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(Yahoo)   What exactly is a Latino? Even the Pope doesn't know, and he's supposed to be one   (news.yahoo.com) divider line 140
    More: Obvious, Latinos, Bergoglio, Chronicle of Higher Education, White Anglo-Saxon Protestant, pope, Mexican-Americans  
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3884 clicks; posted to Main » on 25 Mar 2013 at 9:26 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-03-25 11:19:33 AM  

bulok: He's still white. Who cares where he comes from. Wake me up when they have a REAL ethnic minority for a Pope.


You mean like white people? Or anyone who is not of Asian (if we include India) descent for that matter?

d23: Race is a human construct. It's meaningless.


You tell that to doctors who have found that the different "races", which don't really exist, have markedly different propensity for various ailments.

lack of warmth: Think of people with multiple heritages as a metal alloy, each culture bringing its own element to the mix.


Sure, if you actually were from a different country (or second generation, depending on how the person was raised). There is very little left of the culture of the people who first went to America 400 years ago. Or even the original culture of the people that went 200 years ago. There might be a small influence of the cultures of the people who cam 100 (or less) years ago but mostly the descendants will have adopted the dominant culture to greater or lesser extent.

Claiming that someone is "French-Spanish American" because they had a great grandfather who came from France and a grandmother came from Spain (and married a non-specified American) and had children raised in an environment which speaks neither French nor Spanish (for the most part) and does not have the French or Spanish cultural festivities, history and/or mannerisms doesn't make that person either French or Spanish. It simply makes them whatever culture they grew up in.
 
2013-03-25 11:20:31 AM  
I already like this pope's style...

i.imgur.com
 
2013-03-25 11:20:40 AM  
l1.yimg.com

O, et paene obliti, socius infantes: Booger!
 
xcv
2013-03-25 11:25:26 AM  
It doesn't matter that he was born to Italian parents; the Pope is a trans-Latino: he has been presenting all his life as a Latino and he's clearly capable of passing as a Hispanic. His birth certificate says Argentina. Please use the pronouns and origin adjectives that he prefers.
 
2013-03-25 11:26:49 AM  

computerguyUT: Duh, Latino is one of the search terms on our favorite porn sites to find a specific looking female.


You know the funny thing is that they won't use hispanic women that look European because then, what's the point?  But they will take women are aren't hispanic but 'look' like they are.  Hollywood and advertising agencies do the same thing.  So we have constant cultural re-enforcement of what a hispanic person is supposed to look like.  It would have been refreshing to say, have the Columbian wife on Modern Family be a blond, blue eyed woman.  I wonder if that would have worked.
 
2013-03-25 11:28:01 AM  

fickenchucker: Who gives a shiat?  I thought we were one world community, or some such.

Target marketing=racism.


I'm lovin' it.

My second cousin once removed is from Columbia, but lives in Kenya.
When she comes back to stay in the USA (She's got dual citizenship) is she Latina? Or African American?
Or does her milkshake bring all the boys in the yard?
 
2013-03-25 11:36:28 AM  

fozziewazzi: computerguyUT: Duh, Latino is one of the search terms on our favorite porn sites to find a specific looking female.

You know the funny thing is that they won't use hispanic women that look European because then, what's the point?  But they will take women are aren't hispanic but 'look' like they are.  Hollywood and advertising agencies do the same thing.  So we have constant cultural re-enforcement of what a hispanic person is supposed to look like.  It would have been refreshing to say, have the Columbian wife on Modern Family be a blond, blue eyed woman.  I wonder if that would have worked.


The woman who played bad-ass Latina Pvt. Vasquez in Aliens is actually a large-breasted Jewish woman who also played John Connor's foster mom in Terminator 2.
 
2013-03-25 11:37:34 AM  

d23: FLMountainMan: d23: Race is a human construct.  It's meaningless.

Also meaningless is saying that race is a human construct.

Additionally, try telling that to the non-West-African who has ever run the 100 meter dash in less than ten seconds.  If you can find him.

Any geneticist can look at someone's DNA and determine what continent a majority of their ancestors came from.  And this will roughly correspond to race.  I agree that most of the baggage that goes along with race is stupid and unnecessary, but to say it's something totally invented by modern society is more than a little naive.

Genetics doesn't equal race.


Race = breed, even though everybody is a mutt to some extent.
 
2013-03-25 11:39:01 AM  

vudukungfu: When she comes back to stay in the USA (She's got dual citizenship) is she Latina? Or African American?
Or does her milkshake bring all the boys in the yard?


We will need pictures to tell.
 
2013-03-25 12:22:43 PM  

costermonger: /by that definition, they  are hispanic; I was unaware it had more racial connotations than your standard ethnic labels


It doesn't.  My wife is Mexican and she and her family use that term all the time.

/everything on fark is racist
 
2013-03-25 12:46:04 PM  

dittybopper: [l1.yimg.com image 630x415]

O, et paene obliti, socius infantes: Booger!


mimg.ugo.com

"OK, so you can say that, but you can say *********** ************ ***** *************************************"
 
2013-03-25 01:19:56 PM  

Gwendolyn: He's an Italian who grew up in Argentina. He's as Latino as I am.


Sure....

So the new Pope is down to Earth, humble, and well loved. Because his parents are Italian, he's definitely white.

Obama on the other hand, is ineffectual, can't decide how much cream to put in his coffee without a recent poll, and has let North Korea and Iran run completely out of control. So he's definitely not white.

I'm not saying that I see a pattern here, or that all of you are racist, bigoted scum. So let's just move on...
 
2013-03-25 01:21:59 PM  
Sixth generation Brazilian born.  Is Mrs. Brady a latina?  By the Pope's definition, yes.

www.usmagazine.com
 
2013-03-25 01:31:24 PM  
Two of my sisters are twins.  One pulls from my father's side of the family (dark skin, dark hair, native South American and Italian mix).  The other looks like my mother (Blonde, blue eyes, freckles, Dutch & Portuguese mix).  According to some people on this board, one of the twins is Latina, the other isn't.

/just another Brazilian
//White
///Latino
 
2013-03-25 01:37:23 PM  
If you were born and grew up in a country, went to (in this case) Spanish-speaking school there, speak the language fluently and with a local accent, feel totally at home with the culture, etc, you're from that country.  It doesn't matter where your parents were born.  In this case, the Papa is Argentinean.

The only exception to this rule might be diplomatic families (or in the old days, British administrators in India), who obviously regard the posting as temporary and send their children to boarding schools in England or American schools at the foreign locations.  Here, the intention is clearly to have the kid raised culturally and linguistically as citizens of the parents' country.

My parents moved to Ireland before I was born.  I spent the first 21 years of my life there.  I haven't been there in >10 weeks in the last 30 years, but I'm Irish.

I used to work with a blond-haired blue-eyed guy with a totally English-sounding name.  His British parents moved to Mexico before he was born, and he stayed there until he was 25, attending local schools and university.  When I first met him, I asked him what nationality he considered himself to be.  He was surprised I asked:  Mexican, of course.

BTW, I don't consider the country of birth particularly key.  I you happened to be born in Venezuela and spent the first three weeks of your life there before your American parents returned to California, where you grew up, you're American, not Venezuelan.
 
2013-03-25 01:43:44 PM  

fireclown: [encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com image 176x223]
Born in Panama.

/WHAR is birther movement?  WHAR!!!???!!!


as someone that was born overseas on a military base, please allow me to state the following:

[ahem]

you're an idiot.
 
2013-03-25 02:00:57 PM  

jaytkay: jaytkay: This thread: "It is very important that people describe themselves only in ways I approve"

fozziewazzi: Sometimes it has a real effect though.

99.9999% of the time it's simply people showing their xenophobia and racism.


Or people assigning themselves to a group for political or financial reasons.
/I live in 90210 and am proud of it
 
2013-03-25 02:10:54 PM  
Mexican, chicano, hispanic, latino, it all means get off my lawn, and outta my country, you are stinking the place up somthing fierce
 
2013-03-25 02:34:35 PM  
Really? No Sharpie eyebrow pics?
 
2013-03-25 02:44:04 PM  
We're Mexican. Deal with it. Anyone speaking Spanish around a group of whiteys will always be defaulted to Mexican, so you might as well get used to it. You don't like it? Then stop speaking Mexican like a dayloboring beanjob and learn Amurrican.

We are Mexican. We are legion.
 
2013-03-25 02:52:43 PM  
What do they call black people in Europe?

Irish?

/goin to hell for that... i just know it
 
2013-03-25 02:57:32 PM  

Wittenberg Dropout: We're Mexican. Deal with it. Anyone speaking Spanish around a group of whiteys will always be defaulted to Mexican, so you might as well get used to it. You don't like it? Then stop speaking Mexican like a dayloboring beanjob and learn Amurrican.

We are Mexican. We are legion.


Which means you are on the West Coast but here on the East Coast we are a a healthy mix of all latin American countries.
 
2013-03-25 03:02:32 PM  

theflatline: Wittenberg Dropout: We're Mexican. Deal with it. Anyone speaking Spanish around a group of whiteys will always be defaulted to Mexican, so you might as well get used to it. You don't like it? Then stop speaking Mexican like a dayloboring beanjob and learn Amurrican.

We are Mexican. We are legion.

Which means you are on the West Coast but here on the East Coast we are a a healthy mix of all latin American countries.


What? You think that cuz your right coast you'll be spared? Put it this way, the next Kurt Russell movie is going to be named: Escape From Trece.
 
2013-03-25 03:12:37 PM  

ElizaDoolittle: If you were born and grew up in a country, went to (in this case) Spanish-speaking school there, speak the language fluently and with a local accent, feel totally at home with the culture, etc, you're from that country.  It doesn't matter where your parents were born.  In this case, the Papa is Argentinean.

The only exception to this rule might be diplomatic families (or in the old days, British administrators in India), who obviously regard the posting as temporary and send their children to boarding schools in England or American schools at the foreign locations.  Here, the intention is clearly to have the kid raised culturally and linguistically as citizens of the parents' country.

My parents moved to Ireland before I was born.  I spent the first 21 years of my life there.  I haven't been there in >10 weeks in the last 30 years, but I'm Irish.

I used to work with a blond-haired blue-eyed guy with a totally English-sounding name.  His British parents moved to Mexico before he was born, and he stayed there until he was 25, attending local schools and university.  When I first met him, I asked him what nationality he considered himself to be.  He was surprised I asked:  Mexican, of course.

BTW, I don't consider the country of birth particularly key.  I you happened to be born in Venezuela and spent the first three weeks of your life there before your American parents returned to California, where you grew up, you're American, not Venezuelan.


Actually in Argentina and in most of Latin America, unfortunately, blood lines are very important, dating back to Colonial days, and especially in Argentina where a lot of questionable immigration took place over the years(which you see in their absurd level of national pride.)  Plus,  they consider themselves to be the Europeans of Latin America.

Latin America is the last large bastion of the Churchs war chest and that is why the pope was chosen from Argentina, it is a shout out to the locals, but in reality it is about bloodline so Rome considers this "Papa"
to be one of them because of his heritage. It was a political move.  It allowed the papacy to continue to have a pure Italian bloodline while merely through a bone to the rest of the brown peoples.
 
2013-03-25 03:34:42 PM  

DigitalCoffee: What do they call black people in Europe?

Irish?

/goin to hell for that... i just know it


assets.rollingstone.com

"We'll be down there with you, my fine fellow."
 
2013-03-25 03:45:30 PM  

DigitalCoffee: What do they call black people in Europe?

Irish?

/goin to hell for that... i just know it


How many potatoes does it take to kill an Irishman?

/none.
 
2013-03-25 03:47:22 PM  
Considering how much immigration there was from the late 1800s until after WW2, I think a good size chunk of South America might be more European than the US.
 
2013-03-25 04:47:26 PM  
Given that all popes presumably speak actual *Latin* (as opposed to a Latin-derived language, like French/Spanish/Portuguese/Italian), wouldn't they all qualify?  Hell, by that standard they'd be among the *most* Latino people since the Romans.
 
2013-03-25 05:28:45 PM  

vudukungfu: DigitalCoffee: What do they call black people in Europe?

Irish?

/goin to hell for that... i just know it

How many potatoes does it take to kill an Irishman?

/none.


heh heh
 
2013-03-25 07:05:19 PM  

theflatline: Wittenberg Dropout: We're Mexican. Deal with it. Anyone speaking Spanish around a group of whiteys will always be defaulted to Mexican, so you might as well get used to it. You don't like it? Then stop speaking Mexican like a dayloboring beanjob and learn Amurrican.

We are Mexican. We are legion.

Which means you are on the West Coast but here on the East Coast we are a a healthy mix of all latin American countries.


In South FL, you're Cuban by default.  Especially if you're good looking!
 
2013-03-25 07:24:10 PM  
I just realized:  this Pope speaks Latino!

Dan Quayle is vindicated. Well, except for thinking South Americans speak latin. And being a dumbass.

Did you know that his IQ is estimated at 110, which is nearly median for a college boy? Mind you, he should have spent less time golfing and more time doing his own homework instead of giving it to Marlyn, whose estimated IQ is much higher.

IQs may have risen a fair bit over the decades due to better obstretics, better pre-natal care, better nutrition, more stimulating environments, etc., but I suspect that the amount of real intelligence you get for your points has fallen victim to inflation, possibly grade inflation.

So it may be true that IQs are higher, but you need a proportionately higher IQ to hold your own against a high school drop-out of the 1950s. Some of them were dropping out at university level by today's standards!
 
2013-03-25 07:25:46 PM  
Contrary to rumour, the Pope is not Ladino.

That would bring on the Apocalypse.
 
2013-03-25 07:39:19 PM  

FLMountainMan: d23: Race is a human construct.  It's meaningless.

Also meaningless is saying that race is a human construct.

Additionally, try telling that to the non-WestEast-African who has ever run the 100 meter dash in less than ten seconds.  If you can find him.


FTFY. The best African runners come from a region of Kenya.

Any geneticist can look at someone's DNA and determine what continent a majority of their ancestors came from.  And this will roughly correspond to race.  I agree that most of the baggage that goes along with race is stupid and unnecessary, but to say it's something totally invented by modern society is more than a little naive.

Uh, a majority of all of our ancestors came from Africa, given that humanity comes from there.

give me doughnuts: Race = breed, even though everybody is a mutt to some extent.


Huh? "Breed" is a useful notion when talking about dogs, for example, where, through selective breeding, we have dogs that will instinctively herd, chase or retrieve animals. We've been training and breeding dogs for 10s of thousands of years for the characteristics we need.

The stupidest aspect of trying to classify people into races, of course, is the geographical and semantic arguments.

For example, Israel is in Asia. But lots of Israelis have recent European heritage. At what point do they become Asian?

I'm sure there've been articles on fark about a white South African with US citizenship getting into trouble for saying that he's African-American. Much Like Charlize Theron is, actually.

And given that Egypt straddles Africa and Asia, how does one classify an Egyptian?

/We've been getting around for tens of thousands of years; I can see of no need to define the concept of race unless you really like discriminating against people who look a bit different to you.
 
2013-03-25 07:53:21 PM  

uttertosh: WippitGuud: irsquareamads:

Yet we call all black people in America "African-Americans" pretty much regardless of where they were actually born (US, Haiti, etc), so technically wouldn't he be an "Italian-Argentinian"?

What do they call black people in Europe?

Usually by their first name, except in formal occasion, where the surname is usually preceded with title.


So much this!
Why Americans feel the need to hang onto a racial prefix confuses me.
CSB time? OK if you insist.

I lived near a base which had a lot of American servicemen working there. There were a couple of them who couldn't understand why we Aussies found it funny as fark to her them describe the local population of Somalian refugees as African-American Australians (they were African, but neither American nor Australian). This was topped as the funniest thing when one of the Contractors (of white Zimbabwean ancestry) told us of his time in America, where he was granted African American status on his college application because he was African (by Birth) and American (by naturalisation). Apparently some people had a problem with this.
 
2013-03-25 08:10:03 PM  
FLMountainMan: ...try telling that to the non-West-African who has ever run the 100 meter dash in less than ten seconds. If you can find him.

Finding him is easy. Very easy, so easy in fact I can name him (them); Australian Patrick Johnson, Frenchman Christophe Lemaitre and Namibian Frankie Fredericks. Thus far I believe they are the three.
 
2013-03-25 08:19:32 PM  

theflatline: ElizaDoolittle: If you were born and grew up in a country, went to (in this case) Spanish-speaking school there, speak the language fluently and with a local accent, feel totally at home with the culture, etc, you're from that country.  It doesn't matter where your parents were born.  In this case, the Papa is Argentinean.

The only exception to this rule might be diplomatic families (or in the old days, British administrators in India), who obviously regard the posting as temporary and send their children to boarding schools in England or American schools at the foreign locations.  Here, the intention is clearly to have the kid raised culturally and linguistically as citizens of the parents' country.

My parents moved to Ireland before I was born.  I spent the first 21 years of my life there.  I haven't been there in >10 weeks in the last 30 years, but I'm Irish.

I used to work with a blond-haired blue-eyed guy with a totally English-sounding name.  His British parents moved to Mexico before he was born, and he stayed there until he was 25, attending local schools and university.  When I first met him, I asked him what nationality he considered himself to be.  He was surprised I asked:  Mexican, of course.

BTW, I don't consider the country of birth particularly key.  I you happened to be born in Venezuela and spent the first three weeks of your life there before your American parents returned to California, where you grew up, you're American, not Venezuelan.

Actually in Argentina and in most of Latin America, unfortunately, blood lines are very important, dating back to Colonial days, and especially in Argentina where a lot of questionable immigration took place over the years(which you see in their absurd level of national pride.)  Plus,  they consider themselves to be the Europeans of Latin America.

Latin America is the last large bastion of the Churchs war chest and that is why the pope was chosen from Argentina, it is a shout out to the locals, but

in reality it is about bloodline so Rome considers this "Papa"
to be one of them because of his heritage. It was a political move.  It allowed the papacy to continue to have a pure Italian bloodline while merely through a bone to the rest of the brown peoples.


I stand by my statement that the new Pope is from Argentina.  He's 76; he has spent most of his life there, including his childhood years.  He is not from a rich family. The rich are (in my experience) more likely to stew over blood lines while the poor worry about food lines.  Per Wiki, his father was an Italian immigrant rail worker and his mother, born in Buenos Aires, was of Italian descent.  If he'd been born in the US of the same descent, nobody would seriously be calling him Italian.  Unless they came from a Polack or Irish neighborhood.  And any three random guys from those neighborhoods would be quite likely to wind up fighting in a US uniform.

I hear you about the brown people.  But I find it hard to believe that this Papa was elected because of his pure Italian bloodline.  He's not exactly from the Villa d'Este.

And I'm still not going to agree with him on women in the church, homosexuality, condoms in South Africa, birth control elsewhere, the existence of God, papal infallibility, etc.

P.S.  I'm finishing a renovation.  My contractor, who is Argentinean and not particularly "European" by appearance, couldn't stop beaming about the new pope being from his country.
 
2013-03-26 01:08:06 AM  
Many prefer Latino because they feel it describes a more accurate mix of indigenous, African and European ancestry, instead of strictly European.

This.

/Latina
//speaks fluent Val
//sounds like a gabacha when she attempts to speak Spanish
 
2013-03-26 02:01:05 AM  

ha-ha-guy: WorldCitizen: So basically it then boils down to whether other people from Latin America consider people from Argentina to be Latino. And from the comments in the article, it sounds like many people who call themselves Latino do not.

I'd say it also matters what the other Cardinals consider him.  Because I have a feeling they picked this guy since they saw him as the child of Italian expats, so he is Italian and thus no problems.  But they're happy to present him as a Latino.  Basically a ploy to get credit for electing a non European pope, but not actually having to bite the bullet and elect a Latino or sub Saharan African.


I agree.  There was a lot of speculation about whether or not the next Pope might be from SA or Africa, because let's face it, the Church is dying everyone except the third world and a brown pope would have been sure to sucker in a few more converts.

But they just weren't brave enough.  The found a way to claim they have a "non-white" pope whilst still having a bloody white Italian pope.  What a manipulative cop-out.  And the press have been totally happy to run with the PR line on it.
 
2013-03-26 02:07:48 AM  
Latino = A person of mixed European Spanish and Central/South American Indian ancestry.

Sheesh don't they teach history anymore?
 
2013-03-26 01:18:54 PM  

ginandbacon: Hispanic is used to imply Spanish origins as a way to distinguish themselves from having any indigenous heritage. It's not exactly something to be proud of unless you are really racist. Latino just means of Latin American descent which can include native peoples and doesn't distinguish between ethnic origins.


Holy crap, I actually learned something on Fark.
 
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