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(Detroit Free Press)   "He was like chivalrous in an urban sort of way", say family of Detroit man who stuck his neck out to save complete strangers and was killed for doing so   (freep.com) divider line 91
    More: Sad, Detroit, Royal Oak, Detroit Receiving Hospital  
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16418 clicks; posted to Main » on 25 Mar 2013 at 12:10 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-03-24 05:23:17 PM  
I'd have used the Hero tag...
 
2013-03-25 12:12:58 AM  
We should ban assault knives.
/RIP brave man.
 
2013-03-25 12:14:00 AM  
Chivalrous while being stabbed by a Knight.
 
2013-03-25 12:21:49 AM  
I used to be a knight, but then I took a knife to the leg
 
2013-03-25 12:21:54 AM  
Detroit man who stuck his neck out

Yeah, I could have told him how that would end.  That's like starting an obituary about a "flamboyant gay man from Harlan, Kentucky".
 
2013-03-25 12:22:06 AM  

dopekitty74: I'd have used the Hero tag...


Agreed, Anderson tried to defuse the situation and then become the victim.  Knight suffered from mental illness and his 3rd appointed lawyer should consider a career shoveling fark in the local sewage plant.

Knight's attorney said his client was stabbed in the leg during the incident and was defending himself.
 
2013-03-25 12:23:29 AM  
Detroit sounds so eclectic in a stabey kind of way...
 
2013-03-25 12:25:26 AM  
Sad story all around. The guy defending the couple lost his life. The assailant is mentally ill and homeless and probably should never have been outside a mental institution. Even still, I hope he gets convicted and sentenced to life or pleads insanity and gets sent to treatment for the rest of his life.

And riding the bus where I live is bad enough. I wouldn't want to be riding any bus in Detroit.
 
2013-03-25 12:27:11 AM  
FTA: "He said, 'Detroit's a dangerous place. Don't be running up on people,' " Hill said of the exchange about 11 p.m. Dec. 19.

Well, it's slightly less dangerous with your ass off the streets, asshole.

/I said slightly...
 
2013-03-25 12:27:51 AM  
Lost his life saving a hipster. What a way to go.

Hope that's authentic enough for you, Scott.
 
2013-03-25 12:31:13 AM  
"Andrea Williams, the mother of one of Knight's two sons, said Knight was mentally ill."

I'm thinking she is as well.  What sane woman would think, "This man is insane, I must be impregnated by him."?
 
2013-03-25 12:34:23 AM  
Who the fark names their kid "Karon" ?
 
2013-03-25 12:34:51 AM  
if there be a heaven indeed,
it be for people like this

no matter how stupid you think he was to act.
 
2013-03-25 12:36:26 AM  
"he was like chivalrous in an urban sort of way,"

So, he pulled out in time?
 
2013-03-25 12:38:45 AM  

Amusement: dopekitty74: I'd have used the Hero tag...

Agreed, Anderson tried to defuse the situation and then become the victim.  Knight suffered from mental illness and his 3rd appointed lawyer should consider a career shoveling fark in the local sewage plant.

Knight's attorney said his client was stabbed in the leg during the incident and was defending himself.


And where do you think the lawyer got that story?  Knight's a little off; it wouldn't surprise me if he stabbed himself.  I don't think  the lawyer would go with that story if there was no wound.

As for "hero," I'll remind everyone again:  a hero is just the protagonist in a morality tale, not necessarily a great person.  Anderson is, indeed, the hero of this tale.  The moral is, "Defend the helpless."
 
2013-03-25 12:38:56 AM  

MaritimeGirl: "Andrea Williams, the mother of one of Knight's two sons, said Knight was mentally ill."

I'm thinking she is as well.  What sane woman would think, "This man is insane, I must be impregnated by him."?


As the child of a woman who is severely psychotic... sometimes one person doesn't know the other person is crazy until way after it is too late.

/don't stick your dick in crazy is our family motto now
 
2013-03-25 12:39:37 AM  

HotWingAgenda: Detroit man who stuck his neck out

Yeah, I could have told him how that would end.  That's like starting an obituary about a "flamboyant gay man from Harlan, Kentucky".


http://www.advocate.com/society/law/2013/01/15/vicco-ky-smallest-us- ci ty-lgbt-rights-law
 
2013-03-25 12:42:06 AM  
Why are there still people living in Detroit?? That's the real question...
 
2013-03-25 12:43:46 AM  

Wolf892: Why are there still people living in Detroit?? That's the real question...


Because they keep locking up the knife-wielding psychos.
 
2013-03-25 12:45:42 AM  

Amusement: dopekitty74: I'd have used the Hero tag...

Agreed, Anderson tried to defuse the situation and then become the victim.  Knight suffered from mental illness and his 3rd appointed lawyer should consider a career shoveling fark in the local sewage plant.

Knight's attorney said his client was stabbed in the leg during the incident and was defending himself.


Well, what can the attorney do. Your license requires you to defend your client to the best of your ability, and this is what he's left with. Sadly, he's not allowed to say: "Your Honor, my client is bugf*ck insane, he needs help and the looney bin is the best thing for him, really. Of course, HE doesn't think so, but I do, so that's what I'm going to argue." Alas, that's not what an "adequate defense" consists of these days, so the public defender has to scrape around for anything that might work.
 
2013-03-25 12:46:19 AM  
LIke I said before, if there is one medical service that should be free, and with no hassle, it's for violence oriented mental health issues. Although I would guess the NRA would prefer arming bus and cab drivers with an MP5.
 
2013-03-25 12:47:31 AM  

Pointy Tail of Satan: LIke I said before, if there is one medical service that should be free, and with no hassle, it's for violence oriented mental health issues.


But then everyone would fake violence-oriented mental health issues.
 
2013-03-25 12:53:15 AM  

BarkingUnicorn: Pointy Tail of Satan: LIke I said before, if there is one medical service that should be free, and with no hassle, it's for violence oriented mental health issues.

But then everyone would fake violence-oriented mental health issues.


Michael Moore doesn't fake it.
 
2013-03-25 12:54:02 AM  

BarkingUnicorn: Pointy Tail of Satan: LIke I said before, if there is one medical service that should be free, and with no hassle, it's for violence oriented mental health issues.

But then everyone would fake violence-oriented mental health issues.


I DON'T HAVE AN ANGER PROBLEM!!!! fark YOU!!!!
 
2013-03-25 12:54:38 AM  

DrZiffle: HotWingAgenda: Detroit man who stuck his neck out

Yeah, I could have told him how that would end.  That's like starting an obituary about a "flamboyant gay man from Harlan, Kentucky".

http://www.advocate.com/society/law/2013/01/15/vicco-ky-smallest-us- ci ty-lgbt-rights-law


That's in Perry County, not Harlan.
 
2013-03-25 12:54:52 AM  

7th Son of a 7th Son: BarkingUnicorn: Pointy Tail of Satan: LIke I said before, if there is one medical service that should be free, and with no hassle, it's for violence oriented mental health issues.

But then everyone would fake violence-oriented mental health issues.

Michael Moore doesn't fake it.


Mike fakes everything but his waistline.
 
2013-03-25 12:55:00 AM  

BarkingUnicorn: Pointy Tail of Satan: LIke I said before, if there is one medical service that should be free, and with no hassle, it's for violence oriented mental health issues.

But then everyone would fake violence-oriented mental health issues.


Well, it is Detroit. Maybe that should be the new defense: "Your honor, my client pleads not guilty by reason of insanity due to Detroit".
 
2013-03-25 12:57:29 AM  
He was always there to help when biatches were getting truculent.
 
2013-03-25 01:02:01 AM  
FTA:  Knight's mental health issues were not a mystery to those who knew him.

WHY DID THIS MAN HAVE A FARKING KNIFE??!! A decent human being is now dead because of this!

Knight also wrote that he was praying for Anderson's family and had contemplated suicide.

Too bad he didn't do more than contemplate.
 
2013-03-25 01:04:46 AM  

asynchron: FTA:  Knight's mental health issues were not a mystery to those who knew him.

WHY DID THIS MAN HAVE A FARKING KNIFE??!! A decent human being is now dead because of this!

Knight also wrote that he was praying for Anderson's family and had contemplated suicide.

Too bad he didn't do more than contemplate.


Yeah! We need to keep all weapons away from the mentally ill! Restrict them to soft objects and sponges! Nothing to eat but jello and pudding! Dress them in one-piece smocks and flip-flops! Make them ring bells and shout Unclean! Unclean!

.....you idiot.
 
2013-03-25 01:08:26 AM  

Gyrfalcon: Amusement: dopekitty74: I'd have used the Hero tag...

Agreed, Anderson tried to defuse the situation and then become the victim.  Knight suffered from mental illness and his 3rd appointed lawyer should consider a career shoveling fark in the local sewage plant.

Knight's attorney said his client was stabbed in the leg during the incident and was defending himself.

Well, what can the attorney do. Your license requires you to defend your client to the best of your ability, and this is what he's left with. Sadly, he's not allowed to say: "Your Honor, my client is bugf*ck insane, he needs help and the looney bin is the best thing for him, really. Of course, HE doesn't think so, but I do, so that's what I'm going to argue." Alas, that's not what an "adequate defense" consists of these days, so the public defender has to scrape around for anything that might work.


Why the hell ISN'T he allowed to say that?  If crazy guy disagrees, he can damn well find somebody else willing to represent him.

Dude is 55, violently nutso, and has now taken the life of somebody who was trying to rebuild his own.  Just give him some distracting ice cream and put him down gently like you would a rabid dog.  It's not his "fault" he's crazy, but I don't particularly feel like paying for his room and board for the rest of his useless life.
 
2013-03-25 01:09:43 AM  
In theory, anyone who kills is mentally ill. Even soldiers, who are basically taught to be selective, part time psychopaths. That's why the legal test is knowing right or wrong, not mental state.
 
2013-03-25 01:13:06 AM  
it's time to close Detroit
relocating everyone has got to be cheaper than trying to keep it solvent, safe and liveable
 
2013-03-25 01:14:34 AM  
A dark knight, if you will.
 
2013-03-25 01:15:14 AM  

over_and_done: Gyrfalcon: Amusement: dopekitty74: I'd have used the Hero tag...

Agreed, Anderson tried to defuse the situation and then become the victim.  Knight suffered from mental illness and his 3rd appointed lawyer should consider a career shoveling fark in the local sewage plant.

Knight's attorney said his client was stabbed in the leg during the incident and was defending himself.

Well, what can the attorney do. Your license requires you to defend your client to the best of your ability, and this is what he's left with. Sadly, he's not allowed to say: "Your Honor, my client is bugf*ck insane, he needs help and the looney bin is the best thing for him, really. Of course, HE doesn't think so, but I do, so that's what I'm going to argue." Alas, that's not what an "adequate defense" consists of these days, so the public defender has to scrape around for anything that might work.

Why the hell ISN'T he allowed to say that?  If crazy guy disagrees, he can damn well find somebody else willing to represent him.

Dude is 55, violently nutso, and has now taken the life of somebody who was trying to rebuild his own.  Just give him some distracting ice cream and put him down gently like you would a rabid dog.  It's not his "fault" he's crazy, but I don't particularly feel like paying for his room and board for the rest of his useless life.


The single most requested topic by Ethics Scoreboard readers is in the area of criminal defense lawyer ethics: how can it be right for an attorney to defend in court an individual that he or she knows is guilty?
 
2013-03-25 01:15:49 AM  

over_and_done: Gyrfalcon: Amusement: dopekitty74: I'd have used the Hero tag...

Agreed, Anderson tried to defuse the situation and then become the victim.  Knight suffered from mental illness and his 3rd appointed lawyer should consider a career shoveling fark in the local sewage plant.

Knight's attorney said his client was stabbed in the leg during the incident and was defending himself.

Well, what can the attorney do. Your license requires you to defend your client to the best of your ability, and this is what he's left with. Sadly, he's not allowed to say: "Your Honor, my client is bugf*ck insane, he needs help and the looney bin is the best thing for him, really. Of course, HE doesn't think so, but I do, so that's what I'm going to argue." Alas, that's not what an "adequate defense" consists of these days, so the public defender has to scrape around for anything that might work.

Why the hell ISN'T he allowed to say that?  If crazy guy disagrees, he can damn well find somebody else willing to represent him.

Dude is 55, violently nutso, and has now taken the life of somebody who was trying to rebuild his own.  Just give him some distracting ice cream and put him down gently like you would a rabid dog.  It's not his "fault" he's crazy, but I don't particularly feel like paying for his room and board for the rest of his useless life.



(a)  Lawyer to Abide by Client's Decisions.  Subject to subdivisions (c) and (d), a lawyer 
shall abide by a client's decisions concerning the objectives of representation, and, as required by 
rule 4-1.4, shall reasonably consult with the client as to the means by which they are to be 
pursued.

 In a criminal case, the lawyer shall abide by the client's decision, after consultation with the lawyer, as to a plea to be entered, whether to waive jury trial, and whether the client will testify. 

If client says "the objective is to prove self defense," under most interpretations, the lawyer must abide.  If the client says "the objective is to get the best outcome for me" then the lawyer could go with insanity.
 
2013-03-25 01:16:32 AM  
"He was like chivalrous in an urban sort of way", say family of Detroit man who stuck his neck out to save complete strangers and was killed for doing so

"Chivalrous in an urban sort of way" means that when he helped people they typically said, "Thanks! That was mighty African-American of you!"
 
2013-03-25 01:17:04 AM  
Detroit needs some help.

Attention to the problem of violence, crazy stab'y people, filth, coruption etc...
A reality TV show like Survivor Detroit.   Or along the lines of the great race type shows.

TV can show it live.

See the violence inherent in the system.
 
2013-03-25 01:23:58 AM  

BarkingUnicorn: over_and_done: Gyrfalcon: Amusement: dopekitty74: I'd have used the Hero tag...

Agreed, Anderson tried to defuse the situation and then become the victim.  Knight suffered from mental illness and his 3rd appointed lawyer should consider a career shoveling fark in the local sewage plant.

Knight's attorney said his client was stabbed in the leg during the incident and was defending himself.

Well, what can the attorney do. Your license requires you to defend your client to the best of your ability, and this is what he's left with. Sadly, he's not allowed to say: "Your Honor, my client is bugf*ck insane, he needs help and the looney bin is the best thing for him, really. Of course, HE doesn't think so, but I do, so that's what I'm going to argue." Alas, that's not what an "adequate defense" consists of these days, so the public defender has to scrape around for anything that might work.

Why the hell ISN'T he allowed to say that?  If crazy guy disagrees, he can damn well find somebody else willing to represent him.

Dude is 55, violently nutso, and has now taken the life of somebody who was trying to rebuild his own.  Just give him some distracting ice cream and put him down gently like you would a rabid dog.  It's not his "fault" he's crazy, but I don't particularly feel like paying for his room and board for the rest of his useless life.

The single most requested topic by Ethics Scoreboard readers is in the area of criminal defense lawyer ethics: how can it be right for an attorney to defend in court an individual that he or she knows is guilty?


I'm not arguing "guilty," I'm arguing "crazy".  Maybe that's not a distinction that we're allowed to make, I dunno.  I think the lawyer could help this psycho fark more by getting him put away in the looney bin instead of arguing that he's normal.
 
2013-03-25 01:27:24 AM  

halB: over_and_done: Gyrfalcon: Amusement: dopekitty74: I'd have used the Hero tag...

Agreed, Anderson tried to defuse the situation and then become the victim.  Knight suffered from mental illness and his 3rd appointed lawyer should consider a career shoveling fark in the local sewage plant.

Knight's attorney said his client was stabbed in the leg during the incident and was defending himself.

Well, what can the attorney do. Your license requires you to defend your client to the best of your ability, and this is what he's left with. Sadly, he's not allowed to say: "Your Honor, my client is bugf*ck insane, he needs help and the looney bin is the best thing for him, really. Of course, HE doesn't think so, but I do, so that's what I'm going to argue." Alas, that's not what an "adequate defense" consists of these days, so the public defender has to scrape around for anything that might work.

Why the hell ISN'T he allowed to say that?  If crazy guy disagrees, he can damn well find somebody else willing to represent him.

Dude is 55, violently nutso, and has now taken the life of somebody who was trying to rebuild his own.  Just give him some distracting ice cream and put him down gently like you would a rabid dog.  It's not his "fault" he's crazy, but I don't particularly feel like paying for his room and board for the rest of his useless life.


(a)  Lawyer to Abide by Client's Decisions.  Subject to subdivisions (c) and (d), a lawyer 
shall abide by a client's decisions concerning the objectives of representation, and, as required by 
rule 4-1.4, shall reasonably consult with the client as to the means by which they are to be 
pursued.

 In a criminal case, the lawyer shall abide by the client's decision, after consultation with the lawyer, as to a plea to be entered, whether to waive jury trial, and whether the client will testify. 

If client says "the objective is to prove self defense," under most interpretations, the lawyer must abide.  If the client says "the obje ...


One of the things a defense lawyer cannot do is suborn perjury.  If a client says, "I did it, but I'm gonna testify that I didn't," the lawyer must either persuade the client not to testify or withdraw from the case.
 
2013-03-25 01:30:25 AM  

over_and_done: BarkingUnicorn: over_and_done: Gyrfalcon: Amusement: dopekitty74: I'd have used the Hero tag...

Agreed, Anderson tried to defuse the situation and then become the victim.  Knight suffered from mental illness and his 3rd appointed lawyer should consider a career shoveling fark in the local sewage plant.

Knight's attorney said his client was stabbed in the leg during the incident and was defending himself.

Well, what can the attorney do. Your license requires you to defend your client to the best of your ability, and this is what he's left with. Sadly, he's not allowed to say: "Your Honor, my client is bugf*ck insane, he needs help and the looney bin is the best thing for him, really. Of course, HE doesn't think so, but I do, so that's what I'm going to argue." Alas, that's not what an "adequate defense" consists of these days, so the public defender has to scrape around for anything that might work.

Why the hell ISN'T he allowed to say that?  If crazy guy disagrees, he can damn well find somebody else willing to represent him.

Dude is 55, violently nutso, and has now taken the life of somebody who was trying to rebuild his own.  Just give him some distracting ice cream and put him down gently like you would a rabid dog.  It's not his "fault" he's crazy, but I don't particularly feel like paying for his room and board for the rest of his useless life.

The single most requested topic by Ethics Scoreboard readers is in the area of criminal defense lawyer ethics: how can it be right for an attorney to defend in court an individual that he or she knows is guilty?

I'm not arguing "guilty," I'm arguing "crazy".  Maybe that's not a distinction that we're allowed to make, I dunno.  I think the lawyer could help this psycho fark more by getting him put away in the looney bin instead of arguing that he's normal.


And, as I said and will keep saying: That's not the lawyer's decision to make. Unless you're okay with people just being locked up in mental hospitals against their will without having any say in the matter. Are you? Because that's what you're demanding here. You're asking someone else to say this guy is too crazy to live, based on a three-paragraph news article, and if that's fine by you, then understand it's a short step till anyone can be found too crazy to live based on equally flimsy evidence.
 
2013-03-25 01:31:06 AM  

Pointy Tail of Satan: LIke I said before, if there is one medical service that should be free, and with no hassle, it's for violence oriented mental health issues. Although I would guess the NRA would prefer arming bus and cab drivers with an MP5.


The NRA wouldn't be so gun-shy if a certain group wasn't trying to reclassify owning a gun as a mental illness.
 
2013-03-25 01:31:13 AM  
So where are the trolls from the stop-and-frisk thread?  OK, I plonked one of them, but still there were others.
 
2013-03-25 01:32:46 AM  
BarkingUnicorn:
The single most requested topic by Ethics Scoreboard readers is in the area of criminal defense lawyer ethics: how can it be right for an attorney to defend in court an individual that he or she knows is guilty?

Those questions are certainly not asked by anyone who knows a damned thing about civics.  The accused is innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.  It's sad that the question must even be asked.
 
2013-03-25 01:33:21 AM  

over_and_done: I'm not arguing "guilty," I'm arguing "crazy". Maybe that's not a distinction that we're allowed to make, I dunno. I think the lawyer could help this psycho fark more by getting him put away in the looney bin instead of arguing that he's normal.


You didn't read linked article, did you?  You still have no idea what a defense attorney''s job is. The defense attorney's job is to make the prosecution prove guilt beyond any doubt that a reasonable person would have.  It is his job to raise doubts... all of them, even the most obviously unreasonable ones.

Treatment can be ordered by the court, if he's found guilty.
 
2013-03-25 01:36:39 AM  
I live in the suburbs here (adjacent suburbs, not the ones with large separation from the city)

Who knows what would have happened anyway, but why the hell were two white hipsters on a Detroit city bus?  Public transportation here is not like other cities.

If you are the type of person who reads Fark, then you do not belong on a Detroit bus.  If you are a hipster, you do not get on a Detroit bus even in an ironic "I can ride these buses" way.  You will end up dead or penniless.
 
2013-03-25 01:37:01 AM  

BarkingUnicorn: One of the things a defense lawyer cannot do is suborn perjury.  If a client says, "I did it, but I'm gonna testify that I didn't," the lawyer must either persuade the client not to testify or withdraw from the case.


Ya, that would be subsection (d), which I referenced.  It's also not a problem if the client is very carefully questioned about the details of the case.  It's cute that you're trying to play the "I know stuff about the law because I watch Law & Order."  Please continue to contribute in these amazing ways to these discussions.
 
2013-03-25 01:41:57 AM  

Gyrfalcon: And, as I said and will keep saying: That's not the lawyer's decision to make. Unless you're okay with people just being locked up in mental hospitals against their will without having any say in the matter. Are you? Because that's what you're demanding here. You're asking someone else to say this guy is too crazy to live, based on a three-paragraph news article, and if that's fine by you, then understand it's a short step till anyone can be found too crazy to live based on equally flimsy evidence.


No, I'm asking someone else to say this guy is too crazy to live, based on the fact that he killed someone in front of witnesses.

Yes, I know the lawyer isn't allowed to do that.  I'm merely saddened that a lawyer will defend someone he knows to be guilty rather than stepping down or asking for a mental evaluation.
 
2013-03-25 01:46:11 AM  

BarkingUnicorn: over_and_done: I'm not arguing "guilty," I'm arguing "crazy". Maybe that's not a distinction that we're allowed to make, I dunno. I think the lawyer could help this psycho fark more by getting him put away in the looney bin instead of arguing that he's normal.

You didn't read linked article, did you?  You still have no idea what a defense attorney''s job is. The defense attorney's job is to make the prosecution prove guilt beyond any doubt that a reasonable person would have.  It is his job to raise doubts... all of them, even the most obviously unreasonable ones.

Treatment can be ordered by the court, if he's found guilty.


I think we're talking past each other.  It's great that they're doing their job, but it's a job that shouldn't be required of them in the first place.  I'm too tired and angry to make my point coherent, so I'll stop trying.
 
2013-03-25 01:46:11 AM  

over_and_done: Gyrfalcon: And, as I said and will keep saying: That's not the lawyer's decision to make. Unless you're okay with people just being locked up in mental hospitals against their will without having any say in the matter. Are you? Because that's what you're demanding here. You're asking someone else to say this guy is too crazy to live, based on a three-paragraph news article, and if that's fine by you, then understand it's a short step till anyone can be found too crazy to live based on equally flimsy evidence.

No, I'm asking someone else to say this guy is too crazy to live, based on the fact that he killed someone in front of witnesses.

Yes, I know the lawyer isn't allowed to do that.  I'm merely saddened that a lawyer will defend someone he knows to be guilty rather than stepping down or asking for a mental evaluation.


Why are you saddened that a lawyer would MAKE SURE the government carries its burden and proves the guilt of the accused beyond a reasonable doubt?  Why are you sad that a lawyer would make sure the constitution and laws of this country are followed?
 
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