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(NPR)   New Jersey grandmother founds "Cursive Club" to keep alive the delicate art of cursive handwriting   (npr.org) divider line 105
    More: Hero, New Jersey, New Jersey grandmother, art  
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2227 clicks; posted to Main » on 09 Apr 2013 at 4:43 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-04-09 06:04:29 AM  
It is clearly Time for the Abandonment of the Abfurd practife of cursive Handwriting; except as an Art form as Practiced by Calligraphers.
 
mhd
2013-04-09 06:04:52 AM  

neongoats: WTF variant of cursive is THAT?


That's Sütterlin, a common variant of German handwriting, practically the cursive equivalent to blackletter. Abolished in 1941, although depending on your teacher you could still see its influence. The dash to distinguish a "u" from an "n" still is somewhat common.

/First word is "Lehrpersonen", i.e. "teachers"
 
2013-04-09 06:10:24 AM  
Block letters for everything. My signature is a meh attempt at cursive.
/ knuckle dragger
 
2013-04-09 06:14:24 AM  

mhd: neongoats: WTF variant of cursive is THAT?

That's Sütterlin, a common variant of German handwriting, practically the cursive equivalent to blackletter. Abolished in 1941, although depending on your teacher you could still see its influence. The dash to distinguish a "u" from an "n" still is somewhat common.

/First word is "Lehrpersonen", i.e. "teachers"


I was going to ask if the grandparents were German... It looks rather nazi... just sayin...
 
2013-04-09 06:28:50 AM  

CeroX: mhd: neongoats: WTF variant of cursive is THAT?

That's Sütterlin, a common variant of German handwriting, practically the cursive equivalent to blackletter. Abolished in 1941, although depending on your teacher you could still see its influence. The dash to distinguish a "u" from an "n" still is somewhat common.

/First word is "Lehrpersonen", i.e. "teachers"

I was going to ask if the grandparents were German... It looks rather nazi... just sayin...

 
2013-04-09 06:29:21 AM  

CeroX: It looks rather nazi... just sayin...


Go fark yourself, asshole.
 
2013-04-09 06:30:14 AM  

thamike: I speak in cursive sometimes.


s18.postimg.org
 
2013-04-09 06:31:01 AM  

Baron Harkonnen: CeroX: It looks rather nazi... just sayin...

Go fark yourself, asshole.


Seriously. Nazi's weren't all bad. Great language, snappy uniforms, good food.
 
2013-04-09 06:32:38 AM  
Where else but New Jersey would a grandmother start a cursing club? Holy shiat.

/dnrtfa
 
2013-04-09 06:33:21 AM  

robohobo: Baron Harkonnen: CeroX: It looks rather nazi... just sayin...

Go fark yourself, asshole.

Seriously. Nazi's weren't all bad. Great language, snappy uniforms, good food.


And once you've had one of their showers, you never take a normal shower again.
 
2013-04-09 06:33:43 AM  
Truly histories greatest hero!
 
2013-04-09 06:34:16 AM  

Baron Harkonnen: CeroX: It looks rather nazi... just sayin...

Go fark yourself, asshole.


I'm at work... that comes later as an after work destress...

But thanks for the reminder!
 
2013-04-09 06:35:19 AM  

untaken_name: robohobo: Baron Harkonnen: CeroX: It looks rather nazi... just sayin...

Go fark yourself, asshole.

Seriously. Nazi's weren't all bad. Great language, snappy uniforms, good food.

And once you've had one of their showers, you never take a normal shower again.


I hear they were a gas!
 
2013-04-09 06:47:34 AM  
hero? shiats useless.
 
2013-04-09 06:49:11 AM  
Lots of ITGs in here.
 
mhd
2013-04-09 06:54:53 AM  

CeroX: I was going to ask if the grandparents were German... It looks rather nazi... just sayin...


As I've said, it's basically the cursive pendant to printed blackletter, which seems indelibly associated with the Nazis. Which is kinda strange, as it's been in use since the Gutenberg bible and the Nazis actually abolished it. (Allegedly because of its - non-existing - Jewish roots, but mostly because Hitler didn't like it and thought that using the Latin script makes it easier to establish a cultural hegemony)

/Can't write cursive to save my life nowadays, but maybe it *does* help develop hand-eye coordination in (other) children
//Although you might as well teach a drawing class then
 
2013-04-09 06:59:30 AM  

mhd: My grandparents used to write like this:
[i.imgur.com image 458x244]
(this is a rather legible example, it gets worse from there)

That style of cursive went out of style along with blackletter printing, so in a few years people will be hard-pressed to find someone to decipher old documents.

Any sufficiently stylized cursive is indistinguishable from cryptography.


well if it was written in English it might be legible
 
2013-04-09 07:01:01 AM  

mhd: //Although you might as well teach a drawing class then


Great point, I think teaching that would benefit kids in school way more than teaching cursive. At least teach them calligraphy or something.
 
2013-04-09 07:08:27 AM  

mhd: CeroX: I was going to ask if the grandparents were German... It looks rather nazi... just sayin...

As I've said, it's basically the cursive pendant to printed blackletter, which seems indelibly associated with the Nazis. Which is kinda strange, as it's been in use since the Gutenberg bible and the Nazis actually abolished it. (Allegedly because of its - non-existing - Jewish roots, but mostly because Hitler didn't like it and thought that using the Latin script makes it easier to establish a cultural hegemony)

/Can't write cursive to save my life nowadays, but maybe it *does* help develop hand-eye coordination in (other) children
//Although you might as well teach a drawing class then


The main reason it looked that way to me was the rigid look and the long and almost vertical angles of many of the letters... reminds me a lot of old WW2 documents
 
2013-04-09 07:10:08 AM  
I like hearing this. I'm in the opposite camp, I write in cursive all the time, my printing is atrocious-can't draw a straight line. It's like how a stammerer can sing without affect. Plus, I find cursive for me is quicker than printing and I prefer it to typing as a pen facilitates layouts and drawing diagrams. I don't understand when people use a laptop to take notes. If you're just trying to use it as a dictation tool just record it.
 
2013-04-09 07:12:11 AM  
What does this have to do with sandwiches?
 
2013-04-09 07:15:51 AM  
Being able to write in a coherent script is still a valuable skill, it causes what you write to be consistently legible and prevents you from degenerating into scribbling like a medical resident filling out his 500th form of the day.

That said, cursive specifically is one of the less useful scripts, as the lack of distinction between the letters tends to turn into every letter being a vertical loop when you're in a rush, creating and exacerbating the entire problem that training your hand is supposed to address.  The "side issue" addressed by never picking the pen up is the fragility of quills and gravity-based ink systems (putting it down fresh with each letter would result in frequent blotches halfway through words, harder to read than blotches restricted to the beginning or end of a word), i.e. pens that essentially no one has used since the 1930s.  If you don't have to manually blot your ink when you're done writing, then cursive is the wrong script for you.
 
2013-04-09 07:20:30 AM  
If we lose the art of cursive writing just how will tattoo artists be able to ink excerpts from Walt Whitman's Leaves of Grass on the arms of athletes?
 
2013-04-09 07:22:14 AM  

farm machine: If we lose the art of cursive writing just how will tattoo artists be able to ink excerpts from Walt Whitman's Leaves of Grass on the arms of athletes?


Or RIP on gangbangers/white trash airbrushed t-shirts?
 
2013-04-09 07:24:26 AM  
I quit using cursive in 1995 except to sign my name... and until about 2 years ago my print was about as legible as a 4 year olds... Then one day I decided to make a serious change...

Now I'm one of those people that prints in all caps and just changes the size for capitalization...

Yep, i'm one of those people, but my handwriting has never been better...
 
2013-04-09 07:32:21 AM  

Yes this is dog: Are people under the impression that checks need to be written in cursive?


This. I mean especially this person who apparently had some concern that the check wouldn't clear because of one non-cursive letter.

Sim Tree: I had to write a check to a company recently, I forget which one exactly, which had a capital Q or X or Z in its name. As I put pen to paper, I stopped. I realized it'd been so long, I had absolutely no idea how to write those capital letters in cursive anymore. I remembered that one of them was actually written as a numeral two, or perhaps that was the L.
I finally put a print capital Q in there, instead, and wrote only the lowercase letters in cursive. The check cleared no problem. So I think I'm just going to do that from now on.


I print everything on my checks and sign my name. My signature is a cursive capital B followed by a bunch of scribbles. Very consistent scribbles, but if you didn't know my name, you would have zero chance of figuring it out from my signature.

The point is that there is absolutely no rule that says you have to write in cursive on your checks. If you have the account number, routing number and an unused check number from your bank account, you can write a check in crayon on a napkin from McDonalds in third grade girly balloon letters and sign it.
 
2013-04-09 07:41:55 AM  
I just worte a long paragraph in cursive to see if I could do it.

I cant.  I mean, I got it written, but not one of you would know what it says.

Capital letters suck.  I had to think about every single one of them.

the wierd thing is my fingers hurt.  After 1 paragraph. And people worry about carpal tunnel from typing.
 
2013-04-09 07:54:55 AM  

spittman: Yes this is dog: Are people under the impression that checks need to be written in cursive?

This. I mean especially this person who apparently had some concern that the check wouldn't clear because of one non-cursive letter.

Sim Tree: I had to write a check to a company recently, I forget which one exactly, which had a capital Q or X or Z in its name. As I put pen to paper, I stopped. I realized it'd been so long, I had absolutely no idea how to write those capital letters in cursive anymore. I remembered that one of them was actually written as a numeral two, or perhaps that was the L.
I finally put a print capital Q in there, instead, and wrote only the lowercase letters in cursive. The check cleared no problem. So I think I'm just going to do that from now on.

I print everything on my checks and sign my name. My signature is a cursive capital B followed by a bunch of scribbles. Very consistent scribbles, but if you didn't know my name, you would have zero chance of figuring it out from my signature.

The point is that there is absolutely no rule that says you have to write in cursive on your checks. If you have the account number, routing number and an unused check number from your bank account, you can write a check in crayon on a napkin from McDonalds in third grade girly balloon letters and sign it.


This.

The banks only care about a few things, aside from the magnetic ink info pre-printed on the check..

1.  The amount being machine readable.
2.  Nobody complains.
3.  There is something on the back that can be construed as an endorsement.

The tellers don't looks to see who it is written out to.  The machines that read them certainly don't.  Unless you are writing a huge check, your signature is not likely checked as well.  And as far as that goes, your signature doesn't have to be readable.  It only had to match what ever you left on file with the bank as the signature.    In the end the only time anyone cares about this stuff is if somebody, usually the depositor or account holder, complains about something being wrong.
 
2013-04-09 07:57:09 AM  
Printing...cursive...don't matter to me. I would rather just have people spell correctly instead of using "Ebonic shorthand".

There is no such word as "prolly" and you do not conversate with someone. Er..."sum1".
 
mhd
2013-04-09 08:06:44 AM  

cajunns: well if it was written in English it might be legible


Doesn't help a lot, but of course you're right in the way that we don't really read every letter, but guess most of the words on a page of text. Which works best if the text is rather regular, i.e. with all printed text and good cursive...
But to test your assumption, you culd try to spell the noun in the third line (second to last word) and the noun in the last (second word). One of them exists in English, too, although its meaning is quite different.

TheJoe03: Great point, I think teaching that would benefit kids in school way more than teaching cursive.


Well, I think the argument is that you already teach them how to write, so the time it takes to teach cursive is less than block letters + drawing. And probably that more teachers are qualified to do it.

CeroX: The main reason it looked that way to me was the rigid look and the long and almost vertical angles of many of the letters...


Yeah, lot's of "broken" angles, which is why it's commonly called Fraktur.
 
2013-04-09 08:09:17 AM  
I have one student who writes everything in cursive. While pretty and readable, it grinds my test grading to a halt.

/is that a G or D?
//shakes fist
 
2013-04-09 08:10:56 AM  

Brontes: I took the GRE in 2004 and they made you write out a paragraph in cursive.  After 4 years of EE with 0 cursive, I almost failed the GRE before it started :)


It should make you happy to know that the GRE is entirely computer based now. Even kept the ability to go back and check your answers. Getting a pat down, however, was unnecessary.

Handwritten vs pat down. Hrm.
 
2013-04-09 08:12:39 AM  
Such celebration of ignorance!

Cursive is still taught at my kid's public school in Ohio.
 
2013-04-09 08:25:15 AM  
My handwriting is a bastardized version of cursive. If I'm taking notes quickly, it is damned near illegible. When I'm not in a hurry, it looks pretty good and you can see the influence of cursive. My sisters, my grandmother and myself have similar appearance to our handwriting, which is kind of neat.

When I was in Grade 2, I won my school's penmanship award. The handwriting on the front of the package (a pen, duh) was my grandmother's. She was supposed to present the award but was sick from radiation therapy.
 
2013-04-09 08:25:37 AM  
They still manufacture "pens" and "pencils"?  I thought they quit making those around when the first Blackberry came out.
 
2013-04-09 08:27:51 AM  
Yeah... I'm not sure why you'd do decorative script as a hobby, but stop short of actual calligraphy.
 
2013-04-09 08:35:50 AM  
Why don't they teach cursive anymore?  Penmanship got me a job once.  Went to a job fair, filled out a bunch of applications, got call backs from each company with which I filed.  Each and everyone one of them mentioned that I was one of the few that they could actually read.
 
2013-04-09 08:46:19 AM  

cyberbenali: When I was in Grade 2, I won my school's penmanship award. The handwriting on the front of the package (a pen, duh) was my grandmother's. She was supposed to present the award but was sick from radiation therapy.


Ahh nepotism.
 
2013-04-09 09:08:29 AM  
My daughter is in the 3rd grade and she is learning cursive.
 
2013-04-09 09:08:42 AM  

robohobo: Baron Harkonnen: CeroX: It looks rather nazi... just sayin...

Go fark yourself, asshole.

Seriously. Nazi's weren't all bad. Great language, snappy uniforms, good food.


And nobody could put on large outdoor shows like them.
Although North Best Korea is givign them a run for their money.
 
2013-04-09 09:13:33 AM  

mhd: My grandparents used to write like this:

(this is a rather legible example, it gets worse from there)

That style of cursive went out of style along with blackletter printing, so in a few years people will be hard-pressed to find someone to decipher old documents.

Any sufficiently stylized cursive is indistinguishable from cryptography.


Ah, fraktur. The bizarre script that is keeping me from decoding a lot of family records from the 1800s. I can get help from friends for German in a more modern script (or transcribe it into Google Translate), but fraktur just doesn't work.

I print everything. There was a paragraph of some kind of anti-cheating statement on the MCAT, and we all struggled with it. It had to be purely cursive, no block or print at all, and nobody I knew was strictly cursive. At the least, people had a few letters in print for ease of writing.
 
2013-04-09 09:40:37 AM  
I hated using cursive in school.  Worst thing my teachers could say in elementary school was "Use cursive for everything from now on."  Which was followed by me failing assignments for having horrible cursive handwriting.

Now, thanks to iPads and laptops, I rarely have to put pen to paper.
 
2013-04-09 09:46:39 AM  
I still take all my notes in cursive. It feels more natural to me than printing does. That being said, a keyboard is orders of magnitude quicker, but not nearly as classy.
 
2013-04-09 09:51:42 AM  
images4.wikia.nocookie.net
Ok, now get out your circles of paper...

/hot, like the show used to be
 
2013-04-09 10:32:56 AM  

RenownedCurator: The only reason my cursive isn't a complete disaster is because I haven't got a printer and still need to write letters to my grandmother, who's over 90 and doesn't have a computer or use email. I do think it's important to keep it alive -- if nothing else, people need to be able to *read* it if they don't want an awful lot of the historical record to become illegible. (It's awful when fashions in writing change -- ever try reading anything in secretary hand? You can do it, but you have to really want to).


I think cursive is going to still be taught, but I wonder if it'll be much later, like high school.

I use cursive everyday, it's much faster for handwriting notes and my print is horrible.
 
2013-04-09 10:44:23 AM  

Mawson of the Antarctic: I like hearing this. I'm in the opposite camp, I write in cursive all the time, my printing is atrocious-can't draw a straight line. It's like how a stammerer can sing without affect. Plus, I find cursive for me is quicker than printing and I prefer it to typing as a pen facilitates layouts and drawing diagrams. I don't understand when people use a laptop to take notes. If you're just trying to use it as a dictation tool just record it.


I thought I was the only one... I could never type notes and listen to the lecture at the same time. My printing looks like a toddler. I can cursive write quickly, it still looks "childish" however.

On a side note, on non-lined paper does your writing go off on a slant (not even remotely straight at all)? I've been told that it's strange and someone once asked if I had a shoulder injury, but I've done that my whole life.
 
2013-04-09 10:57:35 AM  
This is why you need to learn handwriting

blog.oldversion.com
 
2013-04-09 11:01:15 AM  

DubtodaIll: Why don't they teach cursive anymore?  Penmanship got me a job once.  Went to a job fair, filled out a bunch of applications, got call backs from each company with which I filed.  Each and everyone one of them mentioned that I was one of the few that they could actually read.


One can exhibit penmanship without the use of cursive.
 
2013-04-09 11:48:48 AM  
Fark Cursive.  Cursive kept me from writing for years.  Now I write books - ON A FARKING COMPUTER THE WAY GOD INTENEDED ME AND EVERYONE ELSE TO WRITE.

Seriously FARK the people who lorded over me, saying I'd never be good at English because my handwriting sucked.  It's the ideas that matter and clearly their ideas sucked worse than my penmanship because they were teaching my ass English instead of being out on a book tour.

And yes, I am bitter.

Then again, I have a job as a computer programmer while all those jackasses are probably still teaching elementary English.
 
2013-04-09 11:49:53 AM  
images.sodahead.com
 
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