rule and do unto others as you would have done to you are one of the main reasons I've been supportive of gay rights.
Looks like prejudice has bit you directly on the ass.
/don't confuse Christianity with US right wing conservatism


Had you farkied as "religious apologist."

nailed it again.

You can "do unto others" all you want, I will continue to point out that most asswits that are trying to deny gays equal rights under the law are religious fundamentalist asswits.
 
2013-04-10 05:20:10 PM

miss diminutive: A convicted sex offender, mass-murderer, thief, adulterer, fraud, domestic abuser can marry anyone they so choose under the law, providing it's someone of the opposite gender. Where is the concern for the future offspring of this individual?


Um, what happens when someone who is required by law to stay a certain distance away from children has children of their own?  Does the state remove them preemptively?
 
2013-04-10 05:31:29 PM

pciszek: Um, what happens when someone who is required by law to stay a certain distance away from children has children of their own?  Does the state remove them preemptively?


There was an article about this on the main page sometime last week I think where a couple kept having kids and they kept getting taken away at the hospital because the father was a sex offender with a history of molesting children.

I can't find it on a cursory search.  But yeah, that's what I'd expect to happen.
 
2013-04-11 02:51:24 AM

NkThrasher: pciszek: Um, what happens when someone who is required by law to stay a certain distance away from children has children of their own?  Does the state remove them preemptively?

There was an article about this on the main page sometime last week I think where a couple kept having kids and they kept getting taken away at the hospital because the father was a sex offender with a history of molesting children.

I can't find it on a cursory search.  But yeah, that's what I'd expect to happen.


For what it's worth, it was a Canadian couple, I believe, and the event in question happened when the guy was 12.  On the other hand, it also mentioned the guy was an alcoholic.
 
2013-04-11 04:09:38 AM

WhiteCrane: NkThrasher: pciszek: Um, what happens when someone who is required by law to stay a certain distance away from children has children of their own?  Does the state remove them preemptively?

There was an article about this on the main page sometime last week I think where a couple kept having kids and they kept getting taken away at the hospital because the father was a sex offender with a history of molesting children.

I can't find it on a cursory search.  But yeah, that's what I'd expect to happen.

For what it's worth, it was a Canadian couple, I believe, and the event in question happened when the guy was 12.  On the other hand, it also mentioned the guy was an alcoholic.


Here is the fark thread.
 
2013-04-11 06:19:53 AM
I did not write this.  I don't know who did

28 reasons to oppose gay marriage

1. Homosexuality is not natural, much like eyeglasses, polyester, and birth control.

2. Marriage is valuable because it produces children, which is why we deny marriage rights to infertile couples and old people.

3. Obviously, gay parents will raise gay children, since straight parents only raise straight children.

4. Straight marriage, such as Britney Spears' 55-hour escapade, will be less meaningful if gay marriage is allowed.

5. Marriage has been around a long time and hasn't changed at all: women are property, matches are arranged in childhood, blacks can't marry whites, Catholics can't marry Jews, divorce is illegal, and adultery is punishable by death.

6. Gay marriage should be decided by people, not the courts, because majority-elected legislatures have historically protected the rights of minorities.

7. Gay marriage is not supported by religion. In a theocracy like ours, the values of one religion are imposed on the entire country. That's why we have only one religion in America.

8. There is no separation between religious marriage and legal marriage, because there is no separation of church and state.

9. Devout, faithful Anglicans should never accept same-sex marriage, because it is an affront to the traditional family values upheld by Henry VIII and his wife, Catherine of Aragon, and his wife, Anne Boleyn, and his wife, Jane Seymour, and his wife, Anne of Cleves, and his wife, Catherine Howard, and his wife, Catherine Parr. They all knew the meaning of marriage and none of them lost their heads over the matter.

10. Married gay people will encourage others to be gay, in a way that unmarried gay people do not.

11. Legalizing gay marriage will open the door to all kinds of crazy behavior. People may even wish to marry their pets because dogs have legal standing and can sign marriage contracts.

12. Legalizing gay marriage will open the door to legislative change in general, which could possibly include the legalization of polygamy and incest. Because we don't know what comes next, we should never change our laws.

13. Children can never succeed without a male and a female role model at home. That's why single parents are forbidden to raise children.

14. Gay marriage will change the foundation of society. Heterosexual marriage has been around for a long time, and we could never adapt to new social norms because we haven't adapted to things like suburban malls and tupperware parties.

15. Legal marriage will inspire gays to mimic the straight traditions of spiritual commitment ceremonies and celebratory parties, which is currently impermissible for them to do and which they have never done before.

16. Marriage is designed to protect the well-being of children. Gay people do not need marriage because they never have children from prior relationships, artificial insemination or surrogacy, or adoption.

17. Civil unions are a good option because "separate but equal" institutions are always constitutional. In fact, compared with marriage, civil unions are so attractive that straight people are calling dibs on them.

18. A man should not be able to marry whomever a woman can marry, and a woman should not be able to marry whomever a man can marry, because in this country we do not believe in gender equality.

19. If gays marry, some of straight people's tax dollars would end up going to families whose structure they may find morally objectionable. Clearly, it is more just to continue taking gay people's tax dollars to support straight families, who are going to heaven regardless of what anyone else thinks of them.

20. Gays should hold off on the marriage question until society is more accepting of them, because they are not part of society.

21. The people's voice must be heard on this issue. Therefore, we must have a referendum on a constitutional amendment to ban same-sex marriage, because we can't think of any other way to discuss the issue.

22. Each state should decide for itself whether gay marriage will be recognized, because there is no "full faith and credit" clause that requires states to recognize each other's institutions.

23. Gay marriage attempts to replace natural heterosexual instinct with a cultural institution. Morality demands that we subordinate institutionalized commitment to raw, unfettered, biological impulse.

24. Gay marriages could very well suffer maladies like domestic violence and substance abuse. That's why we invented the Quality Control department to pre-approve the righteousness of all marriage applicants, such as convicted serial killer Richard Ramirez who married a woman while on Death Row.

25. Those who support gay marriage aim to overthrow the dominant culture, as evidenced by their enthusiasm to participate in it.

26. The country can't afford to provide benefits for married gay couples. That's why Bush would never consider spending $150 million on programs that encourage more straight people to get married.

27. Gay couples do not deserve marriage because, if everyone on earth limited themselves to same-sex sexual behavior, humanity would soon be extinct. Based on the same concern, we also deny marriage rights to the biologically childless and to those who have borne only one child. (We are also considering denying marriage rights to those who have borne three or more children, because if everyone copied them, the world population would shoot through the roof.)

28. Marriage was created in the Bible as a bond between a man and a woman. The people who lived prior to the writing of the Bible, such as the Chinese, sat around in confusion for many years until the Mesopotamians finally came around and invented the family unit.
 
2013-04-11 10:45:57 AM

miss diminutive: Because I'm awake and have nothing better to do, I'm going to tackle this list one by one.


Thank you.

hubiestubert: Reposted for Relevance...

Top Ten Reasons to Make Gay Marriage Illegal


And thank you.

Cloudchaser Sakonige the Red Wolf: I did not write this.  I don't know who did

28 reasons to oppose gay marriage


And thank you, too.
 
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