FARK.com: (7682713) MLB ticket demand visualization chart shows the two most annoying fandoms will show up at any ballpark & drive prices up

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		MLB ticket demand visualization chart shows the two most annoying fandoms will show up at any ballpark & drive prices up (deadspin.com)		70
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WTF Indeed		2013-04-04 12:23:49 PM

It's almost like that chart shows that people go to see the Yankees when they are in town in hopes that their team beats them. Perhaps a good, and spending, Yankees team is good for baseball since all teams make more money when they are in town, and that the more you hate and root against the Yankees, the more successful the game is.

Le Grand Inquisitor		2013-04-04 12:34:00 PM

The SF Giants chart confuses me...Giants/Dodger games are always marked up. Just another example of an article espousing the east coast bias.

IAmRight		2013-04-04 12:34:20 PM

Hey, Seattle didn't kill demand everywhere! Colorado attendance went up!

Why so f*cking much of an increase with those Pirates games in San Francisco? Gonna assume something else was going on besides the Pirates.

lunchinlewis		2013-04-04 12:34:44 PM

WTF Indeed: It's almost like that chart shows that people go to see the Yankees when they are in town in hopes that their team beats them. Perhaps a good, and spending, Yankees team is good for baseball since all teams make more money when they are in town, and that the more you hate and root against the Yankees, the more successful the game is.

I can say from experience that the big green box in Baltimore for Yankee games is(was) Yankee fans.

Also neat to see the Nats have an impact in Boston and Chicago. Kind of surprising actually. And a big negative in Pittsburgh, because you suck Pittsburgh.

IAmRight		2013-04-04 12:37:05 PM

Just checked - opening series at home for the Giants.

Nana's Vibrator		2013-04-04 12:38:01 PM

I mostly skimmed it, but the whole thing confuses me. I see that Yankees and Red Sox drive prices up for about half the teams (the American League+ a few interleague games)...but practically every other team has more pink than green. So most teams drive prices...down? Am I seeing a face value ticket price problem here?

jbc		2013-04-04 12:39:59 PM

You're misreading the Cubs column, Subby, and the Packers are in the NFL.

ElwoodCuse		2013-04-04 12:41:58 PM

Nana's Vibrator: I mostly skimmed it, but the whole thing confuses me. I see that Yankees and Red Sox drive prices up for about half the teams (the American League+ a few interleague games)...but practically every other team has more pink than green. So most teams drive prices...down? Am I seeing a face value ticket price problem here?

Yep. MLB tickets are overpriced. And not in a boohoo those millionaire ballplayers I saw Mickey Mantle for a quarter way. I mean an Econ 101 way. Tickets from the team are priced too high so people buy them on Stubhub or whatever for below face. Naturally MLB's response to this was to get pissy at Stubhub.

Yanks_RSJ		2013-04-04 12:42:21 PM

lunchinlewis: I can say from experience that the big green box in Baltimore for Yankee games is(was) Yankee fans.

Well, that's what it became after several years of Orioles futility, but at least for a while there was a good mix. I don't really think the number of Yankee fans showing up in Baltimore changed all that much, it was just more noticeable when they represented 80% of the seats instead of 40-50%.

DirtyDeadGhostofEbenezerCooke		2013-04-04 12:45:09 PM

Kuta		2013-04-04 12:48:14 PM

Yeah right. When the Pittsburgh Pirates come to SF, the whole city gets into a frothy lather.

Lost Thought 00		2013-04-04 12:48:52 PM

ElwoodCuse: Nana's Vibrator: I mostly skimmed it, but the whole thing confuses me. I see that Yankees and Red Sox drive prices up for about half the teams (the American League+ a few interleague games)...but practically every other team has more pink than green. So most teams drive prices...down? Am I seeing a face value ticket price problem here?

Yep. MLB tickets are overpriced. And not in a boohoo those millionaire ballplayers I saw Mickey Mantle for a quarter way. I mean an Econ 101 way. Tickets from the team are priced too high so people buy them on Stubhub or whatever for below face. Naturally MLB's response to this was to get pissy at Stubhub.

I never understood their frustration. The club got full price for those tickets when they were initially purchased. Do they really think that any of the secondary buyers would buy a new ticket if the secondary market didn't exist? At least this way they get people in the door for concessions.

jackiepaper		2013-04-04 12:49:26 PM

IAmRight: Hey, Seattle didn't kill demand everywhere! Colorado attendance went up!

Why so f*cking much of an increase with those Pirates games in San Francisco? Gonna assume something else was going on besides the Pirates.

IAmRight: Just checked - opening series at home for the Giants.

They should throw out that outlier, given that the Pirates were only in SF once last year

downstairs		2013-04-04 12:52:08 PM

IAmRight: Just checked - opening series at home for the Giants.

Since this chart is for one season, there's far too much "small sample size" going on.

Too many external variables in one season, espcecially since the vast majority of teams will only visit you once in the year.

Pennant races
Special promotions
Opening series

jackiepaper		2013-04-04 12:52:52 PM

Are most teams using dynamic pricing these days?

lunchinlewis		2013-04-04 12:55:01 PM

IAmRight: Just checked - opening series at home for the Giants.

That explains the Cubs boost for the Nats series. Should have remembered that, since the TV guys were biatching about how cold it was in Chicago. They were still biatching about it last night.

tallguywithglasseson		2013-04-04 12:56:51 PM

I get why the Twins would drive up prices for Brewers games at Miller Park... lots of people drive down from the Twin Cities to watch those games.

Don't understand why they would drive up prices in Baltimore. At all.

IAmRight		2013-04-04 12:56:57 PM

jackiepaper: They should throw out that outlier, given that the Pirates were only in SF once last year

I'm not sure I'd throw it out, necessarily, just give it an asterisk.

/kinda like everyone wanted to with the last notable Pittsburgh-to-San Francisco product
//yeah, I wanted to make a tie-in there but I'm too lazy to make it perfect

Raging Whore Moans		2013-04-04 12:56:59 PM

What about bobblehead/Snuggie™/free range chicken nights?

desertgeek		2013-04-04 12:57:22 PM

jackiepaper: Are most teams using dynamic pricing these days?

Seems like it. I know that understanding the Dbacks ticket prices seems to require a doctorate in quantum physics.

A Fark Handle		2013-04-04 01:00:13 PM

Nana's Vibrator: I mostly skimmed it, but the whole thing confuses me. I see that Yankees and Red Sox drive prices up for about half the teams (the American League+ a few interleague games)...but practically every other team has more pink than green. So most teams drive prices...down? Am I seeing a face value ticket price problem here?

yeah, it's laughable what the team want to charge. i mean they can set prices wherever they want, but with 81 home games per market, and hd tv, then the prices they want charge once you're in the door...there's really not the market that they think there is. and that's ok. after all, much of sports at this point is producing live tv entertain to sell which in the age of dvrs and tivo is very very valuable the networks.

ElwoodCuse		2013-04-04 01:03:37 PM

Lost Thought 00: ElwoodCuse: Nana's Vibrator: I mostly skimmed it, but the whole thing confuses me. I see that Yankees and Red Sox drive prices up for about half the teams (the American League+ a few interleague games)...but practically every other team has more pink than green. So most teams drive prices...down? Am I seeing a face value ticket price problem here?

Yep. MLB tickets are overpriced. And not in a boohoo those millionaire ballplayers I saw Mickey Mantle for a quarter way. I mean an Econ 101 way. Tickets from the team are priced too high so people buy them on Stubhub or whatever for below face. Naturally MLB's response to this was to get pissy at Stubhub.

I never understood their frustration. The club got full price for those tickets when they were initially purchased. Do they really think that any of the secondary buyers would buy a new ticket if the secondary market didn't exist? At least this way they get people in the door for concessions.

Yeah they do. They don't like that already-sold tickets are cutting into the market for unsold tickets.

They REALLY hated all those sub-$1 Marlins tickets too. Now you can't sell tickets for under $6, I think it is.

Deneb81		2013-04-04 01:03:39 PM

tallguywithglasseson: I get why the Twins would drive up prices for Brewers games at Miller Park... lots of people drive down from the Twin Cities to watch those games.

Don't understand why they would drive up prices in Baltimore. At all.

Opening Day at Camden Yards.

jackiepaper		2013-04-04 01:05:03 PM

IAmRight: jackiepaper: They should throw out that outlier, given that the Pirates were only in SF once last year

I'm not sure I'd throw it out, necessarily, just give it an asterisk.

/kinda like everyone wanted to with the last notable Pittsburgh-to-San Francisco product
//yeah, I wanted to make a tie-in there but I'm too lazy to make it perfect

not "everyone." many people are intelligent enough to understand, unlike Marc Ecko, that intellectual honesty would require an asterisk on a hundred other players' stats, and many teams' titles as well.

85blue		2013-04-04 01:05:25 PM

There is no reason to pay more than $20 to see a game.Go to the park and a find ticket(scalper or park itself)Stubhub,ticket agencies,season ticket holders,and private businesses buying up tickets have artificially inflated the prices.Even if a team is "sold out" there are tickets.I go to Red Sox games often and have never paid more than $25 a ticket.Don't buy into "sold out" or "popular seats".

Deneb81		2013-04-04 01:05:32 PM

desertgeek: jackiepaper: Are most teams using dynamic pricing these days?

Seems like it. I know that understanding the Dbacks ticket prices seems to require a doctorate in quantum physics.

Quantum prices - like airline prices, they're changed when you look for them.

tallguywithglasseson		2013-04-04 01:09:09 PM

downstairs: IAmRight: Just checked - opening series at home for the Giants.

Since this chart is for one season, there's far too much "small sample size" going on.

Too many external variables in one season, espcecially since the vast majority of teams will only visit you once in the year.

Pennant races
Special promotions
Opening series

Ah, good point. Would definitely want to see data over more than one season.

Deneb81: Opening Day at Camden Yards.

Makes sense (as noted above, case in point).

Super Chronic		2013-04-04 01:09:58 PM

Nana's Vibrator: I mostly skimmed it, but the whole thing confuses me. I see that Yankees and Red Sox drive prices up for about half the teams (the American League+ a few interleague games)...but practically every other team has more pink than green. So most teams drive prices...down? Am I seeing a face value ticket price problem here?

I think it's just math. The mean average effect of all teams on ticket prices has to be zero (average price is average price, and when all games are included there is no deviation from the average). When there are two teams way above zero, the average of all the rest has to be somewhat below zero. Kind of like the standings: take the top team out of it and the rest of the league is sub-.500.

The Muthaship		2013-04-04 01:10:48 PM

Can't we just let them play each other every day?

/ESPN would die of priapism....

Crewmannumber6		2013-04-04 01:21:15 PM

There's probably a high school near you, and they probably have a baseball team.

phaseolus		2013-04-04 01:26:17 PM

tallguywithglasseson: I get why the Twins would drive up prices for Brewers games at Miller Park... lots of people drive down from the Twin Cities to watch those games.

It sort of makes sense that Milwaukee on the road at Wrigley Field drives down prices, too, I expect there's close to zero demand from Milwaukeeans.

First there's the traditional Milwaukee cheapskate psychology, it wouldn't be in character to pay a premium for something we can get at regular prices back home. Second, most of us have seen the worst kind of drunken belligerent Cubs fan up close, and those are the ones that stick in memory. Who in their right mind would wanna be surrounded by them?

SlothB77		2013-04-04 01:46:02 PM

IAmRight: Why so f*cking much of an increase with those Pirates games in San Francisco? Gonna assume something else was going on besides the Pirates.

came to say this. doesn't make sense.

bacongood		2013-04-04 01:48:28 PM

phaseolus: tallguywithglasseson: I get why the Twins would drive up prices for Brewers games at Miller Park... lots of people drive down from the Twin Cities to watch those games.

It sort of makes sense that Milwaukee on the road at Wrigley Field drives down prices, too, I expect there's close to zero demand from Milwaukeeans.

First there's the traditional Milwaukee cheapskate psychology, it wouldn't be in character to pay a premium for something we can get at regular prices back home. Second, most of us have seen the worst kind of drunken belligerent Cubs fan up close, and those are the ones that stick in memory. Who in their right mind would wanna be surrounded by them?

Because if you want drunk and belligerent, you just stay in Milwaukee.

85blue		2013-04-04 01:53:38 PM

bacongood: phaseolus: tallguywithglasseson: I get why the Twins would drive up prices for Brewers games at Miller Park... lots of people drive down from the Twin Cities to watch those games.

It sort of makes sense that Milwaukee on the road at Wrigley Field drives down prices, too, I expect there's close to zero demand from Milwaukeeans.

First there's the traditional Milwaukee cheapskate psychology, it wouldn't be in character to pay a premium for something we can get at regular prices back home. Second, most of us have seen the worst kind of drunken belligerent Cubs fan up close, and those are the ones that stick in memory. Who in their right mind would wanna be surrounded by them?

Because if you want drunk and belligerent, you just stay in Milwaukee.

Or http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ten_Cent_Beer_Night

Super Chronic		2013-04-04 02:02:00 PM

Super Chronic: Nana's Vibrator: I mostly skimmed it, but the whole thing confuses me. I see that Yankees and Red Sox drive prices up for about half the teams (the American League+ a few interleague games)...but practically every other team has more pink than green. So most teams drive prices...down? Am I seeing a face value ticket price problem here?

I think it's just math. The mean average effect of all teams on ticket prices has to be zero (average price is average price, and when all games are included there is no deviation from the average). When there are two teams way above zero, the average of all the rest has to be somewhat below zero. Kind of like the standings: take the top team out of it and the rest of the league is sub-.500.

OK, I see that we're comparing secondary market prices with face, so there's no rule that says the average has to be zero. However, the fact that the mean average is, in fact, somewhere close to zero (with a couple of teams way above and the rest averaging somewhat below) shows me that teams are doing a pretty good job setting face values. If it were a sea of green it would appear that teams were leaving money on the table.

thecpt		2013-04-04 02:04:05 PM

Tb and the phillies?

Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo		2013-04-04 02:19:26 PM

Who actually goes to baseball games anymore? Every time I see a game on TV, they are very careful not to show the stands too often, because they're mostly empty.

IAmRight		2013-04-04 02:37:04 PM

jackiepaper: not "everyone." many people are intelligent enough to understand, unlike Marc Ecko, that intellectual honesty would require an asterisk on a hundred other players' stats, and many teams' titles as well.

The vast majority of people.

/not one of 'em
//the asterisk crowd helped completely finish my relationship with baseball
///not the people using steroids, the constant whiners about them (pretty much everyone that covers the sport)

red5ish		2013-04-04 02:38:33 PM

Kuta: Yeah right. When the Pittsburgh Pirates come to SF, the whole city gets into a frothy lather.

Only because it's "Free Battery" day.

/I question their data.

satanorsanta		2013-04-04 02:53:33 PM

Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo: Who actually goes to baseball games anymore? Every time I see a game on TV, they are very careful not to show the stands too often, because they're mostly empty.

I watch most of the Phillies games on MLB.TV and it is obvious the difference between home and away. Home games have more than 90% of the seats full at all times. In Houston by the end of the game the only seats filled are behind the plate and around the dugouts.

mjohnson71		2013-04-04 02:58:05 PM

The data must be flawed. No way the Brewers are deep red and -25 when visiting the Chicago Cubs. According to the Cubs website all the non-April visits by Milwaukee are "Gold" priced tickets.

mjohnson71		2013-04-04 03:01:08 PM

Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo: Who actually goes to baseball games anymore? Every time I see a game on TV, they are very careful not to show the stands too often, because they're mostly empty.

Us Cardinals fans, who get constantly reminded we're the Best Fans in Baseball, show up like sheep and fill Busch Stadium even on a Wednesday night in April against the Pirates.

/Even I'm tired of the whole "Best Fans" thing

red5ish		2013-04-04 03:02:53 PM

Miami Marlins will be a real attraction this season. Like a super magnet.

/Farking magnets, how do they work? Do they "suck"? Because that's what I meant about the Marlins.

tricycleracer		2013-04-04 03:11:18 PM

Do the Phillies still have "Free Lantern Battery Day"?

MFAWG		2013-04-04 03:22:43 PM

ElwoodCuse: Nana's Vibrator: I mostly skimmed it, but the whole thing confuses me. I see that Yankees and Red Sox drive prices up for about half the teams (the American League+ a few interleague games)...but practically every other team has more pink than green. So most teams drive prices...down? Am I seeing a face value ticket price problem here?

Yep. MLB tickets are overpriced. And not in a boohoo those millionaire ballplayers I saw Mickey Mantle for a quarter way. I mean an Econ 101 way. Tickets from the team are priced too high so people buy them on Stubhub or whatever for below face. Naturally MLB's response to this was to get pissy at Stubhub.

I see your confusion: there's no such thing as 'face value' any more. The price on a ticket has a floor, but no ceiling. A ticket that sells for 10 bucks at noon can be 15 bucks at 3pm.

downstairs		2013-04-04 03:30:25 PM

mjohnson71: The data must be flawed. No way the Brewers are deep red and -25 when visiting the Chicago Cubs. According to the Cubs website all the non-April visits by Milwaukee are "Gold" priced tickets.

Remember, they're in the same division, and play each other tons of times all year long.

By the end of the year, the Cubs couldn't give away tickets. And I'm pretty sure I remember fans selling tickets on StubHub for next to nothing... WAY below face value.

FriarReb98		2013-04-04 03:40:26 PM

ElwoodCuse: Nana's Vibrator: I mostly skimmed it, but the whole thing confuses me. I see that Yankees and Red Sox drive prices up for about half the teams (the American League+ a few interleague games)...but practically every other team has more pink than green. So most teams drive prices...down? Am I seeing a face value ticket price problem here?

Yep. MLB tickets are overpriced. And not in a boohoo those millionaire ballplayers I saw Mickey Mantle for a quarter way. I mean an Econ 101 way. Tickets from the team are priced too high so people buy them on Stubhub or whatever for below face. Naturally MLB's response to this was to get pissy at Stubhub.

1. Given inflation, IIRC, that quarter ticket would now be $11, or thereabouts. Not impossible, but not bloody likely either.
2. The Red Sox should erect a farking shrine to StubHub and the use of them to keep the Pink Hat & Bahstin Frat Boy sellout "streak" alive.

\in case you're wondering, my point of reference for inflation is that a bottle of Coke costs relatively the same now as it did when the nickel years ended
\\The day will come when I can go to a Sox game and not hate 90% of the people sitting in my section

Robo Beat		2013-04-04 03:42:39 PM

tricycleracer: Do the Phillies still have "Free Lantern Battery Day"?

No, last time I was there is was a free paving cobble for the first 15,000 fans through the turnstiles.

IAmRight		2013-04-04 04:04:25 PM

FriarReb98: 1. Given inflation, IIRC, that quarter ticket would now be $11, or thereabouts. Not impossible, but not bloody likely either.

I don't think I've ever paid more than $10 for a baseball ticket (well, regular season, anyway). I would never go for more than that, unless someone else is buying.

/then again, I grew up on the west coast, and the games I've gone to as an adult were mostly Padres games

Nana's Vibrator		2013-04-04 04:11:36 PM

FriarReb98: \\The day will come when I can go to a Sox game and not hate 90% of the people sitting in my section

No. No it won't.

/And that goes double for your livingroom
_{//that last part was a joke}

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