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(The Verge)   Steve Ballmer really *really* wants you to buy a PS4   (theverge.com) divider line 147
    More: Followup, Durango, Durango' Xbox, incorporation by reference, system console, high-fidelity, installations, leaks, optical drive  
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7445 clicks; posted to Geek » on 20 Mar 2013 at 9:06 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-03-20 08:33:01 AM  
That would suck for companies like Gamefly and Redbox, plus the gamers who want to try a game before they buy it.

/Also, fark Sony.
 
2013-03-20 09:10:17 AM  
Microsoft already lost me as a customer because of ads. this is just diahreah icing on the shut cake.
 
2013-03-20 09:11:01 AM  
Haha. No.
 
2013-03-20 09:15:21 AM  
I've lost power more often in the recent years than I lost my internet connection, so I don't have an issue with "always online". I do, however, have a giant issue with this whole anti-used-game trend. Try it, buttheads, I dare you.
 
2013-03-20 09:15:35 AM  

SnarfVader: That would suck for companies like Gamefly and Redbox, plus the gamers who want to try a game before they buy it.

/Also, fark Sony.


Also gamers who like to borrow and trade with their friends. And gamers who like to sell their old games as time goes on. And anybody who views games as an art form worth preserving.

But publishers will sell more copies. Maybe. Hopefully.
 
2013-03-20 09:16:41 AM  

HeartBurnKid: SnarfVader: That would suck for companies like Gamefly and Redbox, plus the gamers who want to try a game before they buy it.

/Also, fark Sony.

Also gamers who like to borrow and trade with their friends. And gamers who like to sell their old games as time goes on. And anybody who views games as an art form worth preserving.

But publishers will sell more copies. Maybe. Hopefully.


Oh, forgot about dedicated game retailers, because new games sure as hell don't have enough margin to keep the doors open.
 
2013-03-20 09:18:08 AM  

zyrian: I've lost power more often in the recent years than I lost my internet connection, so I don't have an issue with "always online". I do, however, have a giant issue with this whole anti-used-game trend. Try it, buttheads, I dare you.


That's NOT the problem with always online.

The problem is they want to control your use of a product you own. fark them.
 
2013-03-20 09:20:00 AM  
In reality, it sounds like they are trying to emulate the PC experience with the Xbox720. It really is an issue of expectations. People expect to be able to share and trade Console game disc, people don't expect to be able to share and trade PC game disc. Different market, different expectations. Microsoft does want us to "Think Different"
 
2013-03-20 09:26:41 AM  

MindStalker: In reality, it sounds like they are trying to emulate the PC experience with the Xbox720. It really is an issue of expectations. People expect to be able to share and trade Console game disc, people don't expect to be able to share and trade PC game disc. Different market, different expectations. Microsoft does want us to "Think Different"


Problem being that the PC is moving to be more console like in its format, with steambox and Ouya aiming to invade living room.  Then there's rift and the whole keyboard/mouse/joystick interface issue in the PC's advantage.

If Xbox steps too fark back, its going to fall into a chasm dominated by the Glorious PC gaming master race.

/People want convenience, Xbox needs to deliver convenience.
/if it ends up delivering nothing but DRM and and sadness, more people will migrate.
 
2013-03-20 09:30:13 AM  
I don't see this going well for Microsoft. They're going to have a hard enough time getting people to adopt for all the standard reasons.

Sony's lack of backward compatibility is also going to hurt adoption rates for the PS4. Granted, they've at least made some effort through online play.

Nevermind that PS3 and 360 prices are rock bottom and the new console prices will potentially be double or more what the current gen is. I really don't see the console launches going well for either of them.
 
2013-03-20 09:31:56 AM  
I'm more likely to get further into pc gaming or a Steambox than a PS4 if this turns out to be true.
 
kab
2013-03-20 09:36:07 AM  

doglover: The problem is they want to control your use of a product you own. fark them.


The bigger problem is that from their point of view, you don't actually own it.

Gamers will ultimately lose this battle, as they seem to readily adapt to most concessions that are put before them (for example, the idea of pay - DLC would have gotten a company laughed out of business in the 90's).

The next move will be to adapt the subbed MMO model across all games.... you pay a tiered fee monthly (of course, over and above whatever you're paying for cable + XBL).  The 'bronze' package nets you 3 titles per month with ads, gold yields 9 per month with all paid DLC included, and no ads.   Or something like that.

End game is, of course, to charge you based on how much you play.   And the idea of the quarter in the arcade machine will have come full circle.
 
zez
2013-03-20 09:36:09 AM  
Since I get my video games from the library I don't like this idea at all.
 
2013-03-20 09:41:53 AM  
I don't think they can do it if Sony doesn't. Might as well directly fund their marketing at that point.
 
kab
2013-03-20 09:42:23 AM  

MindStalker: In reality, it sounds like they are trying to emulate the PC experience with the Xbox720. It really is an issue of expectations.


If they're trying to emulate the pc 'experience', then they need to remember that the frequent and very good sales on Steam are the biggest perk to it.
 
2013-03-20 09:43:30 AM  

zez: Since I get my video games from the library I don't like this idea at all.


I was taken back when I joined my local library and saw the racks of games. I haven't grabbed any yet, but it was interesting to see that they are offering them next to CDs and DVDs now.
 
2013-03-20 09:45:03 AM  
Eh, stuff like this would really push me back into PC gaming. At this point just grabbing a few wireless gamepads and running a monitor cable to my TV in my living room is starting to sound like a better option anyway, but this would be the nail in the coffin.

Of course with PC games going always on as well, I may need to start actually interacting with my family and the outside world... god forbid.
 
2013-03-20 09:45:59 AM  
Comcast and Verizon will kill this pretty fast because 50Gb game downloads.
CSB
Got a letter telling me to upgrade to business X-finity because I was using too much bandwidth. That month I downloaded RAGE (27Gb) twice off steam.
 
2013-03-20 09:50:52 AM  
I have a dumb question, maybe you people can help me out:

Let's say I have a game for my XBox 720. Call it Skyrim, for the sake of convenience. I want to take Skyrim to a friend's house, to show it off. If I do this, there's a pretty good chance my buddy will want to buy his own copy of Skyrim. Wouldn't this concept prevent me from doing that?

And why shouldn't I be allowed to take, well, any game I own to a friend's house and play it there? That was a lot of my gaming experience when I was growing up, way back in the 8-bit days.
 
2013-03-20 09:52:44 AM  

Pick13: Comcast and Verizon will kill this pretty fast because 50Gb game downloads.
CSB
Got a letter telling me to upgrade to business X-finity because I was using too much bandwidth. That month I downloaded RAGE (27Gb) twice off steam.


That's what I did. House with 2 heavy internet users blew through that (now non-existent) 250gb cap fast. I never got chided, but I decided it was best to get the business class to stave it off. The included hosted Exchange account is nice, but I don't believe we will see the new speeds all the areas are getting right now.
 
2013-03-20 09:53:27 AM  

kab: doglover: The problem is they want to control your use of a product you own. fark them.

The bigger problem is that from their point of view, you don't actually own it.

Gamers will ultimately lose this battle, as they seem to readily adapt to most concessions that are put before them (for example, the idea of pay - DLC would have gotten a company laughed out of business in the 90's).

The next move will be to adapt the subbed MMO model across all games.... you pay a tiered fee monthly (of course, over and above whatever you're paying for cable + XBL).  The 'bronze' package nets you 3 titles per month with ads, gold yields 9 per month with all paid DLC included, and no ads.   Or something like that.

End game is, of course, to charge you based on how much you play.   And the idea of the quarter in the arcade machine will have come full circle.


That's why I avoid modern games. I'm not payin' them a red cent if they're not offering what I want.
 
2013-03-20 10:00:28 AM  

Gonz: nd why shouldn't I be allowed to take, well, any game I own to a friend's house and play it there?


Because in your eye you don't own it.  You are just licensed to use it.   The only way I could see this working is if you sign into your Xbox Live account on your buddy's console so that it would work then, but would stop when you leave and he can't use your account.  But it would hurt swapping games with friends as you would need to swap accounts as well.  And it stops used games.  Yeah for the land of Freedom!

Meanwhile, in that socialist hellhole that is the EU, the central court ruled last year that you can sell used software licenses.  Farking commies.
 
2013-03-20 10:01:05 AM  

ikanreed: Microsoft already lost me as a customer because of ads. this is just diahreah icing on the shut cake.


This. Turned on my Xbox the other day for the first time in a few months and there were farking ads on the dashboard. Not ads for games, farking Axe body spray ads. Yeah, no, go fark yourself.
 
2013-03-20 10:01:21 AM  
Sorry, in their eyes you don't own it.
 
2013-03-20 10:04:35 AM  
This is asinine if true. Try finding a new copy of a three year old game that doesn't bear the name 'Call of Duty'. If you ever want to explore the back catalogue of a publisher, too f-ng bad?

Oh I'm sure some games will be on Live Arcade to purchase, albeit at Microsoft's inflated bullshiat price.

Now, granted, I play PC games too, but the pricing has competition between GREENMANGAMING and Steam, meaning I'm not getting charged 20 dollars for a five year old game. Usually.
 
2013-03-20 10:08:56 AM  

YodaBlues: ikanreed: Microsoft already lost me as a customer because of ads. this is just diahreah icing on the shut cake.

This. Turned on my Xbox the other day for the first time in a few months and there were farking ads on the dashboard. Not ads for games, farking Axe body spray ads. Yeah, no, go fark yourself.


I don't even pay attention to them. I just go straight to the game I want to play.
 
2013-03-20 10:16:56 AM  
Dedicated game retailers: fark them, they're just middle men, and provide no additional value.  If I'm going to spend my money on a game, I want to be paying the people who created the game, and only them.  fark gamestop, fark EB, fark Bestbuy, Futureshop, Frys, fark 'em all.

People whining about selling used games: sorry folks, the MMO/Steam/AppStore model is the future.  Software is transitioning from a "product" to a "service".

Let's face it - a painfully low percentage of games break even on sales, much less turn a profit.  The cost to make mid-level and AAA games has skyrocketed in the last decade, to the point where game studios look like movie studios.  Making matters worse is those shiatty $1 games from the App store creating a "race to the bottom" effect.

Anything, and I mean ANYTHING that puts more of the game industry money into the hands of the game makers themselves is a good thing.  I mean, it's a good thing if you don't want to see the industry get stuck at Madden, Halo, COD, WoW, and farking Fruit Ninja forever.
 
2013-03-20 10:18:05 AM  
I've not been seeing a whole lot of reasons so far, from the leaks, to be excited about the next xbox.  Hell, Ms's last few E3's have been duds as well, talking up multimedia then anything worth playing we hadn't seen before.

I'll probably go PC/Ps4/wii u (once zelda hits) this gen.
 
2013-03-20 10:18:58 AM  

YodaBlues: ikanreed: Microsoft already lost me as a customer because of ads. this is just diahreah icing on the shut cake.

This. Turned on my Xbox the other day for the first time in a few months and there were farking ads on the dashboard. Not ads for games, farking Axe body spray ads. Yeah, no, go fark yourself.


I'm assuming they're trying to get a little profit from non-XBL users. If you subscribe to XBL, I'm sure they'll vanish. For instance, similar to Spotify.
 
2013-03-20 10:19:23 AM  

kab: doglover: The problem is they want to control your use of a product you own. fark them.

The bigger problem is that from their point of view, you don't actually own it.

Gamers will ultimately lose this battle, as they seem to readily adapt to most concessions that are put before them (for example, the idea of pay - DLC would have gotten a company laughed out of business in the 90's).

The next move will be to adapt the subbed MMO model across all games.... you pay a tiered fee monthly (of course, over and above whatever you're paying for cable + XBL).  The 'bronze' package nets you 3 titles per month with ads, gold yields 9 per month with all paid DLC included, and no ads.   Or something like that.

End game is, of course, to charge you based on how much you play.   And the idea of the quarter in the arcade machine will have come full circle.


It has come full circle. I have Sonic Dash on my iPhone. Game cost 1.99 and is beautiful, but if you die and want to continue from that spot(rather than start over), it costs you a 'red star' which at the lowest bundle price, is worth about 14 cents.
 
2013-03-20 10:20:37 AM  

Lexx: Anything, and I mean ANYTHING that puts more of the game industry money into the hands of the game makers themselves is a good thing. I mean, it's a good thing if you don't want to see the industry get stuck at Madden, Halo, COD, WoW, and farking Fruit Ninja forever.


So, we're going to beat Madden, Halo, and COD by... giving more money to the people who make Madden, Halo, and COD?

/not to mention, it's debatable whether this would result in more sales anyway
//i doubt it will, to be honest
 
2013-03-20 10:21:18 AM  

digistil: YodaBlues: ikanreed: Microsoft already lost me as a customer because of ads. this is just diahreah icing on the shut cake.

This. Turned on my Xbox the other day for the first time in a few months and there were farking ads on the dashboard. Not ads for games, farking Axe body spray ads. Yeah, no, go fark yourself.

I'm assuming they're trying to get a little profit from non-XBL users. If you subscribe to XBL, I'm sure they'll vanish. For instance, similar to Spotify.


As a former XBL Gold subscriber: they don't.
 
2013-03-20 10:21:47 AM  
These people are full of crap.
If Microsoft really did these things, they could kiss their industry goodbye.

Then again....
I thought that charging a monthly fee to play onlinewould drive off.... everyone.  I was wrong.
 
2013-03-20 10:23:20 AM  

digistil: YodaBlues: ikanreed: Microsoft already lost me as a customer because of ads. this is just diahreah icing on the shut cake.

This. Turned on my Xbox the other day for the first time in a few months and there were farking ads on the dashboard. Not ads for games, farking Axe body spray ads. Yeah, no, go fark yourself.

I'm assuming they're trying to get a little profit from non-XBL users. If you subscribe to XBL, I'm sure they'll vanish. For instance, similar to Spotify.


You'd think that, but you would be wrong. Having gold doesn't remove the ads.
 
2013-03-20 10:24:40 AM  

HeartBurnKid: digistil: YodaBlues: ikanreed: Microsoft already lost me as a customer because of ads. this is just diahreah icing on the shut cake.

This. Turned on my Xbox the other day for the first time in a few months and there were farking ads on the dashboard. Not ads for games, farking Axe body spray ads. Yeah, no, go fark yourself.

I'm assuming they're trying to get a little profit from non-XBL users. If you subscribe to XBL, I'm sure they'll vanish. For instance, similar to Spotify.

As a former XBL Gold subscriber: they don't.


Seriously??? XBL subscribers get ads for things like Axe body spray?
 
2013-03-20 10:25:09 AM  

MadSkillz: It has come full circle. I have Sonic Dash on my iPhone. Game cost 1.99 and is beautiful, but if you die and want to continue from that spot(rather than start over), it costs you a 'red star' which at the lowest bundle price, is worth about 14 cents.


That's nothing.

The My Little Pony game, just a city builder with characters and buildings from the show, cost at LEAST $300 in premium currency to beat the main story line. That was the minimum price to beat without hacks.
 
2013-03-20 10:27:14 AM  
I haven't really used my Xbox since I upgraded to a crossfire setup (2x 5770), and my ps3 is a dedicated The Show console.  For the price of a new gen console you can completely upgrade a PC to play current gen PC titles and retro titles from Wii on back.  The 360 offered groundbreaking online components, but Durango is going to need something beyond big brother Kinect to succeed.
 
2013-03-20 10:32:35 AM  

YodaBlues: digistil: YodaBlues: ikanreed: Microsoft already lost me as a customer because of ads. this is just diahreah icing on the shut cake.

This. Turned on my Xbox the other day for the first time in a few months and there were farking ads on the dashboard. Not ads for games, farking Axe body spray ads. Yeah, no, go fark yourself.

I'm assuming they're trying to get a little profit from non-XBL users. If you subscribe to XBL, I'm sure they'll vanish. For instance, similar to Spotify.

You'd think that, but you would be wrong. Having gold doesn't remove the ads.


Wow. That's ridiculous. I thought charging for online gaming would sink the 360, but was obviously very wrong. Successfully pushing ads to paying subscribers makes me wonder if they've calculated people won't be bothered by an always-on-connection and lack of used games. And maybe they're actually right.
 
2013-03-20 10:35:59 AM  
Even though I've kept pace with video game systems dating back to the Atari 2600, I can't make myself care about this.

The graphics and sound quality on my PS3 leave nothing to be desired and there is now a massive catalog of games that could potentially keep me occupied for the next decade.
 
2013-03-20 10:45:50 AM  
ikanreed:

But you can't spell.
 
2013-03-20 10:51:25 AM  

YodaBlues: digistil: YodaBlues: ikanreed: Microsoft already lost me as a customer because of ads. this is just diahreah icing on the shut cake.

This. Turned on my Xbox the other day for the first time in a few months and there were farking ads on the dashboard. Not ads for games, farking Axe body spray ads. Yeah, no, go fark yourself.

I'm assuming they're trying to get a little profit from non-XBL users. If you subscribe to XBL, I'm sure they'll vanish. For instance, similar to Spotify.

You'd think that, but you would be wrong. Having gold doesn't remove the ads.


I hate the current 360 Dashboard layout.  If I pin apps/games they just get sent to a sub-menu that I still have to scroll through.  I should be able to customize the damn home screen tiles.  I don't mind leaving one streaming ad so I can see new Live content I didn't know about, but I don't need the screen to be 90% ads.

An always-connected console would be a deal breaker for me.  I'm usually connected to the internet, but between occasional drops in service and wanting to bring my console other places without configuring the WiFi settings every time, I won't deal with it.
 
2013-03-20 10:51:30 AM  
HotWingConspiracy:  I don't think they can do it if Sony doesn't.

When Sony was first coming out with Blu-Ray they had considered making it so that any disk can only be played on the first machine it went into, you could not play it on another machine afterwards, preventing you from loaning disks to friends, or even playing a disk on a second home player.  What prevented them was at the time they were competing with HD-DVD which had no such limitation so they dropped that idea.
 
2013-03-20 10:51:53 AM  

Gonz: I have a dumb question, maybe you people can help me out:

Let's say I have a game for my XBox 720. Call it Skyrim, for the sake of convenience. I want to take Skyrim to a friend's house, to show it off. If I do this, there's a pretty good chance my buddy will want to buy his own copy of Skyrim. Wouldn't this concept prevent me from doing that?

And why shouldn't I be allowed to take, well, any game I own to a friend's house and play it there? That was a lot of my gaming experience when I was growing up, way back in the 8-bit days.


I'm sure you will be able to sign on ("recover") your gamertag on your friends Xbox and play.  Lot's of stuff works that way now.

Having said that - if they tie the game to your gamertag AND your console...well then they deserve the business loss they are going to get.
 
2013-03-20 10:53:39 AM  

Latinwolf: HotWingConspiracy:  I don't think they can do it if Sony doesn't.

When Sony was first coming out with Blu-Ray they had considered making it so that any disk can only be played on the first machine it went into, you could not play it on another machine afterwards, preventing you from loaning disks to friends, or even playing a disk on a second home player.  What prevented them was at the time they were competing with HD-DVD which had no such limitation so they dropped that idea.


That sounds horribly similar to DivX.
 
2013-03-20 10:58:27 AM  

kab: MindStalker: In reality, it sounds like they are trying to emulate the PC experience with the Xbox720. It really is an issue of expectations.

If they're trying to emulate the pc 'experience', then they need to remember that the frequent and very good sales on Steam are the biggest perk to it.


For example, Saint's Row 3 (The Full Package version with all the DLC (except the two "bad" DLCs)) is currently $16.99 on Steam (regularly $49.99) and definitely worth it.  This is a AAA title that's less than a year and a half old (the bundle is itself is less than six months old).

On the other side, the amount of pre-order bonuses on Bioshock: Infinite (due to be released next week, priced at $59.99) on Steam is insane.  There's four seperate bonuses: The Industrial Revolution Pack (which is some puzzle game plus a bunch of in-game items), the original Bioshock game, seven TF2 cosmetics, and X-COM: Enemy Unknown (which itself is a AAA title that's only six months old).
 
2013-03-20 11:00:47 AM  
I'm not buying anything that requires a connection to the internet at all times to function. Even the games I buy off Steam can be played offline, so why the hell would I bother with this crap?
 
2013-03-20 11:02:25 AM  

doglover: MadSkillz: It has come full circle. I have Sonic Dash on my iPhone. Game cost 1.99 and is beautiful, but if you die and want to continue from that spot(rather than start over), it costs you a 'red star' which at the lowest bundle price, is worth about 14 cents.

That's nothing.

The My Little Pony game, just a city builder with characters and buildings from the show, cost at LEAST $300 in premium currency to beat the main story line. That was the minimum price to beat without hacks.


That's nothing.

http://www.148apps.com/news/503-ios-racing-game-shocking-reality-iap -r eal-racing-3/
 
2013-03-20 11:02:53 AM  

doglover: MadSkillz: It has come full circle. I have Sonic Dash on my iPhone. Game cost 1.99 and is beautiful, but if you die and want to continue from that spot(rather than start over), it costs you a 'red star' which at the lowest bundle price, is worth about 14 cents.

That's nothing.

The My Little Pony game, just a city builder with characters and buildings from the show, cost at LEAST $300 in premium currency to beat the main story line. That was the minimum price to beat without hacks.


In a game where you have to spend money to beat it, but you own the game itself, is hacking the game files ethical? I've been grappling with that re: Sonic Dash.
 
2013-03-20 11:06:37 AM  
Honestly, I love the idea. I hope Sony adopts something similar with the PS4. The backlash would be spectacular, and  I'm all for anything that pushes people towards other sectors of the gaming industry (PC, steambox, ouya, whatever).
 
2013-03-20 11:07:05 AM  

UrCa: doglover: MadSkillz: It has come full circle. I have Sonic Dash on my iPhone. Game cost 1.99 and is beautiful, but if you die and want to continue from that spot(rather than start over), it costs you a 'red star' which at the lowest bundle price, is worth about 14 cents.

That's nothing.

The My Little Pony game, just a city builder with characters and buildings from the show, cost at LEAST $300 in premium currency to beat the main story line. That was the minimum price to beat without hacks.

That's nothing.

http://www.148apps.com/news/503-ios-racing-game-shocking-reality-iap -r eal-racing-3/


That's for 100%.

I'm just talking for the main story line. To get ALL the stuff, the sky's the limit because you have to play a $1.50 a spin chance game to unlock everything. I played it hacked for almost an hour once, at least 100 times, and I did not unlock jack nor shiat. So if I had been playing legit that would have been $150 bucks just gone pecan.
 
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