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(Huffington Post)   News: SCOTUS rules in favor of the little guy. Fark: In a drug case. UltraFark: With Scalia writing the majority opinion. WTFark: And Thomas joining him   (huffingtonpost.com) divider line 358
    More: Interesting, U.S. Supreme Court, Florida Supreme Court, UltraFark, detection dog, Ruth Bader Ginsburg, majority opinion, Sonia Sotomayor, Justice Stephen Breyer  
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16310 clicks; posted to Main » on 26 Mar 2013 at 1:01 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-03-26 01:19:29 PM  

PsyLord: FTA: "The police cannot, without a warrant based on probable cause, hang around on the lawn or in the side garden, trawling for evidence and perhaps peering into the windows of the home,"

Yet if some bypasser or nosy neighbor sees you walking around naked through the slits of your closed window blinds, the police can cite you for that?  WTF.


That is what he was saying, that the police can't do those things that would get you cited- without a warrant at least.
 
2013-03-26 01:19:30 PM  

elvindeath: Newsflash, folks ... both Scalia and Thomas are generally very critical of the government attempting to expand it's powers, especially when it comes to property rights and infringing on individual freedoms.  The alignment of the Justices is not surprising at all.  All the same hacks expressing shock at "conservative" justices supporting the rights of the individual ought to be in total outrage at the "liberal" administration's position that they can drone strike an American citizen without warrant, search or trial.


Yep. this is what I said. He believes the government should not interfere with the property you own, like your land, wife or slaves.
 
2013-03-26 01:20:16 PM  

AverageAmericanGuy: And libs, this is the kind of judge that is installed by a Democrat President.


Yeah, you really should not be throwing those stones, Mr. glass-house owner.

Scalia: installed by Reagan, worst SC judge I've seen in my lifetime.
Thomas: installed by George HW Bush, complete waste of space. Worked for Monsanto corporation for years, but did not recuse himself on Monsanto-related cases.
 
2013-03-26 01:20:44 PM  

Theaetetus: Corvus: dittybopper: Corvus: But Scalia is a big private property conservative and feels government can't take or interfere with your private property like your money, land, wife or slaves.

How is that inconsistent with the opinion?

Seems to me, a big private property conservative who feels government can't interfere with your private property, like your land, wouldn't be too keen on giving the government the power to remotely sense what is going on inside your home.

You know, like how he wrote the opinion in Kyllo that ruled that using an infrared scanner on a house without a warrant was unconstitutional.

Where did I say it way inconsistent?

Maybe people are confused by you starting your post with "but" as if your sentence was contradicting something Subby said or indicating it was inconsistent with Scalia's normal behavior.


It was it was contradicting subbies surprise at the ruling. You don't think the headline sounded surprised about the his ruling?
 
2013-03-26 01:20:49 PM  

AverageAmericanGuy: Alito also said that the court's ruling stretches expectations of privacy too far.

"A reasonable person understands that odors emanating from a house may be detected from locations that are open to the public, and a reasonable person will not count on the strength of those odors remaining within the range that, while detectable by a dog, cannot be smelled by a human."

Go fark yourself, Alito.

And libs, this is the kind of judge that is installed by a Democrat President. These guys hold this seat for life.


That liberal Democrat George W. Bush?
 
2013-03-26 01:21:05 PM  
Hut hut hut hut Their little peanut sized heads are exploding about right now!
 
2013-03-26 01:21:09 PM  

freeforever: Says someone who knows nothing about the Supreme Court or the philosophies of the justices.  Scalia and Thomas actually disagree quite often on issues of executive authority and federal vs. state powers.


Feel free to list all of those dissenting opinions. I'll wait right here.
 
2013-03-26 01:22:06 PM  
Drug Dog's Sniff Is An Unconstitutional Search, Rules U.S. Supreme Court
www.andrewbellay.com

but also
api.ning.com

encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com

danceswithfat.files.wordpress.com
 
2013-03-26 01:22:13 PM  

jjorsett: TwoHead: vernonFL: It's not trespassing when a mail carrier comes on a porch for a brief period, Alito said. And that includes "police officers who wish to gather evidence against an occupant," Alito said

Uh, what??? I'm not a lawyer, but that is a really stupid argument.

Which is why you are either too smart or too honest to make it as a conservative judge.

So is Breyer stupid, dishonest, or both?


Are you saying Breyer is a conservative judge?
 
2013-03-26 01:22:23 PM  

Gecko Gingrich: I wonder if this will apply to automobiles as well?


I'm guessing that this would not cover cars since a car does not have surrounding property like a house does. This ruling may not even help in an apartment complex where the hallways that lead to your door are public/communal property, They could bring the dog right to your door and never be on your property. .
 
2013-03-26 01:22:30 PM  
I have a hypothetical question for Fark's Armchair Constitutional Scholars:  What if the dog was trained to smell explosives?

I could not be more opposed to the criminalization of recreational chemicals.  But what if the "crime" in question was, you know, a real crime, like building explosive weapons?  Would a simple door-to-door stroll through the suspected neighborhood with a bomb-sniffing dog be unconstitutional?  What if it led to the detection of the tell-tale odors and the discovery of people who were in the process of preparing to murder innocent people by the thousands?
 
2013-03-26 01:22:47 PM  

Corvus: Profedius: I completely agree with the ruling and I am happy they came to rule as they did. Any search of a person, vehicle or private home should require the consent of the person or warrant granted only with strong evidence supporting the need for such a search. I know this hinders law enforcement, but I am will to give up a little safety in order to keep my freedom.

So no probably cause? If you here someone scream "Help me I am being kidnapped" in the back of trunk he has to get a court warrant first? I think that's a bit extreme.


You're thinking of "exigent circumstances" rather than "probable cause". Allowing warrantless searches where someone's in imminent danger or where there's imminent destruction of evidence is a different animal. Probable cause is required in all situations, including getting the warrant.

And if there's someone locked in a trunk that you just pulled over, screaming to get out, a 10 minute phone call to an on-duty judge won't really make much difference. It's not like you have to say "gosh, no warrant, I guess we'll let you drive off."
 
2013-03-26 01:22:52 PM  
Dammit, subby. I haven't even clicked through to the story yet but your headline made me literally drop my farking coffee.
 
2013-03-26 01:23:37 PM  

Gecko Gingrich: I wonder if this will apply to automobiles as well?


Probably not, for 3 reasons:

1) Privacy of the home is considered more "sacred", for lack of a better term, than privacy of a car. The nature of the place to be searched is taken into account when determining whether searches are justified (they can search your backpack under circumstances that it wouldn't be ok to search your butthole, for example.)
2) Cars are mobile. The potential for someone to drive away taking evidence with them gets used a lot to justify warrantless searches of cars.
3) The side of a road is a public place - your porch isn't. They'd likely decide that drug dog sniffing around the outside of your car is just fine, and if the dog detects something it's probable cause for a search of the vehicle.
 
2013-03-26 01:23:42 PM  

Lando Lincoln: AverageAmericanGuy: And libs, this is the kind of judge that is installed by a Democrat President.

Yeah, you really should not be throwing those stones, Mr. glass-house owner.

Scalia: installed by Reagan, worst SC judge I've seen in my lifetime.
Thomas: installed by George HW Bush, complete waste of space. Worked for Monsanto corporation for years, but did not recuse himself on Monsanto-related cases.


C'mon just call him an Uncle Tom already, you know you want too.
 
2013-03-26 01:23:52 PM  

Corvus: Theaetetus: Corvus: dittybopper: Corvus: But Scalia is a big private property conservative and feels government can't take or interfere with your private property like your money, land, wife or slaves.

How is that inconsistent with the opinion?

Seems to me, a big private property conservative who feels government can't interfere with your private property, like your land, wouldn't be too keen on giving the government the power to remotely sense what is going on inside your home.

You know, like how he wrote the opinion in Kyllo that ruled that using an infrared scanner on a house without a warrant was unconstitutional.

Where did I say it way inconsistent?

Maybe people are confused by you starting your post with "but" as if your sentence was contradicting something Subby said or indicating it was inconsistent with Scalia's normal behavior.

It was it was contradicting subbies surprise at the ruling. You don't think the headline sounded surprised about the his ruling?


Oh, I think this headline sucks and Subby should be mauled by police dogs.
 
2013-03-26 01:24:12 PM  
Awesome!
 
2013-03-26 01:24:50 PM  

Vector R: Though he should still be charged with electricity theft. WTF, if you weren't selling enough to cover that (especially with that many plants), then you're doin' it wrong.


Using large amounts of electricity in a residential home can be probable cause for a search. It isn't that he couldn't pay for it, it is just another thing to try to hide to not raise suspicions.

I am very surprised by the ruling. The curtilage issue has been used to allow many things in the past. Cameras on private property installed by police for example

This is why the only way to be sure you are OK is to have a fence around your property that prevents people from entering, period.
 
2013-03-26 01:25:36 PM  

AverageAmericanGuy: And libs, [Alito] is the kind of judge that is installed by a Democrat President.


Why do conservatives lie about things that are so easily disproved?

media1.s-nbcnews.com
January 9, 2006 - President Bush greets Supreme Court nominee
Judge Samuel Alito in the Oval Office
 
2013-03-26 01:25:37 PM  

Onkel Buck: C'mon just call him an Uncle Tom already, you know you want too.


His race has nothing to do with anything.

Now why don't you put up some information about how he's an actual good judge.
 
2013-03-26 01:26:18 PM  
don't they also look into houses with infra-red ...?    seems similar
 
2013-03-26 01:27:04 PM  
Cops are going to be pretty bored when pot gets decriminalized everywhere.
 
2013-03-26 01:27:32 PM  

Phinn: I have a hypothetical question for Fark's Armchair Constitutional Scholars:  What if the dog was trained to smell explosives?

I could not be more opposed to the criminalization of recreational chemicals.  But what if the "crime" in question was, you know, a real crime, like building explosive weapons?  Would a simple door-to-door stroll through the suspected neighborhood with a bomb-sniffing dog be unconstitutional?  What if it led to the detection of the tell-tale odors and the discovery of people who were in the process of preparing to murder innocent people by the thousands?


There was a case here in NC where the cops tried to use a drug sniffing dog as a corpse sniffing dog. The dog sat down because it didnt know what was being asked of it. That was enough for the cops to railroad the guy. He spent 17 years in prison before he was finally released after a new trial found him innocent. Misusing the dog was only one thing in the long list of piss poor police work that was done on that case
 
2013-03-26 01:27:39 PM  

freeforever: Last term [Scalia and Thomas] disagreed 7% of the time.


freeforever: Scalia and Thomas actually disagree quite often


Conservative math. 7% is "quite often"
 
2013-03-26 01:27:50 PM  

Lando Lincoln: AverageAmericanGuy: And libs, this is the kind of judge that is installed by a Democrat President.

Yeah, you really should not be throwing those stones, Mr. glass-house owner.

Scalia: installed by Reagan, worst SC judge I've seen in my lifetime.
Thomas: installed by George HW Bush, complete waste of space. Worked for Monsanto corporation for years, but did not recuse himself on Monsanto-related cases.


I'm as conservative as they get on Fark, but don't get me started on Monsanto.
 
2013-03-26 01:28:08 PM  

Phinn: I have a hypothetical question for Fark's Armchair Constitutional Scholars:  What if the dog was trained to smell explosives?

I could not be more opposed to the criminalization of recreational chemicals.  But what if the "crime" in question was, you know, a real crime, like building explosive weapons?  Would a simple door-to-door stroll through the suspected neighborhood with a bomb-sniffing dog be unconstitutional?  What if it led to the detection of the tell-tale odors and the discovery of people who were in the process of preparing to murder innocent people by the thousands?


If there is some reason the cops are searching the neighborhood for high explosives because someone is planning on murdering innocent people by the thousands and they know about it I would assume a warrant would be fairly easy to attain. Also, I don't know how much use a dog would be in this situation. I can keep a can of gasoline for my lawnmower and some fertilizer for my garden in my shed. You can blow a lot of shiat up with that, but it would be totally normal to have those 2 "bomb making chemicals" within arms reach of one another in the shed. This is a good ruling that reaffirms cops need warrants for searches without hindering them in any real way.
 
2013-03-26 01:28:18 PM  

AverageAmericanGuy: Alito also said that the court's ruling stretches expectations of privacy too far.

"A reasonable person understands that odors emanating from a house may be detected from locations that are open to the public, and a reasonable person will not count on the strength of those odors remaining within the range that, while detectable by a dog, cannot be smelled by a human."

Go fark yourself, Alito.

And libs, this is the kind of judge that is installed by a Democrat President. These guys hold this seat for life.


Obama and his damn time machine again, traveling back to 2006 to nominate Alito.
 
2013-03-26 01:28:39 PM  
Well, color me jaded, but this hardly looks like a "ruling for the little guy." My guess is that they managed to bust some CIA grow op, and are busy doing damage control in order to prevent it from turning into Iran-Contra 2.0.
 
2013-03-26 01:28:56 PM  

HotWingConspiracy: Cops are going to be pretty bored when pot gets decriminalized everywhere.


They'll find something else to entertain themselves with.
 
2013-03-26 01:28:59 PM  

AverageAmericanGuy: And libs, this is the kind of judge that is installed by a Democrat President. These guys hold this seat for life.



You're trolling, right? He was first appointed to the third circuit by GHW Bush, and to the SCOTUS by GW Bush. Which means you're either a good troll, or a typical, ignorant conservative.
 
2013-03-26 01:29:08 PM  

Lando Lincoln: Onkel Buck: C'mon just call him an Uncle Tom already, you know you want too.

His race has nothing to do with anything.

Now why don't you put up some information about how he's an actual good judge.


He pisses you off, thats enough for me
 
2013-03-26 01:29:12 PM  
Search and seizure cases are about the only time I'm ever happy Scalia is on the Supreme Court.
 
2013-03-26 01:29:38 PM  
Sooooooooo.......this is gonna make the following decisions that strike down voting rights and reaffirms DOMA to be OK then, right Citizens?
 
2013-03-26 01:29:50 PM  

Mad_Radhu: AverageAmericanGuy: Alito also said that the court's ruling stretches expectations of privacy too far.

"A reasonable person understands that odors emanating from a house may be detected from locations that are open to the public, and a reasonable person will not count on the strength of those odors remaining within the range that, while detectable by a dog, cannot be smelled by a human."

Go fark yourself, Alito.

And libs, this is the kind of judge that is installed by a Democrat President. These guys hold this seat for life.

Obama and his damn time machine again, traveling back to 2006 to nominate Alito.


I never said Obama nominated Alito. Nor did I say that a Democrat did.

Stop putting words in my mouth.
 
2013-03-26 01:30:52 PM  
Liberal or Conservative, this should be what you want. Less liberties for the police to go messing with people over stupid things.
 
2013-03-26 01:31:32 PM  

Onkel Buck: Lando Lincoln: Onkel Buck: C'mon just call him an Uncle Tom already, you know you want too.

His race has nothing to do with anything.

Now why don't you put up some information about how he's an actual good judge.

He pisses you off, thats enough for me


Yeah, that's pretty much the only reason why Republicans continue to get votes. "Cuz they piss off the libs!"

You are a credit to your party.
 
2013-03-26 01:31:38 PM  

freeforever: jbc: Since when has Thomas ever voted against the wishes of his puppetmaster, Subby?

Last term they disagreed 7% of the time.  The justices who agree the most, contrary to liberal opinion, are Roberts and Kennedy.

http://sblog.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/SCOTUSblog_S t at_Pack_OT11_Updated.pdf">http://sblog.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/up loads/2013/03/SCOTUSblog_St at_Pack_OT11_Updated.pdf


No they aren't. This is a fascinating link, btw.

I never realized how aligned Roberts and Alito were, or Kagan, Sotomayor, and Ginsburg.

For that matter, the wildcard is almost always Kennedy.

There are clearly five clusters. Roberts-Alito, Scalia-Thomas, Sotomayor-Kagan-Ginsburg, Breyer, and Kennedy. Kennedy is really the only moderate. Breyer isn't much different from SKG.
 
2013-03-26 01:31:50 PM  

Phinn: I have a hypothetical question for Fark's Armchair Constitutional Scholars:  What if the dog was trained to smell explosives?

I could not be more opposed to the criminalization of recreational chemicals.  But what if the "crime" in question was, you know, a real crime, like building explosive weapons?  Would a simple door-to-door stroll through the suspected neighborhood with a bomb-sniffing dog be unconstitutional?  What if it led to the detection of the tell-tale odors and the discovery of people who were in the process of preparing to murder innocent people by the thousands?


It as a real crime, and the guy they busted is a real criminal. The question here is one of procedure, and it's more important than the crime in question. It would still be the case if it was explosives, because the procedure is framed by our rights, and changing the procedure is what erodes rights.
 
2013-03-26 01:31:52 PM  

Phinn: I have a hypothetical question for Fark's Armchair Constitutional Scholars:  What if the dog was trained to smell explosives?



Get a warrant. You have to have probable cause before you search someone's property for any reason.
 
2013-03-26 01:33:54 PM  

AverageAmericanGuy: I never said Obama nominated Alito. Nor did I say that a Democrat did.


AverageAmericanGuy: Mad_Radhu: AverageAmericanGuy: Alito also said that the court's ruling stretches expectations of privacy too far.

"A reasonable person understands that odors emanating from a house may be detected from locations that are open to the public, and a reasonable person will not count on the strength of those odors remaining within the range that, while detectable by a dog, cannot be smelled by a human."

Go fark yourself, Alito.

And libs, this is the kind of judge that is installed by a Democrat President. These guys hold this seat for life.

Obama and his damn time machine again, traveling back to 2006 to nominate Alito.

I never said Obama nominated Alito. Nor did I say that a Democrat did.

Stop putting words in my mouth.


You put them there, Brainiac. Thank you for confirming my opinion of conservatives as both stupid and dishonest and lacking personal responsibility.
 
2013-03-26 01:34:08 PM  

Phinn: I have a hypothetical question for Fark's Armchair Constitutional Scholars:  What if the dog was trained to smell explosives?

I could not be more opposed to the criminalization of recreational chemicals.  But what if the "crime" in question was, you know, a real crime, like building explosive weapons?  Would a simple door-to-door stroll through the suspected neighborhood with a bomb-sniffing dog be unconstitutional?  What if it led to the detection of the tell-tale odors and the discovery of people who were in the process of preparing to murder innocent people by the thousands?


Doesn't make a difference to me. Drug dog, Bomb Dog etc etc. We can play What If all day long. This is the balancing act we have as a "free and open society." People are innocent until proven guilty, they have an expectation of privacy. Walking dogs, robots, whatever up to peoples doors to make sure they aren't breaking the law isn't the type of country we should be striving to be.
 
2013-03-26 01:34:09 PM  

Dog Welder: He was joined in his opinion by Justices Clarence Thomas, Ruth Bader Ginsburg, Sonia Sotomayor and Elena Kagan.

I think my brain just melted.

1) Scalia was right about something.
2) This wasn't a decision ruled down party lines.


It was a division of the blocs.

ST and SKG voted for. AR, B, and K voted against. Scalia and Thomas are in a shocking amount of majority decisions.
 
2013-03-26 01:34:43 PM  

AverageAmericanGuy: Mad_Radhu: AverageAmericanGuy: Alito also said that the court's ruling stretches expectations of privacy too far.

"A reasonable person understands that odors emanating from a house may be detected from locations that are open to the public, and a reasonable person will not count on the strength of those odors remaining within the range that, while detectable by a dog, cannot be smelled by a human."

Go fark yourself, Alito.

And libs, this is the kind of judge that is installed by a Democrat President. These guys hold this seat for life.

Obama and his damn time machine again, traveling back to 2006 to nominate Alito.

I never said Obama nominated Alito. Nor did I say that a Democrat did.

Stop putting words in my mouth.


Then what the hell does...

And libs, this is the kind of judge that is installed by a Democrat President.

...mean?  Am I taking you out of context by quoting you verbatim?
 
2013-03-26 01:34:45 PM  

jaytkay: AverageAmericanGuy: And libs, [Alito] is the kind of judge that is installed by a Democrat President.

Why do conservatives lie about things that are so easily disproved?

[media1.s-nbcnews.com image 474x315]
January 9, 2006 - President Bush greets Supreme Court nominee
Judge Samuel Alito in the Oval Office


media1.s-nbcnews.com 
... says the man with the clearly photoshooped picture. I mean, look at that floor, it's like one of those wacky funhouses.
 
2013-03-26 01:34:53 PM  

Onkel Buck: Lando Lincoln: Onkel Buck: C'mon just call him an Uncle Tom already, you know you want too.

His race has nothing to do with anything.

Now why don't you put up some information about how he's an actual good judge.

He pisses you off, thats enough for me


I've met a few people with your attitude. Five year old people.
 
2013-03-26 01:35:14 PM  

Lando Lincoln: Onkel Buck: Lando Lincoln: Onkel Buck: C'mon just call him an Uncle Tom already, you know you want too.

His race has nothing to do with anything.

Now why don't you put up some information about how he's an actual good judge.

He pisses you off, thats enough for me

Yeah, that's pretty much the only reason why Republicans continue to get votes. "Cuz they piss off the libs!"

You are a credit to your party.


Not affiliated, but you sure are easy to annoy, its almost like you're nothing but raw emotion.
 
2013-03-26 01:35:55 PM  

AverageAmericanGuy: Mad_Radhu: AverageAmericanGuy: Alito also said that the court's ruling stretches expectations of privacy too far.

"A reasonable person understands that odors emanating from a house may be detected from locations that are open to the public, and a reasonable person will not count on the strength of those odors remaining within the range that, while detectable by a dog, cannot be smelled by a human."

Go fark yourself, Alito.

And libs, this is the kind of judge that is installed by a Democrat President. These guys hold this seat for life.

Obama and his damn time machine again, traveling back to 2006 to nominate Alito.

I never said Obama nominated Alito. Nor did I say that a Democrat did.

Stop putting words in my mouth.


media.giantbomb.com
 
2013-03-26 01:36:36 PM  

shroom: AverageAmericanGuy: Mad_Radhu: AverageAmericanGuy: Alito also said that the court's ruling stretches expectations of privacy too far.

"A reasonable person understands that odors emanating from a house may be detected from locations that are open to the public, and a reasonable person will not count on the strength of those odors remaining within the range that, while detectable by a dog, cannot be smelled by a human."

Go fark yourself, Alito.

And libs, this is the kind of judge that is installed by a Democrat President. These guys hold this seat for life.

Obama and his damn time machine again, traveling back to 2006 to nominate Alito.

I never said Obama nominated Alito. Nor did I say that a Democrat did.

Stop putting words in my mouth.

Then what the hell does...

And libs, this is the kind of judge that is installed by a Democrat President.

...mean?  Am I taking you out of context by quoting you verbatim?


He doesn't speak for all conservatives. Just for himself.
 
2013-03-26 01:36:36 PM  

AverageAmericanGuy: Mad_Radhu: AverageAmericanGuy: Alito also said that the court's ruling stretches expectations of privacy too far.

"A reasonable person understands that odors emanating from a house may be detected from locations that are open to the public, and a reasonable person will not count on the strength of those odors remaining within the range that, while detectable by a dog, cannot be smelled by a human."

Go fark yourself, Alito.

And libs, this is the kind of judge that is installed by a Democrat President. These guys hold this seat for life.

Obama and his damn time machine again, traveling back to 2006 to nominate Alito.

I never said Obama nominated Alito. Nor did I say that a Democrat did.

Stop putting words in my mouth.


..... Your rather special.
 
2013-03-26 01:36:43 PM  

jaytkay: Onkel Buck: Lando Lincoln: Onkel Buck: C'mon just call him an Uncle Tom already, you know you want too.

His race has nothing to do with anything.

Now why don't you put up some information about how he's an actual good judge.

He pisses you off, thats enough for me

I've met a few people with your attitude. Five year old people.


Meh, and you got over that too I bet.
 
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