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(CNN)   Why the f*** do I even have to write this column for a major news organization to talk about something that shouldn't even remotely be a factor in sports   (cnn.com) divider line 98
    More: Interesting, NFL, gay athletes, sports leagues, promiscuities  
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6693 clicks; posted to Sports » on 01 Apr 2013 at 7:15 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-04-01 12:50:37 AM
Interesting the comments.
 
It used to be (IMO) the comments on gay issues were almost 50/50 pro/con.  But now it is decidedly more pro (as in support for gays).  Assuming this to be true; what accounts for the change?
 
2013-04-01 01:18:46 AM

Frederick: Interesting the comments.
 
It used to be (IMO) the comments on gay issues were almost 50/50 pro/con.  But now it is decidedly more pro (as in support for gays).  Assuming this to be true; what accounts for the change?


Honestly, it is more people getting to know someone who is gay. The more people that come out, the more likely someone who is on the fence has a friend/neighbor/coworked/kid's friend who is gay and goes "wait, that person hasn't tried to destroy me".

Ellen helped a lot because she was someone who came into the homes of housewives and showed them not to be afraid, you also have Modern Family as a top show. Right now it could be the history side of things playing into it. People who have been the 50/50 but slightly con don't want to get lumped in with the wrong group as the winds change.

/just shooting ideas, nothing to really back it
//anyone have data over the last few years about trends
 
2013-04-01 02:31:43 AM
I love Chris Kluwe, he's phenomenal. Smart, well spoke, liberal, and geeky. He even wrote a story for the Penny Arcade/ Pvp comic "The Trenches."
 
2013-04-01 05:20:15 AM
Chris is fun. His Nerdist podcast with Hardwick was a riot. His open letter to Emmett Burns was hysterical in its perfection. Joe Bob says check it out.
 
2013-04-01 07:27:48 AM

TheManofPA: Honestly, it is more people getting to know someone who is gay. The more people that come out, the more likely someone who is on the fence has a friend/neighbor/coworked/kid's friend who is gay and goes "wait, that person hasn't tried to destroy me".


This. It reminds me of Vitaly Klitchko (sp?) talking about his first experience in America. To paraphrase: 'I realized they're not rat-faced people that will steal all of your money. That there are good ones and bad ones, just like everywhere else; no reason to be more fearful or distrusting of them, but certainly reason to be distrusting of the people that spread lies about them.'
 
2013-04-01 08:01:36 AM

Frederick: Interesting the comments.
 
It used to be (IMO) the comments on gay issues were almost 50/50 pro/con.  But now it is decidedly more pro (as in support for gays).  Assuming this to be true; what accounts for the change?


It's also generational. People born after 1980 have about a 70% acceptance rate- and now that generation is old enough to be active in politics, news organizations, etc. That's part of the reason there's been a huge shift over the past few years. Even if gays don't get everything they want out if the Supreme Court this summer, it's only a matter of time before it becomes a moot issue.
 
2013-04-01 08:04:36 AM
It seems every time something Kluwe writes shows up on the internets, I find another reminder that I should buy his jersey.
 
/Lions fan
 
2013-04-01 08:15:58 AM
Why the f*** do I even have to write this column for a major news organization to talk about something that shouldn't even remotely be a factor in sports?
 
Because you work for CNN, and the term "news" has become a foreign concept to them over the last decade?
 
2013-04-01 08:26:18 AM
This is one of the many reasons I like Kluwe:
 
Question: Dear Commissioner. I was curious about what you thought on the role of traumatic injury in the NFL, and the dichotomy between making the game safer versus giving the fans the hard hits and satiated bloodlust they so clearly desire. It seems to me that a lot of the popularity of the game boils down to the fact that there is that risk of injury, so I guess what I'm essentially asking is how are you going to balance that going forward without people feeling like you're never going to give them up, or never going to let them down?
 
2013-04-01 08:30:38 AM

babysealclubber: This is one of the many reasons I like Kluwe:
 
Question: Dear Commissioner. I was curious about what you thought on the role of traumatic injury in the NFL, and the dichotomy between making the game safer versus giving the fans the hard hits and satiated bloodlust they so clearly desire. It seems to me that a lot of the popularity of the game boils down to the fact that there is that risk of injury, so I guess what I'm essentially asking is how are you going to balance that going forward without people feeling like you're never going to give them up, or never going to let them down?


Ok, that is pure unadulterated win right there. Wonder how I missed it when it first came out.
 
2013-04-01 08:44:50 AM
media.punchingkitty.com
 
2013-04-01 09:00:20 AM

Frederick: Interesting the comments.
 
It used to be (IMO) the comments on gay issues were almost 50/50 pro/con.  But now it is decidedly more pro (as in support for gays).  Assuming this to be true; what accounts for the change?


The lessening of ignorance.  Many people used to believe that they didn't know any gay people.  Now it turns out they're everywhere.
 
It's a lot easier to hate on a faceless, nameless entity, than real life people.
 
2013-04-01 09:02:09 AM

Frederick: Interesting the comments.
 
It used to be (IMO) the comments on gay issues were almost 50/50 pro/con.  But now it is decidedly more pro (as in support for gays).  Assuming this to be true; what accounts for the change?

 
 
Because now if you say anything that does not support gays one hundred percent, you are insulted, vilified and treated with the utmost contempt.  The attacks on anyone who doesn't agree with or approve of homosexuality/homosexuals has driven them into the closet (to coin a phrase).
 
2013-04-01 09:08:02 AM

UNC_Samurai: Why the f*** do I even have to write this column for a major news organization to talk about something that shouldn't even remotely be a factor in sports?
 
Because you work for CNN, and the term "news" has become a foreign concept to them over the last decade?


No, he works for the Minnesota Vikings.
 
2013-04-01 09:08:58 AM

vladimpaler: Because now if you say anything that does not support gays one hundred percent, you are insulted, vilified and treated with the utmost contempt. The attacks on anyone who doesn't agree with or approve of homosexuality/homosexuals has driven them into the closet (to coin a phrase).


Those poor, oppressed bigots.
 
2013-04-01 09:12:03 AM

TheManofPA: Frederick: Interesting the comments.
 
It used to be (IMO) the comments on gay issues were almost 50/50 pro/con.  But now it is decidedly more pro (as in support for gays).  Assuming this to be true; what accounts for the change?

Honestly, it is more people getting to know someone who is gay. The more people that come out, the more likely someone who is on the fence has a friend/neighbor/coworked/kid's friend who is gay and goes "wait, that person hasn't tried to destroy me".

Ellen helped a lot because she was someone who came into the homes of housewives and showed them not to be afraid, you also have Modern Family as a top show. Right now it could be the history side of things playing into it. People who have been the 50/50 but slightly con don't want to get lumped in with the wrong group as the winds change.

/just shooting ideas, nothing to really back it
//anyone have data over the last few years about trends


Now if we could just get Democrats and Republicans to admit that both sides have their equal share of fark-ups, idiots, and crooks.
 
2013-04-01 09:12:55 AM

Frederick: Interesting the comments.
 
It used to be (IMO) the comments on gay issues were almost 50/50 pro/con.  But now it is decidedly more pro (as in support for gays).  Assuming this to be true; what accounts for the change?


I'm not sure attitudes have shifted as dramatically in such a short period (although they certainly have somewhat). I think it's probably more likely that the "con" people have learned to stop commenting because everyone they piped up they were drowned out in waves of "you stupid ignorant piece of shiat recheck homophobe.  You're probably secretly gay yourself." I guess it's a kind of progress though.
 
2013-04-01 09:13:05 AM

CheatCommando: babysealclubber: This is one of the many reasons I like Kluwe:
 
Question: Dear Commissioner. I was curious about what you thought on the role of traumatic injury in the NFL, and the dichotomy between making the game safer versus giving the fans the hard hits and satiated bloodlust they so clearly desire. It seems to me that a lot of the popularity of the game boils down to the fact that there is that risk of injury, so I guess what I'm essentially asking is how are you going to balance that going forward without people feeling like you're never going to give them up, or never going to let them down?

Ok, that is pure unadulterated win right there. Wonder how I missed it when it first came out.


Yeah. His reply was pretty good after Goodell actually answered the question and missed the joke.
 
"Fair enough. I have a follow up question then. When a football is sailing through the air, whether it be a punt or a field goal, does it sound more like "wooooooosh"? Or is it a shorter flight and thus more like "whoosh"? "
 
2013-04-01 09:15:40 AM

kronicfeld: vladimpaler: Because now if you say anything that does not support gays one hundred percent, you are insulted, vilified and treated with the utmost contempt. The attacks on anyone who doesn't agree with or approve of homosexuality/homosexuals has driven them into the closet (to coin a phrase).

Those poor, oppressed bigots.


Yes, exactly like that.
 
2013-04-01 09:44:40 AM

vladimpaler: Frederick: Interesting the comments.
 
It used to be (IMO) the comments on gay issues were almost 50/50 pro/con.  But now it is decidedly more pro (as in support for gays).  Assuming this to be true; what accounts for the change?
 
 
Because now if you say anything that does not support gays one hundred percent, you are insulted, vilified and treated with the utmost contempt.  The attacks on anyone who doesn't agree with or approve of homosexuality/homosexuals has driven them into the closet (to coin a phrase).

 
But it's still cool to make fun of black people, jews, 'tards, heebs, wetbacks, etc. Right? It's such a pain when human decency rears it's ugly head.
 
2013-04-01 09:55:21 AM

INeedAName: vladimpaler: Frederick: Interesting the comments.
 
It used to be (IMO) the comments on gay issues were almost 50/50 pro/con.  But now it is decidedly more pro (as in support for gays).  Assuming this to be true; what accounts for the change?
 
 
Because now if you say anything that does not support gays one hundred percent, you are insulted, vilified and treated with the utmost contempt.  The attacks on anyone who doesn't agree with or approve of homosexuality/homosexuals has driven them into the closet (to coin a phrase).
 
But it's still cool to make fun of black people, jews, 'tards, heebs, wetbacks, etc. Right? It's such a pain when human decency rears it's ugly head.


Did I say that?  Did I give my opinion anywhere?  A question was asked, I provided an answer.  Your ridiculous, over- the-top response to my answer is a prime example of the attacks I mentioned, so thanks for that.
 
2013-04-01 09:56:13 AM

facisto: UNC_Samurai: Why the f*** do I even have to write this column for a major news organization to talk about something that shouldn't even remotely be a factor in sports?
 
Because you work for CNN, and the term "news" has become a foreign concept to them over the last decade?

No, he works for the Minnesota Vikings.

 
Let me re-phrase, he's "contributing to" CNN.
 
2013-04-01 09:57:41 AM

INeedAName: But it's still cool to make fun of black people, jews, 'tards, heebs, wetbacks, etc. Right?


You can either make fun of Jews or Heebs. Not both.
 
2013-04-01 10:14:00 AM

vladimpaler: INeedAName: vladimpaler: Frederick: Interesting the comments.
 
It used to be (IMO) the comments on gay issues were almost 50/50 pro/con.  But now it is decidedly more pro (as in support for gays).  Assuming this to be true; what accounts for the change?
 
 
Because now if you say anything that does not support gays one hundred percent, you are insulted, vilified and treated with the utmost contempt.  The attacks on anyone who doesn't agree with or approve of homosexuality/homosexuals has driven them into the closet (to coin a phrase).
 
But it's still cool to make fun of black people, jews, 'tards, heebs, wetbacks, etc. Right? It's such a pain when human decency rears it's ugly head.

 
Did I say that?  Did I give my opinion anywhere?  A question was asked, I provided an answer.  Your ridiculous, over- the-top response to my answer is a prime example of the attacks I mentioned, so thanks for that.
 
Yeah, but anyway, what's it like to lack basic human decency?  Does it bother you people that just a few years ago your kind were in the majority, and now you can only find likeminded people at cross burnings, seal clubbings, and Young Republican gatherings?
 
2013-04-01 10:32:15 AM

Frederick: Interesting the comments.
 
It used to be (IMO) the comments on gay issues were almost 50/50 pro/con.  But now it is decidedly more pro (as in support for gays).  Assuming this to be true; what accounts for the change?


"The arc of the moral universe is long, but it bends toward justice." - MLK
 
2013-04-01 10:47:23 AM

Yes please: vladimpaler: INeedAName: vladimpaler: Frederick: Interesting the comments.
 
It used to be (IMO) the comments on gay issues were almost 50/50 pro/con.  But now it is decidedly more pro (as in support for gays).  Assuming this to be true; what accounts for the change?
 
 
Because now if you say anything that does not support gays one hundred percent, you are insulted, vilified and treated with the utmost contempt.  The attacks on anyone who doesn't agree with or approve of homosexuality/homosexuals has driven them into the closet (to coin a phrase).
 
But it's still cool to make fun of black people, jews, 'tards, heebs, wetbacks, etc. Right? It's such a pain when human decency rears it's ugly head.
 
Did I say that?  Did I give my opinion anywhere?  A question was asked, I provided an answer.  Your ridiculous, over- the-top response to my answer is a prime example of the attacks I mentioned, so thanks for that.
 
Yeah, but anyway, what's it like to lack basic human decency?  Does it bother you people that just a few years ago your kind were in the majority, and now you can only find likeminded people at cross burnings, seal clubbings, and Young Republican gatherings?


More baseless attacks, so goodbye.
 
2013-04-01 10:53:09 AM
I think I'll start up a fantasy football league next year based on who might be gay.
 
2013-04-01 11:16:52 AM

vladimpaler: Because now if you say anything that does not support gays one hundred percent, you are insulted, vilified and treated with the utmost contempt. The attacks on anyone who doesn't agree with or approve of homosexuality/homosexuals has driven them into the closet (to coin a phrase).

 
You're more than welcome to instead feel remorse and pity for those who still shout against homosexuality instead of those whom, after centuries of being vilified and mistreated because of their very being, are finally becoming accepted. I mean, to each their own, but in my book, basic human rights and decency trumps "I find something icky and it should be stopped".
 
2013-04-01 11:52:16 AM
Vlad, I'm reminded of a media kerfuffle from a few years back that involved the Dixie Chicks. Some idiots claimed that because stations refused to play their music after they protested the Iraq war, they were being censored.  And people rightfully said, no, it's just a reaction to their speech and words have consequences. Similarly, it's not that people are baselessly being called bigots because they are anti-gay, it's that by exercising their free speech, they are letting everyone else know they are bigots and then acting butthurt when the public recognizes this and reacts accordingly.  Maybe it's a stretch to apply it to you specifically, but there is no silent majority suffering for fear of being wrongly called a bigot.  There's just a lot of bigots that don't like being called bigots in public.
 
2013-04-01 12:09:44 PM

bglove25: Vlad, I'm reminded of a media kerfuffle from a few years back that involved the Dixie Chicks. Some idiots claimed that because stations refused to play their music after they protested the Iraq war, they were being censored.  And people rightfully said, no, it's just a reaction to their speech and words have consequences. Similarly, it's not that people are baselessly being called bigots because they are anti-gay, it's that by exercising their free speech, they are letting everyone else know they are bigots and then acting butthurt when the public recognizes this and reacts accordingly.  Maybe it's a stretch to apply it to you specifically, but there is no silent majority suffering for fear of being wrongly called a bigot.  There's just a lot of bigots that don't like being called bigots in public.


The original question was why are most posts now pro-gay.  I opined that people who don't support gays are tired of being attacked by those who do.  I did not give any opinion on the subject, I did not say who was right or wrong, I didn't come close to guessing what the actual percentages are.

During the entire time I have been on this board, I have made one post about homosexuality.  In the recent post about Gronkowski, someone asked when we would have a gay post without alluding to sex.  I pointed out the story about the gay soccer player from Leeds only made fun of the city.

Nice to know with that post and this one, I am now one of the biggest bigots on Fark.  Oh well, I guess an accomplishment is an accomplishment.
 
2013-04-01 12:10:58 PM
Hatred is a poor response to anything. Ridicule is unproductive. The latter is a pretty common human response, though, to people who waltz in and pronounce from on high that "homosexuality is immoral!" or "marriage equality is bad!", bullheaded and not to be swayed.

Comments on the subject that are made with sincerity and humility will receive comments in kind. Yes, there will be some insults; this is Fark, after all. You will have to ignore those and focus on the productive discussions.

I believe unequivocally that homosexuality is perfectly fine and that homosexual relationships ought to be given full legal recognition. Slowly, slowly, more every day, that's the way the wind is blowing. If you don't think likewise, the way people are inclined to respond to your opinions depends heavily on how you express them.
 
2013-04-01 12:20:37 PM
vladimpaler:  I responded to you because you asked a question.  Any other questions?

Yes.  What is your personal view on whether a gay person should be accepted as equal?  I mean this in two senses: (1) personal acceptance by teammates/co-workers, and (2) equal protection against discrimination claims under the law.  You seem very eager to remind everyone about what you haven't said on this subject, so it would probably help your cause to put something on the record as to what you have said.
 
2013-04-01 12:44:21 PM
Shh ! Dont even joke about gays or question anything related to any gay person or you will get swiftly screamed at by the militant soccer mom's bigot identification and elimnation squad.

Not surp[risingly these are almost never people who self identify as LBG or T or queer. Ive found that most of them actually take small ribbings at least as well as heteros and are much better and patient with me if I ask ignorant questions in threads like this. Most actually want to just farking want to mingle with folks and be simple pieces in the mosaic of society same as everybody else. Most who can take a dick in the ass can take a joke, so long as it isn personally hurtful.

Very few people who youd want to have a beer and watch a game with want to be the focal points of political pundits or ESPN's nutcases or the Westboro Baptist Chuch or FARK's poo flinging asshat monkey brigade no matter their sexual orientation. But the people who like yelling and screaming at eachother for attention are not about to let go of THE BIG GAY RIGHTS STORIES and allow simple normal gay folks to become simply folks. Not without a huge dramatic push and howls for immediately outing on gay in each and every high visibility high emotion job category. For the good of the person who is peer pressured into the limelight natch.

Strange thing is that over the last few decades weve finally made enormous strides towards considering gay people as just "people" instead of Evil Filthy People" or worse "victims" I mean I understand that y'all probably think you are helpful fighters n this war youve declared. But really you only win a civil war by either fighting until everyone is so much worse for the experiecne that they suddenly go sane and quit fighting despite media egging you forward or you use diplomacy tact and patience to build and teach and heal. This has has been done wherever progress is seen and well before the feudal  screaming fighters arrive to "help"
 
2013-04-01 12:51:37 PM

Frederick: Interesting the comments.
 
It used to be (IMO) the comments on gay issues were almost 50/50 pro/con.  But now it is decidedly more pro (as in support for gays).  Assuming this to be true; what accounts for the change?


The fact that after 9 states legalized gay marriage, the world has not come to an end. It's happening everywhere. Not only that, but the younger generation just isn't as hung up on this as even the people in their 30's.

By the time i'm retirement age, people will be looking back, scratching their heads, and trying to figure out why anyone was THAT worried, just like when people now look back to interracial marriages being illegal and can't figure out ANY justification for it.
 
2013-04-01 12:53:45 PM
Kids. Kids. KIDS. Does mama have to spank?

I saw nowhere where Vlad said that he shared those feelings. Yet he got jumped on, thus proving his point. No hate means NO HATE. When you HATE the people who think homosexuality is immoral, it just makes them that more zealous. When you call them names, it doesn't make them think, oh shiat, I'm a bigot, I had better completely realign my world view. It just makes them more zealous. The only way to get through to people is using reason, and a hell of a lot of the time that doesn't work either. So let's all calm down and a free that while assholes certainly are assholes, jumping all over them is not the way to resolve anything, okay?
 
2013-04-01 12:54:58 PM

Super Chronic: vladimpaler:  I responded to you because you asked a question.  Any other questions?

Yes.  What is your personal view on whether a gay person should be accepted as equal?  I mean this in two senses: (1) personal acceptance by teammates/co-workers, and (2) equal protection against discrimination claims under the law.  You seem very eager to remind everyone about what you haven't said on this subject, so it would probably help your cause to put something on the record as to what you have said.


1.  I have had gay coworkers.  If they did their jobs without bothering me, I accepted them.  This is the same attitude I have towards men or women, whites, blacks, hispanics, Asians, or Native Americans, lefties or righties, Christians, Jews, Muslims, Hindus, agnostics or athiests, or any other groupage you can thing of.

2.  I do not think gays should be protected by discrimination laws.  I do not think there should be discrimination laws, except for governments  (they should not be allowed to discriminate against taxpayers).  I think business owners should be able to hire, not  hire, or fire anyone for any reason they want.  If they have policies against hiring certain groups, they should have to advertise those   That way people can choose to support a business or not.  If a bigot can run a business successfully, more power to him.
 
2013-04-01 12:55:18 PM

mikaloyd: Shh ! Dont even joke about gays or question anything related to any gay person or you will get swiftly screamed at by the militant soccer mom's bigot identification and elimnation squad.

Not surp[risingly these are almost never people who self identify as LBG or T or queer. Ive found that most of them actually take small ribbings at least as well as heteros and are much better and patient with me if I ask ignorant questions in threads like this. Most actually want to just farking want to mingle with folks and be simple pieces in the mosaic of society same as everybody else. Most who can take a dick in the ass can take a joke, so long as it isn personally hurtful.

Very few people who youd want to have a beer and watch a game with want to be the focal points of political pundits or ESPN's nutcases or the Westboro Baptist Chuch or FARK's poo flinging asshat monkey brigade no matter their sexual orientation. But the people who like yelling and screaming at eachother for attention are not about to let go of THE BIG GAY RIGHTS STORIES and allow simple normal gay folks to become simply folks. Not without a huge dramatic push and howls for immediately outing on gay in each and every high visibility high emotion job category. For the good of the person who is peer pressured into the limelight natch.

Strange thing is that over the last few decades weve finally made enormous strides towards considering gay people as just "people" instead of Evil Filthy People" or worse "victims" I mean I understand that y'all probably think you are helpful fighters n this war youve declared. But really you only win a civil war by either fighting until everyone is so much worse for the experiecne that they suddenly go sane and quit fighting despite media egging you forward or you use diplomacy tact and patience to build and teach and heal. This has has been done wherever progress is seen and well before the feudal  screaming fighters arrive to "help"


My word, mika, you and I should become Fark's Voices of Reason.
 
2013-04-01 01:07:30 PM

vladimpaler: Frederick: Interesting the comments.
 
It used to be (IMO) the comments on gay issues were almost 50/50 pro/con.  But now it is decidedly more pro (as in support for gays).  Assuming this to be true; what accounts for the change?
 
 
Because now if you say anything that does not support gays one hundred percent, you are insulted, vilified and treated with the utmost contempt.  The attacks on anyone who doesn't agree with or approve of homosexuality/homosexuals has driven them into the closet (to coin a phrase).


Well sure, but aside from the amount of vitriol expressed, isn't that how it should be?  A person doesn't have to be supportive, and I respect that there are religious or different reasons some people some can't or wont accept homosexuality, but if they speak up against a person because of who they date, then why as a society shouldn't we vilify such individuals?

People can hold their own own opinions and speak freely about them, that doesn't mean people can't weigh those opinions and reply with their own.
 
2013-04-01 01:10:09 PM

Bunny Deville: So let's all calm down and a free that while assholes certainly are assholes, jumping all over them is not the way to resolve anything, okay?


But this is the internet! Relentlessly jumping down people's throats is a favorite pastime around these parts. Now, call me a moron and also randomly interject in this thread how Firefly is the best TV show ever.
 
2013-04-01 01:11:40 PM

Killer Cars: Bunny Deville: So let's all calm down and a free that while assholes certainly are assholes, jumping all over them is not the way to resolve anything, okay?

But this is the internet! Relentlessly jumping down people's throats is a favorite pastime around these parts. Now, call me a moron and also randomly interject in this thread how Firefly is the best TV show ever.


You farking moron, Doctor Who is the best TV show ever. Jesus christ.

/am I doing it right?
 
2013-04-01 01:17:39 PM

vladimpaler: Because now if you say anything that does not support gays one hundred percent, you are insulted, vilified and treated with the utmost contempt. The attacks on anyone who doesn't agree with or approve of homosexuality/homosexuals has driven them into the closet (to coin a phrase).


Lee Atwater on the Southern Strategy (I'm paraphrasing): "In the 1950s, it was 'n-bomb, n-bomb, n-bomb'. By 1960, you can't say that anymore, so it becomes about schools, about busing, about housing. We lost the word 'n-bomb', but kept the same fights up using 'code words' that got the same people on board."
 
2013-04-01 01:44:54 PM
What, no tight end/wide receiver jokes?
 
2013-04-01 01:51:35 PM

Lumbar Puncture: vladimpaler: Frederick: Interesting the comments.

It used to be (IMO) the comments on gay issues were almost 50/50 pro/con.  But now it is decidedly more pro (as in support for gays).  Assuming this to be true; what accounts for the change?


Because now if you say anything that does not support gays one hundred percent, you are insulted, vilified and treated with the utmost contempt.  The attacks on anyone who doesn't agree with or approve of homosexuality/homosexuals has driven them into the closet (to coin a phrase).

Well sure, but aside from the amount of vitriol expressed, isn't that how it should be?  A person doesn't have to be supportive, and I respect that there are religious or different reasons some people some can't or wont accept homosexuality, but if they speak up against a person because of who they date, then why as a society shouldn't we vilify such individuals?

People can hold their own own opinions and speak freely about them, that doesn't mean people can't weigh those opinions and reply with their own.



When I was born, homosexuality was still considered a mental disease according to all scientific sources and a sin by most religions.  Now in the last 48 years  (or so), homosexuality came to be considered so normal that to question it for any reason means you are a hyper religious, stupid bigot who doesn't deserve to live.  That's a pretty big swing for people to accept, but those who don't instantly accept it have been treated very badly on the net.

Sorry if I don't hate those people enough for the rest of the Farkers.
 
2013-04-01 02:08:51 PM
It's only a factor because the left wing crazy make it a factor. Just like anything else.
 
2013-04-01 02:21:53 PM

vladimpaler: When I was born, homosexuality was still considered a mental disease according to all scientific sources and a sin by most religions. Now in the last 48 years (or so), homosexuality came to be considered so normal that to question it for any reason means you are a hyper religious, stupid bigot who doesn't deserve to live. That's a pretty big swing for people to accept, but those who don't instantly accept it have been treated very badly on the net.

Sorry if I don't hate those people enough for the rest of the Farkers.


What is there to question? And I don't care if you are still uncomfortable with the concept of homosexuality as long as you don't try to harm anyone for it or legislate it.

And I'm not so much "pro-gay" as I am "pro-don't-give-a-fark-about-who-you-fark."
 
2013-04-01 02:27:17 PM

vladimpaler: Yes please: vladimpaler: Super Chronic: vladimpaler: CheatCommando: vladimpaler: Did I give my opinion anywhere?
 
If you think you weren't offering an opinion in that post you are either a clueless moron or a shiatty liar. Your pick, pumpkin.
 
 
Are you saying people against homosexuals/homosexuality are not attacked?  Hell, all I did say is that those people are attacked and I've been called a KKK member, an animal abuser, a Republican (ok, that one is true), someone who mocks "black people, jews, 'tards, heebs, wetbacks, etc.", and a clueless moron and/or a shiatty liar.
 
Despite a complete lack of evidence of any prejudice on my part (FYI, I have the same prejudice as Mark Twain), you and Yes please have proved my statements correct.  So, once again, thanks for that.
 
What happened to "goodbye"?
 
I said goodbye to Yes please because he twice hurled baseless insults at me.  He proved he could not have a conversation on the subject, so I will not respond to him again.
 
I responded to CheatCommando because he responded to me.
 
I responded to you because you asked a question.  Any other questions?
 
I only once made baseless attacks, and I thought they were so outlandish that anyone would have recognized them as sarcasm.  In fact, upthread I argued basically the exact same thing that you did on this very point.
 
 
OK, I missed your earlier post.  I apologize for that.  Unfortunately, what you thought was a sarcastic attack was indistiguishable from the real responses from other Farkers (INeedAName, CheatCommando).
 
You can't deviate from this board's norm (100% support/acceptance of gays, liberalism/Democratic party values, hatred of religion, etc) without subjecting yourself to insults, ridicule and hatred.
 
I know, welcome to Fark.


I think people reacted to you because of the "wah, I'm being oppressed" aspect you mention in others and then.... show yourself. In one regard I agree with you, I think maybe questioning gays is moving into non-kosher speech territory... but maybe it should. Would you take someone talking about racial miscegenation seriously, or just roll your eyes? As for the left-right politics, the whole belligerent gambit seems represented on fark; distribution density may vary by thread.
 
2013-04-01 02:35:35 PM

Bunny Deville: mikaloyd: Shh ! Dont even joke about gays or question anything related to any gay person or you will get swiftly screamed at by the militant soccer mom's bigot identification and elimnation squad.

Not surp[risingly these are almost never people who self identify as LBG or T or queer. Ive found that most of them actually take small ribbings at least as well as heteros and are much better and patient with me if I ask ignorant questions in threads like this. Most actually want to just farking want to mingle with folks and be simple pieces in the mosaic of society same as everybody else. Most who can take a dick in the ass can take a joke, so long as it isn personally hurtful.

Very few people who youd want to have a beer and watch a game with want to be the focal points of political pundits or ESPN's nutcases or the Westboro Baptist Chuch or FARK's poo flinging asshat monkey brigade no matter their sexual orientation. But the people who like yelling and screaming at eachother for attention are not about to let go of THE BIG GAY RIGHTS STORIES and allow simple normal gay folks to become simply folks. Not without a huge dramatic push and howls for immediately outing on gay in each and every high visibility high emotion job category. For the good of the person who is peer pressured into the limelight natch.

Strange thing is that over the last few decades weve finally made enormous strides towards considering gay people as just "people" instead of Evil Filthy People" or worse "victims" I mean I understand that y'all probably think you are helpful fighters n this war youve declared. But really you only win a civil war by either fighting until everyone is so much worse for the experiecne that they suddenly go sane and quit fighting despite media egging you forward or you use diplomacy tact and patience to build and teach and heal. This has has been done wherever progress is seen and well before the feudal  screaming fighters arrive to "help"

My word, mika, you and I shoul ...


The problem comes about when these two worlds intersect, and we get garbage on the Sports Tab like that News Busters article last week that got bent out of shape because someone joked about white people dancing at a Heat loss.  That shiat has no place on the Sports Tab, and neither does barneyfife bringing the Politics Tab partisan poo-slinging.

Yes, athletes have slowly become more and more active on this particular issue over the last decade.  We saw it with the NHL players and the You Can Play program.  Athletes are generally part of the younger generation, and in the last few years you've seen kids that grew up in the 90s and 2000s reach the pro levels, so now that's translating into awareness campaigns much like several southern California players in the early- and mid-90s made stopping gang violence an issue.

Lumbar Puncture: Well sure, but aside from the amount of vitriol expressed, isn't that how it should be? A person doesn't have to be supportive, and I respect that there are religious or different reasons some people some can't or wont accept homosexuality, but if they speak up against a person because of who they date, then why as a society shouldn't we vilify such individuals?


You always have to be careful of backlash, but this is what has allowed us to come as far as we have on issues of racism in the US.  We decided to relentlessly teach kids that racism was wrong, period, end of story.  And if someone said something contrarian enough, society forced them to accept the consequences of their statements.  And now people have either the good sense or the societal awareness to know that if you say something like Al Campanis or Howard Cosell, you'll justly see a backlash.

Look at Tim Hardaway; what he said was morally repugnant, but over the last few years he's realized he screwed up, and he's trying to make amends.  That's the benefit of a society putting their foot down and saying, "if you insist on saying inappropriate things, you're only going to make your life more difficult."
 
2013-04-01 02:42:26 PM
I have never announced my sexual orientation to the world.Why are people going around telling everyone about their lifestyle?People don't care and have their own lives to live.Get over yourselves.
 
2013-04-01 02:49:00 PM

vladimpaler: When I was born, homosexuality was still considered a mental disease according to all scientific sources and a sin by most religions. Now in the last 48 years (or so), homosexuality came to be considered so normal that to question it for any reason means you are a hyper religious, stupid bigot who doesn't deserve to live. That's a pretty big swing for people to accept, but those who don't instantly accept it have been treated very badly on the net.

Sorry if I don't hate those people enough for the rest of the Farkers


Hey, I know people like that as well and I love some of them because they're friends or family.  I'm disappointed they feel that way but a lifetime of being told something means they're not going to change their minds anytime soon.  My point to you was, if those people choose to express their opinion that they dislike another person's sexuality on the internet, then they're opening themselves to criticism from random strangers on the internet.

If they feel that strongly about who other people date to voice an opinion, than they need to accept that people, or friends of people, who have spent the last 48 years being told it was abnormal, a mental condition or a sin might also have strong feelings as well and are willing to express that right back to them.  Of course it helps not to be an asshole about it, but some folks feel pretty strongly.

Pretty much goes for anything, gay or not.  An Alaskan representative used the term wetback in a speech and was jumped on about it.  His explanation was that they didn't use the term on his farm as a kid in the way people do now.  Aside from that being bullshiat, does that mean people shouldn't be offended by such references and not call the guy out on it?

So you don't need to apologize to anyone for not hating on folks who think like that.  We probably all know people who aren't comfortable with the idea of homosexuality.  But if you express your opinion in a public, expect the public to express it right back and don't whine if they're maybe a little tired of being told to just accept certain attitudes.
 
2013-04-01 02:50:19 PM

85blue: I have never announced my sexual orientation to the world.Why are people going around telling everyone about their lifestyle?People don't care and have their own lives to live.Get over yourselves.


That's pretty much the summary of the article.
 
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