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(Reuters)   As "Obamacare" marks its third anniversary, it's becoming increasingly clear who the real winners are under this law: healthcare lobbyists, of course   (reuters.com) divider line 35
    More: Obvious, obamacare, Amy Klobuchar, National Coalition Party, America's Health Insurance Plans, National Federation of Independent Business, Medtronic, lobbying, medical device  
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1423 clicks; posted to Politics » on 25 Mar 2013 at 11:30 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



Voting Results (Funniest)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


Archived thread
2013-03-25 11:58:00 AM
6 votes:

kiwimoogle84: /exits stage left


Try not to become dependent on the government on your way out.
2013-03-25 12:05:03 PM
3 votes:
I'd like to add that I don't want to be dependent on the government to ensure the safety of the food that I buy. If you don't inspect and slaughter the animal yourself, that's pure, unadulterated, Maoist, communism.
2013-03-25 11:56:06 AM
3 votes:

macadamnut: FlashHarry: "thrid?"

[www.thrid.com image 288x232]


Ring Kichard the Thrid?

/a shroe, a shroe, my dinkgom for a shroe
2013-03-25 12:05:04 PM
2 votes:

verbaltoxin: The largest economy in the world with the planet's reserve currency can't operate and fund single payer?

Really?


THE US IS SOOOOO DIFFERENT FROM THOSE GUYS!  We're at least 3 tiems larger!
2013-03-25 12:01:16 PM
2 votes:

pinual: I work for a small business with many VH employees and a small staff of salaried employees.

We are just going to end up paying the fines because it works out cheaper then trying to ensure everyone. At least for the first few years. The fact that they tied the fine to insurance premium cost probably means in a few years the fine will be three or four times as high. Then we will just close out doors.


www.mountainside-medical.com
2013-03-25 12:00:50 PM
2 votes:

kiwimoogle84: Fine. You know what? Go ahead and ignore all of my experience in a field that I know like the back of my hand. But it's not going to be pretty.

/exits stage left


The government has statutes in place making sure that the stage is structurally sound, you damn socialist.
2013-03-25 11:48:52 AM
2 votes:

Jackson Herring: HawaiiE: I've given up arguing about Obamacare. Three years of reading fark threads & Facebook posts have taught me that conservatives have no idea what the ACA does, and don't want to learn.

It's very odd behavior to me, if anyone has ever had a success story I'd love to hear it.

government

takeover


of


healthcare


best part


forever
2013-03-25 11:47:40 AM
2 votes:

kiwimoogle84: Jackson Herring: kiwimoogle84: I'm not ok with THE GOVERNMENT deciding whether I live or die.

oh my god are you for real

like really really for real

Then explain to me the clause about "end of life" counseling if you're over a certain age and have a serious ailment. Grandma has cancer? Instead of treating her, we'll just counsel her about her upcoming demise.

That's IN THE BILL.

I'm not a foil hat wearer or anything, but I've worked in government healthcare (Medicare and Medi-Cal claims) long enough to know that if you get too expensive to insure, they'll cut you off.


DEATH PANELS!!!
2013-03-25 11:47:32 AM
2 votes:

verbaltoxin: Jackson Herring: kiwimoogle84: I'm not ok with THE GOVERNMENT deciding whether I live or die.

oh my god are you for real

like really really for real

Probably not, but who cares? Either way it sums up the opposition to single payer: f*ck you, got mine.


That's not my argument at all. This will kill more people than it helps, and quality of care drops dramatically when reimbursement rates drop through the floor.
2013-03-25 11:44:22 AM
2 votes:

kiwimoogle84: I'm not ok with THE GOVERNMENT deciding whether I live or die.


oh my god are you for real

like really really for real
2013-03-25 11:36:23 AM
2 votes:
can't afford healthcare? No worries we'll just fine you

wow overt lying on fark dot com, must be a day
2013-03-25 04:46:10 PM
1 votes:

mrshowrules: Health care reform, GOP strategy:

1) spend 40 years fighting it
2) spend 2 years making it as shiatty as possible
3) spend 3 years saying how shiatty it is


Yeah it is like hiring Unibomber IT Solutions for all your technology needs.
2013-03-25 04:41:50 PM
1 votes:

LincolnLogolas: The conspiracy theorists are also winners here. I've gotten at least two dozen forwards in the last week from people who don't go to snopes.com, who believe that a non-publicized portion of Obamacare is going into effect next week that mandates all citizens get RFID implants in their hands.


A non-publicized portion of Obamacare. What, was it written on the back in crayon? Maybe it was passed by a super secret Shadow Government composed entirely of Soviet agents and funded from the NSA black budget and Nazi gold.
2013-03-25 04:29:49 PM
1 votes:
Health care reform, GOP strategy:

1) spend 40 years fighting it
2) spend 2 years making it as shiatty as possible
3) spend 3 years saying how shiatty it is
2013-03-25 12:41:07 PM
1 votes:

The Stealth Hippopotamus: 2) force people without healthcare into Medicare


First, you mean health insurance, not healthcare. Second, why would a person without health insurance need to be forced into Medicare? Were I uninsured, I would run at full speed directly to whatever office could get me on Medicare if that was an option. Third, no. PPACA doesn't do that.
2013-03-25 12:38:54 PM
1 votes:

hillbillypharmacist: Bravo Two: You mean that the reality that people don't give a shiat about each other and are just as much driven by survival of the fittest as any other beast on this planet? And people will generally look out for themselves and their closest niche and ignore everyone else? *Gasp* say it ain't so! Now, if you'll excuse me, I've got work to do because ain't no one else going to come along and pay my bills for me.

Exactly.  We are beasts, and roll around in our own filth on what is almost certainly a prison ship.  Humanity is a hat trick in a medicine show, a fevered dream, a trance bepopulate with chimeras having neither analog nor precedent, an itinerant carnival, a migratory tentshow whose ultimate destination after many a pitch in many a mudded field is unspeakable and calamitous beyond reckoning.  You must fight without honor for whatever worthless creed drives you, for what is honor or honesty, beyond weakness we have agreed to indulge?


I have you farkied as "I can't remember if he's retarded or not" and every time I see you post it does nothing to clarify the situation. WHICH IS IT DAMMIT?!
2013-03-25 12:35:32 PM
1 votes:

verbaltoxin: BarkingUnicorn: verbaltoxin: At issue are a 2.3 percent tax on medical devices valued at $30 billion over the next 10 years, a $100 billion health insurance premium tax and the employer mandate, which opponents say could cripple many small business with costly fines.

*Sighs* That's because your ability to see a doctor shouldn't be dependent upon your boss' ability to buy an insurance plan! People cry "Socialism!" but are seriously okay with actuaries, shareholders, and their own f*cking boss deciding whether you live or die?

Isn't it really your health care providers who decide whether you live or die?

That depends. Can you get coverage in the first place? If the answer's "no," then you're pretty much f*cked if you have any condition requiring long term care. You're doubly f*cked if it's an emergency that requires additional, in-patient treatment. If you can't pay, a health care provider might never even see you.

Suffice to say, at this point it's insane to say the UK, Canada, New Zealand, Australia, Sweden, Norway, Denmark, Germany, France and a whole host of other nations can run a single payer healthcare program, and we can't. The largest economy in the world with the planet's reserve currency can't operate and fund single payer?

Really?

Really?

Really?


But.. Immigrants, or something!
jbc [TotalFark]
2013-03-25 12:30:58 PM
1 votes:

kiwimoogle84: I'm just against this whole idea that everyone gets the same care and Uncle Sam decides exactly what that care entails.


Then quit telling people you've read the bill.
2013-03-25 12:29:39 PM
1 votes:

kiwimoogle84: verbaltoxin: At issue are a 2.3 percent tax on medical devices valued at $30 billion over the next 10 years, a $100 billion health insurance premium tax and the employer mandate, which opponents say could cripple many small business with costly fines.

*Sighs* That's because your ability to see a doctor shouldn't be dependent upon your boss' ability to buy an insurance plan! People cry "Socialism!" but are seriously okay with actuaries, shareholders, and their own f*cking boss deciding whether you live or die?

I'm not ok with THE GOVERNMENT deciding whether I live or die.


Look, I don't think you are a troll.  At a minimum, the amount of effort you have to expend to keep the arguments up mean you aren't a successful troll, and it seems like you are earnest.

Unfortunately, you are also horribly misguided.  Under the current law, you can purchase your own insurance.  That insurance will place it's own requirements on what it will pay doctors.  You want premium coverage, you can pray a premium penny to get it.  You get to decide, based on your income, whether you live or die.

What the government has placed in the ACA is a coverage floor, minimum requirements for plans to pass the new insurance credits on income tax.  If you don't meet that, you don't get the credit and have to pay higher taxes.  That's the way the mandate has been structured from day one, it's why the IRS is the enforcement agency, and the Supreme Court agreed.  Businesses have similar tax credits they can qualify for.

Non of this places an additional strain on the providers.  Yes, there are some poorly informed, paranoid, conservative doctors that have come out saying it will hurt their business, but it will actually place a positive pressure on demand due to the additional preventative care coverage and increase in the number of insured.  The negative pressure will mostly be against insurance, which is why they have been a leading lobbyist against the ACA, and those who will fund the measure with increased taxes.

Nobody likes increased taxes, but the truth is that the taxes don't actually place pressure do decrease jobs.  That's not how health care taxes work, or any economic industry with entrenched demand (like food production).  Instead, the econometrics show quite clearly that those taxed will have the same demand and thus pass charges across the industry, which will rebalance costs to fill the drain.  This is how most economists, including the CBO, measure the effects here.  And this actually shows that once balanced, the industry will have a slower growth rate than currently.  Why?

Back to insurers.  They are the ones most likely to lose jobs here.  They do not add value to the service and drain the system for profits.  Low value insurance will move to the state-run pools over time, which will have the profit motive mostly removed.  If we had moved to single-payer, it would be completely removed, and since net take after payout would not drain much in either system, year-over-year, the allocations to risk will grow and total cost to consumer will actually fall.

Everything you have said in this thread appears to have been filtered through Fox News or a similar entertainment source geared towards misrepresentation in the name of conservatism.  It is not acceptable to lie about something this important, and you should really feel quite ashamed of yourself.
2013-03-25 12:29:34 PM
1 votes:

hillary: History farts in your general direction, silly American person. Your mother was a humpster and your father smelled of elderberries.


Now go away or I shall taunt you a second time!
2013-03-25 12:25:15 PM
1 votes:

kiwimoogle84: I'm just against this whole idea that everyone gets the same care


I just wanted to quote this as something someone actually said.
2013-03-25 12:25:13 PM
1 votes:

Bravo Two: You mean that the reality that people don't give a shiat about each other and are just as much driven by survival of the fittest as any other beast on this planet? And people will generally look out for themselves and their closest niche and ignore everyone else? *Gasp* say it ain't so! Now, if you'll excuse me, I've got work to do because ain't no one else going to come along and pay my bills for me.


Exactly.  We are beasts, and roll around in our own filth on what is almost certainly a prison ship.  Humanity is a hat trick in a medicine show, a fevered dream, a trance bepopulate with chimeras having neither analog nor precedent, an itinerant carnival, a migratory tentshow whose ultimate destination after many a pitch in many a mudded field is unspeakable and calamitous beyond reckoning.  You must fight without honor for whatever worthless creed drives you, for what is honor or honesty, beyond weakness we have agreed to indulge?
2013-03-25 12:10:33 PM
1 votes:

Bravo Two: Now, if you'll excuse me, I've got work to do because ain't no one else going to come along and pay my bills for me.


Be sure to stay off our roads.
2013-03-25 12:10:31 PM
1 votes:

Bravo Two: verbaltoxin: Probably not, but who cares? Either way it sums up the opposition to single payer: f*ck you, got mine.

You mean that the reality that people don't give a shiat about each other and are just as much driven by survival of the fittest as any other beast on this planet? And people will generally look out for themselves and their closest niche and ignore everyone else? *Gasp* say it ain't so! Now, if you'll excuse me, I've got work to do because ain't no one else going to come along and pay my bills for me.


You've got some drool on your chin.
2013-03-25 11:57:20 AM
1 votes:

Dusk-You-n-Me: kiwimoogle84: I'm against it because I don't want to be dependent upon the government

So...don't become dependent on the government.


The line of reasoning people use in not wanting to become "dependent on government" is so silly because EVERYONE in a modern society is dependent on government. There's no way NOT to be. Businesses use the money issued by governments and the public infrastructure to make a profit. FARKING WELFARE QUEENS
2013-03-25 11:54:52 AM
1 votes:
Fine. You know what? Go ahead and ignore all of my experience in a field that I know like the back of my hand. But it's not going to be pretty.

/exits stage left
2013-03-25 11:52:20 AM
1 votes:

kiwimoogle84: Jackson Herring: ahh ok I get the joke now, you are literally sarah palin

Oh dear christ. Look, I'm neither republican nor democrat. I see the flaws in both sides. BUT I WORK IN HEALTHCARE. I have SEEN firsthand what happens when it comes to paying claims for the gov. It's a mess, it's cheap since so many people have it, and the reibmursement rates absolutely blow.


Oh, You're so adorable! I just want to snuggle you!
i3.kym-cdn.com
2013-03-25 11:51:49 AM
1 votes:

A Dark Evil Omen: kiwimoogle84: Jackson Herring: kiwimoogle84: I'm not ok with THE GOVERNMENT deciding whether I live or die.

oh my god are you for real

like really really for real

Then explain to me the clause about "end of life" counseling if you're over a certain age and have a serious ailment. Grandma has cancer? Instead of treating her, we'll just counsel her about her upcoming demise.

That's IN THE BILL.

I'm not a foil hat wearer or anything, but I've worked in government healthcare (Medicare and Medi-Cal claims) long enough to know that if you get too expensive to insure, they'll cut you off.

DEATH PANELS!!!


ZOMGZ!!!! Socializms gonna kills da Stephen Hawkings!!!!!
2013-03-25 11:51:28 AM
1 votes:

kiwimoogle84: Jackson Herring: ahh ok I get the joke now, you are literally sarah palin

Oh dear christ. Look, I'm neither republican nor democrat. I see the flaws in both sides. BUT I WORK IN HEALTHCARE. I have SEEN firsthand what happens when it comes to paying claims for the gov. It's a mess, it's cheap since so many people have it, and the reibmursement rates absolutely blow.


both sides are bad, therefore death panels exist
2013-03-25 11:50:30 AM
1 votes:

FlashHarry: "thrid?"


www.thrid.com
2013-03-25 11:49:09 AM
1 votes:

Jackson Herring: ahh ok I get the joke now, you are literally sarah palin


Oh dear christ. Look, I'm neither republican nor democrat. I see the flaws in both sides. BUT I WORK IN HEALTHCARE. I have SEEN firsthand what happens when it comes to paying claims for the gov. It's a mess, it's cheap since so many people have it, and the reibmursement rates absolutely blow.
2013-03-25 11:42:39 AM
1 votes:

kiwimoogle84: small business employers


farking lollll
2013-03-25 11:42:38 AM
1 votes:

verbaltoxin: At issue are a 2.3 percent tax on medical devices valued at $30 billion over the next 10 years, a $100 billion health insurance premium tax and the employer mandate, which opponents say could cripple many small business with costly fines.

*Sighs* That's because your ability to see a doctor shouldn't be dependent upon your boss' ability to buy an insurance plan! People cry "Socialism!" but are seriously okay with actuaries, shareholders, and their own f*cking boss deciding whether you live or die?


I'm not ok with THE GOVERNMENT deciding whether I live or die.
2013-03-25 11:35:16 AM
1 votes:
If you're not changing it to single player or public option, STFU.
2013-03-25 11:14:51 AM
1 votes:
I saw Obamacare personally kill my grandmother.
 
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