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(Kotaku)   It's amazing how many high-level execs refuse to learn that "always on and connected" is not a good thing   (kotaku.com) divider line 237
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8321 clicks; posted to Geek » on 05 Apr 2013 at 8:00 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-04-05 08:01:28 AM
This guy's a damn idiot. Whether you agree with always online or not, having someone at Microsoft telling their customers to "deal with it" is unacceptable. If I told one of our customers that at my place of employment, my ass would be on the street within the hour.

When are people going to learn that if you are employed, you are a representative of the company you are with whether you are clocked in to work or not, and you can't just say stupid crap like this online? Are people that idiotic?

Jesus, dude. Just shut up.
 
2013-04-05 08:08:40 AM
I know more than 6 people who have a 360 with no internet connection, which also handicaps them when somebody releases a shiatty game that  needs a launch day patch and can't get it (ie Walking Dead)
I also know a few people without a console or internet who will never buy a console if it means they also have to get the internet.
 
2013-04-05 08:08:50 AM
"Sometimes the electricity goes out. I will not buy a vacuum cleaner."

orly?!?
 
2013-04-05 08:09:21 AM
That guy must post here at Fark with that attitude.

What an asshat. Give me one benefit to ME in having an always on system? I have a time warner cable and my net goes out quite a bit. Plus MS recently had their cloud system go down and had to issue credits as an apology.

I'm an avid gamer with a busy life. If I find an hour to play and I can't? Rage time. I seriously might not buy the new Xbox if its always on.
 
2013-04-05 08:09:22 AM

Keywork99: This guy's a damn idiot. Whether you agree with always online or not, having someone at Microsoft telling their customers to "deal with it" is unacceptable. If I told one of our customers that at my place of employment, my ass would be on the street within the hour.

When are people going to learn that if you are employed, you are a representative of the company you are with whether you are clocked in to work or not, and you can't just say stupid crap like this online? Are people that idiotic?

Jesus, dude. Just shut up.


Look, obviously their customers will get over it.
 
2013-04-05 08:15:02 AM
I can see both sides of the argument.  Players look at it from the perspective of being farked over by Activision/EA shiatting on their customers by cheaping out and not placing appropriate server infrastructure for their always online games, combined with horrible cost cutting based programming and flawed software design.  So we hate it.

Microsoft looks at it from the perspective of their xbox Live service, which for general discussion purposes never goes down or gets overloaded, because microsoft knows This shiat Matters to their customers.  So it makes sense they would have a different perspective, since they dont mind paying the money for appropriate servers and competent programming.

I agree in general with the "get with the times" statement though... different people have different priorities, but I for example take my internet connection seriously, and it is one of the primary factors I look at when moving and choosing a home.  If its got bullshiat internet, no thanks.  Next.

/Microsoft exec still a douche though
 
2013-04-05 08:15:10 AM
Well, if by "deal with it" you mean "exercise choice when purchasing a new console" and send my money to a different company? Sure thing.
 
2013-04-05 08:21:29 AM
Well that was certainly a creative response from their creative director. I doubt the marketing team is too happy, and the sales folks generally frown upon shiatting on potential buyers.
 
2013-04-05 08:21:45 AM

Alonjar: I can see both sides of the argument.  Players look at it from the perspective of being farked over by Activision/EA shiatting on their customers by cheaping out and not placing appropriate server infrastructure for their always online games, combined with horrible cost cutting based programming and flawed software design.  So we hate it.

Microsoft looks at it from the perspective of their xbox Live service, which for general discussion purposes never goes down or gets overloaded, because microsoft knows This shiat Matters to their customers.  So it makes sense they would have a different perspective, since they dont mind paying the money for appropriate servers and competent programming.

I agree in general with the "get with the times" statement though... different people have different priorities, but I for example take my internet connection seriously, and it is one of the primary factors I look at when moving and choosing a home.  If its got bullshiat internet, no thanks.  Next.

/Microsoft exec still a douche though


So if they now make me have it, do I get to stop paying them 60 a year for it?

This is all about piracy, period. Modding consoles is such a pita that its not like it is ever going to be widespread.

The major flaw here (same with EA) is that they piss off their paying customers just to keep some others for getting their stuff for free. Guess what guys? You can probably not convert pirates to paying customers. This business model may reduce piracy, but at a cost to total revenue.
 
2013-04-05 08:25:31 AM

Alonjar: I can see both sides of the argument.  Players look at it from the perspective of being farked over by Activision/EA shiatting on their customers by cheaping out and not placing appropriate server infrastructure for their always online games, combined with horrible cost cutting based programming and flawed software design.  So we hate it.

Microsoft looks at it from the perspective of their xbox Live service, which for general discussion purposes never goes down or gets overloaded, because microsoft knows This shiat Matters to their customers.  So it makes sense they would have a different perspective, since they dont mind paying the money for appropriate servers and competent programming.

I agree in general with the "get with the times" statement though... different people have different priorities, but I for example take my internet connection seriously, and it is one of the primary factors I look at when moving and choosing a home.  If its got bullshiat internet, no thanks.  Next.

/Microsoft exec still a douche though


Well then. That's pretty much what I came in here the post but with better grammar, spelling, and punctuation.

My brother is one of these people he complains to about how he can't afford an internet connection and shells out more money for cable television. Palm this is face. Face I'd like to introduce you to palm.
 
2013-04-05 08:26:50 AM
It's amazing how many high-level execs refuse to learn that "always on and connected" is not a good thing from their mistakes and blame it on someone else.

Not so much FTFSubby, but more like a epidemic when it comes to execs, period.
 
2013-04-05 08:31:39 AM
It's been five years since I was in the Gamestop trenches, and I imagine the numbers are slightly different now.  When I gave up being the manager and went back to grad school in the fall of 2007, we had just gone through the Madden/NCAA 08 releases and were preparing for the Halo 3 launch.  I would say that at least 40% of my customers did not have access to broadband internet, and therefore had no ability to play the games online.  Shadowrun was released that same summer, and its sales were terrible not just because the game wasn't much good, but because customers of mine who were willing to preorder it did not do so because it was online-only, and if you didn't live within Time-Warner's fiefdom there was no way you were getting anything other than 56k through Embarq out in the county.

That has changed in Wilson County, though.  Everyone in the city now has access to municipal fiberoptic, and the plan is to expand that to everyone in the county very soon.  But it's only one small semi-rural county 45 minutes from a major metropolitan area (not counting the whole "Time-Warner paid the state legislature to make it illegal for other towns to do the same thing").  This is Orth's problem; he lives in Redmond or somewhere within that part of the Seattle metro area.  I'm sure there's not a neighborhood within 25 miles of him that doesn't have access to broadband.  But places like eastern North Carolina aren't like that, and I wonder when was the last time Orth lived in an area with less than 1,500 people/sq mi.
 
2013-04-05 08:33:23 AM

Alonjar: Microsoft looks at it from the perspective of their xbox Live service, which for general discussion purposes never goes down or gets overloaded, because microsoft knows This shiat Matters to their customers. So it makes sense they would have a different perspective, since they dont mind paying the money for appropriate servers and competent programming.


It is a draconian method for trying to counter piracy and it is insulting in the extreme because it treats all customers as presumed guilty.

I absolutely will not purchase products like this from any company and any company who pursues this type of policy will be inciting ill will in their potential customer base.
 
2013-04-05 08:35:39 AM
And what happens when their servers go away? Are they going to run them forever?
 
2013-04-05 08:39:06 AM
I know people with XBox 360s who don't have a reliable internet connection, because the terrible ISP they use is the only one with service where they live.

Blame the ISPs, not the customers. If Microsoft wants an always-online console, they should lobby congress to reform our horrible internet infrastructure first.
 
2013-04-05 08:39:41 AM
Oh, and "Oh, Snap!"

i.imgur.com
 
2013-04-05 08:43:13 AM

Kiribub: Well, if by "deal with it" you mean "exercise choice when purchasing a new console" and send my money to a different company? Sure thing.


Problem is that the PS4 looks like garbage as well. I don't need a constant twitter feed running on the side while I play a game, thanks.

If the 720 and PS4 continue this way I may just skip this console generation and move to PC for everything.
 
2013-04-05 08:45:03 AM
It looks like I'm going to have to go PC next gen. The exclusives are all meh and this nonsense will not stand.
 
2013-04-05 08:45:10 AM
I have a 360, I play games occasionally. I don't have a Live subscription, and likely never will. I like to play by myself, I don't play anything online, I don't like the idea of playing a game connected to strangers online. That's just me. I like to pop in a game disk, shoot some bad guys for a while, then turn it off and go back to my life. I'll play again later, in a week or a month. I don't need or want any of the online features, and I certainly don't want to pay $60 for them.
If that's my only option when it comes to buying a new console, I'll hang on to my 360 until I can no longer get games for it, then shop around for a different platform.
 
2013-04-05 08:46:36 AM

Klivian: Kiribub: Well, if by "deal with it" you mean "exercise choice when purchasing a new console" and send my money to a different company? Sure thing.

Problem is that the PS4 looks like garbage as well. I don't need a constant twitter feed running on the side while I play a game, thanks.

If the 720 and PS4 continue this way I may just skip this console generation and move to PC for everything.


Join the glorious master PC gaming race!
 
2013-04-05 08:46:45 AM
members.iglou.com
 
2013-04-05 08:46:50 AM
I'm not believing anything till they get into launch mode with this new console.
Right now its all "heard it from a guy" type rumors.  Most of which are either malicious or outright fabrications to drag people into clicking on websites.

I'm saving my jimmies for when Microsoft has actually said something.
 
2013-04-05 08:46:52 AM
Yes in a market where you want maximum saturation it obviously is a wise idea to force your product to require a connection service in for that market where the saturation for that connection service is poorly distributed and often times unreliable.

facepalm.jpg
 
2013-04-05 08:47:21 AM
D'oh. Wrong discussion. I apologize.
 
2013-04-05 08:47:24 AM

Gergesa: Alonjar: Microsoft looks at it from the perspective of their xbox Live service, which for general discussion purposes never goes down or gets overloaded, because microsoft knows This shiat Matters to their customers. So it makes sense they would have a different perspective, since they dont mind paying the money for appropriate servers and competent programming.

It is a draconian method for trying to counter piracy and it is insulting in the extreme because it treats all customers as presumed guilty.

I absolutely will not purchase products like this from any company and any company who pursues this type of policy will be inciting ill will in their potential customer base.


I don't see this one being an anti-piracy measure. I mean they definitely make it harder/impossible to pirate games but they also gain control over the used game market which console makers have been trying to do forever. Combine that with the "Sell the game with a bunch of shiat disabled and sell those disabled bits a piece at a time after the fact." school of game design and I think those are more likely the thinking.

I am glad I stuck with PCs for gaming, even if every major studio goes for always on DRM crap there's enough indy studios that are quite willing to just sell you the game. Currently sinking time into Don't Starve which is stupidly fun... like a soft core version of Dwarf Fortress with nice graphics.
 
2013-04-05 08:48:04 AM
Telling customers to "deal with it" is bad, but it's only a symptom. Believing -- behind closed doors -- that consumers should just "deal with it" is the disease. It's a deadly disease.
 
2013-04-05 08:48:23 AM

Tyrone Slothrop: Klivian: Kiribub: Well, if by "deal with it" you mean "exercise choice when purchasing a new console" and send my money to a different company? Sure thing.

Problem is that the PS4 looks like garbage as well. I don't need a constant twitter feed running on the side while I play a game, thanks.

If the 720 and PS4 continue this way I may just skip this console generation and move to PC for everything.

Join the glorious master PC gaming race!


But I've owned multiple consoles in each generation! I don't know if I have enough snob/douchebaggery in me...
 
2013-04-05 08:48:27 AM

way south: I'm saving my jimmies for when Microsoft has actually said something.


Well, Microsoft did say  something. That "something" was a stream of insults and mockery directed at their customers.
 
2013-04-05 08:49:02 AM
My argument against online consoles:

Sometimes I just don't want to play with others. And I don't want them messaging me. Or calling me and saying "I see you're online, wanna play? Why not?".
 
2013-04-05 08:49:52 AM
He's right though, they will 'get over it' and they will buy it.  Video gamers aren't that bright and have demonstrated time and time again that they'll settle for an obscenely large dong in their ass just so long as they get to look at the shiny shiny.

There are even segments of the market who are proud to defend the dong in their ass simply because it has an EA or Activision or Blizzard logo tattooed on it.   The '720' could require daily kitten sacrifices and it'd still fly off the damn shelves.
 
2013-04-05 08:51:06 AM

Klivian: Kiribub: Well, if by "deal with it" you mean "exercise choice when purchasing a new console" and send my money to a different company? Sure thing.

Problem is that the PS4 looks like garbage as well. I don't need a constant twitter feed running on the side while I play a game, thanks.

If the 720 and PS4 continue this way I may just skip this console generation and move to PC for everything.


Welcome friend. It's a good time to jump onboard. For the price of a new console, you can make a pretty good gaming box. Do it.
 
2013-04-05 08:52:51 AM

drewsclues: Klivian: Kiribub: Well, if by "deal with it" you mean "exercise choice when purchasing a new console" and send my money to a different company? Sure thing.

Problem is that the PS4 looks like garbage as well. I don't need a constant twitter feed running on the side while I play a game, thanks.

If the 720 and PS4 continue this way I may just skip this console generation and move to PC for everything.

Welcome friend. It's a good time to jump onboard. For the price of a new console, you can make a pretty good gaming box. Do it.


What are you purchasing? When I last priced video cards, they were more expensive than any current generation game console.
 
2013-04-05 08:53:35 AM
Make it an enviornment issue.

Microsoft contributes to global warming by requiring an always on internet connection. Why does microsoft hate polar bears?

Tweet that make it viral get in their faces fair share etc....
 
2013-04-05 08:54:16 AM

Dimensio: When I last priced video cards, they were more expensive than any current generation game console.


The thing you have to keep in mind is that, these days, most games are targeted towards consoles. This means that even on the PC, their hardware requirements are angled towards 5 year old hardware.
 
2013-04-05 08:55:20 AM
So what I'm hearing is fark me if I have to deploy to another shiathole and want to take my games with me.
 
2013-04-05 08:55:31 AM

ModernLuddite: My argument against online consoles:

Sometimes I just don't want to play with others. And I don't want them messaging me. Or calling me and saying "I see you're online, wanna play? Why not?".


Appropriate response for appropriate handle

Us old folks just want to play with ourselves... is that so bad?
 
2013-04-05 08:56:07 AM
Wow, if I were to act like that with a potential customer at my job I'd be fired on the spot.. Way to alienate your fanbase there arsehole...
 
2013-04-05 08:58:51 AM
Oh, and this:

http://www.quickmeme.com/Always-Online-Adam-Orth/?upcoming

Just skimmed the thread, sorry if it's a repost.
 
2013-04-05 09:00:06 AM
nocturnal001: I seriously might not buy the new Xbox if its always on.

Yes, you will.  And they know it.

It doesn't matter what kind of abuse game and console developers pile on gamers, they will always come back and buy because they are hopelessly and pathetically addicted.
 
2013-04-05 09:01:40 AM

Dimensio: drewsclues: Klivian: Kiribub: Well, if by "deal with it" you mean "exercise choice when purchasing a new console" and send my money to a different company? Sure thing.

Problem is that the PS4 looks like garbage as well. I don't need a constant twitter feed running on the side while I play a game, thanks.

If the 720 and PS4 continue this way I may just skip this console generation and move to PC for everything.

Welcome friend. It's a good time to jump onboard. For the price of a new console, you can make a pretty good gaming box. Do it.

What are you purchasing? When I last priced video cards, they were more expensive than any current generation game console.


Uh, a radeon 6570 is on par with the 360 gpu if we're being generous to the 360 and its about $55 on newegg
 
2013-04-05 09:09:09 AM

t3knomanser: way south: I'm saving my jimmies for when Microsoft has actually said something.

Well, Microsoft did say  something. That "something" was a stream of insults and mockery directed at their customers.


Officially, Microsoft ain't said jack.
Some suit that works for them vented on twitter as they tend to do. Maybe to gauge reaction, or maybe he spent the last few hours "not getting it" in a room full of people trying in desperation to explain it to him.
Everyone's going apeshiat about something that should have been decided on months ago, and probably is.

Until they've put something out, I'm doing my best to not care about the pointless speculation.
 
2013-04-05 09:09:47 AM
So some farkers believe that anything said on a public forum that can be tied back to their place of employment should reflect on their employability.

Good to know.
 
2013-04-05 09:11:30 AM

way south: Some suit that works for them vented on twitter as they tend to do.


He vented on a topic clearly related to his work. Whether officially or not, he was clearly representing Microsoft, and in that capacity, insulted and mocked customers.
 
2013-04-05 09:12:14 AM
"just deal with it"

Imagine if a ford exec said that when their Explorers were "exploding" in their garages due to faulty ignition switches...

This phrase needs to die a quick death before it gets into other sectors of business.
 
2013-04-05 09:14:23 AM
"Deal with it" = buy a PS4 or WiiU instead.

Vote with your dollars people.  If you find this outrageous (and you should - requiring an internet connection for a single-player experience is unnecessary, controlling, and arrogant, and bound to cause problems for lots of people), then spend your money elsewhere.
 
2013-04-05 09:16:42 AM

Alonjar: Microsoft looks at it from the perspective of their xbox Live service, which for general discussion purposes never goes down or gets overloaded


archive.heinessen.com

It may not have had the month-long outages PSN has, but it has gone down, sometimes for a week at a time.  Imagine how much worse it will be with every console hitting those servers all the time.
 
2013-04-05 09:17:46 AM

Doc Daneeka: "Deal with it" = buy a PS4 or WiiU instead.

Vote with your dollars people.  If you find this outrageous (and you should - requiring an internet connection for a single-player experience is unnecessary, controlling, and arrogant, and bound to cause problems for lots of people), then spend your money elsewhere.


I already did.

www.pcper.com
 
2013-04-05 09:18:26 AM
Looks like this guy is taking a page from the EA playbook of having contempt for your userbase. Hopefully he'll also go the way the last EA CEO did with their shiat release of their "always on" game.
 
2013-04-05 09:18:26 AM
This war on piracy is getting ludicrous. It's their product and their call to make if they want to make it always online; I just know that when Diablo 3 was announced always-online, I bought Torchlight II. When Starcraft was always-online, I just reinstalled Supreme Commander FA and played that instead. SimCity 5? Bought Tropico 4.

All this will do is weaken sales and kill markets, and it evolves better mods, better hacks, and better pirates who weren't going to buy the product anyway.

And frankly, if I want to play by myself, or in a LAN, I do not want to communicate with a server a thousand km's distant. In many cases, I can't.

/i'm sorry, your car cannot communicate with the dealership server; your car's engine is unavailable at this time
 
2013-04-05 09:19:02 AM

narkor: So some farkers believe that anything said on a public forum that can be tied back to their place of employment should reflect on their employability.

Good to know.


So some farkers believe that intentionally antagonizing the very people who give you money on a public forum is a smart business move and considered just "anything".
 
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