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(Popular Mechanics)   AWD is over-rated because some reporter who test drives the car, and parks in an underground garage thinks AWD isn't needed and snow tires will do. Wait till he sees the pictures from Lancashire today   (popularmechanics.com) divider line 185
    More: Dumbass, AWD, parking garage, Dodge Viper, laws of physics  
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13204 clicks; posted to Main » on 24 Mar 2013 at 7:31 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-03-24 08:44:10 AM  

CarnySaur: You learn not to drive too slow when you find out that lack of momentum means you start sliding backwards and sideways.  Then again, if you think the person in front of you is driving too slow on the highway, man up and pass them in the unplowed left lane, don't tailgate them hoping they get the hint.


Agreed, because they will never 'get the hint'.  Also you're probably just making them more nervous and thus more apt to do something stupid.  But it is agonizing getting stuck behind them until an appropriate passing opportunity arises.
 
2013-03-24 08:47:11 AM  

jafiwam: Happy Hours: AWD is not a panacea. We got dumped on earlier and I just had to drive in it. The major streets had been cleared but the side streets and parking lots were pretty bad.

There's only one way to deal with that kind of mess. Slow down and avoid heavy braking. I only have FWD which may make acceleration more difficult than AWD but braking is different. I have brakes on all 4 wheels. I'm pretty sure all cars have brakes on all 4 wheels.

Yes, yes there is.

[www.famouslogos.us image 430x173]


I've heard people proclaim that Subaru's are great in snow so much that I almost believe it, but I've never driven one. I'm not sure why that is other than I think they're all made with AWD, I don't believe they can defy the laws of physics though. If you're driving on a sheet of ice or there's very little friction you'd best slow down and avoid heavy braking.

You also can't floor it when the light turns green, I don't care how many wheels are fighting to gain traction. And be careful when cornering too.
 
2013-03-24 08:49:23 AM  
Guy at work was talking about his "almost manual ford focus" WTF is almost manual?

Some sort of auto stick?  You can drive it like a manual with no clutch.  I'd love a manual but with my commute I wouldn't want it for everyday driving.
 
2013-03-24 08:53:39 AM  
It's been said, but common sense and taking things slow is the best bet. Living in Maine, I have driven in snow all my life, and rarely gotten stuck. And I have owned fwd, rwd and awd

I would say the author is downplaying how much AWD can help, because in New England, there are alot of hills, and fwd will only get you so far on them.
 
2013-03-24 08:58:24 AM  
I drive a RWD G8 GT through our (admittedly underwhelming) winters.  Snow tires aren't glue, per se, but do offer much superior traction to all-season tires.  The traction control doesn't tend to come on very often unless you drive like a moron.

Constrast this with the Monte Carlo SS I drove some quarter century ago.  It was also a RWD v8 (but with waaaay less hp), but was equipped with some suck-ass gatorbacks.  Got caught in that early snow of October 1987 in upstate NY, and that drive was definitely. not. fun.

/ have driven awd--it's great for launching off the line, and very good offroad.  On pavement...kind of overkill, and pretty expensive to maintain from my experience.
 
2013-03-24 09:01:39 AM  

Happy Hours: I've heard people proclaim that Subaru's are great in snow so much that I almost believe it, but I've never driven one. I'm not sure why that is other than I think they're all made with AWD, I don't believe they can defy the laws of physics though. If you're driving on a sheet of ice or there's very little friction you'd best slow down and avoid heavy braking.

You also can't floor it when the light turns green, I don't care how many wheels are fighting to gain traction. And be careful when cornering too.


My guess is that they are lower to the ground than alot of other AWDs.
 
2013-03-24 09:06:24 AM  

Nick Nostril: SnarfVader: The key is to slow the fark down in slick conditions, no matter what you drive. Just because you have a huge SUV and grew up where snow is measured in feet doesn't make you immune to the laws of physics be considerate and stay home until spring.

FTFY.


fark off. I know how to drive in the snow. People like you are the problem.
 
2013-03-24 09:08:14 AM  
http://www.nokiantyres.com/winter-driving-school  the tires I put all the way around on my RWD Volvo 240 made a huge difference.
 
2013-03-24 09:13:00 AM  

SnarfVader: Nick Nostril: SnarfVader: The key is to slow the fark down in slick conditions, no matter what you drive. Just because you have a huge SUV and grew up where snow is measured in feet doesn't make you immune to the laws of physics be considerate and stay home until spring.

FTFY.

fark off. I know how to drive in the snow. People like you are the problem.


and people like you are the ones that wind up closing the roads down when they decide to play ping pong with the guard rails and the other cars and make me have to sit there for 6 hrs before i find out that they have closed the road because of morons that dont slow the fark down when the weather is bad
 
2013-03-24 09:15:54 AM  

jafiwam: Happy Hours: AWD is not a panacea. We got dumped on earlier and I just had to drive in it. The major streets had been cleared but the side streets and parking lots were pretty bad.

There's only one way to deal with that kind of mess. Slow down and avoid heavy braking. I only have FWD which may make acceleration more difficult than AWD but braking is different. I have brakes on all 4 wheels. I'm pretty sure all cars have brakes on all 4 wheels.

Yes, yes there is.

[www.famouslogos.us image 430x173]



Yup.  Subaru awd rocks.   Lots of vehicles "claim" to have awd but when they are tested, only a small percentage of torque is ever applied to the other wheels..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&v=0_MXK2nzt2Y&NR=1
 
2013-03-24 09:19:58 AM  
Snow tires?  I thought those went away in the 70s.

I have AWD and never thought it would help me corner or stop.  It sure works nice to go, however.  Most of the time FWD works fine and maybe I don't "need" AWD, but there have been a number of times I wouldn't have headed out without AWD.
 
2013-03-24 09:22:28 AM  
Snow tires + FWD will beat AWD with all seasons on a plowed road with no hills, but that is nowhere near reality.   Imagine a typical scenario where you have to go down a big hill and up the next steep one.   If you go safe and slow down the hill, you will probably not make it up the next.   Most cars today strive for a 50/50 weight balance, which is nice in the dry but does not give you traction on a heavy fwd car going up a big hill.   Instead you have to fly down the hill and hope the momentum carries you back up the next.   In AWD, you can go slow down and have the traction to get up the other side.

Another nice part about Subies is the viscous center diff, that locks up when you have a big front/back wheel speed difference.   If your front tires start to slip and lock up during light braking on an icy surface, the drivetrain will increase the brake bias to the rear wheels through the center diff.   The same with downshifting to brake while going down an icy hill.   Instead of your steering wheels slipping, the force tends to equalize and you maintain traction.
 
2013-03-24 09:29:17 AM  
Yes, snow tires would make a great gift.
 
2013-03-24 09:30:33 AM  
I love  my snow tires.

They let me climb hills in a rear wheel drive sports car better then the fools in their 4x4 trucks with bald summer tires.
 
2013-03-24 09:33:39 AM  

harbingerofdoom: SnarfVader: Nick Nostril: SnarfVader: The key is to slow the fark down in slick conditions, no matter what you drive. Just because you have a huge SUV and grew up where snow is measured in feet doesn't make you immune to the laws of physics be considerate and stay home until spring.

FTFY.

fark off. I know how to drive in the snow. People like you are the problem.

and people like you are the ones that wind up closing the roads down when they decide to play ping pong with the guard rails and the other cars and make me have to sit there for 6 hrs before i find out that they have closed the road because of morons that dont slow the fark down when the weather is bad


Who are you responding to? Because I've never ping ponged a guard rail in my life, nor do I speed in the snow.
 
2013-03-24 09:38:49 AM  
and it provides the potential to be going so much faster when you need to stop.

this is true.  In my spiffy '75 Saab 99 I could haul ass in the snow but like 4wd trucks, front wheel drive did nothing for my reflexes or the brakes, or guard rail or light pole or parked truck not even for the front end or door assembly nor the rear axle.
-1 would not buy from again.  Left auto parts scattered across the road, truck and, sidewalk at 3am in a light snow storm.
 
2013-03-24 09:41:09 AM  
Glad to see the general Fark consensus is that subby is the dumbass here. Will take dedicated snows on a rear wheel drive any day. Leave the traction and stability control at home. Watch me pull away from the 4wd in 80,000mi all-season tires. All. Day. Long.

Obviously, properly equipped 4wd is even more unstoppable.
 
2013-03-24 09:46:12 AM  
I co-drove an AWD car to victory in a 24-hour race, and in the rain I enjoyed how the car accelerated off the corners.
However, my experience-hard-earned from wrecking more than one AWD vehicle during snow-handling tests for a tire company-is that AWD is counter-productive when the roads are slick.


yeah, what does this guy know!

/he's right on the money
//have a set of nokians on my RWD car right now
///and snow on the ground, goddamnit.
 
2013-03-24 09:46:38 AM  
Just a couple of truisms about AWD: (some have already been mentioned)
1. It allows you to get yourself stuck in a more inaccessible place.
2. All vehicles are AWD when braking.  You get going too fast with AWD and false sense.
3. If it helped in handling, all race cars would be AWD (apologies to Audi Quatro).
4. It definitely helps in soft, muddy or snowy surfaces, not ice, nothing helps on ice.
5. It's a normal man's Porsche, figure it out.
6. Very few people need it, most who have it never need it, just like SUVs, mostly waste.
 
2013-03-24 09:48:58 AM  

BenJammin: jafiwam: Happy Hours: AWD is not a panacea. We got dumped on earlier and I just had to drive in it. The major streets had been cleared but the side streets and parking lots were pretty bad.

There's only one way to deal with that kind of mess. Slow down and avoid heavy braking. I only have FWD which may make acceleration more difficult than AWD but braking is different. I have brakes on all 4 wheels. I'm pretty sure all cars have brakes on all 4 wheels.

Yes, yes there is.

[www.famouslogos.us image 430x173]


Yup.  Subaru awd rocks.   Lots of vehicles "claim" to have awd but when they are tested, only a small percentage of torque is ever applied to the other wheels..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&v=0_MXK2nzt2Y&NR=1


Subarus are magical in the snow.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ONFvQToNdU


I've got a WRX Hatchback, WITH a set of snow tires, I run those Dec-Apr and the rest of the year I'm running my summer performance tires.  The tire makes a HUGE difference, every year there are people posting on NASIOC about how they didn't think they needed anything besides the stock tires and now their suspension is ruined.

I'm really impressed by the Audi AWD.  I lived in DC during the Snowmageddons a couple years ago and my little A4 went absolutely everywhere in the snow.  I was driving to Florida when the first one hit and it took 5 hours to get to Richmond.  I was the ONLY car on the bypass by time I reached it, every SUV that passed me had gone off the road and every exit prior to the bypass had a mile long line of cars looking to get off the road.  I stuck to the middle of 95 doing 35 mph(on All-seaon Pirellis) and never lost traction.   I had the Audi driving through WV on super slick roads as well and had absolutely no traction problems, my wife spun out in it once while following a semi on I-64 around Beckley, we went through the grass median and up into the other side of the highway but she was able to control the spin because of the AWD and got us safely to the other side of the road without damaging the car one bit.   I thought it was pretty awesome.
 
2013-03-24 09:49:02 AM  
Step 1: Drive 4x4, double cab Toyota Tacoma.
Step 2: opt for stability control, traction control & optional rear locking differential.
Step 3: Install studded winter tires

With that combo, my truck really is pretty much unstoppable. My biggest problem are the other guys on the road, who think it's a smart idea to go over the pass with their bald tire mustang.

/leaving for the ski resort in 26 minutes
 
2013-03-24 09:49:17 AM  
You'd think people know how to drive in snow around Cleveland? No, not true at all.  Works to my advantage though.  Everyone is scared of the left lane, so I have that to my self.  Even when you can still see the road, these people are driving 45-50 and scared to death.  All you need to do is leave a lot of space, don't slam on the brakes and ease off the gas around curves.

/Truly one of the worst driving areas in the country.
 
2013-03-24 09:58:16 AM  
RE: Driving on snow/ice.
I work in Montreal occasionally.  They say it is 9 months of snow and 3 months of road repairs every year so traffic is testing for sure.
But they admit one thing, when the snows/ice comes no one knows how to drive on it and it is chaos for the first two weeks or so, then they figure it out or remember last year and settle down, drive at proper speeds and all goes well.
And they have road clearing equipment/capabilities.
 
2013-03-24 10:00:05 AM  

oukewldave: You'd think people know how to drive in snow around Cleveland? No, not true at all.  Works to my advantage though.  Everyone is scared of the left lane, so I have that to my self.  Even when you can still see the road, these people are driving 45-50 and scared to death.  All you need to do is leave a lot of space, don't slam on the brakes and ease off the gas around curves.

/Truly one of the worst driving areas in the country.


One thing about guys that drive in the un-plowed lane, particularly in slush, YOU SUCK.  Spraying shiat all over the windshields of everyone else so they can't see.  45-50 is acceptable speed if there's only one good lane.
 
2013-03-24 10:07:14 AM  

darkscout: Happy Hours: There's only one way to deal with that kind of mess. Slow down and avoid heavy braking. I only have FWD which may make acceleration more difficult than AWD but braking is different. I have brakes on all 4 wheels. I'm pretty sure all cars have brakes on all 4 wheels.

4WD won't help you stop but it may help you get going. IF you have a locking differential. If you don't then you're almost always just as screwed.

traylor: Yep, snow tires will do. Because snow tires are AWESOME.

I had someone try to convince me that snow tires were some sort of magic super glue. Hell I learned to drive on near bald tires. Slow down you're not going to change the laws of physics.


Tires make a huge difference. I have raced trucks on a skid course. Two trucks and thirty two people with brackets.

The same truck make, model, and year, but truck A had better tires and won every time. EVERY time.

So out of all the matchups, no driver was able to make up for the tire advantage.
 
2013-03-24 10:15:29 AM  

Kimpak: oukewldave: You'd think people know how to drive in snow around Cleveland? No, not true at all.  Works to my advantage though.  Everyone is scared of the left lane, so I have that to my self.  Even when you can still see the road, these people are driving 45-50 and scared to death.  All you need to do is leave a lot of space, don't slam on the brakes and ease off the gas around curves.

/Truly one of the worst driving areas in the country.

One thing about guys that drive in the un-plowed lane, particularly in slush, YOU SUCK.  Spraying shiat all over the windshields of everyone else so they can't see.  45-50 is acceptable speed if there's only one good lane.


Sounds like someone is driving in conditions they shouldn't be.

If you don't feel safe on the road, then get off it.
 
2013-03-24 10:23:04 AM  
In my experience, tires do make a huge difference regardless of the drivetrain.

Good all seasons +1,  Good Snow tires + 5.

AWD is probably another +2 or more  depending on the system, with some being superior to others.

Manual Transmission can help greatly depending on the torque and whether you need to slow down or accelerate.

The driver, of course, and the conditions are always variables.  With a lousy configuration, even a good driver will have issues.  With a good configuration, a bad driver will likely get into trouble.

Some front wheel drive cars are better than some AWD cars with snow tires alone  (Volvo 850 with Snows was just as solid and better than my CRV with crap Continental tires)

My manual Acura GSR was useless in any snow or ice without Snows.  Blizzak's made it drivable in Boston.

My manual Nissan Altima was awful with Continental tires in the rain,  (I hate Continental tires) but is quite respectable with Snows.

I haven't put Snows on the CRV, (toyo all seasons now) but the winter when they were new versus this winter is a noticeable difference.

I have a lot of respect for Subaru's.  The video comparos that they do pick competitors with basic AWD systems.  I bought the CRV instead of the Forester because other than the AWD, I got more car for my money.  Nicer fit and finish, a higher resale is likely, and an AWD system that does what I need it to do most of the time.

Regardless of what you end up with, it sure is nice to have the extra confidence of a car that does a good job in bad situations.  Whether you achieve it with AWD, tires, torque, or some other thing, it is nice to say  -- "that was a worthwhile expense."   Mounted snow tires from Tire Rack -- $650
 
2013-03-24 10:34:13 AM  
Gotta love the farkers posting from the flatlands about how RWD or FWD is the way to go.  Spend some time in the mountains and get back to us.  I haven't had to chain up since we changed to AWD/4WD.
 
2013-03-24 10:42:12 AM  
FTFA: However, my experience-hard-earned from wrecking more than one AWD vehicle during snow-handling tests for a tire company-is that AWD is counter-productive when the roads are slick. At the same time AWD doesn't improve your handling, it does offer an overly optimistic sense of available traction, and it provides the potential to be going so much faster when you need to stop. (Note to those from warm climes: Snowbanks are not puffy and cushiony.) The laws of physics mean a vehicle's cornering power is the job of the tires and suspension.

Sounds like this guy knows a heck of a lot more about driving in snow than subby. Four driven wheels with zero traction are just as bad as two driven wheels with zero traction. If you have SOME traction, good AWD will put the power to the correct wheel, but it seems his point is that AWD makes people overconfident and they tend to drive too fast for conditions. I'd definitely take FWD with snow tires over AWD with road tires on anything slick.
 
2013-03-24 10:47:57 AM  
"All the best [AWD systems and electronic-stability control] will still get beat by a good set of snow tires," Hannemann says.

And if you put those same good snow tires on a car with AWD as opposed to non-AWD.
You get the added benefit of AWD AND SNOW TIRES = Win.

I'll never go back to non AWD for my family cars.
 
2013-03-24 10:48:23 AM  

mbillips: FTFA: However, my experience-hard-earned from wrecking more than one AWD vehicle during snow-handling tests for a tire company-is that AWD is counter-productive when the roads are slick. At the same time AWD doesn't improve your handling, it does offer an overly optimistic sense of available traction, and it provides the potential to be going so much faster when you need to stop. (Note to those from warm climes: Snowbanks are not puffy and cushiony.) The laws of physics mean a vehicle's cornering power is the job of the tires and suspension.

Sounds like this guy knows a heck of a lot more about driving in snow than subby. Four driven wheels with zero traction are just as bad as two driven wheels with zero traction. If you have SOME traction, good AWD will put the power to the correct wheel, but it seems his point is that AWD makes people overconfident and they tend to drive too fast for conditions. I'd definitely take FWD with snow tires over AWD with road tires on anything slick.


You realize you can put snow tires on an AWD vehicle as well right?  And in that case, it's going to make the FWD car look silly.
 
2013-03-24 10:48:43 AM  

Nefarious: Guy at work was talking about his "almost manual ford focus" WTF is almost manual?

Some sort of auto stick?  You can drive it like a manual with no clutch.  I'd love a manual but with my commute I wouldn't want it for everyday driving.


Paddle-shifter.  It's a manual transmission in the traditional sense, but there's a mechanical or mechanical/electronic transmission that works the clutch and the shift for you.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semi-automatic_transmission

They're... not terribly popular, since the vast majority of people that use a manual use it because they don't mind the extra work involved in exchange for the weight and money saved.  A paddle-shift, firstly, adds some of that weight back, and secondly is rather more expensive.  Also it means you're flipping a switch up and down as you drive, which feels kind of... silly to both automatic and manual drivers.

It's very popular on expensive kind-of-race cars for rich people that want to feel like they're going vroom vroom but can't actually drive or take the vehicle anywhere that would necessitate such extra control.  Generally you can put anyone who has one at a good 50% chance of being a complete douche.
 
2013-03-24 10:48:54 AM  
Get what you need for where you live.    How's that?
 
2013-03-24 10:50:01 AM  

Girion47: Kimpak: oukewldave: You'd think people know how to drive in snow around Cleveland? No, not true at all.  Works to my advantage though.  Everyone is scared of the left lane, so I have that to my self.  Even when you can still see the road, these people are driving 45-50 and scared to death.  All you need to do is leave a lot of space, don't slam on the brakes and ease off the gas around curves.

/Truly one of the worst driving areas in the country.

One thing about guys that drive in the un-plowed lane, particularly in slush, YOU SUCK.  Spraying shiat all over the windshields of everyone else so they can't see.  45-50 is acceptable speed if there's only one good lane.

Sounds like someone is driving in conditions they shouldn't be.

If you don't feel safe on the road, then get off it.


THIS.
 
2013-03-24 10:53:43 AM  

mbillips: Sounds like this guy knows a heck of a lot more about driving in snow than subby. Four driven wheels with zero traction are just as bad as two driven wheels with zero traction. If you have SOME traction, good AWD will put the power to the correct wheel, but it seems his point is that AWD makes people overconfident and they tend to drive too fast for conditions. I'd definitely take FWD with snow tires over AWD with road tires on anything slick.


That point is somewhat misleading though.  Its not AWD that's the problem, its the driver.  AWD is doing what its supposed to do which is applying power to the wheels with the most traction.  Its more of a user error at that point if you keep pushing the car past what the laws of physics will allow.
 
2013-03-24 10:55:14 AM  

oukewldave: You'd think people know how to drive in snow around Cleveland? No, not true at all.  Works to my advantage though.  Everyone is scared of the left lane, so I have that to my self.  Even when you can still see the road, these people are driving 45-50 and scared to death.  All you need to do is leave a lot of space, don't slam on the brakes and ease off the gas around curves.

/Truly one of the worst driving areas in the country.


Then you haven't driven in other places in the country much.  I grew up in Cleveland. Driving test at 16 in 14 inches of snow on my birthday in December.    I have driven in every state except the Dakotas and Hawaii.  I've driven in Guatemala, Canada, and Mexico.  I've lived in Texas, Florida, and now Colorado.  I have driven in blizzards, I was guided by the force in a white out sandwiched between two 18 wheelers on 80 in Nebraska with one coming up on the side, I've driven in Jungles, and beaches, and mountains, and deserts.    There are shiatty driving conditions and shiatty drivers everywhere.  It's not just Houston, or Dallas, or Denver, Antigua Guatemal, or Cleveland.  It's everywhere.
 
2013-03-24 10:57:07 AM  

AWD is not a magic bullet, because it's not going that is the problem, usually, it's stopping. So you don't need 4 wheel drive, but 4 wheel brakes. And last I checked, pretty much all cars have that feature...


The problem is the drivers who think that rain is liquid sunshine and snow is crunchy sunshine, so they can drive like it is sunny on dry pavement.


/It's not the flakes falling from the sky that scare me, it's the ones with steering wheels in front of them.

 
2013-03-24 10:57:13 AM  
AWD or 4wd is better than 2wd, period, end of story.

And no, a FWD with "snow tires" is NOT in any way better than an AWD with "all terrains".

Now I might see if you have plain old street tires on your SUV that a FWD with some gnarly snow tires might have an advantage, but if your AWD/4WD had any sort of even mildly aggressive tread, there's nothing a 2wd can do to beat it.

This applies for any frozen precip you can come up with.  Snow, Sleet, Ice, whatever.

What's really funny though, is the idiots who buy an AWD and think that means they can just go like the pavement is dry.
 
2013-03-24 11:00:25 AM  

Jim_Callahan: It's very popular on expensive kind-of-race cars for rich people that want to feel like they're going vroom vroom but can't actually drive or take the vehicle anywhere that would necessitate such extra control.  Generally you can put anyone who has one at a good 50% chance of being a complete douche.


They're also on those expensive sports cars, if I'm not mistaken, because the paddle shifting is faster than a regular gear shift.  So you can go up through all your available gears as fast as the engine can give you power.
 
2013-03-24 11:01:35 AM  

MrSteve007: Step 1: Drive 4x4, double cab Toyota Tacoma.
Step 2: opt for stability control, traction control & optional rear locking differential.
Step 3: Install studded winter tires

With that combo, my truck really is pretty much unstoppable. My biggest problem are the other guys on the road, who think it's a smart idea to go over the pass with their bald tire mustang.

/leaving for the ski resort in 26 minutes


I live on Mt. Spokane on the other side of the state.  Never have much of a problem with the roads, but getting to them can be a bit tricky.  We also have livestock so I followed similar but upgraded path.

Dodge 3500 4x4.  No studs.  Slip right through the passes to Seattle twice a month and almost never put it in 4wd.

/8000lbs of weight beats snow tires :)
 
hej
2013-03-24 11:08:33 AM  
I've got RWD with a set of snow tires.  It's better than summer tires, but I doubt they're tremendously different than what I'd get out of all seasons.  I still worry about getting stuck in snow deeper than 6 inches.
 
2013-03-24 11:09:03 AM  
I used to mock snow tires, but my dad gave me a set when I was in college. Smash cut to me laughing like a maniac as I mob my 10-year-old Protege through a snowbank with both a Tacoma and an F-150 stuck in it.

I use them every year now.
 
kab
2013-03-24 11:09:11 AM  
Snow tires and half a clue behind the wheel actually will do just fine.

The problem is that this article is trying to imply that awd is somehow no better than 2wd in such environments, which is a pretty dumb assessment.
 
2013-03-24 11:10:17 AM  
These snow tires plus AWD will get you anywhere in the snow ;)

www.madwhips.com
/hot like a subaru Trax
 
2013-03-24 11:12:23 AM  

Kimpak: These snow tires plus AWD will get you anywhere in the snow ;)

[www.madwhips.com image 568x426]
/hot like a subaru Trax


Yeah, but you're gonna need one hell of a power steering system if you're gonna dodge that little squirrel in the road like in the commercials.
 
2013-03-24 11:13:37 AM  

Kimpak: Jim_Callahan: It's very popular on expensive kind-of-race cars for rich people that want to feel like they're going vroom vroom but can't actually drive or take the vehicle anywhere that would necessitate such extra control.  Generally you can put anyone who has one at a good 50% chance of being a complete douche.

They're also on those expensive sports cars, if I'm not mistaken, because the paddle shifting is faster than a regular gear shift.  So you can go up through all your available gears as fast as the engine can give you power.


Yes, that's why you'd want a flappy paddle gearbox.  Most of the new cars with the auto-stick have the flappy paddles as well as the the ability to change gears on the stick.  I drove a rental with that option and it's not the same without a clutch or a proper shifter.
 
2013-03-24 11:24:57 AM  
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FTMFW
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2013-03-24 11:25:38 AM  

Nefarious: Yes, that's why you'd want a flappy paddle gearbox.  Most of the new cars with the auto-stick have the flappy paddles as well as the the ability to change gears on the stick.  I drove a rental with that option and it's not the same without a clutch or a proper shifter.


I prefer a regular gear box.  I drove a new mini cooper s with the JCW upgrades.  Its a nice zippy little car but the paddles have a delay that I don't like.  Hit paddle, second later the gear shifts.  So I had to sortof shift before I actually wanted to shift.  This was while the car was in 'sport' mode.  I supposed you could get used to it, but personally if I had that car I'd just leave it in automatic mode and wish I had a regular shifter and clutch.
 
2013-03-24 11:26:01 AM  

darkscout: I had someone try to convince me that snow tires were some sort of magic super glue. Hell I learned to drive on near bald tires. Slow down you're not going to change the laws of physics.


I learned how to drive in Michigan in the winter in a 69 VW bug with decent tires. Never had a real problem.

But then, about 10 years ago, I tried driving a Mustang through the winter and found that there were days when it wasn't possible. I tried chains for two years and it worked but I had to spend 40 minutes laying in snow and slush putting them on. Then I bought snow tires. Made a huge difference. I could actually get to work and back despite the snow.

But after buying an AWD Audi I swore I'd never again drive a 2wd car during the winter.
 
2013-03-24 11:26:27 AM  
Taking the winter rubber off the Audi this week.  Spring is sprung ( and Quattro FTW).
 
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