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(Business Insider)   Unregulated digital currency that explodes in value almost 500% in a month? Seems legit   (businessinsider.com) divider line 143
    More: Asinine, digital currency  
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4736 clicks; posted to Business » on 28 Mar 2013 at 2:22 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-03-28 02:21:01 PM
Christ, did nobody learn from summer 2011?
 
2013-03-28 02:27:39 PM

omnibus_necanda_sunt: Christ, did nobody learn from summer 2011?


No, no, no, this time is totally differrent because reasons I can't tell you.

/ So anyway, I have some Bitcoins to sell. Interested?
 
2013-03-28 02:30:17 PM
This isn't a followup from 2011 & 2012?
 
2013-03-28 02:33:36 PM
Bitcoin is a hell of a con.
 
2013-03-28 02:35:35 PM
Shutup and take my money?
 
2013-03-28 02:37:41 PM
Bitcoin is not legit, but letting a very small group of private bank owners and their ex-college roomates decide how to best to inflate the currency is perfectly legit.
 
2013-03-28 02:42:36 PM
So, anyone want to start a kickstarter with me to create the new digital currency?  I was thinking Great Janitor Nickels (because there might be legal issues against Stanley Nickels).
 
2013-03-28 02:43:06 PM
Now, will someone explain how the Waterhouse family and Enoch Root figure into this again?
 
2013-03-28 02:52:33 PM
Any currency that has a cap on the total number that is allowed in the market would see inflation if there's a huge influx of interest in that currency.

It's one of the reasons why economies have abandoned the gold standard. The global economy was growing too much and sharp adjustment to the value of dollar would have to be made frequenty in order to have it all backed by the gold available on hand by the federal bank. So when France came and said "I want gold for all these billions of dollars" US had to ditch the gold standard.
 
2013-03-28 02:54:04 PM

Great Janitor: So, anyone want to start a kickstarter with me to create the new digital currency?  I was thinking Great Janitor Nickels (because there might be legal issues against Stanley Nickels).


But how are you going to prevent counterfeiting when your currency is just buttons with numbers written on them?

images4.wikia.nocookie.net
 
2013-03-28 02:56:52 PM

ddam: Any currencything that has a cap on the total number that is allowed  supply in the market would see inflation if there's a huge influx of interest demand in that currency thing.


weird.. supply... demand.. price...they could be linked.
 
2013-03-28 03:01:01 PM
I thought the rapid inflation of BCs was due to Silk Road (or whatever that online freak-out supermarket is called) being so popular.
 
2013-03-28 03:01:56 PM

MugzyBrown: ddam: Any currencything that has a cap on the total number that is allowed  supply in the market would see inflation if there's a huge influx of interest demand in that currency thing.

weird.. supply... demand.. price...they could be linked.


Exactly. At the same time I honestly don't think that the current model of bitcoin can be sustained. I understand that want/need to get away from fractional-reserve banking but I don't think global economy is going to stop it's growth anytime soon.
 
2013-03-28 03:02:34 PM
Cue schrodinger's endless, mindless rants.

And why no analysis in TFA about WHY bitcoin has been on a surge? It's easily researchable that people in Spain and other European countries have started to buy in to this now that it's SOP for the EU to "skim" off private bank accounts to meet govt shortfalls.

Cyprus has a financial crisis -> 50% run up in bitcoin

What will happen the next time a major govt has a crisis? My bet is on the open-source, distributed, privately secured currency taking another huge lunge forward.

And this says nothing about the new places taking BTC for payment:  bitcoinstore.com offers new electronics offered for a limited time with no markup if purchased with BTC; wordpress.com gives the option to pay with BTC; Mega (formerly megaupload) is all but secured as a new retailer, and representatives from Facebook will be involved in an upcoming BTC conference.

/wishes I had bought in when I understood them at $8/btc
 
2013-03-28 03:03:05 PM
The Cyprus situation has done a lot for getting interest in Bitcoin out to the masses, and there are plenty of panicky austerity-stricken EU people willing to take dumb risks.
 
2013-03-28 03:04:58 PM

ddam: Any currency that has a cap on the total number that is allowed in the market would see inflation if there's a huge influx of interest in that currency.

It's one of the reasons why economies have abandoned the gold standard. The global economy was growing too much and sharp adjustment to the value of dollar would have to be made frequenty in order to have it all backed by the gold available on hand by the federal bank. So when France came and said "I want gold for all these billions of dollars" US had to ditch the gold standard.


Ah, but a digital currency can just add another decimal point. It would get ludicrous to trade one dust grain of gold weighed at 1000 molesAU, but there's no problem buying a pizza for 1microbit = .000001 BTC.

And that's not inflation - that's price deflation.
 
2013-03-28 03:10:02 PM

ddam: Any currency that has a cap on the total number that is allowed in the market would see inflation if there's a huge influx of interest in that currency.


You mean deflation.

/fark economists... how do they work?
 
2013-03-28 03:11:32 PM
The price has been pretty stable but growing for a good year, then it really ramped up just before February, which is well before the Cyprus news I believe.

I'm not sure what news hit at that time to make it take off at that time.
 
2013-03-28 03:16:05 PM
autism kroners
 
2013-03-28 03:17:52 PM
Wait, sites other than /. report on bitcoin?

/and the Libertarians on FB...
 
2013-03-28 03:20:25 PM
Someone conjured a mountain and filled it with imaginary gold.  Sounds legit.
 
2013-03-28 03:20:39 PM

MugzyBrown: The price has been pretty stable but growing for a good year, then it really ramped up just before February, which is well before the Cyprus news I believe.

I'm not sure what news hit at that time to make it take off at that time.


If you look at the chart you'll see that it was ~$50 on 3/17, so it's almost doubled in less than two weeks.

Strolpol: The Cyprus situation has done a lot for getting interest in Bitcoin out to the masses, and there are plenty of panicky austerity-stricken EU people willing to take dumb risks.


It's also the fact that Cyprus is a huge tax haven.
 
2013-03-28 03:23:15 PM

kronicfeld: Now, will someone explain how the Waterhouse family and Enoch Root figure into this again?


We'll need an encryption scheme that will remain secure for as long as man is capable of evil.
 
2013-03-28 03:24:41 PM
I can't believe anybody would pay $90 for a single bit coin.  It boggles the mind.
 
2013-03-28 03:24:52 PM

tricycleracer: Someone conjured a mountain and filled it with imaginary gold.  Sounds legit.


Except that the conjurer developed the imaginary gold with open source software and 256-bit public key cryptography.

It's legit. Not that it will last forever, but it's set to provide actual value (world-wide electronic value transfer without middlemen or fees, in addition to other things that physical money, gold or paper, can't do) for people in the real world for the indefinite future.
 
2013-03-28 03:26:51 PM

MugzyBrown: Bitcoin is not legit, but letting a very small group of private bank owners and their ex-college roomates decide how to best to inflate the currency is perfectly legit.


Couldn't that very same group of private bank owners and their ex-college roommates manipulate the Bitcoin currency exchange rate?  Seems like it would be very easy if you had a few mil in play money.  Maybe that's what's happening right now.  *adjusts tinfoil hat*
 
2013-03-28 03:27:16 PM

seniorgato: I can't believe anybody would pay $90 for a single bit coin.  It boggles the mind.


I can't believe anybody would pay 80 Euro for a single Benjamin Franklin. It boggles the mind.

These things are only worth what people are willing to take for them.
 
2013-03-28 03:28:01 PM

dualplains: If you look at the chart you'll see that it was ~$50 on 3/17, so it's almost doubled in less than two weeks.


Yeah I get that, but before that it was steady at around $12 until about Jan 15.

Jan 15 - March 1 it rose to about $30, or more than doubled.

Then March 1 - March 15 it rose to the $50 mark, 66%

Then March 15 - present to over $90, another 80+%


The Cyprus news came out around that 3/15 mark.

I'm curious what triggered the other jumps.
 
2013-03-28 03:29:24 PM

valkore: Couldn't that very same group of private bank owners and their ex-college roommates manipulate the Bitcoin currency exchange rate? Seems like it would be very easy if you had a few mil in play money. Maybe that's what's happening right now. *adjusts tinfoil hat*


Not really.. they could purchase a whole bunch to hopefully cause a surge in interest and then sell.. but that's not really manipulating the exchange rate.. they could easily lose a ton of money on such a practice.
 
2013-03-28 03:29:38 PM
when people start selling for pretend money, it's not If it will crash.  It's when.
Heh, so dumb.
Cyprus Panic+Bitcoin
http://www.cnbc.com/id/100597242
 
2013-03-28 03:30:27 PM

MugzyBrown: dualplains: If you look at the chart you'll see that it was ~$50 on 3/17, so it's almost doubled in less than two weeks.

Yeah I get that, but before that it was steady at around $12 until about Jan 15.

Jan 15 - March 1 it rose to about $30, or more than doubled.

Then March 1 - March 15 it rose to the $50 mark, 66%

Then March 15 - present to over $90, another 80+%


The Cyprus news came out around that 3/15 mark.

I'm curious what triggered the other jumps.


New people buying in, new people accepting BTC as preferred payment, less BTC being mined per day since last November.
 
2013-03-28 03:30:44 PM

iawai: tricycleracer: Someone conjured a mountain and filled it with imaginary gold.  Sounds legit.

Except that the conjurer developed the imaginary gold with open source software and 256-bit public key cryptography.

It's legit. Not that it will last forever, but it's set to provide actual value (world-wide electronic value transfer without middlemen or fees, in addition to other things that physical money, gold or paper, can't do) for people in the real world for the indefinite future.


We're not finding any new elements in the ground.  The barrier to entry in the precious metals game is that there's only certain metals we consider "precious" and there is a set amount of each on the planet (until we start roping in asteroids).

There's nothing stopping someone from creating another "mountain" full of a different flavor of "gold".  Why is a Bitcoin superior to a competitor's "Bytenote" or "Gigabux" or "eCash"?

I think competition is what will make virtual currencies eventually fail.
 
2013-03-28 03:32:03 PM
Would you like to buy some Internet Money?

What's that?

Well it's money that's made just for the Internet. It works just like regular money, but it's, er..."fun".

Well, OK, if it's fun...let's see, uh...I'll take $1100 worth.

D'oh!
 
2013-03-28 03:32:56 PM

seniorgato: when people start selling for pretend money, it's not If it will crash.  It's when.
Heh, so dumb.
Cyprus Panic+Bitcoin
http://www.cnbc.com/id/100597242


What's pretend about it as compared to ANY OTHER money? Shiny rocks are just pretend money. Central bank issued slips of paper are just pretend money.

So you're waiting for the silver, gold, US dollar, Yuen, and Euro markets to crash, too, right? So the question becomes: what crash would you rather live through, and wouldn't be a good idea to diversify?
 
2013-03-28 03:33:09 PM

iawai: seniorgato: I can't believe anybody would pay $90 for a single bit coin.  It boggles the mind.

I can't believe anybody would pay 80 Euro for a single Benjamin Franklin. It boggles the mind.

These things are only worth what people are willing to take for them.


Why would it boggle your mind for someone to purchase US currency?  There are literally over a billion people in the world who happily exchange it for goods and services.  As far as a bitcoin?  I certainly can't go to the pub and buy a pint.  Why would I want that?
 
2013-03-28 03:36:13 PM
I'm investing all by Bitcoins into tulip bulbs.  It's foolproof.
 
2013-03-28 03:39:12 PM

iawai: seniorgato: I can't believe anybody would pay $90 for a single bit coin.  It boggles the mind.

I can't believe anybody would pay 80 Euro for a single Benjamin Franklin. It boggles the mind.

These things are only worth what people are willing to take for them.


You can mine currency out of thin air.  Lets not pretend this is world currency with some form of backing.  This is a monopoly money scenario with hyper inflation waiting around the corner.

There are a billion reasons to trade for the Franklin.  If that boggles your mind, that's kinda sad.  Hell, the current situation in the EU should be reason enough to invest in foreign currencies, if not the US, someone else.  Hell, keeping the dollar afloat, if nothing else keeps the US from wanting to blow people up.  Wars make money.
 
2013-03-28 03:39:32 PM

tricycleracer: iawai: tricycleracer: Someone conjured a mountain and filled it with imaginary gold.  Sounds legit.

Except that the conjurer developed the imaginary gold with open source software and 256-bit public key cryptography.

It's legit. Not that it will last forever, but it's set to provide actual value (world-wide electronic value transfer without middlemen or fees, in addition to other things that physical money, gold or paper, can't do) for people in the real world for the indefinite future.

We're not finding any new elements in the ground.  The barrier to entry in the precious metals game is that there's only certain metals we consider "precious" and there is a set amount of each on the planet (until we start roping in asteroids).

There's nothing stopping someone from creating another "mountain" full of a different flavor of "gold".  Why is a Bitcoin superior to a competitor's "Bytenote" or "Gigabux" or "eCash"?

I think competition is what will make virtual currencies eventually fail.


Okay - silver and gold and platinum and palladium all play a part in the precious-metal-as-money markets    - some rise and fall independently from the others. It's conceivable that the price of gold could go to zero if it's function as a currency and industrial uses were out-competed by other metals.

Same with Bitcoin - there's already a "Lytecoin" competitor built on a variation of the open-source software. It could drive bitcoin from the market. But bitcoin has a few things going for it: it was first to market; it is becoming the "Kleenex" or "Coke" of the digital currency world as everything new is compared to it; and you can always sell if you sense the tide turning.

Competition will make individual digital currencies fail - but only because they will fill the demand with a better, more novel product.
 
2013-03-28 03:40:57 PM

seniorgato: Lets not pretend this is world currency with some form of backing


You realize there is nothing backing the US dollar, right?
 
2013-03-28 03:41:57 PM

tricycleracer: I'm investing all by Bitcoins into tulip bulbs.  It's foolproof.


Don't forget the waterfront swamp land you'll need to expand your tulip bulb empire.
 
2013-03-28 03:42:32 PM

meanmutton: As far as a bitcoin? I certainly can't go to the pub and buy a pint. Why would I want that?


Maybe not a pint, but you could buy some pizza.
 
2013-03-28 03:43:17 PM

meanmutton: iawai: seniorgato: I can't believe anybody would pay $90 for a single bit coin.  It boggles the mind.

I can't believe anybody would pay 80 Euro for a single Benjamin Franklin. It boggles the mind.

These things are only worth what people are willing to take for them.

Why would it boggle your mind for someone to purchase US currency?  There are literally over a billion people in the world who happily exchange it for goods and services.  As far as a bitcoin?  I certainly can't go to the pub and buy a pint.  Why would I want that?


It was sarcasm. The point was that I could use 90 US dollars in roughly the same ways that I could use 1 BTC on the internet. Same as I could use 80 Euros in roughly the same way as 100 US dollars. Not all things are purchasable with any of the 3 currencies, but there is a certain level of overlap in my consumer demand that equates those numerical values.

/there are more and more storefronts learning more about BTC, and some areas you could find a pub to sell you a pint for .05BTC
 
2013-03-28 03:44:27 PM
If you want it to go down, all you need is for me to invest in it.
 
2013-03-28 03:44:54 PM

seniorgato: iawai: seniorgato: I can't believe anybody would pay $90 for a single bit coin.  It boggles the mind.

I can't believe anybody would pay 80 Euro for a single Benjamin Franklin. It boggles the mind.

These things are only worth what people are willing to take for them.

You can mine currency out of thin air.  Lets not pretend this is world currency with some form of backing.  This is a monopoly money scenario with hyper inflation waiting around the corner.

There are a billion reasons to trade for the Franklin.  If that boggles your mind, that's kinda sad.  Hell, the current situation in the EU should be reason enough to invest in foreign currencies, if not the US, someone else.  Hell, keeping the dollar afloat, if nothing else keeps the US from wanting to blow people up.  Wars make money.


Again, sacrasm meant to parallel the other poster's point.

And Wars don't make money - they spend money and resources to subjugate competition.
 
2013-03-28 03:47:16 PM

iawai: It's conceivable that the price of gold could go to zero if it's function as a currency and industrial uses were out-competed by other metals.


Humans like to wear shiny things.  Numismatists will pay for defunt currency.

A Bitcoin can't be melted down into jewelry and I doubt a numismatist will pay money for a Wallet.dat file in 100 years.

Competition will make individual digital currencies fail - but only because they will fill the demand with a better, more novel product.

I can't invent New Gold that will have everybody dumping their old gold because mine's got that same great taste but is less filling.  The effect of competition in the development of a virtual currency all but ensures that they will all fail one after another.
 
2013-03-28 03:49:44 PM
I have a whole stack of BTC that I bought at $10 so I am getting a kick out of these replies...
 
2013-03-28 03:49:56 PM

iawai: ddam: Any currency that has a cap on the total number that is allowed in the market would see inflation if there's a huge influx of interest in that currency.

It's one of the reasons why economies have abandoned the gold standard. The global economy was growing too much and sharp adjustment to the value of dollar would have to be made frequenty in order to have it all backed by the gold available on hand by the federal bank. So when France came and said "I want gold for all these billions of dollars" US had to ditch the gold standard.

Ah, but a digital currency can just add another decimal point. It would get ludicrous to trade one dust grain of gold weighed at 1000 molesAU, but there's no problem buying a pizza for 1microbit = .000001 BTC.

And that's not inflation - that's price deflation.


DrPainMD: ddam: Any currency that has a cap on the total number that is allowed in the market would see inflation if there's a huge influx of interest in that currency.

You mean deflation.

/fark economists... how do they work?


It's more of a currency revaluation than regular inflation or deflation. There is a system induced scarcity in bitcoins, thus their value in dollars is increasing. Since everything is priced in dollars, the cost of a good or service in bitcoins is going down but the value of the dollar is not affected. A pizza you can buy for $10 that used to cost 1 bitcoin will still cost $10 but will cost 0.1 bitcoins Now, if bitcoins was a major currency it might affect the price of goods or services but it's not. It's a currency to be used in black markets that are not yet regulated.


But there is also something about how humans brain works. Majority of people will have a very hard time to understand that the same amount of currency can buy them more. We are so used to seeing it the other way around that deflation is viewed as evil. And prolonged deflation is not good for the economy as a whole because people will opt to stay out of the market thinking that prices will "drop" next week or next month.
 
2013-03-28 03:50:03 PM

iawai: seniorgato: when people start selling for pretend money, it's not If it will crash.  It's when.
Heh, so dumb.
Cyprus Panic+Bitcoin
http://www.cnbc.com/id/100597242

What's pretend about it as compared to ANY OTHER money? Shiny rocks are just pretend money. Central bank issued slips of paper are just pretend money.

So you're waiting for the silver, gold, US dollar, Yuen, and Euro markets to crash, too, right? So the question becomes: what crash would you rather live through, and wouldn't be a good idea to diversify?


Yes.  All of them.  But diversifying into bitcoin is, going to be hillarious to watch.  As with all investments, I wish you the best, but I don't share your optimism.  And I'll laugh quietly to myself if it fails. And cry silently to myself if I miss out on cash.

But at least real world currencies are a part of the global economy, not randomly generate by idle PCs.  I mean, we are talking about a currency that is generated by a PC out of thin air and really, not backed by anyone except those who feel like it.

Have none of you played video games?  Digital funds just jump wildly in the blink of an eye.  I'm on a game trading site (Goozex) that just had the point based economy go crazy and crash in on itself.

Digital currency is fun to play with.  You can make a lot of money before it folds in on it'self and crashes.  Just make sure you aren't the one holding the bag.
 
2013-03-28 03:52:46 PM

MugzyBrown: seniorgato: Lets not pretend this is world currency with some form of backing

You realize there is nothing backing the US dollar, right?


Actually, there is a lot backing the US currency.  You know, China.  Our debt.  Fear of a global economic crash should the dollar fail.
Lots of reasons!

That being said.... Heh, I agree.  BitCoin and the USD are in a similiar situation.  One day someone will look up and say, "Wait, you mean it's worthless?  Why am I putting money into it?  Oh CRAP EVERYONE ELSE IS RUNNING FOR THE DOOR!!!" RUUUUUUUUUUUUUUN
 
2013-03-28 03:55:44 PM

iawai: Again, sacrasm meant to parallel the other poster's point.

And Wars don't make money - they spend money and resources to subjugate competition.


My bad.  Missed the sarcasm.
Might be sarcasm, but wars maintain a industrial war machine, which really makes bank for the country.  We are a country of war, perhaps the one thing we do really well.
 
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