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(Forbes)   Why, out of 90 jurisdictions in the US, is Chicago dead last in prosecuting criminals with guns yet first in murders?   (forbes.com ) divider line
    More: Asinine, Chicago, Wayne LaPierre, Obama administration, Chicago dead, Garry McCarthy, Jim Crow laws, judicial district, jurisdictions  
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1191 clicks; posted to Politics » on 27 Mar 2013 at 10:42 PM (3 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-03-27 04:56:56 PM  
Just as I thought, crickets.
 
2013-03-27 05:04:39 PM  
Because i1123.photobucket.com
 
2013-03-27 05:13:08 PM  
Maybe the primary witness is often killed?
 
2013-03-27 05:19:31 PM  

Dancin_In_Anson: [i1123.photobucket.com image 250x100]


yoink
 
2013-03-27 05:21:21 PM  
violentsalvation: yoink

Sorry..It's been one of them days.
 
2013-03-27 05:24:12 PM  
That is one loud picture.
 
2013-03-27 05:24:15 PM  
Dat's da Chicago way!
 
2013-03-27 05:25:34 PM  

R.A.Danny: That is one loud picture.


It caused me to have a seizure.
 
2013-03-27 05:25:42 PM  
I had something to say, but now I have a headache.  And a nosebleed.
 
2013-03-27 05:27:41 PM  
Are they really first in murders? Forbes doesn't think they're bad enough to make the most dangerous of 2012

Maybe just the highest number of murders reported? Still below St Louis, Baltimore and possibly Detroit.

Maybe its really just a lazy prosecutor thing. Not that I'd move there.
 
2013-03-27 05:30:13 PM  

dr_blasto: Are they really first in murders? Forbes doesn't think they're bad enough to make the most dangerous of 2012

Maybe just the highest number of murders reported? Still below St Louis, Baltimore and possibly Detroit.

Maybe its really just a lazy prosecutor thing. Not that I'd move there.


"Lazy"? You do realize that the DA is an African-American, right?

Racist asshole
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2013-03-27 05:30:41 PM  
Because they are short of money and long on criminals with guns?
 
2013-03-27 05:36:04 PM  

vpb: Because they are short of money and long on criminals with guns?


Highest sales tax in the US, high income tax, horrible debt and credit. 4 of the last 7 governors in Illinois went to prison, state and city contractors await payment for month upon month.

Then they re-elect aldermen who are on their way TO prison.

But the one unifying chant is "Guns are bad".
 
2013-03-27 05:42:52 PM  
According to the TRAC study,

Measuring the total number of such prosecutions throughout the nation, however, is very difficult. This is in large part because the burden of bringing weapons violators to court is thought to fall much more heavily on the thousands of local police departments and prosecutors than the much smaller number federal agencies and U.S. Attorneys. But here, because the statistics collected by the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) focus on city, county and state arrests rather than than prosecutions, determining exactly how many gun cases are actually brought to court throughout the country is very difficult.
...
One thing, however, is clear even from these limited numbers. Because of the very different number of the enforcers and prosecutors working at the two levels, state and local gun prosecutions almost certainly dwarf anything that is done by the federal government.


If the Feds are not filing as many cases in Chicago as the NRA thinks they should, is it because the locals are assuming a greater burden than they do in other places? I can't tell, and TRAC can't tell. So how does Wayne La Pierre know the answer?
 
2013-03-27 05:48:04 PM  
Because sociopathism.
 
2013-03-27 05:51:48 PM  

cman: dr_blasto: Are they really first in murders? Forbes doesn't think they're bad enough to make the most dangerous of 2012

Maybe just the highest number of murders reported? Still below St Louis, Baltimore and possibly Detroit.

Maybe its really just a lazy prosecutor thing. Not that I'd move there.

"Lazy"? You do realize that the DA is an African-American, right?

Racist asshole


LOL
 
2013-03-27 05:52:42 PM  

R.A.Danny: vpb: Because they are short of money and long on criminals with guns?

Highest sales tax in the US, high income tax, horrible debt and credit. 4 of the last 7 governors in Illinois went to prison, state and city contractors await payment for month upon month.

Then they re-elect aldermen who are on their way TO prison.

But the one unifying chant is "Guns are bad".


I thought the unifying chant was "I'm not moving to Chicago"
 
2013-03-27 05:52:44 PM  

Dancin_In_Anson: Because [i1123.photobucket.com image 250x100]


Ack ack ack!

/throws up
 
2013-03-27 06:00:41 PM  

dr_blasto: I thought the unifying chant was "I'm not moving to Chicago"


There are a lot of really nice parts where you will never see a violent crime. Of course these aren't the areas where they are closing 61 schools.

The powers that be running this city are the MOST racist bunch of a-holes on the planet, and THAT is what is killing ~450 people a year.
 
2013-03-27 06:19:24 PM  

R.A.Danny: dr_blasto: I thought the unifying chant was "I'm not moving to Chicago"

There are a lot of really nice parts where you will never see a violent crime. Of course these aren't the areas where they are closing 61 schools.

The powers that be running this city are the MOST racist bunch of a-holes on the planet, and THAT is what is killing ~450 people a year.


I have some family in Evanston. Seems nice there, but not my type of place.
 
2013-03-27 06:22:52 PM  
Subby doesn't realize that prosuection isn't necessary for a conviction if the defendant settles for a deal?
 
2013-03-27 06:24:15 PM  

dr_blasto: I have some family in Evanston. Seems nice there, but not my type of place.


It doesn't have to be. I do like Chicago, but now it is only to visit, I wouldn't move back. Not because of the violence though. That really isn't a factor. The corruption on the other hand just depresses anyone that works hard and pays taxes only to see them stolen.
 
2013-03-27 06:25:37 PM  

Bontesla: Subby doesn't realize that prosuection isn't necessary for a conviction if the defendant settles for a deal?


Do you know how I know you've never practiced criminal law?
 
2013-03-27 06:27:27 PM  

Nabb1: Bontesla: Subby doesn't realize that prosuection isn't necessary for a conviction if the defendant settles for a deal?

Do you know how I know you've never practiced criminal law?


Explain.
 
2013-03-27 06:34:56 PM  

Nabb1: Do you know how I know you've never practiced criminal law?


Who cares, man?! She's cute!
 
2013-03-27 06:35:27 PM  

Bontesla: Nabb1: Bontesla: Subby doesn't realize that prosuection isn't necessary for a conviction if the defendant settles for a deal?

Do you know how I know you've never practiced criminal law?

Explain.


LOL.
 
2013-03-27 06:37:39 PM  

Dancin_In_Anson: Nabb1: Do you know how I know you've never practiced criminal law?

Who cares, man?! She's cute!


She's not fat enough for "Fark-Cute".
 
2013-03-27 06:40:46 PM  

TheDumbBlonde: She's not fat enough for "Fark-Cute".


Perhaps but she's got a pretty solid real red pouty thing going on...And you know how I am about the reds...
 
2013-03-27 06:45:08 PM  

Dancin_In_Anson: TheDumbBlonde: She's not fat enough for "Fark-Cute".

Perhaps but she's got a pretty solid real red pouty thing going on...And you know how I am about the reds...


It's solidly in the pink category, but we all have all our crosses to bear. Carry on, my wayward son.
 
2013-03-27 06:56:23 PM  

Bontesla: Nabb1: Bontesla: Subby doesn't realize that prosuection isn't necessary for a conviction if the defendant settles for a deal?

Do you know how I know you've never practiced criminal law?

Explain.


I'm with you Bontesla, explain please? I think your pretty.
 
2013-03-27 07:01:03 PM  

johnryan51: Bontesla: Nabb1: Bontesla: Subby doesn't realize that prosuection isn't necessary for a conviction if the defendant settles for a deal?

Do you know how I know you've never practiced criminal law?

Explain.

I'm with you Bontesla, explain please? I think your pretty.


Dude, I'm no lawyer like Nabb, but who the hell do you think the defendant reaches the "deal" with? The police? Criminals have to be charged with a crime by someone (here's a hint some are called prosecutors) in order to plea guilty.
 
2013-03-27 07:04:50 PM  

TheDumbBlonde: I'm no lawyer like Nabb


Wait. What? He's an attorney? The guy told me he was a piano player in a whorehouse. I've lost all respect for him now.
 
2013-03-27 07:06:13 PM  
Because the ATF who is responsible for enforcing these rules have not had anyone in charge for 10 years because of constant filibusterer even for Bush appointees
 
2013-03-27 07:09:57 PM  

Bontesla: Nabb1: Bontesla: Subby doesn't realize that prosuection isn't necessary for a conviction if the defendant settles for a deal?

Do you know how I know you've never practiced criminal law?

Explain.


In a civil case, the parties can get together before any complaint is filed and negotiate a settlement with no suit ever filed, which is common. Criminal defendants are immediately processed into the system upon arrest. Once this happens, there must be some formal resolution on the record and this will always involve prosecutors.  Also, deals are often made at the 11th hour on the day a defendant is scheduled for a jury trial. That means a prosecutor and a defense attorney (public defender or otherwise) may have gone through lengthy litigation, including contested preliminary hearings, an extensive suppression hearing that may involve extensive briefing, and the time it takes for the attorneys to negotiate a plea agreement.  For murder cases, multiply the cost, complexity, and time of this process by a bunch.

/I can only speak with any authority in PA law
 
2013-03-27 07:16:08 PM  

Dancin_In_Anson: TheDumbBlonde: I'm no lawyer like Nabb

Wait. What? He's an attorney? The guy told me he was a piano player in a whorehouse. I've lost all respect for him now.


I hear he only moonlights as an attorney until his whorehouse franchise takes off.
 
2013-03-27 07:22:18 PM  

Dancin_In_Anson: Nabb1: Do you know how I know you've never practiced criminal law?

Who cares, man?! She's cute!


Thank you.
 
2013-03-27 07:23:06 PM  

johnryan51: Bontesla: Nabb1: Bontesla: Subby doesn't realize that prosuection isn't necessary for a conviction if the defendant settles for a deal?

Do you know how I know you've never practiced criminal law?

Explain.

I'm with you Bontesla, explain please? I think your pretty.


Thank you, too.
 
2013-03-27 07:31:01 PM  

Actual Farking: Bontesla: Nabb1: Bontesla: Subby doesn't realize that prosuection isn't necessary for a conviction if the defendant settles for a deal?

Do you know how I know you've never practiced criminal law?

Explain.

In a civil case, the parties can get together before any complaint is filed and negotiate a settlement with no suit ever filed, which is common. Criminal defendants are immediately processed into the system upon arrest. Once this happens, there must be some formal resolution on the record and this will always involve prosecutors.  Also, deals are often made at the 11th hour on the day a defendant is scheduled for a jury trial. That means a prosecutor and a defense attorney (public defender or otherwise) may have gone through lengthy litigation, including contested preliminary hearings, an extensive suppression hearing that may involve extensive briefing, and the time it takes for the attorneys to negotiate a plea agreement.  For murder cases, multiply the cost, complexity, and time of this process by a bunch.

/I can only speak with any authority in PA law


That's kind of why I summarized that just because a case wasn't tried in Court doesn't mean that it's necessarily unsolved or unresolved. The majority of cases that result in a conviction were never prosecuted in the colloquial sense because a deal was reached.

It's been a long day - nearly 12 hours at work with a few more hours before I'm calling it a night so maybe I'm just dense.. But how are we in disagreement?
 
2013-03-27 07:38:25 PM  

Bontesla: Actual Farking: Bontesla: Nabb1: Bontesla: Subby doesn't realize that prosuection isn't necessary for a conviction if the defendant settles for a deal?

Do you know how I know you've never practiced criminal law?

Explain.

In a civil case, the parties can get together before any complaint is filed and negotiate a settlement with no suit ever filed, which is common. Criminal defendants are immediately processed into the system upon arrest. Once this happens, there must be some formal resolution on the record and this will always involve prosecutors.  Also, deals are often made at the 11th hour on the day a defendant is scheduled for a jury trial. That means a prosecutor and a defense attorney (public defender or otherwise) may have gone through lengthy litigation, including contested preliminary hearings, an extensive suppression hearing that may involve extensive briefing, and the time it takes for the attorneys to negotiate a plea agreement.  For murder cases, multiply the cost, complexity, and time of this process by a bunch.

/I can only speak with any authority in PA law

That's kind of why I summarized that just because a case wasn't tried in Court doesn't mean that it's necessarily unsolved or unresolved. The majority of cases that result in a conviction were never prosecuted in the colloquial sense because a deal was reached.

It's been a long day - nearly 12 hours at work with a few more hours before I'm calling it a night so maybe I'm just dense.. But how are we in disagreement?


Just that the prosecution is always necessary even when there is a plea agreement. You can avoid a trial, but the prosecution's involvement and the costs associated with their involvement are inevitable.
 
2013-03-27 07:45:10 PM  

Bontesla: Actual Farking: Bontesla: Nabb1: Bontesla: Subby doesn't realize that prosuection isn't necessary for a conviction if the defendant settles for a deal?

Do you know how I know you've never practiced criminal law?

Explain.

In a civil case, the parties can get together before any complaint is filed and negotiate a settlement with no suit ever filed, which is common. Criminal defendants are immediately processed into the system upon arrest. Once this happens, there must be some formal resolution on the record and this will always involve prosecutors.  Also, deals are often made at the 11th hour on the day a defendant is scheduled for a jury trial. That means a prosecutor and a defense attorney (public defender or otherwise) may have gone through lengthy litigation, including contested preliminary hearings, an extensive suppression hearing that may involve extensive briefing, and the time it takes for the attorneys to negotiate a plea agreement.  For murder cases, multiply the cost, complexity, and time of this process by a bunch.

/I can only speak with any authority in PA law

That's kind of why I summarized that just because a case wasn't tried in Court doesn't mean that it's necessarily unsolved or unresolved. The majority of cases that result in a conviction were never prosecuted in the colloquial sense because a deal was reached.

It's been a long day - nearly 12 hours at work with a few more hours before I'm calling it a night so maybe I'm just dense.. But how are we in disagreement?


 There is no colloquial sense of "criminal prosecution". You should call it a night right now.
 
2013-03-27 07:47:47 PM  
This thread is predictably high on circle jerk.

Actual Farking: Just that the prosecution is always necessary even when there is a plea agreement. You can avoid a trial, but the prosecution's involvement and the costs associated with their involvement are inevitable.


But significantly minimized.  And you can't get a retrial of any kind in a plea bargain; they're written so the guilty verdict can never be expunged.  Plus what the prosecution views as a slam dunk case doesn't necessarily mean the jury is convinced.

So a plea is cheaper and guaranteed, plus it is not subject to any kind of retrial.  If it turns out the cops forged evidence and used it to get you to sign a plea, too bad.  You cannot get it erased.
 
2013-03-27 07:51:34 PM  

GAT_00: This thread is predictably high on circle jerk.

Actual Farking: Just that the prosecution is always necessary even when there is a plea agreement. You can avoid a trial, but the prosecution's involvement and the costs associated with their involvement are inevitable.

But significantly minimized.  And you can't get a retrial of any kind in a plea bargain; they're written so the guilty verdict can never be expunged.  Plus what the prosecution views as a slam dunk case doesn't necessarily mean the jury is convinced.

So a plea is cheaper and guaranteed, plus it is not subject to any kind of retrial.  If it turns out the cops forged evidence and used it to get you to sign a plea, too bad.  You cannot get it erased.


LOL. Inevitable. How about required under law, Mr. Holmes?
 
2013-03-27 08:00:59 PM  

Actual Farking: Bontesla: Actual Farking: Bontesla: Nabb1: Bontesla: Subby doesn't realize that prosuection isn't necessary for a conviction if the defendant settles for a deal?

Do you know how I know you've never practiced criminal law?

Explain.

In a civil case, the parties can get together before any complaint is filed and negotiate a settlement with no suit ever filed, which is common. Criminal defendants are immediately processed into the system upon arrest. Once this happens, there must be some formal resolution on the record and this will always involve prosecutors.  Also, deals are often made at the 11th hour on the day a defendant is scheduled for a jury trial. That means a prosecutor and a defense attorney (public defender or otherwise) may have gone through lengthy litigation, including contested preliminary hearings, an extensive suppression hearing that may involve extensive briefing, and the time it takes for the attorneys to negotiate a plea agreement.  For murder cases, multiply the cost, complexity, and time of this process by a bunch.

/I can only speak with any authority in PA law

That's kind of why I summarized that just because a case wasn't tried in Court doesn't mean that it's necessarily unsolved or unresolved. The majority of cases that result in a conviction were never prosecuted in the colloquial sense because a deal was reached.

It's been a long day - nearly 12 hours at work with a few more hours before I'm calling it a night so maybe I'm just dense.. But how are we in disagreement?

Just that the prosecution is always necessary even when there is a plea agreement. You can avoid a trial, but the prosecution's involvement and the costs associated with their involvement are inevitable.


Got it.
I think we're in agreement here - I just poorly conveyed it then :)
 
2013-03-27 08:14:17 PM  

TheDumbBlonde: GAT_00: This thread is predictably high on circle jerk.

Actual Farking: Just that the prosecution is always necessary even when there is a plea agreement. You can avoid a trial, but the prosecution's involvement and the costs associated with their involvement are inevitable.

But significantly minimized.  And you can't get a retrial of any kind in a plea bargain; they're written so the guilty verdict can never be expunged.  Plus what the prosecution views as a slam dunk case doesn't necessarily mean the jury is convinced.

So a plea is cheaper and guaranteed, plus it is not subject to any kind of retrial.  If it turns out the cops forged evidence and used it to get you to sign a plea, too bad.  You cannot get it erased.

LOL. Inevitable. How about required under law, Mr. Holmes?


My understanding is that an undergrad degree in cartography makes you a law expert.
 
2013-03-27 08:22:54 PM  

rumpelstiltskin: If the Feds are not filing as many cases in Chicago as the NRA thinks they should, is it because the locals are assuming a greater burden than they do in other places? I can't tell, and TRAC can't tell. So how does Wayne La Pierre know the answer?


Chicago doesnt file federal charges.
The FEDS file federal charges.

I wonder how many federal judges who are being blocked right now were for the northern district.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_District_Court_for_the_No rt hern_District_of_Illinois

oh look 3 vacant seats
soooooo that has to be at least part of the problem.

get back to us when the GOP stops blocking filling those seats
 
2013-03-27 08:27:21 PM  

Dancin_In_Anson: TheDumbBlonde: GAT_00: This thread is predictably high on circle jerk.

Actual Farking: Just that the prosecution is always necessary even when there is a plea agreement. You can avoid a trial, but the prosecution's involvement and the costs associated with their involvement are inevitable.

But significantly minimized.  And you can't get a retrial of any kind in a plea bargain; they're written so the guilty verdict can never be expunged.  Plus what the prosecution views as a slam dunk case doesn't necessarily mean the jury is convinced.

So a plea is cheaper and guaranteed, plus it is not subject to any kind of retrial.  If it turns out the cops forged evidence and used it to get you to sign a plea, too bad.  You cannot get it erased.

LOL. Inevitable. How about required under law, Mr. Holmes?

My understanding is that an undergrad degree in cartography makes you a law expert.


I was unaware of this fact. Thanks for heads up!
 
2013-03-27 08:28:29 PM  
'Why is Chicago dead last in enforcement of the gun laws against gangs with guns, felons with guns, drug dealers with guns?'"

I dunno. Maybe because the guns were bought elsewhere? Does that mean gun laws might not be broken in Chicago? Are the robberies and murders not being prosecuted with said weapons?

Or, is it because the Chicago pols are secretly 2nd Amendment followers ?

Decisions, decisions...
 
2013-03-27 08:46:43 PM  

R.A.Danny: dr_blasto: I have some family in Evanston. Seems nice there, but not my type of place.

It doesn't have to be. I do like Chicago, but now it is only to visit, I wouldn't move back. Not because of the violence though. That really isn't a factor. The corruption on the other hand just depresses anyone that works hard and pays taxes only to see them stolen.


Is there a corruption index by city?
Is red-neck local run towns any less corrupt? Or just differently corrupt??
 
2013-03-27 08:49:23 PM  
Duh.  They're first in murders because there are so many unprosecuted killers with guns.  The less killers with guns you prosecute, the more of them are around to kill.

Can't believe I'm the first to figure that one out.
 
2013-03-27 08:51:35 PM  

AdolfOliverPanties: Duh.  They're first in murders because there are so many unprosecuted killers with guns.  The less killers with guns you prosecute, the more of them are around to kill.

Can't believe I'm the first to figure that one out.


Well, they just get them to plead guilty, so there is less prosecutions. Duh.
 
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